YOSHI FIX THE DANG GIL ISSUE THAT IS KILLING OUR PLAYERS!!!

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Originally Posted by Shadygrove

That's odd. Although I am a legacy player I have started 2 new characters since the ARR launch. Neither has a problem with gil. Both can buy gear that doesn't come from quests. BTW new characters I start have the tattoo and a few helms, and mounts they can't use, but they DO NOT START WITH MORE GILL THAN YOU.

STOP SPENDING GIL ON TELES.

TLDR: You are a spendthrift.

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TLDR: New levelling characters do not have a gil issue.

Educate yourself on the issue please.

There is thousands of players doing fates non stop. Fates every minute with 50-200+ ppl completing them, fates hardly last more then 90 secs. I did over 30 fates and 3 dungeons without repairing once. Thats 3000+ gil in after repairs ~1800 gil in positive.

I didnt even include the guild seals you get had over 5k of seals saved from those 30 fates. You can even trade them in for !!GASP!! dark matter!! Not exactly best use of the seals imo but its an option if your cash strapped.

Players are constantly doing these fates id estimate 2-3 fates being completed every 3-4 minutes in a single zone, multiply that by the multiple zones available...

End game dungeon grinders are the minority so replenish your gil off the majority. If wearing your +99 legendary set of awesomness is costing you 10k every 5 seconds switch to something cheaper? So many people zerg fates you dont need good gear to do them anyways... there is an option where you can save gear sets try using it...

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Originally Posted by Shadygrove

That's odd. Although I am a legacy player I have started 2 new characters since the ARR launch. Neither has a problem with gil. Both can buy gear that doesn't come from quests. BTW new characters I start have the tattoo and a few helms, and mounts they can't use, but they DO NOT START WITH MORE GILL THAN YOU.

STOP SPENDING GIL ON TELES.

TLDR: You are a spendthrift.

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One of the ways to make gil is to create another character, do the main quest, get gil & send them back to main char, then delete & repeat... Otherwise when you get to 50 you stuck with what you have on lower lvs...

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Originally Posted by Scrubbs

Um ... yea that's how economy works. Some have more, some have less. You introduce money into the economy w/o the backing and you introduce inflation, making gil worthless.

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that is NOT how 'economy' works.

blackmarket takes money out of the game. gil you pay as a commission is NO LONGER available for ANYone. this is not exactly comparable to an ebay fee which is paying the people 'behind' ebay.

tax isn't money taken 'out' of real life economy, either, as it's used for building stuff, paying workers (or state servants), who in turn buy stuff for that money

'economy' does NOT take money out unless there's a serious inflation or you have something like a new currency appearing. for example when several countries with completely different economic value decide on a common currency. that happened roughly 10 years ago... I know that's a long time in internet but still.

please don't talk about how economy works when you obviously have no clue.

I had no issues when my character was new either. But when my quest allagans dried up, my relic quest reared its ugly head, and I had to spam to get tomes for darklight, Repairs became such an issue that running a dungeon period puts me in the negative by a few thousand gil.

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Originally Posted by ShadowKuraido

There is thousands of players doing fates non stop fates popping every minute with 50-200+ ppl. Fates hardly last more then 90 secs. I did over 30 fates and 3 dungeons without repairing once. Thats 3000+ gil in after repairs ~1800 gil in positive.

I didnt even include the guild seals you get had over 5k of seals saved from those 30 fates. You can even trade them in for !!GASP!! dark matter!! Not exactly best use of the seals imo but its an option if your cash strapped.

Players are constantly doing these fates id estimate 2-3 fates being completed every 3-4 minutes in a single zone, multiply that by the multiple zones available...

End game dungeon grinders are the minority so replenish your gil off the majority. If wearing your +99 legendary set of awesomness is costing you 10k every 5 seconds switch to something cheaper? So many people zerg fates you dont need good gear to do them anyways... there is an option where you can save gear sets try using it...

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Shadow, I think you're going to have to revise your post - you've included WAY too much common sense >.>

I just don't have the energy to read through the posts anymore. 50% of people don't understand what the thread is about, the other 50% don't care because it doesn't affect them (yet).

I understand the problem, and I agree with those on the forums that understand that there is a problem. This needs to be addressed.

Let us gather Grade 5 Dark Matter again.

Let crafters repair other people's gear again.

Let those who don't understand/don't care suffer apoplexy and be unable to type anymore.

Amen.

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Originally Posted by Jynx

Solution: Make dark matter obtainable by DoL and make DoH slightly usefull again.

Not sure why they made it so you had to buy dark matter for some reason.

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Instead of make Dark Matter obtainable by DoL again, make it a chest drop in high level content like it was in 1.0
It was a happy time to get dark matter 5 after every Ifrit fight ^^

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Originally Posted by amnie

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Would it make you feel better if the NPCs of the world built bigger and better buildings for you to see then? The money is taken to a place where you cannot use it. You no longer have access to it, just like real life. There are no fees going to NPCs because the NPCs are static. If SE brings in a large amount of gil or ways to quickly amass gil then gil becomes worthless. You see things on the AH for millions of gil, which happened pretty quick in XI from what I remember. You can't compare a game economy to real life economy. Please don't talk about how economies work when you obviously have no clue.

:P Why do that? Love seeing Savage Might IIIs going for ~10k and Quicktongues/Battledances for 50k+ -x-

If we had a stable way of generating gil, feel like prices wouldn't be over such a large range (and hurt Tanks/healers more than anyone)

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Originally Posted by amnie

that is NOT how 'economy' works.

blackmarket takes money out of the game. gil you pay as a commission is NO LONGER available for ANYone. this is not exactly comparable to an ebay fee which is paying the people 'behind' ebay.

tax isn't money taken 'out' of real life economy, either, as it's used for building stuff, paying workers (or state servants), who in turn buy stuff for that money

'economy' does NOT take money out unless there's a serious inflation or you have something like a new currency appearing. for example when several countries with completely different economic value decide on a common currency. that happened roughly 10 years ago... I know that's a long time in internet but still.

please don't talk about how economy works when you obviously have no clue.

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They also don't add currency to the real world economy every time someone new is born either.

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Originally Posted by maxxp

They also don't add currency to the real world economy every time someone new is born either.

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I think you are missing the point. Money disappears in this game. Period. This does not happen in real life, unless you like lighting money on fire? Anyone who is disagreeing that there is an evident deflation crisis on the horizon, in this game, is just showing how uneducated they are. Stop it.

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Originally Posted by ShadowKuraido

There is thousands of players doing fates non stop. Fates every minute with 50-200+ ppl completing them, fates hardly last more then 90 secs. I did over 30 fates and 3 dungeons without repairing once. Thats 3000+ gil in after repairs ~1800 gil in positive.

I didnt even include the guild seals you get had over 5k of seals saved from those 30 fates. You can even trade them in for !!GASP!! dark matter!! Not exactly best use of the seals imo but its an option if your cash strapped.

Players are constantly doing these fates id estimate 2-3 fates being completed every 3-4 minutes in a single zone, multiply that by the multiple zones available...

End game dungeon grinders are the minority so replenish your gil off the majority. If wearing your +99 legendary set of awesomness is costing you 10k every 5 seconds switch to something cheaper? So many people zerg fates you dont need good gear to do them anyways... there is an option where you can save gear sets try using it...

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Nobody read the main thread, and you have ignorant fools such as Quesse and Shadow. Time to educate the children.

There are hundreds of thousands of players in ARR...
For every 50-200 people that earn roughly 200 gil (sometimes its lower, sometimes its higher. Using it as a variable), that's roughly 10,000-40,000 gil per fate entered into the economy.

Now, at that time, there is probably 50-200 people at lvl 50 that are repairing their gear at an npc. Assuming that they are not in full DL gear with broken gear (which would be near 5-8k), but instead average 50 gear with a bill of 2k (common variable at 50), that's an economic gil loss of about 100,000-400,000. You would need 10 fates maxed at 200 people (stated previously) earning 200 gil roughly to equalize this. By the time that's done, there are probably people getting out of 50 trials/dungeons that now need to repair.

As Shadow stated previously, he did 30 fates and 3 dungeons without repairing. Joining a FATE grinding team and having others do the main work while one cashes in is a decent individual strategy. He may escape the brunt of the repair bill that way, but what he is forgetting that there are those in those massive fate groups who are losing durability and do need to repair. After those 30 fates, that could easily be millions of gil lost in that time that needs to be countered.

Let's also note that dear Shadow is NOT LEVEL 50. He hasn't gotten started the 50 trek to broke-ness where he has no alagan pieces, where that 3000 gil he made in 30 fates and 3 dungeons will not cover higher level gear. According to http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...acter/2823971/ (his lodestone profile), he is wearing relatively useless gear. At 50, where the AF gear is, the AK dungeon gear is, and the DL gear is, those 30 fates and 3 dungeons will probably only be enough to repair half his lvl 50 gear. Not to mention the gil drain he'll have if he wants to pursue his relic (easily 100-200k).

Also noting that he doesn't have any crafting/gathering classes unlocked and leveled, so he can't "repair his own gear". He could level those classes, but that requires a decent gil investment, not to mention all those seals he's been earning would most likely be solely dedicated to dark matter to repair his gear.

Now as for Quesse, she's on a legacy server and a legacy character, that already potentially puts her on a completely different table. For the sake of argument, I will assume that she didn't have any large sum of legacy gil port over to add on top of her 200k from alagan pieces to add some validity that she could potentially be anywhere close to in the same boat as new players who start off with zip in order to comprehend the issue.

She stated that one could repair their own equipment to solve the issue. For new players, leveling a DoH to max requires a decent gil investment. One does not simply just become a level 50 crafter. Assuming one is able to afford to do so, then comes actually acquiring the Grade 5 dark matter. G5DM costs 350gil a pop. That's 4200gil needed for a fully geared player at lvl 50.

So how does one get 4200gil? As the one you defended said, he did 30 fates and 3 dungeons, and came out with around 3000 gil. Well now, even if he had a leveled crafter, that wouldn't pay for getting his gear repaired. He said he repaired after all that, giving him a profit of 1800gil. And that's with relatively cheap, non-endgame gear. At lvl 50, you could easily look at a 6k repair bill. Well, that's double what Shadow made in all that time before having to repair. He would need to do that sequence about 3 times, coming to 100 fates and 10 dungeons just to break even with the gil sink.

Let's put it in perspective. At level 50, hundreds of thousands of gil can pour in in minutes. However, during those minutes where thousands of players are earning hundreds of gil, thousands of players are needing to pay thousands of gil in repairs. This equates to a large millions of gil lost forever.

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Originally Posted by ShadowKuraido

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Im going to pretend you have the numbers in front of you to justify saying dungeon runners are in the minority. If thats the case, how does that help the dungeoner that finds enjoyment from fighting and not playing the boards amd crafting? He has to not only grind fates to level but for money too? That hardly sounds like an enjoyable solution.

And how does this relate to the future when the majority are running dungeons? Because lets face it, dungeons are the end game.

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Originally Posted by Syfin

I think you are missing the point. Money disappears in this game. Period. This does not happen in real life, unless you like lighting money on fire? Anyone who is disagreeing that there is an evident deflation crisis on the horizon, in this game, is just showing how uneducated they are. Stop it.

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Because reductive reasoning, hyperbole and personal insults scream educated. Keep on fighting that good fight, I'm going to go back to enjoying the game.

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Originally Posted by Scrubbs

Would it make you feel better if the NPCs of the world built bigger and better buildings for you to see then? The money is taken to a place where you cannot use it. You no longer have access to it, just like real life. There are no fees going to NPCs because the NPCs are static. If SE brings in a large amount of gil or ways to quickly amass gil then gil becomes worthless. You see things on the AH for millions of gil, which happened pretty quick in XI from what I remember. You can't compare a game economy to real life economy. Please don't talk about how economies work when you obviously have no clue.

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You see, in real life, you give your money away, that money doesn't just disappear, it goes to another ppl hand so they can spend it, for example, they buy products from your company, then that money goes to your boss, then your boss pay YOU, it goes around in a circle!

It's a little different in MMOs, depend on which subscription model game has, but it based on the same rules too, if there are money sinks, there must be money fountains, you would understand if you play enough MMO & actually care about how they work. This is an example of how money goes around in GW2: http://i299.photobucket.com/albums/m...GW2Economy.jpg, feel free to educate yourself

I make enough gil, what are you doing?

When I hit 50, I had what felt like a ton of money, now not so much. Repairs eat up massive amounts of gil as the gear level goes up. Leveling a crafting job, playing the auction house, doing fates naked or leveling a new char to 50 and transferring money are not GOOD options cause they either don't bring in new gil, they are just silly (naked fates) or stupidly tedious (leveling new char every time you need gil).

What would make sense to me is to add level 50 leves for money, and add treasure coffers that drop silver/gold medals. Not saying you should become millionaire by doing a few leves, but perhaps something like 1500-3000 gil per leve (with luck and good time bonus) would cover the repair expanses for raiding/dungeon crawling. In a long run those few people with millions (who sold some silly people their overpriced relic quest weapons) wont be happy having to loan their friends/FC money just to wipe in bahamut cause people can't afford to repair their relics.

and to level crafting without spending money you either need a lot of friends with the other professions, or you need to level all of them at the same time. While leveling all of them, gathering all the mats yourself, how do you sppose to repair your gear that will break rather often while doing this? the entire time you are leveling these you will be draining gil through repairs. and dark matter is only worth using if you are at 0 otherwise you pay 4200 to repair gear that a merchant would charge 3k for.

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Originally Posted by Iskander

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Thank you so much for saving me the time to write this. Economics should be compulsory in education.

You might find naked FATE silly but that's the only way you're gonna be able to repair when you're looking at iLVL 70 gear in the red and 500 gil to your name.

There is plenty of ways to make gil. I like it how it is, its slow and steady. Don't really thing SE want's to see millionaires right off the bat.

Quick question, can you buy Dark matter with company seals? i can't remember.

And Selling things to make yourself richer and another person poorer OP. that's generally how markets work. That's how life works!

But i do agree that they need to stop giving them tin pieces, at the lv50 dungeons. needs to scale up with us, 500 ones would do

I literally laugh to myself every time i see someone post about their personal wealth. Like that has anything to do with the post. I literally think these people are brain dead idiots for not realizing what this post is about. I mean how stupid can you possibly be. How oblivious to the world and basic understanding can you be.

first world problems. don't get angry when the smart people reach cap in a few weeks while having the mental capacity to generate gil through crafting or other means. this is what you get for spamming to 50 without even knowing the basics of wealth generation

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Originally Posted by Jinzuki

first world problems. don't get angry when the smart people reach cap in a few weeks while having the mental capacity to generate gil through crafting or other means. this is what you get for spamming to 50 without even knowing the basics of wealth generation

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Another person who confuses "making" gil with actually creating gil.

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Originally Posted by AsakuraVN

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Mmmm ok. I'll agree that if you have more money leaving the game that isn't circulating than is coming in, then there's a problem. SE needs to balance the money coming in with the money going out if that's the case. If players could repair armor (and charge a fee if they wish), then that would be money circulating instead of money leaving. As it is though, I believe player repairs cost more than quick repairs, which have more money going out than is coming in via SE's means. I understand the problem now.

SE just needs to make Dark matter attainable by DoL and even dungeon coffers for kicks, once it become a readilly available resource for crafter to repair and they simplify the repair process then players can repair their own gear through the community and allow money to circulate instead of be removed from the system.

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Originally Posted by Jinzuki

first world problems. don't get angry when the smart people reach cap in a few weeks while having the mental capacity to generate gil through crafting or other means. this is what you get for spamming to 50 without even knowing the basics of wealth generation

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Aaaaand, another one, right on cue.

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Originally Posted by Cynric

You might find naked FATE silly but that's the only way you're gonna be able to repair when you're looking at iLVL 70 gear in the red and 500 gil to your name.

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Why naked FATE? Could just wear lower level gear that is no longer important and possibly do lower level FATEs.

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Originally Posted by Inq

Aaaaand, another one, right on cue.

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It's kind of hilarious in a way. A lot of these really stupid people actually tries to portray themselves as the intelligent people whilst totally unaware how irrelevant and ignorant their points are.

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Originally Posted by Scrubbs

Mmmm ok. I'll agree that if you have more money leaving the game that isn't circulating than is coming in, then there's a problem. SE needs to balance the money coming in with the money going out if that's the case. If players could repair armor (and charge a fee if they wish), then that would be money circulating instead of money leaving. As it is though, I believe player repairs cost more than quick repairs, which have more money going out than is coming in via SE's means. I understand the problem now.

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Even if Players could easily repair other People stuff, Dark Matter would still be a Problem. Right now it's only worth to reapir your gear yourself if everything is pretty much at 0%. Reason beeing that the NPC repair costs changes depending on how much damage your gear has. I'm making the number up cause I dont know them exactly.
Lets asume a Darkmatter Piece costs 350. A full repair for an Item from the NPC costs 500.
If the Item is down to 0% repairing it manually saves you Money, but still costs you 350.
If the Item is at 50% and you want to get it to full cause you don't know how often you will die in the next dungeon, the NPC only costs you 250.
Everyway you can generate Gil or aquire Dark Matter actually breakes your gear and allready causes repair costs.
For some reason it Looks like something is totaly off. SE sad they basically cut down everything by removing one Zero. V1 Players got one Zero removed from the gil they had. But repair did never cost 50'000 in V1.. Actually it was free cause Dark Matter droped in instances.
You either could use that to repair yourself if you had the crafting class or you could activate a request repair function where someone else could select you and repair the Equipment you had on using your darkmater. I don't understand why the repair Prices did Change to cost so much more, why the reapir request did get removed and why Dark Matter doesn't drop anymore.

Just knowing this changes makes it pretty obvious that repairing gear costs much more compared to V1.

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Originally Posted by Spirea

I run dungeons all the time and afk in town; I have over 1 million gil. There are many ways to make gil, each person just needs to find their Niche in the economy. Of course I do agree that once someone hits 50, gil from non-player sources comes to a halt. There is a limited amount of gil in the economy and that 1 million simply means others have spent their 200~k from quests.

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Now think about what this means if someone can't buy anthing anymore from you? Cant do anything in the game anymore cause of broken gear....Cause he can't generate Gil...
And some part of his 200k didn't go to you but just dissapeared... How are you going to get Money if noone else has anymore to buy stuff from you?

Really People what's so hard to understand about this? O_O

Serious I'm starting to get psychosomatic sympthoms about all this People not getting what the supposed Problem is and talking about something totally different...

I run dungeons all the time and afk in town; I have over 1 million gil. There are many ways to make gil, each person just needs to find their Niche in the economy. Of course I do agree that once someone hits 50, gil from non-player sources comes to a halt. There is a limited amount of gil in the economy and that 1 million simply means others have spent their 200~k from quests.

Yes, but it is still silly!(@Cenric)

Point of this thread is "fixing" or alleviating the situation. Personal wealth, "being so smart, crafting blablaba" have nothing to do with the core of the issue. Game economy can't work if there is less NEW money coming in at level 50 then the mandatory sinks keep taking it. What I'd like to ask people, why do you defend something that makes the game a lot more tedious to play? Lets look at the "tips" to save money, Don't teleport(yeah why use something SE put in to make traveling nice?), have all crafting classes at lvl 50 without huge up front investment and repair mats.

I can understand the millionaires wanting to have all the money, but in the long you will suffer from the lack of money, who buys from you if no one else has money?

Now with the housing and such coming soon, the need for gil will most likely only go up, why wouldn't SE fix the issue if they want everyone to have a house, a prominent feature they have worked hard for.

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Originally Posted by Inq

Aaaaand, another one, right on cue.

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They take pride on it too... I don't know what to say. :/

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Originally Posted by Scrubbs

Would it make you feel better if the NPCs of the world built bigger and better buildings for you to see then? The money is taken to a place where you cannot use it. You no longer have access to it, just like real life. There are no fees going to NPCs because the NPCs are static. If SE brings in a large amount of gil or ways to quickly amass gil then gil becomes worthless. You see things on the AH for millions of gil, which happened pretty quick in XI from what I remember. You can't compare a game economy to real life economy. Please don't talk about how economies work when you obviously have no clue.

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I replied to you comparing game economy to real life economy, smartass.
and just so you know, if the game let PLAYERS (crafter, for example) build bigger houses I'd absolutely be for it. in fact, I think that's an awesome idea for a great in-game economy and overall community. too bad ARR is not a so-called 'sandbox' game, though.

I give up if you really think there is just as many players repairing end game gear because of repeated dungeon grinds as there is players 1-49 grinding/zerging fates with positive gil returns then I have nothing else to say.

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Originally Posted by amnie

I replied to you comparing game economy to real life economy, smartass.
and just so you know, if the game let PLAYERS (crafter, for example) build bigger houses I'd absolutely be for it. in fact, I think that's an awesome idea for a great in-game economy and overall community. too bad ARR is not a so-called 'sandbox' game, though.

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Mmm no pretty sure you were the first person to mention anything having to do with real life scenarios. I simply said that if SE floods us with gil, it becomes worthless, as has happened in many other MMOs. However, I understand the main problem of the OP now, so our scuffle is moot. I agree that a balance must be struck for the good of the economy.

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Originally Posted by Deatheye

Even if Players could easily repair other People stuff, Dark Matter would still be a Problem. Right now it's only worth to reapir your gear yourself if everything is pretty much at 0%. Reason beeing that the NPC repair costs changes depending on how much damage your gear has. I'm making the number up cause I dont know them exactly.
Lets asume a Darkmatter Piece costs 350. A full repair for an Item from the NPC costs 500.
If the Item is down to 0% repairing it manually saves you Money, but still costs you 350.
If the Item is at 50% and you want to get it to full cause you don't know how often you will die in the next dungeon, the NPC only costs you 250.
Everyway you can generate Gil or aquire Dark Matter actually breakes your gear and allready causes repair costs.
For some reason it Looks like something is totaly off. SE sad they basically cut down everything by removing one Zero. V1 Players got one Zero removed from the gil they had. But repair did never cost 50'000 in V1.. Actually it was free cause Dark Matter droped in instances.
You either could use that to repair yourself if you had the crafting class or you could activate a request repair function where someone else could select you and repair the Equipment you had on using your darkmater. I don't understand why the repair Prices did Change to cost so much more, why the reapir request did get removed and why Dark Matter doesn't drop anymore.

Just knowing this changes makes it pretty obvious that repairing gear costs much more compared to V1.


Now think about what this means if someone can't buy anthing anymore from you? Cant do anything in the game anymore cause of broken gear....Cause he can't generate Gil...
And some part of his 200k didn't go to you but just dissapeared... How are you going to get Money if noone else has anymore to buy stuff from you?

Really People what's so hard to understand about this? O_O

Serious I'm starting to get psychosomatic sympthoms about all this People not getting what the supposed Problem is and talking about something totally different...

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I meant by allowing players to repair armor, that they would give the players everything they needed to actually do the repairs in a cost effective and player-driven way. I guess I should have specified that :P

Based on my personal experience, the tradecraft leve is the best money generator in the game. Especially the ones that asks you to turn in 3 things and are then repeatable if you turn in HQ stuff. As a lvl 25 GSM, I had a leve that asks for 3 magnifying glasses. The only base material required are silver ores (go mine them yourself), and a lens purchasable from the guild NPC. Go play the crafting mini game and make 9 HQ lens (easy if you are wearing on level gears and have all the lvl 15 skills from all other crafting classes). The levee has a base reward of about 600gil. That's almost 2k if all Hq, and you can do it 3 times with only 1 levee allowance. Minus repair for the miner and crafter gear, and the cost of those lenses, I think you can generate about 4.5k Gil with less than an hour work.

To be clear, I do think there is a problem with the economy. There are ways to inject decent amount of Gil into it if you look hard enough, but there are too few of them, and not everyone enjoys doing those activities. Those who only want to dungeon all day should not be rich, they should never be able to buy anything off the market place by only doing that. But they should not be forced into abject poverty either and forced to do other things. This is a game, let people do what they want

Aside from the obvious idiots that don't realize the difference between personal wealth and economy. For those telling people to level crafts, what happens when everyone levels crafts to make money. How are you going to sell things to them when they can make it for themselves? You are basically telling them to not buy anything from you and to make it themselves. You're literally scaring away your own customers.

Haha Yes it is still silly!

And yes if you only dungeon you shouldn't be rich of course! But like Ananda said there's no reason why you should be left with no way to play the game anymore . Like right now I'm pretty much just a Kill stuff kinda guy. I don't mind farming but farming stuff puts me negative even after selling in the market.(My Repairs to farm the items are too high after an hour and possible drop luck being good or bad) But I think I should still be able to go in and kill stuff. I should still be able to continue questing for my relic.

But right now I can't be bothered for it. Any failed runs and my gear will get wasted. Someone leaves after a fail and my gear gets wasted. Doing a leve, or a FATE period my gear will get wasted. (@100 gil for your standard gold 50 FATE isn't worth it to zerg them for practically 1-3% durability per fate if you claim properly for said gold) Doing a dungeon itself costs me thousands I can't make back at all aside from sinking money I don't have into a Class I never had the intention to level.

I never wanted to be rich, Heck I expected to save up for a house and not deal with spending money too much but... I can't even do the one thing I wanted which was kill stuff without going 90% negative.

Sure I can spam Arm of destroyer and make 100 gil every FATE while naked. But that's completely ludicrous and isn't even a proper way to make money while playing the game. I just have nothing better to do. Since it takes hours to actually get 1000's of gil this way.

Thankfully training dummies are free of charge or it'd be a 100% waste to play at all.