Predictions for OC/FT Live Letter

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Originally Posted by Valence

Yeah that's why I found my run of BA extremely underwhelming when I did it last expansion. The whole concept of the instance looked pretty interesting, but ultimately it's been figured out, and there is no individual responsibility beyond the few leaders and it's all about following instructions. You have nothing to do at your level in terms of agency. And even if you wanted to try something, you can't because discipline has to be tight since a single mistake can potentially wipe the instance or kill half the party (with limited raises).

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Mmmm Jeeqbit described the Discord implementation of FT as simply following positional call-outs, so that all that is required is pressing the movement buttons. I assume it's helpful if that is coupled with pressing your actions buttons in a pre-determined rotation. But honestly if I wanted to exercise my fingers in that way I'd pick up my guitar.

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Originally Posted by Mawlzy

That comes as no surprise.

You have expressed rigid views on how the game should be played, and puzzlement that not everybody shares those views.

I'm glad you have found a form of engagement that works for you and that you enjoy the game. But one of the features of a good MMORPG is that it provides almost as many ways of engaging with it as there are players playing it.

FFXIV has met that threshold in the past. It no longer does.

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How the hell am I the one who have rigid views when you are literally the one who scoff at raiders joining discord callout? You even give a "I won't join discord ever" and claimed that the majority of people don't want to follow callout, as if you have proof of this.

Read again what I wrote. I pointed out that no, actually callouts are normal in EX and Savage. Even if you join pug/PF, it's not uncommon to for someone who's more experienced in the fight give minor instructions using macro chat. Or marking themselves so that people can follow them to safe spot.

If I am being rigid, for my perspective, the likes of you are whiny complainer who don't want to get oit from their comfort zone even a bit, then try to invalidate others because they do things you don't like.

I don't like how FT is handled or that discord is almost a must, but the way you blame raiders and discord party in general is not something I agree with.

nothing on BL
nothing on content feedback
preview of MSQ, more WL; a new dungeon
preview of alliance raid ; go to first boss ; oh look you can fall
printout of stuff on shiny paper for 30s
break
preview of next CE, same stuff in orange
some OC stuff
few words on FT saying they'll think about it for .4 or .5
Variant and/or DD ?
oh look Hildibrand doing silly stuff, also corn
maybe a limited job ?
store adds ; events adds ; crossover adds

Nah, I'm setting myself to be disappointed again as I added too much stuff that may by interesting... there's probably half of that for part 2 anyway.

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Originally Posted by Kozh

How the hell am I the one who have rigid views when you are literally the one who scoff at raiders joining discord callout? You even give a "I won't join discord ever" and claimed that the majority of people don't want to follow callout, as if you have proof of this.

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Calm down, honey.

The majority of players don't do EX+ on cycle. That tends to indicate that the majority of players do not wish to follow call-outs, nor engage in raids and trials beyond the MSQ. Be pleased you're a member of the elite minority.

As I said, I'm happy you and your friends are enjoying yourselves.

Id like to hear what the thought process was behind abandoning improvements made in Bozja regarding FT and why they though adding Eureka/Bozja exclusive rewards to chests was a good idea.

HAHAHAHAHAHAH queue for FT will take till 7.3

Thats embarrassing

The live response on r/ffxivdiscussion is not going well.

It sounds/reads like they're doing this type of content for the first time and they need so much time to adjust things. They have the solution already in game from previous iterations. Will future field explorations (8.0) face the same issues again? Are they running in circles?

Why aren't they rather talking about the 3min CE gameplay loop they've implemented? It is an exhausting experience. You cannot even chat with your friends. We're basically rushing within 3min CE timer.

Lots of "we'll consider this for the future" and tone-deaf responses. Disappointing.

Love the fact that they refuse to increase the Atmadroprate, and called it indirect a "skillissue" xD

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Originally Posted by Carin-Eri

Lots of "we'll consider this for the future" and tone-deaf responses. Disappointing.

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I am quite shocked that the reason for a lack of "Normal Mode" Forked Tower was, according to unofficial translations, that it would have cost too much.
This game a load bearing pillar for Square Enix.

The reason for them not implementing a normal version of Forked Tower being cost...is simply...wow...

I'm at a loss for words...

Disappointing at best, enraging at worst. And really, really sad for long time players.

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Originally Posted by AvoSturmfaust

Love the fact that they refuse to increase the Atmadroprate, and called it indirect a "skillissue" xD

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Honestly can't believe how tone-deaf the responses are!

It basically amounts to:
Player Feedback: "this is a problem"
YoshiP: "We will consider addressing this in the future" OR "I don't consider this to be a problem".

The answer to the reason why there's no normal version of FT is just baffling. There's no way to defend that or interpret it differently.. so disappointing :(

The company who merchandises this game to the point Disney should take notes just said they can't do something due to "cost"--I honestly don't have words.

Don't worry the end of the LL is going to fix the cost issue. Just bear with them a little longer. It's going to be brand new plushies and Yshtola mega-pillow.

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Originally Posted by XtremePrime

The answer to the reason why there's no normal version of FT is just baffling. There's no way to defend that or interpret it differently.. so disappointing :(

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Apparently it's not even worth comment why, if there is only going to be one version, it has to be the savage one.

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Originally Posted by Gurgeh

My predictions for the OC FT Live Letter:

Either

• all talk and no action. (I honestly have little insight as to what the detail of that might be. Other than we hear you and please look forward to part 2).

or

• "We aren't gong to comment on our original intentions for FT.
  - But we have heard the complaints of the Upper-class High-end, and because its the easiest change to make, we are helping the discord cartel savage player get what they want, and making it easier for them to pull the ladder up after themselves, and enter with full complete exclusive premades.
  - We will not be changing the design of Forked.
  - We will not be enabling it to be queued casually, nor limiting premades to of 8/48, nor applying stiff penalties for abandoning, nor anything else to really help casuals get in without threat or hindrance
  - We would like acknowledge the complaints of the casual player, but as we don't really acknowledge they exist that would be problematic."
  

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Well we have it I think:

* Premade of 48 now allowed = "- But we have heard the complaints of the Upper-class High-end, and because its the easiest change to make, we are helping the discord cartel savage player get what they want, and making it easier for them to pull the ladder up after themselves, and enter with full complete exclusive premades."

(Oh by the way "the reason there was no normal... cost..." we looked at Chaotic and decided we needed to F the casuals over some more.
That's not an explanation. Why did you decide to do Savage and not normal? = "We would like acknowledge the complaints of the casual player, but as we don't really acknowledge they exist that would be problematic.")

If they'd have any integrity, they would have allowed FT to be queued out of instance, and forced it to be maximum parties of 8, and said we stand by our content, this will help others get in.
Or failing that just ditched the ciphers all together, and said everyone gets equal chance to get as individuals, once your in, don't abandon or be locked out.

"A Normal version, next one"(maybe? I think) = "Other than we hear you and please look forward to part 2"

Well, premade of 48 with huge body checks? Did that for Chaotic, I wouldn't go there again.
I don't know, maybe if the body checks are only 24/48, that won't be so bad.

* Will it be possible if somone enters with a premade of 24? That you will still be able to enter with them at the temple?

I didn't get any comment on their original intentions for the FT systems. Maybe thats translation and it will come out in other summaries/transcripts.

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The one big question still... no normal because of cost.... WHY SAVAGE AND NOT NORMAL?

I don't know. I know I'm just beyond seeing anyof this positively even if there is good there for players like me. I doubt it.

Think I'm done with the letter.
Bye.

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Originally Posted by Aniise

The reason for them not implementing a normal version of Forked Tower being cost...is simply...wow...

I'm at a loss for words...

Disappointing at best, enraging at worst. And really, really sad for long time players.

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^Dont know, i rather trust the Balance Translation and there is nothing about "money"

"Y: However, it would be really difficult to create so much content in time for our usual schedule"
That is what is said in the Balance Discord, im honest with you all, Yoshi P not once said something about "costs to much" in the past, why would he now

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Originally Posted by Yodada

HAHAHAHAHAHAH queue for FT will take till 7.3

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I think the quickest type of queue they could do would be to make it like CLL - a CE type queue. Actually separating it into a separate instance is understandably a bit complex if you understand environment building in games and would take them some time.

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Originally Posted by ovIm

I am quite shocked that the reason for a lack of "Normal Mode" Forked Tower was, according to unofficial translations, that it would have cost too much.
This game a load bearing pillar for Square Enix.

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Yeah - if ever we wanted/needed evidence that the money the game generates doesn't get fed back into the game, there it is - from the EP's own mouth.

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Originally Posted by Mawlzy

Apparently it's not even worth comment why, if there is only going to be one version, it has to be the savage one.

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Yep. That's an issue too.
Like, if you really had to choose between two versions, wouldn't you normally pick the one the majority of players can enjoy?

Why pick the one, only the comparably smaller group will even play at all?

It's mind boggling. It's ineffective. Who makes such baffling decisions in this company?? It simply makes no sense to me, except they really want to filter out the more casual crowd and give 14 a more raiding oriented feeling. The casual crowd should just play the mobile version, I guess, that will probably be monetized to hell and back.... Crazy, simply crazy.

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Originally Posted by AvoSturmfaust

^Dont know, i rather trust the Balance Translation and there is nothing about "money"

"Y: However, it would be really difficult to create so much content in time for our usual schedule"
That is what is said in the Balance Discord, im honest with you all, Yoshi P not once said something about "costs to much" in the past, why would he now

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I didn't know there was another translation. I hope they didn't really say it though. I wish they didn't.

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Originally Posted by Carin-Eri

Yeah - if ever we wanted/needed evidence that the money the game generates doesn't get fed back into the game, there it is - from the EP's own mouth.

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Well, according to Avo quoting the translation from the Balance discord, the constraint may have been time cost, not monetary cost?

Not sure which unofficial translator is to trust here, but that raises a different issue I have complained about in the past: why is the PLL only in Japanese? they pre-prepare everything anyhow and this is an international product.

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Originally Posted by Vikor

The company who merchandises this game to the point Disney should take notes just said they can't do something due to "cost"--I honestly don't have words.

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Development cost, not money. Money isn't a problem. What that means is if they have 10 developers, they assign 3 to Cosmic, 1 to FT, 3 to OC, 3 to extreme and savage - they didn't assign one to a "normal" version.

So next time it'll be solved not due to more money necessarily (considering they are actively hiring), but due to planning the development roadmap better, basically.

Part One of the LL was awful and my opinion of YoshiP has dropped significantly. He is completely tone-deaf.

Nice, we're not even at the end of LL and the first ad is running already.

At this point, it's time to change my sub to the cheap version as well as discontinuing my additional retainers.

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Originally Posted by Aniise

Yep. That's an issue too.
Like, if you really had to choose between two versions, wouldn't you normally pick the one the majority of players can enjoy?

Why pick the one, only the comparably smaller group will even play at all?

It's mind boggling. It's ineffective. Who makes such baffling decisions in this company?? It simply makes no sense to me, except they really want to filter out the more casual crowd and give 14 a more raiding oriented feeling. The casual crowd should just play the mobile version, I guess, that will probably be monetized to hell and back.... Crazy, simply crazy.

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Clearly they can't keep up with their hectic content release schedule. So yeah, just turn an MMO into a raiding simulator.

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Originally Posted by xbahax92

Nice, we're not even at the end of LL and the first ad is running already.

At this point, it's time to change my sub to the cheap version as well as discontinuing my additional retainers.

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Its normal, they always show ads or anything during the break, and right now part 1 is done

Reminder that the idea of "cost" isn't especially about money, it's mostly about time.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

Development cost, not money. Money isn't a problem. What that means is if they have 10 developers, they assign 3 to Cosmic, 1 to FT, 3 to OC, 3 to extreme and savage - they didn't assign one to a "normal" version.

So next time it'll be solved not due to more money necessarily (considering they are actively hiring), but due to planning the development roadmap better, basically.

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Next time?

A start-up six months into its first project is more competent than this.

Hmm... I'm happy that there's *some* preformed party thing available for FT, but by the time it's implemented, it'll be considered "old content" and just end up being a Discord sort of affair again.

I really hate that these LLs are left to unofficial translations. The account I follow will say one thing, another translation says another. I don't expect them to translate everything, but this section was important enough I think to do so.

Castrum was fun they basically forked out the casual crowd and catered to the Savage one and that isn't very smart in my opinion. No excuse for it my view.

Castrum, DR and Dalraidia were all fun and engaging for everyone. The DRS was placed where it should have been at the end of the relic cycle as was BA.

What I find absolutely crazy to hear to is them starting up the stream by saying that the devs took up on them to make decisions on their own before checking up with Yoshida if it was good, and as someone that worked in the dev industry I'm like, what? Isn't that normal behavior? Isn't that what your lead devs are supposed to be doing? And the assistant producers to keep track of little things? And only then the creative director and art director to get the final word on it?

What are their leads doing? Can't they think for themselves?

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Originally Posted by ovIm

I am quite shocked that the reason for a lack of "Normal Mode" Forked Tower was, according to unofficial translations, that it would have cost too much.
This game a load bearing pillar for Square Enix.

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What I find even more baffling is that they'd prioritize the challenging version over the version for everybody if that was the case.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

Development cost, not money. Money isn't a problem. What that means is if they have 10 developers, they assign 3 to Cosmic, 1 to FT, 3 to OC, 3 to extreme and savage - they didn't assign one to a "normal" version.

So next time it'll be solved not due to more money necessarily (considering they are actively hiring), but due to planning the development roadmap better, basically.

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So if we posit that money isn't the problem, why aren't they recruiting appropriately to alleviate development times?

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Originally Posted by Sekundessounet

Reminder that the idea of "cost" isn't especially about money, it's mostly about time.

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Yes, maybe. But even if this is true, the same question remains.
Why would you put your limited resources in content, the majority of the player base will never set a foot in?

It's still just as weird. It still doesn't make sense, no matter which resource they fall short on. Be it money, time or employees.

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Originally Posted by Aniise

Yes, maybe. But even if this is true, the same question remains.
Why would you put your limited resources in content, the majority of the player base will never set a foot in?

It's still just as weird. It still doesn't make sense, no matter which resource they fall short on. Be it money, time or employees.

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Same reason we have Ultimate : Hard content creates publicity and community effervescence, be it because of organizing stuff or just following along. When Bozja came out at first, people complained about the lack of hard content à la Baldesion. And that Castrum was a snoozefest.
So it feels reasonable for them to have the whole zone and CE for casual enjoyment, and Forked Tower for more hardcore people.
The best solution is a normal and savage mode of course, but choosing between the two, I suppose it made more sense to give player a hardcore part for the island exploration.

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Originally Posted by Valence

So if we posit that money isn't the problem, why aren't they recruiting appropriately to alleviate development times?

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I see battle design and story jobs going pretty often. Even if they do bring them in they may need to give them the specifice experience working there and with their tools. I don't know if they find recruiting easy or hard there either.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

I see battle design and story jobs going pretty often. Even if they do bring them in they may need to give them the specifice experience working there and with their tools. I don't know if they find recruiting easy or hard there either.

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They talked about it a lot in recent years, they have trouble recruiting because they need their devs to speak fluent Japanese, and yeah there's teaching for a while. And no amount of money is gonna help if the devs aren't applying.

We're getting bogged down in an argument about what that "cost" means but I think we are just arguing semantics here. Wether it's dev time or money, they are lacking the resources to deliver what people are expecting and are cutting corners on basically everything instead. IIRC FF14 is pretty important to SE overall so this lack of support just feels really odd. The problem in cases like this is generally upper management, even inexperienced workers can be directed to do great things but the top needs to know exactly what they're doing and right now this doesnt really feel like it's the case.

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Originally Posted by Sekundessounet

They talked about it a lot in recent years, they have trouble recruiting because they need their devs to speak fluent Japanese, and yeah there's teaching for a while. And no amount of money is gonna help if the devs aren't applying.

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That's the weirdest argument I've ever heard. Having a really hard time accepting that Japan somehow lacks talents willing to make working in video gaming their dream, that's just crazy talk. In a country of over 120M people? For real?

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Originally Posted by Valence

That's the weirdest argument I've ever heard. Having a really hard time accepting that Japan somehow lacks talents willing to make working in video gaming their dream, that's just crazy talk. In a country of over 120M people? For real?

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I'm not saying that the country lacks in devs, it lacks in devs willing to apply. That's an HR issue that goes beyond CBU3.