It's been 5 years, can we remove the job restriction on glamours?

I want the HAIR unlocked. it's HAIR. any race which can grow hair on their heads should be able to use any style. simple logic.

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Originally Posted by Sylvina

I want the HAIR unlocked. it's HAIR. any race which can grow hair on their heads should be able to use any style. simple logic.

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BuT mIqO'tE aNd Au Ra HoRnS wOuLd ClIp ToO hArD

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Originally Posted by KokoChibata

I didnt read any of the posts besides the OP's but something like this existed in the game during 1.0 before they changed the gear to be "dated" youd see mages with heavy armor and tanks with light armor hence why lyse used to wear sabatons and papalymo wear gauntlets. Im not saying it was a bad system but more over I think it should be restricted to glamor dresser items.

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If this is true then why would the developers implement this silly restriction after ARR was made? D:

If we keep getting job shuffled recolors every so and so patches then give it like 10 years and it will almost be like glamours are unrestricted. I see that to be more likely than removed restrictions unfortunately, only SE is allowed to break the rules.

The "job-specific," AF are completely defensible to keep a job-restriction. If there's one thing that should stay "special" to jobs it's the (mostly) series-iconic sets only wearable by one job. And weapons, (duh).

This says nothing about the gear locked to roles, which I believe has become an arbitrary restriction. So arbitrary, as it's already possible (albeit limited) to glamour mages and things like BRD in certain plate/heavy armor, and armor-clad tanks and DRGs have more than maybe a handful of robes and hats to "mage-it-up." And a spectrum of scouting/striking/aiming gear are all pretty much already divided amongst eachother and the unrelated roles. MNK, DRG and SAM have already shared (dyeable) gear models with casters. NIN and ranged have shared with healers. We've established this in these kind of threads a few times, but the argument about "confusing" players with gear glamour choice (outside of iconic AF) has become such a weak argument in light of how some gear has been selectively-recycled to another role or 2 (or given an "all-job" version), and novelty glamours run rampant.

I suspect that it's no longer about "confusing" players with glamour anymore so much as, as mentioned by Rysir above, the devs are probably holding multiple sets back to either reuse 10-20 levels later next expansion for some throw-away dungeon or create a "craftable, all-job" version. It pains me to accept it, but that's probably the real reason we'll never see role-restrictions universally unlocked; not when they can spray it with a new coat of paint (or lack there-of) and save themselves several dungeons and crafting recipe books-worth of work. :(

I've written before, I think it's a multi-layered problem.

1. Job gear "will not" be allowed to be glamoured onto other jobs. Barring a change of heart from the design team, they've been definite about this.

2. The glamour system judges "glamour eligibility" based on whether your current class can equip the gear, because that's the rule that prevents job gear from being available to other classes. I suspect it would be an "all or nothing" setting and they cannot make exceptions for job gear if they changed it. Thus, everything is locked down for the sake of job gear.

3. Actual gear with levels and stats can't be made "all classes" because it wreaks havoc with the gear recommendation system. Trying to level a tank during ARR with other roles' armour in your inventory makes recommendations useless - it looks at gear level, not actual stats, and tanks are able to equip mage and DPS gear so the system will put you in those.
The post-ARR gear being locked to its specialised role solves this issue, but at the cost of locking down glamours as well.

4. The glamour dresser is not able to help the situation. Despite the process around it, it doesn't transform the gear in any way or turn it into a statless glamour item. It just provides another mechanism to end up with the same effect you previously got by applying a glamour with a prism: associating Gear Piece A's appearance with Gear Piece B. Once the glamour is applied, the system can't tell the difference, and it goes through the same "is Piece A eligible to be displayed with this class?" check.


I believe the job gear is the hold-up, and if they were willing to let us cross-glamour that (which they are quite clearly not) then everything else could be untangled and freed up. Until then, it remains locked down to protect those specific costumes.

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Originally Posted by DPZ2

I would hope that crafters can still use glamour prisms on current gear -- the fact that we have glamour plates does not mean we have to use them. The prisms should still work fine. You just have to store the original gear somewhere ...

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That's not going to help. Remember that all crafters, if leveled evenly, are going to be sharing the same actual gear other than their job-defining tools.

Glamour plates (and the ability to link them to gearsets) are the only thing that *does* make individual costumes viable - letting you instantly switch appearance each time you switch jobs. You're not going to spend glamour prisms and go through the manual process every time you go from weaver to blacksmith to alchemist and back again.

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Copy and paste models are all well and dandy, but many of the game's mobs in both games have existed for decades. Morbols, Tonberries, Drakes, Ahriman, Gigas, Behemoths, among many, many others have all been around a really long time. There is almost some kind of reiteration of nearly every mob in the game that comes from a previous FF installment.

And If you're talking lv50 AF armor, most of those are inspired from previous FF games dating before XI. Some back as far as FFI. FFXI took from those concepts. I won't even give you races. They are all humanoid, which is what the playable characters in the franchise have always been.

I strongly suggest looking outside XI before telling me to stop kidding myself. Reading your post sounds like someone who thinks they know Batman after watching Batman Begins.

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Lol ignorance is bliss. Clearly you miss the whole point and try to play it off like you know what your talking about. You claim there isn't that much similarities, then are given evidence of a ton and still think you somehow know what your talking about. Clearly you have not played the games to think you know. Do some actual research then try to talk.

Also I was talking about Ares's set and Koenig from XI both are directly taken from XI.(Wootz sets in XIV.)

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Originally Posted by Erza_Scarlets

Lol ignorance is bliss. Clearly you miss the whole point and try to play it off like you know what your talking about. You claim there isn't that much similarities, then are given evidence of a ton and still think you somehow know what your talking about. Clearly you have not played the games to think you know. Do some actual research then try to talk.

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https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/...20121217102232

https://ffxiv.consolegameswiki.com/m.../02/Morbol.jpg

Damn, what a copy paste job that was...

Also, you claimed first it was direct copies. Now it's just similarities. Which one is it after all?

Because the concept of similar things throughout a whole franchise is so alien. I guess DQ XI is ripping off slimes from DQ X

I don't know what's with you people that seem to think things equal/similar between two games from the same franchise from the same company is somehow bad and should be despised.

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Originally Posted by JohnSpawnVFX

https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/...20121217102232

https://ffxiv.consolegameswiki.com/m.../02/Morbol.jpg

Damn, what a copy paste job that was...

Also, you claimed first it was direct copies. Now it's just similarities. Which one is it after all?

Because the concept of similar things throughout a whole franchise is so alien. I guess DQ XI is ripping off slimes from DQ X

I don't know what's with you people that seem to think things equal/similar between two games from the same franchise from the same company is somehow bad and should be despised.

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Did you even read the posts? Post like one single mob and fail to even see someone even posted a video of a bunch of copy pastes. No one said all models were. Learn to read all the posts your replying to before you reply to it. Then again logic is hard for some people.

They will never do this, instead they could implement pieces that roughly resemble certain job pieces, but they will never let a warrior glamour AF WHM robes for example, or make a BLM able to glamour full Dragonlancer gear.

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Originally Posted by Erza_Scarlets

Did you even read the posts? Post like one single mob and fail to even see someone even posted a video of a bunch of copy pastes. No one said all models were. Learn to read all the posts your replying to before you reply to it. Then again logic is hard for some people.

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Also, you claimed first it was direct copies. Now it's just similarities. Which one is it after all?

I don't know what's with you people that seem to think things equal/similar between two games from the same franchise from the same company is somehow bad and should be despised.

Are you going to keep ignoring these points and just throwing ad hominems? Because the first one shows you're just moving goalposts.

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Originally Posted by JohnSpawnVFX

Also, you claimed first it was direct copies. Now it's just similarities. Which one is it after all?

I don't know what's with you people that seem to think things equal/similar between two games from the same franchise from the same company is somehow bad and should be despised.

Are you going to keep ignoring these points and just throwing ad hominems? Because the first one shows you're just moving goalposts.

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You failed to read the first post I made. I gave similarities and direct copy examples. Also no one stated even once that it was bad for them to use similar or copied models from same franchise so don't claim that. Like none of my posts said anything about it being bad. I was just showing there are many similarities and copies from XI in XIV, not that it was wrong and there shouldn't be any. In fact it's nice to see they don't abandon older models of mobs and do use things from older games in this one.

Also stating X and Y are mob family in the game is obvious and which is why I said models not monster families or types.

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Originally Posted by Zsolen

I know the Chinese made the mistake, but that is the same thing as allowing PLD artifact gear being worn by anyone. Let the specific classes/jobs keep their gear. Limit it to opening up subgroups like DoH, maiming, and so on.

The real problem is crafters cannot use such glamours without taking up 8 of their 10 plate slots.

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That's not the only problem. Even if I can use just ONE set for ALL crafting class, I would be ok. At least I can still rotate between 2-3 sets. But there is no point of glamouring a coat from ALC and rarely see it. I'm not asking for DoH gears to be available to DoW/DoM (but not that I mind).

And to be frank, with the Omni glamour gears available on the cash shop/seasonal gears, any logic or rationality behind the everyone look the same/class inappropriate arguments are pretty much death and buried. Any restriction thus server nothing but an arbitrary barrier.

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Originally Posted by Raven2014

That's not the only problem. Even if I can use just ONE set for ALL crafting class, I would be ok. At least I can still rotate between 2-3 sets. But there is no point of glamouring a coat from ALC and rarely see it. I'm not asking for DoH gears to be available to DoW/DoM (but not that I mind).

And to be frank, with the Omni glamour gears available on the cash shop/seasonal gears, any logic or rationality behind the everyone look the same/class inappropriate arguments are pretty much death and buried. Any restriction thus server nothing but an arbitrary barrier.

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That's no different than Black Mage wearing Dragoon artifact gear. The artifact/class specific gearsets work for people that want a distinguished look exclusive to that job. If people could claim any look with any job, that ability to look like a specific job or specific crafting or gathering class is removed.

My question is why is SE so adamant on not doing this though? Is it that much easier to just recreate a recolored piece of armor than just to remove the restrictions altogether. And that's frustrating because instead of making new armor sets for the next expansions, it gives SE the excuse to just put recolored gear out there. SB has been so lackluster with new sets simply because we've seen them already from HW. There are very few SB exclusive weapons and armors that actually look good.

This has been something the community has been asking for for years and they refuse to break when it comes to this. I really would have liked to ask Yoshi this at the fanfest on the spot.

removing job restrictions on glamours automatically ruins the economies on certain items
Plus, it means that they have extra incentive to make glamour items priortise to certain roles.
Meaning, an average player, has to spend more time getting the item they want.

long term = more time played = more sub costs = more coin on the dresser for Square Enix.

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That's no different than Black Mage wearing Dragoon artifact gear. The artifact/class specific gearsets work for people that want a distinguished look exclusive to that job. If people could claim any look with any job, that ability to look like a specific job or specific crafting or gathering class is removed.

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I'm pretty sure all the AF armor, at time of release, was meant to be used for more than just looks, so let's not act like that was its only purpose.

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Originally Posted by Fynlar

I'm pretty sure all the AF armor, at time of release, was meant to be used for more than just looks, so let's not act like that was its only purpose.

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Of course they weren't, but that is their current role.

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Originally Posted by Erza_Scarlets

Lol ignorance is bliss. Clearly you miss the whole point and try to play it off like you know what your talking about. You claim there isn't that much similarities, then are given evidence of a ton and still think you somehow know what your talking about. Clearly you have not played the games to think you know. Do some actual research then try to talk.

Also I was talking about Ares's set and Koenig from XI both are directly taken from XI.(Wootz sets in XIV.)

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Got to love debating with someone who starts their post off with, "lol". Hell OK, why not? For shitzngiggles.

First off, since you quoted me initially, I'm kind of the one on the defensive. So if I have to repeat myself, it would be you who is missing the point. Which is the case here. I won't deny that their are similarities between XI and XIV. Having played the former for 5.5 years, and going on 3 with this one I recognize them.

However, the poster I quoted took it a bit further and was stating that XI and XIV inspire each other, and clearly has grown tired of "this isn't FFXI" rebuttals. What seems to ruffle your feathers is that I dismiss the similarities, which is exactly what I'm doing; not claiming there aren't any. And the reason why I am dismissing them is because the similarities the two games share in comparison to what BOTH games take from the franchise is a shrub amongst a forest.

So before telling me that I don't know what I'm talking about, I suggest you actually know what the hell I am talking about. The fanservice to games prior to XI is so vast, showing me sets of gear that belong in both games as grounds of how alike the two games are is about as convincing as telling me it's ok to walk down a dark alley.

It's more important they remove racial restrictions on hairstyles than glamour for job specific armor.

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Originally Posted by Dirwen

It's more important they remove racial restrictions on hairstyles than glamour for job specific armor.

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I guess so. But I’d rather have them add actual physics to our hair.

As I do with every thread about this topic, will reply with:

If my paladin can wear a bikini, why not anything else ?

I agree Artifact armor lock is legit, 'tho.

Any argument they can make against doing it ( looking ridiculous, lore breaking Et al.) went out the window when the fenrir bike came in.

I mean so a Pig headed lalafel in a bikini can drive past me on a motorcycle(minibike scooter), But I can't wear my archer hat on my red mage? ( those elemental hats of aiming in pyros are badass!)

Don't be lazy or cheap grab an Intern sit them down give them a list and tell them to make the changes!

#nomoremagerobes

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Originally Posted by Fredco191

I guess so. But I’d rather have them add actual physics to our hair.

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You keep bringing this up in every thread you can wedge it into, but what are you actually picturing?

Hair does already have some motion to it - more noticable with longer styles perhaps. It moves around as you do, and sways in the wind, or the front parts 'catch' on shoulders rather than clipping through them if the character turns their head.

It's not perfect physics or individual strands, but it doesn't move as a single block either, and it seems convincing enough to me.

I'd be so happy if everything but artifact sets got unlocked. I'd also love to see more race specific cultural armor sets made to keep a level of diversity. Something like WoW heritage armor or GW2 Cultural sets.

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Originally Posted by Bellsong

I'd also love to see more race specific cultural armor sets

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And then you'd see a "please race unlock" thread for those every once in a while like the hempen sets. This thread in itself is proof the playerbase wants options and freedom of choice, not more restrictions.

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

And then you'd see a "please race unlock" thread for those every once in a while like the hempen sets. This thread in itself is proof the playerbase wants options and freedom of choice, not more restrictions.

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You're right, people would ask, but it would be reasonable and easy to argue that there's reason for the armor to be locked to that race if it was actually designed with that races culture and even body shape in mind.
You don't see threads about unlocking GC gear for all GC's, or (as far as I know) threads on the GW2 side about cultural armor being unlocked, or requests for heritage sets to be open in great amounts like with the hempen sets here.

Because if designed well within the games lore the armor has reason to be racially locked. (GW2 also got around this in a clever way by making dungeon armor that can be worn by all with the same themes of the cultural armor)

The hempen sets especially and the starter sets to a lesser degree suffer from that fact that they are in no way culturally significant to the races they're locked too. Why is the starter Miqo skirt special to miqo? Why is the elezen hempen top special to them? They aren't, in fact a lot of the start sets and hempen gear look as if the same group of tailors made the gear, And with such a lack of body diversity between the playable races of the game it makes less sense that the clothing can't be adapted to others. That's a pretty large part of the reason I at least argue for them to be unlocked.

But the important thing is that it would be armor, not just clothing. That's why I think blizz and arenanet got away with racially locked gears in their games, simply because there were always alternatives with a similar look and theme, and that it was carefully designed armor and not just basic common clothing.

This thread and request also makes sense because we can already level everything anyways, why can't we mix and match as well? I would argue that things should stay locked if we could only do one class per character, but it doesn't make a lot of sense that not holding certain weapons means you can't wear certain common armors. The only exception that should be made are artifact armors because they have heavy significance to the Job and not just the weapon type you're holding, which is something people generally seem to agree on.

As long as there's something locked, people will always ask for it to be unlocked, but depending on how reasonable the lock is those request will gain and hold less or more of a following. And people have made it clear they do like and want more or better diversity between races, and I think it's okay to have it as long as it's designed with care and intent unlike the starter and hempen gear.

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Originally Posted by Bellsong

The hempen sets especially and the starter sets to a lesser degree suffer from that fact that they are in no way culturally significant to the races they're locked too.

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In the first lorebook, each race has a section pertaining to their starting outfit. They are very much culturally significant. But that's still weak justification to keep things race-locked. If you can become Bloodsworn with beast tribes that want to end humanity, you can probably get close enough to a certain group from that race and get them to give you their outfits, or at least permit you to wear clothes your size and figure following their design. Culture can be shared.

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

In the first lorebook, each race has a section pertaining to their starting outfit. They are very much culturally significant. But that's still weak justification to keep things race-locked. If you can become Bloodsworn with beast tribes that want to end humanity, you can probably get close enough to a certain group from that race and get them to give you their outfits, or at least permit you to wear clothes your size and figure following their design. Culture can be shared.

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It can be, but FF consists of a lot of different players with different tastes and wants, and I much prefer a compromise in this case.

And not every tribe will give you their clothing either for one reason or another, although it would be nice. Personally I'd love to see full freedom, but I understand why the people who want some diversity want it, and I think it's possible to give them that while not being painfully restrictive.

I am genuinely curious to why exactly the starter armors are race specific though, I don't own any of the lore books and I've always kind of been bothered that some simple stuff like that isn't explained somewhere in the game. Do you have any direct reasons or do you just know it exists in the book?

Careful what you ask for. We'd likely get only a single armor set for all jobs for every tomestone tier/ raid/ dungeon.

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Originally Posted by Ayer2015

Careful what you ask for. We'd likely get only a single armor set for all jobs for every tomestone tier/ raid/ dungeon.

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That doesn't make sense. No one asked to remove restrictions from armors that a role can wear. What is asked for is to remove it for glamour purposes. A single gear set for all roles would mean you would have the same gear but with different stats for each role, which is the part that doesn't make sense. A tank and a caster that both changed the appearance of their armor by glamour makes more sense lore wise than them both wearing the same set but each has different stats for them.

adding an item to the glamour dresser should just remove these "job/role" restrictions. it already removes melds and the name of whoever crafted it if applicable.

I forget where I mentioned it, but Id like them to remove the class restrictions for glamour. But it should be done on one Pre-req: You have to have the class of that armor at equal or higher lvl. Meaning, if you awnt to wear lvl 70 Dragoon Glamour over your white mages armor, you can, but you need both a lvl 70 Dragoon, and lvl 70 White Mage.

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Originally Posted by Alucard135

That doesn't make sense. No one asked to remove restrictions from armors that a role can wear. What is asked for is to remove it for glamour purposes. A single gear set for all roles would mean you would have the same gear but with different stats for each role, which is the part that doesn't make sense. A tank and a caster that both changed the appearance of their armor by glamour makes more sense lore wise than them both wearing the same set but each has different stats for them.

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I'm well aware no one is asking for it. I'm saying it would be a likely byproduct. Why design 3 different sets if all classes can wear one? You give too much credit to SE if you think they wouldn't lessen their workload.

I agree. The only thing that should be restricted is artifact gear.

"Might cause confusion for PvP."

... Whoever turns off their HUD in any damn game that has the OPTION for it are morons, IMO.

You shouldn't be confused when there's a CLASS NAME above your damn model, showing what CLASS you are, JFC.

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Originally Posted by WhyAmIHere

adding an item to the glamour dresser should just remove these "job/role" restrictions. it already removes melds and the name of whoever crafted it if applicable.

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If they were building from scratch, it might be different.

As it is, there isn't anything "special" about glamours applied via the dresser compared to the older prism system.

The dresser makes it seem like you're changing the base item and stripping out its attributes, but that doesn't change the item - it just gets rid of extra details like spiritbond, maker's signature and aetherial stats. It's still the same item with the same name.

(It doesn't display all the usual information when you look at it in the dresser, but that's just because it isn't needed there. Those stats aren't unique to that specific item, and if you restore it, the stats are listed again - but the extra stripped information is lost.)

Applying glamour plates to gear is really just a streamlined version of applying those glamours one-by-one with prisms, and the end result is exactly the same. Gear Piece A has an instruction added to it to appear as Glamour Piece B. Then everything goes through the same check it always did: are you currently able to equip Piece B as real gear?

I think glamours should be made available by Role (Tank, Healer, Melee DPS, Ranged DPS, Caster DPS).

And even make it possible to glamour artifact armors onto different classes.

It took long enough but we got there.