Just realized something: FFXIV is a terrible DPS player's DREAM come true...

You sound like you are a salty bad. Ijs.

WoW had DPS meters. But, if ffxiv get it... (I played in WoW ago)

Would come bad happen with meters.
Since if players noticed who low damage or bad heal. They go rude/abuse for players or kick them out.
This what I can see

And that's why the game needs a dps meter.

I usually run dgs as BLM, so even if the other dps decides to afk the mob packs are still decimated, but goddam, I feel bad for tanks having to run with those guys pulling 3k dps on 7~8 mobs pulls, and if you try saying a thing you are the toxic elitist oppressor that plagues the community.

But I will not agree with healer being a high pressure role. 99% of the time in dungeons if you just spam your aoe heal it is very unlikely that anyone will die, as for raids if no one is running parsers so they will not know if you are dpsing or not, so if the bad dps will not be called out neither will you, and if you are not dpsing so it's not hugh pressure either since you will pretty much be sitting there doing nothing for 60% of the time. It's only a high pressure job if you decide to play it in a high pressure way, just like dps.

I pride myself in playing good. I can always tell who isn't playing at a base level. Great news. unless it's someone in your FC you will likely never party with them again get though and move on.

Or you know ... you could just download ACT and know if they are bad for sure. Most people run parsers anyway.

I for one am glad this game doesn't make it easy to parse and that this situation exists. Not saying I don't want to get better as a DPS personally or that I don't try. But so many people look at FFLogs or ACT and see soandso can do X dps and love to berate others for not doing what they see there. But they are wrong in doing so. Soandso might be able to do 5700 on O1S but that neither means that everyone can or even that it is needed. I've seen it cleared by people doing mostly somewhere around 3800. But people will see that 1900 dps difference and call them bad because that is a huge difference. But are they? Not really... The fight still got cleared and they did enough.

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Originally Posted by Zeonsilt

This does not apply to hard content, though.

- In hard content any 1 person can wipe entire Raid group (Susano's Thundercloud as example, or two Lightning AoE attack in a row)
- If DPS will make a mistake and die(sometimes many times), it's still a wipe due to low DPS and boss enrage timer.

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Your example with the thunder cloud isn't a dps related thing. The thundercloud doesn't only target dps.

As for not having enough damage to kill a boss, that's dps making several mistakes. Maybe even constantly. Not just one. Whereas for a tank or healer one mistake can be enough to mess up the entire fight.

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Originally Posted by Eclipsed

I for one am glad this game doesn't make it easy to parse

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It is extremely easy to parse though- just not for PS4 players.

"It's easy to identify bad DPS players, they're not using all of their class abilities."

Using all of your class abilities and knowing how to use them are two different stories. Anyone can press all of their buttons, anyone can do combos, it's about doing them in the proper order and applying your debuffs in proper order. That's why it's called a "rotation." I've seen plenty of people who use their entire arsenal who have garbage (read: below what is expected of the content, and only in ex/savage content) DPS. No amount of watching "rotation," is going to help you. I swear every time someone lies they can totally determine whether or not someone's DPS is low...

I've actually been "called out," for my DPS before, because my "rotation" was bad. I simply politely told the person that I cannot post my parses because it is against the rules, but that their sense of judgment was ridiculously poor and they should reevaluate themselves entirely. Their DPS was by far the lowest in the group and my DPS was even concerningly higher than the person in second. Let me make this clear. No amount of saying "pay attention to rotation and watch how they play," will suddenly make you magically determine how well their DPS is. Stop spreading this garbage.

Why people are so OBSESSED with calling out people on less-than optimal performance?
This game's content is really forgiving. Just CHILL, man. Put some sugar over that salt.

I'm fairly certain SE doesn't want players to be able to call out anyone for bad performance, as it might create an unwelcoming environment for players. To SE, if you finish the dungeon, that was a success! I think they want actual performance to take a backseat and not be a focus of the gameplay. Still it's easier to call out Tanks and Healers because the effects are so obvious and largely not open to interpretation. I don't think SE can change that, but I bet they would if they could.

I'm actually more forgiving of poor tanks/healers than I am of discernably bad dps, though. Probably because I remember being that bad tank/healer and how awful it was when I fucked up.

I kicked someone for not using eno (back when it was on bars) because he was "watching movies and cba", I kicked a nin who wasn't aoeing outside of frog because they were rude and mouthy and said "kick me if you don't like it", and I kicked a blm who cast nothing but... sleep, constantly. A tank that's not using cds or holding enmity I'll try much, much harder to reach before I resort to kicking.

But if it's just "wow this person has like, empty threat and has't used a single aggro dump" most of the time I just sigh and put up with the terribleness. I'm not out to make people feel like shit, but if you're being a jerk/actively detrimental about it, I guess I will.

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Originally Posted by AlexionSkylark

Why people are so OBSESSED with calling out people on less-than optimal performance?
This game's content is really forgiving. Just CHILL, man. Put some sugar over that salt.

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Because this is not a single player game. If I play Skyrim, it doesn't matter how terrible I am. I am the only one impacted. But, here, bad performance affects 3, 7, or 23 other people to some degree.

And those people are trying to beat the content and move on. They didn't sign up for a 40 minute run because Johnny SMN won't use Bane.

I like not having a PUBLIC dps meter... Though, I'd love to have a personal meter so I could measure my own performance.

Yes, there is that dummy trial thing to dps, but dpsing that doesn't involve movement, avoid aoe, cast your utility on someone, target swaps, etc.

You can tell whether a DD is bad or not, the problem lies if they are and you call them out, the HUGE majority of the time, the rest of the party will ask YOU to shut up because "it doesn't matter". Those who do tell you to suck it up are the root of the problem, as if they supported you and not the slacker, the latter wouldn't be there.

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Originally Posted by dragonseth07

I am the only one impacted.

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Impacted by what? 5 or 10 minutes more to complete a dungeon?
you guys really need to take a chill pill. If you are in such a hurry to get things done in this game and log out that you are willing to be a jerk to people over a couple of minutes, you really need to evaluate whether you really enjoy playing this game.

An amusing correlation I've noticed is that the people who are quick to complain about toxic attitudes regarding having damage meters readily available, have also never touched content where that knowledge (or evaluation of performance) even matters.

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Originally Posted by Oscura

"It's easy to identify bad DPS players, they're not using all of their class abilities."

Using all of your class abilities and knowing how to use them are two different stories. Anyone can press all of their buttons, anyone can do combos, it's about doing them in the proper order and applying your debuffs in proper order. That's why it's called a "rotation." I've seen plenty of people who use their entire arsenal who have garbage (read: below what is expected of the content, and only in ex/savage content) DPS. No amount of watching "rotation," is going to help you. I swear every time someone lies they can totally determine whether or not someone's DPS is low...

I've actually been "called out," for my DPS before, because my "rotation" was bad. I simply politely told the person that I cannot post my parses because it is against the rules, but that their sense of judgment was ridiculously poor and they should reevaluate themselves entirely. Their DPS was by far the lowest in the group and my DPS was even concerningly higher than the person in second. Let me make this clear. No amount of saying "pay attention to rotation and watch how they play," will suddenly make you magically determine how well their DPS is. Stop spreading this garbage.

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Additionally, this more or less hits the nail on the head. Observation of actions is not enough to determine numbers, nor is it a good basis for assuming player skill either. No amount of watching someone will tell you how their cooldowns line up, or what procs they're getting, or if they have actions that get eaten up by server delay beyond their control. There's too many factors that can be easily circumvented by a system that people who likely won't even be effected by it, are too afraid to let the game have.

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Originally Posted by AlexionSkylark

Impacted by what? 5 or 10 minutes more to complete a dungeon?
you guys really need to take a chill pill.

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You may not care how long content takes, but many (myself included) do. It's not unreasonable to ask for your teammates in a group setting to contribute to the team effort.

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Originally Posted by dragonseth07

It's not unreasonable to ask for your teammates in a group setting to contribute to the team effort.

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Maybe in a static group context. Random DF is not made to be a high performance environment, and nobody has the right to try and enforce it upon others.
If everyone inside is on board and capable, fine. Other than that, it's par for the course.

Let's not forget that the design process behind roulettes is to create incentives so YOU go there help OTHERS. Roulettes are not about your tome grinding efficiency, never was.
If you wat maximum eficiency, put together a group of like-minded people and queue outside the matchmaking.

I agree, DPS performance is the least visible of the three roles. A lot of the supporting points here, however, are hyperbole at best. A glance at threat meters will give a general indication of how each DPS is performing relative to the other, and when diversion is used the icon is very clear. Rotation analysis and parsing are unnecessary for this.

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Originally Posted by AlexionSkylark

Maybe in a static group context. Random DF is not made to be a high performance environment, and nobody has the right to try and enforce it upon others.

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This attitude is part of the reason why DF is so awful in this game. There is no community push for players to perform in matched content, so they don't. People coast by doing 1-2-3 all the way up because we let them. I want DF to be a fun experience, not a slog.

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Originally Posted by dragonseth07

This attitude is part of the reason why DF is so awful in this game. There is no community push for players to perform in matched content, so they don't. People coast by doing 1-2-3 all the way up because we let them. I want DF to be a fun experience, not a slog.

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Like I said, they are the root of the problem. If I see that kind of attitude, I'll kick them out. They wanna spam their basic combo? They can go do that to a dummy.

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Originally Posted by Shihen

I agree, DPS performance is the least visible of the three roles. A lot of the supporting points here, however, are hyperbole at best. A glance at threat meters will give a general indication of how each DPS is performing relative to the other, and when diversion is used the icon is very clear. Rotation analysis and parsing are unnecessary for this.

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Elusive jump and lucid dreaming exist. No matter how badly anyone wants to convince themselves, threat meters are not an accurate method of gauging DPS in the slightest. Not a "general indication," not perfectly, not "somewhat," just period, it won't. If someone is single targeting during an AoE phase, and another is AoEing, the single targeter is going to have more hate on that one particular mob. It is extremely illogical to ever assert or associate DPS with your hate generation at any point.

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Originally Posted by dragonseth07

This attitude is part of the reason why DF is so awful in this game. There is no community push for players to perform in matched content, so they don't.

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The alternative is making the game more exclusive, shunning out the ones who are not willing or capable of improving performance.
Let's note for a while that there are a myriad of reasons for not performing other than being "lazy". There are all kinds of people out there, including ones who are not gamers at heart.
The beauty of this game is being INCLUSIVE.

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Originally Posted by AlexionSkylark

The alternative is making the game more exclusive, shunning out the ones who are not willing or capable of improving performance.
Let's note for a while that there are a myriad of reasons for not performing other than being "lazy". There are all kinds of people out there, including ones who are not gamers at heart.
The beauty of this game is being INCLUSIVE.

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Oh, I include them. Consider them included in my open-minded blacklist.

P.S.: Please, call me an elitist to make my day :3

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Originally Posted by AlexionSkylark

The beauty of this game is being INCLUSIVE.

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2 Expansions, a monthly sub, almost a hundred hour wall to reach endgame from scratch, and immense amount of time sinks such as crafting and gathering is, 'INCLUSIVE"?

Checkers must be an exclusive club by this backwards logic.

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Originally Posted by Kazrah

Sorry, but I need to be really blunt here: with all the whining and moaning threads you seem to have posted, maybe this game just isn't for you. Honestly, it seems like you spend more time making threads like this than you do actually playing the game. I'll admit I'm probably not the best spokesperson for this given how much I post here (usually while waiting on DPS queues) and how much I've slowed down in the game to keep myself from burning out (and also waiting for that blasted server transfer lock to end), but I really feel like someone needed to point that out.

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I know what you're saying, but the game is DEFINITELY for me. I love crafting/gathering in this game so damn much it's worrisome. I also do enjoy the boss encounters, raids, etc.

Its just that I A) would like to have a reliable DPS parser to know how to get better at my DPS job and B) feel like healing is a bit schizophrenic in that they can't really decide what healers are supposed to do in this game, given how healing spells can bring a raid to full in 2-3 GCDs.

XIV does everything WoW does better except for raiding and how the game handles glamour/transmog (and maybe PvP). XIV also has more side pursuits than most MMOs could ever HOPE to have: Triad, Choco racing/breeding, maps, crafting, gathering, PotD, housing, hunts, etc, etc.

Beyond that, XIV has heart, as I can feel the passion the developers have for making this game the best it can be (and that includes the localization team who knocks it out of the park every friggin' time).

Is it perfect? Of course not, nothing is, and I'll raise those issues on the forums when something bothers be, but I'll do it respectfully and constructively because I don't want to belittle anyone who worked on this game. So yeah, I'll complain, but that's just me voicing an opinion on something I feel would be more fun if it was done differently. There's no malice behind it at all.

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Originally Posted by AlexionSkylark

Why people are so OBSESSED with calling out people on less-than optimal performance?
This game's content is really forgiving. Just CHILL, man. Put some sugar over that salt.

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I'm not advocating the calling out of anyone so much as I'm pointing out that, as the game currently sits, you have two roles that can and WILL get called out for sub-par performance and one that generally won't.

And here's the thing: knowing that players can see how well you're performing creates an incentive to play better, one that really isn't there when it's extremely difficult to gauge how well you're playing.

If you could tell at a glance which DPS are doing well and which are doing poorly, hell, you might see more DPS players choosing to tank or heal instead because there would be pressure equally distributed across all the roles instead of just tanks and healers feeling that pressure.

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Originally Posted by RichardButte

Its just that I A) would like to have a reliable DPS parser to know how to get better at my DPS job

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Then how about posting in that other massive thread about parsing instead of creating another one with a clickbaity title such as "XIV is a bad dps's dream"?

I'm glad you like the game but you seriously give the opposite impression. It's one thing to rant on the forums, it's another to be creating so many negative threads in a short space of time.

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Originally Posted by RichardButte

I'm not advocating the calling out of anyone

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Blizzard don't either but it happens anyway. You can't completely control how players use content. It's why dps meters very often have a negative effect and why healers are essentially played like hybrids even though they're not intended to be.

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Originally Posted by RichardButte

If you could tell at a glance which DPS are doing well

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Herein lies the issue with parsing; the glance. Most players take a glance and assume numbers are black and white. Most players don't know or don't care to think "maybe that person has bad gear, maybe they got targeted by a lot of mechanics, maybe they had to do off-healing" and so on. They just look at dps rankings and assume last = bad.

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Originally Posted by RichardButte

because there would be pressure equally distributed across all the roles instead of just tanks and healers feeling that pressure.

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Parsers will do NOTHING to change the amount of pressure tanks and healers get. They're under pressure because of the nature of their roles. Not because of the absence of parsers. I healed in WoW for ten years and I never once felt a dps meter took pressure off of me. In fact the dps meter often drove people to take stupid risks to do better dps and that gave me more healing to do.

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Originally Posted by Kazrah

Sorry, but I need to be really blunt here: with all the whining and moaning threads you seem to have posted, maybe this game just isn't for you. Honestly, it seems like you spend more time making threads like this than you do actually playing the game.

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You're definitely not the only one who has noticed.

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Originally Posted by RichardButte

1. No DPS meters so no one can see how bad they are.

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This is exactly why this "community" is so adamant about not having them put in the game.

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Originally Posted by Oscura

Elusive jump and lucid dreaming exist. No matter how badly anyone wants to convince themselves, threat meters are not an accurate method of gauging DPS in the slightest. Not a "general indication," not perfectly, not "somewhat," just period, it won't. If someone is single targeting during an AoE phase, and another is AoEing, the single targeter is going to have more hate on that one particular mob. It is extremely illogical to ever assert or associate DPS with your hate generation at any point.

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Again, a little exaggerated. Elusive Jump is part exactly zero players' dps rotation, as is lucid dreaming, and the point where either does become the correct choice is likely long after a dungeon boss is dead and certainly long after it is clear who is pulling their weight and who isn't. And no, it is not illogical to associate two things that are directly correlated to each other. Yes, modifiers to their relationship do exist, but almost all of the situations those modifiers see use are edge cases within the realm of dungeon content. If someone is single targeting during AOE and it still is not clear who the problem is then an optometrist is needed, not a parser.

Let me just add that I am not advocating against the use of parsers. I very much believe the game would benefit from an optional in-game parser. I just don't believe it is the answer to every dps related problem we currently have.

Spent way too much time in pugs doing O2S who couldnt beat the enrage timer.
I didnt know who was holding who back, and even questioned if it was me. When I got a raid group, they told me I was the highest DPS of the group, and above what was needed from me. So I can say having a means to see your DPS helps a ton.

BUT

Having mid battle parsers does create problems.
I'll give examples real quick, and then talk about what I think is a way to implement parsers.

This obviously doesnt apply to everyone, but WoW is the best example of how people get, when something becomes normal, and people start trying to min/max.
Some jobs dont do as much dmg on their own, but contribute to raid dmg.
If their DPS is low, and people expect "X"dps per person, they can and have kicked people who dont deserve it.
Another example in WoW, but not here, are people who do more dmg at the end of a fight, and it is so high, it makes up for the lack of dmg throughout 75% of the fight. (atm this is shadow priest in WoW)
When they never make it to the end, they look and see a DPS who's doing 20% less DPS than the rest, and they get kicked.
Lastly, is AoE vs Single Target. Less important in savage, but in basic farming roulette dungeons, the jobs that do less AoE dmg will also be kicked, because those who do AoE are going to show a higher amount of dps.

(Ive also ran into people who kicked people out based on what % of the enemies HP they dealt in dmg, rather than DPS. For example, this Warrior did 10k dps. and the leader of the group said everyone must do at least 7k dps. The warrior was kicked, because the other DPS did so much more DPS, that his was lower than their by comparison. The leader looked at how much of their dmg was X% of the bosses total hp. This one is just weird, but i saw it alot in cataclysm, and not as much now.)

The most frustrating thing Ive seen a group do, is kick people who werent pulling.
Essentially ive seen SOOOOO many Hunters, even today, who's DPS is terrible.
So they run ahead of the group, being the 1st to fight, and getting off attacks before melee get to the mobs.
Some people leave the parser going between pulls, therefor the person who gets to mobs 1st has higher DPS. Even if their DPS is terrible, if you only count "in combat" DPS.

This is the MOST annoying one for me. This is the 1 thing that can never be avoided, if you openly allow parsers mid combat. People wont learn their rotations, but instead learn to just run to mobs before the rest of the group. (You can tell they do this because their DPS numbers are different from the rest of the groups, who actually dont keep track of the down time between mobs.)
I also think thats where they stopped looking at DPS, and at total % of dmg done in a dungeon back in cataclysm.

Now, as to how to add parsers.
Personally i absolutely HATE how the game locks you out of content you havent cleared yet, even if you're able to clear it, because clear groups arent capable of doing the fight yet.
Instead, it should be a check mark based on ur ability to handle the test dummy. "Did they beat the dummy and survive?" (survive for healers/tanks)
When they beat it, it should keep track of your recorded DPS, and TELL YOU what it was, so you actually know how much room you have for improvement.
And when people make party finder groups, it should only look to see if you can beat the dummy, and then the leader should be able to look up the record of what your dps was when clearing it. (only showing the DPS of the hardest test dummy, not for each test dummy.)

This both helps players know what thier DPS is, lets a PT leader see what they could do, if given time to learn a fight, lets a PT leader know if they got carried or not last group, if everyone's DPS together will be enough to clear. (in case someone is just shy by a few points for some reason)

Also, the problems i mentioned above cant be caused by this implementation. (It may cause new issues, and of course would be re-evaluated then.)

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Originally Posted by Shihen

And no, it is not illogical to associate two things that are directly correlated to each other. Yes, modifiers to their relationship do exist, but almost all of the situations those modifiers see use are edge cases within the realm of dungeon content.

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I thought the aggro list was reliable for this until I actually used a crystal ball. Running it taught me immediately that the aggro list is worthless as a gauge, completely worthless.

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Originally Posted by Sylvina

Every dps wants to get better.

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From which cereal box do you have that crazy idea? You'll find a ton of players, not only dps players, who don't give a sh.. about getting better because there are always people who'll carry them on their backs because its easier as learning to play their class even close to good.

You see dps who are not even using the game give combo and you can't tell me its not obvious that you should use the skill that gets optical highlighted from the game or just standing around and doing autoattacks.


OP: You can see if one of the dps is bad or doesn't play properly without a parser.

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Originally Posted by dragonseth07

This attitude is part of the reason why DF is so awful in this game. There is no community push for players to perform in matched content, so they don't. People coast by doing 1-2-3 all the way up because we let them. I want DF to be a fun experience, not a slog.

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Some of the classes in this game damn near holds your hand through your rotation. Not having a parser is not the problem, peoples attitudes are.

A parser does not:
tell you your optimal rotation
inform you of ideal stats for your class
rotation per boss/mechanic

It takes a person willing to learn. And if a players isn't willing to learn their proper rotations or in the least what the game is showing them, then a parser is a pointless tool.

The only thing more tired than this subject matter, is peoples expectations that having an ingame parser is going to act as a remedy and cure-all that will miraculously solve everyones DPS woes.

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Originally Posted by Kyuuen

-snip-

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A parser may not tell you that kind of information, but it gives you direction. Nobody is going to improve if they don't even know there's something TO improve in the first place. You can't argue that people aren't willing to learn if there's nothing that encourages people to do so in the first place. It only makes sense to say that if they willfully ignore said encouragement in the first place - of which, again, there is none.

Why is this concept so hard for people to understand? It doesn't help that as large as this game's community is, there's no single organized English fansite or forum dedicated to compiling information on how each job works (much less actual guides). The only resort for many people on our side of the ocean is google search or, even worse, wading through Reddit's terrible search algorithm.

(And I specify English because I'm willing to bet millions that the Japanese community has far more easily accessible information stored somewhere behind the language barrier, which would explain why the developers don't even see this as a problem.)

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Originally Posted by SaitoHikari

A parser may not tell you that kind of information, but it gives you direction. Nobody is going to improve if they don't even know there's something TO improve in the first place.

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There's Stone, Sky, Sea for that

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Originally Posted by SaitoHikari

A parser may not tell you that kind of information, but it gives you direction. Nobody is going to improve if they don't even know there's something TO improve in the first place. You can't argue that people aren't willing to learn if there's nothing that encourages people to do so in the first place. It only makes sense to say that if they willfully ignore said encouragement in the first place - of which, again, there is none.

Why is this concept so hard for people to understand? It doesn't help that as large as this game's community is, there's no single organized English fansite or forum dedicated to compiling information on how each job works (much less actual guides). The only resort for many people on our side of the ocean is google search or, even worse, wading through Reddit's terrible search algorithm.

(And I specify English because I'm willing to bet millions that the Japanese community has far more easily accessible information stored somewhere behind the language barrier, which would explain why the developers don't even see this as a problem.)

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No, I fully understand. But what people are asking for and what you're describing are two very different things. Judging by your explanation you want a gauge. Something that takes stock of your current stats, figures it's maximum output, and spits out your destination/target.

A Parser; as I said, is for people willing to learn. If people aren't going to be bothered to do a little work on their own, they will most likely not properly utilize a parser. It doesn't take as much as you would make it sound.

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Originally Posted by AlexionSkylark

There's Stone, Sky, Sea for that

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Dummy fights are a terrible metric because it only tells you the minimum you need to do, and it doesn't fight back. You won't be weaving in utility skills in SSS for that reason. Plus, it's completely optional, and it's hidden enough that most players aren't even aware it exists.

It's also why using the aggro meter as an indicator of DPS is also a terrible metric due to how differently aggro works for most DPS. BRD and MCH now have two emnity dumps that halve their current emnity, not to mention MCH emnity is also split between themselves and their turret. Same concept for Summoners. And everyone that knows their rotation well enough knows that they MUST use their emnity reducing skills/dumps or else they WILL die.

I dunno, maybe I'm just miffed at the fact that I literally just went through two EX roulettes with co-DPS that was literally doing as much damage as the tank was (and I had literally 3!!! times the damage output because I was actually using multi-target skills in large pulls), and in one run, things were dying at a below average time which caused the healer and tank to assume that the both of us were bad at playing our jobs. Factoring in that our gear wasn't that far from each other, the other DPS really had no excuse besides sheer ignorance.

And that's really what this thread is about in the first place. Good DPS gets zero recognition outside of raids. Parsing was only brought up because it's the only readily accessible tool to measure this. And yet people are afraid to call out bad DPS, because such an act is counterproductive in every way possible - in that doing so basically ADMITS that you're using a parser, and/or that arguing about it ultimately slows down the run even more.

So yes, going back to the original topic, this game really is a bad DPS' dream come true. When something like this is even possible and even bringing it up results in conflict the vast majority of the time, it's an issue that's going to (or already has!) creep into development. What incentive do the developers have to create harder/more varied content when the vast majority of the community is content with the status quo regarding the average player's performance?

At the same time though, I still have to wonder if this is a purely English community problem. You take a quick glance at the Japanese community and notice they have WAY higher savage clear rates AND at the same time, the healer DPS debate isn't nearly as toxic over there as it is on our side of the ocean. Why is that? Because their DPS are expected to perform at a much higher level than ours. My philosophy is that if you're going to main a DPS and take on the burden of the fact that you're going to be sitting in long queue times, you'd better at least understand the basics of your job, because I'd hope you're not sitting in queues for half an hour just to get carried and make things even MORE stressful for the tanks and healers accompanying you.

So there's two topics that people are absolutely tired of hearing about: Healer DPS and bad DPS/parsing. How to kill both with one stone? Start holding the DPS accountable. It doesn't have to be parsing. It's just SOMETHING needs to be designed into the game that gives a clearer indicator on how DPS are performing. Maybe then, it opens a window towards halting the third most annoying topic that gets spammed on these forums - the lack of varied/challenging content. The devs aren't going to break out of this content cycle if the playerbase won't demonstrate that they're ready to move beyond it. The devs, after all, have been repeatedly quoted as saying that they design content while monitoring clear rates - highly implying that if the clear rate doesn't meet their expectations, then they failed somewhere in designing it.

For the love of all that's Holy...

What I wouldn't give to be able to block threads from Elysium-wannabes running their mouths about other people's perceived shortcomings.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AlexionSkylark

Let's note for a while that there are a myriad of reasons for not performing other than being "lazy". There are all kinds of people out there, including ones who are not gamers at heart.

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You made many good points in this thread, well said. Somebody in my FC is a busy mother who doesn't have much time to practice and has a lot of distractions, usually playing while a baby is on her lap. All kinds of people play this game, which a dps number doesn't convey. We should be patient and accepting. Like you said, if somebody wants an optimal run, just preform a group. We don't need to harass people who aren't high performers until the game is whittled down to just the hardcore players.