Regarding the Revision of the Prohibited Activities and Account Penalty Policy

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Originally Posted by Katie_Kitty

Sounds like a rule designed to force tanks and healers to tank and heal for people. I'm a human being, not a slave, and personally I reserve the right to leave any duty at any time I desire to for any reason.

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By that same logic, you don't have to play in the first place. You sound like a real winner, and maybe you're one of the reasons why this was instituted. I'm sure you think trolling people is justified as long as it fits your world view.

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Originally Posted by PharisHanasaki

I'm just stating you are spreading incomplete info. They are doing this for the good of the community, they are a business, a business runs on money. Banning everyone for the silliest of things is dumb. And I doubt they will.

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And as the ol saying goes, 'The road to hell is paved with good intentions.'

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Originally Posted by Gemina

No, you wouldn't be susceptible because you DID NOT DO ANYTHING WRONG. Dude, listen. This isn't the media, and the GMs aren't SJWs out to protect every safe spacing idiot who plays this game. I know terms like 'emotional distress' brings about these kind of concerns, but the ambiguity is to keep everyone aware. When you draw a clearly distinguishable line, then people know how far they can go before they cross it.

It is easy tell everyone's over reactions because no one is even talking about the multiple warnings that are issued, and suggested corrective actions before you even face a 3 day suspension. It's just, "Player didn't like my playstyle, so now I'm going to get banned?" Can't you see how over the top that is? Seriously take a deep breath and just chill.

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With those warnings staying on your account forever regardless of whether they were fair or not, with no oversight or appeals process.

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Originally Posted by WaterShield

There isn't anything that I do that I think is problematic. Like I stated earlier in this thread. I have never been contact by a GM, warned, or punished, for anything, ever.

I am incredibly concerned for the potential of abuse that these vague rules create.

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Then you have nothing to worry about, WaterShield. You don't behave badly, according to what you're saying, and you don't do anything that "inflicts emotional distress" on someone. The GMs aren't going to start saying "because X person said they were offended Y person will be actioned"

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Originally Posted by Anger

This whole issue baffles me. If you don't intend to break the rules why are you concerned? Just don't break the rules and you have nothing to worry about.

If you intend to break the rules then there would be cause for concern.

Some of the issues stated are very obvious right-and-wrong topics. For example, a "reasonable" person would understand that Stalking is not okay.

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Please tell me whose standard of 'reasonable' we are following. Is it going to be the iron stomach of an uwu first or is it going to be the mushy stomach of the average Balmung/Mateaus young adult? I'm dying to know. And no one here intends to break the rules! The issue is the rules are so vague that anything is punishable. If I happen to do something most people would find mild but I land a GM that is high on woke culture, you bet your highlander ass I am in trouble. And this is due to the rules covering everything to be offensive and then at the same time having no line as to when it becomes offensive. That's the problem. Not, 'I want to say naughty words'.

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Originally Posted by Anger

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The issue here is that there are rules that are not clearly defined at all. There are even words that require SE's defining to their users so we would know how to comply.

Here is a set below the "Offensive Expression"


・Expressions that provoke or belittle another person, such as excessive criticism, negation/ridicule
There are people in this game that don't like any advice whatsoever, even if the advice is given in a manner that can't be taken as belittlement. Yet, I run into people who do feel that way, regardless how nice I am explaining things to them. That person can report me for feeling belittled.

A GM will need to determine if I am out of line or not, based on the report provided by the initiate of the report (the belittled). Calories and time spent by the GM because SE did not define what is "excessive criticism" was to the player.

・Expressions that significantly lack consideration for another person
Without know who the person is on the other side, how will I know if what I am expressing lack's consideration for another person?

Mind you, that "other person" doesn't have to be present to read the chat for "lack of consideration" to happen.


・Expressions that unilaterally reject another person's opinion
An example was used before about pull sizes. Basically, who's opinion wins if one person wants big pulls and one doesn't? Which is ok to reject unilaterally?


・Expressions that any reasonable person would find offensive
Expressions that any reasonable person would fine offensive in rural town Kentucky, USA may not be the same expressions that any reasonable person would fine offensive in metropolitan New York, USA. Who's set of standards is SE going to use to determine what is reasonable? SE has to define those for us and the GMs to follow.

・Expressions that compel a playing style
Who sets the standard for play styles? The players? SE? Is me asking a Ninja to use ninja spells so they can increase their DPS trying to compel that playing into "my" play style?


・Expressions that contravene public order and morals
Who's standards of public order and morals shall be used? We have multiple different public orders and morals within each Datacenter Region. Canada's public order and morals will not be the same as Mexico's public order and morals. Quebec doesn't necessarily share the same public order and morals as the rest of Canada.

Again, who's standards of public order and morals shall be used for this point?


・Other expressions that are offensive to another person

And here is the big one right here. Super broad, super undefined. Offense is something that has no actual measure, but I can be penalized for it. A GM cannot tell a player who is claiming that I am causing them offense that they are not actually being offended. A GM's view of offense will be different than the "offended."

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Originally Posted by Anselmet

Please tell me whose standard of 'reasonable' we are following. Is it going to be the iron stomach of an uwu first or is it going to be the mushy stomach of the average Balmung/Mateaus young adult? I'm dying to know. And no one here intends to break the rules! The issue is the rules are so vague that anything is punishable. If I happen to do something most people would find mild but I land a GM that is high on woke culture, you bet your highlander ass I am in trouble. And this is due to the rules covering everything to be offensive and then at the same time having no line as to when it becomes offensive. That's the problem. Not, 'I want to say naughty words'.

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Well, how do you treat other people in real life? Do you give them some respect and treat them nicely or are you rude and try to offend them?

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Originally Posted by WaterShield

Adults follow clearly defined laws and are only punished if they break them... and are always able to be aware that they are breaking the law before hand in the majority of cases.

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What? Have you ever heard of contract and/or civil disputes?

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Under the new rules I have no way of knowing if I am breaking the rules or not because they are subjective in nature. Meaning the only way I can be almost certain to avoid trouble is to refrain from speaking to anyone at all. I feel this defeats the purpose of an online game.

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I keep seeing this tossed around like communicative interactions between players is a common thing. When was the last time you walked up to someone gathering from the same nodes you are and started up a conversation? How about they to you? The lack of interactions between players in this game is something that has been ongoing for a long time now, and discussed in detail on these very forums about how to improve it. Guess what though? You know when you run into a random conversation in Limsa, Gridania, or The Reach between two or more players? That's not going to change. But perhaps when you say, "speak to anyone at all", you're just referring to giving players criticism? If so yeah, I would refrain from it. But it does not defeat the purpose for online gaming. We all have our reasons for playing mmos. Just like irl, players prefer to communicate with others they know, and not strangers.

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Originally Posted by Anger

I CTRL+F'd "offend" in the prohibited activities article and that word isn't used once.

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The word “offensive” is used quite a bit, though. And, generally, if one finds something to be offensive, that means usually means that they are offended by it. Don’t be obtuse.

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Originally Posted by Anger

There's a vast difference between someone being "offended" and "having deep emotional distress inflicted upon them".

I think things are being misconstrued a bit here.

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You also cannot provide a concrete measure for “deep emotional distress”, as it varies significantly between individuals.

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Originally Posted by Anselmet

And no one here intends to break the rules!

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Speak for yourself. The amount of trolling and asshattery in-game has been increasing steadily in recent months. I'm sure some form of it is benign when compared to some real cesspool in WoW, but as the subs are picking up players from that game, we'll get the same crowd as well. This is just pre-emptive measures that will keep the community from devolving further, a lesson learned from Blizzard's initial hands-off approach that caused problems which lead to their decreased subscription.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

The word “offensive” is used quite a bit, though. And, generally, if one finds something to be offensive, that means usually means that they are offended by it. Don’t be obtuse.

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Yes, but it isn't stating "if you're offended" it's stating if something was offensive and: inflicts emotional distress

Example of something offensive that wouldn't inflict emotional distress: I do not like your glam.

Example of something offensive that inflicts emotional distress: berating them, or telling them to play a specific way.

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Originally Posted by Gemina

What? Have you ever heard of contract and/or civil disputes?


I keep seeing this tossed around like communicative interactions between players is a common thing. When was the last time you walked up to someone gathering from the same nodes you are and started up a conversation? How about they to you? The lack of interactions between players in this game is something that has been ongoing for a long time now, and discussed in detail on these very forums about how to improve it. Guess what though? You know when you run into a random conversation in Limsa, Gridania, or The Reach between two or more players? That's not going to change. But perhaps when you say, "speak to anyone at all", you're just referring to giving players criticism? If so yeah, I would refrain from it. But it does not defeat the purpose for online gaming. We all have our reasons for playing mmos. Just like irl, players prefer to communicate with others they know, and not strangers.

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Generally one reads and agrees to a contract before signing. They usually use clear language to make it difficult to misunderstand the intent. Generally the attempt is made to avoid vague contracts because they are unable to be enforced.

Q: When was the last time you walked up to someone gathering from the same nodes you are and started up a conversation? A: Every day
Q: How about they to you? A: Every other day

"Just like irl, players prefer to communicate with others they know, and not strangers."
I enjoy meeting new people... and speaking to them... ergo communicating with strangers.

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Originally Posted by Anger

Yes, but it isn't stating "if you're offended" it's stating if something was offensive and: inflicts emotional distress

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Offensive things tend to distress me. Emotionally that is. One could even say it inflicts the distress.

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Originally Posted by Anger

Yes, but it isn't stating "if you're offended" it's stating if something was offensive and: "Offensive expression" means an expression in general that inflicts emotional distress by being offensive to another person. Offensive expression may include:

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See my reply: how do you measure this “emotional distress”? There is no concrete value for it. It varies between persons.

And you’re still being obtuse. If someone is going to report something as offensive, it probably means that they were directly offended by it. Why else would they be reporting it? You aren’t allowed to file reports on the behalf of a third party—the GMs will disregard it because it’s not being sent by the person involved.

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Originally Posted by Anger

Example of something offensive that wouldn't inflict emotional distress: I do not like your glam.

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Not entirely true. There are some people out there that take something innocuous like this as a personal insult.

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Example of something offensive that inflicts emotional distress: berating them, or telling them to play a specific way.

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While berating someone is uncalled for, telling a DPS to AOE so that things die faster is not offensive. Telling a healer to contribute instead of standing around for 80% of a fight is not offensive. Telling a tank to utilize cooldowns and/or tank stance if necessary is not offensive.

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Originally Posted by Anger

Yes, but it isn't stating "if you're offended" it's stating if something was offensive and: inflicts emotional distress

Example of something offensive that wouldn't inflict emotional distress: I do not like your glam.

Example of something offensive that inflicts emotional distress: berating them, or telling them to play a specific way.

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You are quoting Harassment section, offensive things aren't included in that. Now you're just strawmanning.

Offensives things go under:
■Nuisance behaviour
"Nuisance behaviour" means speech or behaviour that hurts others or obstructs game play, but which is not classified as harassment. Even if it was not the intention, a penalty may be imposed if the end result was that another person was hurt or obstructed.

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Originally Posted by Anger

Well, how do you treat other people in real life? Do you give them some respect and treat them nicely or are you rude and try to offend them?

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You need to reread what I wrote again and reflect because there are some people in life that will get offended even with the best of intentions. I have pissed people off in this game by trying to nicely help them through content. I have pissed a person off by making a joke that the majority of the alliance thought was funny and joined in on. That is the issue. You CANNOT control what people will find offensive and what will upset them. And no amount of claiming, 'well just treat people well and you will have no problems', will change that. As Xtrasweattea posted the vague rules, reread them again and perhaps try to realize why people worry about the demographics in this game that will abuse those vague rules. As I said much earlier in this thread. The rules will only benefit two groups of people: the actual toxic people we want to punish and the overly sensitive that get upset over everything.

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Originally Posted by WaterShield

Q: When was the last time you walked up to someone gathering from the same nodes you are and started up a conversation? A: Every day
Q: How about they to you? A: Every other day

"Just like irl, players prefer to communicate with others they know, and not strangers."
I enjoy meeting new people... and speaking to them... ergo communicating with strangers.

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Sure but do you approach them and say 'lmao you look like a f*** noob, git gud'. I sure hope not. Will any 'reasonable' person find a Hello, and casual conversation offensive? Probably not. So what's the issue?

Just yesterday I had a tank that kept harassing a smn because they we dying a lot in Orbonne. They died so many times he started calling him a hoe, a leech, a stupid f** idiot. Began to spam /slap him at every death. I simply said 'It's fine, just follow the party, and put the markers in the far back.' He died maybe once after that. So heres is a clear example of something I hope any reasonable person would find offensive. Did I report him? No. If the smn wants to he free to do so. And the chat will back him up.

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Originally Posted by Coltvoyance

Some of this seems rather scary. Demolition Man comes to mind... "Only express happy, joy-joy feelings towards others or get banned."

But, how am I supposed to correct someone who is playing poorly without causing "emotional distress"? Some people can have emotional turmoil from someone just saying hello. How am I supposed to know if my criticism of someones playing will have that effect? Should I just let them spam Cure 3, run out of mana, continually wipe the party and sit quietly for 90 minutes? How do I confront them? Can Square include an emotional sensitivity tutorial in the game that can teach me? Since it's now required to play the game?

Maybe I should set aside the first 10 minutes of each Duty Finder run to get to know each player. But what if other players get upset that I'm holding the run back for 10 minutes in an attempt to get to know them so I don't offend them accidentally and get banned? What if I get upset that they're upset at me because I'm trying to calibrate my comments to their emotional sensitivities? Do we all get banned?

Should I just not talk? Maybe I just shouldn't play with others. Or maybe not play at all? Would that be better?

I think that's the solution. No one's feelings can get hurt if no one plays.

It's time to shut FFXIV down. There's too much risk of human interaction in this MMO; which studies suggest is a leading cause of emotional distress. Even if you ban people afterwards, the emotional scar is still there. You can't take back the words. Exposing people to that kind of trauma is too dangerous. Shame on you Square Enix. How dare you profit from an online game where people talk to other people and risk having their feelings hurt!

You should be ashamed!

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What if a person feels deep emotional distress because that causes them to feel lonely and rejected? But don't speak too much either, because that could easily cause deep emotional distress in someone with socialphobia.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

See my reply: how do you measure this “emotional distress”? There is no concrete value for it. It varies between persons.

And you’re still being obtuse. If someone is going to report something as offensive, it probably means that they were directly offended by it. Why else would they be reporting it? You aren’t allowed to file reports on the behalf of a third party—the GMs will disregard it because it’s not being sent by the person involved.



Not entirely true. There are some people out there that take something innocuous like this as a personal insult.



While berating someone is uncalled for, telling a DPS to AOE so that things die faster is not offensive. Telling a healer to contribute instead of standing around for 80% of a fight is not offensive. Telling a tank to utilize cooldowns and/or tank stance if necessary is not offensive.

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I don't think it's appropriate to tell DPS to AOE, healers not to stand around, or tanks to use more cool downs. That is compelling people to play a certain way.

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Originally Posted by WaterShield

There isn't anything that I do that I think is problematic. Like I stated earlier in this thread. I have never been contact by a GM, warned, or punished, for anything, ever.

I am incredibly concerned for the potential of abuse that these vague rules create. I would like to say my piece before things get awful, rather than wait to tell you "I told you so" next year.

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Then this is not even crying over spilled milk. This is like throwing a tantrum over a carton of milk that hasn't even been opened yet. Not you specifically, but just the similar sentiments being expressed in this thread. If you have never in your life been contacted, warned or punished by a GM then you have absolutely nothing to worry about. Period. Not now, not tomorrow. Not ever.

Based on what you said, you sound like a nice, respectful player. Nothing will change for you, or anyone like you. That's my point.

Y'all need to calm down. Go outside. Run some laps or something. Meditate, I dunno.

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Originally Posted by PharisHanasaki

Sure but do you approach them and say 'lmao you look like a f*** noob, git gud'. I sure hope not. Will any 'reasonable' person find a Hello, and casual conversation offensive? Probably not. So what's the issue?

Just yesterday I had a tank that kept harassing a smn because they we dying a lot in Orbonne. They died so many times he started calling him a hoe, a leech, a stupid f** idiot. Began to spam /slap him at every death. I simply said 'It's fine, just follow the party, and put the markers in the far back.' He died maybe once after that. So heres is a clear example of something I hope any reasonable person would find offensive. Did I report him? No. If the smn wants to he free to do so. And the chat will back him up.

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I don't know because who are we using as an example of a reasonable person? This is not clear enough. All I know is a bunch of people just got carte blanche to ban people because they don't like them with very little to reassure me that it won't be abused.

Also if it seems like I'm panicking... that's because I am. This is actually deeply upsetting to me. It's sad that I even feel the need to communicate that. All I'm getting back is a bunch of empty platitudes. What I would like is reassurance from Square Enix that there will be oversight, clarification, and / or an appeals process. That is all I want. I've sunk too much time into this account for it to all disappear because someone decides they don't like me and to sic GM's on me instead of talk about it. The vagueness of the rules leaves them exposed to being weaponized in that way.

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Originally Posted by Anger

I don't think it's appropriate to tell DPS to AOE, healers not to stand around, or tanks to use more cool downs. That is compelling people to play a certain way.

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And I don’t think it’s appropriate for them to refuse to actively contribute. It’s not offensive to tell someone to please AOE, especially if it’s a majority rule. In high-end content, it’s not offensive to tell a healer to contribute to DPS instead of standing around waiting for damage to occur and doing nothing. It’s also not offensive to tell a tank to please use cooldowns.

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Originally Posted by Gemina

No, you wouldn't be susceptible because you DID NOT DO ANYTHING WRONG. Dude, listen. This isn't the media, and the GMs aren't SJWs out to protect every safe spacing idiot who plays this game. I know terms like 'emotional distress' brings about these kind of concerns, but the ambiguity is to keep everyone aware. When you draw a clearly distinguishable line, then people know how far they can go before they cross it.

It is easy tell everyone's over reactions because no one is even talking about the multiple warnings that are issued, and suggested corrective actions before you even face a 3 day suspension. It's just, "Player didn't like my playstyle, so now I'm going to get banned?" Can't you see how over the top that is? Seriously take a deep breath and just chill.

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I mean that's just your opinion, right? Do you have any further information that I haven't been made aware of? A nice distinguished line would really help to make your case here. I could see what kinds of behavior I'm not supposed to venture into, but it's so hard to tell right now.

Of course I mentioned penalties rather than bans. Those penalties will eventually add up to bans, however. Am I emotionally distressing you at the moment? I'm sorry if I am.

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Originally Posted by HyoMinPark

And I don’t think it’s appropriate for them to refuse to actively contribute. It’s not offensive to tell someone to please AOE, especially if it’s a majority rule. In high-end content, it’s not offensive to tell a healer to contribute to DPS instead of standing around waiting for damage to occur and doing nothing. It’s also not offensive to tell a tank to please use cooldowns.

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It's offensive to me.

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Originally Posted by Discordia

Speak for yourself. The amount of trolling and asshattery in-game has been increasing steadily in recent months. I'm sure some form of it is benign when compared to some real cesspool in WoW, but as the subs are picking up players from that game, we'll get the same crowd as well. This is just pre-emptive measures that will keep the community from devolving further, a lesson learned from Blizzard's initial hands-off approach that caused problems which lead to their decreased subscription.

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That is not even what I was saying. The dude above was claiming that unless we want to break the rules then we have nothing to fear. My reply simply meant that no one in this thread is advocating to be able to break the rules and be toxic.

And this base is not that toxic it has roughly remained the same (id actually argue that HW was slightly more toxic and its actually marginally better). I have no idea why anyone thinks that ffxiv is becoming more toxic due growth in wow population. This game has been taking wow refugees in for YEARS and it has been growing for YEARS. I have been running by myself in pf/df for five years. Nothing has changed in behavior. And I run into truly foul people only once a month IF that.

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Originally Posted by Anger

It's offensive to me.

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Ah, a great example of a person why these ToS are a bad idea.

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Originally Posted by WaterShield

I don't know because who are we using as an example of a reasonable person?

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I just find it funny at this point that you keep stressing out over something that could have already happen but hasn't. It hasn't happened, and probably won't. If we, as 'nice' players, get banned. Probably bunch of people not banned will stop playing too because of it. If we start to get banned en mass SQEX losses money. I do not find that reasonable. Do you?

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Originally Posted by PharisHanasaki

I just find it funny at this point that you keep stressing out over something that could have already happen but hasn't. It hasn't happened, and probably won't. If we, as 'nice' players, get banned. Probably bunch of people not banned will stop playing too because of it. If we start to get banned en mass SQEX losses money. I do not find that reasonable. Do you?

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I don't think it will happen in mass. But there are unacceptable odds that too many could slip through the cracks. I think it's too many if even one person is wrongfully banned.

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Originally Posted by Anger

I don't think it's appropriate to tell DPS to AOE, healers not to stand around, or tanks to use more cool downs. That is compelling people to play a certain way.

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You know, seeing your posts makes me finally understand what type of person I was beginning to argue with gg. You ARE the overly sensitive demographic I do not want abusing these rules. If someone wants to actively help you improve then it is not offensive. I learned so much on how to dragoon and sch by randos but its people like you who will cut this knowledge off out of fear of being punished. I feel sorry for the up in coming players. Because unless they have a well rounded fc they may never know that they are not playing their classes optimally because someone on the internet thinks that criticism equals being rude.

https://images-wixmp-ed30a86b8c4ca88...czo42v-pre.jpg

Let this serve as example that what is offensive to one person is not offensive to another. Yes there are people who find this offensive should this guy Banned for his Glam choice!!! SE knows things like this will get reported so goes without saying they have a line drawn its just not specified. The change is aimed at things that are seen as offensive by most people, such as personal attacks and verbal abuse.

Before anyone ask no I ddint report him. I have no issue with how people choose to glam, find his glam rather amusing to be honest lol

It only takes an overzealous GM banning someone with followers to cause heavy damage to games like these.

If there was a twitch streamer that was incredibly popular who get banned from playing FFXIV for telling another player to pick it up, or telling an off color joke to a friend but mispoke it in the wrong chat, and GMs banned their account over someoen taking offense, that is going to hurt the brand hard.

Again, I think people are fine with more GM intervention on certain issues, but I think the issue is the broadness and vague language of the TOS opens it up to abuse by those who are either perpetually offended or those with an axe to grind against others. We should, as players, have the right to critique and criticize how other players play the game. This doesnt mean slinging ad-hominem attacks or harassing and going out of your way to make their life hell, but we should have the ability to tell players "Hey, the way you play isnt great. It slows everything down and makes it more difficult for other players. You really should learn to play better." But under the new ToS, that can be construed as an offense worth GM intervention. Thats an issue. Well one of them.

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Originally Posted by Anger

It's offensive to me.

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I appreciate you proving the points I’ve been trying to make during my time in this thread.

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Originally Posted by Anger

I think I am a reasonable person and my level of sensitivity shouldn't be your concern. What should be your concern is abiding by the rules.

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The problem is, is that the rules cater to too broad a “level of sensitivity”. Your level of sensitivity seems far higher than mine based on our discourse over DPS AOEing, healer DPS, and tanks using basic cooldowns. I’m not offending by someone telling me to AOE 10 mobs, contribute as a healer, or to use my CDs.

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Originally Posted by Anselmet

You know, seeing your posts makes me finally understand what type of person I was beginning to argue with gg. You ARE the overly sensitive demographic I do not want abusing these rules. If someone wants to actively help you improve then it is not offensive. I learned so much on how to dragoon and sch by randos but its people like you who will cut this knowledge off out of fear of being punished. I feel sorry for the up in coming players. Because unless they have a well rounded fc they may never know that they are not playing their classes optimally because someone on the internet thinks that criticism equals being rude.

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I think I am a reasonable person and my level of sensitivity shouldn't be your concern. What should be your concern is abiding by the rules.

They can't action anything unless it's reported. And then you need proof of offense. Teaching someone is different from degrading them for not playing the way you want them too.

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Originally Posted by Anger

I think I am a reasonable person and my level of sensitivity shouldn't be your concern. What should be your concern is abiding by the rules.

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The rules that state

"■Nuisance behaviour
"Nuisance behaviour" means speech or behaviour that hurts others or obstructs game play, but which is not classified as harassment. Even if it was not the intention, a penalty may be imposed if the end result was that another person was hurt or obstructed.


・Expressions that any reasonable person would find offensive

You are a reasonable person according to you.

Ergo... we very much care what you (and everyone's) level of sensitivity is, as that is what determines if we are breaking the rules or not now.

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Originally Posted by Dragoonfyre

They can't action anything unless it's reported. And then you need proof of offense. Teaching someone is different from degrading them for not playing the way you want them too.

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Politely teaching people that are receptive to your teaching is perfectly fine. But making someone feel bad or inflicting emotional distress on someone because you're making them feel bad for not AOEing enough, standing around(being lazy), or not using enough cool downs is not right. It's all about the way you present your self to them.

Appropriate method for assistance: Hey, would you mind if I made some suggestions regarding your Job? (if they agree then proceed)

Inappropriate method of assistance: You're just standing around 80% of the time and not doing anything. (This is derogatory and offensive - it also inflicts emotional distress)

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Originally Posted by Anselmet

You know, seeing your posts makes me finally understand what type of person I was beginning to argue with gg. You ARE the overly sensitive demographic I do not want abusing these rules. If someone wants to actively help you improve then it is not offensive. I learned so much on how to dragoon and sch by randos but its people like you who will cut this knowledge off out of fear of being punished. I feel sorry for the up in coming players. Because unless they have a well rounded fc they may never know that they are not playing their classes optimally because someone on the internet thinks that criticism equals being rude.

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The person you're quoting can report all they want. Nothing will happen to anyone he/she reports. Especially if the GMs see that someone was merely giving him/her some protips.

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Originally Posted by Dragoonfyre

They can't action anything unless it's reported. And then you need proof of offense. Teaching someone is different from degrading them for not playing the way you want them too.

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World would be a better place if more people grasp this idea. :D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Anger

Politely teaching people that are receptive to your teaching is perfectly fine. But making someone feel bad or inflicting emotional distress on someone because you're making them feel bad for not AOEing enough, standing around(being lazy), or not using enough cool downs is not right. It's all about the way you present your self to them.

Appropriate method for assistance: Hey, would you mind if I made some suggestions regarding your Job? (if they agree then proceed)

Inappropriate method of assistance: You're just standing around 80% of the time and not doing anything. (This is derogatory and offensive - it also inflicts emotional distress)

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More like

Appropriate method for assistance: #1 Healing needed in this game is low, this gives you lots of opportunity to contribute damage to speed up the run. (Assuming you were using healer dps as the example)
#2 Holy is helpful when we are attacking lots of monsters.
#3 Using AOE abilities is more useful when attacking lots of monsters.

Inappropriate method of assistance:#1 You're a waste of space and should have been aborted. Insert racist / cancer etc.... : basically being absolutely vile.
#2 You're being carried since you don't seem to understand that you should be using AOE : being more than low key rude
#3 Use AOE moron : Just being generally insulting for no reason

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Anger

I think I am a reasonable person and my level of sensitivity shouldn't be your concern. What should be your concern is abiding by the rules.

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LOL! And your true colors are here. Watch out now! Anger might report us all for telling him his paladin isn't using enough cds. Which btw, as sch I find highly offensive. Guess this will be a quick draw in which of us get to a GM first.