Fell Cleaves...

[Elphy]

bad players will be bad players regardless of whether or not they get fc or participate in book burns. rmt will always find a way to make massive amounts of gil fast and gil buyers will always buy gil.

There is no need to punish legit players for something so silly. If they go back and ban hammer everyone who ever participated in fc pts because it's what some legit players do and just by chance so do rmt, they also need to ban all fishermen, all farmers, everyone who sold a chocobo blinker to an npc, the list goes on and on.

And with the 'disruption' thing, they would also need to ban anyone who ever /sh or /y for ls members, vw pts, storyline progression pts, mercenary work (seeking or offering), or anything that required you to sometimes /sh or /y for an hr or sometimes more since those can also be dubbed as 'disruptive', not to mention the trolls who /sh or /y for hrs sometimes offering services like tele's for gillions, and esp anyone who has ever participated in the dhalmel game which is by far the most disruptive thing anyone can do in /sh and /y.

I just /blist the fc pt ppl and go on my merry way. Problem solved in my book.

[Zarchery]

It seems a little counterproductive to me. The yells from the RMT doing the Fell Cleave parties are irritating. The thing is, they're just /yells, and it's pretty easy to blacklist them and move on. It's NOT so easy to blacklist one, then blacklist the next one after that one gets banned. On Carbuncle, we had the Yangs doing this. I have, on my blacklist, the following names of gil sellers who were spamming the yell channel for their FC party:

Yangem
Yangel
Yangek
Yangepp
Yangeq
Yangeea
Yangeem

I had to add a new name every week when the previous one got banned and my filter stopped working. Considering you don't even need to be higher than level 1 to run a yelling bot, what use is it going after them?

[Caketime]

I'm sorry to hear that NPCing your cruor was your largest source of gil. Seeing as how cruor is so easy to obtain however, it was a natural necessity if they wished to prevent rampant inflation.

If by "prevent rampant inflation" you actually meant "Wait until the damage was already done, then wait a year before fixing" then I agree.

[Demon6324236]

So my thread went from the ethics of FCs and the possibility of people buying gil to enter them, to blinkers... Get out of my thread and go argue elsewhere, this thread it asking for a response directly from a rep...

[Alhanelem]

So my thread went from the ethics of FCs and the possibility of people buying gil to enter them, to blinkers... Get out of my thread and go argue elsewhere, this thread it asking for a response directly from a rep...

If the only thing you want is info from SE, then you should contact support. This is a discussion forum and you can't expect people to not discuss your topic.

None of the discussion increases or decreases the likelyhood of getting an SE response, not that you should need one- Don't use a bot to spam cleave shouts 24 hours a day and you're off the hook. I've said this in multiple "I want a response from SE" threads, and SE themselves have said begging for a response does not modify your chance of getting one.

[Vivik]

I'm not stating that or implying it. I'm saying that people who spend this money on cleaves are comparatively more likely to have bought gil than those who don't spend that money on cleaves.

That is complete bullshit. You are pretty much alone in thinking this. You will argue anyway because that is what you enjoy; arguing a point to death till you think you have won when in reality the person just gives up wasting their time trying to reason with an idiot.

[Chilloa]

I'm not stating that or implying it. I'm saying that people who spend this money on cleaves are comparatively more likely to have bought gil than those who don't spend that money on cleaves.

I'm going against all instincts in replying to this, but I'm curious as to what research your basing this off of. Was there a survey or something that I missed? Or is it just another empty assumption that you're throwing into a topic like you usually do?

[Demon6324236]

I am not begging for a response, and you are not discussing my topic. My topic I started was on a post they made, saying FC parties were punishable now if ran by RMTs, at the same time I was given a contradictory statement from a GM, those who enforce these exact rules. What you all have been talking about is people buying gil to join cleaves, these people who would likely buy gil anyways because they can not find ways to make money and resort to that, this is not related to the topic. You also have talked about the ethics of FCs as they level people quickly, again, nothing to do with it, you have now had blinkers pop up, yet another unrelated topic in the same thread. These are not on topic, they are off topic, and thats why they need to stop.

I have not begged for SE to respond, I have gotten irritated because your incapable of keeping a thread on topic and feel the need to derail every thread with your nonsensical posts which are unrelated. For example, if I make a FC party it is not my job to know if the person joining me bought their gil, its impossible for me to know that really, so why should I be punished if I invite them and take their gil? Simple, I should not, now, if I join a FC shout and they are RMT, should I be punished for joining them? No, I joined a party by paying gil, not money, and thus did nothing wrong by normal conventions.

Punish RMTs all you like, its a great and noble goal, but when you start hurting your players who get caught in the cross fire your doing it wrong. Its like trying to catch a thief in a mall, and while hes running through a crowd of people the police simply open fire. That would cause a ton of injuries in the process, maybe even deaths, much like this can result in tons of unfair bans, and possibly a loss of a few subscriptions. I am tired of anti-RMT attempts effecting players, and in many cases, doing nothing to RMTs. If we are not RMT why should we be the ones effected more than anyone by these changes? RMTs can not make money by FCs, oh no, there are only a hundred other ways they can and do, on the other hand actual players do use the service, and if this is really a measure to stop RMTs as they claim then this is a terrible way to go about doing it.

I am not asking someone to go call and GM and post it here, I already talked to a GM, I was told something different than was posted here, that is why I want a response from a rep telling me what was said from the people who make the rules, not the ones who enforce them. I have never used a shout bot or anything of the sort like you say, but at the same time I am not risking my friends accounts or my own on going out and doing a FC when there is a looming threat that I may be banned for it because SE was unclear on their statements. SE is very stupid when it comes to support, I am sure if my character is banned they would never let me get it back. If that happened, I would quit, to much time and effort put into the game to lose it all on something as stupid as miscommunication between Square and their customers.

In short, you are not on topic, you are talking about several topics which are on something of similar nature which are not actually the same topic, which means you are off topic, and by being off topic, you are not discussing my topic. If you are not discussing my topic, you should not be in my thread be this a discussion forum or not, which means, if you want to talk about these things, go make another thread, this is not the place you are looking for.

[SNK]

I'm not stating that or implying it. I'm saying that people who spend this money on cleaves are comparatively more likely to have bought gil than those who don't spend that money on cleaves.

You're reaching too hard with this one. You don't need to buy gil to get into a cleave party. Honestly I don't do cleaving because I actually enjoy exping but I know everyone else isn't like me. Fell Cleaves are easy exp which is all the people doing it care about. I know a guy who funded a 99 Emp Staff *lol* by cleaving mobs for people who wanted exp.

I normally don't agree a lot with what Frank says but in this case he's right. You're being an ass for an ass's sake.

[Alhanelem]

You don't need to buy gil to get into a cleave party.

Need to? no. likely to? I think so. I question that any legitimate player would even consider buying into one when they could just as easily get into a normal abyssea party for free and still level up whilst expending minimal effort. You're welcome to prove me wrong, but I just don't see it. Maybe I'm just cheap/frugal, but even if I had 100 mil in my pocket right now (which I don't) I'd probably still consider it a waste. Please note that this is an opinion, not research / evidence.

I have not begged for SE to respond, I have gotten irritated because your incapable of keeping a thread on topic and feel the need to derail every thread with your nonsensical posts which are unrelated.

I'm really not sure how the things that have been discussed in this thread are not in any way relevant to the topic. All this talk about what activity is or may be illegitimate and how it is being determined is completely relevant to the topic, which is about fell cleave parties and how/if "legitimate" fell cleave parties can continue doing what they're doing without fear of bans.

There's nothing nonsensical about what I'm saying in my posts, but that's a separate issue altogether, and in the best interest of stability, I will not press any further further.

Punish RMTs all you like, its a great and noble goal, but when you start hurting your players who get caught in the cross fire your doing it wrong.

Can you prove that any legitimate players have actually been "caught in the crossfire" and banned in relation to this issue? If you can show this, it would remove any doubts I have.