Suggestion: Break the game, SE

[saevel]

How is the average gamer blacked out from Nyzul when the event only takes 30 minutes? For that matter, how are they blacked out from any event you call a time sink when no current endgame event takes more than 2hrs?

I also dont think he was saying that he wants events that are too hard for the paying customers. He expressly said that if people want the better gear, they just need to put in the effort. Your attempt to portray that as some sort of ad hominem attack that he secretly wants a false sense of superiority is not supported by what he said.

Actually ....

Earlier today I noticed not one, not two, but four different VWNM shouts that required the melee's to have Emp / Relic weapons. They were not even for Rex but for Ig, Gaunab, Uptala and drum roll please, Pil. I'm not sh!tty you, they demanded emp / relics for ... Pil.

How is the average gamer blacked out from Nyzul when the event only takes 30 minutes?

Because the people who will be organizing these events will demand Emp / Relics and nothing else. The "average" player doesn't have an Emp, I know I've been watching. Without solid friends or a shell getting past Stage II is pretty much impossible now. Nobody even remotely cares for the +2 drops from those NMs nor the Atma's, we've completely saturated the supply with them by having to do them x50 x50 x75. 50 really was too big a number, or the NM only dropping 1~2 was too little, either way it required such a grind that people refuse to help anymore. Relics are now more realistic to obtain then Emps due to being able to do the entire thing by yourself or nearly by yourself.

So yes, "average players" aka the majority of paying customers, are being c*ck blocked from events by leaders demanding relic / emps. Basically saying "you can not participate in any new content without first making yourself several Emps / Relics". And yes it's several, because at this point in time people have different jobs. And if the event leader needs a DRK, and you leveled DRK but have an Almace or Ukon, then your told to go piss off. If the event leader is looking for "Ukon WAR Onry" and you got a Torcleaver but also have WAR leveled and fully geared, your told to piss off.

[Zinato]

This is the flaw in Empyrean's design and the recreation of dynamis. Super weapons were never ment to be an every man item, and this holds true for nearly every MMO. However, now enough people have empyrean to make it "standard", the problem this causes is a rift between content. On the one hand those with empyrean find the content too easy since the weapons themselves are far superior to any non-super weapon counterpart. Then on the other hand, any player unable to gain an empyrean will likely find content too hard or else players will gain the idea of empyrean = faster and therefore only useful way to win. (Since zerg has been the play style for quite some time now)

The problem lies in the uncloseable gap of power in the Weaponskills along with double dmg aftermath, this on low delay weapons makes a major difference. When SE announced new Weaponskills for players that threatened to be as powerful as empyrean, those with the weapon fought back and eventually got the weaponskills weakened. (Not without reason however, they did after all create a weapon vs 100 merits) Had the weaponskills remained in power its possible empyrean would be counteracted and the situation wouldn't be what it is now. Alternatively if the aftermath or even the weaponskill itself was unlocked at 90 or more so 95 the balance would likely be restored. The fact that for larger teams empyrean is dime-a-dozen and for smaller teams its much more of a time commitment the balance will continue to shift. As more people make empyrean out of nessessity the gap grows ever larger and the means to acquire ever smaller.

Imagine for a moment, 6 months from now leveling drk, this is long after the abyssea rush and many ls' will be burnt out on creating empy after making so many others. But, you must have 90 GS to even have a chance of using the job, and whats more this may only be your second job. (This issue affects any DD regardless of how many other jobs a player has.) The common argument is just level a mage, but this not only lowers DD available for runs but from the players perspective has nearly the same result since magian staves are up to 8 or more per mage, excluding WHM. (besides, if a player is forced into a role they dislike its highly likely they wont hang around long.)

[Sagagemini]

The day FFXI breaks the random system for drops and start a point system it will rain in hell. Unfortunately that would be the best change for FFXI. There are so many interesting jobs in this game and so many events that a point system wouldn't remove the longetivity of the game for the casual or the hardcore.

But it would remove a lot of frustration. FFXI became more of a game about things you can't do unless you whore yourself to a linkshell (unless you are a leader, officer or virtual girlfriend from one of those) then things that you can actually log in for 2-3 hours and get things done. A lot of players appreciate that others can't achieve meaningful thing in 2-3h but they are just sick (lack of social life) and don't know yet.

I don't know if its linked to the japanese culture of self-suffering and this is why this random system drop still exists. The proc stuff made it even worse cause now you gotta have a friend nin another whm and another blm.

[Duelle]

Because the people who will be organizing these events will demand Emp / Relics and nothing else. The "average" player doesn't have an Emp, I know I've been watching. Without solid friends or a shell getting past Stage II is pretty much impossible now. Nobody even remotely cares for the +2 drops from those NMs nor the Atma's, we've completely saturated the supply with them by having to do them x50 x50 x75. 50 really was too big a number, or the NM only dropping 1~2 was too little, either way it required such a grind that people refuse to help anymore. Relics are now more realistic to obtain then Emps due to being able to do the entire thing by yourself or nearly by yourself.

This may have been the intention all along, going back to that interview where the devs "claim" they didn't call Abyssea a mistake.

Conspiracies aside, you'd probably have to create a new incentive to make people either grind merit points in abyssea or kill those mobs in exchange for something else. Like, say, an item "created" by killing three abyssea zone bosses that can be traded for one of the items required for the other trials. Could make it specific for each weapon (maybe a sword wielder gets "Blade Shard", a G-Axe user gets "Axe Splinter" and so on). Trading merit points for said items (probably 20 or so) would also work.

[Mahoro]

Actually ....

Earlier today I noticed not one, not two, but four different VWNM shouts that required the melee's to have Emp / Relic weapons. They were not even for Rex but for Ig, Gaunab, Uptala and drum roll please, Pil. I'm not sh!tty you, they demanded emp / relics for ... Pil.



Because the people who will be organizing these events will demand Emp / Relics and nothing else. The "average" player doesn't have an Emp, I know I've been watching. Without solid friends or a shell getting past Stage II is pretty much impossible now. Nobody even remotely cares for the +2 drops from those NMs nor the Atma's, we've completely saturated the supply with them by having to do them x50 x50 x75. 50 really was too big a number, or the NM only dropping 1~2 was too little, either way it required such a grind that people refuse to help anymore. Relics are now more realistic to obtain then Emps due to being able to do the entire thing by yourself or nearly by yourself.

So yes, "average players" aka the majority of paying customers, are being c*ck blocked from events by leaders demanding relic / emps. Basically saying "you can not participate in any new content without first making yourself several Emps / Relics". And yes it's several, because at this point in time people have different jobs. And if the event leader needs a DRK, and you leveled DRK but have an Almace or Ukon, then your told to go piss off. If the event leader is looking for "Ukon WAR Onry" and you got a Torcleaver but also have WAR leveled and fully geared, your told to piss off.

To be fair, i was responding to the point that grindy time sinks are blacking average players out. From a design perspective, no event takes over 2 hours in current FF endgame, so the argument that there are scads of casual or average players who cannot put in time or effort to do SE's events strains credulity. They might be grinds, and I myself do not appreciate artificial grinds like VW, but the intent of the programmer was never to black people out.

As to the phenomenon you are talking about, that lies SOLELY at the hands of the playerbase. Shouting for Relics or Empyreans ONRY in shit like Pil is sheer idiocy. There are various solutions for average players running up against that kind of mindset. One is to join an LS. Another is to start their OWN shout groups.

[Fupafighter]

They should make a DKP system added to LS's lol. So you can't be cheated out of your armor. Like say everyone gets 5 points for events attented and there is a minimum amount of say 100 before you can lot certain armor. This way LS leaders can't abuse people and people get rewards. Via we have to sign in for events with the LS before we start.

[Shipp]

TLDR;


Yes, If you don't carry any healing set or any physical damage down set, and I do, then your physical damage down and your healing sets suck compared to mine. This is because you didn't bother to make a set at all. Not because I have epeen gear and show it off to make others feel inferior.

I carry around a bunch of stuff because it makes my character perform better, and it doesn't require any grinding to get that improvement. I mean seriously, who wants to help a guy get his awesome strength headpiece when the guy doesn't even bother to keep it on him so he can use it afterwards? DO you really not feel annoyed when the mage runs out of mp, and you look over and hes not wearing any HMP gear while he rests? This is all stuff that can be bought cheap off the AH. not king drops.

How can you act like I'm lazy for complaining about months of grinding when you can't even be bothered to buy sets off the AH?

Pardon, but when did I say I don't have hMP sets, nuking sets, MND sets, etc? I didn't. I said I do not need to have them in my inventory 100% of the time. On my mage jobs, I always have my main set of gear plus hMP gear. Situational pieces that might not need use at the time are satcheled or sacked.

You're the one assuming incorrect things. I said nobody (aside from maybe blu) needs to carry 78+ different pieces of equipment for one job for any given event. I never said I don't have 78+ pieces that I use on my jobs. I said I don't have to carry them around in my main inventory 100% of the time while I'm on said job.

Also, you're still trying to portray yourself as superior about gear sets when you just attempted to say that the only reason I feel the way I do about endgame events is because I'm an elitist. Get your story straight. Am I an elitist, or a gimp? Make up your mind please.

I'm beginning to feel like Mahoro is about the only person in the thread who actually has reading comprehension instead of jumping the gun and slanting what someone else says.

[Shipp]

Wow, that was lengthy! Well, back on track:

Break the game, SE. Be brave, and bold. Do something new and innovative. That was what made FF special from the beginning!

Try something new -- because the current approach is just death by small doses. If you make the game shiny, new, and exciting -- and it still fails -- at least it would've gone out gloriously.

Let me requote the relevant parts.

You know, this is the exact same mindset of WoW players. Look how many subs dropped after Cata turned the game into easy-mode. Also, BC was a challenging expansion which most players actually did NOT raid, only the elites. I don't know where you're coming up with your info, but you're sorely mistaken and misrepresenting the facts. Blizzard has even stated that Cata's raids were easier because only a small portion of the playerbase had been raiding from Vanilla through WoTLK.

You are trying to bring a Cata-style revamp into XI, and Cata is the entire reason why I came back to XI. It's trash in terms of endgame. If you want easy events where you get the best gear, go play any other MMO, don't try to turn one of the last MMOs into that.

Yes, let's turn XI into the game that has now lost more subs in one year than XI and XIV even have combined.

You said you don't want godmode, but that's what you're wanting with them "breaking the game."

[Fupafighter]

Let me requote the relevant parts.



Yes, let's turn XI into the game that has now lost more subs in one year than XI and XIV even have combined.

You said you don't want godmode, but that's what you're wanting with them "breaking the game."

To be fair...I don't play these other games except FFXI, but if they had a MUCH higher population than FFXI, wouldn't that mean they're more likely to lose more subscriptions lol? Just sayin.

[FrankReynolds]

Pardon, but when did I say I don't have hMP sets, nuking sets, MND sets, etc? I didn't. I said I do not need to have them in my inventory 100% of the time. On my mage jobs, I always have my main set of gear plus hMP gear. Situational pieces that might not need use at the time are satcheled or sacked.

You're the one assuming incorrect things. I said nobody (aside from maybe blu) needs to carry 78+ different pieces of equipment for one job for any given event. I never said I don't have 78+ pieces that I use on my jobs. I said I don't have to carry them around in my main inventory 100% of the time while I'm on said job.

Also, you're still trying to portray yourself as superior about gear sets when you just attempted to say that the only reason I feel the way I do about endgame events is because I'm an elitist. Get your story straight. Am I an elitist, or a gimp? Make up your mind please.

I'm beginning to feel like Mahoro is about the only person in the thread who actually has reading comprehension instead of jumping the gun and slanting what someone else says.

In the other thread, one person listed out over 100 items that they could easily need on them at any given time. The same can be done for many of the other jobs in the game. No one is going to waste their time listing out all of their gear for every one of their jobs so that you can critique it.

Even if they did, it would still boil down to you saying "I could manage all that gear with the space we already have. So you can't have any more space"

The bottom line is you saying that people can't have more space because you are better than them at managing inventory, and that is a bull crap argument.

Reading comprehension is also a pretty funny argument being as in the other thread you said:

you assumed I was against more inventory/storage and attacked a position I never held to begin with

and yet you continue to argue that we don't need more inventory / storage here. Perhaps you don't comprehend the words that you are using Because you clearly want to assert your superiority at inventory management. You keep asserting that we don't "need" to carry things as if you are the authority on what can and should be done in the game. I bet you would take a different stance and turn all "elitist" when someone pops in claiming they don't need to swap gear at all. Trying to paint me as an elitist because I carry relevant gear is just lol.