Hvergelmir WTF SE

[Dallas]

Tann, I just realized your sig is standing in a "T" shape. Inspired by the "YMCA" song?

[Kimara]

Hvergelmir is the worst Empyrean weapon.

You're the worst Empyrean weapon! :P <3

[Sparthos]

Uh, no. The TP wing idea is for people who don't want to melee. I absolutely can hit whatever I want with it. The weapon absolutely does "funciton properly." It's not malfuncitoning just because you don't use a TP wing, it's just a SUGGESTION for people who would like to use the weapon skill as an extra source of MP as if it were, say, an MP potion, but without ever attacking, since that's so taboo for some of you.

The problem with a TP wing is that it isn't always available and is merely a workaround on the issue mages have with meleeing... namely that they suck at it. Dont get me wrong, I know you can use the Hvergelmir as a battery but the primary way to get that battery working is to get up front and melee.

(Or have a COR like me that often Tactician Roll's the party at stuff like Voidwatch)

You're missing my point and that is that mages do not make good melee. SE knows this yet they continue to churn out these "ultimate" weapons that revolve around the worst part of the class. What if the ultimate melee weapons required casting spells? Would you then tell me it'd work so long as a I pack some ethers beforehand?

It doesn't make sense.

Personally, while I don't make a regular habit of it, I have been able to hit with high accuracy against anything anyone else can hit accurately. Stop acting like these jobs are D rank in their weapon. Their skill is high enough (well maybe not SCH...) to hit anything they might want to hit with it.

Im going to call bollocks on this.

Against difficult targets, even DD have trouble hitting monsters meaning the ill-equipped mage is going to be in the toilet accuracy-wise. On easy targets you'll be able to get away with being near the front lines but at even the lowest tier of endgame your accuracy is going to suffer, you'll be in range of AoEs and the MP gained through being a frontliner becomes less and less effective.

Did I also mention that time meleeing is time you're not doing something else? Like support, crowd control, healing etc. I'll reiterate that I can see situations where the staff could be useful like popping a wing after an item dump !! then getting your MP back through the staff WS but that still puts the staff way below every other Empyrean by a good distance.

(It's not like the ODD works on nukes or avatars... nope, more melee-oriented garbage for a mage)

What do you really want, anyway? Every relic/mythic/empyrean has a special WS associated with it. The only way to use that weapon skill is to either attack or use a TP wing, whether it's a staff or a scythe, and whther it has stats on it you care about or not. You're most likely using this solo, so we, the people who own this weapon, are not suggesting you go try to melee Rani or something. We're suggesting you use it where you can for the function it serves: One of the best MP restoral effects in the game. If you stack max MP when you use it, you can easily get up to 1000 MP or more out of it. Other than the most die hard fans, who cares what else the darn thing does? The weapon skill is the whole purpose of the weapon. If you don't like that, well, too bad.

Too bad indeed that SE can't realize that mage weapons should serve mage purposes and you shouldn't have to be shoehorned into meleeing when the classes offer little in the way of gear to serve that purpose.

Melee aren't suddenly asked to cast spells to access their tools, PLD shields don't require support spells to activate and the BRD harp/horn doesn't suddenly require you to tank in order to activate the unique effects but it's perfectly fine for mages to be tied down to melee in order for their weapons to work.

Right.

[Tannlore]

Tann, I just realized your sig is standing in a "T" shape. Inspired by the "YMCA" song?

It's always fun at the...




Horutoto Ruins!!!!

[Leonlionheart]

*cough* Camlann's Torment *cough*

Can still use Drakesbane with it, and can keep aftermath up too. Just gotta play with it correctly.

haven't been reading all the way through have you. It isn't necessary for them TO melee to use the WS. Especially in abyssea, you.. do know this right? I know you do, stop being coy.

You're asking for a lot. Usually SMN is in it's own party, and not usually inside Abyssea in the first place.
1) Sacrificing ally resorces to give you TP is bad, mmmmmkay
2) Sacrificing atma slots to give you TP is bad, also
3) Sacrificing atmacite slots is actually ok. So this is something that makes the staff usable for TP regeneration.

[Alhanelem]

You're missing my point and that is that mages do not make good melee.

You're missing the point that it isn't about being good melee. The staff has utility, regardless of your melee capability. It's also really easy to get among empyrean weapons.

Melee aren't suddenly asked to cast spells to access their tools, PLD shields don't require support spells to activate

err what? ninjas cast spells, DRKs might cast certain spells, PLDs definitely cast spells. And actually PLD shields do require spells to activate *more*.

It's fine that you don't like the staff, but it is there for the people who do like it and have a use for it. If you're able to leverage it, Myrkr is a great tool to have, not just for the MP restore but for the status cure too.

[Dallas]

2) Sacrificing atma slots to give you TP is bad

LOL, Physical pacts > magic pacts and Myrkr > Minikin. It all comes down to a Ukon WAR having to eventually admit he is a subpar SMN.

[Leonlionheart]

Sacrificing atma slots to give you TP is bad

l2read

[Neisan_Quetz]

You're missing the point that it isn't about being good melee. The staff has utility, regardless of your melee capability. It's also really easy to get among empyrean weapons.

err what? ninjas cast spells, DRKs might cast certain spells, PLDs definitely cast spells. And actually PLD shields do require spells to activate *more*.

What? Aegis doesn't require any "spell" to activate more, it is always active. I shouldn't have to explain Ochain.

Having utility doesn't stop the staff from having poor utility by being tied to the worst aspect of the jobs that can equip it, especially since all 3 typically have better things to do than waste time poking the mob with a weapon that does nothing to enhance each job's strengths. No one cares about how useful it is in giving unlimited mp versus trash mobs.

[Venat]

Best weapons for Mages are Mythics...period... BLM mythic at lv99 has something like... MAB+50. How I know this is it goes +5-10 MAB every 5 levels.

That do crazy... amount damage. Could do something like 15k-40k dmg a tier5 with brew on. It pretty muh gives you extra 5-10k DMG to your high lvl spells.