Response to Yoshi P: you can fix it.. but

It will require more work.. it is more work than DT and EW content combined and you can compare it to 1.0, damage is done and it is good that you accept it, but it is not enough.

Ignoring the complains for years it will backlash you at some point and we are in it.. story was great before DT but here is the truth, DT shows that story can't save you and you have to work more to give people reasons to believe in you, damage is done but it is repairable.. but it require care to the community and people who still believe in you and your team, here is my feedback on what should be done to fix what you have been ignoring for years:

FFXIV suffers, there is no reason to sick in, most people who ignores a game for more than a 3 months will less likely to return back, unless there is an expansion so what to improve to make people stick in a game for fun reasons?

- Gameplay / Netcode:
server structure is holding the game potential for years and it is debt from 1.0 that you didn't pay for it yet, there is a clear latency and request response is less than other online games, even indie games fix their issues and that put a lot of pressure on devs to create a unique experience.

- Progression / Open world:
there is close to nothing to progress in open world/maps in this game, most other online open world games have 3 to 9 systems to progress in the world, it feels alive when there is lots of things to do in open world and then you can integrate the story with open world content and please don't mention fates they are just as horrible as other systems.
things I like is how aether-current grind is enjoyable but again it is creating a problem to give solution and it is 1 time and done never comeback.

- Gameplay / Jobs:
Jobs are one dimensional and the fact that we call non-crit stat as a stat is pathetic, there is no reason to care for a system that have no impact in the game, everything feels like it is calculated with a calculator and gives no room to WoL choices and that's a bad a horrible system.

here is a simple ideas to improve job system,
*Skills will be replaced based on stats: gameplay will change based on stats you have.
*Balance encounter instead of balancing jobs: this will give more room to play unique jobs instead of caring too much of how X job damage.
*Rework jobs that do not perform well and Jobs that do more than other jobs, make a clear guidelines when it comes to designing a jobs.
*Skills should have a higher impact and should feels rewarding, not with animations but on gameplay aspect.

- Story: focus on one theme:
the issue with dawntrail story is that it is focusing in lots of things without a care on player experience, SE isn't an indie company.. they released most successful story in games but I feel like it is just a bad decision by Mr. Yoshi P, focus on one theme get it perfect ask yourself this: do FFXIV players want this theme? will they like to be dragged down with wuk lamat in her journey? why we need WoL in her story? what they can add?


- Replayability: Content generating machine:
criterion dungeon is a perfect example of how you ruin a content in a worst possible way, also other old content there is no reason to play it, and if there a reason it will be one time done, replayability is 0 and even current content is still close to 0.
there should be a system that reward players who do play old content and the reward is most important thing that you do not fix yet.


it is just a multiple bad decisions by Mr. Yoshi P and I believe he is not giving FFXIV another chance to shine after ShB.. I think there is a lesson to be learned and there is a chance to change but if think that saying "Please do not retire" will fix it, you are just out of your mind, this cow will not milk forever, if you think people can't leave FFXIV because they attach themselves on the game you are wrong..

WoW exodus: there are players who play WoW for more than 20 years and drop it, do you think FFXIV players can't do it after playing for 10 years?



End.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BabyYoda

- Gameplay / Netcode:
server structure is holding the game potential for years and it is debt from 1.0 that you didn't pay for it yet, there is a clear latency and request response is less than other online games, even indie games fix their issues and that put a lot of pressure on devs to create a unique experience.

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Server structure is holding them back, yes, but that's a 2.0 decision, not a 1.0 decision. They've proven they can solve this too because they ran the Cloud Test DC.

Can't really comment on netcode because my ping is high. I've been more concerned with the animation delays personally.

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WoW exodus: there are players who play WoW for more than 20 years and drop it, do you think FFXIV players can't do it after playing for 10 years?

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I got a feeling a lot of them still went back after "quitting".

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

I've been more concerned with the animation delays personally.

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The worst part of this is mods have fixed it for years but XIV team refuses to address it. But considering they're finally adding chat bubbles (another thing that has been fixed with mods for years), I shouldn't be surprised I suppose.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

I got a feeling a lot of them still went back after "quitting".

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Understandable. Player feedback is being heard and they've put out two good expansions back to back because of it.

I haven't played WoW since Cataclysm, but even I'm feeling like taking the plunge back into WoW to get away from YawnTrail and the trash combat system we've had for the last 5 years.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by lolnotacat

The worst part of this is mods have fixed it for years but XIV team refuses to address it. But considering they're finally adding chat bubbles (another thing that has been fixed with mods for years), I shouldn't be surprised I suppose.

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Because it isn't an issue in Japan so it is not a priority to fix.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BabyYoda

It will require more work.. it is more work than DT and EW content combined and you can compare it to 1.0, damage is done and it is good that you accept it, but it is not enough.

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Nahhh, i don't think so. ;)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BabyYoda

- Gameplay / Netcode:

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Overall the netcode of FF14 is good. Yes, there are some delays. But you will never get rid of them because the physics says "no". And i know only one game, which has better netcode and it is WoW. And i played a lot of MMORPGs. If you want to see bad netcode then play Swtor or ESO.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BabyYoda

- Progression / Open world:

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Yes, i agree. There is a lot room for improvement.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BabyYoda

- Gameplay / Jobs:
Jobs are one dimensional

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The jobs are so dull and one dimensional because the players implicitly asked for it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BabyYoda

- Story: focus on one theme:

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Seriously, it is very hard to predict, whether the players will like a story or not. In DT, they tried something new and they failed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BabyYoda

- Replayability: Content generating machine:

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FF14 does a better job when it comes to reuse older content than many other games. That's a problem, which every MMORPG faces. And i do not know a good solution how to solve it.



Cheers

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Originally Posted by Larirawiel

Seriously, it is very hard to predict, whether the players will like a story or not. In DT, they tried something new and they failed.

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No--they told us it was a VACATION and has been anything BUT a vacation. It's just more work we have to do (and babysit at the same time). The Golden city was not anything at all worth mentioning because of how poor the direction of it was--and another world we have to either save or destroy because it wants to mess with the source. Japanese don't have a clue on what the word vacation is because they don't go on vacation. They work themselves to death and wonder where their lives went wrong since they turned 18 and could work for the first time.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Elkanah

No--they told us it was a VACATION and has been anything BUT a vacation. It's just more work we have to do (and babysit at the same time). The Golden city was not anything at all worth mentioning because of how poor the direction of it was--and another world we have to either save or destroy because it wants to mess with the source. Japanese don't have a clue on what the word vacation is because they don't go on vacation. They work themselves to death and wonder where their lives went wrong since they turned 18 and could work for the first time.

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Well, yes.

That's also the reason why so many JRPGs and anime are set in the high school setting.
It's basically the only time period they can look back on fondly, before they become cubicle salesmen.

I'm not saying that's the general rule of thumb, but it is the reason why so much media is set in the high school setting.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Larirawiel

Seriously, it is very hard to predict, whether the players will like a story or not. In DT, they tried something new and they failed.

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I wouldn't even say it was new. They tried to use elements from previous expansions which worked but failed to execute that at every level.

Largely this is because they tried to fit so much into what is really a "new start".

Doing something new would have been to not have a big baddie and instead have focused on building this new world, its people and the struggles they go through. Make it like ARR in terms of building the world through city states and its rulers and politics.

Even if it'd be like ARR I would have much rather us made a name for ourselves in this new world similar to how we did in ARR vs what we got.

There were so many ways they could have executed kicking off the next leg of our adventure and they just took the worst possible route and executed it in the worst possible way.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Elkanah

No--they told us it was a VACATION and has been anything BUT a vacation. It's just more work we have to do (and babysit at the same time). The Golden city was not anything at all worth mentioning because of how poor the direction of it was--and another world we have to either save or destroy because it wants to mess with the source. Japanese don't have a clue on what the word vacation is because they don't go on vacation. They work themselves to death and wonder where their lives went wrong since they turned 18 and could work for the first time.

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Maybe they meant with "vacation" vacation from Zodiark, Hydaelyn & Co. ;) I don't know. Ans seriously, if it was a vacation addon then it would be boring anyway. Because vacations are boring.

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Originally Posted by KurenXIV

I wouldn't even say it was new. They tried to use elements from previous expansions which worked but failed to execute that at every level.

Largely this is because they tried to fit so much into what is really a "new start".

Doing something new would have been to not have a big baddie and instead have focused on building this new world, its people and the struggles they go through. Make it like ARR in terms of building the world through city states and its rulers and politics.

Even if it'd be like ARR I would have much rather us made a name for ourselves in this new world similar to how we did in ARR vs what we got.

There were so many ways they could have executed kicking off the next leg of our adventure and they just took the worst possible route and executed it in the worst possible way.

---

Babysitting Wuk Lamat is pretty new in an expansion, IMHO. And they went away from Ascians, Garleans etc. So there are many new aspects, IMHO. But not in a positive way.


Cheers

Honestly the comment sections here were a lot more stable and fair than I would have expected. Good job to all.
That being said, "what will be will be" (que sera sera). We'll see what we get and if the content is what we wish to personally invest in.
If it's all the same to you, I'd like some enriching balanced storytelling back in the game for villains and aspiring heroes alike. Some tactics games are simple in their stories and yet enriching all the same. I can see a vacation scenario where it could very well be interesting, adventurous and thrilling without it being an ouroboros of a certain golden cat telling us about the friendliest friendship to ever peace and harmony.

That and and the slow degradation of Job independence or uniqueness is slowly beginning to become more apparent with each new iteration (patch and/or expansion), so I'm hoping they can do something about that. They [Square] need to put more stock into their MMO if they want more money for their side-projects that seem to be hit-or-miss cases.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Larirawiel

Seriously, it is very hard to predict, whether the players will like a story or not. In DT, they tried something new and they failed.

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Not really?

Quality of the MSQ has always been consistently good in FF14. Even SB was only bad because it's considered to be worse in relative to other expansion, rather than because it was objectively bad. So if your players have been consistently praising you for one thing, I don't think the "it's hard to predict" argument really fly here. The problem stem from a quality of the staffs problems, not because they're trying something news:

- They moved their top writer Ishakawa to other project, and handed the writing to a team that's much less talent.

- They moved Koji-Fox, who has been handling the English localization with a spotless record for 10 years and handed the task to someone who are far less competent and professional ... and it shows.

- Instead of keep hiring top talent - theatrical trained professional British VA, they opt for cheaper and much less professional American VAs ... and it shows.

- In EW, instead of giving us a full zone for relic, we got a a simple "just grind for tome" in the last relic.



And of course, the "copo" reason for all of these are: oh we're just trying something new, oh we're doing this to improve presentation, oh we thought players didn't like long and complex grind for relic so we made it easier. But do you see one common thread among all of these "we did it in the best interest of players"? Conveniently, each and every of those actions will result in saving them money and lower cost? So yeah, I don't buy it. This is like believing youtube's new "pause experience" is genuinely an attempt to improve user's experience, and not "we're just trying to jam as much ads down your throat as we can because it makes us more money".

So no, this is simply just them trying to cut cost and hope you will see it as them trying something new.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Raven2014

- They moved Koji-Fox, who has been handling the English localization with a spotless record for 10 years and handed the task to someone who are far less competent and professional ... and it shows.

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Um.. Koji-Fox's record is actually quite spotted and not without scandals being caught out in weird stuff.

Recently a bilingual (JP/EN) content creator has even started calling him out as actually quite detrimental to the international versions of the game, because of his insistence on rewriting things 'his way' in ways that will then produce massive plot holes in future patches (because the JP devs base how they will proceed on the JP version of the game, not the 'creative localization').

Under Koji's guidance, the localization team has simply omitted major plot points that exist in the JP version from the EN version, completely changed the personalities of major characters (seriously, people like Urianger and Alphinaud, Gaius and Haurchefant), confused things that were supposed to be obvious in the JP script, inserted sexual innuendo in a lot of jokes where they weren't in the JP, changed character motivations (e.g. did you know Gaius never meant to conquer Eorzea? His lines at the start of the Praetorium make SO much more sense in JP, while in English he seems to be seeking you to side with him in.. conquering your own home?), and so many more liberties that ended up creating plotholes and things that look like retcons to EN players a few expansions down the line.

Koji is also rather too fond of his own mythos and gets away with overselling his influence on the game because he can tell the EN player base his side of the story in interviews that don't get fact checked by the JP team.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Eyrilona

snip

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Ok, proof for any of these claim please?

I tried to google one of your claim (about Praetorium ) and the first result is from ~5months ago by someone on reddit who tried to challenge the English translation while openly admit they use "google translate" and then re-write it into proper sentence. Needless to say they got immediately called out for their audacity.

I've been studying Japanese for about 3 years now and while I'm not any where near proficient, I know enough to discern when the Japanese VA don't match the sub. It's the reason why I decided to swear off a lot of tittle from Nintedo the last couple years until I can fully play them in Japanese after too many "there is no freaking way that's what they said" moments with their games. And I honestly don't see what you're claiming.

- I know Y'shtola has the most radical change. In JP she's more a stoic sage, whether in the English version she's more a sassy witch.

- I'm pretty sure the JP community actually think the English Shakespearean Urianger is a better portrayal of his character than the JP version is.

- Your claim about Haurchefant and sexual innuendo ... seriously are you sure you're not getting your accusation backward here? The JP Haurchefant was a total flirt and that's exactly why he got tone down in the English version. This one is hilarious to me because - full disclosure - a lot of my practical experience with Japanese came from reading eroge so his JP line was very familiar to me.

- I have NEVER heard anyone who interpret Gauis's speak the same way you just did, in English or JP. He believes in strength, and those who endowed bear the responsibility of bringing order to the world, kind of like a noble oblige. It's because he recognize the WoL's strength that he wants us to join him, that's a way for him to show respect.

- I know Koji is quite liberal with his insertion of meme, especially in naming of quest.

Again, I'm not exactly fluent so I can be wrong or miss something, I'm just saying if you have proof for any of your claim, that would be nice to see.

To be clear, I'm not a purist who would rail again "localization" simply because it's "difference". I'm fully aware of the difference between translation and localization. As a born and raised Asian but living in the US, it's not rare for me to not be able to translate one from another even though I would consider I'm naturally fluent in both language. The reason why I'm pointing out this is for the most part, his localization are well received because the change he made are often in good taste. Also, he ALWAYS had solid direction, evidence by the strong VA performance we consistently see in the last 10 years. The same can not be said for DT, like ... not even close.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Elkanah

No--they told us it was a VACATION and has been anything BUT a vacation. It's just more work we have to do (and babysit at the same time). The Golden city was not anything at all worth mentioning because of how poor the direction of it was--and another world we have to either save or destroy because it wants to mess with the source. Japanese don't have a clue on what the word vacation is because they don't go on vacation. They work themselves to death and wonder where their lives went wrong since they turned 18 and could work for the first time.

---

I believe at this current point of time, the "vacation" meant that we are not the main character of Dawntrail. Wuk Lamat is, and lore community is theorizing that she is apart of Azem's legacy, and we helped her with that legacy because we carry it too. I don't think advertising: "Hey guys, you aren't the main character in Dawntrail." would be a good tactic to get people to buy your expansion. Its just a theory, and yes... I know a lot of people won't be happy reading this. I am just giving out the deets since I tend to listen to the lore nerds.

What's wrong with the new english localization?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Valence

What's wrong with the new english localization?

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Something is wrong with the recording and the voice direction for multiple characters

Graha was flat the entire time, the only time I felt like he showed his range as the crystal exarch was during the gondola scene, y’shtola sounds like she recorded her voice lines in a bathroom and while we all know the “SPHEEEEEEEENE” there are multiple scenes by multiple characters that feel like the director didn’t actually give the VA the context of the scene and they sorta had to guess what it was. It’s become really noticeable even though I feel like the EN localisation has been slipping since the 6.x patches

It's not something unique to DT, we've had this in EW as well, and I even remember one instance in HW where Urianger sounded very weird. Perhaps DT was the worst though. In my opinion it's a problem on the acting direction/producing and recording side of things, not the translation side, which seems to follow the same render than it always has, for better or worse?

https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/i...FGq49CbETRTQ&s

I've never really had a problem with the voice acting itself (except really Alphinaud, I'm sorry since the actor seems really nice, but I preferred the one from ARR).

But the voice environments have always been... not good. Everyone knows this already for ARR. In Endwalker, Meteion talks quietly to us in Elpis from the other side of the arena and our characters act like they can hear (this would not really happen). It's been a constant issue in a lot of cutscenes where I know in real life I'd not be able to hear their mumbling from that far away. Then there is the lack of a megaphone of some form with Wuk Lamat's speech, which would be fine if a loud voice shouted and echoed on the walls, but her voice is not exactly loud since she is mumbling stuff about happiness. Then I recall echoes where it seems a stretch (but possible) such as The Rising Stones.

Ultimately I put it down to the fact it's a video game and they just don't 100% nail real life with it, but I would appreciate if they did, especially when it's something that is so easy to notice like these examples.

As for localization, just know that the new one has said how they vehemently disagree with this asssessment of them and that localizing instead of translating is the "only way to do it" and that you discover this if you actually do the job they're doing. They talk to the writers extensively asking lots of questions about the intent, what information they want to convey with the story, and what emotions they want to convey, then localize it in a way that achieves what the writers wanted but in the target language. For example, something that triggers sadness in Japan may not do so to English speakers due to different cultures and histories, so they may need to do it differently in order to achieve the same result.

*sigh* I'll bite:
"DT shows that story can't save you" >> Flawed reasoning. If the story was actually good, then it would be enough. DT story is lackluster, and only because of that do people start to see some of the worse aspects of the game. ShB had less repeatable content and less features, yet hailed as a great expansion solely because of story. So clearly, story quality does define an expansion, for FF14 at least.

"FFXIV suffers, there is no reason to sick in, most people who ignores a game for more than a 3 months will less likely to return back" >> Meh, for other games maybe. Not MMOs. And this MMO is also designed to allow players to put it down and come back later. Example: ilvl is basically worthless. Each expansion, the first few dungeons give gear with similar if not better stats than high-end raiding of the last expansion. You can literally just skip an expansion and pretty much come back right away. Players often do return. Very often raiders will just raid for a month or two, then quit, and come back on the new tier. That's fine.

"Gameplay / Netcode" >> Even with 150 ping, netcode seems fine. It's the animation locks that are unnecessary. Said animation locks can and should be fixed sometimes. Other than that, most of what people call netcode issues is usually a skill issue though.

"Gameplay / Jobs" >> Issue with creating wildly different jobs is that job balance now gets thrown out the window. For casuals, that's fine, they won't care. But for high-end raiding? For ULTIMATES? The devs will get an incredible amount of complaints about players feeling that they're being forced to play a certain class or role. This system of kind of homogenizing jobs on a macro level (2 minute bursts) but still creating different rotations on a micro level, is good and allows for more finetuned control over job balance. And even that still leads to metas.

"gives no room to WoL choices and that's a bad a horrible system." >> True, stats need to be looked at. It's kinda silly how bad Piety and Tenacity are. But even so, there will always be 1 meta even if they fix that. This is not something the devs enforce. This is decisions made by numbercrunching gamers who are optimizing the fun out of the game and people just blindly follow it.

"Story: focus on one theme" >> They do this, and then people WILL complain that the story is shallow, boring, and uncomplicated, and that it treats the players as too dumb to handle complex subject matter, and the players then wish the story touched on more themes. The writers will not win regardless of the choice they make, so in this case I would recommend just giving them free reign on what they want to make stories about.

"Replayability: Content generating machine" >> One of the few things I agree on. Game needs more casual/midcore content that can be repeated and is rewarding and fun to do and gives something to do when not raiding, and when you had enough of doing roulettes every day.

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Originally Posted by Raven2014

- Your claim about Haurchefant and sexual innuendo ... seriously are you sure you're not getting your accusation backward here? The JP Haurchefant was a total flirt and that's exactly why he got tone down in the English version. This one is hilarious to me because - full disclosure - a lot of my practical experience with Japanese came from reading eroge so his JP line was very familiar to me.

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The thing with Haurchefant and the innuendo was that Koji removed it due to something about him feeling that since there was the possibility of it being gay if your character was also male and him not thinking that would not sit well with NA audiences which would cause backlash. He didn't add it, he subtracted it, and his reasons came off as, and frankly were, very homophobic. He was even scolded by Yoshida for it publically. I don't remember the details, but it was a big thing back then. To me it came off as the same sort of unintentional homophobia all my straight friends are guilty of, and were not aware of it being homophobic until it was pointed out. So I will give him a pass since it was just a singular incident in a game they were being extra careful in. He has gotten criticism over changing major story beats that do drastically change things, but that was addressed as well and while the excuses made sense, they also didn't. It was something about social and cultural differences, which didn't make sense with the changes since there was nothing that could be considered offensive or polarizing. It was reductive, however, with key plot points being lost. I know in ShB, esp toward the end, there were a lot of changes, but idk if he was still the lead back then or if Kate already had her fingers in it. That being said, Kate needs to go, she doesn't have a job, she has an agenda and its getting tiresome. I would love Koji back, even with his slip ups.

Games just seem to have a massive deficit of one way homosexual attraction

Games either seem to say “no gay characters at all” or “confirmed reciprocal gay romance”. There never seems to be the casual flirting that’s common amongst straight relationships in the gay space where one character flirts at someone of the same gender regardless of if the recipient is or isn’t attracted to the same gender

Horesfart was actually a breath of fresh air in this field for male WOL’s in the JP version and the decision to tune it down to the graha style “trusted companion wink wink nudge nudge” was definitely a misstep in my eyes

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Larirawiel

The jobs are so dull and one dimensional because the players implicitly asked for it.

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Which players? I keep seeing this argument yet I have never seen a significant amount of people asking for jobs to be braindead copies of each other. Are those players in the room with us right now?

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Originally Posted by Larirawiel

Seriously, it is very hard to predict, whether the players will like a story or not. In DT, they tried something new and they failed.

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Did they try something new? DT has another world-ending threat we have to deal with, one who is basically Emet Selch but with worse writing. It has a well-intentioned but inexperienced young person who wants to unite people, like Alphinaud was with his Crystal Braves, except Wuk Lamat's story is worse written and she faces no consequences for her foolish decisions. The theme of loss and having to let go has been something we've been getting beaten over the heads with since Shadowbringers.

I think a large part of people's anger is caused by the fact that the expansion was incredibly falsely advertised. The only one who got a vacation was Estinien and there was no rivalry between Scions.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AnimaAnimus

The thing with Haurchefant and the innuendo was that Koji removed it due to something about him feeling that since there was the possibility of it being gay if your character was also male and him not thinking that would not sit well with NA audiences which would cause backlash. He didn't add it, he subtracted it, and his reasons came off as, and frankly were, very homophobic. He was even scolded by Yoshida for it publically. I don't remember the details, but it was a big thing back then. To me it came off as the same sort of unintentional homophobia all my straight friends are guilty of, and were not aware of it being homophobic until it was pointed out.

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I guess this comes down to people's experience. I've seen JP Haurchefant and I think he would have made me pretty uncomfortable. Not because I'm homophobic (at least I like to think I'm not, being a queer woman) but because he would have felt like he's coming on WAYYYYY too strong. I like the headcanon that JP is what he things, EN is what he actually says. I thought ARR Thancred was really pushing too hard onto the drunken lecher trope, too.

Probably have to get direct translations from someone who knows JP. Ive heard a lot of things changing in translations. And even with my anime level / jp gag comedy show level japanese. Its not hard to figure out if the English sentence is "We'll help" and the JP goes on for like 3 sentences more theres something missing.

Recently watched someone in youtube review Valkyria Chronicles and the localizer butchered the original meanings probably cause they hated the characters' opinions or something.

Hot take. Translate directly. If theres something that loses meaning and is a JP cultural meaning / word THEN do a English equivalent. DONT change the character or their personality / their opinions. You didnt design the character, you didnt write the lines, tone down the ego and do your job.

Not saying anything about the story's quality, saying that the vacation was falsely advertised is disingenuous as heck. They specifically, many times mentioned in every live letter that this was a vacation, but nudge nudge wink wink, they'd probably get more than what it seems to be at first. Did people seriously expect that a RPG final fantasy title would be a beach filler episode?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by PercibelTheren

Which players?

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These players, who start a whine thread and complain about it, that job X is unplayable now because job Y does 0.7675% more dps. SQEX listened to it and they removed almost all differences, which made the jobs somehow unique. And now, a job is only a skin over a role.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by PercibelTheren

Did they try something new?

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You are not the main character now. This is ... somehow new, yes.


Cheers

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Games just seem to have a massive deficit of one way homosexual attraction

Games either seem to say “no gay characters at all” or “confirmed reciprocal gay romance”. There never seems to be the casual flirting that’s common amongst straight relationships in the gay space where one character flirts at someone of the same gender regardless of if the recipient is or isn’t attracted to the same gender

Horesfart was actually a breath of fresh air in this field for male WOL’s in the JP version and the decision to tune it down to the graha style “trusted companion wink wink nudge nudge” was definitely a misstep in my eyes

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Alternatively, you could be Bayonetta, where it's "sisters, hint hint nudge nudge wink wink" in 2 and then all of a sudden the character gets hard confirmed to be straight in 3.

Think about the appeal being made in this thread. Final Fantasy XIV prints money no matter what because of its whale player base with 0 standards. They can continue to do nothing and keep making money. Or they can do something that, by your own admission, is quite challenging and even a bit risky. And even if they do that, there's no guarantee that they'll win back disgruntled players who've left, or make more money going forward. They probably would. I certainly think they would. But why even take that risk to begin with, when simply doing nothing lets them remain profitable?

The XIV situation mirrors modern gaming as a whole. Corporations are always gonna be chasing more profits at any cost, but whales buying into this crap every single time are why it's allowed to keep getting worse. Square's shareholders will hound them for greater returns, and "the scary cash shop lady" will push out some grossly overpriced garbage emote that could've been an earnable item via an event instead... and for every responsible consumer who refuses to accept that and votes with their wallet, there'll be a whale who's buying a single one for every alt on his bloated account. Then they'll turn around and tell me not to judge their purchases, even though on the whole, these types of people have turned my favorite hobby into an endless grift.

Nothing will be fixed. The game printed money even during covid lockdowns when there was no content for close to a year because of the shutdowns. And sure enough, after all that, they began pushing the envelope on how long we could go without updates. From three months to four. 4.5 if we're being realistic. But they continue to charge each month, so ... think about that, right? Every four months we hand them the equivalent of a new game's worth of money, and what do we get in return? Like... one dungeon? A 24man raid? A boring story? But even if you quit, these whales will stay subbed and buy four fantas every day until their eye color is just right. We're cooked, fam. The game's being driven over a cliff, and whales are in the back seat screaming "faster, faster!"

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Originally Posted by Larirawiel

These players, who start a whine thread and complain about it, that job X is unplayable now because job Y does 0.7675% more dps. SQEX listened to it and they removed almost all differences, which made the jobs somehow unique. And now, a job is only a skin over a role.

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So they made balancing easier on themselves by removing all the differences and somehow them being lazy is the players' fault. Got it.

Just silly that currentn skills is replaced by new graphics and how it is performed... jobs donøt need new skills they need their old skills back, you can on top of it per 10 levels add a damage boost to or whatever but keeping the looks.

It seem rather inefficient that spending so much time creating new icons and GFX of how they should look instead of just keeping the old one.

Also remove 4-5 jobs from the game for good among Heals/Tank/DPS and on top of that get diversity to the current jobs and more development those ways if anything.

There is nothing to do in the world and old areas is dead and only used for lvling up characters for the only reason that you need to go there for job quest things which holds after you reach SHB where you do all combined job progression making SHB/EW areas no reason to visit after.

You need to open some sandboxes badly in the current worlds.... and no more ridicoulous fategrind.

Next expansions, you could get really much out of working with the current areas instead of making new ones... the list of unused areas is staggering.

I don't think dawntrail is the worst expension I just wish that the first half would have been longer because the potential was so there to me the game started falling down in endwalker where well we do things that aren't needed and the expension felt rushed not gonna lie and post ew could have been a whole expension and would have been great with the right build up.

all job are alike none really feel unique and the healer are almost practically useless now if you have a warrior/paladin as tank so they need to fix the healer role and tank role first in my book

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Originally Posted by PercibelTheren

So they made balancing easier on themselves by removing all the differences and somehow them being lazy is the players' fault. Got it.

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That's right. Because this is the only reliable way to get balancing right. Other games tried other approaches and failed.



Cheers

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Originally Posted by Larirawiel

That's right. Because this is the only reliable way to get balancing right. Other games tried other approaches and failed.



Cheers

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Except they haven't even manage to do that successfully.

At this point, I'd take some imbalances for better job identity and gameplay.

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Originally Posted by MisterNublet

Except they haven't even manage to do that successfully.

At this point, I'd take some imbalances for better job identity and gameplay.

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Yes. But the balance is good enough, that the players do not complain about it at a big scale. And the other problem is, FF14 focuses on solo- and small group content. And so you have to give every job everything, which fits in the role of the job. Ot you end up like WoW with tons of class stacking on certain encounters etc.




Cheers

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Originally Posted by Raven2014

Ok, proof for any of these claim please?

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Look for the (long!) MSQ playthrough from bilingual streamer and translation critic DoublePerfectKO on YouTube. You will have to have a lot of patience though, he doesn't make summaries and his streams average 4-7 hours a piece..

Good introduction is in his introductory video: "Everything You Know About FFXIV is Wrong: A Realm Rewritten"

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Originally Posted by Eyrilona

Look for the (long!) MSQ playthrough from bilingual streamer and translation critic DoublePerfectKO on YouTube. You will have to have a lot of patience though, he doesn't make summaries and his streams average 4-7 hours a piece..

Good introduction is in his introductory video: "Everything You Know About FFXIV is Wrong: A Realm Rewritten"

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Why would I need to go watch some streamer on youtube? In case you missed it I already said I can translate those things myself since I'm learning Japanese, I even outlined the change I that I verified myself in my reply to you.

What I am asking for proof is your "claim" about the reaction the JP dev have about his "way".

I'll be blunt, I don't know who this youtuber is, but if your post is a reflection of the content than ... let's say I already know what the video gonna be like. I watch enough content creators to know that 90% of them often attached some outrageous claim or hot-take to help drive-engagement, often making a half-lie or conjecture based on a granular of truth. If your interpretation of Gaius is an echo of this youtuber ... I'm not sure I would place much value in their interpretation in general. I watch them purely for entertainment, I don't treat them as influencer. Now it's fine when people just state their opinion, but whenever someone make something that sound more like a allegation or accusation I often ask for proof. It's the same reason why I asked the other poster to show proof for their claim that the Harchenfault's change was due to sexuality or that Yoshi published chew Koji's out for it.

Like I said, I'm capable of understanding Japanese so I can verify thing myself. Also most of the change due to localization have been well documented for years in the community. So it's weird to hear about new angles and allegations that suddenly pop out of nowhere ... which again in my experience ... usually the result of someone found their new favorite streamer/youtuber/influencer. So unless there is an official statement or proof provide, I tend to trust my BS meter when it goes off and treat these kind of things as hearsay. But I also have a morbid curiousity, so I'm very interested in (real) proofs, and it's there I won't deny it.

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Originally Posted by Raven2014

Why would I need to go watch some streamer on youtube? In case you missed it I already said I can translate those things myself since I'm learning Japanese, I even outlined the change I that I verified myself in my reply to you.

What I am asking for proof is your "claim" about the reaction the JP dev have about his "way".

I'll be blunt, I don't know who this youtuber is, but if your post is a reflection of the content than ... let's say I already know what the video gonna be like. I watch enough content creators to know that 90% of them often attached some outrageous claim or hot-take to help drive-engagement, often making a half-lie or conjecture based on a granular of truth. If your interpretation of Gaius is an echo of this youtuber ... I'm not sure I would place much value in their interpretation in general. I watch them purely for entertainment, I don't treat them as influencer. Now it's fine when people just state their opinion, but whenever someone make something that sound more like a allegation or accusation I often ask for proof. It's the same reason why I asked the other poster to show proof for their claim that the Harchenfault's change was due to sexuality or that Yoshi published chew Koji's out for it.

Like I said, I'm capable of understanding Japanese so I can verify thing myself. Also most of the change due to localization have been well documented for years in the community. So it's weird to hear about new angles and allegations that suddenly pop out of nowhere ... which again in my experience ... usually the result of someone found their new favorite streamer/youtuber/influencer. So unless there is an official statement or proof provide, I tend to trust my BS meter when it goes off and treat these kind of things as hearsay. But I also have a morbid curiousity, so I'm very interested in (real) proofs, and it's there I won't deny it.

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...I referred you to that particular stream because he starts by answering, with published sources (interviews, and a formal apology that the company had to make due to a controversy in Korea that went back to Koji's work), at length in the first hour of his first stream that very question you asked me. Do you want me to write in my own words a very long explanation that someone else has already recorded? You demand answers from me, but refuse to actually engage with media containing those answers? And now you are denigrating a content creator you have never even watched, because you have decided to disagree with me and therefore any source I refer you to must be some kind of bad?

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Originally Posted by Eyrilona

...I referred you to that particular stream because he starts by answering, with published sources (interviews, and a formal apology that the company had to make due to a controversy in Korea that went back to Koji's work), at length in the first hour of his first stream that very question you asked me. Do you want me to write in my own words a very long explanation that someone else has already recorded? You demand answers from me, but refuse to actually engage with media containing those answers? And now you are denigrating a content creator you have never even watched, because you have decided to disagree with me and therefore any source I refer you to must be some kind of bad?

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Alright, so I just went ahead and watch the first 45min of that video you recommend. I hope that will please you and show my good will.

And seriously, it was hard to watch ... because it's exactly what I was expecting it to be.

- The information presented was nothing news, and has been well documented in the community.

- What is "new" in this video is his hyberpolic take and spin as most content creators do.

- I'm guessing this video is also the "proof" for what the other poster claimed to the reason change is "homophobic in nature" and "scold by Yoshida", which would be another example of hyperbolic interpretation unless the other poster was referring to something else.


In short, after watching the first segment of this video, I conclude that it does not vindicate anything you originally claimed. They had a process in place, some member of the team discussed their concern (Koji was not even the lead at the time, and the discussion were hold with 2 other teams beside English), the process is found insufficient and create inconsistency, they reviewed and promise to keep thing consistent in the future. Both your original post and the video seems to imply either there is a hidden agenda or that the localization team are some kind of ego driven personality. Again, I watched (the first 45min), I saw what presented on the screen, and my interpretation of them is not the same as yours or that of the presenter.

In hindsight, maybe I should not have made the previous post before giving the video a chance, so for that I do apologize. Even if the content of the book is exactly like the cover, it was wrong to reached a premature conclusion like I did before checking.

However, after watching it, I do stand by every thing I said in the previous post. If anything, it kinda prove why I thought I didn't need to watch it in the first place. I don't plan on watching any more of it, if you believe there are other moment beside the first 45min of that video will help move the needle, feel free to provide links with the specific timestamp and I'll happy to check it out and verify myself, but I don't plan to waste any more time on it.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Raven2014

However, after watching it, I do stand by every thing I said in the previous post. If anything, it kinda prove why I thought I didn't need to watch it in the first place. I don't plan on watching any more of it, if you believe there are other moment beside the first 45min of that video will help move the needle, feel free to provide links with the specific timestamp and I'll happy to check it out and verify myself, but I don't plan to waste any more time on it.

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Very well, what are your thoughts on the segment from 3:22:30 to 3:26:00 in his stream "ARR's Lore is Soul-Shattering (In Japanese). A Realm Rewritten Lore Exploration #1", which goes over a forum post by Koji? (If you don't know, 'Fernehalwes' is or was Koji's forum name. We don't know/can't prove that his later editing that post was because he was scolded or otherwise made aware of it being inappropriate, but either way it does reflect poorly on his level of maturity.