Chill with the fates in Zadnor, I can't even reach them before it dies

I have all the aetherytes unlocked, I bought the riding map, and I still cannot reach the fates because people kill them in less than a minute. Can people chill with the fates? Back in Stormblood people waited patiently and set a pull time so everyone - newbies and veterans alike - can get there in time. What is your hurry to kill the Zadnor fates so quickly? This was a problem in the Southern Front and it still is in Zadnor. Like ffs I got 3 silver medals in a row because people have no patience. And this is with most people only have 1 or 2 stacks of damage valors. Imagine what it would be like when everyone has 10 and the fates die in 30 seconds. The developers need to fix this by doubling the HP of the fates, but players also have the responsibility to be patient and wait.

What I dislike even more is that when people do 2 fates at once in the same zone.
You can hardly reach the 1st and then when its dead, the other one is on 90% >_>
The same happened with the Yokai event as well though, thats why I waited a few days after it became to obnoxious to me.

It will probably help if you focus on just one "zone" for a time and switch it up as needed. Each area drops a different relic item, as do their respective CEs. And in my opinion the mettle gains between the 3 are a difference of 30-40k, so that shouldn't slow you down that much. You are getting 0 if you aren't making it to the skirmishes. :p

The fates didn't respawn immediately in Stormblood. They do in Zadnor, so it's less of a problem. I advise finding the middle of the area and waiting there for the next one to spawn, then you have an equal distance to travel where ever it spawns. I mean the middle of where you happen to be farming (bottom, middle or top area, choose one to farm at a time).

This isn't even a matter of people being impatient, it's like... every fate feels super undertuned. the CEs feel fine but the fates just melt. I'm pretty sure the dino is actually made of papier-mâché.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

The fates didn't respawn immediately in Stormblood. They do in Zadnor, so it's less of a problem. I advise finding the middle of the area and waiting there for the next one to spawn, then you have an equal distance to travel where ever it spawns. I mean the middle of where you happen to be farming (bottom, middle or top area, choose one to farm at a time).

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

It will probably help if you focus on just one "zone" for a time and switch it up as needed. Each area drops a different relic item, as do their respective CEs. And in my opinion the mettle gains between the 3 are a different of 30-40k, so that shouldn't slow you down that much. You are getting 0 if you aren't making it to the skirmishes. :p

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Yes what you said might work, but why not just have everyone be a bit more patient so that everyone can make it to the fate in time, tripling the number of fates you go to. If everyone was just a bit more patient and waited for 30 seconds, we can get triple the mettle. Patience is a virtue, my friend.

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Originally Posted by Avidria

This isn't even a matter of people being impatient, it's like... every fate feels super undertuned. the CEs feel fine but the fates just melt. I'm pretty sure the dino is actually made of papier-mâché.

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This as well. They need to at least double the HP, if not triple it.

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Originally Posted by Venandi

Yes what you said might work, but why not just have everyone be a bit more patient so that everyone can make it to the fate in time, tripling the number of fates you go to.

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No that would reduce the amount of fates to a third of what they would otherwise get, not triple, because in the time they waited, 2 more fates could have spawned.

They are making it on time, so you are just being slow. My advice is what they are doing to get there in time.

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Originally Posted by Avidria

This isn't even a matter of people being impatient, it's like... every fate feels super undertuned. the CEs feel fine but the fates just melt. I'm pretty sure the dino is actually made of papier-mâché.

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They scale based on the activity in the area. If you are completely alone for hours you will find you can solo them, but if a lot of people are fighting them their health increases a lot.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

No that would reduce the amount of fates to a third of what they would otherwise get, not triple, because in the time they waited, 2 more fates could have spawned.

They are making it on time, so you are just being slow. My advice is what they are doing to get there in time.

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Your suggestion means everyone has to wait in their assigned zone for a fate to pop. So yes, having everyone get to every fate will triple the amount of fates you participate in. I know it's not exactly triple since each zone has a different amount of fates to select from but it's very close to triple. This is just basic logic. If I can get to every fate in three zones, then it is triple that over if I can only get to every fate in one specific zone. Maybe in reality it's more like 2.5 times because the first zone has less mettle but you get what I mean.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

They scale based on the activity in the area. If you are completely alone for hours you will find you can solo them, but if a lot of people are fighting them their health increases a lot.

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If that's true then that means the devs forgot to adjust by valor. The more valor each person has, the more HP the boss should have. Simple fix.

Not sure about the scaling. When there were lots of ppl about I managed to solo the rdm boss fight in top zone. However, last night I was alone tried again, his hp was massive he killed the npcs then one shorted me at like 20% remaining lol I even had to shout 3 times for a res there was so few ppl about who weren’t occupied or something.
Likewise the fate just round from the NW aether, doesn’t matter how many ppl are in duty it’s like 5 trash mobs and done. More ppl just melts them in less than 10 seconds. If your not standing at that aether or fate spot when it pops, good luck to ya

It feels like particular skirmishes just don't seem to scale at all. The Brachiosaur in Zone 2 and the Mammoth in Zone 3 in particular never seem to scale up for more than a handful of players, because every single time I've done those the NPCs shave off 10% of their HP on their own before anyone gets there, and me charging in with Seraph Strike and Assize easily blasts a good 10-20%. It's gotten to the point that I call the Brachiosaur Skirmish "T'huban with the Terrible Health Pool". :p

Assuming that Skirmishes work the same as overworld FATEs, i.e. using the amount of players that last completed the FATE, rather than actively adjusting immediately, I guess it's sort of a continuous feedback loop where the Skirmishes start out for a few people, and 2-3 people manage to blast them away before the crowd gets there, so the stuff never gets a chance to scale up, or something.

The two things I learned very fast:
- Focus on one zone only and stand in the middle of it so you can reach every spot fast (you will see people gathering there)
- Be in a group: Even if you are the first at the fate, you may only get silver if you are alone. Just shout "lfg zone (1, 2 or 3)"

I feel like I am going crazy over this too, and then ofc a mob tags you and is hitting you hard so now you have to run around circles to get hits in so you don't miss the fate reward because the fate is being finished too quickly.
It feels really chaotic and annoying a lot of the time.

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Originally Posted by Venandi

Your suggestion means everyone has to wait in their assigned zone for a fate to pop. So yes, having everyone get to every fate will triple the amount of fates you participate in. I know it's not exactly triple since each zone has a different amount of fates to select from but it's very close to triple. This is just basic logic. If I can get to every fate in three zones, then it is triple that over if I can only get to every fate in one specific zone. Maybe in reality it's more like 2.5 times because the first zone has less mettle but you get what I mean.

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You misunderstand how Bozja and Zadnor work...

You farm section #1, #2, or #3. Not all of them at once.

There is typically 1 fate up at any given time in each of these 3 sections ie. the one SE intends for you to farm next.

You get less mettle from the lower sections so just focus on the highest you have access to, or go lower if you want the relic item drops, but do 1 at a time. Otherwise you'll be disappointed because you aren't doing it as it's intended nor how other people are doing it.

There are riding maps which increase you speed in zone. They are 25 clusters. I bought one yesterday for zone 3 cause stuff there just dies way to fast. Don't have that much of a problems with zone 1 and 2 personally.

Few thing mystifies me in BSF, Zadnor, and even Eureka; especially players who dead refuses to stick in one party when situation allows them to (i.e. in the same lv range as the other & not getting disbanded or worse, kicked) but later complaining they're not getting the full credit. Partying can really be a game changer when it comes to getting full reward or not since we do share -some- contribution between participating members. I've literally been one of those paper skirmishes but still getting full credit even when I only manage to slap the boss with -one- move because few of my other faster partymate were already there whacking the baddies. :o

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Originally Posted by Venandi

If that's true then that means the devs forgot to adjust by valor. The more valor each person has, the more HP the boss should have. Simple fix.

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Then what's the point of grinding for the medals.... :rolleyes:

There are ways to minimize your chance to not miss those skirmishes, which others in this thread had already mentioned---ESPECIALLY committing in one zone, only. And yes, I said 'minimize', so even then you'll still miss a few of them. But as long as the content hype is still around, trying to get them all will usually end up getting absolutely nothing. Besides, how are we going to 'control' the way another player behave?

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Originally Posted by Rhus

Not sure about the scaling. When there were lots of ppl about I managed to solo the rdm boss fight in top zone. However, last night I was alone tried again, his hp was massive he killed the npcs then one shorted me at like 20% remaining lol I even had to shout 3 times for a res there was so few ppl about who weren’t occupied or something.
Likewise the fate just round from the NW aether, doesn’t matter how many ppl are in duty it’s like 5 trash mobs and done. More ppl just melts them in less than 10 seconds. If your not standing at that aether or fate spot when it pops, good luck to ya

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They don't scale based on the number of people in the area, they scale based on the number of people that showed up to that FATE the last time it spawned.

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Originally Posted by StouterTaru

They don't scale based on the number of people in the area, they scale based on the number of people that showed up to that FATE the last time it spawned.

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To what do they scale when the pop for the first time in a new instance?

What myself and a few others have determined is that teleporting between zones isn't really viable with how big each zone is and how spread out the teleport locations are.

Pick a zone, and stick there for a while.

Almost everybody can make it on time. The onyl times I ever can't make it on time are the superfast fates, like the brachiosaurus and the red mage.
If you wanna do all three areas at once you're just being greedy.
I don't get why people should waste time and wait for someone who's doing a fate in another area, before doing the one of the area they're focusing on. It's not Eureka. In Eureka fates have to be specifically spawned and they're rare and spread out. In Bozja/Zadnor there'll always be various fates on at once, at least 1 per area, enough for everyone to get enough of them at any given time.
Tbh I'm really glad Bozja is not Eureka and you can just jump in and do whatever.
And as others said, get a group.

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Originally Posted by Pepsi_Plunge

The two things I learned very fast:
- Be in a group: Even if you are the first at the fate, you may only get silver if you are alone. Just shout "lfg zone (1, 2 or 3)"

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This. Was at zone 3 and waiting the esper fate to start, fought with tank stance on for a whole minute or 2 alone until people came in and still god silver (took 50% of one of the 2 bosses) so yeah, just get a group or be really juiced with essences and skill to make a difference.

A healer with dps essence plus Cleric Stance does A LOT for example

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Originally Posted by Pepsi_Plunge

To what do they scale when the pop for the first time in a new instance?

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To 1 person. You shouldn't take "new instance" literally, because instances aren't necessarily new. They just stop letting people in for a while. In that time the fates have probably spawned and expired and scaled to 1 person again.

It's relevant that while the amount of people who fought that fate previously affects the scaling, the amount of people who fought fates linked to it is also relevant. What fates are linked together is something that can only be observed.

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Originally Posted by Avidria

This isn't even a matter of people being impatient, it's like... every fate feels super undertuned. the CEs feel fine but the fates just melt. I'm pretty sure the dino is actually made of papier-mâché.

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Yeah, there have been some, like the "Still Only Counts As One" in the third zone(LoTR reference anyone?) where I get there and both enemies are still at 90%+ HP, then all of a sudden the mammoth drops dead(see it's HP in the enemy list go from almost full to nothing in a second, with only 5-6 people around it), then a second or two later the imperial dies. Not sure what actions people are using...but there definitely seems to be some tuning issues going on.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

They scale based on the activity in the area. If you are completely alone for hours you will find you can solo them, but if a lot of people are fighting them their health increases a lot.

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Full instance, and a FATE just vanishes roughly a minute after it spawns....definitely more than just scaling.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

They scale based on the activity in the area.

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Basically this.

The issue happens when a Fate pops in the second part of the map (example) and nearly everyone rushes there. This leaves zone 1 almost empty. If a fate spawns in zone 1 at this time, it will now be massively undertuned because only a few players are in that zone. The huge crowd of players in zone 2 finish their fate and rush over to zone 1. They melt the fate in 30 seconds. Meanwhile zone 2 is empty now and another undertuned fate pops there. And so on.

You can see the intention of the design is that new players at the starting area don't get stuck with difficult fates while everyone else is in the higher zones. But it doesn't work in practice, nor is it necessary when even high level players travel between all the areas and you need various items from each zone.

The fates pop fast enough that you can generally stick to one of the three zone and still be hitting them consistently, and covering just a third of the map means you can get to them before they hit 0.

Also join a group/start one if needed so that multiple people are hitting things so you can get gold even if you show up to one partway through.

join a farm group so when you get there and somehow to land a hit on the mob you still get gold from your group who got there arleady.

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Originally Posted by Venandi

I have all the aetherytes unlocked, I bought the riding map, and I still cannot reach the fates because people kill them in less than a minute. Can people chill with the fates? Back in Stormblood people waited patiently and set a pull time so everyone - newbies and veterans alike - can get there in time. What is your hurry to kill the Zadnor fates so quickly? This was a problem in the Southern Front and it still is in Zadnor. Like ffs I got 3 silver medals in a row because people have no patience. And this is with most people only have 1 or 2 stacks of damage valors. Imagine what it would be like when everyone has 10 and the fates die in 30 seconds. The developers need to fix this by doubling the HP of the fates, but players also have the responsibility to be patient and wait.

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With SB did you mean Eureka?
In Eureka people set pull time for the NM fate because it took some effort to spawn them, and the time is set by the spawners. People are more respectful to wait for the pull time because, well they're not the one who spawned it.
Here they just spawn on timer so people just engage them directly whenever.

I do agree that skirmishes might be a little under tuned as they get shredded regardless
but yeah best bet is just stick to middle of said zone and wait for skirmishes

Telling people to stick to one zone is giving up and limiting the mettle for everyone to one-third of what it could be. If we coordinated a bit we could get triple the mettle but apparently this is too hard for people. This is why I miss the NM train in Eureka.

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Originally Posted by Venandi

Telling people to stick to one zone is giving up and limiting the mettle for everyone to one-third of what it could be. If we coordinated a bit we could get triple the mettle but apparently this is too hard for people. This is why I miss the NM train in Eureka.

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The reason you have NM train is because the NMs have a lenghtier cooldown compared to Bozja so people work together, there is even a tracker to help out to see how terrible it would be if no one shouted or waited. People barely or never wait for bunny fates since they pop up constantly as the extra part.

Bozja on other hand you will always have those common non CE skirmkshes popping, so best bet is to just get to the middle area of a zone and ready to get to it.
Still shout chat is filled with players looking for Skirmishes group and specifying which zone they want to farm so you can find a party and have a better success in getting golden rating.
(In my experience I do not miss NM fate train, while I met many nice people there and gladly helped in spawning stuff, not having to worry about big cooldown is a blessing)

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Originally Posted by Venandi

Telling people to stick to one zone is giving up and limiting the mettle for everyone to one-third of what it could be.

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No, it is telling you what the most efficient way to grind is. lol Skirmishes spawn too fast and too far apart, often poorly scaled to boot. Trying to coordinate 72 random people is an impossible task. In Zadnor, they are also pretty spread out in zone 2 and 3. So...you are left with 2 choices. Stick to one zone in Zadnor and get mettle, or try to hit them all and get none.

Zerging all 3 zones with 50+ people doesnt sound like a much better compromise and more likely to miss more and have to deal with fate mobs disappearing or just lag.

I got around to trying Zadnor this weekend and this thread is not wrong. I can be at the crystal, a FATE pops and it's nearly done by the time I get there and that's with the speed boost for mounts. Somebody mentioned in shout there's a spawn order, so maybe I can go find out what that is, so I've got a better advantage, but that seems silly to me.

Most of the FATEs really do feel undertuned too. There's some interesting ones, I'll give that.

And in fairness for the Southern Front we didn't tend to camp one area for FATEs but instead went where they spawned. But they were better tuned in the Southern Front.

However, my biggest gripe is, always with the FATE trains. Eureka was supposed to be a throw back to classic MMO titles and like FFXI and introduce its style of endgame with Notorious Monsters in an open area map, what we got as: glorified FATE trains. Bozja was supposed to be an improvement and lessons learned from Eureka and delve deeper into that kind of content, what we got: glorified FATE trains that are at least broken up be CE's. CE's I think make the experience closer to what I'd expect of FFXIV inspired endgame content that's tuned to how FFXIV. But FATE trains aren't engaging or interesting content. And for something that's supposed to be different I'd not expect it here, but outside of it maybe.

But there are things they've done right in this respect, I like the lost actions, I like Castrum, I like Delubrum up until people start getting Doom, I like Critical Engagements, I like the concept. And I like that it's less grindy than Eureka and I don't have to suffer through 2 zones of Eureka content I hate to get to the enjoyable parts.

I just wish most of my experience wasn't running around doing FATEs, I got tired of that for levelling back in 2.0.

The fates scale quite weirdly. It seems as if the zones are divided into more zones and the activity is falsely measured. In z3, the western fates are much faster annihalated, than the one in center and east, where everyone idles until next fate pops.

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Originally Posted by Pepsi_Plunge

The two things I learned very fast:
- Focus on one zone only and stand in the middle of it so you can reach every spot fast (you will see people gathering there)
- Be in a group: Even if you are the first at the fate, you may only get silver if you are alone. Just shout "lfg zone (1, 2 or 3)"

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Agree, it takes more time for zone-hopping than Southern Front.
What I though don't much understand is people not joining up party. Okay, it's annoying if you have a leader who sleeps on registering for CEs, but else there's only advantages in a party.
- You get clusters if a party-member was attacking an garlean
- You get party-buffs
- Your healer sees you if your HP is low or you're having a nap
- It's much easier to get gold in fates

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Originally Posted by Saefinn

I got around to trying Zadnor this weekend and this thread is not wrong. I can be at the crystal, a FATE pops and it's nearly done by the time I get there and that's with the speed boost for mounts. Somebody mentioned in shout there's a spawn order, so maybe I can go find out what that is, so I've got a better advantage, but that seems silly to me.

Most of the FATEs really do feel undertuned too. There's some interesting ones, I'll give that.

And in fairness for the Southern Front we didn't tend to camp one area for FATEs but instead went where they spawned. But they were better tuned in the Southern Front.

However, my biggest gripe is, always with the FATE trains. Eureka was supposed to be a throw back to classic MMO titles and like FFXI and introduce its style of endgame with Notorious Monsters in an open area map, what we got as: glorified FATE trains. Bozja was supposed to be an improvement and lessons learned from Eureka and delve deeper into that kind of content, what we got: glorified FATE trains that are at least broken up be CE's. CE's I think make the experience closer to what I'd expect of FFXIV inspired endgame content that's tuned to how FFXIV. But FATE trains aren't engaging or interesting content. And for something that's supposed to be different I'd not expect it here, but outside of it maybe.

But there are things they've done right in this respect, I like the lost actions, I like Castrum, I like Delubrum up until people start getting Doom, I like Critical Engagements, I like the concept. And I like that it's less grindy than Eureka and I don't have to suffer through 2 zones of Eureka content I hate to get to the enjoyable parts.

I just wish most of my experience wasn't running around doing FATEs, I got tired of that for levelling back in 2.0.

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You're right, but it's not even a FATE train now. It's everyone just rushing from point to point wasting all the potential mettle that everyone can get. The worst offenders are the ones who continue killing FATEs while everyone is stuck in a critical engagement.

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Originally Posted by Venandi

You're right, but it's not even a FATE train now. It's everyone just rushing from point to point wasting all the potential mettle that everyone can get. The worst offenders are the ones who continue killing FATEs while everyone is stuck in a critical engagement.

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What the heck are people who didn't get into the CE supposed to do? They're not allowed to gain any mettle cause you're doing something else?

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Originally Posted by TW-Luna

What the heck are people who didn't get into the CE supposed to do? They're not allowed to gain any mettle cause you're doing something else?

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Chill, they can wait for 4 or 5 minutes so more people can get the mettle from the FATE

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Originally Posted by Venandi

Chill, they can wait for 4 or 5 minutes so more people can get the mettle from the FATE

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The world doesn't revolve around you.