Monk suggestions

this will probably tilt people, but i really wish they would add 100 fists, Formless strikes, and Mantra from FFXI back to Monk. I feel like you could change Brotherhood to a raid wide HP buff(Mantra), or keep brotherhood and add mantra as well. Formless strikes could turn Auto attacks into unaspected damage for x duration. 100 fists is what i want the most though, my take on it for 14 would be to make you auto attack 100 times in rapid succession, but you are unable to perform weaponskills or anything else for the duration. I will note that i know very little about monk in 14 except that it seems to struggle to find a place in content. I think the HP boost would be a welcomed mechanic and utility that isnt really in the game currently and would help them find a place. mnk mains will know better than i though, so hopefully this at least sparks the imagination on ways to improve the job.

http://vignette2.wikia.nocookie.net/...20090731021518

Good News! Mantra exists already, it gives a 20% healing received buff for all party members in range. It's a neat skill, but the problem is that there's not exactly a way to make this skill relevant. Either they make fights with healing checks so insane that Monk becomes mandatory, or the keep it so healers can get through them without it and monks remain in their current awkward role.

There have been several suggestions, and it's honestly not that monk is terrible, just Square has left in a lot of bad skills on the job, taken out useful ones, and the new skills make the job feel clunky. We've all been wanting a buff to Brotherhood. I'm personally in the camp of wanting the skill to boost all outgoing damage for all nearby party members, making the skill not useless if you're in a comp with a lot of caster, and also give the monk the same chance of getting a chakra stack when an ally connects damage with a spell.

Another way to make monks instantly more valuable is to introduce another job that does blunt damage. Currently the only attacks that count are the monk attacks, and book/pole smacks from casters/healers (not counting red mage, they do piercing damage with auto attacks) and possibly reintroduce the INT down debuff that monks could apply with Dragon Kick.

Also there are several skills that just need a complete overhaul that have been added this expansion that we keep brining up but Square insists monk is fine despite all the voices saying otherwise.

Monk is doing really well, I promise. The biggest problem with Monk is that DRG is too good.

Hundred Fists sounds like a 5.0 skill. Count me in.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Llugen

Monk is doing really well, I promise. The biggest problem with Monk is that DRG is too good.

Hundred Fists sounds like a 5.0 skill. Count me in.

---

Doesn't change the fact that most of its kit is useless at best.

Welcome to BLM:

Freeze
Blizzard II
Sleep
Scathe (particularly as it relates to Sharpcast)


All basically useless.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Llugen

Welcome to BLM:

Freeze
Blizzard II
Sleep
Scathe (particularly as it relates to Sharpcast)


All basically useless.

---

Oh please, Black Mage can take a seat then because four useless actions doesn't compare to the amount of garbage in Monk's kit. That's not even half of what Monk has in terms of garbage skills. Fists of Earth, Fists of Wind, Fists of Fire, Arm of the Destroyer (Literally the weakest AOE in the game for one of the highest TP costs), One Ilm Punch (still so useless as to be a meme), Purification (was never useful), Tornado Kick (basically never used), Tackle Mastery (two useless skills in one! Arguably three!), and Riddle of Earth (it's activation requirements are so dumb it ends up here). And that doesn't even begin to count other actions which have long standing issues like Perfect Balance's enormous cooldown or issues with new actions which make Monk miserable to play like Brotherhood.

There's a legitimate argument to be made about Black Mage's performance (even though it extends to Monk and Samurai because the exist in the exact same niche of being Greedy DPS), but there is absolutely no comparison when it comes to which Job has the absolute worst kit overall. It had the most useless actions in Heavensward, and despite the action reworks goal being to fix useless actions it basically didn't touch Monk. We're also the only job to actually get new actions and traits that can be construed as being useless.

Fists of Earth is used by top tier monks to reduce incoming damage for 1-2 GCDs to survive during progression
Tornado kick could use some love but it's absolutely useful for dumping stacks and doing high damage before large downtime (grand cross omega, possibly animal farm, possibly even -100 Gs if your Perfect Balance is already back up though I don't know that one for sure)
Arm of the Destroyer is still aoe damage that is stronger than Bootshine/Dragon Kick on 5ish targets
Purification means more TP for more aoe damage, see also: use Arm of the Destroyer when it's more potency
Tackle Mastery gave you a potency buff to shoulder tackle as Mr Happy preaches endlessly
One-Ilm Punch..... is still pretty useless. I'll give you that one.


So, tell me what Freeze and Blizzard II and Sleep are good for when mobs just resist the status disorders? I'm not saying that these aren't issues that SE should address, but having useless skills is pretty common around here, and apparently less skills are useless than you realize.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Llugen

-blep-

---

You're only proving you don't know what you're talking about.

Fists of Earth is not used to survive in progression because the tradeoff for 5% DPS isn't worth gaining marginal survivability against attacks we can already survive. Either the mitigation put up is sufficient for you to survive or you're dead. You used to be able to use it to recover if you had Weakness/Brink of Death and outgoing damage actually could kill you but that's a thing of the path.
Arm of the Destroyer's TP cost is massive compared to how little damage it does. You can say that it's a DPS gain in 5+ targets, but the gain is so marginal for how much TP it costs that in the long run its better to just use bootshine. The number of AOE situations where it should actually be used can be counted on one finger.
Purification: See Arm of the Destroyer's rebuttal. And, even in the one pull where Arm of the Destroyer is warranted even if you do use it you still often don't need it if your other DPS is pulling their weight or if they at least have the good courtesy to throw you a goad/tactician.
Tornado Kick: The situations where it actually can be used for a gain can be counted on one hand.
Tackle Mastery: They didn't need an entire trait to add 30 potency to an attack, they can just stick 30 potency onto it whenever. They've literally piled potency onto other jobs without ever having to do that. It is the definition of useless. They did not need to waste on of Monk's new traits/actions to do that. In fact making it add potency to Fists of Fire actively makes the issue with the Fist Stances worse. It's designed to be an appeal towards the fist stances being useful when they flat out aren't when the devs couldn't be assed to actually fix them.

Sure, Freeze and Blizzard II are useless. So is Repose on White Mage. That still doesn't make Black Mage's kit even a third as asinine as Monks. Do you have to potentially stand in an AOE that will give you a vuln stack so you have a chance at saving your Enochian, even though its entirely possible for it to just fall off before you get hit? No you just have to spam Transpose. And if that exact mechanic happens within a minute (cough third boss of Rabanastere cough) you don't just get dicked by the fight.

Does Black Mage have anything nearly as useless as One Ilm Punch? As the Fist Stances? Is Enochian nearly as inconvenient to maintain as Greased Lightning? Is the skill you use to restore Enochian in the event of catastrophe on a 3 minute cool down? Does Black Mage have stances that serve no purpose? Does Black mage have traits which at their most useful do something that actively makes an issue that has long been complained about worse? Is Black Mages capstone skill so utterly dependent on party composition that the mere act of using it in a 4-Man guaranteed to make it seem like a flub?

I'm not denying that Black Mage doesn't have issues, but if you want to pretend that Monk's issues with its kit, that have existed for pretty much as long as ARR mind you, are non-existent you're flat out lying to people.

But, this thread is about MNK, not BLM. BLM has 4 skills that are useless and are all old skills, but this expansion they got about 4 mandatory skills/traits (Umbral hearts could use some change though) in Thunder IV, Foul, UH and Triplecast. Between the lines is niche at best, but look at MNK's kit. This expansion they got no new attacks (the only DPS job that didn't, mind you), three niche tackles where only one of them is used (boring as hell), Brotherhood (very composition dependent), Riddle of Fire (good skill, but not a community-favourite), Riddle of Earth (kinda good, but goes against Tornado Kick), while removing good skills like ToD and not touching skills like PB (seriously 3 minutes is way too long), Tornado Kick and a bunch of others Burd mentioned in their post.

Niche skills aren't bad, but when 50% of your kit is niche, it becomes a problem.

You didn't even successfully refute a single one of my points lol

I don't need to fight with you about this, but you should probably take a long hard look at your skills and determine which of them are actually useless because many of them are not. Situational, sure, but not useless.

You are right, though. I apologize for derailing the thread and ruler-comparing it to BLM. I only meant to point out that there are many jobs that have less-than-useful skills (if not all of them).

Monk is the job whose design has changed the least over the course of this game. If anything I'd say that means that they had good design from the very beginning and they are simply staying true to what they had in mind. It is lamentable that they still haven't learned from the deleteMNK mentality about jobs needing utility, though.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Llugen

You didn't even successfully refute a single one of my points lol

I don't need to fight with you about this, but you should probably take a long hard look at your skills and determine which of them are actually useless because many of them are not. Situational, sure, but not useless.

You are right, though. I apologize for derailing the thread and ruler-comparing it to BLM. I only meant to point out that there are many jobs that have less-than-useful skills (if not all of them).

---

You're wrong and you fundamentally don't understand Monk. Most of your points are would be like saying "Scathe is useful because it lets you DPS while moving".

You just admitted yourself that your skills have uses. You might not LIKE them, but they have them, period. Lack of AOE damage is something that the caster pool also suffers from (or forced AOE limit break, even worse). Fists of Earth is NOT a thing of the past, in case you forgot Unending Coil just came out, so who knows where 10% damage reduction (the same as your own personal sacred soil or collective unconscious, mind you) might be useful for a few GCDs. Don't say that I fundamentally don't understand the class because you are too short-sighted to understand how your tools work.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Llugen

You just admitted yourself that your skills have uses. You might not LIKE them, but they have them, period. Lack of AOE damage is something that the caster pool also suffers from (or forced AOE limit break, even worse). Fists of Earth is NOT a thing of the past, in case you forgot Unending Coil just came out, so who knows where 10% damage reduction (the same as your own personal sacred soil or collective unconscious, mind you) might be useful for a few GCDs. Don't say that I fundamentally don't understand the class because you are too short-sighted to understand how your tools work.

---

Scathe can be used to DPS while moving, don't be too short sighted to understand how your tools work.

Stretching pretty hard dude. Potency loss between Fire IV and Scathe is 368. Your potency loss on two GCDs without Fists of Fire is significantly less than that, not to mention you don't have to deal with any cast times. But nice try.

Tackle Mastery could use some love but it's still a potency increase. Your job is very strong, and like I said before, the biggest thing that is wrong with it is that DRG is just too good for synergy with BRD/MCH and NIN is a given. You don't not deserve quality of life, but there are other areas of other jobs that need fixing a lot more.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Llugen

Monk is doing really well, I promise.

---

This is something only someone that doesn't play Monk can say.

Aside from it's issues in balance (utility being extremely weak, damage not enough to fill the gap), they are currently extremely clunky to actually play.
RoF is made with the idea that you'll get plenty of Forbidden Chakra in that window, but RNG is cruel and the fact that it should NEVER be a core aspect of a jobs kit is made apparent here. Not getting a single FC is very common, especially in 4 man's, or pugs where you could potentially get two casters.
So you end up with a skill that slows you down to a crawl with no benefits but hitting harder, which no Monk enjoys.

Then there's the issues with the tackles. To put it simply, it's all useless. Every one of them. You'll never leave Fire Stance. I thought they were deleting bloat skills not adding them? Then there's Riddle of Earth...Sigh.

I have been leveling monk and I think Deep Meditation should apply to all crits not just weapon skills. Now I haven't been in a dungeon but the proc seems extremely low in an open world at the moment.

Game balance is not zero-sum. Highlighting BLM's issues is meaningless in a MNK thread because fixing one job does not exclude fixing others, they all deserve it where necessary.
That said, I feel like the BLM issues mentioned here have been blown somewhat out of proportion. Our core rotation and rotation-saving tools work smoother than ever!
Yes, sleep and Blizz II are useless to the point where you can entirely ignore them, and yes, they should be either removed or fixed. But Freeze has niche uses when targets are dying/respawning extremely fast (i.e. A12S adds) and even Scathe is quite regularly useful (MP to spare, no time to finish another cast before boss invuln/target death, and no procs to use? Scathe!)

Altogether, BLM is a joy to play, while MNK just feels bad. Seems clear to me which is in greater need of QoL attention.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wintersandman

I have been leveling monk and I think Deep Meditation should apply to all crits not just weapon skills. Now I haven't been in a dungeon but the proc seems extremely low in an open world at the moment.

---

I thought this myself. I get so many crits, but a lot of it is from auto attacks, not my actual weapon skills.
But tbh that might be crossing into the job being OP.
What I'd much rather have is, on top of the Brotherhood effect generating chakra from other members, it gives us an additional effect that every crit from our own weapon skill is a 100% chance for a chakra.

Overall, moving Monk away from RNG will only do them good.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Exiled_Tonberry

I thought this myself. I get so many crits, but a lot of it is from auto attacks, not my actual weapon skills.
But tbh that might be crossing into the job being OP.
What I'd much rather have is, on top of the Brotherhood effect generating chakra from other members, it gives us an additional effect that every crit from our own weapon skill is a 100% chance for a chakra.

Overall, moving Monk away from RNG will only do them good.

---

Monk is like Bard in that regard in that they're dependent on critical hits off their DOTs to trigger extra effects on their songs, difference is, however, that Bards have a 100% proc on repertoire every time either of their DOTs crit. A bard can always have a song up the way their skills align, so purely for balance, and monk should just have that same 100% chance on any crit weapon skill. Yeah it will be strong because of bootshine, but that on its own would only give you a free Forbidden Chakra every 30 global cool downs, nothing that would make the job OP.

Another thought I had, which was connected again to Bard, was to change purification to be a small AOE esuna. Monks in other Final Fantasy titles have had the ability to cleanse debuffs from the party, so this would be in line with the job's historical skill set. Take it off the chakra requirement, give it a decent cooldown, and you've got some added raid utility. Especially nowadays as many duty finder healers don't have Esuna.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Exiled_Tonberry

I thought this myself. I get so many crits, but a lot of it is from auto attacks, not my actual weapon skills.
But tbh that might be crossing into the job being OP.
What I'd much rather have is, on top of the Brotherhood effect generating chakra from other members, it gives us an additional effect that every crit from our own weapon skill is a 100% chance for a chakra.

---

Could move it to a 30% or 25% chance. I agree on the RNG component but at the same time it is a bonus to get a free chakra while in combat.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wintersandman

Could move it to a 30% or 25% chance. I agree on the RNG component but at the same time it is a bonus to get a free chakra while in combat.

---

It's currently a 50% chance, so that move would be a nerf to the trait. The problem is that other jobs that are reliant on crit (see my post above about Bard) have a 100% proc on their skills off crit whereas monk only has a 50% proc. Getting a critical hit is already RNG in itself, and then saying that only half the time you'll get a chakra, of which you need 5 to execute Forbidden Chakra, is a pretty weak trait. Most of the time in dungeons you won't get that off in a pull of normal monsters, and maybe you'll proc one Forbidden Chakra in a boss fight. Then, considering they nerfed the potency of the skill, it's not much of an increase over where it was in Heavensward if you get two, and it's a nerf from where it was if you don't proc enough to get off an extra one at all.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wereotter

Monk is like Bard in that regard in that they're dependent on critical hits off their DOTs to trigger extra effects on their songs, difference is, however, that Bards have a 100% proc on repertoire every time either of their DOTs crit.

---

You know what, youre absolutely right. It wouldn't be OP at all if Monk has 100% chance of chakra on a weaponskill crit. No skill in his game should be under multiple layers or RNG, it's just not fun. Especially when there's a 20 seconds long "buff" that relies on us getting these procs to even function efficiently.

But SE is sticking to their guns and just not paying us Monk's any attention. They're looking only at numbers, and not how the job actually plays.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wereotter

It's currently a 50% chance, so that move would be a nerf to the trait.

---

You missed my earlier post. I said if Deep Meditation gave it off of any crit not just weapon skill. Which Exiled responded saying that would be OP and hence my response with the 25-30%. I honestly don't care what Bard has. No matter what I would still feel that just WS crits would minimize Deep Meditation as I find myself critting more on Auto Attacks than skills. But again open world where I don't get the benefit of 100% bootshine crits.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wintersandman

You missed my earlier post. I said if Deep Meditation gave it off of any crit not just weapon skill. Which Exiled responded saying that would be OP and hence my response with the 25-30%. I honestly don't care what Bard has. No matter what I would still feel that just WS crits would minimize Deep Meditation as I find myself critting more on Auto Attacks than skills. But again open world where I don't get the benefit of 100% bootshine crits.

---

You're right, I did.... though given RNG on top of RNG, I'm not sure that a 50% rate on all critical hits regardless of auto attacks or not would be OP.

Also related since you brought up open world.... why do open world enemies still have positional hit rings?? It's painful to any melee DPS job, but especially to monks. Why can't they have omni positional rings like they do in palace of the dead??

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by wereotter

Also related since you brought up open world.... why do open world enemies still have positional hit rings??

---

Because SE hopes we would party more. The whole game is this conundrum. We want you to party for fates and level together but wait. You try and do a story duty (duty not dungeon) you have to do it alone. Nope you cant go through it together but alone. Again they add positionals to those enemies as well vs the omni ring. The whole positional thing is incredibly confusing and throws me off even though I have done the dance I don't know how many times.

But when I was leveling SAM to 60 I was like why am I only getting Kenki on x ability and not every ability like the tooltip says "ahhhh yeahhhhh positionals." To throw salt into the wound they make True North have an insane cooldown when it has no real benefit outside of solo play.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wintersandman

To throw salt into the wound they make True North have an insane cooldown when it has no real benefit outside of solo play.

---

Slightly off topic but this is just dead wrong. True North is incredibly important in O2-O4s. Lakshmi and Susano also see regular use of these skills, they all move around so much, or is forced to face the party (fuck you, Catastrophe) for prolonged periods.
Perhaps it doesn't effect DRG or Ninja much, but Monk who's every attack is a positional just cries for about 15 seconds without true north.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Exiled_Tonberry

Slightly off topic but this is just dead wrong. True North is incredibly important in O2-O4s. Lakshmi and Susano also see regular use of these skills, they all move around so much, or is forced to face the party (fuck you, Catastrophe) for prolonged periods.

---

Fair enough. I have yet to do anything at 70. I am still on Lakshmi NM XD.

True North going to a 60 second cooldown is something I've brought up before that would be such an asset to monk. Plus at that duration, a ninja could take it for every trick attack for just in case the boss decides to look at someone other than the tank while the skill is going off. <cough cough> Halicarnassus

TL;DR Every single monk thread since Stormblood dropped:

The slow on Riddle of Fire sucks
Leaving in One ilM Punch and Arm of the Destroyer and taking out Touch of Death and Fracture is a joke, especially after all those speeches we got about trimming job bloat.
Tackle Mastery is a complete garbage (again, referring to job bloat, why does Fists of Wind exist after the changes to sprint?)
Tornado Kick needs a rework (In savage, from o1s to o4s, I use this skill exactly once during a battle, on Omega transition. Yay, our level 60 skill.)
Needing to take damage for Riddle of Earth to refresh stacks is ridiculous
Brotherhood is lackluster and awful with certain party comps, especially if another monk is in the group
Monk hasn't evolved since 2.0.

We're yelling in a empty hallway here because all the devs are seeing is "dps is fine".

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tigerlilley

TL;DR Every single monk thread since Stormblood dropped:

The slow on Riddle of Fire sucks
Leaving in One ilM Punch and Arm of the Destroyer and taking out Touch of Death and Fracture is a joke, especially after all those speeches we got about trimming job bloat.
Tackle Mastery is a complete garbage (again, referring to job bloat, why does Fists of Wind exist after the changes to sprint?)
Tornado Kick needs a rework (In savage, from o1s to o4s, I use this skill exactly once during a battle, on Omega transition. Yay, our level 60 skill.)
Needing to take damage for Riddle of Earth to refresh stacks is ridiculous
Brotherhood is lackluster and awful with certain party comps, especially if another monk is in the group
Monk hasn't evolved since 2.0.

We're yelling in a empty hallway here because all the devs are seeing is "dps is fine".

---

I would add that Riddle of Earth and Perfect Balance also needs a reworks as well,Riddle of Earth is easily the worst ability in the game for maintaining a buff attached to the shortest Job Critical buff in the game and Perfect Balances cooldown is still massively long in a way that no other action of its type is.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tigerlilley

We're yelling in a empty hallway here because all the devs are seeing is "dps is fine".

---

It's really annoying that all our issues are being handwaved because our DPS is fine. There's so many problems with the design of this job, and maybe they know that but don't want to put in effort to fix it mid expansion.

My favorite counter-design is giving us longer GL times, more ways to manage our stacks, less boss downtime, and then keep Tornado Kick as is, even going as far as to decrease the recast time. Like wut?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Llugen

So, tell me what Freeze and Blizzard II and Sleep are good for when mobs just resist the status disorders? I'm not saying that these aren't issues that SE should address, but having useless skills is pretty common around here, and apparently less skills are useless than you realize.

---

Fine since were being petty i'll help you <3. If youre soloing in open world you could use freeze on them, or blizzard II or sleep and those mobs wouldn't resist so there ya go :D oh and you can scathe to damage while moving! See those aren't actually useless they're "situational" <3

I agree with Llugen, I actually think mnk is pretty good the only gripes I have are tackle mastery and most of all tornado kick (for real make it give like 2 gl stacks or something it would leave one empy but if you form shift right you would have 3 quick if used after downtime but idk I don't make vidya games just my 2 cents). tbh mnk does pretty good even with these being here. I feel like some of you just don't like how the job plays and that's totally fine but the job actually performs quite well when in the right hands.

But, I feel this is a case by case thing like I enjoy mnk quite a lot its been my favorite job since I started and still is, where some people really don't like it. I do agree though a job shouldn't be overlooked just cuz it performs well I think things like tackle mastery and worst of all tornado kick really do need to be changed because they are almost useless esp tornado kick.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Larx

[...] I feel like some of you just don't like how the job plays and that's totally fine but the job actually performs quite well when in the right hands.[...]

---

The problem that I, and I imagine quite a few others, have with the job is that with the changes in SB it became significantly less fun to play than where it was before in HW. It's been stated time and time again, but they removed skills that we used consistently (Fracture, ToD, and occasionally Haymaker for fights with gaze attacks), and in addition to the rotation being made more dull with those changes, it's also slower and clunkier due to RoF. In exchange, skills that were only used once in a blue moon have not been improved to take the place of what was removed (Arm, One Ilm, Tornado Kick) and all the new additions may as well not be there (Tackle Mastery, Riddle of Wind) or are unsatisfying to use (RoF, RoE, Brotherhood, and the RNG-upon-RNG nightmare that is Deep Meditation).

Yes, some of us "just don't like how the job plays" because we've played it for months, if not years, in a state where it was much more enjoyable to play.

I also have played it for years but I did say that just because I like it doesn't mean everyone will. In addition to that I also said if it performs well doesn't mean it doesn't need some fixes like tackle mastery and tornado kick. Now as you said you find mnk was more fun in HW due to loss of skills and flow of the job with riddle of fire and such and I can understand that. I would welcome such a change I don't mind riddle of fire but that doesn't mean I wouldn't want a change to it I can see how slowing down kinda doesn't match the class identity and I do actually miss facture and tod It just doesn't ruin the job for me that they are gone but that doesn't mean I wouldn't like to see them return. I am happy with mnk now I still enjoy it but I can see why people would want some things changed and I would welcome it.

Well, While I understand the fustration of the slow due to RoF, I also understand it's what allow us to double weave Forbidden chakra during brotherhood, something we wouldn't do if we didn't loose the 15% skillspeed.

To me, what the monk is lacking is some more interesting riddle conception, like RoE beeing some kind of solo/levelling tool in addition to it's effects, Riddle of Wind beeing something you could use for a faster gameplay, maybe unable to weave any oGCD, so time it once your main burst are done.

Tackle mastery seems lackluster, none of them beeing usefull at all, that's a true failure here.

TK could have some use with a lower CD on PB, or some AOE chakra spending ? Who knows. The fact is, RoE is only superior if you take damage during a boss jump. If future encounters are designed with boss jumps with only AOE to dodge and no unavoidable damages, RoE will end useless. Earth reaction should be triggered by defaut, and every damage taken during it's effect would refresh the duration of GL.

I think what lacks the monk now, is what Fracture used or could be : A non positionnal at will skill, tied to a dot to avoid spamming in bad situation, something with no higher potency than the average Weaponskill, that you can quickly weave when repositionning yourself after some jump/bump/turnaround.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MauvaisOeil

[...]While I understand the fustration of the slow due to RoF, I also understand it's what allow us to double weave Forbidden chakra during brotherhood, something we wouldn't do if we didn't loose the 15% skillspeed[...]

---

Like you said, the need to doubleweave only stems from the current design of Brotherhood (random acquisition of Chakra completely out of the player's control) and the slow on attacks is a sloppy bandaid over the inability to plan your moves one to two steps in advance due to this. If, for example, Chakra was gained at a steady rate during BH (i.e. one guaranteed chakra for every weaponskill executed by the monk themselves, which is only slightly slower than average when compared to being partied with two tanks and two physical DPS), or like one suggestion I've read before - disable Chakra recovery and simply allow the monk to use FC every one of its 5s cooldowns (which, if you are lucky with BH procs, are forced into doing anyways) then the need to doubleweave or miss out on potential Chakra gain is moot. In other words, just another aspect of where monk's current kit seems to work against itself half the time.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MauvaisOeil

Well, While I understand the fustration of the slow due to RoF, I also understand it's what allow us to double weave Forbidden chakra during brotherhood, something we wouldn't do if we didn't loose the 15% skillspeed.

---

Assuming you earn enough chakras during Riddle of Fire to actually do this. I've been in parties with three melee, and two tanks and still manage to only get one extra Forbidden Chakra as the norm while under Brotherhood.

The problem with monk's skills since the expansion is, in part, that they're all locked behind several layers of RNG. Deep Meditation, for example, there's the RNG of "is this weapon skill going to crit?" if yes, then there's still the 50/50 chance of getting a chakra. With Brotherhood it's the same. While the first layer of RNG isn't there for critical hits, it's still only a 30% chance that a party member doing physical attacks ONLY will give you a chakra, making the skill terrible in 4-man groups, and kind of "meh" in most 8-man groups.

No other job is locked behind this many layers of RNG to play, and if just that were addressed, the job would start to become much more enjoyable.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Exiled_Tonberry

It's really annoying that all our issues are being handwaved because our DPS is fine. There's so many problems with the design of this job, and maybe they know that but don't want to put in effort to fix it mid expansion.

My favorite counter-design is giving us longer GL times, more ways to manage our stacks, less boss downtime, and then keep Tornado Kick as is, even going as far as to decrease the recast time. Like wut?

---

Saying it's the middle of the expansion isn't an excuse at all. The expansion hasn't even been out for 6 months yet, and more importantly the single most marketed point for Stormblood was the action rework where they were said they were going to re-evaluate useless or overly circumstantial actions. Both categories have been complained about by Monks in particular since ARR, but despite these complaints being so long standing not only did they not address any of them, they actually designed new actions and traits around one of them. And that's not the only thing they promised and failed to make good on, Yoshi also stated in an interview that they were going to redo our animations since they're all so dated but they didn't do that either.

Stormblood Monk is the single most profoundly dissapointinv job in the game and the devs should be ashamed of it.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by SpeckledBurd

, Yoshi also stated in an interview that they were going to redo our animations since they're all so dated but they didn't do that either.

---

I'm extremely curious where/when he said this, and was it for Monk particularly or all jobs?
If you happen to have that interview I'd love to read it. Monk getting new animations on the level of 4.0 MCH would make me so happy. Monk just LOOKS so boring.