[Suggestion] Just give us Stats on our Equipped Skills.

I really don't know why this wasn't the next step in The Armoury System. A system that seems to be based right off of Blue Mage from FFXI to an extent.

Give each Skill in the game a set Stat that it gives if equipped on Main Class and a slightly weaker set Stat that it gives when equipped Cross Class.

Make it so it wont give stats if your not Recommended level for the Skill.

Boom, you have a functioning Stat progression system that will make characters stronger and influence mixing and matching of skills by players.

You wanna be a tank? Better equip all those defensive skills that give you bonuses to Vit and Defense.

Wanna deal more melee damage? Better equip some extra weapon skills that give you a boost to Strength and Attack.

Fighting a bunch of Ice mobs? Equip a bunch of fire based skills to boost up your Fire Affinity.

This is how I was hoping it would work from the moment they said you could equip any skill you knew already. I was kinda disappointed they went with a "Points when you level up" system like Ragnarok. Especially when they had already designed a stat distribution system for Blue Mage that seemed to fit so perfectly into the Armoury System.

I think it's pretty good the way it is.
It would be neat to try something different though.

Can't wait for the Materia system, or did they already do that?

that why they will give us materia system

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Originally Posted by Rinoa

I think it's pretty good the way it is.
It would be neat to try something different though.

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Even if it wasn't the "MAIN" way you got stats but just minor bonuses, it would be a big improvement.

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Originally Posted by Greed

that why they will give us materia system

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Materia is an addendum not a replacement for stat progression.

Every game has multiple ways to gain stats outside of normal character progressions.

Character Progression
Weapons
Equipment
Enchants
Merits
Food
Pots
Buffs from other party members
Self Buffs

Having more then one way to progress your characters stat is beneficial in the long run. No reason to stagnate growth.

I think the job system + materia will be fixing this so this, while not a bad idea in itself, is not something they will consider, I think.

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Originally Posted by Perrin_Aybarra

I think the job system + materia will be fixing this so this, while not a bad idea in itself, is not something they will consider, I think.

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The job system has nothing to do with stats, it only deals with skills A job might give minor stat bonuses, but it wont affect permanent stat progression for the character.

It also probably wont do anything for people like me who wont be using the job system until much later because we don't want to be locked down to a specific role if that role is on a weapon we do not like.

Currently our skills are based on weapon type, PUG has all mostly blunt but Victimize is piercing? Why? ><

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Originally Posted by Petori

Currently our skills are based on weapon type, PUG has all mostly blunt but Victimize is piercing? Why? ><

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Pugilist has tons of piercings weapons too. But really that topic is not what this thread was for.

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

The job system has nothing to do with stats, it only deals with skills A job might give minor stat bonuses, but it wont affect permanent stat progression for the character.

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Nor would your idea. Since you can unequip skills to change your stats. So will the job system. It's permanent in the same way, once you unlock a job, ie Paladin, you will always have to choice to "equip" it to gain the desired tank stats (more vit), plus it limits your skills and from what I understand give you some unique job abilities.

Like I said, your idea might be good, but it doesn't fit with the upcoming job system.

I like this idea, also what about traits? In XI's BLU certain combinations of skills gave job traits, so perhaps if a Conjurer equips Curaga2/Cure2/3 etc they might unlock a 'Healer' trait. The job system pretty much does this, but additional bonuses would provide some extra interest and strategy in making setups. Maybe in the future when jobs/classes have larger pools of skills to draw from (level cap rising) this would be something that could be explored in more detail.
A paladin could, for example, see a battle as not really requiring the full-defence approach, and by equipping a couple of aggressive skills they might gain traits for it. As a disclaimer, I'm not saying Paladins should go around trying to DD, I'm sure Gladiator will get another job for that, but it could be useful in a few situations.

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It also probably wont do anything for people like me who wont be using the job system until much later because we don't want to be locked down to a specific role if that role is on a weapon we do not like.

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Good luck getting groups if jobs are that much better than classes at roles <_< But yeah eventually i'm sure each class will have multiple jobs/roles so everyone should find something :D

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Originally Posted by Perrin_Aybarra

Nor would your idea. Since you can unequip skills to change your stats. So will the job system. It's permanent in the same way, once you unlock a job, ie Paladin, you will always have to choice to "equip" it to gain the desired tank stats (more vit), plus it limits your skills and from what I understand give you some unique job abilities.

Like I said, your idea might be good, but it doesn't fit with the upcoming job system.

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Actually I think it would work awesomely. If all the skills a Paladin gets from its job grant Defense, Vit, HP, Mnd, and Healing power, It would greatly help them.

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

I really don't know why this wasn't the next step in The Armoury System. A system that seems to be based right off of Blue Mage from FFXI to an extent.

Give each Skill in the game a set Stat that it gives if equipped on Main Class and a slightly weaker set Stat that it gives when equipped Cross Class.

Make it so it wont give stats if your not Recommended level for the Skill.

Boom, you have a functioning Stat progression system that will make characters stronger and influence mixing and matching of skills by players.

You wanna be a tank? Better equip all those defensive skills that give you bonuses to Vit and Defense.

Wanna deal more melee damage? Better equip some extra weapon skills that give you a boost to Strength and Attack.

Fighting a bunch of Ice mobs? Equip a bunch of fire based skills to boost up your Fire Affinity.

This is how I was hoping it would work from the moment they said you could equip any skill you knew already. I was kinda disappointed they went with a "Points when you level up" system like Ragnarok. Especially when they had already designed a stat distribution system for Blue Mage that seemed to fit so perfectly into the Armoury System.

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the problem with this is i think if you only get +stats from the abilities you severely limit experimentation.

you can't have a tank with what might be considered weird skills because the +stats could severely gimp him.

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

Actually I think it would work awesomely. If all the skills a Paladin gets from its job grant Defense, Vit, HP, Mnd, and Healing power, It would greatly help them.

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Yes I understand what you mean, but what if instead, equiping the paladin job it would give you the same Def, Vit, HP (but that's vit), some MND and healing power. Saving us the trouble of having skills granting stats and giving the same end result AND allowing players to actually choose the skills they want to use instead of having cookie cutter skill build for everyone. And since they are already working and polishing the job system, they could add this without much trouble I'd assume.

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Originally Posted by Perrin_Aybarra

Yes I understand what you mean, but what if instead, equiping the paladin job it would give you the same Def, Vit, HP (but that's vit), some MND and healing power. Saving us the trouble of having skills granting stats and giving the same end result AND allowing players to actually choose the skills they want to use instead of having cookie cutter skill build for everyone. And since they are already working and polishing the job system, they could add this without much trouble I'd assume.

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The job IS a cookie cutter build you wont be making many changes from it.

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Originally Posted by Cairdeas

The job IS a cookie cutter build you wont be making many changes from it.

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Of course not, if you are a paladin you are a tank and with the job will come the necessary traits/stats to perform in your role. BUT you still have the choice of what abilities you want to set on your action bar.

With your suggestion it's almost like forcing people to use X and X skill if they want to perform in their role. Everyone will be expected to have X and X ability set for Y role they want to perform. Else they will be subpar.

Integrating the stats/trait with the jobs is much more logical since if you invite a paladin in your group, you know that he will have the proper stats to do his role, and the white mage will have the traits/skills to do his role, regardless of what combination of skills/spells they have set on their bar.

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Originally Posted by Perrin_Aybarra

Of course not, if you are a paladin you are a tank and with the job will come the necessary traits/stats to perform in your role. BUT you still have the choice of what abilities you want to set on your action bar.

With your suggestion it's almost like forcing people to use X and X skill if they want to perform in their role. Everyone will be expected to have X and X ability set for Y role they want to perform. Else they will be subpar.

Integrating the stats/trait with the jobs is much more logical since if you invite a paladin in your group, you know that he will have the proper stats to do his role, and the white mage will have the traits/skills to do his role, regardless of what combination of skills/spells they have set on their bar.

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Your system limits its use only if your using a job (not everyone wants too) my system lets everyone use it even if using a job.

I'd rather go with the system thats more inclusive.

Hm. Interesting idea... I actually kind like the idea of being better at something with more actions of that nature set. The more offensive actions you set, the stronger you are, the more defensive actions you set, the more resilient you are. If the stats granted directly effect the action you're equipping, I'm all for it. I just don't want something like fire to give me +5 strength or something, if strength has nothing to do with the fire spell. But if fire increased intelligence, mind, and/or piety, I'm game.

I don't think this is a bad idea. It might fix some of the current issues with some abilities being too powerful cross-class. It would be nice if people had to weigh utility vs strength when equipping abilities. However, I could see the system being wide open to abuse, and I know SE is very cautious when treading in those zones. Like THM equipping all defensive actions and getting really buffed defensive stats and becoming a super-tank again.

I think that this would be best implemented alongside the job system in the future and bonuses only apply when you select a job. That way, they can make the act of choosing a job have the most impact, and then secondary customization coming from which actions you equip.

Alternatively, instead of putting primary stats on abilities, they could put secondary stats on them. Like +Accuracy, +Potency, +Attack, etc.

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Originally Posted by Sephr

I like this idea, also what about traits? In XI's BLU certain combinations of skills gave job traits, so perhaps if a Conjurer equips Curaga2/Cure2/3 etc they might unlock a 'Healer' trait. The job system pretty much does this, but additional bonuses would provide some extra interest and strategy in making setups. Maybe in the future when jobs/classes have larger pools of skills to draw from (level cap rising) this would be something that could be explored in more detail.
A paladin could, for example, see a battle as not really requiring the full-defence approach, and by equipping a couple of aggressive skills they might gain traits for it. As a disclaimer, I'm not saying Paladins should go around trying to DD, I'm sure Gladiator will get another job for that, but it could be useful in a few situations.



Good luck getting groups if jobs are that much better than classes at roles <_< But yeah eventually i'm sure each class will have multiple jobs/roles so everyone should find something :D

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This could be a nice turn of events if they did that. Certain combinations for DA, delay, haste, TP & who knows what else. If the "good" traits came from Main Class only, then it would also help the need to have everything leveled.

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Originally Posted by RabidSquirrel

Hm. Interesting idea... I actually kind like the idea of being better at something with more actions of that nature set. The more offensive actions you set, the stronger you are, the more defensive actions you set, the more resilient you are. If the stats granted directly effect the action you're equipping, I'm all for it. I just don't want something like fire to give me +5 strength or something, if strength has nothing to do with the fire spell. But if fire increased intelligence, mind, and/or piety, I'm game.

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That is how I see it.

Every skill in the game fits into one of a few categories.

Curative (Increases Health or removes ailments)
Defensive (Increases defense or grants an immunity to some negative action)
Offensive (Deals direct physical damage of some kind)
Elemental (Deals magic damage of some kind)
Enfeeling (Leaves a negative status on an enemy)

Atleast as far as I can tell they fit into those or a mix of them. So if you gave classes of stats to classes of skills it would be something like the following with Order of Importance.

Curative = Mind, Healing Effectiveness, Piety, Intellegence, HP, MP, Magic Defense
Defensive = Vitality, HP, Defense, Block, Parry, Piety, MP, Magic Defense
Offensive = Strength, Dexterity, Attack Power, Accuracy, Weapon Skill Damage, Evasion, HP
Elemental = Intellegence, Piety, MP, Elemental Effectiveness, Magic Defense, Evasion, HP
Enfeebling = MP, Piety, Intelligence, DoT/Status Effectiveness, Magic Defense, HP, Defense

Skills that are a Mix, Like say Red Lotus Blade (Offensive + Elemental) would get some from both so RLB might get +2 Str, +1 Fire Affinity, + 1 Evasion +5 MP.

They could just make it so that Cross-Class skills don't give stats. I like the idea overall much more than allocating stat points.

What I'd like to see with this idea is:
Keep the Physical Levels, have them determine your stats, automatically allocated (this would be like, roughly averaging all stats no min/maxing)
Then have abilities give additional stats. So without any abilities your primary stat may be like 92 but when you equip abilities and have 130 or 150 or whatever depending on which abilities you use.

(I kind of like the idea of physical levels just not their implementation).

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Originally Posted by Defmetal

They could just make it so that Cross-Class skills don't give stats. I like the idea overall much more than allocating stat points.

What I'd like to see with this idea is:
Keep the Physical Levels, have them determine your stats, automatically allocated (this would be like, roughly averaging all stats no min/maxing)
Then have abilities give additional stats. So without any abilities your primary stat may be like 92 but when you equip abilities and have 130 or 150 or whatever depending on which abilities you use.

(I kind of like the idea of physical levels just not their implementation).

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Cross Class Skills should at least give half the stats of Main Class Skills.

As usual Cairdeas, I love your ideas.

When we heard of the Armoury System, the possibilities of what it could have been raged on. But what we actually got.

You wouldn't happen to have an existing depot for your thoughts on this would you?

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Originally Posted by Fiosha_Maureiba

As usual Cairdeas, I love your ideas.

When we heard of the Armoury System, the possibilities of what it could have been raged on. But what we actually got.

You wouldn't happen to have an existing depot for your thoughts on this would you?

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