MNK vs DRG *pld need advise*

So the title doesn't do justice for what I am asking.

I been playing PLD since lunch and wanted to level a mnk or drg. But I know very little about them other than being a melee dps job. I'm also not looking to know which is better than the other I just want to know their play style, information, what kinda stats is important, etc etc.

Both use about the same stats. Mnk is more about chaining smaller but more frequent hits while drg is about big numbers. Both you need to move for positioning for your attacks. However, drgs can't continue thier combos with out a position attack while mnks just lose potency if they are not in the right position. Mnks as they continue with thier combos they self buff themselves. While drgs is mostly what you see is what you get. Mnks are usually agreed upon to be harder to play. However mnks also get silence and stun. While drg only has stun. I would play both up to 20ish. Because you can use cc skills from each other classes, and go with what play style you enjoy most.

Fz

They both want STR. They both have flank and rear attacks I believe, which means it does more damage when the monster is attacked from that direction. Main difference is that MNK has more of a set rotation, but DRG abilities pop up randomly so you need to be more aware of what ability is used from which direction on the fly. I could be wrong I haven't played DRG much only 15 and my MNK is 41.

Play both through 30 at least. Get a solid feel. If you decide monk then you want dragoon 34 anyhow for bfb cross class skill. If you decide dragoon you can go as high as 42 on monk for mantra cross class skill. So really by completing all cross class skill requirements you will have played both far enough to ideally know which you prefer most.

Otherwise all the above posts are pretty close to accurate.

drg is harder to maintain perfect rotation, its actually harder to play than monk
monk has higher dps for the same gear, even if you just stay on mob side and never go to his back you can still outdps everyone else
drg usually has a little easier time with aoes

Dragoon was harder to play in 2.0 due to DoT clipping mechanics and jumps, as well as Monks having had more lenient positional requirements.

Post-2.1, Dragoons have become relatively easier to play, and Monks have become relatively harder to play due to having more important (and a larger quantity of) position checks than pre-patch. Post 2.1 Monks are harder to play than DRGs.

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Originally Posted by Makado

DRG abilities pop up randomly

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Err, no. Everything cooldown you use has a recast timer, which is very much not random. I have every single optimal DPS ability in my rotation, including off GCD stuff, so all abilities tend to "pop up" at the same time throughout my fights.

Both classes require positional abilities to achieve optimal DPS, monk requiring a bit more movement. Monk will do more damage over time, dragoon has higher burst damage and big numbers that will give you a warm and fuzzy feeling.

If the thing you are fighting stays alive for more than a minute, a monk will probably do more damage; otherwise, dragoon should do more damage in the more bursty situations.

So yeah, who cares. Play both for a while and see what's fun to you. Hell, my buddy who only has tank jobs leveled takes full DPS gear with his marauder (for cross-class skills) into CT and we absolutely destroy other parties at Atomos.

TLDR: who cares, have fun

Dragoon.

why? because you have to level Dragoon to 36 or something to get blood for blood. Already have to level it that much, might as well keep going.

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Originally Posted by Akirakogami

Dragoon.

why? because you have to level Dragoon to 36 or something to get blood for blood. Already have to level it that much, might as well keep going.

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Same can be said for monk and Mantra, if you're a very thoughtful person XD

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Originally Posted by JetBrooks

Same can be said for monk and Mantra, if you're a very thoughtful person XD

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Mantra is only 5% cross class which is pretty meh, I wouldn't say it is vital to get.

Sorry, I should have bolded the words "very thoughtful", bahaha.

I did the same only I deleted my PLD because I got bored of it and wanted to start over. I really enjoy the speed of MNK and having to keep up DoT's/buffs to maximise damage. While there are rotations it's also important to be able to shift things around as the situation requires which makes things more interesting than just following a straight rotation. Lancer feels a bit slow compared to MNK though I've heard it gets better at level 50.

Im in the same boat. I always play Rogues and thieves, but none present.
I was going to go Monk at release but opted to try my hand at tanking thinking DPS queues would be nuts with smaller party size.
Wasn't wrong there.
So my PUG was 15, LNC 11. I got Lnc to 15 last night and then pug to 16 so I can start some roulettes.

I start school next week so I will be somewhat limited and I also want my BLM which is lvl 28 right now and I choose BLM over SMN because of burst vs dot. Which I dont know if I want another burst dps but leaning on it.

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Originally Posted by Runalong

I did the same only I deleted my PLD because I got bored of it and wanted to start over. I really enjoy the speed of MNK and having to keep up DoT's/buffs to maximise damage. While there are rotations it's also important to be able to shift things around as the situation requires which makes things more interesting than just following a straight rotation. Lancer feels a bit slow compared to MNK though I've heard it gets better at level 50.

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I went from Paladin to monk as well, although I kept mine :3 (Had already +1'd it). I really enjoy the speed and fluidity of monk versus the sluggish moves of DRG. It was complete torture for me getting to 34 for BfB and that was using fates! I will never play DRG again lol. To the OP, if you like quick game play, choose monk. If you want to see big numbers, play DRG.

having a 41 MNk and a 50 drg, ill go over some of the basics.

Monk- Has a pretty set rotation with more positional requirements over DRG, though not meeting positional requirements holds a lesser punishment than its DRG counterpart. The rotation is a lot more steady then DRG rotation because no matter where you hit, you will be getting your debuffs or buffs off as they are determined by your stance (Fancy for combo) not the position you are hitting. your position determines if you get a garunteed crit, or more dmg off.

MNK is the kind of job that is harder to learn but easier to master in my personal opinion. Once you learn your rotation, it simply becomes doing it over and over again.

MNK Difficulty **** Master ***



Dragoon- This class is the easier of the two to start playing, there are really only 2 positinal requirments for the job. 1 Flank and 1 Rear. DRG is a lot more unforgiving than its MNK counterpart though, if you miss a positional requirment you only do 100 potency and you dont put up whatever buff or debuff you were going for. Truly exceling at DRG is something that requires a lot more work as there is not really a exact rotaion, instead, there are a checklist of things to have up on you and on the target. with many cooldown abilities and non global cooldown abilities to use, you are constantly weaving in attacks in between your Global cooldown abilities.

DRG Difficulty *** Master ****

I like playin as mnk more than drg. I havent even gotten to GL3 yet and i already feel like GL2 boost to gcd is lovely. Atk animations look so good. Shoulder Tackle makes me feel like a ninja. MNK is just awesome. Drg is ok imo. Shoryuken looking Full Thrust. Nice to weave in Jump. My only thing is outside of Jump and whatever that uber-looking jump is at 50 that I see others do, the class just bored me. Oh and the armor is nice too of course.

Maybe if DRG jumps were at the core of the combos or something then i would like it. Like jumping as the end of TTVTFT or something. I'll level both to 50 just to see the end game rotation on drg,but as of now...mnk...mnk....and more mnk.

Did I mention mnk?

I like DRG so much more for these reasons:
Jumping!!! you can do it more often than you think!!!
Big, big hits. Those who understand how to stack CD's and rotations can find themselves critting 3x in a row for 1100-1400 DMG.
Aggro drop: Means i can safely go ham, backflip, spineshatter dive back, never miss a beat and im not getting hit.
Tankish: Say your tank dies, and the boss aggros to you. you can tank it. you obviously have highest DPS/threat because DRG is awesome and unbeatable! I've tanked Titan seeing full rock/MB rotation... can be done
Armour:The Wyrm gear is just plain awesome, and the best, maybe you can argue for warrior, but this is MNK vs DRG.
Loot:Fact is, more DRG loot drops than MNK.
Mechanics: MOST fights have mechanics which will force your MNK off target. It takes a lot of skill and attention to not let your GL3 drop. Sometimes even impossible. For this reason i find my DRG doing more than equally geared (and skilled) MNK.


There's some food for thought :)

Mnk is the highest single target dps in the game and is a very durable dps fist of earth exct it provides a useful healing boon for stack phases. Drg brings a debuff that increases the damage of the most useful dps in the game brd has higher aoe damage than mnk and more burst damage useful for dropping multiple adds quickly with out ramping up 2 gap closers three if you are really good with elusive in a zero lag situation also a threat dump.

well maining both drg n mnk, i'll just say that :
1.DRG are WoW's fury warrior (high alpha and sustained heavy damage) with (situational) multiple gapclosers and thus are best on mobile fights while MNK are WoW's enhancement shamans (machine gun pea shooter) and thus are best on tank and spank fights.
2.difficulty wise, MNK is much more easier than DRG as their "flexible" rotations as much less forgiving than DRG's rotations in a fight where the boss are spinning or moving chaotically.
3.MNK have more party wide utility compared to DRG

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Originally Posted by Empressia

well maining both drg n mnk, i'll just say that :
1.DRG are WoW's fury warrior (high alpha and sustained heavy damage) with (situational) multiple gapclosers and thus are best on mobile fights while MNK are WoW's enhancement shamans (machine gun pea shooter) and thus are best on tank and spank fights.

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Though I generally agree with that. MNK literally have the WoW warrior's charge, lol. It's 30s so while drg can do two gap closers in a row, they have a 180 cd on each. I guess you can count elusive but it's doesn't seem that fast. Even with all 3, MNKs can charge more often.
Also, did I mention it was actually a charge?
MNK is something like the older enhancement shamans before they made them have long cooldowns on everything. So I agree with that.

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Originally Posted by Allyrion

Though I generally agree with that. MNK literally have the WoW warrior's charge, lol. It's 30s so while drg can do two gap closers in a row, they have a 180 cd on each. I guess you can count elusive but it's doesn't seem that fast. Even with all 3, MNKs can charge more often.
Also, did I mention it was actually a charge?
MNK is something like the older enhancement shamans before they made them have long cooldowns on everything. So I agree with that.

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WoW references in an FF game will not be tolerated. Consider this your first warning,Heretic!

i got both to 50 and i have raided with both .. i main monk because well the rotation are fluent once i get going its easier to keep it up, as far as wich one is harder depends dragoons hard part would be that sometimes your move wont register as behind or flank dont know why my monk has a bigger window for flank and rear....
monk priority is completing combos because losing GL is a major dps loss ... so doing a move not on the right postion still a dmg loss but you can continue your combo as in dragoon you have to redo the move again and see if those nice litle lines pop up .... but for dragoon also you only use 2 moves 1 flank your buff and Impulse drive the behind combo after that is as easy as 1-2-3 as any of those moves can be done in any position and debuf last 30 sec so you got more time to re apply ...

but overall play what you like i love monk just more just because .... dragoon are cool but i get too bored easy

i can imagine rolling both, and simply fill the role of melee dps, rather than monk or dragoon. that way you can adapt to any situation optimally

I play both (i90 monk, i83 DRG), they are useful for different things. I would recommend Monk for most content but there are cases like Garuda EX, T5, etc that I would play a DRG over MNK. Usually any fight where GL3 falls more than once I would go for DRG or an encounter that benefits from high burst.

To summerize this post and people's replies:

Monk lower skill floor, higher skill cap:

Due to missing positional requirements not interrupting your rotation, but difficult to master because you will need to hit every positional requirement to maximize dps.

Dragoon higher skill floor, lower skill cap:

Due to positional requirement misses breaking your rotation, but requiring less movement overall once your positional attacks are landed affording you more time to pay attention to mechanics.


Damage-wise ofc, Monk is superior most of the time individually, while drg paired with bard will give you equal or better raid dps given your bards' level of gear and skill. Monk provides utility in the form of mantra, which is really not neccessary on most fights, dragoon does not provide utility outside of damage increases.


source: i90 drg with allagan weapon, i88 monk with allagan weapon

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Originally Posted by Fricket

Damage-wise ofc, Monk is superior most of the time individually, while drg paired with bard will give you equal or better raid dps given your bards' level of gear and skill. Monk provides utility in the form of mantra, which is really not neccessary on most fights, dragoon does not provide utility outside of damage increases.

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Dragon Kick is MNK's main utility, Mantra is secondary. It lowers the Boss's INT by 10% and is made to be a constant debuff.
It's like a permanent mini-Supervirus (the super virus trait lowers int by 15%) and, of course, stacks with Supervirus.

This is beneficial for any fight with magic damage. Similarly, Rage of Halone from the PLD reduces STR by 10% and is the counterpart to DK.

Dragon Kick's utility is usually overlooked cause it's built into our rotation and mainly functions to increase our damage.
However, it plays a larger utility role than, say, Mantra since it's a permanent debuff to the boss.

@Fricket, As far as utility goes, Dragoon has a vastly superior Slow debuff. I would imagine this is a sort-of counterpoint to Mantra. One decreases incoming dmg, one speeds recovery. Both are Cross class, and both have class associated Traits pumping them up.

I cant really consider Haymaker if not used cross class by a warrior. The pre-req dodge makes it too unreliable for a class that isn't intentionally getting attention. Feint on the other hand has a much longer duration and can be triggered at almost any time.

I'm only level 32 on Dragoon, but there has been very little that has been immune to Feint so far.

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Originally Posted by Tzain

I'm only level 32 on Dragoon, but there has been very little that has been immune to Feint so far.

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I'm not sure how well Feint works on end game bosses but it may very well work.
It is better than Lethargy due to the increased time. I can't say Feint is better than Shadowflare though. Shadowflare may only be 5% but it is always up (no diminishing returns), it's an aoe and it's already included in the SMN single target rotation (no dps loss by using it).
Major downside is obviously the lower slow and that the enemy has to stand in the area to get the debuff. Still a Slow simply works better as a sustained debuff generally.

Has anyone ever tried to use Feint on Twin to space out her Death sentence/Plummet/Auto-attack? That's the only real utility I can see for it. That diminishing returns hit hard . Like 3 Feints and then the target will fully resist, I think. With a shorter duration each time.

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Originally Posted by Allyrion

Dragon Kick is MNK's main utility, Mantra is secondary. It lowers the Boss's INT by 10% and is made to be a constant debuff.
It's like a permanent mini-Supervirus (the super virus trait lowers int by 15%) and, of course, stacks with Supervirus.

This is beneficial for any fight with magic damage. Similarly, Rage of Halone from the PLD reduces STR by 10% and is the counterpart to DK.

Dragon Kick's utility is usually overlooked cause it's built into our rotation and mainly functions to increase our damage.
However, it plays a larger utility role than, say, Mantra since it's a permanent debuff to the boss.

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It's true, my main lack of remembering the int debuff is because a large majority of boss abilities end up being physical or str based. But it is something that Drg doesn't bring utility wise.

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Originally Posted by Tzain

@Fricket, As far as utility goes, Dragoon has a vastly superior Slow debuff. I would imagine this is a sort-of counterpoint to Mantra. One decreases incoming dmg, one speeds recovery. Both are Cross class, and both have class associated Traits pumping them up.

I cant really consider Haymaker if not used cross class by a warrior. The pre-req dodge makes it too unreliable for a class that isn't intentionally getting attention. Feint on the other hand has a much longer duration and can be triggered at almost any time.

I'm only level 32 on Dragoon, but there has been very little that has been immune to Feint so far.

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The reason I leave out feint and stuns is because they're not usuable on end game, but you are of course correct. Slow is an amazing utility that would trivialize most bosses(the only end game raid boss I know that is affected by it is garuda), which is why I assume you can't use it on them.

I have and play both since they can share the same Acc. items. I prefer MNK more cause its more forgiving when it comes to rotations if you mess up, cause you'll just lose potency, And I like to punching stuff in the face ^^. But I don't play DRG enough to follow this insanely long 27hit rotation or w/e it is now. But my Wife plays DRG and loves it. MNK hits fast for lower numbers and DRG hit slow for higher numbers.

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Originally Posted by Fricket

It's true, my main lack of remembering the int debuff is because a large majority of boss abilities end up being physical or str based. But it is something that Drg doesn't bring utility wise.

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I wouldn't count it out so much. All Primal things, All ADS(mini ADS in T1 and all of T2) and T5's Fireball, Liquid Hell, Twisters, Gigaflare (if you're a little crazy).
A good chunk of end-game has magic damage (and a good amount of that is unavoidable). Most tank attacks, though, are admittedly STR based.
It's still fairly significant.

ultima sports a wild amount of magic attacks as well, if im correct.

i do admit i do forget the INT debuff of DK cause the one thing i get told on coil sometimes we want ur dragoon for disembowel and im just like learn to do blunt dmg =P

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Originally Posted by Subucnimorning

I play both (i90 monk, i83 DRG), they are useful for different things. I would recommend Monk for most content but there are cases like Garuda EX, T5, etc that I would play a DRG over MNK. Usually any fight where GL3 falls more than once I would go for DRG or an encounter that benefits from high burst.

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Best answer in this thread. I've done every fight in this game on both classes (drg is on my alt) and really you should just play what you have more fun on. This is how I would summarize the endgame content for which is better in my experience though.

Better fights for MNK
Coil t1
Coil t2
Coil t5
Titan Extreme

Better fights for DRG
Coil t4
Garuda Extreme
Ifrit Extreme

levelling monk even though i hate the class, because manta, int debuff, high sustained damage, shared accessories, similar skill level, same role... still though. drg will always be my favorite of the two.

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Originally Posted by TallSummit

Best answer in this thread. I've done every fight in this game on both classes (drg is on my alt) and really you should just play what you have more fun on. This is how I would summarize the endgame content for which is better in my experience though.

Better fights for MNK
Coil t1
Coil t2
Coil t5
Titan Extreme

Better fights for DRG
Coil t4
Garuda Extreme
Ifrit Extreme

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T1 is ok for DRG too since cadeceus basically stands there and asks for us to just beat him up.
T2 ... i do rot, so basically every node is also standing there to get beaten up, well except for ADS sadly.
Titan Ex ... there is only heavy thrust where i have to move to flank, other than that the full rotation can be done at the back. So i think it's still ok.

I don't have a monk, but i would like to try it one out soon.
Flashy moves :D

MNK if you want to hit really fast, have higher sustained damage and do sweet karate.

DRG if you want to see big numbers (albeit slow GCD), have higher burst and fly through the air like a badass airplane.