MNK 4.0 Changes . . . I'm not a fan tbh

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Originally Posted by Arcian

Someone on Reddit summed it up quite nicely:

"Going slow was a punishment. Now it's baked into our rotation."

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Yea, that really is the best summary for the entire issue with RoF.

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Originally Posted by Arcian

You're looking at Tackle Mastery, which gives Shoulder Tackle in FoF a whopping 20 more potency.

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@Julliebeans
The same amount you lose in less than every 2 GCDs due to the weaponskill nerfs and loss of Touch of Death and Fracture...

(Compare to the potency increases of all other extant melee classes.)

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

@Julliebeans
The same amount you lose in less than every 2 GCDs due to the weaponskill nerfs and loss of Touch of Death and Fracture...

(Compare to the potency increases of all other extant melee classes.)

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Losing Fracture is something I would have grumbled about. Losing both Fracture and ToD is just...ugh.

Looking forward to all those mandatory demo clips, mmmm.

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Originally Posted by Arcian

That's not a new trait. FoF has always been a flat 5% damage increase.

You're looking at Tackle Mastery, which gives Shoulder Tackle in FoF a whopping 20 more potency.

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yes i am looking at Tackle mastery, the new trait at 66.. but isnt "fist of fire" increase dmg for all your dmg skills? so if it said "increase dmg dealt" by using fist of fire, which mean it should increase all your dmg skill in general right?

Great Job Se. Imma go play sam now, atleast I won't feel bad for having about 5 skills I never click

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Originally Posted by Jilliebeans

yes i am looking at Tackle mastery, the new trait at 66.. but isnt "fist of fire" increase dmg for all your dmg skills? so if it said "increase dmg dealt" by using fist of fire, which mean it should increase all your dmg skill in general right?

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Fists of Fire has always existed. The reason they added tackle mastery was to try and get us to not spend all our time in Fists of Fire for some reason.

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Originally Posted by Jilliebeans

yes i am looking at Tackle mastery, the new trait at 66.. but isnt "fist of fire" increase dmg for all your dmg skills? so if it said "increase dmg dealt" by using fist of fire, which mean it should increase all your dmg skill in general right?

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No. Tackle Mastery only applies to Shoulder Tackle. The "damage increase" is that 20 potency I mentioned.

That's it. That's all you get.

We have yet to see how useful tackle master is going to be.
out of pvp I have no idea yet...

wow.. MNK sure is getting all terrible in this patch then lol, MNK population is already low enough beside MCH.. now we barely see any of them in 4.0 =/ good job SE...

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Originally Posted by DatPotato

We have yet to see how useful tackle master is going to be.
out of pvp I have no idea yet...

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Wind Tackle's hits are significantly lower in potency than the single hit granted by Fire Tackle, even without the 5% from FoF added in. Also the window for popping the second tackle is five seconds.

Earth Tackle adds a knockback.

To a gap closer.

For a melee dps.

That is one of the least useful things I have ever seen implemented in an MMO.

Are they really planning to leave the job as it is now ? and even tell us to "calm down a little bit ?"

Why can't they just admit how bad they fucked up the job and fix it ? If we're mad there is a reason, we know the job since we played for years.

I'm really mad right now <_<

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Originally Posted by Deithwen

Are they really planning to leave the job as it is now ? and even tell us to "calm down a little bit ?"

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Did they really say that? Where? Because I really hope they did, so they give me a reason to rage quit this job as soon as I'm done with MSQ. I have been maining it ever since I started playing over 3 years ago and I am, as basically everyone, just.... not happy.

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Originally Posted by Rheumasalbe

Did they really say that? Where?

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Yoshi said in the E3 conference a couple days ago. He said everyone needs to "calm down a bit" and play the jobs for themselves before coming to conclusions. I had hope, but I really feel like they dropped the ball on a lot of jobs.

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Originally Posted by Rheumasalbe

Did they really say that? Where? Because I really hope they did, so they give me a reason to rage quit this job as soon as I'm done with MSQ. I have been maining it ever since I started playing over 3 years ago and I am, as basically everyone, just.... not happy.

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Yep. That's exactly from the translation of the most recent (E3) interview when talking about WHM and especially Monk players.

Exactly what anyone exasperated over incompetence and a poor track record for timely and satisfying balance corrections needs, right?

After browsing through the job's list of skills and abilities, I frankly am satisfied with them. And that's coming from someone who has been maining monk since November(-ish) 2014, with some white mage maining at the very beginning of Heavensward.

Weaponskill potencies have been reduces by 10, but Twin Snakes increases your damage by 10% instead of 5%, and Internal Release gives +30% critical chance, which easily makes up for it.
TP costs have been reduced, giving monk players some relief in drawn-out battles, and less reliance on Purification and Invigorate.

Frankly, losing the stun on Steel Peak is my biggest complaint. That will be quite the adaptation process.

we had enhanced twin snake which was already a 10 % increase and im pretty sure enhanced internal release was a 30% buff too

man just read the patch notes and omg i can feel the dev team was drinking haterade when they were working on monk like seriously wtf...first time im triggered enough to complain in a forum geez

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Originally Posted by tedsharpy

we had enhanced twin snake which was already a 10 % increase and im pretty sure enhanced internal release was a 30% buff too

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It was 5% base, but increased to 10% with the trait, which is the part that escaped me. So that's my bad. :(

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Originally Posted by Holy-chan

Weaponskill potencies have been reduces by 10, but Twin Snakes increases your damage by 10% instead of 5%, and Internal Release gives +30% critical chance, which easily makes up for it.
TP costs have been reduced, giving monk players some relief in drawn-out battles, and less reliance on Purification and Invigorate.

Frankly, losing the stun on Steel Peak is my biggest complaint. That will be quite the adaptation process.

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Twin Snakes has always been 10%
Internal Release has always been 30% (Cross skill classes it was 10%)
Lowering potencies by 10 isn't that big of a deal, sure, but I guess it more than makes up for it seeing as those two buffs didn't change.

And if you're upset about losing steel peak stun fret not. One Ilm Punch always stuns on raptor form, which easily makes up for it.

So the #deletemonk was taken to heart by the dev team it seems. Welp time to jump on the sam bandwagon, I guess that's why we share gear with them.

well try this new monk don't interest me, since it's mostly a huge nerf and slap in the face, then i did calm down, simply refuse to play a dumb down useless jobs.

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Originally Posted by Seemo

Twin Snakes has always been 10%
Internal Release has always been 30% (Cross skill classes it was 10%)
Lowering potencies by 10 isn't that big of a deal, sure, but I guess it more than makes up for it seeing as those two buffs didn't change.

And if you're upset about losing steel peak stun fret not. One Ilm Punch always stuns on raptor form, which easily makes up for it.

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Wait, was Internal Release always that much? Oh my God, I need to pay attention to tool tips I stopped reading over two years ago. (I tend to just remember the base stuff on skills I also used to cross-class on other jobs.) Once again, that's my bad. I feel like a moron right now. :(

The changes to One Ilm Punch are nothing too special in my eyes. What was cool about Steel Peak is that it's usable on the fly. As is Shoulder Tackle, of course. Having an ability that deals damage without stun will make me want to cross-class that new ability that stuns and does no damage, but I won't be able to use both very easily. It's a muscle memory issue for me, as I'll basically want to use two abilities that used to be one and the same, so to speak. Ah well.

Just wish the monk community was as big as white mages. The German forum has no thread about Monk 4.0, and the French one has one thread with 2 replies and 300 views. It sucks that we are treated like this but SE will probably hardly care since we are so few players.

I sincerely hope they will fix this mess because they are basically ruining monk for the players.

Also, on the topic of Riddle of Fire again: why did they think it's a good idea to do 67 levels of "attack as fast as you can" and THEN implement this basically necessary (or useless, depending on who you ask I suppose) buff that slows us down and - reiterating what many have said before - completely defeats the purpose and identity of the monk. It's just utter bs.

These changes don't look great on paper... I guess we'll have to live with it for a while until a balancing out patch is out. Funny, for a Monk themed expansion, we sure didn't get the treatment i expected.

I've just tried monk at level 60, it's really boring as hell, good thing though is that the dps loss is not that big even though it's here, I basically lost 15s on the a12s dummy.

I'll need to try on my drg and my nin to see if this applies for them too, if it doesn't .. that would be very very bad.

Tempted to just say eff it and switch to Samurai, as well. but im still holding out hope. But right now Samurai looks way more interesting and im sad. it's making me grind my teeth.

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Originally Posted by phishstix

Tempted to just say eff it and switch to Samurai, as well. but im still holding out hope. But right now Samurai looks way more interesting and im sad. it's making me grind my teeth.

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I feel the same. Also I feel kinda "forced" to play samurai because of how bad the state of monk is, and I don't feel like I'm enjoying it as much as I should because of that.

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Originally Posted by Deithwen

I feel the same. Also I feel kinda "forced" to play samurai because of how bad the state of monk is, and I don't feel like I'm enjoying it as much as I should because of that.

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Same here, I actually didn't enjoy any class as much as MNK, I hope I won't have to change classes :|

yea played monk- I didn't feel weaker- but OMG how boring is MNK- why didn't they give us a new combo- its dull as dirt esp. with no new offensive skills

Just some ideas for what I hope could be a thing for Monk.

Brotherhood: Affects everyone. Keep the weaponskill restriction, but add a +5% to magical damage, healing done and -5% damage taken.

Fists of Wind/Riddle of Wind/Wind Tackle: FoW increases attack speed (Possibly SkS) and gives an additive bonus to crit chance (These values would even out with the DPS bonus on FoF). RoW Tackles give a Chakra stack for each tackle (In this idealized fantasy of a Monk, FoW is about building more chakra via more Crits and speed)

Riddle of Earth/Earth Tackle: RoE grants a damage reduction bonus to everyone. Remove the GL refresh. Earth Tackle inflicts a large potency attack (Fitting the idea of a hard, crushing blow in an Earthen Fist).

Fire Tackle:A minute long DoT that is roughly equal to two Touch of Deaths (Thematic givens FoFs small, but ultimately hugely potent bonus of damage).

Deep Meditation: Lower Chance to proc off any crit.

Aside from a straight buff to Brotherhood, the idea is to work with the ideas and theming SE wants the Monk to have. I love the idea of using different fists at different times. It suits the Monk's style given the plethora of moves from so many martial arts and them constantly changing forms. FoE should stay defensive, but be great at being defensive, since that's never really valued too highly for a DPS, and the damage at least gives it a use and a choice of what tackle to use mid FoF DoT(And gives us monks more to do lol). There would actually be a meaningful choice between FoF, FoW and FoE (For the tackle) depending on the amount of Chakra you have, party size, Brotherhood or Riddle of Fire being up, whether you gamble on the Crits or like the consistency of FoF, etc...

Anyone knows if I can disable the new MNK UI? I have no idea where to keep this thing in my screen and I find it easier to keep track of GL and Chakra if they are in my status effect bar.

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Originally Posted by TheAngelneer

Anyone knows if I can disable the new MNK UI? I have no idea where to keep this thing in my screen and I find it easier to keep track of GL and Chakra if they are in my status effect bar.

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You can disable it in the UI settings. I don't think you'll be able to track those on your status bar thought. You can also make it smaller if you want (crl + home to change the size if I remember correctly).

Things I'm guilty of so far:
1. hitting the button touch of death used to be on and expecting a DoT
2. Hitting steel peak when I need to stun

I have a couple suggestions to help improve monk for sb, constructive criticism is welcomed.

- Make one ilm punch an aoe attack.

- Grant the buff of dragon kick on the first hit.

- Make Forbidden chakra a buff instead of an attack which grants a greased lightning for
every successful 5 chakra procured.

- Remove form shift because of previous two points above.

- Get rid of the the three separate fists and make them into one single fist.
Granting damage boost, critical hit, movement speed, damage reduction and
replenishment of a greased lightning if hit

Thanks for reading. #Tryingtomakemonkbetter.

anyone reached a high level and likes monk so far ?

Without Touch of Death and Fracture, the rotation looks simpler than what we've been using for all these years. Hopefully Riddle of Fire's 20 second damage boost is enough to overcome the drop in attack speed it brings. Also hoping that the brotherhood ability grants us a lot of chakras when its active (since the duration seems to be only 15 seconds.)

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Originally Posted by Ragology

Without Touch of Death and Fracture, the rotation looks simpler than what we've been using for all these years. Hopefully Riddle of Fire's 20 second damage boost is enough to overcome the drop in attack speed it brings. Also hoping that the brotherhood ability grants us a lot of chakras when its active (since the duration seems to be only 15 seconds.)

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Under the ideal setup, with a full party of monks, so 7 other people using a weaponskill every 2 seconds, the average chakra generation from Brotherhood is around 17 chakra. In a normal raid comp, even with all monk dps, you can expect roughly 11 chakra. At 50 potency/chakra, that makes Brotherhood roughly worth 550 potency, with about a 100 potency loss for every caster. With a 90s cooldown, this makes Brotherhood worth about 360 potency a minute.

at level 66 monk so far and by my observations...my damage is waaayyyy less than 3.x Monk. Rotation hasn't really changed much and Riddle of Earth is kind of hilarious imho. The potency reductions for the job specifically, to me, shows that they don't know what to do with Monk. Other jobs as well have received potency reductions and I don't feel it was worth it. I've played with RDM's, BLM's, SMN's, DRG's, BRD's, MCH's via DF....Only RDM I have seen positive critique on from this expansion. I think they should return the potencies they reduced back to full and stop the nerfs.

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Originally Posted by Alkimi

Pretty much every job that had a 30 sec DoT lost it. Mutilate, Phlebotomize, Scourge, Fracture are all gone.

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This is why I canceled my subscription. I have not found anything to show that this is good in any way.

the only thing more upsetting than what they did to monk is the fact people saying we got buffed with skills we already had and they just removed the job trait for and put it in the skill itself... seems no one actually knows alot about monk except for the few mains probably fewer now.... :c