Confused about people's obsession with open world raids/dungeons.

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Originally Posted by wish12oz

Excluding yourself from doing things is fine, people's cheating excluding you from being able to participate from things you want to get stuff from is a bad thing. I don't understand how you are so dim witted you cannot understand this. Do you even want this game to succeed? If people can't do the limited amount of content there is, they will leave and play something else, simple as that. You seem to think this is a good thing, can you explain why?



People tried that in FF11, it didn't work. Good bots are not detectable.

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I played FF 11 for years every time someone did not get claimed they call a GM said X ls was botting. People will claim you are in xi even if you was on ps2 >.>. when people start yelling but it poped Purple you no one to blame but your self.

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Originally Posted by Firon

I played FF 11 for years every time someone did not get claimed they call a GM said X ls was botting. People will claim you are in xi even if you was on ps2 >.>. when people start yelling but it poped Purple you no one to blame but your self.

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Are you attempting to imply that botting wasn't rampant in XI with this post?

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Originally Posted by Charismatic

Are you attempting to imply that botting wasn't rampant in XI with this post?

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What he is probably implying is not that botting didn't happen it is that some people would say others are bots yet the person in question is playing from a PS2 and can't really be a bot...

I curious as to why this thread is still growing in posts... really... lets just have both and have both be equally rewarding and go on our happy ways... it is pointless to remove one or the other and makes more sense to have both so that all will be happy with it... then again you humans do complain and rage at each other over nothing and anything anyways so why am I even bothering??

the cat is bemused =-.-=

I dont have a problem having both Instanced and OW content. As long as each has the same/similar rewards. I for instance would be strongly opposed if there was a bad ass shield that could only be gotten through OW content. I dont want OW content and I dont want to do it, and would feel put out and upset if the only way I could get said shield is by doing what I dont want to do.

Now as long as I had an Instanced alternative for getting said bad ass shield, all would be well.

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Originally Posted by Amsai

I dont have a problem having both Instanced and OW content. As long as each has the same/similar rewards. I for instance would be strongly opposed if there was a bad ass shield that could only be gotten through OW content. I dont want OW content and I dont want to do it, and would feel put out and upset if the only way I could get said shield is by doing what I dont want to do.

Now as long as I had an Instanced alternative for getting said bad ass shield, all would be well.

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I'm all for having equally powered rewards in instancing an OW content. All for it. But you also have to realize that the gear likely isn't going to be the same in terms of there being a Lv.50 shield from an instance and the same Lv.50 shield from an OW NM. That just isn't practical. If you want to be min/max you'll likely have to do both types of content.

gear that is similar in both is like killing one of the contents for people that want to do it all. i'm for choices and stuff but not in this manner. if there is open world and instance they should all be different rewards.different pieces of gear or slots something that makes doing both relevant. i doubt SE would make content where only some people would want to do it or half do the other instead of making good on all there resources for all to use. this is probably why i feel you can't have both, a game is either made for some types of gameplay or others. ...otherwise it's just half a game.

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Originally Posted by weeble

gear that is similar in both is like killing one of the contents for people that want to do it all. i'm for choices and stuff but not in this manner. if there is open world and instance they should all be different rewards.different pieces of gear or slots something that makes doing both relevant. i doubt SE would make content where only some people would want to do it or half do the other instead of making good on all there resources for all to use. this is probably why i feel you can't have both, a game is either made for some types of gameplay or others. ...otherwise it's just half a game.

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yet in FFXI you had a majority of the endgame linkshells doing Ground HNM, Dynamis, Sky/Sea trigger HNM, Limbus, Einherjar, Salvage, Nyzul and Abyssea all at the same time. Then you had linkshells who focused specifically on certain content based on their personal goals. It worked and can work in XIV if done properly. As long as there are no proverbial D.Rings, Ridills or Adaberks from ONE single type of content and everything is similar in usefulness/power (aside from the obvious endgame legendaries) then it will work.

Yea, thats why I said similar/same before. It wouldnt have to be the exact same item but it would need to be similar enough. Alternatively lets say that there is a sword and shield set that is OW only and then a Sword and shield set that is Instanced only. What if an item by themselves was different but together you got relatively the same stats? You know, basically the same overall stats, but distributed differently throughout a a set of gear. And of course a different design. I think that would create enough variation so that each content could be viable and worthwhile.

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Originally Posted by WiiSam

Explain to me how you can't explore an instance? It'sa "new area" just like any you visit. That involves exploration. Don't be dense.

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Exploration and "Visiting" are two different things. When I explore I can do it whenever I want, I don't need 7 other people or need to be a specific rank to enter the area.

You don't "Explore" a instance you experience the on rails ride the developers set for you.

not one of ffxi's endgames had the "same" gear though. at most they all had full sets and maybe 1-2 items in them that you would want for each class other then getting the rest so you can store it on npc. if a nm had a sword of gluttony and a instance had it, one of the 2 content = not a point in doing though. and also most will just pick the easiest route. in ffxi all those content were all worth doing if wanted to. yes you could do all week sky ls or do a sky/sea ls but they all had there reasons to be there. if they both had the same gear it would literally void one of them. ffxi did a great job in keeping all gear wanted and i loved that and hopefully they shape up and get back to that focus.

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Originally Posted by Fiosha_Maureiba

WiiSam! You gots ta shut the gate! Dooo eeeet!!!

(Didn't think this thread was against open world content, just competitive open-world PvE dungeons).

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You are right, that is exactly what this thread is about. There are just a lot of folk who aren't getting it. The folks who want open world competition are full of slippery slopes:

-They say botting is not an excuse because you can bot instances, but what they don't get is that botting in an instance doesn't screw anyone over.

-They say instances are boring because who wants to sit in town and teleport to a dungeon, when that is not at all necessary. Nobody is teleporting to darkhold. They also don't realise they are sitting in town just the same spamming for a party to go a kill an open world nm just like they would spam for a party to go complete an instance.

-They use bowl of embers as an example as to why dungeons lack exploration, when that is a flaw with design, not a flaw with instances. Instances can be as big and massive as they decide to create them.

-They say instances cause people to /afk at the aeth waiting all day for a party when all they do is /afk at an NM's spawn waiting for it the same way :S.

-They say they want to meet random people to help them kill these open world NMs but they are definitely going to use their LS or find a pt in town, so point moot.

-They say a lot of things that I, and many others, have refuted, but they insist that my points have been refuted over and over, which I have yet to see because all arguments entail slippery slopes. Matter of fact they are such trolls by nature they will read through this post and analyze the crap out of it to make and when they realize that a few of my points aren't exactly slippery slopes they will say im a dumbass who doesn't know what a slippery slope is. Which has nothing to do with the argument.

Raffle Faffle.

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Originally Posted by weeble

not one of ffxi's endgames had the "same" gear though. at most they all had full sets and maybe 1-2 items in them that you would want for each class other then getting the rest so you can store it on npc. if a nm had a sword of gluttony and a instance had it, one of the 2 content = not a point in doing though. and also most will just pick the easiest route. in ffxi all those content were all worth doing if wanted to. yes you could do all week sky ls or do a sky/sea ls but they all had there reasons to be there. if they both had the same gear it would literally void one of them. ffxi did a great job in keeping all gear wanted and i loved that and hopefully they shape up and get back to that focus.

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inb4 Einherjar vs. Kings

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Originally Posted by WiiSam

You are right, that is exactly what this thread is about. There are just a lot of folk who aren't getting it. The folks who want open world competition are full of slippery slopes:

-They say botting is not an excuse because you can bot instances, but what they don't get is that botting in an instance doesn't screw anyone over.

-They say instances are boring because who wants to sit in town and teleport to a dungeon, when that is not at all necessary. Nobody is teleporting to darkhold. They also don't realise they are sitting in town just the same spamming for a party to go a kill an open world nm just like they would spam for a party to go complete an instance.

-They use bowl of embers as an example as to why dungeons lack exploration, when that is a flaw with design, not a flaw with instances. Instances can be as big and massive as they decide to create them.

-They say instances cause people to /afk at the aeth waiting all day for a party when all they do is /afk at an NM's spawn waiting for it the same way :S.

-They say they want to meet random people to help them kill these open world NMs but they are definitely going to use their LS or find a pt in town, so point moot.

-They say a lot of things that I, and many others, have refuted, but they insist that my points have been refuted over and over, which I have yet to see because all arguments entail slippery slopes. Matter of fact they are such trolls by nature they will read through this post and analyze the crap out of it to make and when they realize that a few of my points aren't exactly slippery slopes they will say im a dumbass who doesn't know what a slippery slope is. Which has nothing to do with the argument.

Raffle Faffle.

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-I just out claim the bot
-I never said that.
-Nope, I didn't
-Nope, again
-Umm I don't wanna meet random people to kill an nm, I want to meet random people and explore and do stuff. If I'm on, and I feel like I wanna explore, but nobody else does, I wanna run into people along the way.
-Nope, not one time have you refuted any of MY comments, you never even responded to one of mine(maybe 2). I never said you were a "dumbass".<--- Thats counting for everyone the 2 responses. maybe 4, but ya, they didn't refute me in anyway.

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Originally Posted by Rokien

-I just out claim the bot
-I never said that.
-Nope, I didn't
-Nope, again
-Umm I don't wanna meet random people to kill an nm, I want to meet random people and explore and do stuff. If I'm on, and I feel like I wanna explore, but nobody else does, I wanna run into people along the way.
-Nope, not one time have you refuted any of MY comments, you never even responded to one of mine(maybe 2). I never said you were a "dumbass".

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:S Never had a problem with your posts. Me not wanting open competition doesn't harm your "running into people along the way." So I'm glad what you want and what I want can co-exist.

Like, Mabinogi was the best MMO in ideas ever, it just lacked in graphics(didn't age well) also, it was mostly instances, which REALLY turned me away. It was just sooo blah, though all the ideas they put in the game were amazing, and would be/is kinda my favorite mmo. I like that competition, though, I also like a few instances here and there as well. FFXIV is not doing instances well right now, they are terrible. If they keep em how they are now, I just want pure open world.

Here... watch this... the whole thing... this is what most of you humans strive for.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Du2mLuK9edk

Your base instincts tell you to fight and compete... so you can get stronger and evolve into something greater.

Those who are weak and cannot keep up always pull for the equality and equal sharing of wealth and such... communism or socialists come to mind when this comes up...

In the end I will stick with what I have said... for those that love to compete and fight it out for gear and such... give them the open world events that they wish for. For those that do not wish to do that give those the instanced dungeons they wish for. Both sides can be happy and both sides can have what they wish... taking away one aspect or side of this because you feel it is not right and that the competition is wrong in some way is a selfish act on your part and you are trying to remove the fun and wants of others from the game.

Both sides can have what they want and both sides can be happy... if you cannot see this fact or refuse to see it then you are nothing more then a selfish blind fool... I do hope you can see this but then again I have started to lose hope in you humans...

The cat is bemused =-.-=

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Originally Posted by Richard_BG

inb4 Einherjar vs. Kings

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I cant possibly "This" Enough.

People who only want instanced content should be playing an offline game with maybe a co-op function instead of a mmorpg isntead of screwing us all because it doesn't suit their tastes.

Instaces take the mm out of the orpg.

And don't get me started about the people who want to divide the servers by region.

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Originally Posted by Charismatic

Are you attempting to imply that botting wasn't rampant in XI with this post?

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I'm not saying it was not rampart but you never knew who was truly botting your best friend could have been botting you would not know I was accused over 50 times i was a botter when i only played on ps2.

Edit: Even when i ran my own ls i had ls mates claiming other ls was botting and had to calm them down
it's damn near impossible to tell if someone has a claiming bot, but an movement speed or walking thru wall bot or claiming a mob 100 feet away is pretty obvious.

The way the game is set up right now, instanced encounters only allow one group. Thats where I take issue, I want content that requires more then 1 group as an option, so I can bring 3 groupd from my LS, to kill a mob that takes 20-25 players to kill. Let the bots claim that if they exist there. If someone besides my raid pary had 20-25 people there and ready, then they are entitled to it, if they claim it first. If they don't have a full raid party there, they die, and lose the claim anyway, and it no longer becomes an issue.

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Originally Posted by WiiSam

You are right, that is exactly what this thread is about. There are just a lot of folk who aren't getting it. The folks who want open world competition are full of slippery slopes: No, the thread is about how before you ninja edited your first post, you said that all end game content should be instance, and then you argued how no end game content should be open world.

-They say botting is not an excuse because you can bot instances, but what they don't get is that botting in an instance doesn't screw anyone over. I say cheating is cheating. And if your not agaist policing boting as a whole then your for it. Policing boting should be enforced not limiting content because of it.

-They say instances are boring because who wants to sit in town and teleport to a dungeon, when that is not at all necessary. Nobody is teleporting to darkhold. They also don't realise they are sitting in town just the same spamming for a party to go a kill an open world nm just like they would spam for a party to go complete an instance. No, this is not actually the case, but it does demonstrate how you attept to ignore inconvenitent truths. I do not sit around town at all. I and many from 2 of my LS actual used the group search and found group there, believe or not. We also had multiple LS we formed parties from as well as friends list. The only time I got to town is to hit the wards for supplies. You have develped a strong knack for stereotyping players in this thread to suit your needs.

-They use bowl of embers as an example as to why dungeons lack exploration, when that is a flaw with design, not a flaw with instances. Instances can be as big and massive as they decide to create them. Not really, none of the dungeons we have leave much to explore. "Can be" and "are" are two diffeent things.

-They say instances cause people to /afk at the aeth waiting all day for a party when all they do is /afk at an NM's spawn waiting for it the same way :S. Clearly you tell convienent lies to avoid the inconvienent truth. You are so against OW material that we have no reason to believe your around any of it to know what people do there anyway. Its a rarety to see a sight you claim as common, here. One more testimate that you make statements based on how you want the system to be as compared to its reality.

-They say they want to meet random people to help them kill these open world NMs but they are definitely going to use their LS or find a pt in town, so point moot. Again you make up convenient lies and assumptions to tell us how we will play. Sure we will use LS and friends list, but once the working group registry gets fixed the efficiency to shout in towns will be eliviated. Not that this arguement holds any logic, as before ifrit, all you heard in shouts in towns was players trying to form instanced parties for toto and DH.

-They say a lot of things that I, and many others, have refuted, but they insist that my points have been refuted over and over, which I have yet to see because all arguments entail slippery slopes.Thats you opinion, not the general concesus. Intertaining how you stat it as if by some illogical means of magic that it becomes fact because you spew it on to the forums.

Matter of fact they are such trolls by nature they will read through this post and analyze the crap out of it to make and when they realize that a few of my points aren't exactly slippery slopes I see, anyone who disagrees with you and supports policing of bots is a troll. Wierd, I always though posters who were against pushing for policing of bots and wanted to limit content because of it were trolls.

they will say im a dumbass You called it, not me.

who doesn't know what a slippery slope is. Which has nothing to do with the argument. If you want to dee everything a slippery slop, how does it become less relavent to the debate? The real issue is you originally posted to have all endgame material instanced and spoke against OW material, and when you realized the debate was 25 to 1 agaist you and everyone bashed you for it, you attepted to ninja edit your post 3 days later and lies about the original stance.

Raffle Faffle. <-this part I totally agree with

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You use the same crystal ball to make all these false assumptions that you used to detirmine CON = BLM and THM = WHM also?

there are merits to both sides but let me just say that Sky and Sea were two of my favorite things from ffxi. 10-20 people going about the entire region, farming things, looking for pop times and whatnot. it scaled from easy breezy, to jesus flossing christ save me. I always thought a little competition made it fun, but if there were already 2 or three linkshells out and about we had more than enough things to go off and do something else. it was also largely a social experience that the majority of the linkshell could participate in.

we didn't have too many instances in xi, limbus, BCNMs, later on assualts and salvage, closed off requiring specific technical and strategic expertise from a specific number of people with fancy shmancy rewards. even dynamis was sorta instanced.


Sorry getting kinda nostalgic but before I lose myself in memory lane my point is that there is room for both and I don't understand why we need to pick one over the other .

WiiSam doesn't even know what he is trying to get at.

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Originally Posted by Coglin

The way the game is set up right now, instanced encounters only allow one group. Thats where I take issue, I want content that requires more then 1 group as an option, so I can bring 3 groupd from my LS, to kill a mob that takes 20-25 players to kill. Let the bots claim that if they exist there. If someone besides my raid pary had 20-25 people there and ready, then they are entitled to it, if they claim it first. If they don't have a full raid party there, they die, and lose the claim anyway, and it no longer becomes an issue.

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I agree with you on this one, I personally like big group content instanced or open world.

I've read several post in this thread and I would like to put my two cents on it.

I myself like Open World more so than Instanced areas with way the things are in FFXIV. With Instanced areas you are set to the group limit specified by SE. I will give Ifrit for an example, you are in a group with ls of 8 doing Ifrit then someone gets wife aggro and has to go. You are stuck outside unable to enter with 7 members who can still easily take down Ifrit. You are stuck for awhile looking for someone to replace him if no one is available and will have to call it a day if you can't find one. Also have the issue with making ls events of limited Instanced Raids. You can have more than 8 members wanting to go but only 8 can get in and the ones who aren't in the first group will more than likely feel left out. With open world everyone can participate even if not in the claiming group. If they implement group alliances and tailor instanced dungeons for it that would be ok in my book.

FFXIV can have Open World and Instanced raids as long as its balanced with the gear drops aren't better than the other. They can spread set drop out between the 2 like having 3 pieces drop Instanced while the other 2 drop from open world. There will be competition no matter what and that whats make playing online fun. Either its out claiming someone on a open world NM or being the first ls to do this.

Like Oran Kells said Sky was one of my favorite Open World areas. It spread out the work for an ls to farm the drops and everyone who was able to come could contribute to the efforts. It was also fun cause you had to camp several NM's for pop items to pop another NM which in turn drop another pop item to pop the final NM and all dropped gear items. After a few days of work to farm those triggers and beat Kirin was real accomplishment because you put in work for it.

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Originally Posted by Coglin

You use the same crystal ball to make all these false assumptions that you used to detirmine CON = BLM and THM = WHM also?

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You missed the whole point of each of my points. Also, I left my original post at the top of the OP, untouched, so everyone can see what changed. Everything that was in the original OP is still there in quotation marks. All you did was call me a liar to "refute" my posts. You didn't explain or actually refute anything.

Rofl and you said that because you and TWO other LS members use the CURRENT party search that somehow everyone else does? And then you say I spew out stuff that I think everyone does? The current party search sucks and HARDLY anybody uses it. Fail.

Oh and I was also never involved in any WHM BLM argument so I don't know what you're talking about. I could give a flying F*$! whether thm is blm or whm.

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Originally Posted by Coglin

The way the game is set up right now, instanced encounters only allow one group. Thats where I take issue, I want content that requires more then 1 group as an option, so I can bring 3 groupd from my LS, to kill a mob that takes 20-25 players to kill. Let the bots claim that if they exist there. If someone besides my raid pary had 20-25 people there and ready, then they are entitled to it, if they claim it first. If they don't have a full raid party there, they die, and lose the claim anyway, and it no longer becomes an issue.

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So your argument for open world is to use more than one party. So if SE gives you an instance that allows more than one party aka a "raid" as per wow, you'll be happy? That isn't an argument for open world content, thats an argument for "SE please gives us content to do as multiple parties" because right now nothing in the game is intended to be accomplished by more than 8 players. And that has nothing to do with open world dungeons vs instanced dungeons.

i'll still stay with my original opinion. i prefer open world content because of the competition. i like to run instanced content as well. i like both and would like to see content of both types in the game. there is absolutely NO reason to make only one type of content.

i get it sam, you prefer instanced content and there is absolutely nothing wrong with that. i prefer open world content and there is nothing wrong with that either. the dev team should not make all content to be what you want no more than it should make it all for me. they should make content for both of us. give you some instanced stuff and give me some open world stuff.

by the looks of the responses in this thread you wouldn't want them to give a players poll on it. you would be out voted by at least 25-1 in favor of open world content.

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Originally Posted by darkstarpoet1

by the looks of the responses in this thread you wouldn't want them to give a players poll on it. you would be out voted by at least 25-1 in favor of open world content.

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I respectfully disagree and I want to thank you for being civilized unlike a few others. I would love it if there was a players poll about this. But the poll has to be specific " Do you want open-world competition ie roaming NMs and out door dungeons/coffers/nms/loot"

I would love to see that poll to finally squash this argument. In my opinion open worldwould be out voted 20-1. Elitist like open world competition, and im sorry to say, elitists are far and few between. I'm sorry if the word elitist came out negative, but I am just using a plain word. WoW has proven that the majority of people prefer instances. And before you say "this isn't WoW" you have to remember that folks who were really into ffxi are the minority in this community.

But in short, that poll would be great, hopefully in the third players poll (which comes out in January I think yoshi said?) that question will be included.

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Originally Posted by WiiSam

And before you say "this isn't WoW" you have to remember that folks who were really into ffxi are the minority in this community.

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LOL WAT........

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Originally Posted by WiiSam

And before you say "this isn't WoW" you have to remember that folks who were really into ffxi are the minority in this community.

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hahaha this is a joke

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Originally Posted by WiiSam

WoW has proven that the majority of people prefer instances. And before you say "this isn't WoW" you have to remember that folks who were really into ffxi are the minority in this community.

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i know you realize that this isn't wow. the people that prefer instanced everything are there. they are not in xiv so they would not be voting in the poll. the majority that support the final fantasy series and are playing this game would vote for a mixture of both open world and instanced.

you want the question framed one way, but if it was framed the other way then people would vote against it. you want it framed as an either/or thing. frame the questions correctly and you will not. a simple list of 3 questions to see who wants what.

1. all battles, strongholds, and dungeons instanced.
2. all battles, strongholds, and dungeons open world.
3. a mixture of open world and instanced events.

i will bet you the vast majority would vote the 3rd option. remember this is not wow and does not have the same type of player base. it seems that all besides maybe 5 total people in this thread want the mixture. the in game community is going to be close to that same percentage.

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Originally Posted by darkstarpoet1

i know you realize that this isn't wow. the people that prefer instanced everything are there. they are not in xiv so they would not be voting in the poll. the majority that support the final fantasy series and are playing this game would vote for a mixture of both open world and instanced.

you want the question framed one way, but if it was framed the other way then people would vote against it. you want it framed as an either/or thing. frame the questions correctly and you will not. a simple list of 3 questions to see who wants what.

1. all battles, strongholds, and dungeons instanced.
2. all battles, strongholds, and dungeons open world.
3. a mixture of open world and instanced events.

i will bet you the vast majority would vote the 3rd option. remember this is not wow and does not have the same type of player base. it seems that all besides maybe 5 total people in this thread want the mixture. the in game community is going to be close to that same percentage.

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Yup I would have to agree that majority would want mixture well the ones who aren't biased and bashing the other side for no real reason besides they don't like the other.

I played XI for several years, from ps2 release up to the middle of the treasures expansion and have done everything up til then. After quitting XI I have yet to find a MMO to take it's place after I quit. Even though XIV is a ways away to catch up to XI it has caught my attention more than other MMO's. I favor Open World content more so than instanced raid dungeons but I would love to see an equal mixture of both to keep both sides of the playing field happy that way this game can grow and prosper.

Why is there 35 pages on this? Just agree there's room for both in a MMO and call it.

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Originally Posted by Firon

I'm not saying it was not rampart but you never knew who was truly botting your best friend could have been botting you would not know I was accused over 50 times i was a botter when i only played on ps2.

Edit: Even when i ran my own ls i had ls mates claiming other ls was botting and had to calm them down
it's damn near impossible to tell if someone has a claiming bot, but an movement speed or walking thru wall bot or claiming a mob 100 feet away is pretty obvious.

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Yo Firon, you coming back for 1.20? I have no idea if you're gonna see this, but if you do, I made a new site for us to get organized: http://reddot.guildwork.com/

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Originally Posted by Madruk

Why is there 35 pages on this? Just agree there's room for both in a MMO and call it.

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because of WiiSam troll skill, but his skill is only half way from the one make the jump thread

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Originally Posted by Splice

hahaha this is a joke

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How do you explain why this game is so much less hardcore? And continously taking that direction? Folks who were really into XI want nothing short of super hardcore. Yoshi mentioned that he is trying to hit a wider fanbase because XI is still there for the hardcore XI players. There are a lot of franchise fanboys here who weren't into XI, I am one of them.

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Originally Posted by darkstarpoet1

i know you realize that this isn't wow. the people that prefer instanced everything are there. they are not in xiv so they would not be voting in the poll. the majority that support the final fantasy series and are playing this game would vote for a mixture of both open world and instanced.

you want the question framed one way, but if it was framed the other way then people would vote against it. you want it framed as an either/or thing. frame the questions correctly and you will not. a simple list of 3 questions to see who wants what.

1. all battles, strongholds, and dungeons instanced.
2. all battles, strongholds, and dungeons open world.
3. a mixture of open world and instanced events.

i will bet you the vast majority would vote the 3rd option. remember this is not wow and does not have the same type of player base. it seems that all besides maybe 5 total people in this thread want the mixture. the in game community is going to be close to that same percentage.

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Oh, yes of course, I would vote third option as well, because I want Roaming NMs, i love them, I just don't want open world dungeons. But I just wanted to frame the question that way specifically, without the option of the mixture, to see which side people prefer more, instance, or open world, if they had to choose. The 3rd option can skew the statistic at all, using me as an example, I would only pick option 3 because I like roaming NMs and not open world dungeons, so how would they differentiate between the two you know? So if we posed the question as either open world or instancestrictly then the devs might get an idea of which to put more of. Because the majority want both to some extent, we can agree on that.

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Originally Posted by WiiSam

How do you explain why this game is so much less hardcore? And continously taking that direction? Folks who were really into XI want nothing short of super hardcore. Yoshi mentioned that he is trying to hit a wider fanbase because XI is still there for the hardcore XI players. There are a lot of franchise fanboys here who weren't into XI, I am one of them.

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What is wrong with having some elements in the game?
You say you're a franchise fanboy, but you seem against optional content which has been a big staple of the Final Fantasy franchise. Ever beat Omega and Shinryu in FF5? Ever gone up the Fanatics Tower in FF6 (without ultima)? Ever beat Emerald and Ruby weapon in FF7? Ultima weapon in FF8? Tantarian, Hades, Quale, OZMA in FF9?
All this optional content was there for those who wanted to challenge themselves.
Franchise fanboy? Stop it.
XI is a shell of its former self.

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Originally Posted by Lucifer

What is wrong with having some elements in the game?
You say you're a franchise fanboy, but you seem against optional content which has been a big staple of the Final Fantasy franchise. Ever beat Omega and Shinryu in FF5? Ever gone up the Fanatics Tower in FF6 (without ultima)? Ever beat Emerald and Ruby weapon in FF7? Ultima weapon in FF8? Tantarian, Hades, Quale, OZMA in FF9?
All this optional content was there for those who wanted to challenge themselves.
Franchise fanboy? Stop it.
XI is a shell of its former self.

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Sure I did several of those things, but there was nobody trying to stop me from doing it. That is the only point I'm trying to make. How can it be optional when guilds like BG will "Monopolize camps. Everyday." kthx

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Originally Posted by WiiSam

Sure I did several of those things, but there was nobody trying to stop me from doing it. That is the only point I'm trying to make. How can it be optional when guilds like BG will "Monopolize camps. Everyday." kthx

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It's optional because you don't have to do it when you have your instanced content. Everyday. kthx