Confirmation of Uncapped Raids. Confirmation of a terrible decision.

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Originally Posted by DurtiMonkeyToe

But again this is going to limit playability. Max rank players are going to run 2-3 times until the content is complete then ignore them, where they could be farming it 10-15 times for gear that is mediocre. What scenario seems to have more reply appeal?

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like i said, the best answer is to make capped content, or content that tests primarily the skill of the player, have use across multiple levels, this makes it extremely replayable. Even more so than either of the other options. It shouldnt be the only form of progression, it should be an option. Look at Phantasy star online, Challenge mode was loved, and played numerous numerous times, it essentially featured capped content designed to be challenging and require team work, it was very popular, and highly entertaining. And it gave rewards that were usefull across a large level range.

essentially the point of these dungeons according to them was to create content that was challenging and required team work. Such a system should be difficult for all users, and reward people appropriately. I'll be honest, if they design these dungeons right, and give the right type of rewards, it could be the type of thing that people will want to play for a very long time, no matter what level it is.

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Originally Posted by DurtiMonkeyToe

To which our argument is that there shouldn't be anything in a r30 dungeon that a r50 should need. By your argument the CHALLENGE of a r30 capped dungeon will never equal the REWARD for a r50 who doesn't need r30 gear.

To which your argument will be: Well there may be useful things in the r30 dungeon for r50s.

To which I will argue that it is unreasonable to put r50 gear or even r50 comparable gear in a dungeon 20 levels below r50. Why not just put the r50 gear in content designed for r50, rather than stuffing it in mid level content.

This is why we are going around in circles. There is no clear winner/loser. No right/wrong. There is only differing opinions.

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the reward doesn't need to be gears that drops in the dungeon. It could be reputation/currency/novelty items usuable at any level. So this point is also refutable. And to be fair all our points are refutable since we are just assuming and going off hypothetical situations.

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Originally Posted by Richard

for people who actually enjoy challenging games, the grind and SE's notoriously low drop rate, a sync'd cap + running it 10-15 times seems more appealing. I'd rather run content for a month than 1 day because then i'm going to be annoyed with no content. But hey if you like capping out on gear in a week and then waiting another 3 months for content - enjoy!

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This is your speculation based on your biased opinion. I guarantee that I will not run a r30 capped dungeon more than three times, no matter what the 'challenge' is. Once I beat it, the challenge is gone and all I have left is the question of whether or not I want to farm the dungeon for gear or mats and if all the gear and mats is for r30 jobs, I have no incentive to keep running it.

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Originally Posted by Perrin_Aybarra

cap can be optional too you know. The slider is stupid really, it serves no purpose if the reward is the same, no one will voluntarily handicap themselves, all it does is make the content last a little bit longer if you want to SP in it. Also a slider doesn't allow high level to go help lower level player, it exclude them even more and divide people even more. Optional cap is way better than a slider, and I hope that you see that.

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its not better
its the same thing

the difference being a rank 50 can actualy play on the rank 50 job rather then having to be deleveled

people dont go to rank 50 to be deleveled, they go to 50 to be 50

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Originally Posted by Perrin_Aybarra

the reward doesn't need to be gears that drops in the dungeon. It could be reputation/currency/novelty items usuable at any level. So this point is also refutable. And to be fair all our points are refutable since we are just assuming and going off hypothetical situations.

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You can change the word gears/mats to whatever you want. IT IS UNREASONABLE TO EXPECT A R50 TO RUN A R30 DUNGEON FOR R50 REWARDS WHEN THEY COULD JUST DESIGN R50 CONTENT FOR R50 PROGRESSION. This seems to me to be a simple concept.

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but you guys keep telling us the reward doesnt matter

you want a challenge

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No, Vedis, that's only what you insist we are saying.
I guess you intentionally try to twist our arguments.
Luckily, noone falls for it.

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Originally Posted by TheVedis

its not better
its the same thing

the difference being a rank 50 can actualy play on the rank 50 job rather then having to be deleveled

people dont go to rank 50 to be deleveled, they go to 50 to be 50

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Wow, I don't want to call you blind but I will. Why are you so stubborn? They are different in if a level 50 want to help a level 30 and not ruin the challenge, an optional cap will let him do that. A slider will not, a slider makes the monsters harder, making it more a challenge for the level 50, still ruining the level 30's experience. You are so aggravating in your blindness and never wanting to conceed on reason.

Being optional still let the level 50 go steamroll content if he so desire which is laughable anyway, and still let them go powerdungeon his level 30 friend if that friend is also not wanting a challenge and just wants easy content.

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Originally Posted by Rinsui

No, Vedis, that's only what you insist we are saying.
I guess you intentionally try to twist our arguments.
Luckily, noone falls for it.

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if challenge doesnt matter
then who cares if i steamroll it?

steamrolling = 0 challenge, and if challenge doesnt matter, let me do it


so obviously im not twisting words, it is the problem you have

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Originally Posted by Perrin_Aybarra

I will honestly say that this is the least of my concerns, and you are free to believe me or not.

I really don't care if you want to steamroll content to obtain stuff for nothing and pretend you are skilled and that you went through content with your shear brillantness of your gameplay.

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1. I could care less about rank 25 content, I doubt I will ever do it
2. your weak attempt of insulting me was weak
3. that same weak attempt of insulting me shows that you do care if high ranks get things faster then you

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I care and replay value and giving everyone the option to go through content the way the dev designed it,

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Obviously you don't or you would not be trying to get the devs to redesign it the way you want everyone else to play it.

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Originally Posted by Perrin_Aybarra

Wow, I don't want to call you blind but I will. Why are you so stubborn? They are different in if a level 50 want to help a level 30 and not ruin the challenge, an optional cap will let him do that. A slider will not, a slider makes the monsters harder, making it more a challenge for the level 50, still ruining the level 30's experience. You are so aggravating in your blindness and never wanting to conceed on reason.

Being optional still let the level 50 go steamroll content if he so desire which is laughable anyway, and still let them go powerdungeon his level 30 friend if that friend is also not wanting a challenge and just wants easy content.

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right back at you

you can still help your friend on your 50


you are helping them, if you are helping them then the challenge to you should not matter

and if you WANt the challenge switch jobs or level a new character

or i dont know...maybe the fact hes 30 and your 50 and you 5 starred it will make it a challenge even fuirther by making it so the group is under leveled