YOSHI FIX THE DANG GIL ISSUE THAT IS KILLING OUR PLAYERS!!!

What do people need to buy so desperately that they need more money? Just curious cause housing isn't available yet and that's the only big purchase thing I can think of.

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Originally Posted by Krystal_Storm

Any amount of money saved at end game means jack squat when the community are penny pinching misers. I need to make a madman's whispering rod and add 2 quick tongue materia 3's. For the price that people ask for the rod i might aswell level alchemist myself (which i did and nearly sent me bankrupt on high tier mats) and then i turn around and they want 60,000k minimum for ONE yes ONE materia when i need 2. Ok 120,000k down the drain, the cost of high end mats and getting alchemist up to 47? Yes i am bankrupt all my savings have gone bye bye.

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Well maybe if you didn't go for a Relic before obtaining Dark Light you wouldn't have said issue, but what do i know...

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Originally Posted by ZakarnRosewood

What do people need to buy so desperately that they need more money? Just curious cause housing isn't available yet and that's the only big purchase thing I can think of.

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10k repairs?

Look, this is apparently a big issue, and a divisive one.

I can sympathize with the people who think others are complaining about their lack of personal wealth. It's annoying. But, that's not what's happening here and the issue goes farther than personal wealth.

Since 1.0 my husband and I have done everything we could to be a self-sufficient duo. Coming into FFXI later than him, a lot of things were hard for me and I needed support. We didn't want that to happen to either of us this go around.

So, he leveled the gathering classes, and I leveled the crafting classes. Battle classes took a secondary position. We left 1.0 for a while, and came back around the time Yoshi was starting to put in new content. We let our crafting and gathering slide for a bit to take some battle classes to 50, husband got 3 to 50, I only took one to 50. We completed the storyline and went back to gathering/crafting.

As this was done with an eye to self-sufficiency, we hoarded everything we could and didn't really sell anything in the markets. We still don't since I'll need all the mats I can to level and craft gear. We had a small sum of gil saved up (or should I say 'gold' and successfully derail the thread?) but not millions, especially after the re denomination. We have maybe a half mil saved up. We're saving it for a house. On all of the quests, I've chosen the Allagan pieces since I can craft my own gear. With the exception of some teleports, chocobo porters and repairs, I've saved everything I could. We still don't have a large amount of cash from the new economy.

Since we're still not primarily focused on battle classes, our repair costs are much less than most others who do repeated dungeon runs. Both of us can see that if the current situation remains as it is, we won't be able to be self-sufficient in the long term.

I repair my own gear, but have run out of grade 5 dark matter and must now start purchasing it.

My husband has to pay for repairs, with gear at 25% this is costing him between 2k and 3k.

This is a perfect illustration of the economy since we don't interact with the market boards. Market boards are shuffling money between players, and taking gil OUT of the economy at each side of the transaction, and so, should not be taken into account when determining if the economy can sustain itself.

My husband does gathering leves. He does anywhere from 8-30 depending on how many he has saved up, taking him from 2-4 hours to complete.

So, on a daily basis, if he does 8 leves per day, that's 2 hours of playing time, and the gil he receives just barely cover the repairs he needs. This is not sustainable. Especially considering that he's still working through the storyline and is not yet up to the high level dungeons.

What this translates to, is that he'd have to do all of his available leves, every day, for the total amount of his available playing time just to cover repairs. He'd be able to do just a handful of dungeon runs every week with this model.

For myself, since I've run out of grade 5 dark matter and have hoarded mats, it's cheaper for me to just craft new gear and convert the old rather than pay for repairs or dark matter. We're doing everything we can, and just about breaking even on the gil.

This is the larger matter at hand that we're understandably upset about. End game, you cannot generate enough gil (outside of the market boards) to cover dungeon running. Once everyone reaches the point where they're losing more gil than they're making, the market boards will dry up as a source of personal income.

For myself, I do have the suspicion that this was done on purpose to drain some gil out of the post 1.0 economy. I hope that is the case and that the current situation is temporary.

For myself, if they bring back player repairs and gatherable/dropped dark matter 5, I think the situation will be less dire. If the Allagan pieces dropped evenly to everyone in a dungeon, that would be even better.

Oh, and I think I should add, I completely understand that not everyone wants to craft or gather. And I don't feel that you should have to do either just to sustain your dungeon running.

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Originally Posted by Kobolt

Most of those sites are blowing smoke anyways. just a way to steal accounts. since you cant transfer characters and slots are limited, they are basically selling snake oil.

Chinese gold farmers speak better English than what you just wrote

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According to most of those snake oil websites they use the in-game mail system to send the gil, or they trade you in person.. how do they steal anything doing that?

Problem with the game currently is that it punishes you for doing any activity in the game and consumes all the gil that is generated. Be it crafting, grinding, questing, dungeon runs, or even gathering. Everything comes at a cost and once everyone does reach that lvl 50 zone for either Disciples of War or Land; prices skyrockets for everyone. Materials cost more as they are harder to obtained, repair costs go up as weapon and armor go up in lvls, as well as repair costs for miners and fishers as they hunt for higher quality items, and the market constantly drains gil away from the economy.

Until Square takes a look into the matter and find a solution, reason to continue to play this game will slowly start to diminish over time as gil slowly starts to disappear. Once that gil does eventually dissappear, players won't be able to do anything else in the game, as without gil, their is no activity to do as everything is broken and becomes nothing more then junk in your inventory.

The game is only 1 week old and the economy is still in its infancy. At this point I'm not sure if the inflow of gil is positive or negative. Unless you work for SE, you cannot say there is more gil being taking out of the economy. I personally think there are more gil flowing into the economy at this time but it may reverse if more people reach lv 50 and stop doing FATE.

lol I will be glad if they fix the issue but also mad it was an issue to begin with 150k gone >..<

PS its pathetic that not a single dev has posted on their thoughts considering its now at 25 pages this thread.

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Originally Posted by Doctor-

PS its pathetic that not a single dev has posted on their thoughts considering its now at 25 pages this thread.

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lmao, you are soooo right. the devs have absolutely NOTHING better to be doing right now. Gotta love armchair devs....

While I sympathize with all the high level players who got broke from the repair cost from doing end-game content, I believe this is the developers' faces right now

http://i.imgur.com/tXNrBLU.jpg

This high repair cost bill is probably put in place for the time being to stop people who rush to end content from doing end game content too much. The'll probably lower the repair cost for high level gears when the end-content-rushers move on to another game and more casual players hit end game.

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Originally Posted by davidbowie

lol some of these people powered their way to level 50 did not bother to do any tradecrafts now upset oh well.

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Originally Posted by Quesse

I know what you're saying, but I think that people, the OP included, are complaining that the gil fountain isn't in their Inn Room. Endgamers are used to raking in fountain gil from endgame activities. FFXIV isn't set up like that and they are QQing about it. FFXIV has tiny gil fountains all over the game to spread the gil out over all players instead of making the fountain endgame heavy.
So now that endgamers have to actually work to make gil instead of having it handed to them from their endgame activities, they are QQing all over the place and inventing this gil issue. Its fairly humorous to watch actually.

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What part of "I did not rush to 50" do you not comprehend? I have only worked on weaver since 2.0 has began.I have worked on the storyline at a steady pace, farmed mats, sold things on the market boards. as soon as something sells, I need repairs, and look, I Just lost the gil I made. Please stop with the horrible, inaccurate accusations that do not describe me at all.

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Originally Posted by Majidah

I didn't grind fates and made 300k on just leveling my arcanist to 50. I think the OP is whining at the wrong tree.

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That's a one time thing. I completed the story as well, and only leveled weaver in 2.0 and it's only 40ish, and I have only the money I had when I completed. If you read my original post, which you obviously didn't, I have not made any more money or any less. I am dancing between 190-200k and have not gone over, despite my continued efforts. If you think playing the AH is helping the economy, you're sorely mistaken. so please, read before you post.

Alot of short term answers but SE wants long term. And I believe our current prices are overinflated on the market board already. And once I hit 50 it became pretty simple to hq the level 45 leve items. I would use leves for gil if it worth more. But craft for craft market board is more.

They stated this game is great for casual play...do casuals do hardcore dungeon crawls? Not really. The 6 leves for gil per day would cover a normal casual players daily repair costs. If you want to do more dungeons wouldnt it make sense that you would need more daily gil? SE leaves that to you as a player to figure out.

And for those who dont know it. .. realize one of the best ways to make gil is fates but not the actual gil from fates. Invest in a full set of gear that gives tier 3 materia. This should be your im to strong for this content gear. A. Cheaper repairs B. Convert to materia. 11 or 12 items for convert at once is a hefty gil day.

I didn't grind fates and made 300k on just leveling my arcanist to 50. I think the OP is whining at the wrong tree.

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Originally Posted by Chiruru53

What part of "I did not rush to 50" do you not comprehend? I have only worked on weaver since 2.0 has began.I have worked on the storyline at a steady pace, farmed mats, sold things on the market boards. as soon as something sells, I need repairs, and look, I Just lost the gil I made. Please stop with the horrible, inaccurate accusations that do not describe me at all.

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I did not make any horrrible inaccurate accusation?? Beyond saying your argument is false - I think I have a right to say that!

See now you're just complaining that even though you farm/craft its not enough for repairs - repairs are too expensive. That is a completely different issue.

Your original issue was that you couldn't personally fate/quest enough gil to cover repairs. My position is that the TOTAL player base of 20000+ characters provides more that enough gil to cover the repair gil sink of the endgame few. You can't prove that it doesn't.

By the way, thanks for NINJA EDITING your post with this new info and using my reply. Very classy.

I guess you missed this so I'll post it again:

There is not a one to one relationship between hardcore grinding endgamers and gil creators!!!! Your entire argument is based on "assuming" (as you say) that there is!

You have to use the total amount of gil created over time from the ENTIRE economy. This would be 7800 people connected at a given time using Yoshi's numbers. Take that number and multiply it by X gil generated per hour by one character doing fates/leves. Then subtract from it the small percentage grinding endgame 24x7. As more people get to endgame level, more will join, and some will leave. This cycle continues - as long as it does (and here is where it is still theory not fact on both sides) there should be gil generated.

You purport that Endgamers should be generating gil for themselves to cover repairs. NO, they shouldn't. The entire economy generates gil. Players A,B,C generate gil, Endgame Player D has to do work to gather/craft/farm and sell to Player A/B/C - that is perfectly valid. It is not valid to expect that Endgame Player D will have gil directly handed to him - it comes form the economy as a WHOLE.

So YES, crafting and gathering are valid ways for endgamers to get gil as they sell to those that generate it. They just don't generate it themselves.

/sigh... this is just too complicated to understand I guess. >.>;

But why not have an intelligent discussion? I'm not attacking anyone! I'm just putting down a valid argument.
Why do you treat it as an attack and then don't even include my argument in your post but just trash everyone who disagrees?

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Originally Posted by Chiruru53

That's a one time thing. I completed the story as well and I have only the money I had when I completed. If you read my original post, which you obviously didn't, I have not made any more money or any less. I am dancing between 190-200k and have not gone over, despite my continued efforts. If you think playing the AH is helping the economy, you're sorely mistaken. so please, read before you post.

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Those 300k are seed money, genius.

Grind Am keep, buy the items for Rosegold earrings. Use that money to pay a crafter to create them. There you got, millions.

God.

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Originally Posted by Majidah

I didn't grind fates and made 300k on just leveling my arcanist to 50. I think the OP is whining at the wrong tree.

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Thank you for proving you do not have reading comprehension. Please move along post oblivious and or trolling remarks somewhere else.

The issue is that at the current rate of accumulation gil just isn't sustainable right now. It's honestly ridiculous. I was doing tradeleves yesterday, and of course I wanted to turn in HQ items for the 200% bonus rewards. When I completed the leves, I realized that the gil reward – including bonus – didn't even cover the cost of the base materials I used to make them. Why in the world am I completing quests at a freaking loss? Yes, okay, I could conceivably gouge item prices on the market board to keep myself afloat financially, but the thing is that players should not have to do that just to make enough money to keep playing the game. It's absurd.

Meanwhile, you're perfectly able to farm XP at a ridiculous rate. The rewards need some serious tweaking.

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Originally Posted by Majidah

Those 300k are seed money, genius.

Grind Am keep, buy the items for Rosegold earrings. Use that money to pay a crafter to create them. There you got, millions.

God.

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You honestly think anyone will pay for overpriced earrings at this point with the economy like this when they can get darklight for free?? really? Don't make me laugh.

That is still playing the AH. No one has the gil right now really to blow on things like that. wanna know how I know? because I have had those earrings for a while and no one has bought them to the point I've given up. so your "solution" is flawed.


God.

I bought a piece of gear on accident from an NPC the other day for like around 6500 gil. I realized I didn't want it and went to sell it back to him to get at least a portion of some money back, and the selling price turned out to be a lousy 23 gil. WTF! There's a huge problem right there.

I actively study economics. I'll be happy to have an economic debate with you anytime but for now let me make these points. You are obviously clueless and have poor reading comprehension. People seem to keep joining both of the topics of making personal money vs gil generation overall. I addressed both of these topics. You are making endless assumptions based on ZERO evidence. You have NO clue how much gil is actually generated. SE DOES. If it really was as bad as you say, the economy of the marketplace and the actions of each player would reflect that. SE obviously can tell how much gil fluctuates through the economy. Until SE comes out with a statement saying that more gil is going out than coming in and they will make adjustments accordingly, quit making baseless assumptions. They just make you and everyone else here look stupid.

If you're so worried about the cost of upkeep, crafting and gathering classes can accommodate this. It's not like NPCs are the only option. If gil was pouring out as quickly as you say, everything on the marketplace would be going down in price dramatically and crafters would be shouting their cheap repair services by now (like white mage teleports in FFXI).

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Originally Posted by busta

If you're so worried about the cost of upkeep, crafting and gathering classes can accommodate this. It's not like NPCs are the only option. If gil was pouring out as quickly as you say, everything on the marketplace would be going down in price dramatically and crafters would be shouting their cheap repair services by now (like white mage teleports in FFXI).

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It's not an issue yet because of the inflation caused by levelling. Once quests dry up the inflation vs. deflation is going to take a massive peak in negative direction. There are hardly any gil fountains in this game, while plenty of ways to get rid of it. Surely as someone who studies economics you understand the implications on the economy when a bunch of money goes *poof* in a rapid rate, without any means of replenishing it.

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Originally Posted by Gilthas

Not sure why people are already complaining about this.

I'm sure that the gilsellers will be making enough gil to cause inflation soon enough.

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The only way RMT could cause inflation is if they level alts over and over, otherwise they are just circulating the existing funds already in the economy, which if done over the market board removes 5 % of money with every trade.

Not sure why people are already complaining about this.

I'm sure that the gilsellers will be making enough gil to cause inflation soon enough.

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Originally Posted by Chiruru53

FATES do not generate gil due to repairs. crafting does not as there's dungeon gear easily obtainable.

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Not to mention the act of crafting actively degrades the durability of your equiped gear at a high rate of speed. It's kind of ludicrous that if I sit down with a needle and thread, everything I'm wearing including said needle degrades until it breaks. As if it weren't expensive to craft already.

Less and less players joining groups better do something before its realm UNborn

I think we should be able to gather Dark matter as well as buy it. We shouldn't be able to sell it though.

Also crafters can't repair other peoples gear. This was removed from the game. I dunno how many people keep missing this but it's been said in like every thread.

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Originally Posted by busta

snip

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other character can't repair your gear, u have to have the crafting class on your own or use the npc repair (that is why crafter aren't spamming to repair at cheaper prices)

also since dark matter can't be gathered anymore u have 2 way to get it: buy it at 350 gil per piece (r4 dark matter that is wht u need at lvl 50) or 5k company seal for 2 at grand company vendor.
The 350 per piece of dark matter makes it convenient only if your equip is at 0% but since u can't change class during duty u have to choose to repair before entering (so spending money on the npc or wasting dark matter) or run part of the duty with equip broken because u can't repair it on the fly
About buyng it with seal it is clear that the time u need farming fate to have enough dark matter will also be enough for your equip to logorate.

Is it just me or are the popular threads in the right panel of the main forum page now tailored to only show "approved" threads?

http://29.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_l2...59fwo1_500.jpg

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Originally Posted by busta

I actively study economics. I'll be happy to have an economic debate with you anytime but for now let me make these points. You are obviously clueless and have poor reading comprehension. People seem to keep joining both of the topics of making personal money vs gil generation overall. I addressed both of these topics. You are making endless assumptions based on ZERO evidence. You have NO clue how much gil is actually generated. SE DOES. If it really was as bad as you say, the economy of the marketplace and the actions of each player would reflect that. SE obviously can tell how much gil fluctuates through the economy. Until SE comes out with a statement saying that more gil is going out than coming in and they will make adjustments accordingly, quit making baseless assumptions. They just make you and everyone else here look stupid.

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This man speaks the truth

Played 1.0, had 12k when I started 2.0, leveled Botany, and now I have 580k and don't ever go below 560k. You guys are doing it wrong.

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Originally Posted by TheWitcher

Less and less players joining groups better do something before its realm UNborn

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thats real clever bra.

but no, if you think u can make a sustainable income without a gathering/crafting profession and make money doing raids/dungeons/instances then you are mistaken. go play wow

Just like real life, it takes 99% of the population to raise up the other 1%. It works in the real world, why change it in game?

So, since S-E is reducing repair costs, what does that say about how S-E feels about the gil situation? Don't think too hard.

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Originally Posted by busta

[snip] Until SE comes out with a statement saying that more gil is going out than coming in and they will make adjustments accordingly, quit making baseless assumptions. They just make you and everyone else here look stupid.

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...like their saying that the cost of repairs at higher levels turned out too be too high and they are therefore making adjustments accordingly?

Honestly, don't know why this debate still rages. Let's just wait and see how things are after the update.

Can't wait to see this repair cost and DM 5 cost.

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Originally Posted by busta

Until SE comes out with a statement saying that more gil is going out than coming in and they will make adjustments accordingly, quit making baseless assumptions. They just make you and everyone else here look stupid.

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Significantly reduce repair fees and the cost of dark matter
While the focus will be placed on high-levels, we will be significantly lowering the overall fees for repair and the cost of dark matter.

Here you have the official statement. You are welcome.

Let's start worrying about gil problems once we've fixed the "i can't play whatsoever' issues.

Actually they changed that because lots of people complained on an individual level, not because more gil is being destroyed than created.