Alexander loot systems sucks :/

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Zitat von Kiteless

Yeah... that's it, I'm giving up on Alex. I've spent 8 hours over the last two days grinding Floor 1 with nothing to show for it. I'm going to stop wasting my time with this crap before it has me hating FF14 entirely.

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I stopped running the floors more than once already.

I also stopped healing floor 4. I'll do shitty SMN dps before subjecting myself to that stress.

To the "just do PF" crowd... Most of us have tried that. Someone always leaves after getting their loot and you have to replace them with folks that will often do it too.

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Zitat von Klamor

That's exactly my point. The current version of Alexander isn't even end game content...

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Well, if your point is that Alex is not endgame content, why suggest that they keep a loot system catered for endgame content ?

I use PF to get my loot for alex. It's worked wonders. I don't see why the loot system has to be modified to make up for crappy PF groups. Might as well just bring back tokens with a weekly limit but for each floor. So long as I can get all my tokens for the week within about 3 hours of clearing I'm happy.

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Zitat von Valkrist

Starting next week, the amount of players that will do endgame will start skipping NM entirely. Many are already done gearing up everything they need. Alexander NM is very quickly going to be not done at all for anyone that doesn't need it for story clear.

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Some of us are obsessive about collecting gear sets...

Just leaving my feedback here. I think alexander was poorly implemented, the loot rules are really bad and as others have pointed out the content is getting stale very fast, soon there will be less people running it so itll be even harder to get these junk tokens. Why isnt it one universal type of token instead of ones for each item? Please leave this loot system in the past and dont use it again for future content.

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Zitat von Zfz

It's a good idea to bookmark the "Forum Top" page and come in through that page each time, because the Community Rep responses are always listed to the right. Unless you're on mobile, then obviously it's different.

Or even better, check the Dev Tracker every now and then.

And here it is. The first listing of Rep response on the "Forum Top" page:

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...85#post3147685

Yes. This thread. When the thread listing icon gets a crown, it means a community rep has responded.

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Oh nice. Thanks for the link, would've never found it buried in the thread.

Thanks for the tip about the crown, too. ^^

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Zitat von Peachy

Just leaving my feedback here. I think alexander was poorly implemented, the loot rules are really bad and as others have pointed out the content is getting stale very fast, soon there will be less people running it so itll be even harder to get these junk tokens. Why isnt it one universal type of token instead of ones for each item? Please leave this loot system in the past and dont use it again for future content.

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I agree, i would've rather seen 1 type of token drop then the 7 different type of tokens we need to farm right now.

• Head > x2 Tarnished Gordian Lens
• Body > x4 Tarnished Gordian Shaft
• Hands > x2 Tarnished Gordian Crank
• Waist > x1 Tarnished Gordian Chain
• Legs > x4 Tarnished Gordian Spring
• Feet > x2 Tarnished Gordian Pedal
• Accessories > 1x Tarnished Gordian Bolt

Considering that you would like to get all of the Gordian items, you would need to get a total of 19 drops in order to all of the Gordian items which are available at this time. So, in order to gear up 1 class, you will need to run at least 19 Floors where you get the drop you need with each individual run. Since you can only get 4 items per week, that would mean that it will take you at least 5 weeks in order to get 1 class geared up with the Gordian gear.

But, you are not the only person in the party and they want to get their item drops as well. The chance that you will get the item you need with the first run of a floor, is pretty slim. Also, if you are playing with a static or a farming group, you would have to run 1 specific floor at least 4 times before everyone gets their drop. So, even if everyone in your static will get the item they need during those 4 runs, you would still need to run 16 Alexander Floors every week.

That is... If you manage to get the item you need within those runs.

I believe that this route is better than having class specific gear drop from each Floor, where people still have to see the item drop that they need after running the same floor a hundred times over (yes, i'm exaggerating). The chance that the items you need will drop are significantly higher, but also the amount of people who can Need on it has increased as well.

From what i understood, the Alexander Savage Loot System sounds more like the type of system that we’re looking for:

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Zitat von Bayohne

[Alexander: Gordias (Savage) Loot Rules]

It will be possible to complete each area once per week, and in addition to obtaining equipment directly from treasure coffers, everyone will receive a token that can be used to exchange for gear.

In the event that players who already completed an area for the week are present, similar to Coil, the number of chests that appear will change based on the amount of these players; however, you will still be able to obtain the token item if you have yet to do so for the week.

Additionally, in regards to the normal mode of Alexander, we've been seeing feedback mentioning that the lotting battles are rough, so we may look into increasing the amount of rewards.

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I just hope that will use 1 specific token which we can trade in for the Savage gear, rather than using the same 7 different types of tokens where we will get 1 of these 7 types of tokens at random after clearing a Floor for the first time that week. We might end up getting 4 Bolts, while we needed 3 Shafts in order to get the new Body Piece.

I mean… Next week, we’ll get access to Alexander Savage as well as access to the Esoteric Tomes. We should also hear more about the new Relics, the 24 man Raid as well how we can get the AF2 for our classes.

SE, i can understand that you do not want us to gear up every class within 2 weeks of the release, but please… Don’t make it too complicated/frustrating to gear up 1 class, let alone multiple.

I think the system is fine. The change I would like to see is make all items available on every floor.

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Zitat von Nadirah

I stopped running the floors more than once already.

I also stopped healing floor 4. I'll do shitty SMN dps before subjecting myself to that stress.

To the "just do PF" crowd... Most of us have tried that. Someone always leaves after getting their loot and you have to replace them with folks that will often do it too.

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How is healing A4 stressful? I am on my SCH and our static whm usually goes astro for it just for the fun. If your healers are good and your tanks, you basically can skip every single mechanic and just brute force it. cept adds ofc.

Everyone is going to cry and moan about something. I will admit the drop system from the coils was pretty frustrating. I ran t10 15 times before i saw my earrings drop once. At least I can pick and choose what I wanna go for. If you take 10 seconds to think ahead, you can even develop a plan to get all the gear you need in a good an optimal amount of time! Amazing!

The only difference here is how stupidly boring these runs are. I know savage is coming up and will revamp things but my god, I was tired of every floor after 2 runs. It took a while to get that way with the coils. Perhaps it's because it's so race roll easy, maybe it's because I don't think the setting is as awesome as BCoB. That's a whole separate thread though. Just be thankful getting loot drops you need can be made 10x easier with a static or FC farm group that has an hour to spend on each floor.
/queue people crying about not having an hour in their busy retail/restaurant schedules etc.

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Zitat von Ondori

How is healing A4 stressful? I am on my SCH and our static whm usually goes astro for it just for the fun. If your healers are good and your tanks, you basically can skip every single mechanic and just brute force it. cept adds ofc.

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You just said it. "Static".

You can't have pugs(even my FC run has a few) and ignore the healer debuff, adds and orbs.

I get dps that eat orbs then get one shot by lazers. I get tanks that forget their job includes orbs. I get dps that panic when adds come out and want to group them for aoe. I get healers that soon as the debuff goes out proceeds to pretend there isn't another healer on the other side of the room and runs it through all the dps to reach a melee on the other side.

And I play both SCH and AST.

Please do not change the loot system for alexander. Do not pander to the lowest common denominator that just happens to be the ones that come here to complain and whine because it's not handed directly to them on a silver platter for no effort or time spent. The rest of us are fine and happy with the current system. We'd much rather be able to challenge the turns as many times as needed and compete over 3 different drop pieces rather than the 15+ or so that would drop before.

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Zitat von dark494

Please do not change the loot system for alexander. Do not pander to the lowest common denominator that just happens to be the ones that come here to complain and whine because it's not handed directly to them on a silver platter for no effort or time spent. The rest of us are fine and happy with the current system. We'd much rather be able to challenge the turns as many times as needed and compete over 3 different drop pieces rather than the 15+ or so that would drop before.

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Pretty much this.

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Zitat von AireTamStorm

The only difference here is how stupidly boring these runs are. I know savage is coming up and will revamp things but my god, I was tired of every floor after 2 runs. It took a while to get that way with the coils.

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For me its down to the story, I was routing to progress in coil to see the story unfold, and getting the next cutscene was the cake, loot was secondary on the first kill, not an incentiive.

Alex stoory is, in comparison, lackluster. Goblins? Too hard to take them serious, IMO Goblin story would have been better as a Hildibrand questline. Alex story should be on par with Coil.

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Zitat von Reynhart

Well, if your point is that Alex is not endgame content, why suggest that they keep a loot system catered for endgame content ?

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My point was not to keep a loot system that you say is "catered for endgame content." My point was that the loot system is what it is. The OP, IMO, is too casual for content to be catered to suit their needs (or more accurately, wants). However, the side point is that the story-mode Alexander is not actual end-game content, but is actually catered to suit people like the OP, which is obviously contradictory to the point of OP being too casual to be catered to. It's a purely rhetorical point that does nothing but belay just how much, or really how little, some people actually respect the game for what it is. The sheer fact that players demanded a new loot system, got it, and then turned around and bitched about it mere hours after people are getting all four floors cleared via the Duty Finder simply expresses how little regard they actually have for the developers or any other player other than themselves.

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Zitat von WinterLuna

Pretty much this.

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Well apparently the JP side is complaining about it too. BisEX and RavEX is what it should of been honestly but that's my opinion

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Zitat von dark494

Please do not change the loot system for alexander. Do not pander to the lowest common denominator that just happens to be the ones that come here to complain and whine because it's not handed directly to them on a silver platter for no effort or time spent. The rest of us are fine and happy with the current system. We'd much rather be able to challenge the turns as many times as needed and compete over 3 different drop pieces rather than the 15+ or so that would drop before.

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The current system works, but that doesn't mean it can't be improved. A4 & A3 loot aren't handled well imo. They could stand to make 1 spring (A3) and 1 shaft (A4) a guaranteed drop since you need four of them and they only drop on 1 floor (well, spring drops on A4, but it has to compete with the shaft). They could also stand to add another chest per floor (or at least for A3 & A4 since these have the leg/chest parts).

I don't think either of these ideas is "pandering to the lowest common denominator".

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Zitat von SaitoHajime

Well apparently the JP side is complaining about it too. BisEX and RavEX is what it should of been honestly but that's my opinion

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http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...81%84%E3%81%A6

Here is their thread, pretty much got the same reply as us. Please wait.

LOL this system is far better than the old one but anyhow... hold your horses cuz they will add more loot probably next Tuesday to make things easier as usual as they said in the last Live Letter.

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Zitat von dark494

Please do not change the loot system for alexander. Do not pander to the lowest common denominator that just happens to be the ones that come here to complain and whine because it's not handed directly to them on a silver platter for no effort or time spent.

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Please do not listen to people who think "RNG" equals "effort or time"...

But RNG does equal to time and effort! It just isn't uniformly distributed time and effort. ;-)

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Zitat von Ronyx

LOL this system is far better than the old one but anyhow... hold your horses cuz they will add more loot probably next Tuesday to make things easier as usual as they said in the last Live Letter.

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So, how do you like the new savagemode alexander loot system then? its exactly same what we had...

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Zitat von Aldora

From what i understood, the Alexander Savage Loot System sounds more like the type of system that we’re looking for:

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in addition to obtaining equipment directly from treasure coffers, everyone will receive a token that can be used to exchange for gear.

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(..)

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I cant find that in the patchnotes, we will get the token from chest and thats a very bad idea!
SE pulled again the LOCKOUT trick... are they just stupid?

That "lockout trick" is a hell of a lot better imo, than being forced to run repeatedly to offset shit RNG.

I *prefer* the Alex savage system personally.

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Zitat von Nadirah

That "lockout trick" is a hell of a lot better imo, than being forced to run repeatedly to offset shit RNG.
I *prefer* the Alex savage system personally.

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Did you really do Coil? I doubt so, because then you should know it is RNG to have YOUR class drop, arguing with RNG to defend lockout is a bad idea! You are true if you argue with the (new) tokens but that we havnt had in Coil and so i can not follow you...

I'm thinking they just don't want the Law gear completely displaced by AlexN gear. Otherwise AlexN actually would be a great place (seeing it's the main "story progression" at level cap) to just award everyone an AlexN token per boss, and you can buy whatever parts with the designated number of the same AlexN token. Then put in special furniture materials, pets and mounts as random drops.

But if they do that, then Law gear will be completely displaced. So AlexN end up getting the RNG treatment.

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Zitat von Zfz

I'm thinking they just don't want the Law gear completely displaced by AlexN gear. Otherwise AlexN actually would be a great place (seeing it's the main "story progression" at level cap) to just award everyone an AlexN token per boss, and you can buy whatever parts with the designated number of the same AlexN token. Then put in special furniture materials, pets and mounts as random drops.

But if they do that, then Law gear will be completely displaced. So AlexN end up getting the RNG treatment.

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Try to buy Fenrir and Cloud with MGP, just tell me how you can rush that?
Its an old system and proven by many games, you gain income, spending that income into different paths of your choise is how players have freedome - best known example is EXP
You cant buy everything instant - win - win...

And thats how a token system normally works

You misunderstand me. I actually don't know why you replied to my post and how rushing anything has anything to do with my post. Perhaps you read something that I never intended. Or perhaps you melded my post together into the other complaints in the thread and assume I'm also complaining about not getting gear quickly. In that case, you indeed misunderstand me.

In any case, the biggest complaint about AlexN is the multiple layers of RNG, and that kind of setup gets complained about in every game. Unless the drops are static (i.e. A1N always drops Chain*1+Bolt*1, A2N always drops Lens*1+Bolt*1 etc.), a token system like AlexN isn't much better than a direct-drop system (Coils). AlexN is just one notch easier because you can pick and choose what you roll for.

yes i just mix up posting :)
Sorry... i am in a bit of enrage mode, gonna go cooldown - its hot outside too, not helping, taking a cold shower now :)

The problem is SE promising on events and interviews just to release the same old shit a little bit tweaked (we dont know how many tokens you will need...)

After Tanaka in 1.0, Yoshi-P modified primals and released a good system with garuda, why they changed back to tanaka system with 2.0 and ongoing they have never said.

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Zitat von Zfz

In any case, the biggest complaint about AlexN is the multiple layers of RNG, and that kind of setup gets complained about in every game. Unless the drops are static (i.e. A1N always drops Chain*1+Bolt*1, A2N always drops Lens*1+Bolt*1 etc.), a token system like AlexN isn't much better than a direct-drop system (Coils). AlexN is just one notch easier because you can pick and choose what you roll for.

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This exactly. I don't mind fighting for rolls against 7 other people but what gets me is sometimes you don't get to roll at all because the token that you want won't even drop.

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Zitat von Yukiko

I cant find that in the patchnotes, we will get the token from chest and thats a very bad idea!
SE pulled again the LOCKOUT trick... are they just stupid?

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They mentioned that within the previous Letter of the Producer LIVE (which i quoted with my previous post), but it has it’s also been confirmed within the “Alexander: Gordias (Savage) Preview” (which has been posted on Lodestone):

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Zitat von Alexander: Gordias (Savage) Preview!

- Rewards
Treasure coffers that appear upon completing areas in Alexander: Gordias (Savage) will yield gear. In addition, players will receive a page of the Gordian Manifesto from each area, which can be exchanged for gear of your choosing.
* Players will only receive one page of the Gordian Manifesto per area each week upon completing said area for the first time.

If your party contains players replaying an area prior to the weekly reset, the number of treasure coffers appearing upon completion will decrease.*
Furthermore, players will be ineligible for rewards from treasure coffers as well as pages of the Gordian Manifesto when replaying an area prior to the weekly reset.

* If there are one to four players in your party replaying a turn, only a single treasure coffer will appear.
If there are five to seven players in your party replaying a turn, no treasure coffers will appear.
Players in the party who have yet to complete a given area in Alexander: Gordias (Savage) prior to the weekly reset will receive a page of the Gordian Manifesto.

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so savage will have RAX and BiSEX loot system.
very nice.

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Zitat von Yukiko

So, how do you like the new savagemode alexander loot system then? its exactly same what we had...


I cant find that in the patchnotes, we will get the token from chest and thats a very bad idea!
SE pulled again the LOCKOUT trick... are they just stupid?

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In savage gears will drops and tokens too. Patches? None so far but they will on Monday night. We are just saying what SE told in the last live letter. Alex normal will get more drops too when Savage comes.

look in news: patchnotes are already out... (preview notes)
Checked in japan text - it may be a translating issue, still it says it comes from a chest...
true only once each floor and each week, but if you go in with 4 who already beaten it -> no chests...

There are many possibilities how they implement it, its not what i think they will do, its just confusing what they have given us as news!

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Zitat von Yukiko

After Tanaka in 1.0, Yoshi-P modified primals and released a good system with garuda, why they changed back to tanaka system with 2.0 and ongoing they have never said.

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There was no primal fights during Tanakas time. Or do you mean the Leve NMs with their tokens?

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Zitat von Yukiko

look in news: patchnotes are already out... (preview notes)
Checked in japan text - it may be a translating issue, still it says it comes from a chest...
true only once each floor and each week, but if you go in with 4 who already beaten it -> no chests...

There are many possibilities how they implement it, its not what i think they will do, its just confusing what they have given us as news!

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- Players in the party who have yet to complete a given area in Alexander: Gordias (Savage) prior to the weekly reset will receive a page of the Gordian Manifesto.

it means u will get a token even if theres no chest.

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Zitat von Felis

There was no primal fights during Tanakas time. Or do you mean the Leve NMs with their tokens?

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Ifrit & Garuda were in 1.x

they also dropped weapons & tokens to trade for weapons, pretty much the same as bis & rav today.

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Zitat von Deviant1

Ifrit & Garuda were in 1.x

they also dropped weapons & tokens to trade for weapons, pretty much the same as bis & rav today.

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SE switched Tanaka with Yoshide during november 2010. Ifrit, the first primal fight, came out 1 year after. Time enough for Yoshida to change what was already finished. Nobody outside of the dev team know how Tanakas plan for the primal fights was. We players only saw Yoshidas primal fights.

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Zitat von hagare

so savage will have RAX and BiSEX loot system.
very nice.

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Except you can't farm it :p Alex Savage will have what many of us already asked for. We just wanted to feel rewarded if we're unlucky. In my static, on 2nd coil we had our monk who never dropped gloves from T8 (when he needed accuracy) until lockout was removed. On FCoB, I never saw healing pants from T11, healing choker from T12 and ring only dropped once. Feels really bad being excluded simply by RNG, no matter how well you're capable of completing a suposedly challenge, for months. So yes, savage loot system is the best we could get. We won't have full set in one month, but we at least know we're getting rewarded, slowly.

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Zitat von Khemorex

- Players in the party who have yet to complete a given area in Alexander: Gordias (Savage) prior to the weekly reset will receive a page of the Gordian Manifesto.

it means u will get a token even if theres no chest.

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You should check other languages, not the first time SE does have translation issues!

Edit: Ifrit was a finished fight back then, yoshida changed the lootsystem based on players suggestion. It may be true, that ifrit wasnt released when tanaka was still there but it was already programmed.
Somehow nostalgic to have every year same discussion as we had in 1.x

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Zitat von Yukiko

Edit: Ifrit was a finished fight back then, yoshida changed the lootsystem based on players suggestion. It may be true, that ifrit wasnt released when tanaka was still there but it was already programmed.
Somehow nostalgic to have every year same discussion as we had in 1.x

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Besides, the token system for Ifrit was garbage, since the tokens themselves had a really low drop rate :p