Hildibrand for relic? Really?

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Originally Posted by MikkoAkure

No, I provided an example of something not serious happening in an otherwise grim storyline. If you can say "I'm going to ignore that and move on" to the DRK Moogles then I'm not sure why small moments in Endwalker are hard to swallow either.

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Because they aren’t small. The entire moon arc outside of the 10-15 minutes with zodiark is lighthearted loporrit fluff. Same with the second labyrinthos segment.

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Originally Posted by AnnRam

In SHB they demanded runs of CT Raids , totally out of their minds.

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Uh, which step demanded that?
In CT you can get Loathsome Memories, which you can get much more easily in CLL or Bozja CEs, and I think a 1 time step that you could also just grind fates for in a much shorter time (which is what I did).
Only AR it required were the Ivalice ones.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

Because they aren’t small. The entire moon arc outside of the 10-15 minutes with zodiark is lighthearted loporrit fluff. Same with the second labyrinthos segment.

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Yeah? I still think the Lopporits are dumb but having mascots randomly thrown into the middle of the MSQ isn't something new and I while I groaned through it and sigh whenever I have to go to that part of the Moon, I don't stew on it and constantly bring it up and let it ruin my experience of the game as a whole.

If you focus on what makes you upset, you're always going to be upset.

Some people are going to enjoy the Hildibrand quests with the relics, others are going to groan but stomach through it anyway, and I guess others are going to ignore it on principle because they don't want silly in their FF game and either miss out on relic or miss out on relic AND complain about it in the forums. It's just a questline. It's also new so it's not like it's retconning or replacing anything.

We still don't know what it will involve or what the relics will look like either. If the weapons are gaudy or the quests or the process absolutely suck then by all means complain and I will too. But all we know right now is that Hildibrand is tied to relic and nothing else so all that can be accomplished is virtue signaling on either side whether or not you like Hildibrand.

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

4. 3 in ARR, 1 in SB.




You both must be new here.

ARR forces Crystal Tower 24 mans down your throat to continue MSQ..

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Im well aware of that, hence why one my alts is locked on 5.3 msq due not wanting to do CT on it.

I'm unironically contemplating paying someone to pilot my character through Hildibrand quests the way you buy ultimate clears...

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Originally Posted by Azuri

I'm unironically contemplating paying someone to pilot my character through Hildibrand quests the way you buy ultimate clears...

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Lol .... seriously they're not that bad. I won't tell you how many i did to catch up my alts but they aren't too bad if you skip. I'd recommend doing the 50 quest line first get the dance/emote/couple minions and an outfit and then to the 60 and 70 level ones. Personally I did them to be able to do the new Hildi hoping we'll get some cool new rewards has no clue they'd be a requirement for relic.

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Originally Posted by MikkoAkure

Yeah? I still think the Lopporits are dumb but having mascots randomly thrown into the middle of the MSQ isn't something new and I while I groaned through it and sigh whenever I have to go to that part of the Moon, I don't stew on it and constantly bring it up and let it ruin my experience of the game as a whole.

If you focus on what makes you upset, you're always going to be upset.

Some people are going to enjoy the Hildibrand quests with the relics, others are going to groan but stomach through it anyway, and I guess others are going to ignore it on principle because they don't want silly in their FF game and either miss out on relic or miss out on relic AND complain about it in the forums. It's just a questline. It's also new so it's not like it's retconning or replacing anything.

We still don't know what it will involve or what the relics will look like either. If the weapons are gaudy or the quests or the process absolutely suck then by all means complain and I will too. But all we know right now is that Hildibrand is tied to relic and nothing else so all that can be accomplished is virtue signaling on either side whether or not you like Hildibrand.

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Having them be thrown into major story aspects and revolve around major story aspects is. How about the flying pigs that cure one of the most dangerous and serious plot points since the beginning of the game? This whole trend of major fluff and haha funny became a major problem starting in ShB and has since gotten worse. It’s not even comparable to say, HW where yes you had the odd moment with the moogles or with estinien and alphinaud sibling rivalry antics, but it didn’t take away from the story nor did it feel THAT out of place. Whereas with the loporrits you’re literally at the end of the world and forced to play dress up and take them on fruit sampling tours while people are being massacred. So i can’t focus on the story i guess? They’re a major part of it after all.


We’re going from having 4 relic zones and an entire story that gave us depth and backstory on various major plot points in the game to….Hildibrand whose storyline is typically motioned as Non-canon and adding nothing substantial to the actual story. We’re missing out on the chance to get actual worldbuilding and serious plot points discussed and instead getting a storyline revolving around characters who are known for their wild and haha funny antics…..

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Originally Posted by Gemina

Because it's not about knowing the players. It's about knowing the content. It's niche, optional content so it is just common sense to know that not only will the content not appeal to everyone, it will indeed appeal to very specific players. That's a big problem. Imagine requiring players to do tribe quests, squadrons, or custom deliveries in order to advance the relic. Same thing on all accounts.

Relic grinds making players go into PvE content is fine. Incentivizing relic grinders to run older content helps new players. Forcing a player to do Hildabrand does this, how?


It's not an opinion that more players are interested in the relic than Hildabrand. It's also not an opinion that a lot of players don't want to be required to do a long questline on top of another long questline to obtain said relic. Those are facts whether you choose to see them as such or not. And if you need more convincing, you only need to look at the fact that the devs chose to gate the relic behind the Hildabrand questline.

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I'm not at all disagreeing that some people might not want to go through the Hildebrand quests. However, once again you're stating that "a lot" of players don't want to do that.

Well, likely 'a lot" of players might not have wanted to unlock Ivalice for the Resistance weapon. or do POTD, or do you remember the second one-time step- newer player might have had to unlock Alexander, Omega and Eden to do that. in this case, we could actual go back and check , since we can see how many people completed them and get their feedback.

You're objecting to optional content that's required to do optional content, where in the past optional content was also required to do this optional content? You're also objecting to some unknown quantity of people objecting to a grind, upon what is typically grindy content I might add, when we have almost no facts to go on other than 1 LL which consists of a few slides and not much else. Can you now understand why I might not agree with you here, and would rather wait until we get more facts?

what will happen though is people skipping through hildi without even trxing if they like it just to get to the relic

i like connected questlines though. allows a more connected world and story

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

Having them be thrown into major story aspects and revolve around major story aspects is. How about the flying pigs that cure one of the most dangerous and serious plot points since the beginning of the game? This whole trend of major fluff and haha funny became a major problem starting in ShB and has since gotten worse. It’s not even comparable to say, HW where yes you had the odd moment with the moogles or with estinien and alphinaud sibling rivalry antics, but it didn’t take away from the story nor did it feel THAT out of place. Whereas with the loporrits you’re literally at the end of the world and forced to play dress up and take them on fruit sampling tours while people are being massacred. So i can’t focus on the story i guess? They’re a major part of it after all.


We’re going from having 4 relic zones and an entire story that gave us depth and backstory on various major plot points in the game to….Hildibrand whose storyline is typically motioned as Non-canon and adding nothing substantial to the actual story. We’re missing out on the chance to get actual worldbuilding and serious plot points discussed and instead getting a storyline revolving around characters who are known for their wild and haha funny antics…..

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We're on a long journey to find the secrets behind the Dragonsong War, traveling with people from both sides who hold different ideologies, and we make our way to the world's highest peak to meet Hraesvelgr, only to find a tribe of Moogles that we had no prior context for and we need to do favors for them in order to proceed and it can't be skipped.

I don't know if you were around back when HW was new, but people complained about the Moogles back then and then over time they got over it. The complaining obviously had no impact at all on the writing for future expansions.

This isn't new, and this wasn't invented in ShB. I think people fall back on Y'shtola's one random silly line, or hamburgers, or Lopporits, or flying pigs just because it's recent and more present in their head right now.


I would like some transparency from them to see if there's a specific reason we wouldn't expect relic zones like the 2 previous expansions, but I think cost and overall negative reception to zones like the original Diadem, Eureka, and Bozja over the years can be to blame. I can't remember the Matsuno tweets specific words, but it seemed that Bozja was abruptly cut off from an order from above. The team who does the stuff like that seems to be working things like criterion dungeons and the new PotD that was teased anyhow and that could also be reasons for it.

Eureka and Bozja were their own things that relic got tied to. You didn't NEED to do relic to do those. People back in the day even complained about relic being tied to Eureka. Relic originally was just it's own separate thing that had no real storyline except for a grind and "haha, drunk highlander is in debt again and pretends to not be in love with his ex". Now relic is tied to something else and the teams who worked on the other stuff are now doing other things. We could end up getting something new that is similar to those that isn't tied to relic. Until we know more, we wait and see.

Queueing into any of the Hildy trials on Materia DC is a huge pain in the neck due to how few people have them unlocked. Requiring them for relics = more people will unlock them = more people will get them in Trial Roulette. This is a win in my book.

(Also, the ARR Hildy quests may have been tedious and annoying, but the HW and ShB ones were Solidly Okay.)

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Originally Posted by Kaurhz

Absurdly long? Just skip the scenes, it takes like 2-4 hours which is probably not so different from their requirement of Ivalician raids for the Bozjan relics. Ivalice doesn't act as any form of skill-check LOL. Those raids are regularly a 30-40 minute slogfest of wiping and throwing corpses at the bosses until they die.

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Yea my friend who skips all cutscenes finished it very quickly.

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Originally Posted by MikkoAkure

We're on a long journey to find the secrets behind the Dragonsong War, traveling with people from both sides who hold different ideologies, and we make our way to the world's highest peak to meet Hraesvelgr, only to find a tribe of Moogles that we had no prior context for and we need to do favors for them in order to proceed and it can't be skipped.

I don't know if you were around back when HW was new, but people complained about the Moogles back then and then over time they got over it. The complaining obviously had no impact at all on the writing for future expansions.

This isn't new, and this wasn't invented in ShB. I think people fall back on Y'shtola's one random silly line, or hamburgers, or Lopporits, or flying pigs just because it's recent and more present in their head right now.


I would like some transparency from them to see if there's a specific reason we wouldn't expect relic zones like the 2 previous expansions, but I think cost and overall negative reception to zones like the original Diadem, Eureka, and Bozja over the years can be to blame. I can't remember the Matsuno tweets specific words, but it seemed that Bozja was abruptly cut off from an order from above. The team who does the stuff like that seems to be working things like criterion dungeons and the new PotD that was teased anyhow and that could also be reasons for it.

Eureka and Bozja were their own things that relic got tied to. You didn't NEED to do relic to do those. People back in the day even complained about relic being tied to Eureka. Relic originally was just it's own separate thing that had no real storyline except for a grind and "haha, drunk highlander is in debt again and pretends to not be in love with his ex". Now relic is tied to something else and the teams who worked on the other stuff are now doing other things. We could end up getting something new that is similar to those that isn't tied to relic. Until we know more, we wait and see.

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It’s less about them being recent and moreso it being constant. Again, you’re falling back on a single thing, moogles, who had a single arc. Compare that to ShB where we have things like flying pigs being instrumental to the storyline and then fast forward to EW where we have 2 entire arcs dedicated to loporrits in an expansion about the world ending, not just a single country being in turmoil BUT THE ENTIRE WORLD, and it’s the expansion filled with the most fluff and least amount of consequences overall…. and then it’s the same the next patch where we have yshtola acting like a 5 yr old.

You see the humor is not only is his clothes ripped, but he's upside down in the ground. I didn't see you laugh the 47th time this happened during the hildibrand quest so we included it at least 71 more times in 6.2

Thanks for playing

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Originally Posted by Zumi

Yea my friend who skips all cutscenes finished it very quickly.

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Honestly, the length of the quest is the weirdest complaint/angle to take given the context of the matter is relics, where grinding, and time-wasting endeavors form an integral part of the experience.

I could understand if the issue was the light-hearted, 'comedic' nature of Hildibrand, but man the length of the quests is just the worst possible angle I think, especially when you can skip them. At least that is the issue people are bringing up now at least, which is a positive -- But we'll have to see what actually substance is behind it rather than being too presumptuous about it.

Sorry I am not up to date on what is going on...we getting more Hildabrand content?

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Originally Posted by Ascended_Demon

I know we have no idea what the weapons will look like but honestly? The vibes do not mesh. I would like majestic, visually impressive relics not something made out of pyrite.

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the quests will involve gerold who is a low key comic relief character anyways and you can basically bet your ass that we will also get to see godbert lend a hand, and that dood for all his antics is pretty much the most respected gold smith in the realm and does surprisingly pretty work if he puts his mind to it so i wouldn't worry to much about the weapons ending up gaudy, maybe an early step as a kinda joke but surely not the end result.

I love hildibrand but honestly, i don't understand why locking relic through it. You could've just made a throwback to hildibrand in the relic story but I don't see much point on having them together.

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Originally Posted by AmpelioB

I love hildibrand but honestly, i don't understand why locking relic through it. You could've just made a throwback to hildibrand in the relic story but I don't see much point on having them together.

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that one is kinda easy to solve i would say, its cutting development costs aswell as time. they promised more hildibrand, by doing it like this they can offer a lot more hildibrand for people that like it without doing really any extra work as getting a relic weapon was basically a given.

at the end of the day its a win for those that like hildibrand and a loss for those that don't, but people need to at least admit that some "super serious" relic quest also isn't everyones cup of tea.

Are you also mad about the tea kettles, OP?

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Originally Posted by Akiudo

that one is kinda easy to solve i would say, its cutting development costs aswell as time. they promised more hildibrand, by doing it like this they can offer a lot more hildibrand for people that like it without doing really any extra work as getting a relic weapon was basically a given.

at the end of the day its a win for those that like hildibrand and a loss for those that don't, but people need to at least admit that some "super serious" relic quest also isn't everyones cup of tea.

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In the end of the day people would be mad and disappointed regardless, they can't do anything here that appeals to everyone.
SHB had a much more serious and depressing storyline, people who prefered that already got it last time, so now this time we get something different that will appeal to others who like something different.

Also we haven't even experienced it yet...
Ppl could at least give it a chance first.

I also think it was heavily implied that we'll have to do the Void Ark for other content if we haven't already too, having to do previous content to unlock new content is an actual thing that has been happening in FFXIV for a very long time now.

I don't know about you, but I'd rather play Hildebrand than have another Eureka/bozja in this game

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Originally Posted by Kolsykol

In the end of the day people would be mad and disappointed regardless, they can't do anything here that appeals to everyone.
SHB had a much more serious and depressing storyline, people who prefered that already got it last time, so now this time we get something different that will appeal to others who like something different.

Also we haven't even experienced it yet...
Ppl could at least give it a chance first.

I also think it was heavily implied that we'll have to do the Void Ark for other content if we haven't already too, having to do previous content to unlock new content is an actual thing that has been happening in FFXIV for a very long time now.

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ShB had more fluff and light hearted moments than any expansion before it, and also had the least amount of consequences compared to any expansion before it. Players have had the chance to have something different especially in msq where they even let you pick who you want to have a date session with. Personally my main problem with this is that instead of using the relic quests to flesh out the world, or other mentioned zones and give us a deep story like Bozja had that was unfortunately cut short, we’re instead getting a story that revolves around a character whose entire storylines are considered non-canon and “comedic.” So i think it’s fairly safe to say that their won’t be any meaningful fleshing out like past relic quests have had and considering it looks like it’s all quest related it seems like it’s just a typical hildibrand questline with relic quests sprinkled in.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

ShB had more fluff and light hearted moments than any expansion before it, and also had the least amount of consequences compared to any expansion before it. Players have had the chance to have something different especially in msq where they even let you pick who you want to have a date session with. Personally my main problem with this is that instead of using the relic quests to flesh out the world, or other mentioned zones and give us a deep story like Bozja had that was unfortunately cut short, we’re instead getting a story that revolves around a character whose entire storylines are considered non-canon and “comedic.” So i think it’s fairly safe to say that their won’t be any meaningful fleshing out like past relic quests have had and considering it looks like it’s all quest related it seems like it’s just a typical hildibrand questline with relic quests sprinkled in.

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They're talking about the relic questline specifically, not the entire expansion. Bozja was most definitely, definitely, definitely not "more fluff and light hearted" than anything before it. It was the complete opposite of that. And I wouldn't even call that true of ShB in general...

I think the person you responded to said it perfectly. Last xpac we got the ultra-serious, deep relic questline. This time around we get something much more lighthearted. Everyone gets what they "like" most at some point.

I doubt relic weapons are going to be comedy weapons.

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Originally Posted by Striker44

They're talking about the relic questline specifically, not the entire expansion. Bozja was most definitely, definitely, definitely not "more fluff and light hearted" than anything before it. It was the complete opposite of that. And I wouldn't even call that true of ShB in general...

I think the person you responded to said it perfectly. Last xpac we got the ultra-serious, deep relic questline. This time around we get something much more lighthearted. Everyone gets what they "like" most at some point.

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Except said serious questline got cut short. So its hardly comparable or fair in the grand scheme of things. If you want fluff, thats what you have the beast tribe quests, msq, tataru quest, and hildibrand questlines for. Not the relic questlines.

I can't even imagine how a person can exist who is totally fine with relic grinds like Eureka but thinks having to do Hildebrand quests is too much work.

This thread has to be some sort of troll/parody, right? You're all just goofing around and pretending to have your jimmies rustled about this for fun aren't you?

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Originally Posted by Fawkes

I can't even imagine how a person can exist who is totally fine with relic grinds like Eureka but thinks having to do Hildebrand quests is too much work.

This thread has to be some sort of troll/parody, right? You're all just goofing around and pretending to have your jimmies rustled about this for fun aren't you?

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I don't have an issue with it personally, but I do have some concerns about the relic story along with the potential designs of the relics themselves. Hopefully this is just their way of getting people to do the Hildebrand content by featuring a few of the characters during the relic grind and very little else.

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Originally Posted by Fawkes

I can't even imagine how a person can exist who is totally fine with relic grinds like Eureka but thinks having to do Hildebrand quests is too much work.

This thread has to be some sort of troll/parody, right? You're all just goofing around and pretending to have your jimmies rustled about this for fun aren't you?

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Some of us were hoping to have a storyline associated with the relic that took itself seriously at the bare minimum, if it added significantly to the world's lore (Corvos, etc) then that would have been fantastic. We went from Matsuno's writing to Hildibrand. Political intrigue, emotionally charged storytelling. To memes. And yeah, I'd much rather do some of the more engaging raids in this game to unlock my relic than Hildibrand's series of fates and pushover trials.

Instead of encouraging the playerbase to improve and do better, they pivot away from some any content that might suggest the notion in favor of haha borgor funny and the gazeebo nonsense. Bonus points if Tweetingway shows up in this relic questline. The crowd who is so enamoured by the likes of Hildibrand should not be catered to on this scale, with the MSQ ridden with fluff and more memes than substance at times and now the relic is also subjected to this.

This is a Final Fantasy game at the end of the day, that means having a good balance of what is haha funny and what is actually involved storytelling. Seems like if I want the latter I have to wait until Summer 2023 when FFXVI comes out.

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Originally Posted by Fawkes

I can't even imagine how a person can exist who is totally fine with relic grinds like Eureka but thinks having to do Hildebrand quests is too much work.

This thread has to be some sort of troll/parody, right? You're all just goofing around and pretending to have your jimmies rustled about this for fun aren't you?

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Nobody complained about "too much work". People complained about having to do something very unfun, and the relics potentially looking like an absolute joke.

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Originally Posted by Tlamila

Nobody complained about "too much work". People complained about having to do something very unfun, and the relics potentially looking like an absolute joke.

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It's literally in the OP, my guy.

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Originally Posted by aveyond-dreams

Not sure whether they were being actually serious about this or not, but either way it's bad form to require such an absurdly long questline to be completed before we can do this expansion’s relic. I don’t even think Ivalice is as time consuming, and at least acts as a skill check on the playerbase.

Just why?

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I hate hildi. It's not funny, it's stupid. And I'm also not a fan of Tataru's requirements either.

Cuts out two things I was looking forward to.

3 expansions worth of questlines is longer than 1 expansion's alliance raid series.

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Originally Posted by aveyond-dreams

3 expansions worth of questlines is longer than 1 expansion's alliance raid series.

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1 expansions worth of wipefests I've been avoiding like the plague do as mot to put them in my roulettes, you mean.

It's why I never unlocked bozja.

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Originally Posted by Shenlao

I'm very confused how many people bring this argument, mostly because doing Hildi is just the prerequisite. I'm quite confident that we'll get our usual grindy relic steps after it as the expansion progresses.

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I don't know, why would they be called Manderville weapons, if Hildebrand was only a requirement? It's true that we don't know the specifics yet, but the name + the progrssion being quest-based seems to point out that the progression/grind will be just more Hildiverse shenanigans.

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Originally Posted by Imora

1 expansions worth of wipefests I've been avoiding like the plague do as mot to put them in my roulettes, you mean.

It's why I never unlocked bozja.

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It's a safe bet that the relic grind for Endwalker will send you into those very same raids, though. There's no new Eureka or Bozja coming, so the grind will be locked behind FATE's, roulettes and specific raids that need players to queue for them. Assuming the pattern follows which is likely.

This is a pre-requisite quest grind to even get to the relic grind itself. The relic grind itself is probably going to remain how it always was- annoying and tedious. Except now you have to sit through hours of cringe content before even being able to start it. I just hope this isn't the relic questline. I want something more serious, or interesting about the actual world of Eorzea and its cultures. I mean c'mon we literally went to the moon... why are we going back to this content for a relic?

At the end of the day, I'm gonna grind it regardless. Just a bit sad that its going to be a storyline I have literal no interest in.

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Originally Posted by aveyond-dreams

This is a Final Fantasy game at the end of the day, that means having a good balance of what is haha funny and what is actually involved storytelling. Seems like if I want the latter I have to wait until Summer 2023 when FFXVI comes out.

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I agree they should be balanced, and considering Shadowbringers skipped out on funny entirely and there wasn't any Hildibrand content for several years it makes sense for the pendulum to swing back the other way.

Wow, I made a joke about this around here a few months ago, because I thought it'd be too absurd to happen. And I say that as someone who loves the Hildebrand quests.

Considering the last two relics were locked behind content I didn't enjoy or care for, I'm curious how this one will go.

I made it to the quest with the potsherds in the river, got bored, deleted the quest from my log and never looked back at it. Guess I have some quests that I'll need to force myself through. Thank god there's youtube, audible, listening to the Taco Bell gong sound for 10 hours, or literally anything else to keep me awake.

Also this is dumb. Stop tying new content to older stuff. I get it, no one wants to run the Ivalice raids or no one is queueing into the old Hildibrand stuff but that sounds like an SE issue. Maybe if I could go back and do raids at a much higher level or a few max level FC members help with it, it wouldn't be so much of an issue would it SE?