Pay for your inventory.

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Originally Posted by Silverbane

To me, even $30 a month to play FFXIV is a bargain. That's around 20 cents an hour, a far better deal than a movie or typical $60 game.

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Anybody that supported this comment is part of what is wrong with the gaming industry as a whole, but let's save that for another thread ;)

You're right - the difference between you and I is I won't throw money at a 'solution' to a problem that really shouldn't exist in the first place. I'll work around it and if that means dropping a few more items than I would otherwise, that's ok with me.

Microtransactions may be the world we live in, but by the goddess I don't have to like it. I'm from the generation that believed in getting value for our dollars, not just throwing more dollars at something because a company is too lazy to craft an actual solution to a problem they created.

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Originally Posted by Onikimaru

Anybody that supported this comment is part of what is wrong with the gaming industry as a whole, but let's save that for another thread ;)

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Let me put it another way: I've spent many times my subscription cost for FFXIV on the hardware I bought specifically for playing the game: specialized mouse and keyboard, new monitor with faster GtG response, upgrading to a GTX 970, and so on. And I plan to keep upgrading my hardware as time goes on (e.g. to 4K when that technology is mature).

Another $8 a month for 4 more retainers isn't going to change my FFXIV-related spending much. YMMV, but at least appreciate that spendy people like me keep Yoshida-san's corporate overlords happy. :)

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Originally Posted by Souljacker

You're right - the difference between you and I is I won't throw money at a 'solution' to a problem that really shouldn't exist in the first place. I'll work around it and if that means dropping a few more items than I would otherwise, that's ok with me.

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I applaud your industry, sincerely. But I have more money than I need and less time to play FFXIV than I would like, so I have chosen a different path. Hopefully both our paths allow us to enjoy the game.

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Originally Posted by Musashidon

there is already enough room for everything.

if you want to keep more then you actually need then you will need to pay.

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This. Even with all jobs and classes leveled, there's plenty of room for gear and everything else. Quit holding onto useless crap that just needs to be crafted or desynthed. Proper inventory management doesn't even take up one full retainer.

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Originally Posted by Silverbane

I applaud your industry, sincerely. But I have more money than I need and less time to play FFXIV than I would like, so I have chosen a different path. Hopefully both our paths allow us to enjoy the game.

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I find it fascinating that your very first four posts are all in this thread to support paying for inventory. Was that a coincidence?

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Originally Posted by Silverbane

Let me put it another way: I've spent many times my subscription cost for FFXIV on the hardware I bought specifically for playing the game: specialized mouse and keyboard, new monitor with faster GtG response, upgrading to a GTX 970, and so on. And I plan to keep upgrading my hardware as time goes on (e.g. to 4K when that technology is mature).

Another $8 a month for 4 more retainers isn't going to change my FFXIV-related spending much. YMMV, but at least appreciate that spendy people like me keep Yoshida-san's corporate overlords happy. :)

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Just remember, nickle and dimeing can cost you more in the long run that up front, one time large costs. And spending a lot may keep the corporate suits happy, but remember, they are not looking out for your best interests. And in the end, they get their way if customers allow it.

The more they realize you're willing to spend on things that would have otherwise been covered by subscription fees, the more they'll lock content behind paywalls, and the more you'll have to pay for less content, since cost cutting is also part of making money as a business. They will push your limits, and until you draw a line, they will continue.

If customers are willing to pay twice as much money for half as much content as they used to get, this is what corporate suits will want. This is why we get so much less value from DLC these days in games in general, and why we now have cash shops and such in Pay to play games when previously such a thing was out of the question.

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Originally Posted by Souljacker

I find it fascinating that your very first four posts are all in this thread to support paying for inventory. Was that a coincidence?

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It's like this: usually I just read the FFXIV reddit, but I'm psyched for HW so I browsed here to. This thread caught my attention so I logged in and posted a comment. Then I followed up on replies and other posts. Call it a whim if you like, nothing darker.

It's just a distraction to keep me from the work I really should be doing. Fortunately the servers are down tomorrow so I can make up the time I should have worked today.

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Originally Posted by Silverbane

Let me put it another way: I've spent many times my subscription cost for FFXIV on the hardware I bought specifically for playing the game: specialized mouse and keyboard, new monitor with faster GtG response, upgrading to a GTX 970, and so on. And I plan to keep upgrading my hardware as time goes on (e.g. to 4K when that technology is mature).

Another $8 a month for 4 more retainers isn't going to change my FFXIV-related spending much. YMMV, but at least appreciate that spendy people like me keep Yoshida-san's corporate overlords happy. :)

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Yeah sure not for you as long as you are ok that's fine right?

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Originally Posted by Onikimaru

Yeah sure not for you as long as you are ok that's fine right?

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To be fair though, it really is just an optional service. One that you can pay the in-between (don't have to go for max retainers) or just not use at all. Hoarding, even in a video game (an RPG, no less), is still a bad habit lol. The only true issue is how it contradicts the excuses we were given in the past about inventory and/or proper armoire expansion. Even if it were 1 more retainer for free or them expanding the armoire a little, it would have at least shown a bit of understanding towards the issue. Instead of doing what can easily be taken as lying to find an excuse to give to find more ways to make players pay for more things in a P2P game, even if there might be legit unknown reasons. "The dog ate my homework!"

Again, not a big deal as far as offering additional optional services, but it can become a far bigger deal when you contradict yourself to make it seem like you're innocent and caring LOL.

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Originally Posted by Adire

Just remember, nickle and dimeing can cost you more in the long run that up front, one time large costs. And spending a lot may keep the corporate suits happy, but remember, they are not looking out for your best interests. And in the end, they get their way if customers allow it.

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I used to play another MMO so I have experienced exactly what you are talking about.

But here, we have a marquee IP and, importantly, Yoshida-san. I believe the FFXIV team are artists who take pride in their accomplishments, not just salaried drones. I will risk $30 a month that they aren't just milking me for $$$.

But the minute they stop providing me with $30 worth of entertainment every month, I'll go look elsewhere. I won't repeat the mistake I made with my last MMO, where I was constantly disappointed by the game and the devs but stayed out of a sense of obligation to my raid group.

The people agreeing with $12 for more inventory are either trolling or they are being paid to do so! Look at Everquest 2 you get 6 slots and you can put 6, 75 slot bags for a total of 450 slots of inventory for selling and its 100% FREE. And in FFXIV you get 40 free slots for selling and 120 more slots for $12 a month. That's a complete rip off! AND FYI! Paying $25 a month to play this game is $300 a year or a GTX 970!

So...is it definitely confirmed to not be a typo in the patch notes? (because I saw a slight error in the Scholar quests section)

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Originally Posted by Onikimaru

Yeah sure not for you as long as you are ok that's fine right?

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I would not presume to speak for other people.

But please recall that this is a game, a luxury item, and as with any luxury item, there is nothing morally or ethically wrong with the seller asking people to pay as much as the market will bear for it.

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Originally Posted by Silverbane

there is nothing morally or ethically wrong with the seller asking people to pay as much as the market will bear for it.

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That's what most of the posts here are getting at. Those of us who posted are either on the side of "We refuse to accept this as a way to alleviate the inventory issue and will not pay this, or can not pay this" or "Deal with it they charge what ever the f they want. If you don't want to pay for it, then you don't get it."

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Originally Posted by Blissa

The people agreeing with $12 for more inventory are either trolling or they are being paid to do so!

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Nonsense. That's uncalled for. I am sincerely fine with it, and not being paid to post.
My real job, which has no connection to SE or FFXIV, pays well enough that $8 a month doesn't make any difference to my finances.

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Originally Posted by Silverbane

I would not presume to speak for other people.

But please recall that this is a game, a luxury item, and as with any luxury item, there is nothing morally or ethically wrong with the seller asking people to pay as much as the market will bear for it.

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That's a JOKE "luxury item"! They know people are addicted to this game and they know they are going to pay the extra $12 a month. All they are doing is praying on peoples addiction. But they are not getting a dime out of me!

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Originally Posted by Silverbane

Nonsense. That's uncalled for. I am sincerely fine with it, and not being paid to post.
My real job, which has no connection to SE or FFXIV, pays well enough that $8 a month doesn't make any difference to my finances.

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Its not about the money its the principle. First they wanted $13 a month and then they wanted another $4 a month and now they want another $8 a month. When does it end? How much more are they going to want in another 6~12 months!

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Originally Posted by Silverbane

I would not presume to speak for other people.

But please recall that this is a game, a luxury item, and as with any luxury item, there is nothing morally or ethically wrong with the seller asking people to pay as much as the market will bear for it.

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That's why the gaming industry is so rotten since some years...

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Originally Posted by Blissa

That's a JOKE "luxury item"! They know people are addicted to this game and they know they are going to pay the extra $12 a month. All they are doing is praying on peoples addiction. But they are not getting a dime out of me!

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Thoreau once said "If I knew for a certainty that a man was coming to my house with the conscious design of doing me good, I should run for my life." As you yourself are obviously not one of those addicts of which you speak, please harken to the words of Thoreau and stop trying to do good to those of us who might be.

You don't even know us. You're not qualified to advocate on our behalf.

You mind your interests, and I'll mind mine. Fair enough?

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Originally Posted by Silverbane

Thoreau once said "If I knew for a certainty that a man was coming to my house with the conscious design of doing me good, I should run for my life." As you yourself are obviously not one of those addicts of which you speak, please harken to the words of Thoreau and stop trying to do good to those of us who might be.

You don't even know us. You're not qualified to advocate on our behalf.

You mind your interests, and I'll mind mine. Fair enough?

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That was not directed at you, but I speak the truth!

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Originally Posted by IceWing

"Deal with it they charge what ever the f they want. If you don't want to pay for it, then you don't get it."

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Yup, and its those people with that mindset which are responsible for what the gaming industry has become lately. Its just sad. Of course theyd probably just proudly say something along the lines of "Dont like it? Stop gaming."

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Originally Posted by Blissa

That was not directed at you, but I speak the truth!

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The truth is, no one has to pay more to play FFXIV:ARR with the launch of HW. Subscription fees are unchanged. You are not forced to hire new retainers. You do have to buy HW to access the new content, but even then your subscription rate is remaining the same.

So even someone addicted to FFXIV does not need to pay more to continue indulging their vice.

I thought for sure that we were getting a third free retainer with 3.0, but I guess I misunderstood or things were translated poorly or something. This is pretty disappointing to me, and I really don't want to have to pay $2 per month extra just to spare myself some inventory woes. It's not that I can't afford it. My boyfriend and I already spend $30/month on this game (or somewhat less with subscribing for more than 1 month at a time, but still), and I have always felt like quality of life changes like increased storage and whatnot were something included with a subscription fee. I have never played any other game, free or subscription, that asked for a monthly rental fee for extra storage space.

I find it hard to believe that having a fully functioning armoire and/or a glamour log would be difficult to implement, and both of these would go a long way to help out with storage capacity problems they claim to have. At the very least, it would be nice to have account storage or be able to mail things to alts. Using FC chest to transfer things between alts is not an option for everyone (Both my FC and my alt's FC chests are pretty much full at this point, and not everyone has full FC chest access either). I don't know, some sort of change would be nice. I got rid of a lot of glamour things and crafting mats that I was holding onto so that I could make some space for 3.0 things, but that still only left me with about half a retainer of space.

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Originally Posted by KayoZ

Yup, and its those people with that mindset which are responsible for what the gaming industry has become lately. Its just sad. Of course theyd probably just proudly say something along the lines of "Dont like it? Stop gaming."

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I am almost to that point! $60 for Evolve and another $240 for DLC. $60 for Batman and another $80 for a dlc subscription and now $25 a month to play FFXIV if you want max Inventory spaces. I mean seriously $300 a year to play this game joke!

It's disturbing how they take back the 1 extra retainer with expansion thing and add even more space eating items like "Collectible Items", on top of the new gear, recipe mats, item drops, etc. to eventually force everyone to cave in and fork over money for more inventory space.

The white knights will gladly throw money at it and the ones that repel it will eventually get over it and will be forced to hand over the money. Even those who do well in space management will eventually feel the hurt of limited inventory space.

Those who don't want to pay and suffer from limited space are forced to get rid of things when they shouldn't be forced to play a certain way from something as small as glamouring space. I can already forecast in the future that any new incoming jobs will be behind a pay wall, because they'll have us pay for the extra soul gem space. But hey, it's not P2W because having that specific class is just glamour and doesn't give any particular advantage, right? Don't like it? They'll get over it and pay eventually.

SE is getting bold with the idea that the players will throw away money on just about anything nowadays.

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Originally Posted by KayoZ

Of course theyd probably just proudly say something along the lines of "Dont like it? Stop gaming."

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No need for that, there are plenty of major F2P games.

Bottom line is, if the game says you can do everything on one character, and they keep adding kore items/gear to the game, more storage is needed. But to make us pay for most of it is uncalled for, simply adding one new retainer would of been enough. And while we aren't sure, hopefully, if we "complain" enough by 3.1 this will be a possibility. SE should learn not to mention anything with a degree of concreteness, as it drives fans wild with speculation, and when those speculations aren't realized, there is a major backlash.

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Originally Posted by Silverbane

The truth is, no one has to pay more to play FFXIV:ARR with the launch of HW. Subscription fees are unchanged. You are not forced to hire new retainers. You do have to buy HW to access the new content, but even then your subscription rate is remaining the same.

So even someone addicted to FFXIV does not need to pay more to continue indulging their vice.

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Obliviously you must not craft. Because I have 4 retainers now and 1 of my 8 level 50 crafters can FILL all 80 selling slots on my retainers. What am I supposed to do. Twiddle my thumbs and do nothing why I wait for stuff to sell? The expansion is in 2 days and they know people are going to need more spaces to sell. What a perfect time to hit them up for another $8 a month.

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Originally Posted by Blissa

I am almost to that point! $60 for Evolve and another $240 for DLC. $60 for Batman and another $80 for a dlc subscription and now $25 a month to play FFXIV if you want max Inventory spaces. I mean seriously $300 a year to play this game joke!

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Just be like me and don't pay for what you don't feel is worth the money (or you feel is ethically/morally wrong). I am going to get Arkham Knight, but I am NOT paying for the DLC. I am perfectly content with a vanilla game. If I wasn't, but still wished to play, I'd just spend my time on something else (like this game maybe) and wait for the eventual mark-down/sale a year or so after. Even the Smash Bros paid DLC is kinda ridiculous IMO. Whereas games like Hyrule Warriors will give you a HUGE amount of quality DLC with that game for $20. That is a perfectly justifiable cost.

In the case of retainers, given how it is with having the 2 paid retainers, I really only need 1... maybe 2 more. An extra $2-4 monthly isn't wallet breaking for (safe to assume) 99% of the player population. My only issue is the lack of a reason why inventory expansion (player inventory, armoire, company chest) is such an issue, when they can clearly double the already existing load with this. If they're willing to tell us server capacity is an issue for inventory related limitations, they should be more than willing to tell us why it's suddenly okay as long as we pay for it lol.

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Originally Posted by Silverbane

I would not presume to speak for other people.

But please recall that this is a game, a luxury item, and as with any luxury item, there is nothing morally or ethically wrong with the seller asking people to pay as much as the market will bear for it.

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What does it matter if it is a luxury item? A television is a luxury item, you expect it to work and the picture to be adequate. When you purchase any good or service you have an expectation. An expectation isn't being met here, regardless of how much or little disposable income any one player has and if that expectation isn't being met you should bitch because if you don't they aren't going to know they need to take the issue seriously. What if people didn't raise hell about the whole XBox red ring of death back when? Think Microsoft would have still done warranty repairs on those systems if hundreds of thousands of people didn't express their disappointment.

These are people who are wanting to use in game systems, Glamour, crafting, gathering and being restricted by inventory then told to throw it away or give SE money. SE designed these systems, specifically glamour which didnt need to use inventory, to consume inventory spaces and with each update and expansion the available maximum inventory remains the same while the number of usable items increases in addition to glamour armor which according Live Letters the developers and Yoshi P are totally into and behind. So much that they design items SPECIFICALLY for glamour then yes, they need to take this issue seriously.

How does additional inventory for all players negatively affect you let alone anyone in this forum? If you are just here to white knight SE for yet another cash shop purchase when we all ready have to pay an increase sub fee to have multiple characters per server, yet we cannot give these characters items from our mains without a third-party, an FC, or the market board as an intervening factor. The inventory complaints everyone has had could have been alleviated day one by allowing us to mule efficiently, reaped the rewards of the extra couple bucks a month from the sub change but instead they choose to skirt around the issue offering pay only solutions while people like you Silverbane create a forum account just to white knight SE when they are receiving criticism on a decision that affects paying customers.

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Originally Posted by Blissa

Obliviously you must not craft. Because I have 4 retainers now and 1 of my 8 level 50 crafters can FILL all 80 selling slots on my retainers. What am I supposed to do. Twiddle my thumbs and do nothing why I wait for stuff to sell? The expansion is in 2 days and they know people are going to need more spaces to sell. What a perfect time to hit them up for another $8 a month.

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Sorry, but you are one of the people that are actively working past the necessary minimum. You're the demographic that they are aiming for with this limited business. Because they know people like you will never be content with managing what you're given. And yes, it's entirely possible to do so, but you choose to work in excess. This is how marketing works and how money is made.

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Originally Posted by Lewtskie

Sorry, but you are one of the people that are actively working past the necessary minimum. You're the demographic that they are aiming for with this limited business. Because they know people like you will never be content with managing what you're given. And yes, it's entirely possible to do so, but you choose to work in excess. This is how marketing works and how money is made.

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It's funny though, I thought we were already paying them.
I must've been mistaken.

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Originally Posted by Welsper59

Just be like me and don't pay for what you don't feel is worth the money

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I am not willing to pay for it! I canceled my sub and I canceled my preorder. As I said in the other post. First they wanted $13 a month and then they wanted another $4 a month and now the want another $8 month. When does it end?

The funny thing is they say they can't give us any more inventory spaces due server limitations. But some how $12 a month magically fixes those limitations!

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Originally Posted by Eloah

Bottom line is, if the game says you can do everything on one character, and they keep adding kore items/gear to the game, more storage is needed. But to make us pay for most of it is uncalled for, simply adding one new retainer would of been enough. And while we aren't sure, hopefully, if we "complain" enough by 3.1 this will be a possibility. SE should learn not to mention anything with a degree of concreteness, as it drives fans wild with speculation, and when those speculations aren't realized, there is a major backlash.

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Eventually gear is replaced though, least.. I know that I replace my gear when I get new pieces? I'd hope people replace theirs when they get newer pieces too, meaning the older gear shouldn't sit around anyways unless it's gonna be desyn'd or something. :/

Only excusable reason I could think of is if another class needs the gear but then you just toss out the other gears you're not glamouring or like to glamour with to GC or something. :/

For mats.. well I do the same thing but I am probably going to try to toss out stuff that I can easily get back or make if there's a lot of newer mats however I still do have room even with mats from 2.0 ~ 2.55.

And to put this out there for people; I have bought from mogstation like fantasia and my wristlet but nothing like a mount, minions or retainers so I'm still dealing with 2 myself but... there's ways to manage the issue with two retainers i'd like to believe.

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Originally Posted by ziddyt

It's funny though, I thought we were already paying them.
I must've been mistaken.

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Should I make an in-depth list as to what you're getting per month? Cause I'm certain I can show you that what you're paying for is all you'll ever need to actually play this game and partake in all of its content.

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Originally Posted by Lewtskie

Sorry, but you are one of the people that are actively working past the necessary minimum. You're the demographic that they are aiming for with this limited business. Because they know people like you will never be content with managing what you're given. And yes, it's entirely possible to do so, but you choose to work in excess. This is how marketing works and how money is made.

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They are not making another dime off me! I canceled my sub and I canceled my preorder!

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Originally Posted by Lewtskie

Should I make an in-depth list as to what you're getting per month? Cause I'm certain I can show you that what you're paying for is all you'll ever need to actually play this game and partake in all of its content.

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Your list isn't going to change what's actually in my inventory, nor all of the new items (specifically gear for three new jobs) being added into that.

Play with the bare minimum or pay is a thing in the F2P/P2W, It shouldn't be in a P2P

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Originally Posted by Eloah

Bottom line is, if the game says you can do everything on one character, and they keep adding kore items/gear to the game, more storage is needed. But to make us pay for most of it is uncalled for, simply adding one new retainer would of been enough. And while we aren't sure, hopefully, if we "complain" enough by 3.1 this will be a possibility. SE should learn not to mention anything with a degree of concreteness, as it drives fans wild with speculation, and when those speculations aren't realized, there is a major backlash.

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Agreed, someone should make a petition thread to get one of the retainers for free, or have different options to chose from such as "Three free retainers total" "A discount for paying for all retainers" or "It's fine the way they've made it" so that all PoV's are seen.