Is anyone annoyed by the HUGE number of people using bots on this game?

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Originally Posted by Crica

I was asking about your logic, not laws.

Logic says - if crafting was fun w/o botting, the majority of players would craft w/o botting because it's fun.

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Really. STILL hilarious.
Hey, you're right. It's the game's fault you have ethics faults.

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Originally Posted by Kurokikaze

ITP: Denial.

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Do you need money or something? I mean the game's kindof free I can understand if you don't have money to buy your Bieber CDs.

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Originally Posted by Peregrine

Really. STILL hilarious.
Hey, you're right. It's the game's fault you have ethics faults.

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Me? I am talking about the players who are botting crafting because its boring.

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Originally Posted by Kurokikaze

But at least they turned it into a full time job Oni. Amirite?

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And you think that justifies anything? They could have made retainer a full time job where you stand in the markets for hours shouting at people passing by hoping they come browse your goods. Would that have made a a better idea or a better way of doing things?

Kurokikaze, I don't really see you playing on Saronia but I'm very aware that your linkshell members of Rzero are among the worst bot users of our server. I won't name names here but if you need any proof, feel free to log in and send me a tell, I can easily point at any of them who are currently doing so this very moment attached to the craft support npc or fishing at the ferry with 4-5 rank 50 fisherman accounts at a time. But if your actively playing right now, this might not be any news to you and your stance on bot use probably means you won't care either way.

In the end, the bot users deserve to be banned. When the game comes to a point where it becomes pay to play, I expect SE to have done something about it by then. Until then, just ignore and continue playing without thinking too much about it because there is nothing that can be done at the moment.

This thread just went full retard.

You never go full retard.

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Originally Posted by Onidemon

And you think that justifies anything? They could have made retainer a full time job where you stand in the markets for hours shouting at people passing by hoping they come browse your goods. Would that have made a a better idea or a better way of doing things?

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Dude you missed my point. I agreed with you and made a joke of it. >.>;

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Originally Posted by Radaghast

This thread just went full retard.

You never go full retard.

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Trolls trolling trolls trolling trolls. LOL

Peregrine posts faster than every 30 seconds. It's a bot guys.

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Originally Posted by Adol

Some people don't have fun, simply because they are different to a person who does have fun. Not everyone will have the same idea of "fun".

Some people will just cheat because they can get away with it and it's easy to do.

I know you're trying to get your point across to this person but trying to get a point across to Peregrine is like smashing your face in to a brick wall, or in other words fruitless.

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Oh, dude. Not only fruitless. Stupid.

Mind what side of the conversation you're actually on.
Lol we have a half a dozen people in here trying to blame their ethical sewers on the media that they **** in.

One more reason why there is so many bots is that with the population of players constantly declining i don't see SE banning/suspending or doing anything to push those remaining players away.

Once the game is in a good shape and we get over 1 mil or 2 population going on then i'm sure SE will bring down the ban hammer.

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Originally Posted by Crica

Me? I am talking about the players who are botting crafting because its boring.

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You're more to blame why they bot than the game is. Blame the botters, then blame those tolerating them. Kill the terrorists, imprison those aiding and abetting terror.

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Originally Posted by Peregrine

Oh, dude. Not only fruitless. Stupid.

Mind what side of the conversation you're actually on.
Lol we have a half a dozen people in here trying to blame their ethical sewers on the media that they **** in.

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So you actually agree that you do not tolerate the opinions of others?
Well there you have it people, there's no point trying to discuss anything with Peregrine.

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Originally Posted by Onidemon

One more reason why there is so many bots is that with the population of players constantly declining i don't see SE banning/suspending or doing anything to push those remaining players away.

Once the game is in a good shape and we get over 1 mil or 2 population going on then i'm sure SE will bring down the ban hammer.

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Faulty logic. Now the game has a reputation for being a botter haven that no one cares about. Who'se going to want to play this piece of trash now?

No one. They should have never given the botters a foothold. Now their product just looks like all the more **** because of it.

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Originally Posted by Adol

So you actually agree that you do not tolerate the opinions of others?
Well there you have it people, there's no point trying to discuss anything with Peregrine.

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Since when were cheaters to be negotiated with? They don't have a voice. They don't get a say. They're not equals. They're blight.

There comes a point where your opinion no longer matters. That point, for you all, came about the time you went ethically belly-up in the genre and started sympathizing with botters.

The game made me do it! I'm repressed! I'm a aproduct of my environment!

Oh cry me a river. You had a choice. You chose poorly.

Stop botting replies bro. It's obvious.

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Originally Posted by Peregrine

Since when were cheaters to be negotiated with? They don't have a voice. They don't get a say. They're not equals. They're blight.

There comes a point where your opinion no longer matters. That point, for you all, came about the time you went ethically belly-up in the genre and started sympathizing with botters.

The game made me do it! I'm repressed! I'm a aproduct of my environment!

Oh cry me a river. You had a choice. You chose poorly.

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You need help.
Just going to leave it at that.

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Originally Posted by Adol

You need help.

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What, do you mean like a bot?
Uhno. Maybe YOU do.

You need to make better decisions on who and what you support.
Look at all these botter sympathizers up in here. Geeminy christmas it's worse than I thought.

Ethically dereclict. It's XIV's fault so many people botttttt.
Christ I've never wanted to be a republican more than right now, and that is disgusting.

There are so many ways to look at this.. I mean, for one, both sides of the argument have to realize that anything a bot can do, you can do.

The argument lies on who actually plays legit? Why does it matter so much? You play your own character, the bots shouldn't effect you. The fact is that you are simply jealous that the player behind that bot does not have to sit through tedious crafting. Well, what is it that is stopping you from getting a bot of your own?

How you would feel about using a bot should bring up an important question. "Is this cheating?" Why, yes. Yes it is.

Now, think of the bigger picture. You can work on that same craft, and someday, you will have all of your classes ranked to cap, just like that bot. However, you can at least say that you got to where you were without having to cheat.

Pretty much what all of this dumbs down to is, who gives? Just play your own character and hope that someday, these bots will be discovered and banned, all of their efforts(lol effort, i know right?) will be in vain.

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Originally Posted by TonyMontana

She used to craft in limsa too, but i know the Emily bot you are talking about. The one I am refering to is Balin Jerry in limsa, there are a few more there too but he has been there as long as the ability to break fish nto shards has been in the game.

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Oh there are a lot more in Limsa besides the 4-5 that camp at the Hyaline. If you go to the northern islands area in limsa you will find 4-6 more making shards. There are many others scattered throughout each city and zone too 95% of the time in the same spots doing the same things, wearing the same things, not answering, not responding to you sitting on their orb, etc. If there is a special task force in this game they are not doing anything at the moment or are just really bad at what they do. =\

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Originally Posted by Peregrine

What, do you mean like a bot?
Uhno. Maybe YOU do.

You need to make better decisions on who and what you support.
Look at all these botter sympathizers up in here. Geeminy christmas it's worse than I thought.

Ethically dereclict. It's XIV's fault so many people botttttt.
Christ I've never wanted to be a republican more than right now, and that is disgusting.

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Calm down son, deep breaths.

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Originally Posted by Nuru

There are so many ways to look at this.. I mean, for one, both sides of the argument have to realize that anything a bot can do, you can do.

The argument lies on who actually plays legit? Why does it matter so much? You play your own character, the bots shouldn't effect you. The fact is that you are simply jealous that the player behind that bot does not have to sit through tedious crafting. Well, what is it that is stopping you from getting a bot of your own?

How you would feel about using a bot should bring up an important question. "Is this cheating?" Why, yes. Yes it is.

Now, think of the bigger picture. You can work on that same craft, and someday, you will have all of your classes ranked to cap, just like that bot. However, you can at least say that you got to where you were without having to cheat.

Pretty much what all of this dumbs down to is, who gives? Just play your own character and hope that someday, these bots will be discovered and banned, all of their efforts(lol effort, i know right?) will be in vain.

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Society doesn't run on the punishment of the ethically bankrupt. It runs on the good faith in other people. If XIV gets the reputation of suffering these ethically bankrupt players, there will be no legitimate players left to build a real society on. We will leave.

They leech the system. Like parasites. Without us, they can't support any society as the component that erodes social fabric itself.

Ban them. Months ago. If square enix doesn't start banning cheaters, legitimate players will just quit and take with them any chance for a legitimate game. Then the botters will quit because what's the point in looking accomplished in a game where no one plays legitimately?

Again, parasites. They can't live without the integrity of other players as the standard. The only reason they cheat is because they aren't even good at this. Like a petty thug, they aren't even GOOD at stealing per se. The only reason they choose to do it is because people who are more talented and smarter than they are refuse to. If everyone cheated like they do, they'd be nobodies again.

So anyone else find it strange that the MMO with the most anti-botting/rmt mechanics in place is the one where the problem is the most rampant/commonplace?

This says something about the game I feel.

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Originally Posted by Peregrine

Society doesn't run on the punishment of the ethically bankrupt. It runs on the good faith in other people. If XIV gets the reputation of suffering these ethically bankrupt players, there will be no legitimate players left to build a real society on. We will leave.

They leech the system. Like parasites.

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I can't really disagree with you seeing as how i was able to get my friend a character slot a few days ago and he couldn't even find rank 10 armor that was affordable. Not sure if it was due to all of the botting or anything, its one of those scenarios where you just have no clue what is going on, or who to blame.

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Originally Posted by Kurokikaze

So anyone else find it strange that the MMO with the most anti-botting/rmt mechanics in place is the one where the problem is the most rampant/commonplace?

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Kuro, think it only seems that way because there isn't much of a playerbase left. If you compare the Bot/Player ratios between this game and others, you'd most likely see that it is considerably balanced. The more populated MMOs you just don't notice as much because that is not what you are focused on.

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Originally Posted by Nuru

I can't really disagree with you seeing as how i was able to get my friend a character slot a few days ago and he couldn't even find rank 10 armor that was affordable. Not sure if it was due to all of the botting or anything, its one of those scenarios where you just have no clue what is going on, or who to blame.

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nah the low level gear issue is cuz you cant make money off it so no one makes it

also add the fact in you can get to 20 in a matter of hours so why get lower gear at all

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Originally Posted by Nuru

I can't really disagree with you seeing as how i was able to get my friend a character slot a few days ago and he couldn't even find rank 10 armor that was affordable. Not sure if it was due to all of the botting or anything, its one of those scenarios where you just have no clue what is going on, or who to blame.




Kuro, think it only seems that way because there isn't much of a playerbase left. If you compare the Bot/Player ratios between this game and others, you'd most likely see that it is considerably balanced. The more populated MMOs you just don't notice as much because that is not what you are focused on.

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That has something to do with the amount of gil currently in play. Nothing to do with the botting. If anything the botting should be making more supply thereby bringing the prices down.

Or did that make too much sense?

Really... The ratio is balanced? Thats why we're having this discussion right? Because the ratio of botters to legitimate players is balanced like in other games... that is why we're 19 pages deep in this stupid conversation?

The worst thing with bots for me in FFXIV is that I can't do anything to them. Ok I reported them, but now I would like to take this spot, in other games I can pk them, or train them, heal mob etc. Here I can't get rid of them at all ://

I manage few times to take mob on my self when bot was targeting it, then some agro mob show up, start attacking bot and it went down, but to do that u will have to spend a lot of time and it's not always even possible.

I would like to ask SE, to give us some tools for fighting with bots in game as well.

This is what happens to any MMO in which there is no enforcement of the rules.
The parasites overload it. It's not the nature of the game. It's the chronicity of the no action. There's never been a modern MMO this lack-ass about botting.

It's not the game's fault. It's the developers' letting bad players take over their product.

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Originally Posted by Peregrine

This is what happens to any MMO in which there is no enforcement of the rules.
The parasites overload it.

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Oh... that explains why you're still around.

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Originally Posted by Dega

Oh there are a lot more in Limsa besides the 4-5 that camp at the Hyaline. If you go to the northern islands area in limsa you will find 4-6 more making shards. There are many others scattered throughout each city and zone too 95% of the time in the same spots doing the same things, wearing the same things, not answering, not responding to you sitting on their orb, etc. If there is a special task force in this game they are not doing anything at the moment or are just really bad at what they do. =\

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I found some very well hidden bots around Limsa as well on my server making shards too. In Lower Limsa, at the far stretches of the docks and passageways to where those sea gull statues are, there are a few bots working away. Also during the Easter event while in search of the spriggan, I noticed a pair of 4x Alchemists full time hasty handing shards in Cassiopeia Hollow at the far opposite corners of the map where the waters separate them from any common pathways or monsters.

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Originally Posted by Kurokikaze

That has something to do with the amount of gil currently in play. Nothing to do with the botting. If anything the botting should be making more supply thereby bringing the prices down.

Or did that make too much sense?

Really... The ratio is balanced? Thats why we're having this discussion right? Because the ratio of botters to legitimate players is balanced like in other games... that is why we're 19 pages deep in this stupid conversation?

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No no, that makes sense. I also mentioned that the ratio is considerably balanced. I think more botters exist in a game like WoW than they do in FFXIV, in terms of the exact number of botters, not the ratio. You can't say that FFXIV has the most Bots in any MMORPG, because that would mean that the FFXIV population would have to all be bots, and then some.

You tend to notice bots more because its such a small diminishing community.

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Originally Posted by Nuru

No no, that makes sense. I also mentioned that the ratio is considerably balanced. I think more botters exist in a game like WoW than they do in FFXIV, in terms of the exact number of botters, not the ratio. You can't say that FFXIV has the most Bots in any MMORPG, because that would mean that the FFXIV population would have to all be bots, and then some.

You tend to notice bots more because its such a small diminishing community.

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Trust me dude. No normal players bot in WoW. That shit is already automated to begin with. You cannot further automate that which is already done by itself.. lol

And that is exactly what I'm trying to say. A staggering majority of the current playerbase is probably botting. Thats the whole reason we're having this discussion. I see it like smoking pot - everyone is doing it but no one admits it. The only difference here is that they do it because the underlining task is remedial and boring.

Actually i thought bots were just ran to do the automated work. I know you are exaggerating when you say that WoW is already automated, but there are still commands to execute before you craft, or attack mobs, which implies that any MMORPG is subject to botting. FFXIV just has better reasons to bot, but whatever the case, botting is cheating, and cheating is cheating. Botting should cease to exist, it does nothing to help.

Peregrine post = keep scrolling past.

Bots are always going to be in this game they are in every MMO, nothing will ever be done about it.

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Originally Posted by Nuru

Actually i thought bots were just ran to do the automated work. I know you are exaggerating when you say that WoW is already automated, but there are still commands to execute before you craft, or attack mobs, which implies that any MMORPG is subject to botting.

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I'm talking crafting bots here. And no I'm not exaggerating when I say WoW is already automated. I get my mats, I pick the number of that item I want to synth, hit synth and go afk. Thats how I leveled my Jewelcrafting to 450 from 0 back in Wrath.

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Originally Posted by Nuru

FFXIV just has better reasons to bot, but whatever the case, botting is cheating, and cheating is cheating. Botting to cease to exist, it does nothing to help.

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So now you're agreeing with me but still falling back on the age old response. Of course it's cheating in this game because SE doesn't allow it.. no one said it wasn't. But as I stated earlier the question that the players and more importantly the devs need to be asking themselves is "Why are so many people cheating?".

The correct answer is:

Because the underlying task is not fun, involving or rewarding enough to do it legitimately.

^ see? I can not agree with the matter but still extend an arm and meet at the center.

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Originally Posted by Kurokikaze

I'm talking crafting bots here. And no I'm not exaggerating when I say WoW is already automated. I get my mats, I pick the number of that item I want to synth, hit synth and go afk. Thats how I leveled my Jewelcrafting to 450 from 0 back in Wrath.

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And I agree that is how it should have been done with this game, given how many mats you need and how ridiculous it is to make gear. Doing this would prevent the need or desire to bot.

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Originally Posted by Kurokikaze

So now you're agreeing with me but still falling back on the age old response. Of course it's cheating in this game because SE doesn't allow it.. no one said it wasn't. But as I stated earlier the question that the players and more importantly the devs need to be asking themselves is "Why are so many people cheating?".

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That is true, and i even quoted that same question a couple of replies ago, just not that the devs ask themselves, but you as a player. The devs do need to ask themselves that question though, in fact, many questions about the game in its current state.

So i guess its a matter of how to hault the botting.

Change the system or ban the bots? This is the argument, no?

The people that bot are currently in the majority I'd say. Banning them gets rid of a lot of the playerbase.

Change the system so that going forward others will not have to resort to cheating.

Omg... Did we just have an intelligent debate amidst all the trolling? lol