Did Yoshi P messed up the relics Im trying to understand the meaning of this help me!

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

You are acting like this Nerf happened two weeks after FFXI got released.

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No I am acting like those nerfs came...once...the...level...cap...increased.

All similarities to current FFXIV situation is exactly intended

Ok, let's make something clear: Any item you will gather before the final level cap will be worthless or nerfed in the end. So deal with it or stop playing ANY MMO.

Or we can actually make the game rewarding instead of this mega nerf? Nerfing was in thisgame before a level cap incase you forgot? We have been level 50 for almost 2 years levelcap and ilvl are two different things imo.

Your complaint boils down to "I can't wave my epeen around anymore now that more people can get the same thing I have."

Not really it boils down to why should you get a handout what gives you some right to get something with half the effort because of an expansion? Again thats why its best of some things could have been unturned and made enjoyable

Skizzle.

There is NOTHING enjoyable about spending several months and many millions of gil on ONE piece of GLAMOUR.

The FF11 model worked because people hadn't tried anything better. In today's market, people like to have a chance now and then of catching up to the pros at least in terms of gear; therefore expansions to MMOs tend to reset the gear grind so everyone is on a relatively level playing field.

You will have PLENTY to do in a month when the new relic quests start, so just ... Just accept that this is how this game works and that it isn't FF11. Please. You sound like one of these grumpy old men who can't accept that the world has changed from when they were kids.

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Originally Posted by Moonleg

snip snip

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Well that depends on the person really, used to play with a guy who adored grinds. Why? Who knows. Capped all classes at max level, grinded for mounts, achievements, weapons, you name it, and that's what he enjoyed doing (he eventually got invincible after like a year too and I was incredibly jelly).

But yeah, the majority do not enjoy that.

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Originally Posted by Colorful

Well that depends on the person really, used to play with a guy who adored grinds. Why? Who knows. Capped all classes at max level, grinded for mounts, achievements, weapons, you name it, and that's what he enjoyed doing (he eventually got invincible after like a year too and I was incredibly jelly).

But yeah, the majority do not enjoy that.

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<currently farming Atmas for the final 7 relics, 5 zones / stacks of 7 Atmas done!> Yeah and I hate Fates. I dunno....

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Originally Posted by Moonleg

There is NOTHING enjoyable about spending several months and many millions of gil on ONE piece of GLAMOUR.

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NEVER look down on masochists !

To each his own kind of pleasure :p

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Originally Posted by Moonleg

Just accept that this is how this game works and that it isn't FF11.

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Except even FF XI did the same thing..numerous time. But he'll just cover his ears singing La-La-La-La...no...Taru-Taru-Taru-Taru !

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Not really it boils down to why should you get a handout what gives you some right to get something with half the effort because of an expansion? Again thats why its best of some things could have been unturned and made enjoyable

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You're right! Increase all of Coil to 60 because I deserved that gear because I got it while it was fresh too! And my gear from Alexander better be upgraded too when the second part is released! As well as make the ilvl requirement for Coil and Alexander always equal to the newest stuff! Why? BECAUSE I WORKED HARD FOR THAT WHEN IT WAS USEFUL!

/sarcasm

Because that's how you sound.

You used FFXI as an example several times. Sure, your weapon was the top of its league. Sure, you could upgrade it more after they upped the level cap. But for the majority of the game? There was no vertical progression, only horizontal. That meant that gear released with new expansions was generally on par with what you got from the last one.

FFXIV, however, offers vertical progression. Are you currently using your relic? No? Why not? You worked SO hard for it.

The point is, relics are no longer a symbol as they once were. There's no point in making people grind through old content. That's why they gave more experience and better gear for quests, because who wants to grind through old stuff? You'll get your new status symbol starting in 3.1. You won't give a damn about your relic then.

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Originally Posted by Violyre

There was no vertical progression, only horizontal. That meant that gear released with new expansions was generally on par with what you got from the last one.

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Wrong, there was vertical too. The problem is that most people outside of Japan started when the level cap was 75, and it stayed that way for years.
The vast majority of lvl 50 gear (The initial cap) was worthless at 60, and the vast majority of lvl 60 gear was worthless at 75.

But I'm sure Skizzle earn everything in FFXI the hard way. No Genkai with help of people above lvl50... A Shadow Lord with a full party capped at level 50...

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Wrong, there was vertical too. The problem is that most people outside of Japan started when the level cap was 75, and it stayed that way for years.
The vast majority of lvl 50 gear (The initial cap) was worthless at 60, and the vast majority of lvl 60 gear was worthless at 75.

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Yes, I suppose this is true. Though since what, 85% of the game was spent with a 75 cap, I tend to forget.

I actually agree with the OP here. A lot of people have said "this isn't FFXI", and it isn't, however how many things have they taken from FFXI? A lot of enemies, a lot of moves, a lot of move designs and job trait designs, armor designs, race designs, beastman designs, crafting design, targeting combat design, etc, the list goes on for quite a long way.

Relics are something not just from other MMOPRGs but something from FFXI in particular, obtained via brutally grinding means, to acquire not just a typical dungeon drop or currency exchange item (which FFXI had as well), but something you busted your rear to obtain a ancient piece of equipment that would be usable for an extremely long time because it is not just another "mere weapon" or "mere glamour", but a legendary weapon that is involved with the world and story of the game.

A few months exclusivity doesn't really reward the amount of effort required to obtain such items, and even in their heyday, there were always items very similar in power to them. In FFXI there was a clear difference in a weapon that was Relic and wasn't, I don't think it needs to be a huge difference, however I do think that the effort you have to painstakingly go through to obtain something of this level which literally takes playing the game like it's your real life job should be usable in content for a pretty long time and not just a few months.

Some say "If you can obtain one item like this, why would you do future content"? because there are armor upgrades, because there are new items, new content, and most importantly of all, these weapons were only for a minority of the playerbase. Most people would not finish this weapon line the way it was before, and most people are perfectly fine with never obtaining these weapons as long as they have something that's good enough to get through content they will be satisfied.

I haven't earned a single one, and I even see why it would be a let down. I never even earned one in FFXI either (and trust me I tried).

What is the point of all this effort, all this time spent when they are merely just considered glamours later? It's honestly a smack in the face to those who truly earned these. With as much time and effort you had to spend on these compared to any other content in the game, it truly is.

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Originally Posted by KokonoeAiyoko

In FFXI there was a clear difference in a weapon that was Relic and wasn't...

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In FFXI, relics...were...not...lvl...50...weapons.
Nor were introduced before the first expansion.

Stop comparing the two because they have nothing in common, gameplay wise.

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Originally Posted by KokonoeAiyoko

What is the point of all this effort, all this time spent when they are merely just considered glamours later? It's honestly a smack in the face to those who truly earned these. With as much time and effort you had to spend on these compared to any other content in the game, it truly is.

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May I ask how you keep relic relevant in a vertical progression game? It would be dumb if they did not start fresh per expansion pack. Imagine if we are in Version 5.0 and you were doing relic quest steps from Patch 2.0, 3.0, and 4.0. It would be such a major pain that no one newer to the game at the time would take the time to do it at all.

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Originally Posted by Velhart

It would be such a major pain that no one newer to the game at the time would take the time to do it at all.

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Shhh, don't say that, it's exactly what they want ! :p

How in the name of all things final fantasy are we even trying to compare XI relics with XIV relics.

The content was different, required vast amounts of people, vast amounts of currency, and time that is not even within the same galaxy as what the XIV relic costed. I put 10x more time into XI and I never even got close to achieving a relic weapon. Yes somehow I attained a fully upgraded relic in a matter of a few months of casual play on this game....

There is simply no comparison there.

If your mad that you did some work to achieve a weapon that at the time was the best and now it's outdated then your simply playing the wrong genre of game. This is a common theme accross MMO's in general, especially theme park style MMO's.

Maybe if the relic chain was actually challenging, there would be some merit to retaining its exclusivity, but it's just a series of grind quests. It was little more than a time sink and a way to populate dungeons and trials. Now, it's a more accessible grind, which means more players are likely to attempt it. It continues to populate dungeons rather than becoming an obsolete quest line that no one attempts any more. Am I upset someone new can wave their Zeta around town? Heck no, they can do what they want in their own time, and if that's completing outdated content, then power to them.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

In FFXI, relics...were...not...lvl...50...weapons.
Nor were introduced before the first expansion.

Stop comparing the two because they have nothing in common, gameplay wise.

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You still didn't exactly refute his argument there. In FFXIV, a relic is just a shiny skin. The only bearing it has on stats is that you can customize the secondaries with all the impact of a squeaky mallet.

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Originally Posted by Velhart

May I ask how you keep relic relevant in a vertical progression game?

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You do this in two ways. Firstly, you curb the vertical progression. Secondly, you create a weapon that evolves, rather than merely stagnating. The relics in FFXI start at level 75 but eventually become level 99 through upgrades.

The reason people would do it is because the relic would be special, something worth owning. You might have a sword at level 99, but what of the person with the relic sword who deals bonus holy damage on strikes, or that guy adding poison onto targets through mere melee strikes?

The reason no one really cares about XIV relics is that, aside from their appearance, they're boring. They offer you nothing new or unique over existing weapons, just a shiny glow and new bodywork. Give people something to care about, and you'd see a lot more support for future relics.

So the OP expects something that they were able to use as a top tier weapon in then relevant content over the course of two years to take just as long to acquire now for people whose only possible use for it is for glamour? Yeah, sounds like modern MMO's are not for you - maybe you should find some old MMO servers from pre-2005 ish to relive the "glory" days of MMO grind. Have fun.

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Originally Posted by Lemuria

You do this in two ways. Firstly, you curb the vertical progression. Secondly, you create a weapon that evolves, rather than merely stagnating. The relics in FFXI start at level 75 but eventually become level 99 through upgrades.

The reason people would do it is because the relic would be special, something worth owning. You might have a sword at level 99, but what of the person with the relic sword who deals bonus holy damage on strikes, or that guy adding poison onto targets through mere melee strikes?

The reason no one really cares about XIV relics is that, aside from their appearance, they're boring. They offer you nothing new or unique over existing weapons, just a shiny glow and new bodywork. Give people something to care about, and you'd see a lot more support for future relics.

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Ok so lets say they buy your argument, and with 3.1 they introduce a new relic that you'll never need to get again. Except you have to grind out a new instance that requires 36 people with no DF for 2-3 years before you can have it. However, we dont really know what the ilvl will be by that time of the game.... so just know that when you get it we'll design it then or something.

This sort of experience doesn't have an equivalent in this game, because progress is so much faster. Your asking for something that would not only be hard to implement but that would alienate a new customer base. The key to a successful MMO in the current market is keeping all of the player base happy. That includes new players. If you want this MMO to last... then your better be happy SE is thinking about that.

The glory days of XI were more than a decade ago we have an entirely new generation of gamers that have grown up on mobile platforms. Think about them how you will, but they are a primary consumer. Making them happy is a key to success.

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Originally Posted by Lemuria

You do this in two ways. Firstly, you curb the vertical progression. Secondly, you create a weapon that evolves, rather than merely stagnating. The relics in FFXI start at level 75 but eventually become level 99 through upgrades.

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That just goes back to what I originally said. How do you expect people to catch up when we are 2-3 expansions in?

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The reason people would do it is because the relic would be special, something worth owning. You might have a sword at level 99, but what of the person with the relic sword who deals bonus holy damage on strikes, or that guy adding poison onto targets through mere melee strikes?

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That only works in the context of FFXI. Adding features like that to a weapon is potentially breaks balance and makes getting a weapon through raiding less relevant. If devs do something like that, they would have to greatly rework how their weapons and stats work.

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The reason no one really cares about XIV relics is that, aside from their appearance, they're boring. They offer you nothing new or unique over existing weapons, just a shiny glow and new bodywork. Give people something to care about, and you'd see a lot more support for future relics.

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People do not care about the relic? Each time a new relic step came out, PF was booming with people doing things like light parties, dungeon spam. Even making LS's for them. Materia prices also booming each time. You are going to have a hard time convincing me that people do not care. BiS players most definitely care.

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Originally Posted by Lemuria

You still didn't exactly refute his argument there.

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Because he has no argument besides "In FFXI, my relic was..."

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Originally Posted by Lemuria

You do this in two ways. Firstly, you curb the vertical progression.

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Which is only really doable once you stop increasing the level cap. And for FFXI specifically, only work because there was the stupid idea than you can change your pants while casting a spell.

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Originally Posted by Lemuria

Secondly, you create a weapon that evolves, rather than merely stagnating.

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Relic are specifically weapons that evolves, in case you can't compare a Curtana to an Excalibur Zeta. It's just that you don't like vertical evolution, so it's not the game for you, at least, yet.

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Originally Posted by Lemuria

The relics in FFXI start at level 75 but eventually become level 99 through upgrades.

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They became lvl99 because people were bitching exactly like now, and it was, again, when level cap reach its final peak after 5 expansion. Point is, we know nothing of how the game will "end", and you're already complaining about people not having to do all your hard work.

And besides, if they nerfed, it's to urge people to still do it, so it can still be relevant in the long way.

Again, you know nothing...

I notice people saying vertical progression game...does that not contradict their armory system that they so heavily advertise for this game?

How do you have it so people can effectively play more then one job..and then have the gear progression vertical? That is a different topic for a different thread though. If it was one job per character I'd think it would be fine, but let's be real here..there is no way we can take more then one job in Alexander Savage effectively LOL.

Anyway I agree with some points made here, the relic is extremely underwhelming in this game. In 2.0, it was just used as something to help newbs and attempt to keep old content relevant. Relic in the Final Fantasy lore, was never something that held so little merit. I'd like to think we can all agree on that^^;

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Originally Posted by Iromi

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May I ask how vertical progression makes the Armory System contradict itself?

Again and again! Everything else in this game is a vertical progression. Just keep one lousy thing horizontal progression if possible. Its not really that bad to make you earn the relic compared to other weapons you can get in this game.
Its already gameover with this theory since Yoshi P already announced how the new questline will look and long story he short messed up anything that had to with the grind beeing enjoyable and rewarding for the relics.
Instead its a major handout and a slap to the face to exactly anyone who devoted time and spent millions of gils on this.
Thank you everyone that supported me in this topic and everyone else that enjoy these braindead handouts instead of earning anything you won with this useless WoW gaming mentality of constant outdated cares faster than you can enjoy them.
I truly hope Blizzard steals their customers from FFXIV Yoshi P and SE gets burned the hard way for wanting to go this path with the game.
Its partially their fault and the FFXI players during the 1.0 days when everyone complained about not wanting another FFXI on these forums but yet we got Yoshi Ps FF WoW Version.
We have no one else to blame but ourselves. Its already too late I hope Yoshi P is proud of himself taking the enjoyment and ruining anything rewarding from everyone who actually gave a rats ass about wanting something to grind for in this game.
The heart of the game died out a while back and its all about business and making as much money as possible short time and thats why we are stuck with this FF in a WoW Clone. Nothing will change that until the customers in this disloyal group they are trying to cater too moves on to the next MMORPG.

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Originally Posted by Iromi

I notice people saying vertical progression game...does that not contradict their armory system that they so heavily advertise for this game?

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That has nothing to do with what vertical progression actually is or how it works...

Armor is class based MMO's anyway, so whether we were vertical or horizontal has no bearing on how the job system works in XIV.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Wat

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I'm not even going to attempt to translate this.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

. Its already too late I hope he is proud of himself taking the enjoyment and ruining anything rewarding from everyone who actually gave a rats ass about wanting something to grind for.

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I still don't see how you are upset over an OLD WEAPON QUEST? It is glamour fodder - you got to enjoy the grind (lol?) while it was a relevant, useful item. Don't worry, you can re-earn your special snowflake status soon enough. You will have a new relic to grind in 3.1, please look forward to it.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Again and again! Everything else in this game is a vertical progression. Just keep one lousy thing horizontal progression if possible. Its not really that bad to make you earn the relic compared to other weapons you can get in this game.
Its already gameover with this theory since Yoshi P already announced how the new questline will look and long story he short messed up anything that had to with the grind beeing enjoyable and rewarding for the relics.
Instead its a major handout and a slap to the face to exactly anyone who devoted time and spent millions of gils on this.
Thank you everyone that supported me in this topic and everyone else that enjoy these braindead handouts instead of earning anything you won with this useless WoW gaming mentality of constant outdated cares faster than you can enjoy them.
I truly hope Blizzard steals their customers from FFXIV Yoshi P and SE gets burned the hard way for wanting to go this path with the game.
Its partially their fault and the FFXI players during the 1.0 days when everyone complained about not wanting another FFXI on these forums but yet we got Yoshi Ps FF WoW Version.
We have no one else to blame but ourselves. Its already too late I hope Yoshi P is proud of himself taking the enjoyment and ruining anything rewarding from everyone who actually gave a rats ass about wanting something to grind for in this game.
The heart of the game died out a while back and its all about business and making as much money as possible short time and thats why we are stuck with this FF in a WoW Clone. Nothing will change that until the customers in this disloyal group they are trying to cater too moves on to the next MMORPG.

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It's always been about selling a product for a customer. If you believed otherwise then you've been deluding yourself for a long time.

This thread was never really about the relic, it was about reliving a dream that was XI... but that is dead now. I've made my points on this already so I'm not gonna rehash them.

Games are a business that need to cater to the majority of a playerbase... i'll let you figure it from there.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

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Man, did it really bite you in the ass when they asked in the survey, "Would you like us to make drastic changes to how the foundation of FFXIV works." and you clicked yes.

Just keep fighting the good fight, one day this game shall be renamed FFXI-2 and the world will be rebranded as Vana'diel HD exactly as you want.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Again and again! Everything else in this game is a vertical progression. Just keep one lousy thing horizontal progression if possible. Its not really that bad to make you earn the relic compared to other weapons you can get in this game.

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All this "Outrage" over something that isnt even released yet. Happens every time... I guess, its more entertaining to fear the worst than hope for the best.

Sounds like there was some info that I missed out on. Can anyone post a link to how the devs described the new relic quests and how the old one will interact with it? I think I'm missing some of these details that people keep mentioning.

To everyone who is intentionally thinking I want a new FFXI its not what i want im getting extremly tired of the same corny replies. Either you read all replies or just don't reply with half information. I want something in this game one lousy thing to just be enjoayble and rewardable grind wise. You guys have everything else just leave one damn piece of the cake for everyone else who wants to enjoy a grind. I can't beleive it sometimes. Let the relic be enjoyable you want it grind for it no handouts no bs no nerf get lights and dungeon drops like everyone else.

Honestly I just don't get it. I got my Zeta book, used it well into Heavensward and have it to glamour on all my future weapons so after two years i'm still getting a use out of my Relic. Plus we have a new grind right around.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

To everyone who is intentionally thinking I want a new FFXI its not what i want im getting extremly tired of the same corny replies. Either you read all replies or just don't reply with half information. I want something in this game one lousy thing to just be enjoayble and rewardable grind wise. You guys have everything else just leave one damn piece of the cake for everyone else who wants to enjoy a grind. I can't beleive it sometimes. Let the relic be enjoyable you want it grind for it no handouts no bs no nerf get lights and dungeon drops like everyone else.

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Your other topics say otherwise.

Basically: "I am not saying I want FFXI, but I want FFXI."

Speaking of which, I should try the new FFXI expansion in my free time, looks fun.

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Originally Posted by Iromi

Anyway I agree with some points made here, the relic is extremely underwhelming in this game. In 2.0, it was just used as something to help newbs and attempt to keep old content relevant. Relic in the Final Fantasy lore, was never something that held so little merit. I'd like to think we can all agree on that^^;

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The relics had lore written into them, have some very nice designs, and they were BiS at several points in 2.x.

If you find that underwhelming or of little merit, I'm not sure what to tell you.

So no, I don't agree with you at all.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

The heart of the game died out a while back and its all about business and making as much money as possible short time and thats why we are stuck with this FF in a WoW Clone. Nothing will change that until the customers in this disloyal group they are trying to cater too moves on to the next MMORPG.

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What you need to realize is that the market itself has shifted and changed with time. The generation of gamers that started out willing to do years long grinds for in-game items generally no longer has the time for that kind of commitment. Most of them have real life obligations of one sort or another to deal with. The newer generation of gamers is more of an instant-gratification crowd. So, with the majority of the grinders having no time to grind and the gimmie-now crowd never having wanted a grind in the first place, you have an atmosphere where a grind for what is now ultimately a glamour item just doesn't fit into the game that the devs want to present to us.

If there's one thing that sets FFXIV apart from FFXI it's the fact that it's very casual-friendly, which is something that's needed to survive in today's MMO market. People seem to like to villify the fact that SE is concerned with their bottom line, but they can't just put this game out here for us and expect nothing back in return. This game is a business venture. If it didn't make money, they wouldn't have kept it up and we wouldn't be here.

Ashkendor again: If everything is already casual friendly why not let the 1.0 players with the double subscriptions and most FFXI players (we all know FFXI funded this game during its darkest hours) have one lousy thing its just one thing. Don't touch the relics let them be. Let the new generation understand who the old farts used to play. Its really not that hard. You want something else? Learn the ex primals alexander or any other shenanigans that will give you a weapon with most likely the exact same ilvl. Why be greedy and want exactly everything as if what you so called casual have infront of them right now already isnt enough. I really thought the relics would continue and level up instead It was a huge let down and Yoshi P disrespected exactly everyone by nerfing it along the path.
You burn your brains out doing 1000 garudas before nerf. Or how about doing Stone vigil 44 times for a drop or spending 8+ million gil on getting the materias to hit. Where in anyones mind do they think they should get a handout for this or some retarded royalty treatment that just because they pay for a subscription they should get it for half the effort?
You want the relic do it like everyone else. These handouts are a messed up joke and a disrespect to me and many others who feel this way. These should have been untouched but this is what we get when a game dev comes directly from a WoW and DAoC envoirment. If you think about it its one lousy thing. You don't see me complaining about why there is no dynamis in this thread or why no other gears is upgradable. Ive accepted everything but I don't tolerate this.

The relic is the one thats most time consuming to get out of all the weapons that are the same ilvl as it denying that is beeing naive honestly (not directed to anyone). 3 weeks you can have an i200 weapon through esoterics there let the others who want an i200 relic burn their brains out for drops etc. Seperate the players a bit its not that much to ask. There is no need for this communism nerf gameplay.

@ Skizzle:

So the new relic will be basically handed to us? No grind involved? The old relic will have zero bearing on the new relic so it wont matter if we do the previous stages at all? and the new relic will not be the BiS with each successive upgrade step in the patches? Can you link to where they gave these details, cause I think I missed them. Or are you just building a straw man so you can tear it down over and over again to get some sympathy for being so persecuted? I'm just trying to understand, that's all.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

To everyone who is intentionally thinking I want a new FFXI its not what i want im getting extremly tired of the same corny replies. Either you read all replies or just don't reply with half information. I want something in this game one lousy thing to just be enjoayble and rewardable grind wise. You guys have everything else just leave one damn piece of the cake for everyone else who wants to enjoy a grind. I can't beleive it sometimes. Let the relic be enjoyable you want it grind for it no handouts no bs no nerf get lights and dungeon drops like everyone else.

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I fail to see how a player grinding out a relic several months after I've completed mine has any bearing on my enjoyment or sense of accomplishment of my own. The only thing that preserving the grind does is make it more difficult for a new player to accomplish it along with the newer, relevant content. The only thing that does, in turn, is make current relic holders the only relic holders, except a rare few that are willing to grind it in its entirety. I don't understand why that's what you want, the relic is inferior in every way to NQ white gear we obtain at higher levels.

We grinded the 2.0 relics for both appearance and performance. Now, only the appearance of those weapons is relevant, it's a raid worthy weapon that has become purely cosmetic. It makes no sense to have a grind in place that rewarded a powerful, relevant, and uniquely designed weapon when it's look is all that matters now. You'd be better served instituting a grind for a level 1 glamour that would never become invalidated because of something like ilevel.

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Originally Posted by MageBlack

@ Skizzle:

So the new relic will be basically handed to us? No grind involved? The old relic will have zero bearing on the new relic so it wont matter if we do the previous stages at all? and the new relic will not be the BiS with each successive upgrade step in the patches? Can you link to where they gave these details, cause I think I missed them. Or are you just building a straw man so you can tear it down over and over again to get some sympathy for being so persecuted? I'm just trying to understand, that's all.

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I wanna see this too. Only thing that has been said that Zeta owners are getting "consideration" for 3.1 relic.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

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I don't think at development meetings that they take into consideration FFXI players when making a decision nor have any reason to care. Despite what you believe, the team does not owe the FFXI community anything.