To everyone who says tanks shouldn't be able to meld Direct Hit

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Originally Posted by Ametrine

snipperoo

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I never said you, specifically, were bad. I was just saying that a reliance on tenacity is a bit weird, and shows the healers lack of skill or confidence. Healing is so ridiculously potent and damage is so low that tenacity should make barely a difference, if it makes any difference at all.

About wanting to deal high damage - just play a dps:
I want to be a healer, but I also want to push myself to do the most I possibly can. Since healing is such an easy job I fill in the space with damage. If I had to heal my ass off all the time I would maximize my healing just like I do with my dps.

I can do with with bad tanks and with good tanks, regardless of what their secondary stats look like. With a good tank l yes I will be able to DPS more, but I have never seen an actual tie between my dps and the amount of tenacity a tank has. CD rotations are the most important mitigation tools a tank has, so with a proper rotation any half decent tank (in half decent equipment) is a breeze to heal.

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Let me use expert here really quick. I've had 340's in full DH/STR melding be so much easier to keep alive than full 350 tanks that went all Tenacity. Why? Because the 340 used cooldowns and didn't stand in every last thing in the game.

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Trying to compare a competent tank in DH gear with an idiot in tenacity gear is not really making a fair argument for DH.

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Originally Posted by alimdia

I'm more curious about why is this thread here, that suggestion came from a JP player, not NA/EU.

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And? It was something that was actually brought up in the live letter, and if one person has those thoughts, who is to say that some people in other regions have that same thoughts? I'm more curious into why you think it'd 'just' be limited to Japanese players.

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Originally Posted by Ametrine

I do not like this facet of FFXIV's current job design and feel that there is evidence SE doesn't either, and that my personal, anecdotal experience towards defensive play is positive.

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This would probably be better spun off into its own thread. What the game is now is one thing, and what we'd like it to be in 5.0 (the next time an overhaul large enough to change this could realistically happen) are different things.

Wanting a more defensive focused game in 5.0 is great, but it doesn't really fit into a thread about banning tanks from using DH now, as right now that's just a band aid that does nothing to address the reason why people are doing that.

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Originally Posted by Ametrine

Yet, what amazes me is my WAR buddy has stacked his HQ crafted right and left set with a much Tenacity as the game would allow without losses has some of the best personal survivability of any tank I've ever seen. His personal healing skills are far more potent along with it bolsterimg his defenses and damage output.

So, it's very much the perfect stat booster for tank roles. He main tanks everything he can.

But only if you want to actually play like a tank and not a DPS with good defense like meta enforces.

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So you want less people to play tanks? Gotcha. Since it seems as if you are not happy with the current DPS focused meta which is fair, I suspect though if SE forced a more defensive play style by the removal of stats many tanks would simply not play tank.

Though even if they remove DH which I think currently only PLD melds DH the other two meld crit if I am not mistaken, been out of the tanking loop. So not sure what the removal of DH would accomplish.

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Originally Posted by Ametrine

Yet, what amazes me is my WAR buddy has stacked his HQ crafted right and left set with a much Tenacity as the game would allow without losses has some of the best personal survivability of any tank I've ever seen. His personal healing skills are far more potent along with it bolsterimg his defenses and damage output.

So, it's very much the perfect stat booster for tank roles. He main tanks everything he can.

But only if you want to actually play like a tank and not a DPS with good defense like meta enforces.

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Your friends with a guy who seems to be the ultimate guardian? I would be amazed too if I were friends with that guy!

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So you want less people to play tanks? Gotcha. Since it seems as if you are not happy with the current DPS focused meta which is fair, I suspect though if SE forced a more defensive play style by the removal of stats many tanks would simply not play tank.

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Let's be real here:

1) tanks are already the hardest to come by of the three roles
2) anyone who was really obsessed with outputting as much damage as possible would play... a DPS job.

I'm sure the primary reason a lot of them play tank is for the faster queues and "ins" on content, and this would not change if they forced tanks to be more turtley.

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Originally Posted by Awha

I suspect though if SE forced a more defensive play style by the removal of stats many tanks would simply not play tank.

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If you look at some statistics, tanks do about 80% of the damage a damage dealer deals. I really don't like that trend that you depend on healer and tank dps more and more to clear fights. Dps could have more damage for the loss of tank/healer damage...That are their "roles" after all...1 dead dps and then warrior will be over you in dps for the rest of the fight... We are getting close to the point where you can run with 7 warriors and be totally fine.

They could also change that all tank damages is derived from vitality instead of strength, while increasing the vitality damage modifier to compensate. Would stop excessive overmelding costs and substat question for rightside at least altogether.

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Originally Posted by Fynlar

Let's be real here:

1) tanks are already the hardest to come by of the three roles
2) anyone who was really obsessed with outputting as much damage as possible would play... a DPS job.

I'm sure the primary reason a lot of them play tank is for the faster queues and "ins" on content, and this would not change if they forced tanks to be more turtley.

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While anecdotal most of the tanks and healers that I know enjoy the role in FFXIV while despise the role in other games simply because they enjoy the DPS aspect. Granted I am sure the faster queues are bonus, I do wonder how many tanks would stick around if they were forced into a turtle play style outside of prog.

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Originally Posted by Commander_Justitia

If you look at some statistics, tanks do about 80% of the damage a damage dealer deals. I really don't like that trend that you depend on healer and tank dps more and more to clear fights. Dps could have more damage for the loss of tank/healer damage...That are their "roles" after all...1 dead dps and then warrior will be over you in dps for the rest of the fight... We are getting close to the point where you can run with 7 warriors and be totally fine.

They could also change that all tank damages is derived from vitality instead of strength, while increasing the vitality damage modifier to compensate. Would stop excessive overmelding costs and substat question for rightside at least altogether.

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What is wrong with a tank or healer being able to contribute meaningful damage while still performing their primary role?

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Originally Posted by Awha

if they were forced into a turtle play style outside of prog.

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You could make the stances permanent in combat, similar to WoW where you have the talentsystem with a dps and tank warrior. But people love their overpowered ability to switch between tank and dps build instantly/few secs here