Just got into a daily trial with several level 70s who didn't know to not stand right next to the main tank. 4 people were welcomed to cleave-city.
Just got into a daily trial with several level 70s who didn't know to not stand right next to the main tank. 4 people were welcomed to cleave-city.
I decided last night that it would be a GREAT idea to get more tomes by loading in trials. The screen goes black and then fades into that most dreaded of visages, Shinryu.
Aiiiiiieeeeeee!!
But then I notice that at least 5 group members are sitting there watching the cutscene.
AIIIIIIEEEEEEE!!!!
It turns out one skipped the cutscene quickly so it was actually 6. Of the 6, 2 were just on alts. So I was like, 'oh my god if you're actually new please speak up,' and it turns out that last 4 were genuinely new, including my co-tank.
You'd think this would turn out to be a horror show, but SPOILER it didn't, because the half of the group that knew the fight teamed up to spend at least 5 minutes explaining mechanics to the newbies, and at least one person was warning or reminding during the fight about certain mechanics (like water puddles during Hellfire, active time maneuver). As I told them in the beginning, I didn't expect us to clear first try but we would all try our hardest...
At this point I'll just point out that in my experience, the quality of your PUG's first time fight is very, very heavily dependent on a) the veterans being patient enough to sit and explain, b) the newbies being patient, eager learners who listen to the explanations and try their best to do it, and c) the explanations have to be good, concise, and pinpoint the parts of the fight that will give the most trouble.
Thanks to all the veterans of the fight who pooled our knowledge together (since I didn't remember everything, the fight has so many freakin mechanics) to explain, and to the newbies who did their best to learn, we cleared on the first attempt. It started getting kinda dicey at the end, but our DPS was on point whenever the tail hit the platforms, my newbie co-tank managed to stick next to me for most of the Ahk Morns, healers were on the ball, and we managed to pull off a first try clear.
Honestly I was kind of expecting to be at it for multiple tries so I was pretty happy we did it. Anyway if you were in that group last night, GOOD FREAKIN JOB! Because 2 were also on new alts, that meant only 2 members of the PUG were technically overgeared (since you can't get all that fancy Reach gear until after this fight) while the rest were...uh...likely close to minimum ilvl (didn't look). We did FANTASTIC! :D
Aery. Nice Dungeon, I like it a lot. I am on Tank, a friend is accompanying me as Black Mage. Someone is new, apparently the Healer - but he does great, and even bought Level 56ish Gear from vendors even if he would get some via MSQ later. Still, Mobs take forever to die, and I wonder. And then Nidhogg happens - DPS is way too low, you know how it goes, Add Phase is a disaster. I take a look around and notice the other DPS - a Level 57 Summoner, with Gear that... uh... he had parts of the Ironworks Gear, not augmented, the weapon was a iLvl 115 NQ one... and the right side... grey accs, 40 and below, and the crowning: the Ala Mhigan Earrings. One ring was blue and 50, rejoice - the Ironworks Tank Ring. As Caster. Alright, maybe he didn't know, I tell him - and while we wipe on the orbs not being destroyed in time, SMN decided to educate us that we are all wrong and Gear does not make a difference. Eventually, we cleared, but... just have some chat logs to leave an impression. I pity the poor group that gets him in the Vault.
The sad thing? He had a Level 70 Paladin.
Blue = BLM Friend; Green = Healer; Red = the fabled SMN
https://abload.de/img/chare5f7v.jpg
https://abload.de/img/chat17bf0n.jpg
https://abload.de/img/chat2d0eq9.jpg
https://abload.de/img/chat3k9iwv.jpg
I would hazard to say that at most, cap level gear from a prior expansion should only be taken 3 maybe 4 levels and no more than that. (3 levels for base cap IL gear and maybe 4 If the gear is upgraded) If anything stormblood shows the huge ramp up in stats between small item levels that do a wealth of good for you. (Which by the way, I can only wonder how IL 440 will look stat wise)
There really needs to be an IL requirement for all co-op duties, yeah, perhaps it'll gate people and it will require people to farm more gear for a little longer but it is always frustrating in a 4 man when a party member isn't up to par in gear. For roulettes, like the leveling roulette, it should have a floating IL requirement based off of your current highest level dungeon duty. It really breaks the ebb and flow of the game and if you're farming for glam or cards, (as I do) repeated instances of picking up slack can really bring down your experience.
On the matter of ilvl, I had a tank in Tam-Tara who used the left side Strife glamour set. He had the least HP in the party, including myself the BLM, and the healer. I stopped ripping instantly when I pointed it out to him and he started running OOM every pull spamming Flash, to the point I Mana Shifted him. Also Diversion and Lucid Dreaming on frigging cooldown.
His last words were "it was a breeze!"
Sure it was. You were carried. All my admiration to the healer who only let him die once, and even that was to something I'm pretty sure he could've avoided but didn't.
Remember that quest that said you had to have ilvl 5 before moving along? Good times.
I would have booted that Smn, personally, and not let them get a(nother?) pass on leveling content without learning such a simple basic of how the game works, but that's my jaded ass. This isn't Carry Fantasy, people.
Finally killed Savage Omega/O11s.
The way it happened was kinda funny though.
Due to a number of death's near the end DPS get's slowed down, and the boss is at about 0,1% HP when he finishes his enrage cast.
Everyone is all "NOOOOOOO!" in the chat as the screen goes black.
Then all of a sudden instead of the fight restarting the cutscene of the boss breaking down plays, so everyone is all "Wait what?" before bursting out laughing.
I can only speculate that he died to DOT's moments after wiping the group, but before the instance could reset itself, so the game registered it as a kill even though we were all dead.
Has anyone else here ever had this happen to them?
I know an FC mate of mine had it happen on A12s back in the day, Alexander kills them all, only to drop dead itself before the wipe registers.
Well its the nice variant of the old "i was out of the aoe but still died" game, happens, its just rare as the timing is hard...
Strangely... I have a happy ending story for once. I decided to queue up for leveling roulette on my 70 war and got gubal. Have a NIN, RDM, and a SCH. The catch here is that the scholar hasn't played in forever, didn't have any 52+ skills as noted by zero indoms and broils (had ruin instead), and spammed adlo to heal which was killing their mp. However we were understanding of their situation and actually gave out constructive advice. They were even thankful for said advice! I mean they died on the first book closing attack but the dungeon went smooth anyway (red mage took over any healing when required). I took pulls slow as to not overwork the SCH in their circumstances. Overall a happy ending.
Under normal circumstances I'd be losing my damn mind over how bad someone would be but I think they get a pass due not having played in ages. Always nice when people are open to constructive advice. This for me is rare. Godspeed rusty SCH!
Been one of those runs... had aggro problems out the wazoo, had to spend bosses in shield oath (and most of the final boss in shield oath + aggro combo spam), because we had a BLM that was just INSANE. On the final boss, since I had death debuff (got creamed twice in fairly quick succession), even provoke + shield oath aggro combo spam, I was losing aggro to the BLM. I asked for Diversion/Lucid, which I don't think they saw. They apologised after because they realised "Oh, I should have popped that". It's fine, it was the heat of battle and we scraped through without any wipes. But dang did that smash what little tank pride I had left into oblivion.
So I decided to finally attempt to tank for alliance raids. I'm on an alt character with only the Crystal Tower unlocked. It can't be that hard... can it?
We zone in. It's Syrcus Tower, and I'm in Alliance B which (by Japanese server etiquette) makes me the designated main tank for the raid. Oh dear.
I call out in alliance chat that I'm inexperienced, but don't get any responses.
First room was very messy and I wasn't really sure what was going on or which things I was supposed to be keeping hold of. I think the other tanks had the rest of the enemies, but I wasn't sure because I hadn't thought to check their names before we started.
At Scylla I start to get the feeling this might be a "new people" party. When the time comes for Ancient Flare, there's only one puddle in sight and what looks like only about three people in it. (Though must have been another one further outside of my view, because I didn't see any of my party lose health.)
Somewhere along the way, someone randomly marks presumably-a-friend with "Target to Ignore".
A DPS pulls one of the Azers while I'm waiting for everyone to arrive.
At Glasyas Labolas, people seem to be trying to do the correct-but-long-abandoned mechanics, and multiple people are stunned by the clockwork wrights.
Halfway through the Amon fight, one of the other tanks is suddenly marked as if they're the main tank. I still have Amon's attention. The other tank promptly dies.
As we make our way to Xande, the "person to ignore" target person is at it again. "X marks Y 'target to ignore 1'" ... "X marks Y 'target to ignore 2'" ... "X marks Y 'target to ignore 1'" .... back and forth ten times.
(During one of the 'starfall circle interlude' segments, I take the opportunity to turn off the marker. Because.)
Ancient Quaga is messy and half the party dies. Including myself the second time, because they were clustered together and I was trying to stand on the edge and not point him at the whole party.
I was just glad to get out of there.
It is known that in Alliance Raids you don't fight the Raid, you fight the Alliance.
I posted about a similiar thing a while ago. It wasn't quite a wipe (one warrior scraped through due to boosted HP) but it looked like one. 23/24 people got killed by Phlegethon's Ancient Flare - and then he died to my MCH time-delay bomb and the game counted it as a win. With everyone lying dead on the floor.
This one is more general one for me instead of a specific instance.
I've run so many bad Leveling Roulette runs, mostly in SB leveling dungeons, that gets to the point where even the Main Scenario Roulette is more time efficient to earn tomes from other Non-Expert Roulette sources for yours truly.
Put up a PF for Ramuh, Shiva, and Ravana EX unsynced for WT.
Didn't manage to even get past Ramuh because apparently "Kill the adds before attacking the boss" is some indecipherable message that only astrophysicists can hope to comprehend.
After three wipes at the exact same part, I disbanded the party. If you can't listen to instructions then waste someone else's time, please.
This is why anytime I get Ramuh EX as a WT duty, I just battle him solo unsynced at any of the 3 tank roles. Been doing it ever since I geared each of the tank roles to I350. I can grab orbs to get the buff, self heal via combos or abilieis, kill all adds during add phase, and beat Ramuh without much trouble. I cleared the duty in 4 minutes and 30 seconds to 5 minutes.
You would think after so many years each of RPGs and MMOs being a thing, people would know that standing in the fire is usually bad and killing adds is typically a must.
With those two fights, people don't understand, or seem to care, that pushing past a certain HP% will mean death for everyone. That's why I'd constantly tell people no DPSing Ifrit past 19% until the last set of nails is down, and no DPSing Ramuh past 66% until those first five adds are wasted (the lone sixth later on can be ignored), during the extreme versions. I'll let you guess how many people talked back to me about it, leading to yet more death, versus the times people do listen and we clear no problem.
That's what I wound up doing in the end.
I had a weird Ifrit WT party that wound up skipping the third Hellfire somehow. I was sure we were going to wipe, but Ifrit didn't even manage to get it off. I didn't know that was possible.
If he is in the middle of a cast of some skill, he will not use Hellfire until after that. It's just a theory, but maybe the trigger for him to cast hellfire occurred at the beginning of a cast and he died before it was finished, therefore the trigger was never resolved for a wipe.
Unfortunately, this happens when almost everything else can be brute forced through no problem. It's among the reasons I wish SE would stop nerfing older content just to speed people along. It encourages bad habits when they can easily ignore most mechanics.
You have a very small window to burn him down before he endlessly spams Hellfire if you ignore nails. I've managed it solo on both Samurai and Warrior but it's more or less lucky based.
It could have been worse. You could have found out that they were opening in diversion, and using it and lucid on CD throughout the fight. If ive taken those two steps, the only other way for me to drop hate is to stop attacking or die. And neither of those options benefit the run any. But dont let this be a blow to your ego. You met a good dps(a great one would have been using their enmity skills) who plays a class that outputs good damage. Now that youve seen(one version) what good dps looks like from a tanks perspective, youve got a great target to aim for as you improve. Hell, this is sort of like a game i play with a tank friend of mine from time to time. Ill go absolutely nuts and challenge him to keep up. If im not making him sweat, i need to be better - if he isnt keeping control, he needs to be better.
Another possibility. Once the final nails are finished you can immediately go into your full burn on Ifrit, even before he actually casts hellfire. If youre quick enough, he wont get the jump off and therefore wont even get to use his final hellfire(if he does jump, the nails being gone means its just the same weak hellfire regardless of any extra damage you did). The same works on Ramuh - after the arbiters are gone you dont have to wait for judgement bolt to attack, but he's still got most of his health so he'll get the cast off regardless.
You'd be surprised, Berteaux. People hardly pay attention to anything. They are in their own world of "muh sub" and won't move from there. -.- You see it with mechanics, skills, callouts, you name it. People don't care. This is why I second the motion of stop nerfing content. Brute forcing through creates bad habits like Bourne said. It's baffling for me when people say that, if you want efficiency, you must rely on PF (Sometimes) and not randoms. Such is the average skill level of our playerbase...
As a DF story.
Yesterday I was on my alt, and I decided to do 50/60. So I queue up as a tank because gil bonus and fast queues. I consider myself pretty competent when I play tanks, I know my stuff. We get Lost City of Amdapor.
After the barriers go down, I greet the party (got silence in return, how surprising), waited for protect and started pulling. So I use HG then Sentinel then Rampart+Bulwark... my HP was sloooowly getting depleted and no healing whatsoever. I died and asked the healer why I wasn't getting any heals, the lala SAM said "ur sh*t tank". I tell them that no, I'm an amazing tank but I wasn't getting heals. We pull again... dead. The lala insults me once again. I tell them that no, I'm a very good tank, but sadly I can't heal myself (not at level 50 at least!).
I minimize the amount of monsters I'm pulling and things were dying extreeeeeeeemely slow... heck, I was outdpsing them even spamming Total Eclipse. I nope'd and closed the game. I'm not dealing with that, so I decided fo finish the second season of Konosuba. Such a good anime... I feel empty now. :( 3rd season, when.
Last night I had a party that, while I appreciate them trying hard, it just made my brain melt.
Rolled Copperbell Hard on 50/60 roulette, party was pld, sam, blm and me as sch. There's no new player notice at the start, so I think okay, everyone knows what they're supposed to do. God I was wrong.
First boss went alright since normally the tank just drags all the adds to the end and we camp there until it's dead, but then I notice the sam only has one self-buff up at a time. We punch through and get to the second boss and everyone starts running around like headless chickens. I'm the only one that grabs the bomb to drop on the boss, and then one of them speaks up about not knowing the fight. I tell them to drag the bomb onto the boss, and after seeing me do it one of them gets the idea. We almost wipe because I'm forced to juggle healing, shielding, DoTing, and carrying the bomb, as well as dodging aoes. Somehow the blm and sam both die to self-destructs on the second boss, I manage to get them back up before the boss dies.
Apparently they were entertained by my res macro callout (I was inspired to change it after my friends and I were joking around in discord about another game one of them were playing).
We get to the final boss and I ask as to who's on worm rock duty. The pld then says it's the healer's job to deal with that mechanic. But if it's my job, then that means no healing or subpar healing from my fairy, and judging from how much healing I had to use on the tank and entire party, this was going to hurt hard. The sam and blm said they didn't know the fight either, despite having obviously run this before. If I was whm or ast, this part would've been easy. Sch has a harder time doing this.
I've honestly never seen a 50 boss take so very long to kill in a while. Third rock I grabbed I thought I was in the sand, apparently the game decided to troll me and it blew up in my face, almost killing me. I went to go grab another rock when everyone got sucked in by the worm and one-shot the sam. I'm now scrambling to get her back up when the pld dies. I'm struggling to get the tank back up when my fairy goes poof, and while I get the tank back up, then the sam, the blm dies. The last 10% of the fight was spam healing and shielding as half my healing is gone. I get the blm back and he immediately lbs and finishes off the boss.
While I got all three comms, that party should not have made my brain melt so badly.
It's been a 50/50 shot since 4.4 of getting tanks who are i385 and higher pulling expert dungeons one...pack...at...a...time...
It's not due to bad heals, the healers are usually dpsing nearly the entire time, but when there are 2 aoe dps, you are sufficiently geared and you are pulling 1 pack at a time...
They probably thought the tank could heal themselves or literally carry the party, to which SE will gladly smack them in the balls for even assuming. Though the dpsing healer sounds like the one I had a while back in Longstop, only they've gotten worse from the sounds of it.
No, he was most likely defending his healer friend when I asked them "Why I wasn't getting any heals?". The healer was standing idle, looking at me as my HP was slowly getting depleted. Even when I pulled less next time, idle... a cure I from time to time. No DPS at all.
What he said didn't offend me at all, I was impressed by the nerve of saying such thing after his healer friend didn't do anything related to their job.
I wasn't even direspectful, what I typed there is exactly what I said. I wanted to know what happened and got silence in return and this insult on his end. I didn't feel like report them either, so... closed game, anime time. I feel bad for the tank replacement they may have gotten after that.
I've noticed this on runs I do as a healer too. I can understand if its their first run that they're pulling slower, but when they've done the place before and still go ultra-slow it feels like such a slog. If I go as WHM, its always a slow tank, and if I go on WAR, its a zero-DPS, pre-pull Regen healer and/or DPS who don't know what Diversion & Lucid are. I've gotten to where I just wait the couple minutes on the tank queue (because Aether DC is weird like that most days) vs healing most times because at least then I know it'll be wall-to-wall pulls, even if its hell to grab everything because of the healer.
Its the same with the older dungeons like Swallow's Compass & Hells' Lid too. There's a massive difference when I go as WHM and end up with a slow tank vs. going as WAR and pulling everything. The older uncapped dungeons especially need pretty much zero healing outside of a couple pulls or tankbusters. I can't count the number of Regens I've cancelled in recent times just to keep the healer from insta-pulling everything.
So I did Pagos today (because I enjoy being tortured) and found myself as the party leader for a train group (we tried to do other things and even the high level bunny FATE, which gives decent and frequent exp by the way. 100k for failing and 200k for clearing at level 30 and it respawns pretty quick. Better than 500k every 30-60+ minutes). Group was making its way to Brothers and because Pagos is a layered monstrosity, people fell to the wrong ledge.
A healer and myself were trying to figure out ways to get the tank in our group on the wrong ledge to ours. What we eventually wound up doing was grabbing a Haunt, then the tank would buff the healer/provoke mob and then hope it would climb up to them and then kill 'em. It didn't, but the healer had another idea. Rescue! Tank was pulled from their ledge and down into the abyss (dying because they had hate), but I was still able to Raise them back up (after carefully positioning myself so I could actually Raise them to the ledge and not fall down myself). Brothers didn't spawn for another 10+ minutes after, but hey. We saved someone a lot of time/stress.
Ran a couple of expert dungeons to grab some gears for my sub classes. Before starting the run, I kindly asked people if I could get gears for tanks and ninja and some people agreed, others stayed silent. Later on the silent ones greed all tanks, aiming and scouting gears, when themselves having iLvl 370 or above.
sighs
Whilst it's annoying to loose a roll, they're still in their right to do so. They didn't even say yes.
For mine: I got Shinryu the other day for trial roulette. Nothing bad happened, but it still feels weird seeing how quickly he dies since there isn't ilvl sync there. Still catches newbies with first tidal wave but the two in my group picked it up fine after that.
Recently had someone like this in a level 70 dungeon. My friend I went in with made a joke about how the paladin didn't seem to like tanking, which upset him enough to leave. Before leaving he made a comment about not liking pulling more mobs, so he's had people question him about it enough before. There's being careful and pulling small, and then there's purposefully not taking mobs to a gate so both can be aoed down. The replacement tank showed up halfway us killing Zenos and he just sat outside cheering us on. The replacement tank got a free clear and the mount drop too. I try to be the good conscience but sometimes my friend fires off those comments before I can stop him. I would still rather have a tank that pulls slowly and holds agro than a drunk one who moves erratically and can't find their stance.
It’s been quite some time since I last had a reason to use this thread.
Yesterday for weeklies reset, one of my runs in Alphascape 3.0 had a questionable moment. I sign up as a PLD and get Alphascape 3.0. I zoned in, the barrier didn’t drop right away. After a bit, it became obvious that the WHM is a newcomer to the fight. (Complete with the message flash) The battle starts and, for the most part, goes pretty well. The WHM dies a few deaths to the Larboarding and Starboarding and once to something else. (Not too surprising. That part confused me on my first attempt too) This made me feel a bit sorry for the SCH, who was mostly solo healing at this point. (And was doing a VERY good job of it)
I also noted that a DPS had died a few times as well. But I didn’t think much about that... until near the end of the battle where the said DPS suddenly chimes in with this quote:
“I hope these healers never set foot in savage. They’re so terrible.”
That triggered me and I feel I should have said something, but I didn’t at the time. In fact, no one did. Not even the amazing SCH, who never died once BTW and kept more then half the party alive in the battle. That SCH kept me going through those Mustard Bombs and the WHM has the excuse of being new to the fight, but was obviously trying to survive while figuring out how the battle works. (I was getting Cures, Regens, and WHM shielding as needed, when the WHM was alive anyway)
But that DPS dude goes and calls them both bad anyway. Someone clearly needs to grow up and learn how to dodge Omega’s pew pew lasers. The good news out of this is that just a few more runs later, I got my Armored War Lion mount. (Yay!) Guess I’ll work on DRK’s next, since I already have a little over 100 runs already recorded on my DRK on the achievement list.
While I’m here, this is now an old post to be responding to, but I’m going to anyway...
I felt all 3 of my Tank jobs cringe at once reading that. What sort of Tank goes and stands in every AoE possible, then blames everyone else!?
/soothe
Guys, guys, one little question here:
Do u know the new tendency of random AST to not buff the pty and use the cards only for them or just use "draw" but doing anything with the card?
O______O <--- my face these days doing roulettes