Is There a Way to Make Eureka [b]Not[/b] Suck?

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Originally Posted by RexArtis

I'm not missing the point.
You are continuing to complain about something that you simply don't know well.
Plus: you are just wining and wining and crying without showing the facts that support this theory of yours that Eureka is a bad instance.
I am replying to you because I do it for a content that I (and many many others) love, while you are only demonstrating ingnorance on the topic.

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"Don't understand". Yes because "grind X mobs to spawn a FATE" is such a complex mechanic. "Oh but there's an elemental wheel that bolsters your attack or defense depending on your element as opposed to the enemy's". So complex. Please.

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Originally Posted by Joven

"Don't understand". Yes because "grind X mobs to spawn a FATE" is such a complex mechanic. "Oh but there's an elemental wheel that bolsters your attack or defense depending on your element as opposed to the enemy's". So complex. Please.

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You are now talking about complexity... Did you know that simple things could be the most challenging?

Example: draw a perfect circle by free-hand. Can you do that now? No. You need skill.

Plus: you are mentioning just two of the many mechanics of Eureka.

See you at the Logos Manipulator and at The Baldesion Arsenal.

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Originally Posted by RexArtis

You are now talking about complexity... Did you know that simple things could be the most challenging?
Example: draw a perfect circle by free-hand. Can you do that now? No. You need skill.
Plus: you are mentioning just two of the many mechanics of Eureka.
See you at the Logos Manipulator and at The Baldesion Arsenal.

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So now it takes skill to mindlessly kill mobs to spawn a FATE? Who knew? Maybe you just mean it takes skill to navigate the over crowded map without pulling unwanted mobs? Maybe.

I would love to see you at the Logos Manipulator and Baldesion Arsenal, but first I have to deal with the mindless slog and that's where the roadblock is. If you were paying attention you would understand that.

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Originally Posted by Joven

but first I have to deal with the mindless slog and that's where the roadblock is.

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Unfortunately, "mindless slog" is kind of what the devs intend for it to be.

Not just from a design standpoint (it's meant to emulate FF11's levelling experience), but marketing as well (grinds exist to tie you to the game, let's be real).

So I doubt there's going to be much changing that.

Not saying that you're wrong in feeling that way. I WISH they had done a lot more with these areas. But I feel like SE just made it clear what they wanted out of it, and they don't really tend to go back to old content and make it any better. At least, not without a complete overhaul.

Plus, it doesn't factor into any gameplay part anymore, as it's its own isolated thing.

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Originally Posted by Midareyukki

Unfortunately, "mindless slog" is kind of what the devs intend for it to be.

Not just from a design standpoint (it's meant to emulate FF11's levelling experience), but marketing as well (grinds exist to tie you to the game, let's be real).

So I doubt there's going to be much changing that.

Not saying that you're wrong in feeling that way. I WISH they had done a lot more with these areas. But I feel like SE just made it clear what they wanted out of it, and they don't really tend to go back to old content and make it any better. At least, not without a complete overhaul.

Plus, it doesn't factor into any gameplay part anymore, as it's its own isolated thing.

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Having played FF XI, they didn't even emulate the leveling experience too well. Or anything else for that matter. As I said before, all it is, is glorified Fate grinding and very little more than that.

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Originally Posted by Joven

So now it takes skill to mindlessly kill mobs to spawn a FATE? Who knew? Maybe you just mean it takes skill to navigate the over crowded map without pulling unwanted mobs? Maybe.

I would love to see you at the Logos Manipulator and Baldesion Arsenal, but first I have to deal with the mindless slog and that's where the roadblock is. If you were paying attention you would understand that.

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No, it doesn't take skill but attention and study. You failed also to mention that the mobs you are talking about must be killed at certain weather conditions too (and in certain areas yes, you need a lot a skill).

You are again showing ignorance on the subject.

Just for you to know: I am paying a lot of attention. I am in fact destroying each one of your "points".

And this is a fact.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

Having played FF XI, they didn't even emulate the leveling experience too well. Or anything else for that matter. As I said before, all it is, is glorified Fate grinding and very little more than that.

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That much is true. I mean, let's face it, even if you don't go out spawning NMs in FF11, you also won't be pulling in so many mobs all at once, even with a party. That's an almost sure-fire way of getting you killed.

Issue is, FF14 isn't FF11, no matter how much the devs insisted on trying to approximate the two in Eureka. The reason why it failed to properly emulate the experience is because 14's own nature won't allow for the same sort of system. So they did 'whatever' with it: make mobs take long to kill and yield little experience while also removing experience and levels should you die to them.

The fate grind was to try and replicate the NM system. But FATEs aren't NMs, and the way they did it led to FATE trains. Even I at the time said as much: "lol they wanted to make it FF11, but it doesn't work. This isn't how FF11 played like, this is just FF14 trying to force itself to look like 11 and failing at it".

So yeah. I totally understand that yes, it IS a glorified fate grind area and nothing more. It's just that the leading principle behind making these areas was trying to copy old-style MMO experiences.

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Originally Posted by RexArtis

No, it doesn't take skill but attention and study. You failed also to mention that the mobs you are talking about must be killed at certain weather conditions too (and in certain areas yes, you need a lot a skill).

You are again showing ignorance on the subject.

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Oh, I'm so sorry I missed an arbitrary mechanic.

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Originally Posted by RexArtis

Just for you to know: I am paying a lot of attention. I am in fact destroying each one of your "points". And this is a fact.

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https://imgur.com/vymGv8Z

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Originally Posted by Joven

Oh, I'm so sorry I missed an arbitrary mechanic.



https://imgur.com/vymGv8Z

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You missed a lot more than that.

Laughing posting an old meme won't change anything.

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Originally Posted by RexArtis

You missed a lot more than that.

Laughing posting an old meme won't change anything.

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I can't speak for zones I haven't been in yet and I'm not trying to.

It's not meant to change anything. Just to show how ludicrus your statement is.

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Originally Posted by Midareyukki

Unfortunately, "mindless slog" is kind of what the devs intend for it to be.

Not just from a design standpoint (it's meant to emulate FF11's levelling experience), but marketing as well (grinds exist to tie you to the game, let's be real).

So I doubt there's going to be much changing that.

Not saying that you're wrong in feeling that way. I WISH they had done a lot more with these areas. But I feel like SE just made it clear what they wanted out of it, and they don't really tend to go back to old content and make it any better. At least, not without a complete overhaul.

Plus, it doesn't factor into any gameplay part anymore, as it's its own isolated thing.

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I just wish there other things to focus on. Maybe have FATEs that aren't reliant on killing mobs to spawn regularly.

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Originally Posted by Joven

I can't speak for zones I haven't been in yet and I'm not trying to.

It's not meant to change anything. Just to show how ludicrus your statement is.

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You can try stopping making useless statements so, and actually play the game.

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Originally Posted by Joven

I just wish there other things to focus on. Maybe have FATEs that aren't reliant on killing mobs to spawn regularly.

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I personally feel like if the dev team is going to take cues from Ivalice, they should have learned from the mechanical aspects of FF12's sidequests. Where interacting with the environment and doing specific things caused changes that unlocked specific things. But no, we just got "Kill X mobs to spawn Y fate", with the treasure chest idea being relegated to bunny fates. Where instead of recycling the treasure maps we have, we instead recycled the code for the Aether Currents for some reason.

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Originally Posted by RexArtis

You can try stopping making useless statements so, and actually play the game.

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So which one are you again? The pot or the kettle?

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Originally Posted by RexArtis

You can try stopping making useless statements so, and actually play the game.

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https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...6352838029.png

I "love" digging up this picture...

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Originally Posted by Joven

So which one are you again? The pot or the kettle?

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Not the pot, nor the kettle. I am Rex Artis.

Update: I am in Eureka and I just dropped two Happy Bunny Triple Triad cards in a row. That is hilarious and really ROTFL-ing.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

Okay, but the requests thus far have been quite explicitly and specifically just to (A) have more to do outside/between the grind and (B) to undo the limitations that, seemingly intentionally, broke the ability for players to support one another despite larger level gaps (which becomes an inevitability as the content's player counts dry up).

No part of that asked for less, nor for it to lose any of its unique components or to be any less diverse.

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I agree with B). The issue is that people ask for more thing to be added to avoid grinding, aka avoiding to do the content in the intended way. You're suposed to grind mobs, that the point of Eureka. LEveling is part of the challenge.

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Originally Posted by Kaurhz

A friend cannot reasonably help you unless they are within your level range (or vice versa), or unless they are willing to de-level themselves. This is a large contributory part of why people dislike Eureka, as they is nothing that actively facilitates this, bar when you can level sync on FATE and burn things down - Even then you get approx. 3 minutes at best for every spawn.

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You can start bagging their tags, you can spawn NMs for them so that the former starts being more and more effective. You can give them Logograms

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Originally Posted by Rein_eon_Osborne

1. Flat plain zones means you don’t need to take detours to avoid certain obstacles to reach XYZ locations.
2. After being exposed to the bs that Anemos threw, I had more or less developed that ‘preparedness’ thinking “I know SE gonna put something to make me pull my hairs off lol.” so I was less surprised by the time I reached Pagos. It was also the place where I learned mobs have different types of aggros which also mostly applies in Pagos.
3. Can you trade/MB them? The only outlier to this was the T-Rex mount and that’s it—it also appeared in one of the past mogtome event. Everything else can be bought via MB. If people who find the contents annoying realizes there’s a workaround, they will attempt that.

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1. God forbid you waste 45 more second to reach next fate in worst case. It not like it had some big mountain that blocked your path and turned the thing into a mess (Like Yanxia before you unlock flying.)
2. Anemos has no bs to threw at you. You don't even need to mind mobs agros and you can alway sprint away from mobs if you agro to many or even just dodge high level mobs with mount. The bs start on the following zones and onward.
3. You can trade most of the thing, but if you rather spend 100K gil and + on each glams instead of doing like, 5 FATE, you do you.

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Originally Posted by Joven

I just wish there other things to focus on. Maybe have FATEs that aren't reliant on killing mobs to spawn regularly.

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Eureka doesn't need the one thing about it that encourages people to actually work with each others in the zone in getting fates to spawn changed.

Eureka has it's problems, but not being a copy of how Bozja works isn't among them.

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Originally Posted by FireMage

You can start bagging their tags, you can spawn NMs for them so that the former starts being more and more effective. You can give them Logograms

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Again, there should be something more fluid that actually allows people to play with each other, without the level disparity effectively being "I'm going to carry you through Eureka" - I can say peoples' mindset towards this is very mixed, I've had people put off Eureka because it effectively feels like they aren't playing nor contributing equally with the party until around Level 17, and then this completely resets again in Pagos and Pyros and Hydatos.

Just give a system that allows people to downscale their own level according to the people they wish to play with. without unnecessarily punishing themselves by intentionally dying to do so. Is that really a difficult request, or difficult to understand for that matter?

The most ironic part is people in this thread constantly chirping on the nonsense of Eureka supposedly meant to be a hardcore, call to the days of old with MMOs pure grinding random monsters in the field, yet there's no system that actively facilitates this unless you want to cheese as FATE for 2 1/2 minutes, and even then the players' sole contribution to this is dealing 204 damage, whilst people cheesing are dealing damage tenfold of that.

Doesn't really make for a fun nor engaging system, does it?

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Originally Posted by Kaurhz

Again, there should be something more fluid that actually allows people to play with each other, without the level disparity effectively being "I'm going to carry you through Eureka" - I can say peoples' mindset towards this is very mixed, I've had people put off Eureka because it effectively feels like they aren't playing nor contributing equally with the party until around Level 17, and then this completely resets again in Pagos and Pyros and Hydatos.

Just give a system that allows people to downscale their own level according to the people they wish to play with. without unnecessarily punishing themselves by intentionally dying to do so. Is that really a difficult request, or difficult to understand for that matter?

The most ironic part is people in this thread constantly chirping on the nonsense of Eureka supposedly meant to be a hardcore, call to the days of old with MMOs pure grinding random monsters in the field, yet there's no system that actively facilitates this unless you want to cheese as FATE for 2 1/2 minutes, and even then the players' sole contribution to this is dealing 204 damage, whilst people cheesing are dealing damage tenfold of that.

Doesn't really make for a fun nor engaging system, does it?

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No such system needs to be made, Eureka is fine as is. Learn to make friends?

yes don't play it.

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Originally Posted by FireMage

No such system needs to be made, Eureka is fine as is. Learn to make friends?

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I see the point of the post went over your head like the other with an abysmal reading comprehension.

Congratulations, allow me to reiterate, making friends is not the issue. The issue is friends are routinely punished and inconvenienced by such a system given they cannot pair up with friends that aren't equally leveled without either inconveniencing themselves or by playing Eureka in the most boring and unengaging way possible.

Such a system does need to be implemented and if you cannot see a reason why, and deliberate attempts to try and misconstrue the premise of the post then I don't really see a productive debate coming from this.

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Originally Posted by Kaurhz

I see the point of the post went over your head like the other with an abysmal reading comprehension.

Congratulations, allow me to reiterate, making friends is not the issue. The issue is friends are routinely punished and inconvenienced by such a system given they cannot pair up with friends that aren't equally leveled without either inconveniencing themselves or by playing Eureka in the most boring and unengaging way possible.

Such a system does need to be implemented and if you cannot see a reason why, and deliberate attempts to try and misconstrue the premise of the post then I don't really see a productive debate coming from this.

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I'm not debating you, as the word presumes you have a point worth merit. You don't, I am informing you

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Originally Posted by FireMage

I'm not debating you, as the word presumes you have a point worth merit. You don't, I am informing you

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Yet you have deemed your time and the point worthwhile enough to respond several times, seems like you're contradicting yourself there.

This condescending nonsense may work with others, but not here. Either stop contradicting yourself or stop replying. I would say it's that simple but then it might be difficult for you.

Perhaps you just like the attention? That's simultaneously cute and cringeworthy, well done.

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I see the point of the post went over your head like the other with an abysmal reading comprehension.

Congratulations, allow me to reiterate, making friends is not the issue. The issue is friends are routinely punished and inconvenienced by such a system given they cannot pair up with friends that aren't equally leveled without either inconveniencing themselves or by playing Eureka in the most boring and unengaging way possible.

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Why do you feed the troll?

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Originally Posted by Kaurhz

Yet you have deemed your time and the point worthwhile enough to respond several times, seems like you're contradicting yourself there.

This condescending nonsense may work with others, but not here. Either stop contradicting yourself or stop replying. I would say it's that simple but then it might be difficult for you.

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I'm not contradicting myself at all. You are in need of education. You are welcome

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Originally Posted by FireMage

I'm not contradicting myself at all. You are in need of education. You are welcome

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You should stop looking in the mirror here. It's not really healthy.

You insist the posts are not worth merit, and similarly have no point yet you're insistent on wasting your time replying.

You are trying to assert one thing, yet your actions are completely contradicting this. There's your first lesson.

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Originally Posted by Magikazam

Why do you feed the troll?

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It's a great way to discover new heuristics and hone debating skills.

What can I say, I'm a sucker for it.

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Originally Posted by Kaurhz

You should stop looking in the mirror here. It's not really healthy.

You insist the posts are not worth merit, and similarly have no point yet you're insistent on wasting your time replying.

You are trying to assert one thing, yet your actions are completely contradicting this. There's your first lesson.

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I'm not looking into a mirror, if I was I'd have brought up a bunch of bad ideas. You're welcome for the education

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Originally Posted by FireMage

I'm not looking into a mirror, if I was I'd have brought up a bunch of bad ideas. You're welcome for the education

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I see you weren't fully capable of refuting your contradictory behavior, that's ok.

I won't charge you standard rate tuition fees. I'm feeling really charitable since you're in need, clearly.

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Originally Posted by Magikazam

1. God forbid you waste 45 more second to reach next fate in worst case. It not like it had some big mountain that blocked your path and turned the thing into a mess (Like Yanxia before you unlock flying.)
2. Anemos has no bs to threw at you. You don't even need to mind mobs agros and you can alway sprint away from mobs if you agro to many or even just dodge high level mobs with mount. The bs start on the following zones and onward.
3. You can trade most of the thing, but if you rather spend 100K gil and + on each glams instead of doing like, 5 FATE, you do you.

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1. I'm not saying they should do away the obstacles. I'm just stating how Anemos felt off putting to me personally on my original post and those are one of them.
2. YMMV. At the time I entered Anemos for the first time, I had very minimal understanding about the mobs aggro. How they aggro, is it sight? is it sound? is it magic? is it low health? is it level related? If so, how much is the diff? Can I just outrun them while taking 1-2 hits while still surviving? (hello, traversing Pazuzu cave as a lv19) When none of these details really matters outside Eureka, having all these suddenly been thrown at once was the 'bs' that crushed me back then. Half a year later when I came back more prepared, they weren't all that bad after all. By the time Pagos came to light nothing seems so surprising anymore because "infuriates you" feels like the general vibe of the content, in overall sense. In fact, thanks to Anemos, all 3 later zones feels nothing like 'bs' anymore. It's nothing that you haven't seen before.
3. I'm not sure what glam piece that will costs you 100k per piece outside the field dressing because everything else have been crashing hard, pretty much down to 50k or as low as 1g per piece, which is just a drip in the downpour of gil the game offers you daily. Is this a DC specific thing?

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Originally Posted by RexArtis

Not the pot, nor the kettle. I am Rex Artis.

Update: I am in Eureka and I just dropped two Happy Bunny Triple Triad cards in a row. That is hilarious and really ROTFL-ing.

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So Pot it is.

Um, yay? Good for you I guess? To me that just sounds like that card has a decent drop rate and will be easy to get once I get to that area.

On a side note: while I hate the idea of snooping on someone, but my curiosity got the better of me and I took a gander at your Lodestone. Imagine someone without a single level 90 to his name trying to lecture me about being "prepared" for fights. Also judging by your gear all you do is Eureka. Like, have you ever done an EX fight?

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Originally Posted by Kaurhz

I see you weren't fully capable of refuting your contradictory behavior, that's ok.

I won't charge you standard rate tuition fees. I'm feeling really charitable since you're in need, clearly.

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Oh wow, you didn't even do unnerfed Eureka looking at your achievements. Yikes. You wouldn't have lasted in Stormblood

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Originally Posted by Joven

So Pot it is.

Um, yay? Good for you I guess? To me that just sounds like that card has a decent drop rate and will be easy to get once I get to that area.

On a side note: while I hate the idea of snooping on someone, but my curiosity got the better of me and I took a gander at your Lodestone. Imagine someone without a single level 90 to his name trying to lecture me about being "prepared" for fights. Also judging by your gear all you do is Eureka. Like, have you ever done and EX fight?

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Aren't you like a graylet?

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Originally Posted by FireMage

Oh wow, you didn't even do unnerfed Eureka looking at your achievements. Yikes. You wouldn't have lasted in Stormblood

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Bold of you to assume I haven't had older characters. Similarly, I wouldn't expect this level of critical thinking to be in your grasp, that's OK though.

Try again.

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Originally Posted by Joven

[...]On a side note: while I hate the idea of snooping on someone, but my curiosity got the better of me and I took a gander at your Lodestone. Imagine someone with no level 90s to his name trying to lecture me about being "prepared" for fights. Also judging by your gear all you do is Eureka. Like, have you ever done and EX fight?

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There are actually folks who repeatedly creates new alts to replay Eureka over and over after they finished doing so on their main. Whether it's to complete all 15 weapons to Physeos stage or just to have fun in BA. They typically do these alts' MSQ or buy the story skip up to StB and nothing more, simply to unlock and re-experience Eureka.

After seeing dozen of Eurekan addict having at least 6 alts, all have completed enough Baldesion Arsenals to amass 2 or more stacks of Eurekan Fragments with full elemental gears for multiple roles in my DC, I wouldn't be surprised to see more of them out there lol.

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Originally Posted by Rein_eon_Osborne

There are actually folks who repeatedly creates new alts to replay Eureka over and over after they finished doing so on their main. Whether it's to complete all 17 weapons to Physeos stage or just to have fun in BA. They typically do these alts' MSQ or buy the story skip up to StB and nothing more, simply to unlock and re-experience Eureka.

After seeing dozen of Eurekan addict having at least 6 alts, all have completed enough Baldesion Arsenals to amass 2 or more stacks of Eurekan Fragments with full elemental gears for multiple roles in my DC, I wouldn't be surprised to see more of them out there lol.

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That's, disturbing, to say the least.

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Originally Posted by Hafu

Eureka doesn't need the one thing about it that encourages people to actually work with each others in the zone in getting fates to spawn changed.

Eureka has it's problems, but not being a copy of how Bozja works isn't among them.

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Except Bozja is a copy of Eureka, only improved.

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Originally Posted by FireMage

Aren't you like a graylet?

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Beats being a brainlet, but hey, you seem to be doing well for yourself regardless.

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Originally Posted by Joven

Beats being a brainlet, but hey, you seem to be doing well for yourself regardless.

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Literally the same thing, since you can't play without being carried. Poor taste and poor play? Oof, I'd uninstall out of shame