Do you tease lalafells?

Lalafells don't make me want to violate the Geneva convention, so they are fine. FemRoe on the other hand...

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Originally Posted by Fyrebrand

I think you need to be careful making certain kinds of jokes, especially around people you don't know. Even though you have good intentions, all the person on the other end gets is text with no tone of voice or mood. They only know some random stranger decided to single them out and make them the center of attention, which can be uncomfortable or intimidating even when they know it's a joke. I can certainly imagine them thinking "Why is this person making fun of my character?" And if you keep it up with multiple comments throughout the dungeon, that can naturally evolve into "What is this person's problem with me!?"

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This. It's a perfect stranger making jokes at someone else's expense. And the general feeling in this thread is that said person just has to put up with being the butt of their joke because they want to tell it. But they don't have to do that. They can find it tired or unfunny or inappropriate. And they're not being uptight or a party pooper when they do so. They're asserting what their boundaries are.

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

This. It's a perfect stranger making jokes at someone else's expense. And the general feeling in this thread is that said person just has to put up with being the butt of their joke because they want to tell it. But they don't have to do that. They can find it tired or unfunny or inappropriate. And they're not being uptight or a party pooper when they do so. They're asserting what their boundaries are.

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Apparently us having boundaries is deemed highly problematic by the community. If we don't go along with the joke we're 'uptight' or 'need to go outside'.

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Originally Posted by xxmiamorecadenza

Apparently us having boundaries is deemed highly problematic by the community. If we don't go along with the joke we're 'uptight' or 'need to go outside'.

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I don't want to get ultra-serious but those are the same sort of things I hear as a woman about "locker room" types of jokes.

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Originally Posted by xxmiamorecadenza

Apparently us having boundaries is deemed highly problematic by the community. If we don't go along with the joke we're 'uptight' or 'need to go outside'.

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I mean in this case I do think most reasonable people would view this as a silly issue boardering on uptight.

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

I don't want to get ultra-serious but those are the same sort of things I hear as a woman about "locker room" types of jokes.

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Agreed. It doesn't matter how minor or harmless it is. If someone is bothered by it, no matter their personal reasonings behind it, you should stop out of respect for that person.

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Originally Posted by Awha

I mean in this case I do think most reasonable people would view this as a silly issue boardering on uptight.

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It's annoying. It's akin to a fly. A common house fly is harmless in a lot of ways. It can be easily avoided by going into another room or going outside of your house. But it doesn't change the fact that it's an irritant and you likely want to be rid of it.

That's how I view the jokes. They buzz their same old buzz and it's bothersome.

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Originally Posted by xxmiamorecadenza

Agreed. It doesn't matter how minor or harmless it is. If someone is bothered by it, no matter their personal reasonings behind it, you should stop out of respect for that person.



It's annoying. It's akin to a fly. A common house fly is harmless in a lot of ways. It can be easily avoided by going into another room or going outside of your house. But it doesn't change the fact that it's an irritant and you likely want to be rid of it.

That's how I view the jokes. They buzz their same old buzz and it's bothersome.

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Normally I do not see people voicing their annoyance towards said fly in a public space they either kill it or ignore it for the most part.

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Originally Posted by Awha

Normally I do not see people voicing their annoyance towards said file in a public space they either kill it or ignore it for the most part.

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Yet the jokes are often made in 'public' spaces. In parties, shout chat or in social settings in general such as Discord. The people making the jests are interacting with other people and likely expecting a response.

So that's why, in voice chat for example, if someone were to say they wanted to 'punt me' or that 'i'm a little evil creature' I'm going to respond appropriately - which is by telling them to 'stop'.

Yet the behavior persists regardless. And it's considered acceptable and even encouraged.

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Originally Posted by Awha

Normally I do not see people voicing their annoyance towards said fly in a public space they either kill it or ignore it for the most part.

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Well yes, some kill (report) them. Some ignore them.

But flies don't really value their "life" anyways. So no need to cry about them.

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Originally Posted by xxmiamorecadenza

Yet the jokes are often made in 'public' spaces. In parties, shout chat or in social settings in general such as Discord. The people making the jests are interacting with other people.

So that's why, in voice chat for example, if someone were to say they wanted to 'punt me' or that 'i'm a little evil creature' I'm going to respond appropriately - which is by telling them to 'stop'.

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Point remains if someone refers to your character as an evil creature and that annoys you to the point where you need to voice concern when one could have easily just ignore the annoyance. Then do not get shocked people call you soft or uptight. Cause generally such comments are easily seen as jokes and nothing more.

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Originally Posted by Ranaku

Well yes, some kill (report) them. Some ignore them.

But flies don't really value their "life" anyways. So no need to cry about them.

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Let us be real as mentioned in other posts if people walked around in fear of the ToS players would not be able to do much of anything since the ToS is so vaguely written depending on the GM an action can be seen as nothing or something.

Though yeah people can report people for what they want though reporting someone for established memes are soft.

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Originally Posted by Awha

Point remains if someone refers to your character as an evil creature and that annoys you to the point where you need to voice concern when one could have easily just ignore the annoyance. Then do not get shocked people call you soft or uptight. Cause generally such comments are easily seen as jokes and nothing more.

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If having personal boundaries makes me 'soft' or 'uptight' then I'll happily be viewed as such.

I've dealt with being called 'soft' and 'uptight' in the military because I didn't tolerate jokes made at my expense as a black woman.

So I'll keep on keeping on.

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Originally Posted by xxmiamorecadenza

If having personal boundaries makes me 'soft' or 'uptight' then I'll happily be viewed as such.

I've dealt with being called 'soft' and 'uptight' in the military because I didn't tolerate jokes made at my expense as a black woman.

So I'll keep on keeping on.

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"Black women" eh I willing to bet it had less to do with that and more so had to do with the personality. Just the "black women" was the attribute they choose to make jokes about.

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Originally Posted by Awha

"Black women" eh I willing to bet it had less to do with that and more so had to do with the personality. Just the "black women" was the attribute they choose to make jokes about.

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Seeing as they were racial jokes. Yeah, it was.

I call Minion a Shorty Shorty Short-Short and I ask him how the bugs are doing.

I also remind him I could probably swallow him whole and it wouldn’t even count as a snack.

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Originally Posted by Awha

"Black women" eh I willing to bet it had less to do with that and more so had to do with the personality. Just the "black women" was the attribute they choose to make jokes about.

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Awha, I'm gonna tell ya, just stop there. I know you don't get why this bothers people. But you need to stop there.

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

Awha, I'm gonna tell ya, just stop there. I know you don't get why this bothers people. But you need to stop there.

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I'm sure he wants me to share the entire story about how I was treated by my chain of command and then spin it to make it look like it was entirely my fault.

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

Awha, I'm gonna tell ya, just stop there. I know you don't get why this bothers people. But you need to stop there.

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May I ask why? The reality is that context matters if I got upset everytime someone made a joke at the expense of my personality and picked a attribute of mine to mock I would have a head full of grey hair.

Sometimes a joke is just a joke and often people read too much into it.

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Originally Posted by xxmiamorecadenza

I'm sure he wants me to share the entire story about how I was treated by my chain of command and then spin it to make it look like it was entirely my fault.

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Nah the fault is not on you that they made the jokes but yeah I will say the fault is on you for getting offended. I come from a military family I get how messed up officers can be especially when it comes to pranks and jokes I have heard enough tales.

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Originally Posted by Awha

Nah the fault is not on you that they made the jokes but yeah I will say the fault is on you for getting offended. I come from a military family I get how messed up officers can be especially when it comes to pranks and jokes I have heard enough tales.

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It's my fault for getting offended by racially derogatory remarks made toward my race as well as my gender by a bunch of older men who are all my superiors.

Okay.

I guess the best thing for me to have done in that scenerio is keep my head down, keep my mouth shut and pretend to think it's acceptable.

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Originally Posted by xxmiamorecadenza

It's my fault for getting offended by racially derogatory remarks made toward my race as well as my gender by a bunch of older men who are all my superiors.

Okay.

I guess the best thing for me to have done in that scenerio is keep my head down, keep my mouth shut and pretend to think it's acceptable.

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From anecdotal stories yeah to a degree. It seems they went harder on those that showed they were visibly upset. Especially if they were your CO, in the end you cannot control the actions of others but you can control how you let said actions impact you on a personal level.

Not saying what they did was right but given the boomer mindset that in the military not much else you really could have done expect show it bothered ya or just ignored it.

Just saying this from the stories I have heard at the dinner table and yeah military pranks and jokes are rough.

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Originally Posted by xxmiamorecadenza

It’s a tired joke that’s a little bit irritating since it’s typically made at our expense. I’m not offended. I’m just annoyed at the same joke being lobbed at me for the 100th time.
It’s boring. Can y’all do something new? Say something fresh?

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Something fresh ? I don’t know what you expected.
I ate lalafells since I dunno 2015 ? and I kept eating them until today.
Its my daily routine, Its what I’ve been doing and I can assure you I’m not gonna stop.

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Originally Posted by Awha

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It's interesting to note that based off your words you have a very weak grasp of how the military functions.

I did do something in response to those jests - despite you likely disapproving of any course of action against them - because after half a year of dealing with my company I utilized the 'open door policy', spoke with my SGM and got them into trouble while getting a transfer to a company that actually treated me well. And if I could rewind time? I'd have done it way earlier and I would've gotten IG involved.

The moral of the story is that if you're uncomfortable or irritated that you should voice your concerns. It's just that simple.

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Originally Posted by Awha

Let us be real as mentioned in other posts if people walked around in fear of the ToS players would not be able to do much of anything since the ToS is so vaguely written depending on the GM an action can be seen as nothing or something.

Though yeah people can report people for what they want though reporting someone for established memes are soft.

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Established memes, huh? I would rather say NA humor that originated from a culture of trolling and shitposting + having the need to feel superior by making fun of others.

It seems what you all are really mad about is not that jokes aren't allowed. It's more that there are rules preventing you from bringing your 4chan troll lifestyle into a game that should be neutral ground. A bit sad but i am out of here for now.

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Originally Posted by xxmiamorecadenza

It's interesting to note that based off your words you have a very weak grasp of how the military functions.

I did do something in response to those jests - despite you likely disapproving of any course of action against them - because after half a year of dealing with my company I utilized the 'open door policy', spoke with my SGM and got them into trouble while getting a transfer to a company that actually treated me well. And if I could rewind time? I'd have done it way earlier and I would've gotten IG involved.

The moral of the story is that if you're uncomfortable or irritated that you should voice your concerns. It's just that simple.

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As mentioned my experiences are anecdotal but the stories I heard from my family they laughed when others tried to pursuit punishment as they like to say it depends on the hook or hooks you have. I have seen them jest about some horrible shit and some still serving. Complaining may work for some but it easily could have back fired on you. I have lived with high ranking military boomers their views are dated but their reach is massive. Glad it worked out for you but if we are being honest can you really say that is always the case for those that speak up?

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Originally Posted by Awha

As mentioned my experiences are anecdotal but the stories I heard from my family they laughed when others tried to pursuit punishment as they like to say it depends on the hook or hooks you have. I have seen them jest about some horrible shit and some still serving. Complaining may work for some but it easily could have back fired on you. I have lived with high ranking military boomers their views are dated but their reach is massive. Glad it worked out for you but if we are being honest can you really say that is always the case for those that speak up?

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The military has its issues. S*xual assault, for example, can have people who brings it up meeting some form of backlash.

But that doesn't mean someone should just lay down and accept their abuse.

It's important to speak up and speak out - or nothing ever changes for the better.

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Originally Posted by Ranaku

Established memes, huh? I would rather say NA humor that originated from a culture of trolling and shitposting + having the need to feel superior by making fun of others.

It seems what you all are really mad about is not that jokes aren't allowed. It's more that there are rules preventing you from bringing your 4chan troll lifestyle into a game that should be neutral ground. A bit sad but i am out of here for now.

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Trust me the ToS does not stop me from me saying what I want to say in game if I get banned so be it.

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Originally Posted by xxmiamorecadenza

The military has its issues. S*xual assault, for example, can have people who brings it up meeting some form of backlash.

But that doesn't mean someone should just lay down and accept their abuse.

It's important to speak up and speak out - or nothing ever changes for the better.

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From where I am sitting at dinner and galas nothing will ever change in any meaningful way.

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Originally Posted by Awha

From where I am sitting at dinner and galas nothing will ever change in any meaningful way.

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And seeing as you're not in the military - nor are you even former military - your perspective means next to nothing.

All you have is secondhand information and dinner talk.

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Originally Posted by Awha

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Imagine trying to invalidate the first-person lived experiences of someone you don't even know, with second or third-hand stories from the "dinner table" and "galas."

https://i.imgur.com/0ZNENBU.jpg

We're getting into some borderline "GamerGate" style dog whistles and gaslighting, here.

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Originally Posted by xxmiamorecadenza

And seeing as you're not in the military - nor are you even former military - your perspective means next to nothing.

All you have is secondhand information and dinner talk.

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Sure my personal perspective means nothing but let me ask do you honestly believe things in the military will change for the good in any meaningful way because pd whistleblowers and those that speak out? I am sure for every positive outcome for speaking out you would find many more that do not work out so well that lead to further abuse, gaslighting, manipulation, and sometimes even suicide.

Sure all I have is second hand talk but that second hand Talk and how freely many are about speaking about such behavior does reinforce that stuff will nor change in any meaningful way as long those in power maintain that power.

As mentioned I am sure you are aware of how prevalent sexual assault is and how often it falls on deaf ears due to semantics.

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Originally Posted by Fyrebrand

Imagine trying to invalidate the first-person lived experiences of someone you don't even know, with second or third-hand stories from the "dinner table" and "galas."

https://i.imgur.com/0ZNENBU.jpg

We're getting into some borderline "GamerGate" style dog whistles and gaslighting, here.

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When you are surrounded by people that make games out of how far they can push people due to their position of power you do become jaded over the aspect of change. Especially when they laugh at the attempts to go "public" the reality is the military does have problems with things like racism, and sexual assault amongst other things but unfortunately it does go unpunished and at times those that do report are treated worse off for it.

It is sad positive outcomes for abuse and assault are not always the norm when it comes to the military especially when it comes to women.

When I first tried the game orignally I thought lalafells were a joke much like gnomes in wow. The more I played though I realized how adorable they are and my two favorite main characters are lalafells(Krile and Tataru). Tataru's excited/anxious animation make me giggle every time.

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Originally Posted by Awha

Sure my personal perspective means nothing but let me ask do you honestly believe things in the military will change for the good in any meaningful way because pd whistleblowers and those that speak out? I am sure for every positive outcome for speaking out you would find many more that do not work out so well that lead to further abuse, gaslighting, manipulation, and sometimes even suicide.

Sure all I have is second hand talk but that second hand Talk and how freely many are about speaking about such behavior does reinforce that stuff will nor change in any meaningful way as long those in power maintain that power.

As mentioned I am sure you are aware of how prevalent sexual assault is and how often it falls on deaf ears due to semantics.

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Yes it does change things. The implementation of the SHARP program came about because people spoke up. I've seen people face Article 15's because of their behavior.

Change is a slow and gradual thing.

Do you think women gained their rights after just a few years of speaking up?

Were the rights of minorities gained in a few measly years because folk decided to speak up?

No.

It took time and for a lot of brave people standing up despite the consequence of standing up for themselves.

Silence allows for abusers to reign without fear of their awful actions. And I will never tell a victim to keep their mouth shut.

But of course, you seem to be pro accept the status quo and tolerating abhorrent behavior that physically and mentally ruins vulnerable men and women in the armed forces.

Which is genuinely disgusting.

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Originally Posted by xxmiamorecadenza

Yes it does change things. The implementation of the SHARP program came about because people spoke up. I've seen people face Article 15's because of their behavior.

Change is a slow and gradual thing.

Do you think women gained their rights after just a few years of speaking up?

Were the rights of minorities gained in a few measly years because folk decided to speak up?

No.

It took time and for a lot of brave people standing up despite the consequence of standing up for themselves.

Silence allows for abusers to reign without fear of their awful actions. And I will never tell a victim to keep their mouth shut.

But of course, you seem to be pro accept the status quo and tolerating abhorrent behavior that physically and mentally ruins vulnerable men and women in the armed forces.

Which is genuinely disgusting.

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I am more sure it sucks but I am sorry I do not buy into the report it and justice will happen cause that is not always the case. As people we have very little say in what another person does or how they treat another person and even less say in how a people will view how others view another.

You say it is disgusting cool I rather be that then dream in some fantasy world that systemic bias, bigotry, racism etc . . . Will ever go away. The reality is sure the needle moved a little over the last 100 years for many movements but yeah still sort of suck.

Point remains consequences are still a factor and until they are not people will be less likely to speak up which is why I say I do not see things changing in any meaningful way. Especially when such behavior is normalized to a degree.

As humans riddled with our own biases we will always find a means to abuse power and mock others. Maybe if we can change that I will buy into the notion that things will change. I just doubt it cause we are clever beings we will always find a way to abuse something or someone we want to abuse.

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Originally Posted by Awha

words

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You're advocating for complacency.

To me your words are translating to 'yes, you were violated severely and that was wrong. but if you fight back against your violator you'll only be hurt far worse than you are now. leave it behind so that the violator can move on with their lives and you can move on with yours.'

You're telling us to do nothing. If someone refers to me as a slur I should accept that because 'well, racism has always existed, so it's okay if that person calls me the n-word. i should just ignore it.'

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Originally Posted by xxmiamorecadenza

You're advocating for complacency.

To me your words are translating to 'yes, you were violated severely and that was wrong. but if you fight back against your violator you'll only be hurt far worse than you are now. leave it behind so that the violator can move on with their lives and you can move on with yours.

You're telling us to do nothing. If someone refers to me as a slur I should accept that because 'well, racism has always existed, so it's okay if that person calls me the n-word. i should just ignore it.'

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As mentioned glad it worked out for you but that is not always the case. Generally what I am saying is people should do what is best for them first and foremost, not just in that moment but also down the line. You did what you felt was right and cool but for many others that is not the case and for change to happen more people would have to speak up and face potential consequences for doing so and I do not think we should be promoting that people should risk their careers and lives on the promise of change when we cannot guarantee such things. Though not saying you are doing that.

Though yes I will say when it comes to verbal slurs I do fall into the camp of okay so what. I do also fall into generally people give far too much power to words and people would be better off if they did not take it personally.

Though hey if others want to try and change the world one complaint at a time cool fighting the system is just not my style I will just do me and move on with life, life is far too short and can end far too easily to try and write the wrongs that have plagued or world for years and probably will still plague our worlds for many years after I am gone.

Sounds like Awha is from Sharlayan. Let us do nothing and watch the world and people burn!

But the fact is, people can change. Look at Europe. We loved to just slaughter and be at war with each other. And nowdays? We unified into something that can compete with the USA or any other global player. Cause people spoke up. Took action. Made something real which half a century ago would have been exactly that, a dream/fantasy.

But it's wasted time to talk to people like you. If you turn a blind eye on everything you are just as guilty.

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Originally Posted by Awha

Though yes I will say when it comes to verbal slurs I do fall into the camp of okay so what.

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The reason why I won't 'okay, so what' to certain slurs is because of the historical context of them. I was raised to never accept being referred to as such because of how my family's respective line was treated.

I get it. To you, some of that stuff is all in the 'past' so 'why should we care'.

Well I most certainly care about how my people were and are treated so I'm never going to 'okay, so what' to that word or others of its ilk.

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Originally Posted by Ranaku

Sounds like Awha is from Sharlayan. Let us do nothing and watch the world and people burn!

But the fact is, people can change. Look at Europe. We loved to just slaughter and be at war with each other. And nowdays? We unified into something that can compete with the USA or any other global player. Cause people spoke up. Took action. Made something real which half a century ago would have been exactly that, a dream/fantasy.

But it's wasted time to talk to people like you. If you turn a blind eye on everything you are just as guilty.

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I mean watching the world burn would be anything but boring so I could get down with that.

Though glad you think people can change I do ot have such faith in humanity.

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Originally Posted by xxmiamorecadenza

The reason why I won't 'okay, so what' to certain slurs is because of the historical context of them. I was raised to never accept being referred to as such because of how my family's respective line was treated.

I get it. To you, some of that stuff is all in the 'past' so 'why should we care'.

Well I most certainly care about how my people were and are treated so I'm never going to 'okay, so what' to that word or others of its ilk.

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I get that but way I see it how can we move forward with any meaningful speed if we are are constantly looking behind us. Many horrible things happened in the past but that was in the past, not saying this towards you but I have found far too many people let the past define them.

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Originally Posted by Awha

I get that but way I see it how can we move forward with any meaningful speed if we are are constantly looking behind us. Many horrible things happened in the past but that was in the past, not saying this towards you but I have found far too many people let the past define them.

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Do you know why we let a good chunk of our history represent us from my perspective, Awha?

Because we don't have much else when it comes to our respective identities. I can't just pop myself into 'ancestors.dot.whatever' without reaching a hard dead end because we were taken onto ships generations back and that portion of our identity was thoroughly smeared. Our history is muddled and we've lost touch with our respective roots. So Black History Month is meant to represent the leaps and bounds we've made since. And a lot of that history involved slavery and the civil rights movement. We built ourselves up from the bottom and we're still building.

So it's not that easy to just 'toss away the past' and forget a word used to hurt us ever since we arrived in North America.

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Originally Posted by xxmiamorecadenza

Do you know why we let a good chunk of our history represent us from my perspective, Awha?

Because we don't have much else when it comes to our respective identities. I can't just pop myself into 'ancestors.dot.whatever' without reaching a hard dead end because we were taken onto ships generations back and that portion of our identity was thoroughly smeared. Our history is muddled and we've lost touch with our respective roots. So Black History Month is meant to represent the leaps and bounds we've made since. And a lot of that history involved slavery and the civil rights movement. We built ourselves up from the bottom and we're still building.

So it's not that easy to just 'toss away the past' and forget a word used to hurt us ever since we arrived in North America.

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Tbh from my end it is kinda easy but maybe it is because I am only half or because I have ancestors on both sides of the line. Though yeah I will never get letting the past or colour of ones skin define them. I have no real attachment to my ancestors or blood be it the slaves or slave owners.

I am my own person people want to call me whatever great that is on them I know where I stand.

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Originally Posted by Awha

Tbh from my end it is kinda easy but maybe it is because I am only half or because I have ancestors on both sides of the line. Though yeah I will never get letting the past or colour of ones skin define them. I have no real attachment to my ancestors be it the slaves or slave owners.

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Seeing as you have no 'faith in humanity' and don't care if abusers are punished or not, your stance is generally unsurprising.

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Originally Posted by xxmiamorecadenza

Seeing as you have no 'faith in humanity' and don't care if abusers are punished or not, your stance is generally unsurprising.

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It is not that I do not care I just do not think the potential consequences are always worth the outcomes when it comes to standing up against abusers especially when it comes to things like verbal slurs.

More or less when it comes to verbal abuse I to do not think the risk is worth the reward. Though if that means I do not care so be it, I rather just not let it get to me far easier to control own perception of a word.