Can't make a full premade for Crystal Tower...

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Originally Posted by ashikenshin

yup, "if I can't do it with my FC, noone can! waaaawwaaaahh"

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OUt of 127 responses to this thread only 3 people are defending the decision SE made. But since Ashikenshin seems to be the most vocal I award you this coveted award:

http://imageshack.us/a/img198/7932/kpz1.jpg

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Originally Posted by Shikiseki

I think it'll be interesting , you need all teams to succeed to proceed - egoism will get you nowhere xD

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I think you meant egotism.

I play with random and new people all the time. Hell, I helped a random person's NM Garuda with a friend because they were struggling and just because. That I can't queue up with more than 8 people means that people in my guild who aren't doing coil with us will either have to displace one of our other members or continue to have other people watch from the sideline. I'm not sure if I'd even go in with a full 24 since my guild doesn't have that many truly active players. 24 man content through the DF made me think this was something I could do to play with people who aren't in my 8 man group, but didn't require me filling all 24 slots.

Feel the way you want, but I don't think that all people are upset about this because they'll have to leave their bubble. I think some people, like me, are disappointed because this seemed like something you could do with a bunch of your friends that you might not do coil with. Believe it or not, this actually makes the 8 man bubble worse. It doesn't help at all.

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Originally Posted by Phe

no please - explain it to me.

how ON EARTH can it be more complicated and more time consuming to program an alliance feature while programming the whole freaking Crystal Tower?

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They have barely pulled off the implementation of the UI for 24-man groups (it still looks a bit questionable). Clearly something is posing problems for them with the full implementation of a 24-man group.

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Originally Posted by Phe

no please - explain it to me.

how ON EARTH can it be more complicated and more time consuming to program an alliance feature while programming the whole freaking Crystal Tower?

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Mechanics, overlay, UI interface, PEt interaction, Priority system, Loot system, random distriubition system, hate mechanics, other features..

oh wait, you thought that this would only be the crystal tower? The entire game would be affected by a new system involving more than 8 people.

They could have gated it using some kind of token system to allow for groups to form a token at the enterance to CT I guess, but then you would have griefers who sit at the gate, ruin your party of 3, and then just do jack-all to ruin your day.

So Earth was explained to you, Cyrstal tower has existed for a long, long, long time. So eh.

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Originally Posted by ashikenshin

yup, "if I can't do it with my FC, noone can! waaaawwaaaahh"

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Yes, until SE let us play this game the way we want, with the people we want to play with.

idc if we have to spend hours leaving the DF, our FC want to play together.

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Originally Posted by Belzeboss9

CT should be full FC! Thats why FC exists anyway, to play with your friends!

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I agree. An awful lot of people have been basing their FC size around doing alliance content, 8 people plus a load of pickups is not what everyone had in mind.

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Originally Posted by Jowy

I agree. An awful lot of people have been basing their FC size around doing alliance content, 8 people plus a load of pickups is not what everyone had in mind.

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It'll come, oh it'll come.

In the meantime, Hell yeah Crystal Tower! More than 8 people doing something that you can actively see! Woo!

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Originally Posted by KHShadowrunner

Mechanics, overlay, UI interface, PEt interaction, Priority system, Loot system, random distriubition system, hate mechanics, other features..

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how are these things different from a duty finder alliance compared to a pre-made one?

i'm only talking about this feature:

building an alliance on myself and not with duty finder.
they can limit the alliance feature to this dungeon.

bad design decision to be sure, but who cares its level 80 gear, meh

I know myself and my free company are pretty disappointed to not be able to do the 24 man content in groups larger than 8. We were really looking forward to doing Crystal Tower as a free company and now.....we can't. I hope they either add the alliance feature in or allow you to queu with two other groups of your choosing thru the same server party finder.

Since you cant enter without a premade 8 at minimum, You would only ever be grouped with OTHER premade 8s.
So 9 times out of 10, you will enter with 2 other FC crafted groups. Sometimes you'll enter with a RevToll shout group.

The issue with queuing as a 24 man alliance is likely due to the current cap of 8 players to a Party. They probably want a create a proper UI for forming such a group, or to limit it to Alliance only content.

Wasn't the Crystal Tower useless, because it only drops level 80 gear? Then everyone is making a huge deal of it?
MMORPG forums, I guess.

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Originally Posted by Phe

okay i guess i have to ask more detailed.
i'm only talking about this feature:

building an alliance on myself and not with duty finder.
they can limit the alliance feature to this dungeon.

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I fail to see what's different from my reply.

For example:

Let's say you form an alliance of 24 people. Before entering the CT, your white mage casts protect.

Who gets the buff?

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Originally Posted by Yurikitty

OUt of 127 responses to this thread only 3 people are defending the decision SE made. But since Ashikenshin seems to be the most vocal I award you this coveted award:

http://imageshack.us/a/img198/7932/kpz1.jpg

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dude, they are adding the stuff later on! it's not like this is going to stay this way. Can't you people wait? are you that impatient?

Some people are so blinded by the rage that they take this as a decision to make it this way, and not a decision to include it this way for now. They even stated that. It's not ready YET for full pre-mades.

But forget about me, I want to see you cry some more.

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Originally Posted by Ri_ri

Wasn't the Crystal Tower useless, because it only drops level 80 gear? Then everyone is making a huge deal of it?
MMORPG forums, I guess.

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because crying in forums is in vogue

"LFM CT full gear 80+, exp. 9/24"

They want to avoid that.

Edit: BTW, make 3 groups of 8, click the DF on the same time... magic happens. If it doesn't put you with the two other groups, just do the run or leave, then try again.

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Originally Posted by KHShadowrunner

I fail to see what's different from my reply.

For example:

Let's say you form an alliance of 24 people. Before entering the CT, your white mage casts protect.

Who gets the buff?

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only one party.
it's all the same like outside the dungeon until you enter it.

different alliance mechanics only inside CT.
just building it outside.

I don't think it matters too much. This is the casual content gear up an alt job that you don't take to coil or have myth gear for. Its not like the serious hard core end game. Yoshi already said that this would be for the casual players. Most of the people complaining about it already run coil and have no need for this zone on their mains.

Its more like the I am bored I think I will queue up for this to run my alt job.

With that in mind, I could see a system where you use a sort of token-based way to enter the CT as a full alliance. So say you have 3 groups of 8, the Ldr of group 1 sends a request to the leader of group 2, and this creates a token. Ldr of group 1 or two, having been marked as having the token, send a request to the ldr of group 3. The 3 leaders can then select to enter the tower, and the game waits for all 3 to accept the request before beginning the dungeon.

But hten how does it handle individual group members being AFK? (you'd assume this isn't a problem, but pre-mades aren't all FC members)

And could you create the system to know that there's just 2? (Yes.)

I'm not saying there aren't ways. I'm just saying it'll come in due-time.

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Originally Posted by Phe

only one party.
it's all the same like outside the dungeon until you enter it.

different alliance mechanics only inside CT.
just building it outside.

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But see, A full party is 2 Light parties. If the WHM of light party 1 casts protect, it hit's all 8 members. So why would it not hit all 24 members of an alliance? And if it's all the same like outside, how are you properly connected so that it recognizes you as an alliance?

These are the things that would need to be worked out. And it wouldn't be just in the 'alliance zone', it would need to exist outside of this.

Again, I can think of at least one way to do it. But I dunno what the repercussions would be of doing it that way.

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Originally Posted by Fyce

"LFM CT full gear 80+, exp. 9/24"

They want to avoid that.

Edit: BTW, make 3 groups of 8, click the DF on the same time... magic happens.

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Who cares if people make premades with particular gear requirements? It doesn't affect you; you can still queue by yourself or with likeminded friends. As for your "solution" - it doesn't work for dungeons now when trying to replace, say, a tank who dropped; it won't work for CT.

Not allowing more than 8 people to queue at a time is absurd. Once again, Squeenix proves they have only about 3/4 of the necessary understanding of the MMO market in just about everything they do.

LFM Fate party 22/24

I think it might boost xp for fates :P

Pre-made parties are not subject to the retry timer if they leave an instance. This will lead to frustration due to many parties starting and leaving until they get paired up with their own people and SE will eventually need to change it.

Yet again SE is cutting corners... This was certainly the most dissappointing comment in the live letter today and it certainly is a let-down for me. Come on SE, if you are going to add alliances, do the full job, not half of it.

I was really banking on CT being a way to bring larger group content events to our FC and then they pull this on us. I know they say they'll make it possible in the future, but we've already been splintered off into Coil statics for so long, I'd love the opportunity to dig into some content with a larger pool of FC members.

Please Yoshi reconsider your stance on this, it's very disappointing to say the least.

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Originally Posted by Molly_Millions

Pre-made parties are not subject to the retry timer if they leave an instance. This will lead to frustration due to many parties starting and leaving until they get paired up with their own people and SE will eventually need to change it.

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They already are going to change it in 2.2. Its just that queuing with alliances isn't ready in 2.1.

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Originally Posted by Zumi

They already are going to change it in 2.2. Its just that queuing with alliances isn't ready in 2.1.

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That doesn't mean the scenario I laid out won't happen. It will. A lot.

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Originally Posted by Ri_ri

Wasn't the Crystal Tower useless, because it only drops level 80 gear? Then everyone is making a huge deal of it?
MMORPG forums, I guess.

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Never cared about the gear coming from CT. I care about how much fun I'll have doing it and how many people I'll have to tell "sorry, we're full" for a 24 man dungeon when we have only 8 people. Not sure why your first thought would be to value CT by what kind of gear drops from it. MMO players, I guess.

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Originally Posted by ToraFomalhaut

I was really banking on CT being a way to bring larger group content events to our FC and then they pull this on us. I know they say they'll make it possible in the future, but we've already been splintered off into Coil statics for so long, I'd love the opportunity to dig into some content with a larger pool of FC members.

Please Yoshi reconsider your stance on this, it's very disappointing to say the least.

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This guy gets it.

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Originally Posted by Naunet

Not allowing more than 8 people to queue at a time is absurd.

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Do you really need, right now, to be able to have a full 24 player premade raid to crawl a casual dungeon?

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Originally Posted by Molly_Millions

That doesn't mean the scenario I laid out won't happen. It will. A lot.

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I doubt it because most hard core people won't want to get 24 people together to do a casual dungeon for lvl 80 gear. Most of my coil group doesn't even want to touch CT because it drops worse gear then coil, except for the run it once to see how it is, and the few who want to gear up alts jobs. Also it might not count as a premade because there is now 24 people in the group so you may still get the penalty even if you queue with 8.

I guess im of the few that is not in a big enough free company to set up 24 man raids. This atleast gives smaller FCs a chance at this content.

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Originally Posted by Zumi

I doubt it because most hard core people won't want to get 24 people together to do a casual dungeon for lvl 80 gear. Most of my coil group doesn't even want to touch CT because it drops worse gear then coil, except for the run it once to see how it is, and the few who want to gear up alts jobs. Also it might not count as a premade because there is now 24 people in the group so you may still get the penalty even if you queue with 8.

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Do you not see the number of people in this thread saying they want to do CT with their FC? It's going to happen. This is the only content that a medium or large FC can rally around aside from housing.

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Originally Posted by ToraFomalhaut

I was really banking on CT being a way to bring larger group content events to our FC and then they pull this on us. I know they say they'll make it possible in the future, but we've already been splintered off into Coil statics for so long, I'd love the opportunity to dig into some content with a larger pool of FC members.

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Yeah, I was really looking forward to CT, because we could treat it as a fun team-building event for the whole FC, as we have something like 2.5 groups of 8. Now? Not looking forward to it at all. Huge mistake on SE's part.

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Originally Posted by Ranzan

I guess im of the few that is not in a big enough free company to set up 24 man raids. This atleast gives smaller FCs a chance at this content.

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You'd have a chance regardless, because the thing is queueable.

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-d-GL69PWLL...Bobby-Hill.gif

Complete rubbish this one.....
Seriously considering tossing this game where it belongs, in the garbage....
Such a shame too. This could be the best game ever MMO wise, but small party sizes (4/8) instead of (5/20 or 6/18) and face roll progression is killing this game.

Don't know why I even play MMO's anymore. It looks like the Days of FFXI/Evercrack/Vanilla Wow and a game actually being challenging are gone. No more are epic adventuring worlds full of danger. Now you just fate bash your way to 50 and face roll content and get cookies, Lots of cookies.

I'm sick of cookies. I want a main course thanksgiving feast.

The duty finder is toxic. Forcing people to play with 16 people they don't know when they have enough people ready and geared to run Two CT's.... Why oh why.

MY FC is going to TANK when they see this, it will just implode. We have 6 BCB Groups which is enough for 2 Crystal Tower Groups... Guess all 6 groups get to que alone.

gotta like the attitudes if you're not part of my fc i want nothing to do with you! grrr lol stop being selfish, its a mmo for a reason to play with other people even the people in your fc were strangers before be nice hang out with your fellow 14 players.

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Originally Posted by Fyce

Do you really need, right now, to be able to have a full 24 player premade raid to crawl a casual dungeon?

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Do we really need free company in this game then? Why not just remove the whole FC system then if they want to focus on 8man x3 for 24 man duty finder. What's the point of allowing FC to even be larger than 8 man size if we are getting forced into groups of 8 for almost everything endgame.

Might as well just trash the whole system and force everyone into a linkshell if they don't want to prioritize FC gameplay.

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Originally Posted by Musashidon

gotta like the attitudes if you're not part of my fc i want nothing to do with you! grrr lol stop being selfish, its a mmo for a reason to play with other people even the people in your fc were strangers before be nice hang out with your fellow 14 players.

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If a player that want to pug is from my server, then cool, I would love to add them to my CT group if there is room. Oh nvm, this is duty finder so I will probably end up with some random from another server that I will never see again. That alone is a big turn off for duty finding CT.

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Originally Posted by Musashidon

gotta like the attitudes if you're not part of my fc i want nothing to do with you!

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Yes, that's exactly what people are saying. Right.

Think about it...

Duty Finder forces you to play with people amongst other servers, which is great for people who don't want community, that's the purpose of it! So the people who do not have a group of people to play with can find groups to play with. i.e. I like MMO's for the adventure and the mass number of people, but I do not want to play with them, I want to do my own thing.

However; for the people that want to play with people (I'd say like >75% of the population), there are FC's and LS, which are there for people to get to know one another and play with each other and just have fun with friends. That's the MMO aspect.

Duty Finder removes the MMO aspect, and by forcing us to use it, it removes the community aspect as well. Come on SE, please reconsider...

Edit: I'm not bashing on the people who don't want to play with people, that's their choice and everyone is free to do what they want.

What is the DAMN purpose of a FC then?. We are still limited to 8man groups.. THIS IS PATHETIC

The amount of butthurt over a slightly delayed aspect of one part of the patch is getting rather hilarious.

If you have a large FC that wants to run 24 man premades ....

Wait one more patch for that functionality!

In the meantime, the rest of us who don't mind playing with strangers will enjoy what Crystal Tower offers.