Too many flashy abilities?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AlexNiculaie

But it's your poor ability to understand, though I would state that it's more like bitching that the cookie dough doesn't look like a cookie. Your complaints are still premature. Alpha is not meant to display game content or actions, it's meant to test server stability. It is understood that most things (animations, quest, et.) are likely already changed. Beta is when such things are actually being tested.

---

It's not like a cookie at all. That's the whole point and why the analogy is stupid. Alerith essentially said it's like a cookie and then said not to compare it to a cookie because he knows his analogy doesn't logically fit. A game can change based on feedback at whatever stage. A cookie does not. They both finally reach their form but a cookie doesn't take feedback into account. The games final shape is not a given. A cookie's is.

I can assume things like textures will get better. Optimization will get better, and now that they confirmed it, animations should get better. Those are pretty much the only thing we should take for granted like the cookie dough taking form. For anything else, saying "IT'S JUST AN ALPHA" is horsecrap. The alpha is meant for server stability and what not but its stupid to assume that the "game content or actions" are going to be drastically different from what we've got, just because. There is absolutely no downside in telling them what you think about what they've got earlier on in the cycle.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by casker

It's not like a cookie at all. That's the whole point and why the analogy is stupid. Alerith essentially said it's like a cookie and then said not to compare it to a cookie because he knows his analogy doesn't logically fit. A game can change based on feedback at whatever stage. A cookie does not. They both finally reach their form but a cookie doesn't take feedback into account. The games final shape is not a given. A cookie's is.

---

Try again.

You try again. It's your stupid ass analogy.

Alpha wasn't current even when testers got access. Do you understand that fact? The animations and systems in it, are weeks, if not months behind the current version of the game. Do you UNDERSTAND that? You are basically complaining about things which are more than likely not even in the current build. You can't accurately offer an opinion on anything other than server stability with alpha. Beta has long left it behind before testing even started.

Alpha is about server stability, not animations or even battle systems. Alpha is NOT about visuals, it's about server structure only. DO YOU UNDERSTAND? I don't think anyone can say it more simply for you.

Beta is when you CAN critique because it will be the most up to date at that time. Even if complete access is not granted, Beta is the up to date version, and the systems, animation, etc. are the most current, therefore allowing for the opportunity to accurately judge those things by.

Alpha = not current, asking for changes not helpful, Beta = current and looking for changes where needed.

I think its funny that many are not seeing the real point OP is trying to make.

Think of it this way, when you go to PVP or some kind of event (Like FATE stuff) would you rather leave your effects on and be able to tell whats what, or HAVE to turn them off because everything is blinding you, you can't tell what skill is what and be able to counter easier. The battles now are paced a lot faster than what we're used to, so seeing flash flash for every single little thing- while cool now, will get very old and annoying over time.

Yes it's alpha, we ALL realize this. We don't know exactly for sure what to expect for as far as battle graphics go. But the point is to say this now so it can be fixed. Yes we do want Flashy OTT effects, but they should honestly be saved for the more powerful skills so well... you can differentiate it easier. This is EXTREMELY important in not only PvP, but also for when fighting normal mobs too. ( Easier to see effects than text sometimes ) They are trying to just say to the dev team "Hey, maybe you guys should not make all skills be SUPER flashy so we can see whats going on easier later on." just in case it is similar, which is more than likely.

I agree 100% with the OP and casker (only read the first page and skimmed through btw ) on how the skills for lower levels should be scaled down a bit, if it hasn't been done for beta already. This was always a pet peeve of mine in games- especially when it comes to PVP. I rather be able to see the pretty effects for the more powerful skills over the lolflash of every single normal ability blocking everything. :< Easier to support and counter stuff especially when you don't have to STARE at the chat log 100% to know whats going on.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by AlexNiculaie

Alpha wasn't current even when testers got access. Do you understand that fact? The animations and systems in it, are weeks, if not months behind the current version of the game. Do you UNDERSTAND that? You are basically complaining about things which are more than likely not even in the current build. You can't accurately offer an opinion on anything other than server stability with alpha. Beta has long left it behind before testing even started.

Alpha is about server stability, not animations or even battle systems. Alpha is NOT about visuals, it's about server structure only. DO YOU UNDERSTAND? I don't think anyone can say it more simply for you.

Beta is when you CAN critique because it will be the most up to date at that time. Even if complete access is not granted, Beta is the up to date version, and the systems, animation, etc. are the most current, therefore allowing for the opportunity to accurately judge those things by.

Alpha = not current, asking for changes not helpful, Beta = current and looking for changes where needed.

---

Sure buddy. And when they give us the beta it will be behind what SE currently has in development, and you will be saying "DON'T CRITICIZE IT IT'S JUST IN BETA, WAIT FOR LAUNCH. SE'S CLIENT PROBABLY ALREADY FIXED IT!

So if I don't like the back pedaling I am supposed to assume it will change because IT'S JUST AN ALPHAAAAAA
If I think the flashiness is too much I am supposed to assume it will change because IT'S JUST AN ALPHAAAAAA
If I think the sprint ability could be improved I should just not saying thing and assume it will change because IT'S JUST AN ALPHAAAAAAAAA
If I think the 3 second CD is not good I shouldn't say anything and assume it will be changed because IT'S JUST AN ALPHAAAAAAA

There is no downside to telling them what you think. Ever. At any time.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by casker

You try again. It's your stupid ass analogy.

---

My, my. Someone is getting touchy. Very well, I'll throw you a bone and actually explain it for you. Though only god knows why something this simple needs to be explained...

At no point did I say "The game is like a cookie." I stated that "Complaining about certain things in an Alpha is like complaining about a cookie that you didn't fully bake."

As you can see, the comparison is between stupidity of complaints pertaining to incomplete products, not how the game is like a cookie.

I feel deeply saddened this extremely simple thing needed to be explained to you. The comparison you're trying to insinuate is the comparison of the Alpha to Cookie dough. However, since that isn't what I said to begin with, the argument from you is just ...*sunglasses* half-baked.

I'm not in alpha, but i have seen actual gameplay outside of those in the official videos, and even though the person used every ability often, it was never hard to tell what was going on, nor did it fill the screen with too big effects. Maybe it was because they had the camera further out, but the issues being complained about just were not a problem. Who knows if it will be the same or not. No point in worrying about it until we can actually see one way or another and SE is actually looking for our input.

Actually once beta is here I'll say bitch all you want because that is when it will actually be useful. But keep on being obtuse. It's what you seem best at.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alerith

My, my. Someone is getting touchy. Very well, I'll throw you a bone and actually explain it for you. Though only god knows why something this simple needs to be explained...

At no point did I say "The game is like a cookie." I stated that "Complaining about certain things in an Alpha is like complaining about a cookie that you didn't fully bake."

As you can see, the comparison is between stupidity of complaints, not how the game is like a cookie.

I feel deeply saddened this extremely simple thing needed to be explained to you. The comparison you're trying to insinuate is the comparison of the Alpha to Cookie dough. However, since that isn't what I said to begin with, the argument from you is just ...*sunglasses* half-baked.

---

Apparently you don't know how analogies work. If complaining about the game in alpha is like complaining about a cookie baking, you are taking the game to be the cookie. So yes, your analogy says the game is like a cookie. And since they have key differences, the game is not like a cookie, which makes the analogy a bad one.

I feel deeply saddened (amused) that you don't even understand the mechanics of your own analogy, and furthermore, what an analogy does, or what makes a good analogy.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by casker

Apparently you don't know how analogies work. If complaining about the game in alpha is like complaining about a cookie baking, you are taking the game to be the cookie. So yes, your analogy says the game is like a cookie. And since they have key differences, the game is not like a cookie, which makes the analogy a bad one.

I feel deeply saddened (amused) that you don't even understand the mechanics of your own analogy, and furthermore, what an analogy does, or what makes a good analogy.

---

It's very disappointing to see that you still lack comprehension on such a simple thing.

Cookie and Game = Incomplete product. (Note that this is NOT saying that they are being compared to each other for the sake of similarities, but that they both represent an incomplete product for the purpose of the comparison.)

Bake Time and Production Time = Time into the project. (Again, not compared to each other for the sake of similarities, but for the representation of the point on the timetable the game/cookie has been in production/bake)

The analogy works because the comparison of one stupid complaint pertaining to an incomplete product translates directly into the stupid complaints of another incomplete product.

But perhaps I can simplify this for you:

Complaining about certain things in the Alpha is like complaining you're getting wet in the rain and you didn't bring an umbrella. (In before "Oh yes, because an umbrella is SO MUCH like the game!")

If you still don't get it: "It's simply stupid."

I will say nothing more on the matter. Good day to you.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by casker

It's not like a cookie at all. That's the whole point and why the analogy is stupid. Alerith essentially said it's like a cookie and then said not to compare it to a cookie because he knows his analogy doesn't logically fit. A game can change based on feedback at whatever stage. A cookie does not. They both finally reach their form but a cookie doesn't take feedback into account. The games final shape is not a given. A cookie's is.

I can assume things like textures will get better. Optimization will get better, and now that they confirmed it, animations should get better. Those are pretty much the only thing we should take for granted like the cookie dough taking form. For anything else, saying "IT'S JUST AN ALPHA" is horsecrap. The alpha is meant for server stability and what not but its stupid to assume that the "game content or actions" are going to be drastically different from what we've got, just because. There is absolutely no downside in telling them what you think about what they've got earlier on in the cycle.

---

Nothing good will come out of this, you know very well that in order to actually have a valid opinion on this require that you have a copy of the game installed on your hdd. Giving feedback in this matter based on a short video is not good enough to judge how it will be in beta stage. Everyone, including those who participate in alpha have no clue wether certain things will remain and proceed to be used in beta. This is why people are questioning you. Like you said, cookies are not comparable to xiv, I think most people over the age of 2 understands this.

It is true that feedback at any stage is helpful, and you placing a concern over wether these flashy animations will remain or not is something you actually have to wait and see, because in alpha, they don't change these things like you claim. When the time comes and you are able to log into beta, you will have a full picture to work with instead of bits and pieces, that is why i think ranting about this will have no outcome.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alerith

It's very disappointing to see that you still lack comprehension on such a simple thing.

Cookie and Game = Incomplete product. (Note that this is NOT saying that they are being compared to each other for the sake of similarities, but that they both represent an incomplete product for the purpose of the comparison.)

Bake Time and Production Time = Time into the project. (Again, not compared to each other for the sake of similarities, but for the representation of the point on the timetable the game/cookie has been in production/bake)

The analogy works because the comparison of one stupid complaint pertaining to an incomplete product translates directly into the stupid complaints of another incomplete product.

---

Cookie and Game = incomplete product.
Bake time and Production time = Time into the project.
No argument there. But let me spell this out for you, you are saying the game is like a cookie, and baking is like production time. That is what your equal signs represent. That is how analogies work. Hopefully you now understand that such an analogy entails you saying a cookie is like a game.

Complaining about a game while being developed -> can lead to change
Complaining about a cookie while being baked -> cannot lead to change

Your analogy said the game is like a cookie, but here we have an instance of why the game is not like a cookie. Which means your analogy is stupid.

You do not take into consideration the attributes of the subject matter being compared, and how they are different. One does not make a good analogy by outright ignoring the characteristics of the subject matter.

Quote:

---

Complaining about certain things in the Alpha is like complaining you're getting wet in the rain and you didn't bring an umbrella. (In before "Oh yes, because an umbrella is SO MUCH like the game!")

I will say nothing more on the matter. Good day to you.

---

It's really not. You are honestly horrible at making analogies and I hope you stop trying to do it, as you clearly don't understand how they work.

From someone who wanted faster animation in combat I am solo pleased ATM only thing I ask is maybe a when I pull off a combo cause it is a little harder to tell. People have to realize that with faster combat chances are we won't have pure tank n spanks like ffxi had (I love that game but let's be real now) everyone isn't gonna be on top of one mob, and also we won't be fighting little tiny squirrel

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tobalito

From someone who wanted faster animation in combat I am solo pleased ATM only thing I ask is maybe a when I pull off a combo cause it is a little harder to tell. People have to realize that with faster combat chances are we won\\'t have pure tank n spanks like ffxi had (I love that game but let\\'s be real now) everyone isn\\'t gonna be on top of one mob, and also we won\\'t be fighting little tiny squirrel

---

Notifier* is what I meant to say before combo lol

I like it. It matches the style of the more recent final fantasy games and maintains the speed and fps that we want. If anything, have an option in settings to lower the particle effects.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alerith

...

This is why I'm glad SE selectively listens to the community for the most part. Over a year ago: "ALL THE ANIMATIONS LOOK THE SAME, THEY AREN'T FLASHY ENOUGH, THEY AREN'T BIG ENOUGH."

---

He's got a point.. Its why they originally upscaled the graphics for the spells in 1.0.

I'm pretty sure they have chosen their direction regarding this, and its unlikely to change.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tobalito

Notifier* is what I meant to say before combo lol

---

Yea, the indicator for combos are a little small. The little yellow box.

I do have to say weapon skill animations aside I think other animations are a little much imo

Like hitting sprint always has like a glass breaking animation when it wears off, why?
For how often you hit sprint it will get very annoying imo lol

And some of the gathering animations and sound is a bit in your face to me. I like my gathering to not sound like heated combat lol

Weapon skills and spells dont seem bad to me tho. just the other animations that I mentioned are a bit much but thats just my opinion. ^_^

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by IloveYouPumpkin

In the new video he's only level 15 or something.. yet I see a lot of really obvious and flashy stuff happening, maybe it's too much (lancer)? I wonder how it will look at 50 especially in PVP. Will we know what's going on, or will it be overwhelming? I like cool-looking abilities, but not everything needs huge graphics.

---

I agree with your comment; we definitely want flashy but there are too many swirly things going on that cover up the flashy that we are looking for. The Black and Yellow swirly effect looks outta place. We just want the WS itself to be flashy not the effect around the character indicating we used one; we know.

i'm not a big fan of what i've seen as far as abilities/WS go thus far either. i'm especially discouraged with how they sound. very tinny, similar and annoying.

Apparently there is just no winning. You are damned if you do and damned if you don't. I like the spells and moves, they could always use improvement, which is why I have no criticism towards this post. What we need is some really awesome move, flashy isn't all that bad, but for the flashyness to make sense to what they are, like what you pointed out earlier, maybe AoE being full body animations.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alerith

I will say nothing more on the matter. Good day to you.

---

Next time just start here when these types of people start in man......

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Biggs

Next time just start here when these types of people start in man......

---

The mentality that no issue that you have should be mentioned during the alpha test, is pretty bizarre. Nothing wrong with just expressing a concern as early as you see it. The fact that we're not in beta phase isn't a reason to not bring anything up. That's what Alerith was proposing I should have done.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bittereye

I agree with your comment; we definitely want flashy but there are too many swirly things going on that cover up the flashy that we are looking for. The Black and Yellow swirly effect looks outta place. We just want the WS itself to be flashy not the effect around the character indicating we used one; we know.

---

I actually think that the black and yellow swirly thing was the slug's attack, the one where they string goo all over you. Rather, instead of black, we get a golden-glow/aura for a very brief moment when we activate a WS, if that's what you're after.

Most of the flashiness is caused by the slugs... How do people not notice this?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Buddhsie

Most of the flashiness is caused by the slugs... How do people not notice this?

---

Everyone who isn't looking for anything they can to complain about already has noticed.

Still in alpha not all animations are even programed in yet. Animations look good. Keep it up team!

Actually I was merely commenting on a conversation descending into petty argument that leads to no real constructive ideas for anyone. Didn't mean to insinuate they shouldn't express opinions about the game.

Too flashy? Is that term even usable in the same sentence as "Final Fantasy?" Being "Too flashy" is kind of the signature of the Final Fantasy series. I'm glad that they're following traditional Final Fantasy archetype.

Flashyness and over the top spell animations have been a staple in the Final Fantasy series for a long time. For the majority of FFXIV people complained that effects weren't flashy enough.