Reddit vs. the Forums in the Graphics War of '24

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Originally Posted by CNitsah

The real question is : are they mostly happy there because that the general concensus of the FFXIV player base or are they happy there because everyone that disagreed with them was downvoted to oblivion to the point they don't bother with reddit anymore? My guess is that it's probably a little bit of both, you can't deny that, on the larger scale people are mostly happy the game, except for some niche, like raiders or people that have thousands of hours of gametime, but the stats on reddit are still high because of that echo chamber process.

But honestly, those past month, I feel like the forum have been in a better shape, the obvious trolls are either taking a break or been banned, so overall, I feel like the forum is a far better place than a year ago.

[edit]
After checking it, it seems there was a ban wave of trolls at the end of last summer, and that we now have some kind of moderation, and that's why the forum is far less of zoo than it was a year ago - I'll give SE credit for that, that was needed. It still not perfect, but it's going in the right direction. That's something reddit hasn't acknoledged yet.

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That's not really how Reddit works. Popular views get upvoted, unpopular views get downvoted. If people were generally unhappy you would expect their views to be at the top, not downvoted so much they get hidden.

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Originally Posted by Fuyume

I have an character that's an elezen that I loaded into the benchmark, and I wasn't mad at it. I thought she looked fine, and the textures were nice. Same for my fem highlander and fem middie alts, a few small differences but overall they kept their vibes and looked nice. And yet, I can't stand what they did to Face 4 Au Ra; it does not keep the spirit of the original face design and instead opted for making it look more like all the other au ra fem faces, rounded and cute and dimpled. So it's seriously a ymmv situation when it really shouldn't be.

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As a general sentiment, I agree that a lot of language used is hyperbolic and exaggerated, and some races generally are 'close enough' that I can get over it.

Yet I genuinely cannot comprehend how people on NA don't think Face 4 fem Au Ra looks goddamn scuffed, lol. Everything on the face protrudes in a way that gives them a slight bee-sting effect. The cheek scale textures are literally warped with awkward, ugly round edges when they're supposed to be pointy like every other Auri facial scale.

Yeah, sure, they still look cute. The vast majority of models have beautiful features by default. It's very easy to make them look simply as cool or cute as possible, which is all the average person generally cares about. But even with that in mind, like, honestly...this one is just...worse looking?

The graphic update to characters is so minor, and still doesn't even quite match up to 1.0, so aside from the scale detail being nicer, I can absolutely see why it feels like a downgrade. I don't even play a fem Au Ra with Face 4 (Although I do think Face 2 is equally scuffed in the 'just sorta looks worse all around' way. The thousand-yalm stare on that face is incredibly uncanny now in all lighting).

Though, Fuyume, I've noticed you get dismissed a lot in particular, and I just wanted to say, if it helps you feel better, Face 4's differences are veerry well documented in the JP thread, and in general they appear to be in agreement with you. If you use Firefox and get a translator extension, it works well in allowing you to understand the main gist of what they're saying.

Anyway, nobody here has any objective sample sizes. There's no proof the "vast majority" is completely stoked for the update, nor is there proof for the opposite. I mean, Reddit has the group of people who thinks the benchmark's horrifying Lalafell dolphin mouth is cool and better and intentional actually, so take that as you will.

And again, there are very easy methods to look over the JP side of the forums and understand the gist of their feelings. You'll find posts that also have exaggerated (but more polite) sentiments about being uncomfortable with the changes to their characters and wanting them fixed regularly get 100+ upvotes or near it.

This isn't a "gotcha," but I don't think the attempt to use upvotes on Reddit or random Twitter screenshots as a proving point's exactly mature either.

The grapes didn't even bother people this much.

Reddit is a toxic echochamber cesspool. There's no room for discussion there.

A lot of pots calling kettles black here lol. You don't think everyone on reddit telling anyone with a complaint to come here has anything to do with it? No one cares to give positive feedback in the forum. It's all complaints, which is fine since this is the proper channel for them.

People have come to the forums to vent their frustrations because the forums are generally regarded as the place to post feedback that might (big emphasis on "might") be seen by staff and developers. Things like the viera slouch, limbal rings, and the wet look of the au ra horns are just a few things I can think of that were changed due to forum feedback. Reddit isn't really a place to deliver feedback, nor is Twitter. So, by virtue of the forums' purpose, you're going to have a lot of complaints that would regularly get publicly decried on Reddit and Twitter funneled into here. I know that I am someone who never used the forums before the update. I also know a great many others who are in the same boat as me. While it might just as unlikely that thoughts are seen here, the forums at least give the illusion of being listened to. And (even with the chaos, lmao) they are more well-organized and easily archived.

I think we have to make peace with the fact that some people really like the update while others really do not. Compromises need to be made, some things will likely have to be accepted. But generally speaking, other sites aren't exactly conducive to large breakdowns and collecting information. So the forums it is — stacked high with complaints (some meritless, some serious, so it goes.) People just really want to be heard and think this place is their only chance.

Edit: To add, when posting complaints on Reddit, or Twitter, or elsewhere, there's always someone telling you to "go to the forums." There were tweets circulating the day of with 1-5k likes that said "take your complaints to the forums." So, if you're wondering, "why did people come here," it's also because people were literally told to do so.

The updated graphics seem to be the most exciting thing about Dawntrail. Doesn't seem to be much hype for the expansion outside of that and the Female Hrothgars. Looking at some of the many features coming in WoW's upcoming expansion versus the far less we seem to be getting here, is worrisome. WoW is eating our lunch where actual hype is concerned.

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Originally Posted by Freyt

The grapes didn't even bother people this much.

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When are they going to add grapes as a playable race? :mad:

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Originally Posted by twobear

That's not really how Reddit works. Popular views get upvoted, unpopular views get downvoted. If people were generally unhappy you would expect their views to be at the top, not downvoted so much they get hidden.

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re reading my post, I admit it might not be clear, but was basically saying that the ration positive/negative is that high on reddit because :
- on the larger scale, people are globally positive about the game
- people that have critics about it don't bother with reddit since they know they will be downvoted to oblivion

That while still high, the ration positive/negative over the whole community might be lower than on reddit. Best example being the whole long running content drought EW had, that got downplayed on reddit until some influencers began to point it out, then suddenly it was ok to say so there. What you say does not contradict that in any way.

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Originally Posted by Gokki

Reddit is a toxic echochamber cesspool. There's no room for discussion there.

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This forum is even worse!

I still like it here more than reddit though, at least most of the posts here aren't worthless fluff, even if I think the majority of people here are brainlets with the game design sense of a very confused and lost bee. But I will take arguing with idiots over having to sift through bad memes, fanart, and streamer garbage any day.

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Originally Posted by CNitsah

re reading my post, I admit it might not be clear, but was basically saying "on the larger scale, people are happy with the game, but the the echo chamber makes still burry the problems that are there". Best example being the whole long running content drought EW had, that got downplayed by reddit until some influencers began to point it out, then suddenly it was ok to say so there.

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Oh, yes I mean it will tend to hide the minority view, that’s correct. I do see people who are somewhat unhappy there, but I do think they are the minority.

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Originally Posted by Fawkes

Reddit isn't a good place for discussions, usually. Most people use downvotes to disagree which stifles any arguments, so the majority of subreddits just end up being a bunch of people agreeing with each other.

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It was funny that l said "what's wrong with cure 1" Amd got a storm of downvotes. I need to troll harder

Perhaps it's just me overthinking, but I've noticed that Reddit discussions often set their course within the first five comments. Typically, it's one of the initial posts that rise to the top, shaping the direction of subsequent responses.

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Originally Posted by missTori

im actually flabbergasted by all the negative threads regarding a graphics update,
i for one am super excited. i watched https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WxS0SGJG2n8 desperius video comparing both old and new models, and it seriously doesnt look that different (in a negative way) to me. i dont know where people are pulling these complaints from

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I think like 98% of update is good; the valid issues here are the ones that have had actual features removed without any other options, so it then appears more like a downgrade in that narrow extent.
Some lip and eye shapes which looked different before, look the same in the benchmark & choosing different options are redundant. Those unique features like the miqote female face 4 lip gap, now gone- the crooked nose option is gone, Lalafell nose smudge is gone on darker skin, their lips are all the exact same shape as well as eyes- it's those things that are baffling imo bc the people updating these features HAD to have noticed. And the skin texture is very rubbery/ plastic like. Those to me are the valid complaints.
And alot of people are now starting to come around to the changes, especially considering they will continue to be updated.

The problem with that too is people assumed graphic update = character creator update. I say that because ALOT of folks immediately assumed "oh this will be fixed/ this feature will be added once graphics are updated!' when there has been zero mention of actually making the character creator better.

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Square enix needs to come out and admit where they actually pull feedback from because it doesn’t seem to be anywhere. Reddit and twitter get outright ignored while the white knights tell people to come to the forums, people come to the forums and get radio silence while we continue to spin round the same 5 topics they refuse to acknowledge

Then people say go to the JP forums and then they seem to ignore that as well, the JP forums didn’t like Kaiten or the healer reworks or the simplicity of modern SMN, they got ignored as well


At this point just tell us to put up and shut up if they won’t take feedback from us anywhere, even their own channels

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I agree, this is something I've asked like "you say you guys need feedback & have mentioned you don't get enough- so WHAT AND WHERE should we submit??"

I know there are other topics that focus on specific issues like missing textures/ housing/ etc. basically, General Discussion isn't for bug reports or graphic issues.

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

What regular changes do they make in response to general feedback that actually mean anything

They are incredibly rigid on refusing to change the jobs, they rarely respond to feedback about role distinction, they are near silent on changes to content and rewards, yoshi himself outright blew off healers last event, viera and Hrothgar are still waiting for hats

Saying “they do respond to community feedback because they added an extra parasol when they ignore the core functions of the game is just disingenuous

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Which isn't what I said at all.

You said:

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Square enix needs to come out and admit where they actually pull feedback from because it doesn’t seem to be anywhere. Reddit and twitter get outright ignored while the white knights tell people to come to the forums, people come to the forums and get radio silence while we continue to spin round the same 5 topics they refuse to acknowledge

Then people say go to the JP forums and then they seem to ignore that as well, the JP forums didn’t like Kaiten or the healer reworks or the simplicity of modern SMN, they got ignored as well


At this point just tell us to put up and shut up if they won’t take feedback from us anywhere, even their own channels

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Then I said they clearly do take feedback since they've made changes based on it.

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Originally Posted by CidHeiral

They have made changes as a direct result of feedback from all over so I would assume they look at various social media channels, they just don't announce "thank you citizen we have received your request."

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Whether they are changes you want or not is irrelevant. You original post was about them ignoring feedback entirely, not ignoring specific feedback.

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Originally Posted by HeyMcFly

I agree, this is something I've asked like "you say you guys need feedback & have mentioned you don't get enough- so WHAT AND WHERE should we submit??"

I know there are other topics that focus on specific issues like missing textures/ housing/ etc. basically, General Discussion isn't for bug reports or graphic issues.

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Yoshi P has said multiple times the forums and has been consistent on this since ARR. That said, the man and presumably most of the dev staff probably aren't spending a lot of time on the NA forum for obvious language barrier related reasons. Presumably there's some poor bastard or 2 out there whose job is at least partly to come here and collect info to pass to the devs, but maybe there isn't! There've definitely been a couple of changes that people were asking for for awhile that took having Yoshi P come here for fanfest and experience them firsthand before getting any tractions (machinist rapid fire ping issues and a couple others I don't remember).

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Originally Posted by CidHeiral

Which isn't what I said at all.

You said:



Then I said they clearly do take feedback since they've made changes based on it.



Whether they are changes you want or not is irrelevant. You original post was about them ignoring feedback entirely, not ignoring specific feedback.

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Yes and my point stands

Saying they take feedback about useless minor things as evidence they do take feedback when they blatantly ignore feedback about how the game actually works is disingenuous

Since ShB they have functionally accepted no feedback regarding any major change to any major system despite asking for our feedback. Are we supposed to only offer feedback on minor things nobody cares about

SE does take feedback.
From japan.

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Originally Posted by Oizen

SE does take feedback.
From japan.

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It's a good thing then that JP is bringing up the exact same points of criticisms as we do.

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Yes and my point stands

Saying they take feedback about useless minor things as evidence they do take feedback when they blatantly ignore feedback about how the game actually works is disingenuous

Since ShB they have functionally accepted no feedback regarding any major change to any major system despite asking for our feedback. Are we supposed to only offer feedback on minor things nobody cares about

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Off the top of my head didn't they overhaul PvP, add a deep dungeon, and change the variant rewards based on player feedback? If nobody cares about those things why were there so many threads complaining about them?

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Yes and my point stands

Saying they take feedback about useless minor things as evidence they do take feedback when they blatantly ignore feedback about how the game actually works is disingenuous

Since ShB they have functionally accepted no feedback regarding any major change to any major system despite asking for our feedback. Are we supposed to only offer feedback on minor things nobody cares about

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Your definition of useless is everything that isn't immediately addressing healer griping, which as a non-healer main I consider emminently more useless than most of the examples of feedback that people bring up to you when you say stuff like this.

Edit: They should address it though because it's not like I really disagree. For my money, I think healers are more boring now than they were.

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Originally Posted by Eastwall

It was funny that l said "what's wrong with cure 1" Amd got a storm of downvotes. I need to troll harder

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This. They are quick to gang up on anyone that doesn't follow their narrative.

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Originally Posted by Arkdra

Your definition of useless is everything that isn't immediately addressing healer griping, which as a non-healer main I consider emminently more useless than most of the examples of feedback that people bring up to you when you say stuff like this.

Edit: They should address it though because it's not like I really disagree. For my money, I think healers are more boring now than they were.

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There is a lot more complaints than healers but also you know a whole third of the trinity being completely useless isn’t exactly a minor complaint

You bought up housing a few comments ago, why do we still not have instances housing (apartments don’t count because they lack critical features), why can they never seem to remotely balance the tanks, why will they still give us no feedback on why they decided to delete Kaiten, why do they wait till jobs are literally getting locked out of PF before they make changes we pointed out weeks before the jobs even got released (WHM and MCH), why do they still refuse to do anything for people with high ping despite it being easily accessible. Why did they not change course on the design of myths after aglaia got negative feedback for being too easy and not feeling like an alliance raid, why will they still not give viera or Hrothgar hats. Why will they still not split au ra horns from their face or miqote clan markings from their face. Why have they forced a double melee dominance when nobody asked for it. Why do they keep doubling and tripling down on body checks in savage. Why did they make criterion savage and ultimate light when people were begging for midcore content, why did they double down on EO basically being designed as a solo challenge when that was HOH’s biggest criticism

The list of ignored feedback is long and varied, I’m a healer main so a lot of my energy goes into discussing healers but it isn’t the remote totality of my problems with the game, and all of these points have had multiple threads on them and they get ignored

If y'all want to see an actual bad graphics update, look at what Pokemon Go just did to its female character models. They now have the male body + boobs. It looks so awful. THEY WERE FINE. WHY. WHY.

My turn to have a meltdown on their official forum sources.

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Originally Posted by CidHeiral

Off the top of my head didn't they overhaul PvP, add a deep dungeon, and change the variant rewards based on player feedback? If nobody cares about those things why were there so many threads complaining about them?

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I'd like to point out that there's no evidence they based any of those changes directly on player feedback. It's a lot more likely that they based it on general player sentiment.

PvP got overhauled because The Feast was barely alive and there's a lot of people who constantly complained about PvP being bad, so they made it casual and accessible, none of what they did was based off of feedback from people who actually still engaged in PvP.

A deep dungeon got added because a lot of people misses having one, but going by the EO feedback, the deep dungeon regulars didn't get a lot of their gripes addressed.

Criterion dungeon did get more rewards added, sure, but only in savage, and no one gave feedback asking for a tome weapon upgrade.

It's very likely they change things according to their interpretation of player sentiment without actually gathering and reading any of the feedback and suggestions.

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Originally Posted by Catwho

If y'all want to see an actual bad graphics update, look at what Pokemon Go just did to its female character models. They now have the male body + boobs. It looks so awful. THEY WERE FINE. WHY. WHY.

My turn to have a meltdown on their official forum sources.

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Hahaha oh wow


https://i.imgur.com/G0gTjgk.jpg

that's a shame the avatars were one of the better things about that game

Aravell brings up a good point I believe I have failed to explain very well

When changes are made they don’t seem to be based on feedback so much as general sentiment

Like she pointed out PVP got a change but they never went around and asked for our feedback or our input they simply responded to the general sentiment the community was unhappy with PVP in general, the same I touched on with criterion, they saw a general sentiment that people wanted harder dungeons but they never really polled anyone to see if they wanted something like BA or basically ultimate lite

So half the feedback they actually ignore the other half they just implement their own vision based on vague sentiment of the community

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Originally Posted by Aravell

It's very likely they change things according to their interpretation of player sentiment without actually gathering and reading any of the feedback and suggestions.

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How would they know the sentiment without reading the feedback?

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Like she pointed out PVP got a change but they never went around and asked for our feedback or our input they simply responded to the general sentiment the community was unhappy with PVP in general, the same I touched on with criterion, they saw a general sentiment that people wanted harder dungeons but they never really polled anyone to see if they wanted something like BA or basically ultimate lite

So half the feedback they actually ignore the other half they just implement their own vision based on vague sentiment of the community

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Correct me if I'm wrong but it sounds like what you want is for them to individually poll every one of the millions of people who play this game and implement what those players ask for verbatim. Is that right or am I misunderstanding?

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Originally Posted by CidHeiral

How would they know the sentiment without reading the feedback?



Correct me if I'm wrong but it sounds like what you want is for them to individually poll every one of the millions of people who play this game and implement what those players ask for verbatim. Is that right or am I misunderstanding?

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Yes that’s exactly what I’m saying why would you think I would ever have a more nuanced view than literally the single most outlandish interpretation of my comment you could possibly make

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Originally Posted by Jessica_VS

Isn't it interesting that most people (though, of course, not everyone) posting on the FFXIV Reddit favour the visual updates to characters, while the opposite is true on this forum?

I wonder why the two have such different perspectives. Hopping between both Reddit and here is like visiting alternative realities.

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because ppl come, specifically, to complain here based on the thought that devs would see it (they wont)

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Yes that’s exactly what I’m saying why would you think I would ever have a more nuanced view than literally the single most outlandish interpretation of my comment you could possibly make

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Well I was in good faith trying to understand your perspective since you're being vague and contradictory but if you're going to be a sarcastic baby then whatever bro. :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by CidHeiral

Well I was in good faith trying to understand your perspective since you're being vague and contradictory but if you're going to be a sarcastic baby then whatever bro. :rolleyes:

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You obviously aren’t trying to understand anything if your first instinct is to ask “hey are you asking them to do the most outlandish and unreasonable thing they could possibly do within the bounds of your comment”

What I want is simple

1) the Kaiten issue- if you make a change out of the blue then explicitly ask for feedback on it you need to tell us what that feedback did or what it represented (ie did it present a large enough amount of feedback to consider a reversion, if not then why not) this doesn’t require polling this is exactly what the forums are for. If the forums and the stats contradict each other tell us (ie “we notice it’s a big problem on the forums but we have seen a massive upswing in SAM’s in content so we believe the overall playerbase is content)

2) the healer issue- if you have two opposing groups fighting for a design space (the sylphies vs the glarebots) you need to make it clear what your design is trying to do, nobody is happy with modern healers according to EN feedback, we have vague surveys that indicate satisfaction for AST and SCH crashed, if they have seen a stabilisation of healer queues and see this change as a success again tell us. You could shut me and the healer forums up overnight if you outright told us you think the healer changes have been to the benefit of the game because of the change in healer queues, don’t leave us in the dark and dodge our comments

3) the housing issue- if you have a philosophy for an aspect of the game you refuse to deviate from (the neighbourhoods) then outright tell us you won’t accept feedback on this issue and our energy would be better spent on asking for changes to things on the side (say asking for planters in apartments). If you won’t change why do you allow us to give feedback

4) the forum organisation issue- if you have a specific method you seek to obtain feedback on the forums (say it’s the Japanese way of megathreads you upvote opinions you agree with and move on) then you need to make that clear and you need to have your mods organise our forums to adhere to that so our feedback is actually being heard

I dont want that much I just want square to stop leaving us in the dark while we circle the drain on the EN forums while they apparently respond to “feedback” none of us can find and is contrary to near all the feedback we actually offer

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Originally Posted by CidHeiral

How would they know the sentiment without reading the feedback?

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You can very easily gauge sentiment by just skimming thread titles without actually reading any of the feedback (constructive or otherwise).

Like if you browse through the PvP subforum, you'd very quickly know that people have a problem with Frontlines, but you wouldn't know why. So in this scenario, SE could implement changes to Frontlines that could end up making things worse, because they only know the sentiment but not any specific feedback.

Same with general discussion. The general sentiment seen from browsing thread titles here seems to be that the graphical update has problems, but you can't tell what the problems are exactly unless you go through the feedback that people have provided.

My point is mainly to point out that the things they've done "in response to player feedback" are very general things that don't correspond to any feedback in particular (popular ones or otherwise). I would again point to the criterion rewards, a lot of people were discussing possible rewards, but nobody asked for a glowing tome weapon upgrade, yet here we are.

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

You obviously aren’t trying to understand anything if your first instinct is to ask “hey are you asking them to do the most outlandish and unreasonable thing they could possibly do within the bounds of your comment”

What I want is simple

1) the Kaiten issue- if you make a change out of the blue then explicitly ask for feedback on it you need to tell us what that feedback did or what it represented (ie did it present a large enough amount of feedback to consider a reversion, if not then why not) this doesn’t require polling this is exactly what the forums are for. If the forums and the stats contradict each other tell us (ie “we notice it’s a big problem on the forums but we have seen a massive upswing in SAM’s in content so we believe the overall playerbase is content)

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A good post, but to answer this question, they responded to my feedback personally.

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...lation-sky-pie. Posted at 01-17-2021 02:17 AM in the lead up to EW

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Originally Posted by Arkdra

3. Kaiten - I realize this is the only reason there is any friction at all in the samurai kit up until Tsubame, but what does it really add? It's just a matter of being able to remember, "Don't spend kenki unless you have >30 of it" which is not complicated. I feel like it is an unintuitive ability to newbies and it also just makes everything from levels 52 to 62 feel terrible because you don't generate enough kenki to kaiten for higenbana and midare in your opener. I think they need to find a more interesting way to add friction to the kenki gauge than this.
.

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Originally Posted by Aravell

You can very easily gauge sentiment by just skimming thread titles without actually reading any of the feedback (constructive or otherwise).

Like if you browse through the PvP subforum, you'd very quickly know that people have a problem with Frontlines, but you wouldn't know why. So in this scenario, SE could implement changes to Frontlines that could end up making things worse, because they only know the sentiment but not any specific feedback.

Same with general discussion. The general sentiment seen from browsing thread titles here seems to be that the graphical update has problems, but you can't tell what the problems are exactly unless you go through the feedback that people have provided.

My point is mainly to point out that the things they've done "in response to player feedback" are very general things that don't correspond to any feedback in particular (popular ones or otherwise). I would again point to the criterion rewards, a lot of people were discussing possible rewards, but nobody asked for a glowing tome weapon upgrade, yet here we are.

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Is it that no one wanted it or is it that the EN community didn't want it? I'm curious if it was a blanket "No." across all the communities or if this was some ask on the JP side of things.

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Originally Posted by LianaThorne

Is it that no one wanted it or is it that the EN community didn't want it? I'm curious if it was a blanket "No." across all the communities or if this was some ask on the JP side of things.

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My understanding is that the JP side of things has been very happy with Variant and Criterion overall, and that it is only the NA and EU player base who are upset. I'd venture to guess the reason that we are upset is because we were the ones asking for challenging four man content. What people on our side of the pond were really asking for though was WoW's Mythic+(M+) system. Which if anyone doesn't know, M+ allows you to run a dungeon at a higher level, this level scales up and the higher you go the better the rewards get until they cap out at whatever level they cap at now(they keep changing it). What NA and EU players were really asking for, was a 4 man scaling difficulty loot farm. What we got was a four man non-scaling difficulty challenging experience with no loot. So OF COURSE NA and EU are unhappy. They wanted M+ and got 4 man diet Ultimate.

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Originally Posted by Freyt

The problem arises when people decide it requires no organization to it, to fill up the board, and act like everyone in the world agrees with them.

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But why do you care so much lol. Are you managing this place? We have mods. They can close and redirect people to other threads if they don't like how we are giving feedback.

This is a lot emotions for things that don't concern you.

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Originally Posted by Fawkes

Hahaha oh wow


https://i.imgur.com/G0gTjgk.jpg

that's a shame the avatars were one of the better things about that game

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ITS CURSED, CURSED I TELL YOU

Some people are very happy with the body sliders - that they can have a representation of themselves for real in PoGo now. But between 50-75% of people are unhappy with the uniform body type, the faces, or just the sloppy implementation of the new skin tones.

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Originally Posted by Jessica_VS

Isn't it interesting that most people (though, of course, not everyone) posting on the FFXIV Reddit favour the visual updates to characters, while the opposite is true on this forum?

I wonder why the two have such different perspectives. Hopping between both Reddit and here is like visiting alternative realities.

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It's pretty simple - reddit is a larger community where people tend to "hang out" and just chat, whether it be about positive or negative things. Whereas people come to the official forums with specific issues. The tone of either does not invalidate the feedback offered by the other.