just reminding SE they added two new races last expansion ...

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

But it is generally how SE takes feedback. 1 large thread is worth more than hundreds of small threads.

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Be that as it may (and it's not a given you're correct unless you are involved in SE's internal dealings), little things do build up. Will it work? Who knows. But both options are preferable over not saying anything at all. And the whole entitlement thing some people love to throw around is really getting old. But I get you. ^^

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Originally Posted by Payadopa

Be that as it may (and it's not a given you're correct unless you are involved in SE's internal dealings), little things do build up. Will it work? Who knows. But both options are preferable over not saying anything at all. And the whole entitlement thing some people love to throw around is really getting old. But I get you. ^^

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I mean, that is correct because SE has stated that's how they look at feedback on the forums.

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Originally Posted by Payadopa

Be that as it may (and it's not a given you're correct unless you are involved in SE's internal dealings), little things do build up. Will it work? Who knows. But both options are preferable over not saying anything at all. And the whole entitlement thing some people love to throw around is really getting old. But I get you. ^^

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One large, concentrated thread is the way to go, but that seems to be a JP thing instead of an NA thing. Which to me would be all the more reason since it's a JP company. But...here we are, with multiple threads on multiple subjects because everyone has to make their own.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

One large, concentrated thread is the way to go, but that seems to be a JP thing instead of an NA thing. Which to me would be all the more reason since it's a JP company. But...here we are, with multiple threads on multiple subjects because everyone has to make their own.

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JP threads are absolutely massive, with dedicated threads for things. Over here we've got dozens of smaller threads for the same complaints.

Similarly, the German threads and French threads are also absolutely massive, guaranteeing that the issues stay on the front page because people will keep talking about them in those threads whereas our issues tend to get pushed back because people keep making threads and then they fizzle out. They even have off-topic discussion threads in all three of the other language forums, yet over here every thread will get derailed with OT discussions.

IMO someone should just make one massive thread for the bungirl and tigerboy complaints, and hopefully it'll make it so discussion remains in that specific thread. This way rather than fizzle out every few weeks, the megathread remains on the front page.

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Originally Posted by MilkieTea

JP threads are absolutely massive, with dedicated threads for things. Over here we've got dozens of smaller threads for the same complaints.

Similarly, the German threads and French threads are also absolutely massive, guaranteeing that the issues stay on the front page because people will keep talking about them in those threads whereas our issues tend to get pushed back because people keep making threads and then they fizzle out. They even have off-topic discussion threads in all three of the other language forums, yet over here every thread will get derailed with OT discussions.

IMO someone should just make one massive thread for the bungirl and tigerboy complaints, and hopefully it'll make it so discussion remains in that specific thread. This way rather than fizzle out every few weeks, the megathread remains on the front page.

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That would be ideal, yeah, but the only way I could see that happening on the NA side of things is by making this a requirement just to keep us looking decent and orderly. But seeing how certain pandemic restrictions were viewed...well...lol I'd expect there to be an uproar. "You can't tell us what to do, SE!" "Muh rights!" "But the ToS!" "I'll do whatever I want!"...and so on. I know what it's like living here. :p Much to my dismay, of course. It's just how things are, online or offline.

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Originally Posted by BloodRubyXII

This is literally the third or fourth hairstyle this expansion

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With these two it will be ten new hairstyles since 5.0 for the pre-ShB races.

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Originally Posted by BloodRubyXII

because they've explained already both races would be limited and they were delivered because we wanted them so badly, but this would be the form we would get them in, and it's not a priority for them to resolve the headpiece/hair issue for them. Think about how much stuff inc the ultimate they're behind on, largely due to the pandemic and realise this is probably the last quality of life thing you're going to get.

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Not an excuse for saying nothing about it for almost two years, especially when they had said new hairstyles for us would come. Asking for information isn't expecting too much after so long. It doesn't cost loads of dev time to at least acknowledge the issue. Aside from that one comment at the beginning of the expansion we have gotten literally nothing.

For many of us just SE letting us know that we're not forgotten would mean so much.

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Originally Posted by BloodRubyXII

It was expected that players who picked these races would understand this, apparently not. But then again, knowing this community, I remain unsurprised.

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I understood just fine that I would have access to very little hats and that I would have to wait for new hair. However we have been waiting for nearly an entire expansion without any scrap of an update on information so we doubt that it is even coming, meanwhile the pre ShB races are spoiled for choice. It does appear SE need a reminder that we exist because they're acting as if we don't. We even had an event in which one of two rewards, and the only glam piece, was not useable by the two new races.

<insert comment here about how I know this community too so I shouldn't be surprised that yet another person tries to make us look like spoiled brats because we dare to ask for scraps over a two year period>

I would like a mega thread about the Viera issue that focuses entirely on the unfulfilled promise about unique hair. Too many of these threads seem to derail or focus on the modern aesthetics, which we were never given any indication would be usable by Viera. Which then lets people detract from the fact Viera are missing the justification for their limited state by saying things like..

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Originally Posted by BloodRubyXII

It was expected that players who picked these races would understand this, apparently not. But then again, knowing this community, I remain unsurprised.

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It's the fourth hairstyle added to the game that Viera reasonably cannot use. It is also the fourth hairstyle to release while the Unique And Exclusive hair Viera were said to get did not come out. That should be the focus.

It's not like players disgruntled by the limitations of viera/hrothgar, are some sort of hive mind. I post this all the time in these, but, generally, these threads are created by new or more inactive users. Granted, there are some here who do create threads on the same or similar subjects constantly.. I will usually use the search function if I have something, rather than create a thread, personally.

I will say; to the people who are bleeding that "You're so entitled" type of aura, these threads are obviously NOT meant for you and if you aren't coming in here to help that cause of the players who are feeling left out, then leave. Your comments of "You're so entitled" or anything along those lines arent helping and are just straight up rude and very annoying to be quite frank. begone with you

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Originally Posted by MilkieTea

JP threads are absolutely massive, with dedicated threads for things. Over here we've got dozens of smaller threads for the same complaints.

Similarly, the German threads and French threads are also absolutely massive, guaranteeing that the issues stay on the front page because people will keep talking about them in those threads whereas our issues tend to get pushed back because people keep making threads and then they fizzle out. They even have off-topic discussion threads in all three of the other language forums, yet over here every thread will get derailed with OT discussions.

IMO someone should just make one massive thread for the bungirl and tigerboy complaints, and hopefully it'll make it so discussion remains in that specific thread. This way rather than fizzle out every few weeks, the megathread remains on the front page.

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NA: no I have to make MY OWN thread so MY OWN UNIQUE idea gets ITS OWN place to shine and not SHARE SPACE with OTHER, WORSE, MORE BAD threads than MINE.
or something like that.

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Originally Posted by WhyAmIHere

NA: no I have to make MY OWN thread so MY OWN UNIQUE idea gets ITS OWN place to shine and not SHARE SPACE with OTHER, WORSE, MORE BAD threads than MINE.
or something like that.

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Also the title has to describe my personal opinion rather than a neutral statement of the topic to be discussed.

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Originally Posted by WhyAmIHere

NA: no I have to make MY OWN thread so MY OWN UNIQUE idea gets ITS OWN place to shine and not SHARE SPACE with OTHER, WORSE, MORE BAD threads than MINE.
or something like that.

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Looks like Akimori started a megathread, so we might want to take the discussion there. A bunch of other threads were linked by SturmChurro as well, so they are compiled in the OP itself.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

Looks like Akimori above started a megathread, so we might want to take the discussion there.

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Yes, let's move further discussion over here

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...gar-Megathread

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Originally Posted by LisSquid

Yes, let's move further discussion over here

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...gar-Megathread

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I'm just questioning whether there is actually anything to discuss, that hasn't already been discussed?

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/pr...MeZtI0PAvhOsJM

I'm waiting for May.

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

I'm just questioning whether there is actually anything to discuss, that hasn't already been discussed?

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/pr...MeZtI0PAvhOsJM

I'm waiting for May.

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Nothing wrong with getting a head start. Either way, they want constructive feedback condensed into single threads. Better late than never?

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Originally Posted by Akimori

I will say; to the people who are bleeding that "You're so entitled" type of aura, these threads are obviously NOT meant for you and if you aren't coming in here to help that cause of the players who are feeling left out, then leave. Your comments of "You're so entitled" or anything along those lines arent helping and are just straight up rude and very annoying to be quite frank. begone with you

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Yeah berating those that disagree sure does much to debunk their perception of entitlement.

That being said tossing the community a scrap regarding hair styles requires next to zero effort. Something as simple as we are aware but covid has delayed our efforts. Even a lie at this point probably would go a long way to those that wish to be acknowledged or heard.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

Nothing wrong with getting a head start. Either way, they want constructive feedback condensed into single threads. Better late than never?

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There wouldn't be a never. Someone, well, let's be honest here, several people are going to make threads discussing Viera/hrothgar additions (IF THEY ADD ANY or not), leading up to, during, and after fanfest regardless. There is simply no actual news keeping a 'megathread' lively enough for it to remain on the first page, since many here seem to not want to use the search feature.

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

There wouldn't be a never. Someone, well, let's be honest here, several people are going to make another thread discussing Viera/hrothgar additions (IF THEY ADD ANY), leading up to, during, and after fanfest regardless. There is simply no actual news keeping a 'megathread' lively enough for it to remain on the first page, since many here seem to not want to use the search feature.

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Yeah, that's fair.

well here we go again .. the same cycle , i open a thread asking POLITLY (excluding this thread :)) for some more info about these two races and all the comments i get
- not this topic again omg !!
- you knew the limitations yet you still chose to play Viera !
- covid-19 excuses
- viera and Hrothgars should be deleted !!!

they don't even try to read anything not to mention most of them don't even play any of these two races ... yet you want to just make one big thread about it?:)
...
actually everytime you enter the forums you will see dozens of trolling threads about .. nothing lol .
so really making a few more threads about these races might be the only way :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by Awha

Yeah berating those that disagree sure does much to debunk their perception of entitlement.

That being said tossing the community a scrap regarding hair styles requires next to zero effort. Something as simple as we are aware but covid has delayed our efforts. Even a lie at this point probably would go a long way to those that wish to be acknowledged or heard.

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Its not berating them for disagreeing. Its berating them for berating the players who try to start discussions about this sort of topic by calling them entitled, spoiled, etc etc. The point of my statement is that if they didn't have anything that actually progressed the discussion whether its them agreeing or disagree, but instead of just basically telling them to shut up because they're lucky we got Viera/hrothgar or something stupid, then.yea. Please read :)

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Originally Posted by lalin

they don't even try to read anything not to mention most of them don't even play any of these two races ... yet you want to just make one big thread about it?:)
...
actually everytime you enter the forums you will see dozens of trolling threads about .. nothing lol .
so really making a few more threads about these races might be the only way :rolleyes:

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Do make one big thread about it, not "a few more threads", because that's what the devs have said will get through to them.

Spamming new threads (and turning any discussion about hairstyles into a discussion about Viera hairstyles) just frustrates the forum population and maybe gets the message through to whoever is directly monitoring the forum discussion, but it's not going to put any of them individually onto the list of highly visible long-running threads, which is what can get carried up for action.

I want 12 races, and all them have to be 50 genders each. (Troll reply)

I just wanna remind people that Yoshi-p will not sleep with you because you called people entitled for expecting new hairstyles to fit on the equally as new races.

I wanna hope that the hair actually works on Viera and they just didn't show it, cause it's obvious they don't mind giving something to one and not the other when it comes to Viera and hroth, like the law's order helmets. Really wished I lived in a timeline where they whole assed one race instead of half assed 2 though, that's the dream.

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Originally Posted by Bellsong

I just wanna remind people that Yoshi-p will not sleep with you because you called people entitled for expecting new hairstyles to fit on the equally as new races.

I wanna hope that the hair actually works on Viera and they just didn't show it, cause it's obvious they don't mind giving something to one and not the other when it comes to Viera and hroth, like the law's order helmets. Really wished I lived in a timeline where they whole assed one race instead of half assed 2 though, that's the dream.

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If it's any consolation, the helmets on Hrothgar look horrendous. Small head, large body.

Source: Myself while playing as a Hrothgar.

FFXIV is small indie budget dev team that can't do what a half dozen players do with a bit of spare time in regards to Viera and Hrothgar headgear please understand.

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Originally Posted by ReynTime

FFXIV is small indie budget dev team that can't do what a half dozen players do with a bit of spare time in regards to Viera and Hrothgar headgear please understand.

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When compared to WoW's dev team and budget...yes the FF14 dev team might as well be a Indie dev team.

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Originally Posted by NanaWiloh

When compared to WoW's dev team and budget...yes the FF14 dev team might as well be a Indie dev team.

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Not really. I don't think it would have killed them to add one or two hairstyles for Viera. If there was a legitimate reason as to why, I would have at least expected an official statement towards Hrothgar/Viera players.

"Hello dear adventureres of Eorzea. We hope you enjoy your time playing as much as we enjoy working on the game and delievering content to you. We are aware that some players in this game feel ignored, particularly Hrothgar and Viera players. Understand that we are currently having issues with creating content for said races due to time constraints and our schedule overlaping with the developement of Endwalker. Do know that we are fully aware of your requests and we understand your frustrations. We will find a way to overcome this issue in time. Thanks for your understanding."

If they would've went with this approach you'd have much less threads begging for hairstyles. It's the baffling intransparency and lack of an official statement that is driving Viera players insane (unless there is an official statement, it would prove me wrong). I do agree that these threads are not necessary in quantity. But these players are part of the community just as much as anyone else. More importantly, they are paying customers. They deserve acknowledgement from the developers. Even if they are aware of these issues and the fact nothing has been added since 5.0, that doesn't take away the legitimacy of their concerns.

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Originally Posted by NanaWiloh

When compared to WoW's dev team and budget...yes the FF14 dev team might as well be a Indie dev team.

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IIRC FFXIV's dev team is larger than WoW's. An infographic from the Stormblood era showed that the game had about 300 devs. I don't think that the WoW team ever broke 200, and a lot of the WoW team devs have been siphoned off to other projects or laid off.

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Originally Posted by NanaWiloh

When compared to WoW's dev team and budget...yes the FF14 dev team might as well be a Indie dev team.

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It's not because WoW's is possibly bigger that SE is a small indie company and that it should be acceptable for them to put so little work into that.

Not big vs small budget, it's big vs bigger "budget"

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

That would be ideal, yeah, but the only way I could see that happening on the NA side of things is by making this a requirement just to keep us looking decent and orderly. But seeing how certain pandemic restrictions were viewed...well...lol I'd expect there to be an uproar. "You can't tell us what to do, SE!" "Muh rights!" "But the ToS!" "I'll do whatever I want!"...and so on. I know what it's like living here. :p Much to my dismay, of course. It's just how things are, online or offline.

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NA community in a nutshell. I'd be active in other EU parts but I want to converse in english so here i am, as a european.

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Originally Posted by lalin

snip

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Nothing about your OP was polite. So I don't understand why you expected a favorable response when go around calling people toxic.

I’ve seen reports of random Hrothgar NPCs in Bozja have hairstyle/face combos not available to players. Not major, named NPCs, just background NPCs.

Still, I think Covid borked up minor projects like this.

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Originally Posted by Akimori

Its not berating them for disagreeing. Its berating them for berating the players who try to start discussions about this sort of topic by calling them entitled, spoiled, etc etc. The point of my statement is that if they didn't have anything that actually progressed the discussion whether its them agreeing or disagree, but instead of just basically telling them to shut up because they're lucky we got Viera/hrothgar or something stupid, then.yea. Please read :)

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Point is you are berating other players since at the core you are telling people if you do not agree with their statement then do not bother to post in the thread. By agree I mean you may not like their statement but you are in agreement with how they phrase or what their criticism is regarding the subject. In essence that is a case of entitlement.

That is the point I was making their message does progress the discussion cause unless it is blatantly trolling their opinion is still valid no matter how others may perceive it.

As I said though overall SE really needs to work on their communication with the community.

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Originally Posted by MorionQ

I’ve seen reports of random Hrothgar NPCs in Bozja have hairstyle/face combos not available to players. Not major, named NPCs, just background NPCs.

Still, I think Covid borked up minor projects like this.

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Yugiri has had a face/horn combo unavailable to Au Ra players since she was first unmasked back in 2.55, so I wouldn't take that as an indicator of anything.

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Originally Posted by MoofiaBossVal

IIRC FFXIV's dev team is larger than WoW's. An infographic from the Stormblood era showed that the game had about 300 devs. I don't think that the WoW team ever broke 200, and a lot of the WoW team devs have been siphoned off to other projects or laid off.

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Blizzard's annual revenue was 8.09 billion $ in 2020, Square Enix's was 2.4 billion, almost 3.5 times lower. That said, the size of the team isn't everything. The budgets Blizzard and SE can spend on their projects simply isn't comparable. Some folks tend to think SE baths in gold - well, they don't, even though "2.4 billion" may sound like a huge amount of money (it is, but not with the amount of projects and, ironically, the amount of people they have. Sometimes bigger team means more issues than benefits, given you need to pay all these people their wages and additional expences like insurance and others, and this is just people inside the company without the cost of mainting and renewing servers and computers or spendings on marketing and all that, all of which doesn't come free either).

That's not much of an exuse to the fact Viera and Hrothgars didn't get even a single additional haircut in 2 years, but honestly this "small indie company" meme is tiring at this point - they aren't even in top 10 among GameDev companies in terms of wealth. Yes, they aren't an indie company, but they aren't nearly as rich as people apparently imagine them to be with all these SE vs Blizzard comparisons.

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Originally Posted by Awha

Point is you are berating other players since at the core you are telling people if you do not agree with their statement then do not bother to post in the thread. By agree I mean you may not like their statement but you are in agreement with how they phrase or what their criticism is regarding the subject. In essence that is a case of entitlement.

That is the point I was making their message does progress the discussion cause unless it is blatantly trolling their opinion is still valid no matter how others may perceive it.

As I said though overall SE really needs to work on their communication with the community.

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Im a bit confused...How is basically telling them to get lost because their "you're entitled" contents are putting down other players actually progressing the discussion....?

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

I think racial issues are a bit more important than your EGI glamours but that's just me. I suppose your egi must be very upset not being able to wear any new hairstyles. But hey I won't trade my Viera alts I love them even with the limitations. I'm also reasonably optimistic we see significant additions with the upcoming xpac.

And I support those willing to let the devs know they're not happy.

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Why is what you want more important than what others want? That's just being selfish. SE stated the Egis would get new skins every few patches along with a better system for applying them being worked on. It has be 4 or 5 years with no new info. You guys were told you would get new hair in the future and have be throwing hissy fits with every new hairstyle release.

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Originally Posted by spf1200

Why is what you want more important than what others want? That's just being selfish. SE stated the Egis would get new skins every few patches along with a better system for applying them being worked on. It has be 4 or 5 years with no new info. You guys were told you would get new hair in the future and have be throwing hissy fits with every new hairstyle release.

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Oh hissy fits. Oh really. If you say so. Sorry but your pets aren't as important as the new race additions I hate to break it to you at least in my humble opinion. You're entitled to your opinion certainly but I'm sure people like myself with summoner roles on some alts could give a hoot about our egi.

The new race additions shouldn't be second class racial additions and deserve at least some love. They've gotten nothing in 2 years and that's simply ridiculous. If you can't find that there a a problem when new hats or hair are added for all the other races (events and patch updates) and they get nothing I don't know what to tell you. People with those races have every right to make their feelings known and I'm happy to see them do it.

I'll say prayers for your egi btw I promise every time I go to bed.

And I'll add that at the very least the director and development team owe the community a status update of what to expect and when and just maybe you wouldn't see threads like this popping up all the time.

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Originally Posted by spf1200

Why is what you want more important than what others want? That's just being selfish. SE stated the Egis would get new skins every few patches along with a better system for applying them being worked on. It has be 4 or 5 years with no new info. You guys were told you would get new hair in the future and have be throwing hissy fits with every new hairstyle release.

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I think that's because people were told they were getting new hairstyles later on in Shadowbringers expansion, but we're on patch 5.5 (which means 2 years has passed since ShB started). Egi glamours are also a valid concern too, but people are more afraid of races getting the egi glamour treatment (aka the feeling of infinite hiatus) since this is about a character's avatar and that has a lot more character customization involved than changing egis since a majority of the cutscenes involve your character as a whole whereas changing egis may not be applicable if you don't play Summoner.

I was thinking by the title this was a reminder to not ask for more races but HNNNNNG I-I'm fine....just trying to enjoy my bun bun WoL here. No regrets...none...[pours a drink for the upteenth time]

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Originally Posted by Akimori

Im a bit confused...How is basically telling them to get lost because their "you're entitled" contents are putting down other players actually progressing the discussion....?

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Because it is a general forum where people are free to state their opinions. The action of disagreement or wanting a certain feature are not what is considered entitled (cause SE did say they were coming, granted per covid) but the desire to not have people post because you may not perceive their input as fruitful to the conversation is though.

Forums are not meant to be echo chambers or player policed zones. Outside of certain cases anything added to a thread could be seen as a progressioning the discussion even if it is at the expense of the OP or those in supports feelings.

That is just me though never been a fan of the whole please don't post here if you do follow x y and or z. It is a general forum people should be encouraged to post. This is going off topic though.