It's funny how when a bunch of people positively advocate for something in North America, there is always a little knee-jerk reaction against it.
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03-27-2019, 01:15 PMniteypants
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03-27-2019, 01:18 PMstormygabeHonestly, I feel like people like that take the few who are actually being caustic and inflate them to include the entire group. They kinda sound like those people who, as an example, accuse someone of being overly sensitive when they try applying a certain type of critique to a certain type of entertainment. I also think it's interesting considering a vast majority of people asking for a stop to the gender locks are doing so in an amicable way. But what can ya do... I guess we're all just a bunch of crybaby SJW whiners.Quote:
Originally Posted by Galaktica
Keep calling for gender unlocks folks! We won't get them without trying! -
03-27-2019, 01:37 PMreivaxe
As for the topic, I agree. It makes the most sense to do things this way when you think about how things are...
It feels like people have gone into such a tizzy they have forgotten basic reading comprehension.
I'm gonna disregard this foolish sexism bit.Quote:
Originally Posted by Angelitus
They have said several times that with their current work flow this ... is it. This is as many races they can handle and still get everything done as fast as they have been. A lot of work goes into not only design and development of a race but also going back and readjusting all gear they can use to fit them ... and it doesn't stop there. They also have to factor in all future gear and animations and such seeing as everything going forward has to have support for that race to. The game is much bigger than it was when it became ARR, as things are added it becomes much harder to support the added strain of introducing new races.
So no, them politely saying they will "look at feed back" doesn't change that fact. They may never say NO out right but that doesn't mean you're gonna see them pop up in 6.0 or ever really.
I personally don't really foresee them changing it. They have had it hard getting ready for this new Expansion and I feel it shows in the game. -
03-27-2019, 01:52 PMTsumdereThey can come into the positive threads and be negative like "unsub lol" and "male bunnies gross and don't follow lore", but we can't touch their threads. No no no. Can't have that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Galaktica
On topic though, I disagree. I respect the work it takes to make a new race and do not expect the other genders any time soon, but I would like to see them. -
03-27-2019, 01:58 PMgrinkdaboyit's because they feel like the sunken cost fallacy they've integrated into their feelings toward the game are being attacked and need to be defended. see: blizzard bootlickers when bfa launched and it was just a big dumpster fireQuote:
Originally Posted by niteypants
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03-27-2019, 02:09 PMLeomoonHow is making gender locked races sexist?Quote:
Originally Posted by Angelitus
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03-27-2019, 02:15 PMHalivelThis is true. Still, it does not forbid people to ask them about this and maybe see the change in future. In polite way without weird arguments, of course (quite small amount of people overreact in their request anyway).Quote:
Originally Posted by reivaxe
Back in start of 4.0 some my acquaintances talked about possible implementing of Viera and I personally was like "uhm no, too much work and the lore is quite against" and it was not only my opinion and well... here we are. Vieras were a thing for few years, this is a result. If implementing missing genders going to be a thing for a long time too - they really can reconsider it. The problem in this case will be resources... adding new race now for 5.0 is hard already (8000+ armor items). In 6.0 and later it's going to be only worse, so they should be absolutely sure that it's worth (which most likely will be worth in case with Vieras, but I can't say anything about Ronso. I would like to create female alt cause I usually play beast races in games, but well, it's me). -
03-27-2019, 02:26 PMSennIn my opinion, they should get started on making male viera and female hrothgar as soon as they can for this very reason. It's not because I'm impatient. I'm actually a pretty patient guy. However, their workload will only get worse the more gear comes out. I think in this stage, they are looking at feedback and considering whether to implement these two genders. Perhaps I'm going to sound optimistic, but I'm going to guess their response to unlocking the genders will be affirmative, even if they won't officially announce it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Halivel
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03-27-2019, 02:38 PMLittleChickenNuggetWhen you have one group screaming loudly and making a scene, they tend to drown out the rest of them. You always notice and remember the loud ones.Quote:
Originally Posted by Galaktica
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03-27-2019, 02:49 PMAlucard135Here's an example of a civil one that drownedQuote:
Originally Posted by LittleChickenNugget
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...mmurise-thread. -
03-27-2019, 03:09 PMreivaxeNot saying it does.Quote:
Originally Posted by Halivel
But them saying "We'll look at feed back" doesn't mean "Basically confirmed!" as that poster was making it seem. -
03-27-2019, 03:11 PMSennI was only speculating.Quote:
Originally Posted by reivaxe
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03-27-2019, 03:17 PMHalivelSure, I see you point. Just.. some people tend to react in way "muh shut up already stop whine" which is a little bit wrong because in the way how they see it, the fact of implementing female Vieras now and other genderlocked races in past is the result of "whining", too. So there is overreacting on both sides of this conflict.Quote:
Originally Posted by reivaxe
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03-27-2019, 03:26 PMSennI might even go back to my original support thread and check to see if any people who were against adding viera fantasia to female viera when they come out... lolQuote:
Originally Posted by Halivel
Even when we're being reasonable about our requests, we get shut down. Those who mock and belittle us get to enjoy the fruits of our labor later down the line forgetting how it is exactly we got these cool races. It's a shame. -
03-27-2019, 03:26 PMxbahax92
I do wonder what people gain by whiteknighting something they wont gain anything from.
Does it pleasure you that much? So people dont get what they desire for?
Can you really sleep if Yoshida would indeed agree cause of this?
Do you enjoy that much when people go berserk and cause on outrage again.? Are you being that sadistic? -
03-27-2019, 04:07 PMVirusOnlineSo you would also agree on halting development on BLU as well ?Quote:
Originally Posted by Vomitbelch
Your argument is quite one sided. Why is it only the genderlocks that should be ignored ? Because of stress and strain ? BLU development as such a unique class could take years to fully implement, but unlocking gender is just too hard and so should not do it ?
Coming from someone who is familiar with the game development process, there is almost always stress and strain, especially the larger a team is.
No one is asking for them immediately, we know not to expect immediacy.
So in this logic on any issue ever, because one person is acting like a toddler, the rest of the hundreds of thousands needs to be punished. Eureka !Quote:
Originally Posted by Vomitbelch
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03-27-2019, 04:20 PMLaphaelWhat you say is all just opinion.Quote:
Originally Posted by VirusOnline
I for example don´t need more races, but i like Eureka. For me it would be much better if they put their ressources into that content.
And btw there was only 1 person activly working on Blue mage, they even said that. And making a new race is much more work, so compareing those two things doesn´t make sense. -
03-27-2019, 05:42 PMreivaxeI really hate how strangely personal people seem to take any opposition to their PoVs and how they color said opposition as malicious.Quote:
Originally Posted by xbahax92
To put it in the most basic way I can think (Cause most people don't seem to get why it's hard for them to just add a race) it's like ... going to a circus and watching someone ride a unicycle, do tricks and juggle stuff at the same time.
Entertainer says: I'm juggling 7 colorful balls! I can ONLY handle juggling 1 more colored ball and still do all the cool tricks I have planned ... but you all like the colors so I'm gonna grab this half yellow and pink ball!"
Small group of people in the front row: BOOOOOOOO!!!! We want a 9th! *Insert all the ways people take this as a personal attack and threaten him. Also toss in claims of sexism or w/e alarmist nonsense they use to get attention*
Juggler: Uhhh, I figure people wouldn't be happy. I'll think about it but this is really pretty much all I can handle ...
Other people: Juggler, it's ok. I enjoy your show and I'd love more colored balls but it's fine if that's all you can legit handle. I wouldn't want to see fewer tricks because you're trying to do something you can't handle well.
Front Row Group: Why are you whiteknighting them!?! Why would you want ME not to see more balls juggled!? What could you gain by voicing an opinion that doesn't align with me seeing a fully pink ball juggled ... and yellow ball I guess!
That's what this sounds like to me.
I mean, I'm unique in this I think.
I was a firm believer in the Blufever leaks. He said 2 races so that's what I was expecting no matter what people said. And I even thought it was silly to think they would gender lock. Figured that they must have started work on these 2 new races after HW was released and THAT'S a long time so that's how we could get 2. And unlike most all people asking for unlocks (being a Femroe for years at the time of this post for you future peeps) I felt like I'm one of the few who would actually PLAY as a tall Lion woman. I know I'm going Viera but I always figured that if they look good to me I'd jump races around sometime. (still gonna flip flop if I like the guy I can make in the benchmark)
After the confirmation I was let down some ... but then I read them say SEVERAL times how hard it seems to be for them to add races and how they can only handle this much. I look back and reflect on how I haven't felt the need to do these seasonal events ... because they're so busy being hard at work making Viera and Da Beasty Bois along with all the other stuff for ShB that they're willing to make a lame AF DRK Sword and a CUL 2nd hand Knife be the glam rewards for friggin Valentines day and leave us the durppy Ghost Minions for Halloween. Looked back on other things that are suffering as we go towards to this next expansion and realized it's not bad to be content.
So yeah, I'm fine with them focusing on the other parts of the game if this is as much as they can handle with their work flow and still get things out as fast as they normally do. Adding a new race is a huge undertaking that permanently adds more difficulty for them moving forward.
In a prefect world I everyone would be happy ... maybe they will figure out a way to improve their work flow or maybe they will have a break through in updating their spaghetti code.
People are free to voice their opinion and I'm free to tell them " I'm OK with this". -
03-27-2019, 06:08 PMSelovaAnd calling someone a troll and claiming they are triggered just because they made a thread respecting the dev's decision isn't toxic? Talk about hypocritical.Quote:
Originally Posted by manickitty
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03-27-2019, 06:18 PMSinSiew79
I find it just sad how ludicrously entitled alot of ppl playing this game are. "I WANT A PINK PONY NOW AND IF I DONT GET IT SE ARE AGAINST ANIMALS; BURN THEM ALL!" like grow up already. it's a game, not your personal erp playground. I seriously hope Se wont add male viera or female Hrotgars, I hope they wont be swayed by all the crybabies. And if ppl quit the game over this? good riddance.
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03-27-2019, 06:27 PMCampi100% agree with you :)Quote:
Originally Posted by SinSiew79
Looks like the erp-com is hard toxic o: -
03-27-2019, 07:23 PMShurrikhanQuote:
Originally Posted by Lacan
False ultimatum much?Quote:
Originally Posted by Seraphor
Though, yes... yes I was, if it actually followed the concept art this time. -
03-27-2019, 07:27 PMEmmanellain
I don't understand how you can't respect the devs and also express that you want opposite sexes for the new limited races?
90% of the people asking for male Viera and female Hrothgar are actually giving constructive feedback and exchanging fan artwork considering Yoshi announced they would be open for the feedback?
a lot of us have loved Viera since 2006, and being able to actually play a male Viera has never been an option, now they can give the fans and old fans an exclusive FFXIV take on the male Viera.
As for the ones that are miffed, and disappointed.
That's not entitlement, people just feel let down that SE is going back to the genderlock they themselves admitted was a mistake in 1.0 and practically said they wouldn't go back to.
If the community never see the shadow of a female Hrothgar or Male Viera, that's that.
If we get them in 6.0, it's a win/win, so I see zero point in fighting the people that want to end the genderlock.
but that's just me.
I'm pretty sure everyone can agree the development team work on a really tight schedule and allocate a ton of extra hours into this content, I don't think a single person here doesn't appreciate the creators. In the end they're the ones who decide what content we get. -
03-27-2019, 07:38 PMxbahax92I just dont get it in which way male Viera or female Hrothgar will hurt your gameplay?Quote:
Originally Posted by SinSiew79
If you are against it, fine by me. Im not here to convince people, but just go play the game as it is then?
But if people come up with lore or their immersion as a point, it makes me shake my head. NPCs that might have to change cause of lore or people that use arguments like "homophobic" or "ERP" are just extreme exaggerations.
There are enough things that break the lore and soon enough our Prince Lucis is gonna appear in Eorzea, which is totally normal right?
Beside you find in total maybe 2 moon keepers in the whole game, for a male race that is very much non existent but a playable race.
So I dont understand why people are voting for genderlocks because they do not lose anything from it. It looks rather that people enjoy the tears and salt of others, which just proves my point. -
03-27-2019, 08:00 PMChocoFeruExcept they're not sexist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Angelitus
After reading tons of player's accusations against the Dev team, I hope they never release male Viera and female Ronsos. Devs shouldn't fall into that kind of traps.
All my support to the Devs, and shame on everybody who feels entitled enough to call them sexists with no evidence at all. -
03-27-2019, 08:04 PMCampiI just dont get it in which way Genderlock will hurt your gameplay?Quote:
Originally Posted by xbahax92
Just play the game like it is and the devs make it?
You don't need the male viera to play the MSQ, you don't need it to do any content, you even don't need it to do rp. :>
So I don't unterstand why ppl are voting for male viera, because they don't lose anything. It looks like they just don't want that something is unique. I don't need to have everything.
Looks like the ppl enjoy the complainment with "sexist", "homophobic" and stuff like that :shrug: -
03-27-2019, 08:07 PMNekoNovaQuote:
Originally Posted by Campi
Voting against the gender-lock : Increasing options and variation in the game
Voting for the gender-lock : Limiting options and variation in the game. -
03-27-2019, 08:30 PMLaphael
Thanks SE for listening to your players and giving us not only 1 but 2 new races for shadowbringers!
Not only do you give us the long wished Bunny race you also give us a more beastlike race many players were asking for.
Most ppl understand, that developement time, staff and ressources are not infinite. -
03-27-2019, 08:34 PMACE135Then why don't we have an infinite number of races, classes, Armor, Dungeons etc.? Anything less than infinite would be limiting options and variation in the game, right?Quote:
Originally Posted by NekoNova
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03-27-2019, 08:39 PMLaphaelVoting against gender-lock: Increasing options and variation in the game for style onlyQuote:
Originally Posted by NekoNova
Voting for the gender-lock: Freeing up ressources for other content in the game
Fixed that for you -
03-27-2019, 08:50 PMNekoNovaYou are right, it would be best, but sadly SE doesn't have the infinite resources for this.Quote:
Originally Posted by ACE135
I'm not sure this applies entirely.Quote:
Originally Posted by Laphael
The team responsible for creating the characters is not responsible for creating new dungeons/zones for example.
So your statement is not entirely correct.
That said, I personally would be okay if they just released one race with both genders, and added the other race later on.
The order wouldn't even matter to me, but it would have prevent the entire shitstorm.
But probably started another I suppose. -
03-27-2019, 08:54 PMChocoFeruVoting against gender-lock: Decreasing game content such as less zones, less dungeons, less new jobs, less gear, less options.Quote:
Originally Posted by NekoNova
Voting for gender-lock: Increasing game content such as more zones, more dungeons, more jobs, more gear, more options.
Because devtime and resources are a thing, and the priority should be the game quality before cosmetics. -
03-27-2019, 08:58 PMNekoNovaQuote:
Originally Posted by ChocoFeru
see previous reply, that's not how "dev resources" work -
03-27-2019, 09:04 PMLaphaelIf it was that easy, we would have gotten a new race for HW and SB too, because by that logic a whole team had nothing to do for 2 expansions. But thats not how it works.Quote:
Originally Posted by NekoNova
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03-27-2019, 09:05 PMChocoFeruThen delete the resources part and stick to the "devtime" and voila, you got your answer.Quote:
Originally Posted by NekoNova
You've gotta find a new excuse to keep the hate.
Edit: also, making a new race affects the teams who design emotes, gear, sounds and so on. -
03-27-2019, 09:10 PMSouljackerThen how about just no new races at all? I mean, THINK of all the copy-pasted dungeons we could have if they hadn't added this! Think of all the copied telegraphs we could be dodging instead! Just think of all the tomes we could be grinding!!!! I, for one, haven't had NEARLY enough tome grinding yet in this game.Quote:
Originally Posted by ChocoFeru
This argument is weak and tired. -
03-27-2019, 09:11 PMniteypantsThis is a bad take because adding male viera and female hrothgar isn't cosmetics or aesthetics -- characterization is game quality and gameplay. If you don't agree, go change your Lala into a male roegadyn. Why not?Quote:
Originally Posted by ChocoFeru
It's a question of priorities and not resources, and most players are giving respectful and succinct appeals to Square to change their priorities. What's wrong with that? -
03-27-2019, 09:14 PMPixelburstYou're sexist.Quote:
Originally Posted by Angelitus
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03-27-2019, 09:16 PMLacan
Going off of Yoshi's interview with Mr. Happy, it honestly sounds like they wanted two full races to begin with but were limited by dev time and resources, likely coming from orders from above. Yoshi didn't want the genderlock and understood that people would be critical of it from the start. People creating the outrage they have over it might actually be helping Yoshi get the okay from the higher ups to dedicate more resources to the game to finish out the races.
I mean, it is well known how the execs at SE feel about the XIV project. They're always pressuring Yoshi because it doesn't make as much as their mobile division. He likely has to fight for every allotment they get. Being able to show them, "Look how much the community wants this. Could we please have the additional resources we need to do it?" would be a good bargaining chip.
I don't get people being bitter about it to the point they support genderlocking races that the dev team doesn't even want to. But I guess spite is a powerful thing? Lol -
03-27-2019, 09:19 PMGalakticaQuote:
Originally Posted by SinSiew79
Players playing the two races most notorious for ERP strawmanning to dismiss the inclusion of remaining genders for upcoming races.Quote:
Originally Posted by Campi
I'm not saying either you ERP...but...c'mon.