Goodbye strength tanks. Let us never be forgotten.

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Originally Posted by Voulgar

this honestly just makes me irritated, with every other job/class they will be getting more damage getting more gear, tanks are going to be doing less damage than current, which means holding agro will be harder, and there will be no actual feel of progressing and feeling like you get stronger with the gear. It sucks. I enjoyed str tanking a lot, really pushed the boundries between me and my healers during A3s and A4s but oh well we got our clears while it was still possible.

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That's why you're getting native enmity boosts in most abilities. Holding hate will be fine, and if you wanna do DPS, play a DPS class.

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Originally Posted by Voulgar

this honestly just makes me irritated, with every other job/class they will be getting more damage getting more gear, tanks are going to be doing less damage than current, which means holding agro will be harder, and there will be no actual feel of progressing and feeling like you get stronger with the gear. It sucks. I enjoyed str tanking a lot, really pushed the boundries between me and my healers during A3s and A4s but oh well we got our clears while it was still possible.

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They have stated that enmity modifiers are going to be adjusted - and it's also in the patch notes:

Shield Oath Use will no longer interrupt weaponskill combos.
Damage penalty has been reduced from 20% to 15%.
The amount of enmity generated has been increased.

Grit Use will no longer interrupt weaponskill combos.
The amount of enmity generated has been increased.

Warrior Defiance The amount of enmity generated has been increased.

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Originally Posted by Lilith_Merquise

That's why you're getting native enmity boosts in most abilities. Holding hate will be fine, and if you wanna do DPS, play a DPS class.

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You're really uninformed and really have a narrow minded view on what str tanking was, or maybe just don't know anything about the way a good tank performs in Ffxiv, please leave our thread

"Goodbye strenght tanks
Though I never knew you at all
Because I main a Paladin
And my dps was always small
You called out to our static
And carried us through dps checks
Now you belong to patch nerfs
We should press X to pay respects

And it seems to me you lived your life
Like a candle in the wind
Always dancing through stances
Because a scrub joined in
And your footsteps will always fall here
Along Eorzeas's greenest hills
Your candle's burned out long before
Your legend ever will"

Rip in pieces my dearest WAR offtank

よしだあああああああああ！！！

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Originally Posted by Lilith_Merquise

if you wanna do DPS, play a DPS class.

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Tell SE to make OT more important than 10-25% of a fight or recovery only. OT is pretty much a DPS job when not handling adds or extra mechanics. They bring alot of potential to overall raid DPS.

lol I play WAR and DRK, I know how it works, but that's not how it was intended to work. And until SE wakes up and realizes hybrid classes are fun and making classes do more then their square peg. That's how it is and how it will be. Also I'm not uninformed which is why @Kaurie listed what I was saying, where as you have said nothing to why I am such.

Also true, but you still will be able to DPS, it's not like you're going to lose all your DPS and deal 10 damage. You just won't be able to OT Fell Cleave and compete with subpar DPS players. Also they've mentioned that going forward strict DPS checks will not be a thing, therefore the DPS Meta is dead. More reason why it's not necessary for tanks to put out fat numbers, and if you go back and do old Alex Savage, you'll have overgeared it easy and will have 0 difficulty meeting DPS checks.

They probably realize str tanks have fun.
But they want to appease the casual crowd first and foremost - meaning healers that can't deal with str tanks.

Ideally, everyone would have gear options like tanks did, but instead we're going the opposite direction.

"STR Tanks" Haha! Good one!
Get some better DPS, you didn't need to carry them if they were good.

Also on a side note, where was that "Ice Mage" everyone always complained about, but never proved to exist?

I feel like this next raid patch is going to end up looking like those Coil T7 days...you can do all the DPS you want, but that doesn't help if you can't do mechanics.
DPS won't be as necessary, which is why they are changing the meta. This will require even the bad STR tanks to learn their job more and to know what their doing.

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Originally Posted by Kaurie

STR, (s)he hates losing the DPS rankings to WAR

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Uhh No? Most of the time I'm top DPS in anything I do, so don't make assumptions it just makes you look idiotic when you know nothing about the person. When I finish A3 Savage with 1200 so I think I do pretty good compared to most people out there.

Regardless this thread was a goodbye for STR tanks that cared. We had fun, we did things noone wanted us to do in the name of optimization and in the end we got patched into a more streamlined system.

I'm glad I won't have to fight for accessories for one, but riding the edge of health, survivability, and DPS was something that drew many of us to tank and there were even some of us that were *gasp* good at it. Maybe not myself, I'm not here to lord over others, but I definitely had alot of fun balancing DPS with survivability.

I won't lie though, I can't wait to see the threads in 2-3 weeks about tanks that don't cycle CD's again. It's going to happen and then we will be right back to the same complaining that started in 2.0. We might as well go back and necro the threads now.

As a vit-tank, I will miss the days of taking over for the remainder of the Void Ark run after strength tank #52693 ran out of health while trying to tank an easy boss. Dead = 0 DPS.

This the circlejerk thread? Where do I stand?

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Originally Posted by Gyson

As a vit-tank, I will miss the days of taking over for the remainder of the Void Ark run after strength tank #52693 ran out of health while trying to tank an easy boss. Dead = 0 DPS.

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to be fair if the tank is doing stuff right then thats a healers fault they died..

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Originally Posted by SpookyGhost

This the circlejerk thread? Where do I stand?

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Hopefully not the center.

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Originally Posted by karateorangutang

Hopefully not the center.

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Are you kidding?! He needs to get in the center fast x_x!!!


On topic yes good riddance full STR tanks. You will be swiftly forgotten.

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Originally Posted by TheUltimateSeph

Are you kidding?! He needs to get in the center fast x_x!!!

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Now he can!

Dem sprint pvp buffs.

Im curious if people in this thread hate all str tanks or just the bad ones.

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Originally Posted by Gyson

As a vit-tank, I will miss the days of taking over for the remainder of the Void Ark run after strength tank #52693 ran out of health while trying to tank an easy boss. Dead = 0 DPS.

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And I will miss the days of VIT tanks desperately trying to hold hate off me while I'm in DPS stance. :3

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Originally Posted by Ashkendor

And I will miss the days of VIT tanks desperately trying to hold hate off me while I'm in DPS stance. :3

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Little too much fantasy happening in your fantasy game there, bud. ;)

Can't recall that happening ever. If that's an issue you ran into, it probably had more to do with i-level differences and less with who was wearing VIT or STR accessories.

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Originally Posted by Gyson

Little too much fantasy happening in your fantasy game there, bud. ;)

Can't recall that happening ever. If that's an issue you ran into, it probably had more to do with i-level differences and less with who was wearing VIT or STR accessories.

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Gotta face the facts that with equal skill and gear a str tank walked all over a vit tank in agro generated and DPS.

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Originally Posted by Gyson

As a vit-tank, I will miss the days of taking over for the remainder of the Void Ark run after strength tank #52693 ran out of health while trying to tank an easy boss. Dead = 0 DPS.

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lolwut?
The damage output of the bosses in Void Ark is so low that if a tank dies, it's either:
1) They're dumb and stood in crap (e.g. Cu's barf)
or
2) Healers' fault

It's not gear related.

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Originally Posted by Andrea

Gotta face the facts that with equal skill and gear a str tank walked all over a vit tank in agro generated and DPS.

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Oh, there is no doubt that if both tanks are trying their hardest to hold onto mob, the one stacking STR is going to win (assuming comparable gear). That goes without saying.

However, that is absolutely never an issue for a VIT tank, not unless the tank stacking STR is intentionally trying to steal threat away. That certainly doesn't happen when they're "in a DPS stance".. that only happens when that tank (STR, VIT or whatever) is being a grade-A twit and not working as a team.

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Originally Posted by Gyson

As a vit-tank, I will miss the days of taking over for the remainder of the Void Ark run after strength tank #52693 ran out of health while trying to tank an easy boss. Dead = 0 DPS.

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Another sadly mistaken thread poster. Can you Debbie's please all leave the thread with your lame attempts at bad jokes about situation that involved bad tanks, not str tanks.

Thank you

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Originally Posted by Iagainsti

Another sadly mistaken thread poster. Can you Debbie's please all leave the thread with your lame attempts at bad jokes about situation that involved bad tanks, not str tanks.

Thank you

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STR tanks are bad tanks

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Originally Posted by TheUltimateSeph

STR tanks are bad tanks

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care to explain?

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Originally Posted by Gyson

Oh, there is no doubt that if both tanks are trying their hardest to hold onto mob, the one stacking STR is going to win. That goes without saying.

However, that is absolutely never an issue for a VIT tank, not unless the tank stacking STR is intentionally trying to steal threat away. That certainly doesn't happen when they're "in a DPS stance".. that only happens when that tank (STR, VIT or whatever) is being a grade-A twit and not working as a team.

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While this is indeed true, i always let the VIT tank MT.... because whats the point of me tanking when his DPS would be abysmal anyway. However, when I'm sitting there using only SP and SE on my DPS rotation and VIT PLD is sitting on the mob spamming only RoH cause hes so afraid of losing hate, then that is the ultimate facepalm. Not doing your own DPS rotation because your afraid of not being useful is completely silly and I see it almost every single time I'm in that godforsaken Void Ark.

Maybe you don't do this, but I see it an awful lot, and sadly it's primarily PLD's that I see doing it. It makes me sad because I mained PLD for a long time before 3.0 when I was requested to switch. Playing defensively and outputting DPS are not mutually exclusive situations in FFXIV.

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Originally Posted by Iagainsti

Another sadly mistaken thread poster. Can you Debbie's please all leave the thread with your lame attempts at bad jokes about situation that involved bad tanks, not str tanks.

Thank you

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Yes, I got it. ; ) Every STR tank in this thread is an example of tanking perfection. All the ones that die horribly are just bad.

If there are suddenly a whole lot less "bad tanks" starting tomorrow, we can revisit this discussion and ask why that is.

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Originally Posted by Andrea

care to explain?

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Wow like a hungry shark. Nah not really. I shouldn't have to.

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Originally Posted by Andrea

Im curious if people in this thread hate all str tanks or just the bad ones.

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I'm going to assume that we're automatically talking about the baddies. It's just more common to come across bad str tanks than vit tanks, in my personal experience. /shrug

Finally a point to get Fending accesories \o/

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Originally Posted by TheUltimateSeph

Wow like a hungry shark. Nah not really. I shouldn't have to.

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Ok, in that case Im gonna just say players named Seraph Morningstar are bad then. After all clearly thats all someone needs to do for something to be fact.

I'm going to miss feeling like a "man-mode" str tank though. Now I get to feel like the immovable object. Rawr.

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Originally Posted by Andrea

Ok, in that case Im gonna just say players named Seraph Morningstar are bad then. After all clearly thats all someone needs to do for something to be fact.

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Because tanks are supposed to be tanking not DPSing and to use STR gear instead of VIT gear is gimping their HP on purpose and being rude to other players they queue with and making it harder for healers to keep them alive because their HP pools are smaller then the dps. At that point might as well just get rid of the tank and add a third real dps.

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Originally Posted by karateorangutang

While this is indeed true, i always let the VIT tank MT.... because whats the point of me tanking when his DPS would be abysmal anyway. However, when I'm sitting there using only SP and SE on my DPS rotation and VIT PLD is sitting on the mob spamming only RoH cause hes so afraid of losing hate, then that is the ultimate facepalm. Not doing your own DPS rotation because your afraid of not being useful is completely silly and I see it almost every single time I'm in that godforsaken Void Ark.

Maybe you don't do this, but I see it an awful lot, and sadly it's primarily PLD's that I see doing it. It makes me sad because I mained PLD for a long time before 3.0 when I was requested to switch. Playing defensively and outputting DPS are not mutually exclusive situations in FFXIV.

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I think having a raid-wide threat meter (rather than just party-wide, or at least one that shows the top 8 threat generators) would go a long way in alleviating the problem you're describing. It is difficult to tell what game the other tanks are playing on any given run, and I'm sure nearly every tank that has stepped into Void Ark (or any other 24 man raid) has found themselves wondering "what are the odds that all the other tanks here aren't going to be #$%hats?" before the petri-dish walls vanished.

It will be nice to feel like a tank again and not some wannabe dps. Was str the meta, without a doubt. Did I comply to maximize my dps, yes. Did I agree with it, resounding no. Goodbye Str tanking, you will not be missed by me.

~Signed~
Traditional Tank

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Originally Posted by Kyros

Look at it from the playerbase perspective: The large majority of their interaction with STR tanks where shepple that had no clue what they where doing, went STR, and did worse than a VIT specced tank would. A bad VIT tank might lose hate, but a bad STR tank was a true nightmare: It costed healer DPS and it died easier, and most of the time the damage added wouldn't offset the lost from healers.

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Except no one is going "Boo all those tanks that stacked STR and couldnt handle it!", theyre going "BOO STR tanks" with no clarification.

For everyone saying that everything changes tomorrow, the main thing that is staying the same is the overall mindset.

People who go "STR tanks are BS\Good riddance!" think the tank's job is to stand there, build a suitable level of aggro, and stay alive.
People who pushed themselves for STR in pre 3-2 thought the tank's job was to be a dynamic member of the raid, build and maintain huge aggro and quick snap aggro, contribute strongly to a group's DPS to push mechanics\make DPS checks easier, AND had to be more in control of their CD rotation than a turtle tank.

Also, I love how we go "BUT THE HEALLLERRZZ??!!111" - what about the DPS? Wouldn't you prefer a skilled tank pushing damage as high as they could rather than someone who COULD do more but chooses to give 75% the effort of the rest of the raid?

Doesn't matter though. I'm sure whoever comments next had one time that one guy totally screwed up, gaiz, like srsly, so STR tanks are 100% terrible in all situations. There's no denying it took more confidence, skill and ability than being a VIT tank with a happy finger for CDs did, sure - and there's no denying that good tanks who stacked STR were ALWAYS better than good tanks who stacked VIT.

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Originally Posted by Edewen

It will be nice to feel like a tank again and not some wannabe dps. Was str the meta, without a doubt. Did I comply to maximize my dps, yes. Did I agree with it, resounding no. Goodbye Str tanking, you will not be missed by me.

~Signed~
Traditional Tank

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STR tanking going away doesn't mean maximizing DPS goes away. Think this is probably a common misconception filling this thread, that the STR meta being gone means that DPS tanking is gone as well and that we need to fondly look back on it.

Str tank, Vit tank, idk. Do your job, do it right.

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Originally Posted by TheUltimateSeph

Because tanks are supposed to be tanking not DPSing and to use STR gear instead of VIT gear is gimping their HP on purpose and being rude to other players they queue with and making it harder for healers to keep them alive because their HP pools are smaller then the dps.

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Funny you should say that as when talking about un-equipping your job stone you told me this.

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Originally Posted by TheUltimateSeph

why bother kicking them for playing on a class in the first place? Because you want to take a chance at getting someone who might be more efficient at their role? This is why I defend "lazy" play and "gimping" yourself. Because if they are actually contributing something to the party you have no one but yourself to blame when the run goes slower because your attitude towards them is bad or you kick them for their choice of playstyle. Can't wait till people follow your train of logic further down the tracks and start vote kicking people who's gear simply doesn't meet their standards.

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So for Job stones its ok to gimp yourself, but for gear its not?

You also claimed that people would start vote kicking people due to gear not meeting standards..but here you are calling every strength tank bad...?

Then theres also this gem on people complaining about people gimping themselves....

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Originally Posted by TheUltimateSeph

Also to all these arguments saying it's rude and selfish etc. for people to gimp themselves like this, I just wanna say you come off at least equally as selfish in your complaints. It's always they are slowing down MY run, wasting MY time, ruining MY experience. It's MY sub and I shouldn't have to play with these bad players. So much Me Me Me

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