useless scholars

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Originally Posted by thunderbreak

Ok, if it's 25% then I remembered wrong, but if it heals about the same but can't be as effective in cleric stance or diseased isn't that still a nerf? I mean this topic is about Scholars not dpsing, and I feel lustrate has a contribution factor to it for sure.

And about that deliverance tanking....I'm really wondering if this is intended by SE or not.

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Well, you can call it a nerf if you think that not being able to use it in cleric is a big deal. On the other hand it can now crit and it's effective on other party members other than tanks, so if you don't have any problem at stance dancing it can actually be considered as a buff. As for deliverance...out of the 5 new skills WARs received, 3 are the dps version of already existing ones, so if it wasn't intended devs really screwed up.

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Originally Posted by samkitwood

why are 90% of scholars in this game adamant on not wanting to dps? .........I'm at 70-80% hp you don't need to use lustrate ill sort myself out from there. Stick to whm if ya don't wanna dps n find a new game if ya cba or too ignorant to learn how things should be done

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I think its time to lay off the dps with our healers. If ppl are comfortable doing both, they will, if not then be an adult and carry on.
If everyone survives then their "job" is complete....period
I dont heal...but its getting really old this complaint and it needs to stop imo.

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Originally Posted by LeeraSorlan

Funny story even, i was in a low level dungeon as a whm, didnt feel like dpsing, one of the dps so rudely said "can u stop standing around like an idiot and start dpsing?" so, i Xclassed ruin and used that over and over without cleric, well, i was dpsing at least, right?

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I would have stopped healing and only dpsed. "Opps, was dpsing and forgot to heal".

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Originally Posted by Lastelli

Snip from eveything he's said thus far

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Seems to me like you're the only l33t one here and everyone else should bow down to your awesomeness. I think you should rewrite all the rules of the universe to fit your exact and only way of doing anything ever at all for the rest of time itself. I still have the inkling that someone will botch that up too so you can find another outlet to tell people they're bad.

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

It can still be viewed as a nerf if you look at it strictly from being able to heal through debuffs and cleric stance. But in terms of healing power, lustrate actually got a boost/buff.

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Is it affected by debuffs? I was doing Ramuh EX the other day with solo tank and even when they had 3 overcharges, lustrate was still doing the same amount

I've come into mostly healers who just have a lack of understanding or maybe just don't care? Not just scholars, all of them. There are plenty reasons that some users do not DPS, though I'm noticing the extreme of DPS or not DPS'ing being common. I wonder if it's because they're doing FATES so much that they're loosing out on the extra tid-bits you can only get while jumping into dungeons?

I was tanking Darkhold last night and we kept dying. It was a mixture of two things, the healer dying standing in aoe's on trash and the Arcanist (not smn.) kept running too far ahead and would get hate from the next set of mobs that wander around. The healer in the end could not heal the second boss, didn't use regen and popped all cool downs before going in, otherwise just stood there.

I had a hard time staying alive so I looked at her gear, it was up to date except on the accessory side which was left blank except two VIT pieces.

On the other hand I've had players come in who only dps jobs previously and were new to healing, some don't DPS it's a bit of pressure to anticipate the party's HP so you're sure you have time to DPS then heal.

Then there's other times when the party stands in everything and you get no time to heal. Then..there's the I'm tired, I just need this run my mind is sooo far away from this dungeon that I'm already checked out lol.

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Originally Posted by Ashelia_Ferron

Is it affected by debuffs? I was doing Ramuh EX the other day with solo tank and even when they had 3 overcharges, lustrate was still doing the same amount

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If I remember right, lustrate can cure through healing down debuffs because it counts as an "ability" and not healing magic.

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Originally Posted by Leigaon

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Sounds like you just had terrible teammates. One who doesn't understand their job and game mechanics, and the other who doesn't understand party basics and roles.

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Originally Posted by Ashelia_Ferron

Is it affected by debuffs? I was doing Ramuh EX the other day with solo tank and even when they had 3 overcharges, lustrate was still doing the same amount

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I assumed it would be affected by debuffs but, as Blessedbythesun noted, it seems some of them only affect spells. I'm now wondering how it interacts with other debuffs...

Regardless, Cleric Stance does affects both spells and abilities. Benediction is the only healing action that isn't affected by CS now, AFAIK, and that can't be cheesed much thanks to its 5 minute CD.

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Originally Posted by Leigaon

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Yeah, honestly, a lot of the time if I don't DPS on my healer it's because I just got done a long raid night or something and I'm pretty much a zombie by that point. I've also noticed that there seems to be some polarizing around the subject, probably because people hold such strong opinions.

Personally, outside of the current raid tier, my view is "DPS if you want to/feel comfortable/etc". But, meanwhile, the two sides will rage at each other...

I dps because the healers in this game have no other option to do anything else but dps when your party is topped off. We don't have any significant supporting skills or any debuffing/buffing responsibilities so the only other thing I resort to when I don't need to heal is dps. I mean I've been playing healers and mmorpgs for about 7 years now some get them right, some don't. This game in particular could use some work on the healer roles and give us some responsibility other than iheallol.
How about halfing the potency of all the Stone skills for whm as an example and give them a debuff that lasts for 5 or 7 seconds that decreases the enemies defense or magic resistance by 10%. Or an insta buff that increases raid offense by 10% that lasts for 20 seconds with a 15 second cd?

Short version: The reason you see so many healers doing nothing when everyone's topped off is because there's nothing do once everyone's topped off besides dpsing.

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Originally Posted by RadiantRay

How about halfing the potency of all the Stone skills for whm as an example and give them a debuff that lasts for 5 or 7 seconds that decreases the enemies defense or magic resistance by 10%. Or an insta buff that increases raid offense by 10% that lasts for 20 seconds with a 15 second cd?

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Yeah the closest thing to this is Astrologian, but even then, they only get to play with cards once every 30 seconds.

I'd love more supporty stuff personally, though something would need to be done about button bloat...

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

Personally, outside of the current raid tier, my view is "DPS if you want to/feel comfortable/etc". But, meanwhile, the two sides will rage at each other...

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I am with you on that, I do believe it is reasonable for healers to DPS at their discretion. What I don't support is polarization to one side or the other. In this particular case, the assumption that a SCH not DPSing means they are trash and just leeching.

Or you could put some DoT while not in Cleric Stance. People won't notice your damage tho (Unless the parser guy gonna complain about SCH's DPS so low, I don't care IMO)

I do not like to stand still. If I can shield a tank and then spend 10-15 seconds for dots and broils while the fairy heals then I think that's a valuable use of time. Ideally I think you want to maximize your contribution, and this is in no way unique to SCH's (it's why DPS have openers and rotations). Obviously if your tank is made of paper you will not want to risk a cleric cooldown, but if you are comfortable and an adlo + fairy would allow you to dot + bane or whathaveyou, then it's lax to not take advantage. Even a WHM can regen targets and then blast away for a few rounds in raid settings (and do not underestimate WHM burst, as Stone III > Broil)

But having said that, this is a game, and if a relaxed pace is fun for you then I won't criticize you for it; your foremost priority should be having fun. However, taking advantage of your class and opportunities to do your best is also a way to enjoy the game, and the one I personally prefer. I hate just standing around.

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Originally Posted by samkitwood

why are 90% of scholars in this game adamant on not wanting to dps?

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why does sch need to dps to begin with, it should be a completely voluntary thing (yes i dps every now and then on my sch, but i wont scold another for not doing it)

if you are hurting for the extra dps from a sch, the dps in your party need to get good, the content is made so healers dont have to dps, nor tanks, they just "do their jobs"

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Originally Posted by warren-ragnarok

why does sch need to dps to begin with, it should be a completely voluntary thing (yes i dps every now and then on my sch, but i wont scold another for not doing it)

if you are hurting for the extra dps from a sch, the dps in your party need to get good, the content is made so healers dont have to dps, nor tanks, they just "do their jobs"

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Why should it be voluntary and not mandatory? You didn't make the game, SE did. And in this game about half of healer's kits are dps and they have the ability to contribute meaningful dps to parties while healing. For good gameplay in FFXIV in most content, healer dps is required. If anyone isn't trying are or doesn't care, so be it. But all jobs should try to use their entire ability sets to be the best teammates they can be. I think that's fair to require from my fellow teammates, and they can expect the same from me

You have no idea what you are talking about, the meta says healer must dps, that leads to more wipes than i can count on my fingers.
If you don't feel comfortable or its not within your ability, let it go, srly. Do you mainjob healing first before adding sugar and creme to it, because dead dps/tank is more dps than you can ever contribute to within that time(given that they not entirely sux).

Ofc if you are doing savage that's a different story, but how many are actually doing it well? not many, so leave that be, not every sch you see is a dps-maschine, if you can great, if not don't, nothing to do what the meta says but rather what you can do, and i expect not much from people, so this discussion won't even come up.

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Originally Posted by MariaNyan

You have no idea what you are talking about, the meta says healer must dps, that leads to more wipes than i can count on my fingers.
If you don't feel comfortable or its not within your ability, let it go, srly. Do you mainjob healing first before adding sugar and creme to it, because dead dps/tank is more dps than you can ever contribute to within that time(given that they not entirely sux).

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That's sort of an irrelevant point, mainly because it's assumed that you are properly fulfilling your primary role as a healer before you start contributing to DPS. As for the DPS contribution, being able to pull 1500+ DPS for the first half of A2S as a SCH is certainly enough of a contribution compared to Tank DPS. ;p Even our WHM was doing around 1200 DPS. Seeing numbers like that really does make you wonder how much of a hinderance those 'heal only' healers could be to a progression group.

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Originally Posted by Kabzy

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You're talking about endgame raiding for players that make up a very small percentage of the population. The type of content that could actually hinge on healer DPS because Alexander savage has been a massive DPS to begin with. If a designated healer isn't DPSing in savage, something is wrong. But again, that is strictly endgame raiding, which currently makes up 4 instances out of majority of the current content. Your point is irrelevant because the majority of the population of the game aren't playing the limited content that pushes them to play more methodically.

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Originally Posted by Blessedbythesun

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But if you actually read my post you can see I'm responding to someone who is describing the current 'meta'. The current meta only applies to the 4 instances making up said endgame raiding, and so the point is very much so relevant. I know he then says Savage is different, but I think he's confusing himself because that's what the meta is. All other content is just a repeat of dungeons and other content that even fairies can solo heal.

So the argument seems to be 'it's ok to be bad, cos you don't have to be good'....great, lol.

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Originally Posted by DarkerOrange

So the argument seems to be 'it's ok to be bad, cos you don't have to be good'....great, lol.

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This is a bit like saying a SMN is bad if they never use Eye for an Eye, even if they top the DPS charts.

Of course, it's ideal if one uses their full toolkit. But someone that handles their primary responsibility well isn't bad just because they neglect a few extras.

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Originally Posted by warren-ragnarok

if you are hurting for the extra dps from a sch, the dps in your party need to get good, the content is made so healers dont have to dps, nor tanks, they just "do their jobs"

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Yeah, and I suppose it's my job to give a reality check: DPS is a party responsibility. It doesn't matter what color your icon is.

This reminds me of someone in the tank forum who said Alex Savage was designed for tanks to wear full VIT right side. If that were true we'd have more blistering tank busters that required the given HP, but we don't so all that extra HP is just a waste. Over 17k is just wasted in A3S. There are shorter intervals for the tank swaps in P4 compared to normal.

DPS could be putting out an average of 1400 and that could really be on the high end for their job, and it's darn hard to add another 200+ to that when they are hitting capacity with potions, and party buffs. Then you have mechanics that will arbitrary hurt their DPS to no fault of their own (quarantine in A4S). . Healers and tanks have the capacity to help raid-wide DPS, and notice I said healers. Not just one.

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

This is a bit like saying a SMN is bad if they never use Eye for an Eye, even if they top the DPS charts.

Of course, it's ideal if one uses their full toolkit. But someone that handles their primary responsibility well isn't bad just because they neglect a few extras.

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I feel bad for anyone getting picky over a "jackpot mitigation" skill. But I totally agree.

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Originally Posted by technole

I feel bad for anyone getting picky over a "jackpot mitigation" skill. But I totally agree.

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Oh, there have been times (progression sorts of times) where I've begged the SMN to rotate it with me. The RNG factor really isn't that bad because auto attacks are frequent enough to trigger it and it lasts a while once triggered. It's also worth pointing out that those really early BCoB clears? A lot of their strategies included rotating E4E and Virus (before Antibodies existed). They're both really valuable abilities when you're pushing content.

OTOH, like healing DPS, it's nice but ultimately doesn't matter in other things ~.^

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Originally Posted by technole

This reminds me of someone in the tank forum who said Alex Savage was designed for tanks to wear full VIT right side. If that were true we'd have more blistering tank busters that required the given HP, but we don't so all that extra HP is just a waste. Over 17k is just wasted in A3S. There are shorter intervals for the tank swaps in P4 compared to normal..

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This actually comes from an interview/dev comment. They said healer DPS was not considered in party/raid encounter design. Tank DPS is considered, in tank stance with vit.

It is possible they changed that just for Alex Savage, I suppose, but there's been no other official information. Healer and tank DPS is still invaluable when attempting to clear below the target ilvl, and/or with DPS that are not performing to the developers' expectations.

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

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No, that's not an apt analogy. A SMN who doesn't Eye4Eye is closer to a BLM that doesn't use Apocatastasis or a MNK that fails to Mantra. These moves disrupt DPS rotations but take only a single cooldown. DPS'ing as a healer requires cleric stance and the 5 second cooldown lock.

For all jobs "downtime is wasteful". A DPS just auto-attacking is considered bad because they probably aren't playing the class well. Healing is a little different, but the idea of avoiding waste is just as important. This is why "overhealing" is frowned upon, as it wastes resources, and like inactivity is something a player giving their best should try to avoid. But if your heals aren't required and you have 10 seconds free then is there any reason not to land your dot rotation while the fairy heals? Don't do it if you're not comfortable with incoming damage, but if you can make the fight faster then that is something a player maximizing their role will do.

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Originally Posted by Blessedbythesun

You're talking about endgame raiding for players that make up a very small percentage of the population. The type of content that could actually hinge on healer DPS because Alexander savage has been a massive DPS to begin with. If a designated healer isn't DPSing in savage, something is wrong. But again, that is strictly endgame raiding, which currently makes up 4 instances out of majority of the current content. Your point is irrelevant because the majority of the population of the game aren't playing the limited content that pushes them to play more methodically.

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Here's the thing though - it's not just Savage. I was solo healing some Ravana runs last night to get weapon for peoples alts and just for fun, and even though I'm a SMN main with healer alts, my 190 SCH was able to add 200 dps while solo healing. And Admittedly, I am not a very good healer. If I was a better player, I am sure I could have done more. And what if a group was doing that with 2 healers...so much time when not healing is needed. When I run 4man dungeons for dailys - I generally do like 500 dps over the whole dungeon. And if I wasn't - I'd be standing there twiddling my thumbs half the time doing nothing. I actually don't know how healers don't dps in dungeons - they must be drinking coffee and reading the news or watching a movie as they are playing.

The times when a healer shouldn't be trying to help dps are extremely limited - maybe while actually leveling with a poorly played or undergeared tank. But that's about it. The vast majority of the content simply doesn't have enough needed healing uptime to make dpsing not pretty much required/beneficial/should be doing it depending on your preferred phrasing for such.

I don't understand why people don't think that all players should be trying to use use their entire skillsets to be the best teammates they can be. I think that's fair to require of your teammates and commit to yourself.

There are a lot of games where healers can't dps while healing, or their damage is so low as to be pointless to try and do so. But FFXIV just isn't one of them. I feel like a lot of players are attempting to take their experience from other games or their personal preference of how they like to play and state it as a reality in FFXIV, when it just simply isn't the case here.

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Originally Posted by Risvertasashi

This is a bit like saying a SMN is bad if they never use Eye for an Eye, even if they top the DPS charts.

Of course, it's ideal if one uses their full toolkit. But someone that handles their primary responsibility well isn't bad just because they neglect a few extras.

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Actually this is a terrible comparison. Taking SMN as the example you gave, they can simply weave in Virus and E4E as necessary while still maintaining their DPS (both ogcd). It doesn't require the same commitment as healers going into Cleric Stance. Also a DPS' primary responsibility lasts for the entire duration of the fight, healers will usually find downtime in which they can safely add to DPS and not just stand there looking pretty. So they definitely have more scope to explore their full toolkit!

I'm in the Process of Leveling Summoner. However, as someone who has always played a Black Mage as their primary class, I will be perfectly honest; I came across FAR too many SCH's who thought they were DPS, not healers. Do you know how ludicrous it is to spam Physick as a Black Mage because the SCH can't be bothered to drop out of Cleric Stance and actually heal the tank? I -really- hate to say it, but that's happened to me more than once in my time playing. It doesn't keep the tank alive, but part of me hopes out of pure SHAME the Scholar will get back to healing.

So, I don't Stance Dance. I'll toss some DoTs up now and then if I know there will be a lull in incoming damage, but my priority is to keep the tank alive and the party in good shape.

As a thought to leave off on, is a DPS slacking off if they're not healing with what healing skills they possess?

No. Just no. Do not ever use cure/physick as a BLM, it is just bad. Stop it.

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Originally Posted by Vexander

As a thought to leave off on, is a DPS slacking off if they're not healing with what healing skills they possess?

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You're making a false equivalency, and a big one. DPS is actually bad for using cross classed healing skills because they don't have healing stats and have effectively made the fight last longer by slowing the party's damage output. DPS never had downtime in a fight by design.

Healers who don't DPS are wasting time doing nothing half the fight.

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Originally Posted by DarkerOrange

No. Just no. Do not ever use cure/physick as a BLM, it is just bad. Stop it.

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Well, you can't use Cure as a BLM =)

And I haven't really used Physick in ages outside of solo content where I feel like sleeping a mob and topping off my HP. But, I've had a fair few dungeon runs where, to my horror, the SCH was that bad. Not that it helped much since the tank died anyways, but still. Sometimes I think players in dungeons are bots... They never respond when you tell them things, even using the translator, and are just horrible.

Recently went back to leveling my SCH and have to say...on no other healing class have I found it to be THAT stressful to try and dps in between. The fairy isn't even remotely helping, the tank's HP drop just as fast as if I had regen up on him on WHM/AST, sometimes even faster because the fairy takes her sweet time to do ANYTHING, and if I order her to do buffs/despells, she even loses a GCD. Regen ticks don't ever miss a GCD, just sayin' :x

But my main problem with SCH is that, when I switch stance and dps, the tank's HP drop and I have no means to raise them quickly again after I switch back to healing. Lustrate is weak as hell AND limited to having aetherflow stacks available. After dpsing on WHM and AST, I throw two or three big heals at the tank (or my REALLY big instant heal, if he's close to dying, which btw SCH also doesn't have, at least not at my lvl, 57) and he's at full HP again. Lustrate isn't just weaker than any other "big" heal, I also usually do not have several aetherflow stacks available because I used at least half of them on dpsing. Adlo is not helpful either, one single hit and it's gone, and tanks usually get hit several times in the span of one GCD because at least in dungeon runs, they have several monsters hitting them.
So yeah, while I do dps on SCH, I do it a lot less regulary than on my other healers, simply because my tank is always about to die whenever I do so. It's not because I'm lazy, I'm just preventing us from wiping.

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Originally Posted by Atoli

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I think you need a lot more practise with the job if that's the case. SCHs can pretty much get away with not healing at all in dungeons and letting the fairy do everything. You need to make use of all your defensive CDs for the tank while DPSing and maybe manage your AF stacks better for those emergency moments. Maybe you've had an unlucky streak with all STR tanks or something?

Also saying that Lustrate is 'weak as hell' kind of discredits your opinion here. I'm pretty sure every healer who knows what that spell does will disagree with you on this.

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Originally Posted by Kabzy

I think you need a lot more practise with the job if that's the case. SCHs can pretty much get away with not healing at all in dungeons and letting the fairy do everything. You need to make use of all your defensive CDs for the tank while DPSing and maybe manage your AF stacks better for those emergency moments. Maybe you've had an unlucky streak with all STR tanks or something?

Also saying that Lustrate is 'weak as hell' kind of discredits your opinion here. I'm pretty sure every healer who knows what that spell does will disagree with you on this.

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I think it depends on the tank, really. I've had tanks where I've never had to use Lustrate, but I had to alternate adlo and physick with my fairy spamming it's heal to keep the tank up. I've also had tanks who I could spam 6 lustrates on and barely keep alive. On trash. A bit of a problem is knowing your party, and if you do duty finders, you don't know your party. The best parties I've had, I could've DPS'd in, but the few times I had, I was told to stop and just focus on healing. The worst parties I've had, I started running out of mana with. Sometimes players are picking up an old class, or they're under-geared. These things happen.

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Originally Posted by samkitwood

Its what your role does so do it.

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Just want to throw in some info...:

Did you know that a green class color (in the party interface) marks the Healer. SCH have that green color so their role is to heal.

Don't get me wrong, but if you are ranting about something you should stay away from such statements to avoid misunderstandings.
BTT: I somewhat agree with you, that not-dpsing as a healer somewhat wastes the time of not only yourself, but also the others.
Considering though, that everyone wants to play the game as they want, you, yourself need to accept that it might be their way of playing their class.
Of course the run is faster if the heal does damage and of course many are doing it ( more or less ), but it is just wrong to assume that it is in the interest of every player.
So you got two choices, either: deal with it or kick him and risk a ticket for abusing vote kick.

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Originally Posted by Kabzy

I think you need a lot more practise with the job if that's the case. SCHs can pretty much get away with not healing at all in dungeons and letting the fairy do everything. You need to make use of all your defensive CDs for the tank while DPSing and maybe manage your AF stacks better for those emergency moments. Maybe you've had an unlucky streak with all STR tanks or something?

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If I don't heal together with my fairy, it takes less than 4 seconds for the tank to fall to 1k HP or less. I rarely get tanks that are a bit more sturdy, but even they are dead by the time I have applied and spread my DoTs if I leave healing to the fairy.
Even if I spam Physick/Adlo together with the fairy and don't dps at all, I've had tanks I could barely keep alive even with throwing 6 Lustrates at them. And it's not equipment trouble either, at least not on my end, since I kept pretty much the full leveling sets after leveling AST to 60.
Defensive cooldowns? Am I missing something? I can use Protect and Adlo (and in theory Stoneskin, but the casttime alone kind of disqualifies it to be cast in the middle of a fight), the tank usually never stays in Sacred Soil anyways (and using it also cripples my dps). Eye for an eye is useful about every third pull, unless it's not, because most monsters in the Aery have magic-based attacks which means even if it triggers, it does absolutely nothing. Eos would be useful against magic-based mobs, but then half of the party starts crying because they want Selene's buff. Don't get me wrong, I don't consider myself a good Scholar by any means, but I hardly see anything wrong with what I'm doing. Leaving it to the fairy is simply not an option.

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Originally Posted by Kabzy

Also saying that Lustrate is 'weak as hell' kind of discredits your opinion here. I'm pretty sure every healer who knows what that spell does will disagree with you on this.

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It heals some HP. With a potency of 600. At most 3 times in a row (or 6, if you get new aetherflow stacks in between and do not need to use them on anything else). It's no magical save-all skill like Benediction or Essential Dignity that gains potency when the tank's HP get low. It's just a slightly weaker version of Cure/Benefic II, with the slight advantage of being instant cast (which Benefic II is pretty often, as well, so not really any gain). It doesn't even have the special traits anymore that it had in ARR that made it useful for situations where healing spells that rely on potency got useless due to anti-heal debuffs on the tank (like in the Ramuh fight). Now it's just a weaker healing spell. So please tell me "what that spell does"...

More on topic:
I really hate it when healers just laze about. As in, they heal if necessary but just don't do anything when there is no need to heal. But at least in my experience, on SCH there is just no time to dps, not because I want to be lazy but because otherwise my party dies. Which is the main reason why I'm always amazed by people writing about how SCH is 90% dps and 10% healer o.Ô

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Originally Posted by Atoli

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It's off GCD. Nuff said.

Of course you can't live by it alone, but if you know what you are doing, - as others said before - you won't need to heal at all in dungeons.
Indeed there tanks out there that are tough as a wet noodle is stiff... and yes these need some more attention, but overall, you almost always have enough time to dps at least a bit.

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Originally Posted by Atoli

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I'm not sure what to say here. In my admittedly limited experience with leveling scholar, outside of a few heavy damaging boss encounters, I've only had to leave cleric stance to cast healing spells on average about twice a dungeon. My girlfriend who plays exclusively DPS (mains SMN) tends to roll her eyes and call me "dime store summoner" or "wannabe DPS" when she watches me play SCH in group content.

I am still waiting on that video from DarkerOrange doing Expert roulette with out a pre-made party to give me hard proof that it's "very, very easy" for a SCH to go right in without healing almost the entire dungeon, if not the entire thing. Meanwhile I am becoming entirely aggravated at this notion that, outside of leveling under level 40 as SCH, Eos and Selene can completely carry the weight of healing now. Not only does it sound ludicrous, it undermines all the healing roles by saying SCH can go full DPS and the fairy can effectively replace not just SCH healing, but WHM and AST.

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Originally Posted by Atoli

It heals some HP. With a potency of 600. At most 3 times in a row (or 6, if you get new aetherflow stacks in between and do not need to use them on anything else). It's no magical save-all skill like Benediction or Essential Dignity that gains potency when the tank's HP get low. It's just a slightly weaker version of Cure/Benefic II, with the slight advantage of being instant cast (which Benefic II is pretty often, as well, so not really any gain). It doesn't even have the special traits anymore that it had in ARR that made it useful for situations where healing spells that rely on potency got useless due to anti-heal debuffs on the tank (like in the Ramuh fight). Now it's just a weaker healing spell. So please tell me "what that spell does"...

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Lustrate still bipasses the healing debuff in Ramuh btw, because it's considered an action with a potency, not a spell. So there's one thing the spell does. xD

BUT anyway, I'm not trying to call you out. It's just Lustrate is an amazing spell. 600 potency, instant oGCD heal is no joke. Also you're almost never at that point where you need to spam it more than once if you're taking care of your primary role first. Being an instant cast heal is not a 'slight' advantage.

As for the DPS thing, generally people are talking about raid scenarios where you have a WHM taking care of the healing part. In dungeons, things can get sketchy depending on the party, but honestly the Fairies make healing so lenient. I actually can't figure out any reason as to why you're unable to find more downtime to DPS. In dungeons, SCHs have the perfect tools to add DPS in almost every scenario.