Zepla: Endwalker is the Worst FFXIV Expansion I have played

Can we please stop repeating the phrase "dimply tart." I've never seen it before in my life, and I've already seen it written more times than I ever needed to.

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Originally Posted by ty_taurus

Can we please stop repeating the phrase "dimply tart." I've never seen it before in my life, and I've already seen it written more times than I ever needed to.

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At this point we are well on our way to semantic satiation. We'll repeat the phrase until it's lost all meaning.

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Originally Posted by Zairava

She absolutely does not have to tone done her opinion because people refuse to see the bigger point she is making. It doesn't matter if she put it politely enough as if she was coddling a child, people would still find reasons to be upset toward her for one reason or another.

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That would actually annoy me more than anything. I'd rather have someone swear at me than have them talk to me like I'm a fragile toddler who needs their feelings protected from the big mean words.

Zepla is right, the community cannot take ANY criticism about 14 at all. On the main subreddit an hour ago I said that 14 was falling behind the other big MMO's like GW2 and WoW and that comment is sitting at -13 votes right now.

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Originally Posted by SargeTheSeagull

Zepla is right, the community cannot take ANY criticism about 14 at all. On the main subreddit an hour ago I said that 14 was falling behind the other big MMO's like GW2 and WoW and that comment is sitting at -13 votes right now.

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Actually that’s because it is a bs troll post trying to drum up a stupid “Console Wars” type internet slap fight.

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Originally Posted by SargeTheSeagull

Zepla is right, the community cannot take ANY criticism about 14 at all. On the main subreddit an hour ago I said that 14 was falling behind the other big MMO's like GW2 and WoW and that comment is sitting at -13 votes right now.

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I think it's often less what you say and how you say it, and this isn't a "FFXIV community" thing, it's a Human thing.

"I think you might get better reactions from people if you attempt to enhance your personal presentation."
vs
"GOD you stink! Have you showered...ever? My nose is offended by your very presence. You disgust me, you slob! And what's with those clothes? Have you never heard of an iron, washing machine, or style in your life? Maybe if you weren't such a sack of trash, people would give you the time of day!"

Both are essentially saying the same thing, but one is VERY likely not to be taken as an honest attempt at critique and helping. I saw someone in FFXIVdiscussion saying how they were just honestly critiquing the game in the mainsub but were attacked for it. When the folks in Discussion asked for them to link to the thread they got downvoted, the person got evasive, refused to say it, then deleted their posts. The going take on the Discussion sub was that the person likely was kind of a dick in their OP and didn't want people to tell them that might be why they got the downvotes, not the critiques themselves, and the person ended up deleting the threads/posts rather than face the fact that it was how they were saying things - basically being insulting and a jerk to everyone - not what they were saying.

Very often, we think we're saying things in a way that is neutral and fair, but people don't take it that way. Part of this is just a downside of text communication, but sometimes it is people being kind of...dicks. And then shocked when people mouth off to them in return.

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Originally Posted by Renathras

I think it's often less what you say and how you say it, and this isn't a "FFXIV community" thing, it's a Human thing.

"I think you might get better reactions from people if you attempt to enhance your personal presentation."
vs
"GOD you stink! Have you showered...ever? My nose is offended by your very presence. You disgust me, you slob! And what's with those clothes? Have you never heard of an iron, washing machine, or style in your life? Maybe if you weren't such a sack of trash, people would give you the time of day!"

Both are essentially saying the same thing, but one is VERY likely not to be taken as an honest attempt at critique and helping. I saw someone in FFXIVdiscussion saying how they were just honestly critiquing the game in the mainsub but were attacked for it. When the folks in Discussion asked for them to link to the thread they got downvoted, the person got evasive, refused to say it, then deleted their posts. The going take on the Discussion sub was that the person likely was kind of a dick in their OP and didn't want people to tell them that might be why they got the downvotes, not the critiques themselves, and the person ended up deleting the threads/posts rather than face the fact that it was how they were saying things - basically being insulting and a jerk to everyone - not what they were saying.

Very often, we think we're saying things in a way that is neutral and fair, but people don't take it that way. Part of this is just a downside of text communication, but sometimes it is people being kind of...dicks. And then shocked when people mouth off to them in return.

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tldr

"she said something i dont like so she deserves it"

moving on

I think someone doesn't have friends who bantered with him.

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"GOD you stink! Have you showered...ever? My nose is offended by your very presence. You disgust me, you slob! And what's with those clothes? Have you never heard of an iron, washing machine, or style in your life? Maybe if you weren't such a sack of trash, people would give you the time of day!"

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This is over the top that actually, everyone, I mean everyone, would take it as a joke.

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Originally Posted by FenyxRising

I think someone doesn't have friends who bantered with him.

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Or maybe after doing a little joke, they pampered him and gave him some good headpats to make sure they were okay and that it didnt hurt their feelings

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"GOD you stink! Have you showered...ever? My nose is offended by your very presence. You disgust me, you slob! And what's with those clothes? Have you never heard of an iron, washing machine, or style in your life? Maybe if you weren't such a sack of trash, people would give you the time of day!"

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Are you good bro ?

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Originally Posted by SargeTheSeagull

Zepla is right, the community cannot take ANY criticism about 14 at all. On the main subreddit an hour ago I said that 14 was falling behind the other big MMO's like GW2 and WoW and that comment is sitting at -13 votes right now.

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got a link to the reddit? and wanted to chime in keep in mind on how the community attacked lazypeon to a point where he took down the video and quin

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Originally Posted by Renathras

I think it's often less what you say and how you say it, and this isn't a "FFXIV community" thing, it's a Human thing.

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I don't think so. At least not in relation to FFXIV, since very vocal elements of the community are notorious for throwing absolutely anything and everything at someone critical of the game in an effort to intimidate or silence them. Multiple people have brought this up throughout this very thread, revealing that they and/or someone they know have been the target of credible threats of harm. It's alarmingly common.

Even not accounting for the threats, another common tactic is deflection. Post a source? A reason will be conjured up as to why it's 'wrong' even if it's a direct quote from the game itself. Tone and subject policing is very common. Quite a lot of posters - who are known to be exceedingly emotional or aggressive in their own posts - will often attempt to insinuate that there's something wrong with the individual they're engaging with in an effort to pass them off as hysterical or unhinged. We've seen this at play in this very thread, I believe, when a certain poster attempted to police the facial expressions of a content creator.

I've posted around these parts for quite some time. Particularly in recent years - and conveniently aligning with the game's major problems reaching critical mass - the backlash against criticism even when perfectly polite and constructive has become rather intense.

It's also a game that encourages people to self insert so there's a bunch of players who treat liking or disliking the 'wrong' characters as the worst sin known to man.

It's so great that this is what this conversation has devolved to. Instead of discussing the issues with Endwalker and our concerns that Dawntrail is just going to be more of the same (or even going further in that direction), it's could Zepla have worded her video more kindly, what was her body language, how to word your own posts so noone takes offense or who cares anyway cause Zepla is just some <insert insult>. Jfc.

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Originally Posted by Axxion

got a link to the reddit? and wanted to chime in keep in mind on how the community attacked lazypeon to a point where he took down the video and quin

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https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/

Although I don't see the thread that was referenced in the post you quoted to be honest.

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Originally Posted by Rolder50

If you ever want to find bullies and people with questionable attitudes, just say something negative about FF14. As evidenced by the 88 pages in this thread.

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Yeah...pretty much. Her point (also a point I've been voicing for a while now myself) about the community and criticism of the game is being proven with each passing page.

Community: "How dare you! We can take criticism! You're just wrong!"

Also the community: *proceeds to trash talk literally everything about her*

https://media.giphy.com/media/K5Hf3Ixz3rE0E/giphy.gif

Zepla tried to expand the repertoire of her stream and it failed because her community by in large seemed to just want XIV content. Now she is desperately trying to maintain any relevancy at all by turning on the game that made her. Taking a page straight out of many WoW streamers playbook circa 2019.

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Originally Posted by Xaruko_Nexume

Zepla tried to expand the repertoire of her stream and it failed because her community by in large seemed to just want XIV content. Now she is desperately trying to maintain any relevancy at all by turning on the game that made her. Taking a page straight out of many WoW streamers playbook circa 2019.

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WoW had been in decline for a while at that point in time, and community frustration had been building up. It was starting to boil over then, but the situation exploded with Shadowlands, which was released in 2020. Sure, some were probably bashing WoW for the clicks, but the general frustration of the player base was all too obvious. There was a basis for it all, and it didn't have much to do with streamers maintaining their relevancy. WoW still hasn't fully recovered from the last few years, either. Many players had finally had enough of Blizzard and left, never to return.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I don't think so. At least not in relation to FFXIV, since very vocal elements of the community are notorious for throwing absolutely anything and everything at someone critical of the game in an effort to intimidate or silence them. Multiple people have brought this up throughout this very thread, revealing that they and/or someone they know have been the target of credible threats of harm. It's alarmingly common.

Even not accounting for the threats, another common tactic is deflection. Post a source? A reason will be conjured up as to why it's 'wrong' even if it's a direct quote from the game itself. Tone and subject policing is very common. Quite a lot of posters - who are known to be exceedingly emotional or aggressive in their own posts - will often attempt to insinuate that there's something wrong with the individual they're engaging with in an effort to pass them off as hysterical or unhinged. We've seen this at play in this very thread, I believe, when a certain poster attempted to police the facial expressions of a content creator.

I've posted around these parts for quite some time. Particularly in recent years - and conveniently aligning with the game's major problems reaching critical mass - the backlash against criticism even when perfectly polite and constructive has become rather intense.

It's also a game that encourages people to self insert so there's a bunch of players who treat liking or disliking the 'wrong' characters as the worst sin known to man.

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Yes I got called a misandrist for calling them out about those comments. A lot of people end up just devaluing her because "She's just annoying, her face, opinions, etc" When most people forget we have a large community because of people like her.

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Originally Posted by Xaruko_Nexume

Zepla tried to expand the repertoire of her stream and it failed because her community by in large seemed to just want XIV content. Now she is desperately trying to maintain any relevancy at all by turning on the game that made her. Taking a page straight out of many WoW streamers playbook circa 2019.

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Oh is that right? I wonder what happens if you rank the games she plays by average viewership.

https://i.imgur.com/3yD0vaj.png

Oh....

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Originally Posted by SargeTheSeagull

Zepla is right, the community cannot take ANY criticism about 14 at all.

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I think that isn't really true. There are things that nobody defends, such as:

• The fact the story is massive and only getting bigger, preventing people catching up to a friend who is at max level very easily.
• The UI being annoying, such as managing lots of different inventories.
• Not being able to communicate with people in duties through /tell.
• Lack of variety in Expert roulette.
• Lack of decent item level syncs for old duties such as the first max level trial of each expansion.
• Pre-ordering an expansion not giving you access to the prior expansions until the actual launch day (really bad for sprouts).

If people don't take criticism of the game, then either they simply disagree or the tone and wording is the part they disagree with because perhaps they would make such a criticism without being a negativity nancy about everything else. For example, their outlook is going to be more like "that part is not very good, but all these other things are good!"

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On the main subreddit an hour ago I said that 14 was falling behind the other big MMO's like GW2 and WoW and that comment is sitting at -13 votes right now.

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What really do you expect? It's like going into a bar and saying alcohol is unhealthy. Sure it is, but it's trolling to go there and say it.

But I think that if you're going to argue that then you should use some statistics otherwise it really is just your opinion. Statistics themselves can be subject to interpretation but at least it is not just throwing something out of nowhere with no evidence.

LoL I scanned back through this thread and I think the metagaming herd decided I was a troll and put me on ignore? Apparently my ideas were so radical and unacceptable that it broke their brains and they had to invent weird conspiracy theories about me…. what the actual f***

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Originally Posted by LittleImp

Oh is that right? I wonder what happens if you rank the games she plays by average viewership.

https://i.imgur.com/3yD0vaj.png

Oh....

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lol

Outside of raiding and Ultimates, FF XIV isn't the most entertaining game to stream. If that list is current, then good on you Elden Ring for standing strong. It deserves to be near the top of the list.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

Outside of raiding and Ultimates, FF XIV isn't the most entertaining game to stream. If that list is current, then good on you Elden Ring for standing strong. It deserves to be near the top of the list.

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Actually, one of the most streamed aspects of FFXIV has long been the MSQ. Long before the Asmongold thing, streamers with 200 viewers would go through the MSQ and go through similar things that Asmongold did. They still do and it still happens all the time. People like watching others experience the story that they did.

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Originally Posted by LittleImp

Oh is that right? I wonder what happens if you rank the games she plays by average viewership.

https://i.imgur.com/3yD0vaj.png

Oh....

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https://media4.giphy.com/media/TEcDhtKS2QPqE/giphy.gif

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

Actually, one of the most streamed aspects of FFXIV has long been the MSQ. Long before the Asmongold thing, streamers with 200 viewers would go through the MSQ and go through similar things that Asmongold did. They still do and it still happens all the time. People like watching others experience the story that they did.

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That's fine, too. I'm just saying that, compared to other games, it's probably not the most engaging experience to watch.

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Originally Posted by Lauront

Exactly. It's not just about endgame as in raiding but what is there for me to do in general as a player once I'm at max level? And I think it's rather myopic to think that players don't ask such questions ahead of time to see if the game is worth pouring their effort and sub money into. Not all do, obviously, but being the type of game it is, it's part of researching how the product shapes up by the point you get past the levelling experience.

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Most consumers don't research products at all, especially not low value items such as games.

Day one sales are a good example of that. A game can have millions of sales on day one with no information available outside of reviews from industry critics who've gone through maybe the first 15-20 hours of the game.

Even with review bombs hitting the first week of release, sales can continue to climb because consumers aren't doing any research. New World had 4.5 million copies sold by the end of its first month of release and that had climbed to 17 million by the end of the second.

It usually takes them being burned with a very bad purchase on a similar product before they start doing the research. Even then, they may not bother with a game because they don't see the money involved as a big deal.

So while there are some players who will do that research in advance, I highly doubt its as many as you think. Did you thoroughly research this game and its end game before you purchased it? Did all of your friends?

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

lol

Outside of raiding and Ultimates, FF XIV isn't the most entertaining game to stream.

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FFXIV is a terrible stream game outside of the MSQ/raiding. There is tons of private talk around this between people who stream the game, and some of the games bigger streamers actively loathe that they staked their entire identity on the game during the EW hype period. It's not even because they necessarily hate the gameplay or anything, it's just because it's a really difficult game to stream and it doesn't pay the bills anymore. I've mentioned this a few times, but an insane portion of the FFXIV streaming scene was being floated by just a handful of mega-whales, and when most of them stopped spending/watching, reality came crashing down.

Part of why Zepla is willing to put out a video like this this is because she's built out her presence enough that she doesn't care if her reputation in the 14 community takes a hit.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

Actually, one of the most streamed aspects of FFXIV has long been the MSQ. Long before the Asmongold thing, streamers with 200 viewers would go through the MSQ and go through similar things that Asmongold did. They still do and it still happens all the time. People like watching others experience the story that they did.

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I dont wanna riff on people streaming to 200 viewers, getting that far is actually a huge accomplishment. But those arent particularly driving numbers for a game. The game is boring af to watch. It's currently sitting at place 69 on twitch for a 7 day average of 4k viewers.
For comparison:
Lineage 2 is at 4.1k
Fall Guys at 5k
Among us at 5.2k
Albion online is at 7.5k
Lost Ark at 12.2k
WoW at 60k

I'm sorry but by and large people arent interested in watching other people play ff14. I'm not even saying that as a bad thing about the game, that's just a fact. (Atleast we beat smite lol)

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Originally Posted by Saraide

I'm sorry but by and large people arent interested in watching other people play ff14. I'm not even saying that as a bad thing about the game, that's just a fact. (Atleast we beat smite lol)

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I always forget that Smite even exists until someone mentions it. I don't think I've ever actually played that game.

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

lol

Outside of raiding and Ultimates, FF XIV isn't the most entertaining game to stream. If that list is current, then good on you Elden Ring for standing strong. It deserves to be near the top of the list.

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People only tune in to a FFXIV stream only for the story and watching their favorite streamers their first time reactions. The only other content I can think of for proper viewership is for when an Ultimate comes out but the game is one of the worst MMOs for streaming content imo.

I think the MSQ's would be more interesting to watch other people go through them if there were meaningful choices to make. I get more mileage out of games such as Baldur's Gate 3 or The Witcher 3 on that front since there's a lot of different options as to how the majority of quests can play out - so even if I do not intend to go a specific route myself I can look up the scenes on Youtube to see them if I'm curious.

In FFXIV, everyone is forced down the exact same path with only some very minor tweaks to dialogue.

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

Most consumers don't research products at all, especially not low value items such as games.

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1) Going to just say "bald assertion" here because of how sweeping that statement is, with such a low bar as "at all".

2) "low value" is very much dependent on what you're comparing it to and discretionary expenditures like an MMO sub are some of the first things to go when budgets get tight. The game has a sub as well as upfront purchase cost, and it's not just money but time you're investing in it too. People are increasingly cost-conscious, as well.

3) "Research" in this case is not a particularly high bar (especially if you're saying "at all") since it can involve as little as looking up existing threads on the topic, asking a friend who already plays or asking someone in-game or simply observing with your own two eyes how active the max level playerbase is. I'm not talking about reviews, which have become so fraught with issues that they're often just ignored, but simply looking up/asking for feedback on (or indeed, observing) what the game is like at max level. And it's not hard to find or get.

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It usually takes them being burned with a very bad purchase on a similar product before they start doing the research. Even then, they may not bother with a game because they don't see the money involved as a big deal.

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Or it just takes them questioning what the value of the subscription is when they're curious as to what the game is like when you get through the levelling experience... it's a sub-based MMO, don't forget that. You're treating this like it's a one off purchase.

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So while there are some players who will do that research in advance, I highly doubt its as many as you think. Did you thoroughly research this game and its end game before you purchased it? Did all of your friends?

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Seems like a goalpost switcharoo here, from "at all" to "thoroughly". But yeah, I did in fact research the game and its max level content (not just end game, as was pointed out to you) to see what it's like once you go through the levelling experience. This may not immediately occur to someone who is completely new to MMOs and the importance of a healthy community in them, but a common criticism of this game is that it's not the greatest fun while levelling, so putting aside customers who are simply put off by that altogether and just quit without another word, it's not like the question won't come up eventually.


And besides, the "research" is just one aspect of it, as was mentioned; the other is that you'll eventually cease to be a new player and thus that seemingly inexhaustible backlog of content, some of which may not even interest you, will no longer be as inexhaustible. So whether you research it ahead of time or not, assuming you stick around that point will eventually come. Going back to the original post prompting all of this, the game's current content durability may not be an issue to new players whilst they're new but it eventually will be. The difference researching it will make is how long it takes to find out that could be an issue to you.

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Originally Posted by Axxion

got a link to the reddit? and wanted to chime in keep in mind on how the community attacked lazypeon to a point where he took down the video and quin

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https://reddit.com/r/ffxiv/s/87Nig40M50

Mine is the comment on how WoW’s devs were told to play 14 as homework and the comment I referenced is in the replies to that

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Originally Posted by LittleImp

Oh is that right? I wonder what happens if you rank the games she plays by average viewership.

https://i.imgur.com/3yD0vaj.png

Oh....

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This honestly needs to be much more visible, I'm honestly shocked, I expected other games to be lower than FF14 but maybe just by 10% or 20%, but I didn't expect her to get way more viewers from other games...

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Originally Posted by Vahlnir

lol

Outside of raiding and Ultimates, FF XIV isn't the most entertaining game to stream. If that list is current, then good on you Elden Ring for standing strong. It deserves to be near the top of the list.

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First time MSQ reactions can be good as well. But that is, by definition, a one and done.

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Originally Posted by SargeTheSeagull

https://reddit.com/r/ffxiv/s/87Nig40M50

Mine is the comment on how WoW’s devs were told to play 14 as homework and the comment I referenced is in the replies to that

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That would make since. If i recall correctly, they put out a survey asking people what was the likely hood of you playing 14. It kinda funny if you think about yoshi played wow to get the understanding of it the do and dont and wow devs played 14 to help with dragon flight.

On side note. I notice someone mentions about viewer ship. One thing is with 14 is that its easy viewership the problem is said viewers will try to back seat you when playing and will get upset at you if you dont play it there "way". Like someone mentioned there is not really much to watch as far as content. Like are you going to watch someone grind for hours for a relic that you already have? Are you going to watch them play golden saucer games that you already play. You might if the person streaming is entertaining. But other than that no.

The only time its watched alot is when the world race starts one when its a new patch/expansion, new deep dungeons etc.

Man, Lineage 2 being more popular on twitch is pretty amazing to me, I never really paid attention to 2 but I remember 1 being all about large scale PvP? So I guess that explains some of it's longevity to a certain extent.

On a more positive note, Stray was exceptional. Go play it if you haven't already++

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I don't think so.

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I very much do.

Look at my posts in this thread. I haven't once disagreed with Zepla. I commented on the way she said it, and even in that same post stated points of agreement. And then, got attacked for dozens of pages because I dared to mention how she was talking.

But look at us. I've never accused you of that, because your posts don't do that - least not the ones I've read. There very much is a difference between criticism and insult, and people need to stop pretending there's not when that's the big reason people get pushback when they do. I've made honest criticism of the game - INCLUDING ON THE MAINSUB ON REDDIT - and not been downvoted over it. So it really is how you say as much as what you say.

.

Now, I absolutely DO agree that people will try to avoid accountability or admitting they were wrong (a certain someone here refused to apologize for mischaractierizing my posts as me saying Zepla hurt my feelings but just stopped replying when I demanded proof and I honestly and fine with it staying dead at this point), and some folks (like the below in HB quoted) would rather talk about post length or take snarky jabs at people or people critical of tone rather than discuss the points THEMSELVES.

But those are attacks against people saying the game is good/being positive, so that kind of defeats the argument that the community is critical to any negativity since this forum is critical to positivity but is part of the overall community...

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Originally Posted by ChrysOCE

It's so great that this is what this conversation has devolved to. Instead of discussing the issues with Endwalker and our concerns that Dawntrail is just going to be more of the same (or even going further in that direction), it's could Zepla have worded her video more kindly, what was her body language, how to word your own posts so noone takes offense or who cares anyway cause Zepla is just some <insert insult>. Jfc.

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I mean, it's a fair critique. But note that fair minded people are saying "I don't like her tone, but I agree with her on the merits", but the negative posters are running with that as "HOW DARE YOU NOT COMPLETELY AGREE WITH HER POINTS AND HER TONE!!!" instead of saying "Okay, we disagree on her tone, but we do all agree on the points raised, let's discuss that". Indeed, some seem to REALLY want to derail the thread (and the passive aggressive talking about people present in the discussion in the third person or goading them to try and help derail the thread so they can blame said people for derailing the thread and then harvest likes for doing so) while there are others trying to seriously discuss the topics.

Her tone IS fair game.

But it's not being done by many people to the exclusion of the points. [Key word: "many"]. I've outright addressed points and agreed with some of hers. Funny how that isn't worth mentioning by the people heckling me. Even if you have no problem with her tone, there's no harm in saying "Okay, I see where you're coming from on the tone - don't agree, but do understand at least. But it seems we agree on the lack of content and that DT needs to address this?" If you say that, I'd say "Yes, very much in agreement. Here's what I think needs to be addressed... <list>"

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

I think that isn't really true. There are things that nobody defends, such as:
...
What really do you expect? It's like going into a bar and saying alcohol is unhealthy. Sure it is, but it's trolling to go there and say it.

But I think that if you're going to argue that then you should use some statistics otherwise it really is just your opinion. Statistics themselves can be subject to interpretation but at least it is not just throwing something out of nowhere with no evidence.

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This.

People complain about things all the time and are praised for it. The only people that get absolutely hammered by "the community" here are the ones being positive, not the ones expressing negativity. The latter are only confronted by a small amount of people, and only a few of them are namecalling antagonistic types trying to shut down conversation, most are being mature about it and offering arguments and rebuttals, only to be met with "lol, write another book, shill".

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Originally Posted by Rolder50

If you ever want to find bullies and people with questionable attitudes, just say something negative about FF14. As evidenced by the 88 pages in this thread.

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I mean, if you ever want to find bullies and people with questionable attitudes around here, just say something positive about FF14. As evidenced by the 88 pages in this thread.

But...that's really a side thing, isn't it? For so many people complaining about people complaining about Zepla's tone instead of her points, so many of them seem to want to "critique" the community instead of discussing Zepla's points.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

tldr

"she said something i dont like so she deserves it"

moving on

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No.

And no, Stormpeaks, I will NOT aid you in derailing the thread.

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Originally Posted by FenyxRising

I think someone doesn't have friends who bantered with him.



This is over the top that actually, everyone, I mean everyone, would take it as a joke.

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No, Titanalt. I will not help YOU derail the thread, either.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

Or maybe after doing a little joke, they pampered him and gave him some good headpats to make sure they were okay and that it didnt hurt their feelings



Are you good bro ?

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No, Stormpeaks, I will not help you derail the thread.

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Originally Posted by FenyxRising

It's the same culprits all the time. Jojoya, Renathras, ... I mean what's new, they always do this.

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No, Titanalt. I WON'T help you derail the thread. Also, I'm still waiting on that ring and marriage proposal.

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Originally Posted by Blossoming

Yes I got called a misandrist for calling them out about those comments. A lot of people end up just devaluing her because "She's just annoying, her face, opinions, etc" When most people forget we have a large community because of people like her.

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/sigh

That isn't why you got called a misandrist. But no, Blossoming, I will not help you derail the thread, either.

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Originally Posted by Zairava

This was your initial response.



You have provided virtually nothing since other than acting like a victim when we all called you out on providing nothing actually relevant to the discussion you yourself said was derailed, and derailed it further and still are. You said what essentially boiled down to "concerns not valid because content creator".

This same content creator that you constantly insult is the one between you two to actually give extensive detail concerns while being open minded and playing it as safe as possible. You've done nothing here but piss and moan about how you can't have an opinion when you said originally has actually nothing of substance when what she says, like it or not, objectively has details in it that are worthy of discussion, concerns we have been repeating for quite some time.

You're playing the victim when you got rightfully shunned for insinuating her concerns are worthless to begin with. She's just as much a person as we are.

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Okay so, in my defense, it's not like I made that image. It actually comes from a different thread, this one right here, I am not wasting my time going through people's post histories, we pretty much know what we're all about at this point.

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Originally Posted by Sindele

snip snip

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I remember this thread, NOT because of stalking or whatever they want to make up (I find this incredibly humorous because of the death threats I've received over my time here), but because the topic was SO ridiculous and so many people and hundreds of thumbs ups came out of the woodwork to just unify and collectively say "you're wrong lmao" with like two images. That's more engagement than even developer or community rep responses most of the time. I found it absolutely hilarious and it stuck in my head ever since as the quintessential FFXIV OF topic, just without the walls of text or gaslighting.

At least it was funny. Now it's just sad, in hindsight.

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Originally Posted by Xaruko_Nexume

Zepla tried to expand the repertoire of her stream and it failed because her community by in large seemed to just want XIV content. Now she is desperately trying to maintain any relevancy at all by turning on the game that made her. Taking a page straight out of many WoW streamers playbook circa 2019.

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I'm glad at least one person gets it.

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Originally Posted by JamieRose

I'm glad at least one person gets it.

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So you agree with people bashing her because "she's desperate and is trying to maintain relevancy" just because she has an opinion about a game that doesnt match with yours

and then you talk about bullying ?

do you even see yourself or how does your every day life work, I am genuinely intrigued, do you sometimes self reflect and ask yourself if what you're doing is not the same thing as you blame others for, or do you just go on and keep telling yourself you're a victim while actually doing what you say people shouldnt do ?