Good time to buy stock in Square-Enix?

NIKKEI225 taking a hit this Friday morning. SE on the decline along with a lot of other game company stocks. lol

Hopefully it picks back up after lunch.

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Originally Posted by Neomarl

Oh yeah? Where's your proof that versus is still in production, OTHER than wada's word "s-sure guys...it's s-s-still in production t-trust me guys!"
Absolutely no new info in several years = game will never come out.

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First and foremost, you're an imbecile.

Secondly, that's the only thing we know is going by what Wada said - that Versus is still in production and they have no other news at this time.
I'd rather see a true DLC that actually wraps up the ending of FFXIII-2, than Versus XIII.

So, yeah, you don't have proof other than the CEO's words. umad, bro?

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Originally Posted by Neomarl

http://i.imgur.com/5UgaA.png

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The summary of this persons posts.

Here, let's list some game franchises that Square Enix has....

-Final Fantasy. Did you know that FFXIII sold 6.7 million copies as of last month, and was the fastest selling game in the series' history? FFXIII-2 sold 2.5 million copies as of last month. Final Fantasy XI also still has a fairly large playerbase, so it's definitely paying the bills.
-Dragon Quest. Dragon Quest IX set records for sales in Japan, selling over 4 million copies in Japan alone by March 2010. Dragon Quest X was released in Japan today/yesterday and is an MMO on the Wii. We'll see what the sales/subscription numbers are.
-Deus Ex. Human Revolution sold 2.18 million copies as of September last year.
-Kingdom Hearts. Kingdom Hearts 3D sold 300,000 units in Japan as of May this year, and was just released in America a few days ago. We'll see sales numbers.
-Just Cause is co-developed with Square Enix and is published by Eidos (which now belongs to Square Enix)
-Tomb Raider (recent acquisition)
-Kane & Lynch (from IO Interactive, which is owned by Square Enix)
-Hitman (acquisition from IO Interactive > Eidos > Now Square Enix)
-Legacy of Kain
-Wakfu for NA
-Thief

So on top of all the game series they have, they now have.....Final Fantasy XI, Final Fantasy XIV, Dragon Quest X, and Wakfu.....4 MMORPGs to make money off of. Sounds like they'll be doing just fine.

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Originally Posted by Neomarl

Hardware sales are what matters, since they make a profit on every DS/3DS/Wii sold.
Better than Sony and their nogames PSVita/PS3.

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The things you say.. . Its like I can tell exactly what part of the internet you come from ;v

The price of a stock reflects a few things, but one thing it rarely ever represents is the actual value of the company. When a stock fluctuates dramatically, either rising or falling, it signals a shift in peoples' expectations.

Right now expectations are very low. If you were to invest now, and 2.0 turned out to be a hit, the actual value of the company will rise, but the stocks might not rise in proportion. You should only invest in a company as a long term commitment. Forget 2.0 for a moment, and unless you can justify investing in Square Enix for some other reason... I'd suggest not doing so.

YEAH, I LIKE FINAL FANTASY 14 GAMEPLAY TOO! YEAH NICE NM! DAMN THIS GRAPHICS GOOD! I LOVE TO TALK ABOUT FFXIV THE VIDEOGAME!

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Originally Posted by Neomarl

It's fun to be in denial land, isn't it?
SE killed FFversus.
They keep milking the FFXIII series instead of making a new one.
SE canceled FFXIII-3.
FFXIV got 4.0 out of 10.
They are bleeding money. I wouldn't be surprised if they got bought by another big gaming company, like Nintendo.
That would actually save Square Enix.

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Ahem. You might want to take that time warp back to this month or/and read some news.

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Originally Posted by Mijin

That's not true, if 2.0 fails you will see another huge loss in the companies earning forecasts(just like in 2010) which effects stock value. That was the point I was trying to make.

It's worth pointing out that contrary to your opinion, the company is loosing money, you can read about it here: http://www.playstationlifestyle.net/...ions-imminent/

Also, don't go around calling people foolish. It's rude, unnecessary, and even more frustrating when you're dead wrong about the point you were trying to sound so cool making. Also personally attacking people is against the ToS, and most importantly if I'm not allowed to do it I most definitely don't want someone like you to get away with it.

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First of all, I didn't personally attack anyone. Calling the general attitude of people foolish is not against the ToS. Secondly, you should learn to vet your sources. Do you honestly believe it is in anyway reasonable that a company as big as SE would be expecting a meager 12 million dollar profit? That's absurd, most companies make that off a single game. Even more ridiculous, do you actually think a company expecting a meager 12 million dollar profit can take a 150 million dollar loss and not fold? You very clearly do not know what your talking about and you should probably do more than type in google if you want to know the truth about something.

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Originally Posted by Azurymber

SE stock will continue to drop as their recent games have met with a negative response, and failures such as XIV have reduced consumer confidence.

Even if XIV 2.0 is perfect it is nearly impossible to re-market a failed game, and all the people on here who claim spamming advertisements will work have no real marketing experience. 2.0 will not be SE's saving grace.

SE's stock will rise again if the next final fantasy (15? versus?) is a massive success. If not, they will probably fall drastically.

There are a lot of -MUCH- safer stocks out there.

That being said, SE probably won't die as they can make millions off KH3, FFVII-HD/3D, FF15

If you want to invest in a winner, try ZeniMax Media if they ever go public (owns Bethesda). Their new Elder Scrolls MMO will almost for sure be one of the most successful mmo's on the market and will probably make ff look like a joke. Even the screenshots of it and concept art look years ahead of XIV. Plus they will have 3-way massive PvP battles and let you explore all of skyrim, morrowing, tamriel, and a bunch of other places. So its like every elder scrolls in one in a multiplayer arena.
And slated for release 2013.

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Pretty much this.

SE's development as been pretty lackluster for the last several years. not everyone liked FFX. a lot of people did not like FFXII or FFXIII and FFXIV flopped as well. of course i'm not sure how these games did in Japan. I'm also not sure how much cash the mobile market brings in for them or their retail stores.

Eidos is bring in a lot of cash for the company, sure. but as a whole there are a few things in the pipeline and not a lot of hype, as usual.

However it is implied that SE has enough cash to throw around to keep FFXIV alive. so either the subs are enough to keep it afloat or their pockets are deeper than implied.

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Originally Posted by Onisake

However it is implied that SE has enough cash to throw around to keep FFXIV alive. so either the subs are enough to keep it afloat or their pockets are deeper than implied.

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It's the latter. Sub fees are currently a drop in the bucket to what they're spending in development.

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Originally Posted by Fear

1: SE did NOT cancel FF13 Vs. that was a rumor that Wada said was false.
2: I doubt they did, wheres your proof?
3: Thats why the hell we're getting a FF14 2.0, if your so negative and think the company is failing why the hell are you playing one of their games?

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oooooh ~~ me~ow!

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Originally Posted by Neomarl

It's fun to be in denial land, isn't it?
SE killed FFversus.
They keep milking the FFXIII series instead of making a new one.
SE canceled FFXIII-3.
FFXIV got 4.0 out of 10.
They are bleeding money. I wouldn't be surprised if they got bought by another big gaming company, like Nintendo.
That would actually save Square Enix.

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1. As others have said FFversus13 is not cancelled. I think there is even supposed to be something for it at the 25th anniversary event of FF
2. FF13-3 wasn't officially announced; besides, they've announced the Lightning saga project (which is probably just FF13-3 anyways) and also said the details will be revealed at the 25th anniversary event
3. A Realm Reborn nuff said

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Originally Posted by Neomarl

Oh yeah? Where's your proof that versus is still in production, OTHER than wada's word "s-sure guys...it's s-s-still in production t-trust me guys!"
Absolutely no new info in several years = game will never come out.

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Except that your proof is only a rumor, and Wada's word > rumor any day. There has been new info on Versus, in 2011 they said that they moved from the crystal tools engine to a specific game engine for it. That change is part of the reason versus has taken so long to come out; the other reason is that most, if not all, of the team was focused on completing KH3D.

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Originally Posted by Neomarl

Hardware sales are what matters, since they make a profit on every DS/3DS/Wii sold.
Better than Sony and their nogames PSVita/PS3.

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You strike me as one of those Nintendo fanboys who think they can do no wrong. Nintendo couldn't make profit off of the 3DS until they lowered the price; I believe they were losing investors until they lowered the price. Your outdated statement of "nogame PS3" kinda proves my point. PSVita on the other hand needs more games, I'll agree there.

I would like to point out a couple of things.

1) FFXI is THE most profitable Final Fantasy game ever. Yes, more profitable than VII, XIII, and XIV. And they're still making new content for that game.

2) The future of FFXIV is more important than the past, and even more important is the direction of the game is going. So far, the game has improved VASTLY since the 1.00 days, and as a result, it has been a generally more fun game to play. Now if they'll release some FFXIV 2.0 gameplay videos, I would think that the excitement level go up a bit, but we probably won't see any till the 25th anniversary show coming later this month.

3) The CEO has said that vXIII (and really, I think that game is a bit over-hyped) has not been cancelled (or XIII-3 or however you want to say it). As noted, SE is holding a 25th anniversary special of Final Fantasy on the 25th of anniversary.

Would I invest money in SE? I'd probably wait till the 25th of August to see what SE does, but until then, I'd hold on to my money.

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Originally Posted by Onisake

SE's development as been pretty lackluster for the last several years. not everyone liked FFX. a lot of people did not like FFXII or FFXIII

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Final Fantasy X was wildly popular. It's one of the most popular Final Fantasy games. Maybe you should step outside of the forums once in a while and meet with real people. It sold 6.6 million units. It was so popular, it became the first Final Fantasy game to have a direct sequel. FFXI was a huge success as well, becoming one of the best known and most-subscribed to MMORPGs of all time. FFXII was also a huge success. It won Game of the Year awards, sold over 2mil copies in Japan, was the 4th best-selling PS2 game of 2006, and sold over 5.2 million copies as of March 2007. It also has an empire of merchandise and spin-offs. FFXIII was the fastest selling title in the entire FF series and sold 6.7 million copies as of last month. FFXIII-2 has sold 2.5 million copies as of last month.

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and FFXIV flopped as well

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If by "as well" you mean being the only one to flop, then sure.

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of course i'm not sure how these games did in Japan

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All of them except FFXIV did well in both Japan and the international market.

EDIT: For comparison, the original God of War (which came out in 2005) has sold 4.6 million copies as of June 2012. Halo 3 has sold 8.1 million copies as of June 2008 (don't know if/when they'll update that). So FFX-XIII-2 are no mice in a world of gaming giants.

Close to a decade and Versus still on the air.... Yup i'll trust wada on that one......

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Originally Posted by Jynx

The summary of this persons posts.

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seriously, i wish people would stop responding to obvious flamebaiting bullshit and ignore that kind of people /sigh

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Originally Posted by Azurymber

If you want to invest in a winner, try ZeniMax Media if they ever go public (owns Bethesda). Their new Elder Scrolls MMO will almost for sure be one of the most successful mmo's on the market and will probably make ff look like a joke. Even the screenshots of it and concept art look years ahead of XIV. Plus they will have 3-way massive PvP battles and let you explore all of skyrim, morrowing, tamriel, and a bunch of other places. So its like every elder scrolls in one in a multiplayer arena.
And slated for release 2013.

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Except the gameplay is totally MMO and not TES, the 10m+ people buying Skyrim are not guaranteed to be interested in it. The "old school" TES fan are even less interested in it because they are already bashing Skyrim for being fantasy GTA. And please don't even talk about those screenshots, because they have been nothing but lolwut to Skyrim players, the art-style is just waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too different (I prefer not to call it XxX clone).

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Originally Posted by SuzakuCMX

Final Fantasy X was wildly popular. It's one of the most popular Final Fantasy games. Maybe you should step outside of the forums once in a while and meet with real people. It sold 6.6 million units. It was so popular, it became the first Final Fantasy game to have a direct sequel. FFXI was a huge success as well, becoming one of the best known and most-subscribed to MMORPGs of all time. FFXII was also a huge success. It won Game of the Year awards, sold over 2mil copies in Japan, was the 4th best-selling PS2 game of 2006, and sold over 5.2 million copies as of March 2007. It also has an empire of merchandise and spin-offs. FFXIII was the fastest selling title in the entire FF series and sold 6.7 million copies as of last month. FFXIII-2 has sold 2.5 million copies as of last month.

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I guess that's all part of propaganda. Your numbers are right. ... but out there in the interwebs there's a couple ten thousand people who will hate on anything that came after VI, VII, VIII, or IX depending on their preference. On this, it's kind of like a sports team. The haters always yell the loudest, and the sensible folk never call into the radio talk shows. So there's an overinflated perception that the FF franchise has been in decline for a long time, but that's just the over-inflated badgering of internet trolls catching on to a smattering of others who keep reading it and eventually begin to believe its true.

Reality is only what people think reality is after all.

I do think FFXIII could have used NPC populated areas otherwise known as towns though ... hahaha. but whatever.

http://www.ign.com/videos/2012/07/24...-not-cancelled proof ty goodbye

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Originally Posted by Neomarl

It's fun to be in denial land, isn't it?
SE killed FFversus.
They keep milking the FFXIII series instead of making a new on
SE canceled FFXIII-3.
FFXIV got 4.0 out of 10.
They are bleeding money. I wouldn't be surprised if they got bought by another big gaming company, like Nintendo.
That would actually save Square Enix.

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Originally Posted by RiseAgainst

http://www.ign.com/videos/2012/07/24...-not-cancelled proof ty goodbye

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How naive can you be? Just because they say that doesn't mean it's true. Have you even wondered why they haven't showed ANY gameplay videos yet? Screenshots? information?

They are just holding the fans/stock investors by a leash. SE knows the backlash that would ensue if they ever said otherwise.

And linking to ign.com automatically invalids any arguments you make.

1984
/10char

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Originally Posted by NefarioCall

There have been a few games throughout history that 'got stuck' in development for years and years. Doom?
I really don't think SE will cancel this, if only for the same kind of Japanese pride that may have spurred on 2.0
They promised us this game and have come too far with that promise now to fail in its delivery.
it just might ... be a while ... before we see it. Even if it takes another five years. Who knows.

Also, IGN isn't that great a site, but your argument structure is also .. at least in this topic ... weak enough to draw trolls rather than counter arguments .. generally speaking. Reading all the responses i kind of felt like <_>

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Stop fucking replying to Neomarl. Goddamn. There's like 8 different threads where people keep saying not to. Neomarl is obviously a troll so stop replying.

Stock market thread on the English XIV forums started by a XIV-fan... lol. Players should know their place. When you don't know anything about stock market, don't start suggesting stupid investment ideas.

The stock value of SE is not only determined by the performance of the company itself. The global conjecture of Japan's economy is just as important if not more important. Same goes for USD/JPY ~ EUR/JPY ~ GBP/JPY. And finally the whole industry sector.

Some players think that stock exchange is as easy as "betting" (sorry I hate using this term when talking about stocks) on the success of a title/product. Sorry but it's not.

I'm far from being expert, but you don't need to actually be very knowledgeable to understand that any investment idea coming from a random player on a game's forum shouldn't be followed. This thread should even be closed because some naive people may start losing real money by trying to perform things they do not fully understand.

Also OP, at least if you want to look at little serious, start giving stock price in the native currency of the market where the stock in listed, talking about SE shares in USD is just plain wrong.

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That's a 2:1 investment

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More like 2:1 stupidity.

Also : "Search thread" + "dividend" = 0 result found. Yeah 7 pages and no one even mention something as basic as that...

http://imageshack.us/a/img24/5553/13...2038521323.jpg

Well not everyone but certain posts are just hilarious.

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Originally Posted by Antipika

More like 2:1 stupidity.

Also : "Search thread" + "dividend" = 0 result found. Yeah 7 pages and no one even mention something as basic as that...

http://imageshack.us/a/img24/5553/13...2038521323.jpg

Well not everyone but certain posts are just hilarious.

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^^That's certainly not my intention. I doubt that a lot of people here work with stocks for a living.. but that's not what i'm getting at. it's not meant to be some fantastic genius. Instead of writing the drawn out wordyness of my OP i simply could have written the following:

SE stock will eventually be notably higher than it is right now, even if it falls a bit farther first.
The chances that it will eventually (and within a 5 year window) be notably higher than it is right now are very very good.

...or can you give us good reason to understand that the current value is as high as it will ever be in the next 5 years?

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Originally Posted by Neomarl

How naive can you be? Just because they say that doesn't mean it's true. Have you even wondered why they haven't showed ANY gameplay videos yet? Screenshots? information?

And linking to ign.com automatically invalids any arguments you make.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vkZvdT3QS4k

Yes it is IGN but it is an official video and yes it is a little old (what info isn't going to be re:FFXIII Vs) but it shows gameplay including battle and general gameplay. Thanks for playing.

edit: Skip to 3:00 if you want.

A good reason is : Investment isn't about guessing and "betting" on products. Investment is a full time job, that requires a lot of skill, time, patience, money and dedication to be fully understood and be profitable in the long run.

One does not make profits just by looking at couple of charts, read a wiki and decide that "it's a good time to buy because according to my non existing trading knowledge, I determined that it was a good time to buy".

This process is how tons of small retails investors using online brokerage services lose their savings every day.

There is no such thing as a good "2:1 investment" that's safe. It doesn't exist, it will never exist. If anyone can just double their investment like that, you would already have the biggest investment banks of the world buying SE shares.... and that's not happening now. Your bank is only giving you a 2~4% (gross) interest rate on your savings for a reason. Getting more without taking risks isn't possible.

Lol even Greece could start investing in SE then! "2:1 investment" will solve their financial crisis!

Sorry if I sound annoying, but I think it is always good to stress this message especially to audiences that are complete beginners in stocks exchange. Stay away from that unless you know what you are doing.

If you want to start taking interest in market and shares; pick something "local" you can try to understand. Square Enix is not the way to start for a beginner.

- On top on following SE share, you will have to get knowledgeable in FOREX since exchange rate will have a major impact on your profits and on the price of the share.

- Not speaking Japanese makes it simply impossible to follow and understand the Japanese market and how SE is behaving within that very market.

- Square Enix holding is big and too diversified. (They're not only making games). It means that you will need knowledge in different kind of market sectors.

- Square Enix is an international company and that's make it also very hard to understand since what is happening in the US or Europe can have an impact on the share...

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...or can you give us good reason to understand that the current value is as high as it will ever be in the next 5 years?

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If I could predict the future and could predict a fall of the Square Enix share, I would just short it and make profits as well. But well, I don't.

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Originally Posted by Antipika

There is no such thing as a good "2:1 investment" that's safe.

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I agree, but at the risk of sounding arrogant, i think the complexity of the whole thing is widely blown out of proportion to provide a bit of 'upperclassmanship'. I know my musical theory inside and out, but i still purposely got 49% on it in my university course. Music is music. To otherwise define it is to kill it.

Now, if someone wants to put every cent they own into stocks of a company and they lose it all and end up on the street, i think that's a terrible thing, but the general foolishness of that i think ... is not a matter of 'stock knowledge'. Same can be said for someone who goes into the casino and bets their house on roulette or the slots.

When i look at the stock market i divide every company into a category.
First, you have the companies that most people have never heard of and hold a low stock value.
I think of these companies as lottery tickets. That is unless you put in the time and effort to research them one by one and are fortunate enough to get some sort of 'inside track' to buy into Apple Computers before they were big, it's a big glob**** of penny shares.

Secondly, i think of products and parts. What is the uniqueness of the product and can it be replaced? For example, Nike is a big company. I would consider it a product because it sells finished items. The product it sells however, is completely replaceable. Someone else will make and market popular shoes if Nike folds. The world will get on with it, but only so long as the company itself isn't providing a central nervousness system to the economy behind the scenes. In terms of parts, like the fibres that are used to make a shirt, if the company that produces the fibres folds, then someone else will be able to step in and produce the fibre. in this case however, i'd ask, who is the fibre company supplying and what is the ownership connection? Money talks, but i wouldn't bet my savings on either company.

Third are the giants. ... and without disrespecting them overly, i still see it a bit like the playground hierarchy. You've got that member of the boys club that is a part of it, but not really safe. that guy everyone can say so long to and that's it. There's the leader as well, but i wouldn't invest in a leader because when a revolution happens, the leader is the one who gets the boot. So i'd look to the second or third in command instead. The one who is still standing after everything goes to hell.

I understand there are university degrees on the stock market, and having that knowledge would certainly aid anyone willing to learn, but i think it's a bit much to think it's necessary in being capable of making a profit.

Coming back to SE now...
They are not the golden god of investments. I do not have any mindset that they are big bucks.
I have simply identified them as a product to begin with. I don't generally favor investing in products but i believe that without mortgaging the house, this is a favourable option for a small bump. As some other posters in this thread have pointed out, SE is more safe than the majority of other companies regarding being stable enough to survive at all. Do said posters have a lot of stock knowledge? No. But i'd say they have looked at the numbers and understand that SE is not in any danger of folding, and not only that, but they can take a lot of damage before they reach a dangerous level. Now, if the economy gets in a real bad way that dwarfs what we've seen so far, then well, that's a whole nother issue well beyond stocks in SE.

IN THAT CASE I RECOMMEND INVESTING IN SILVER INGOTS. YOU'LL WANT TO TRADE THEM FOR FOOD. or maybe better yet, steel. But that depends who you're trading to.

okay, so it's going to survive, or at least its chances of surviving are well enough that if you're not willing to chance this company ... i mean ... there are safer companies out there, but how safe do you want to be? This ones pretty safe. it's also not the kind of company that will ever likely grow in value by 10 times or anything ridiculous. It's a violent stock. A gaming industry stock. it will go up, and it will go down. and up ... and down .. and up ... and down...

Given all of this wall of text, i suppose the information i am looking for is if anyone with said education can point out information that says the gains will be so small as to make it worthless? Or that there won't be gains at all? I recognise that there's more 'complexity' to the market than a graph, but that doesn't marginalize the graph. It's a lot of silly to think that the current stock value of this company will maintain itself at the same amount forever. But SE is going to fluctuate as violently as a video game company will, only, ... it's rock bottom on it's own 7 year curve of ups and downs. Will it develop a new curve over the next 7 years that establishes the current bottom as the top? I don't think a degree in economics is necessary to feel that is highly unlikely.

But hey, i mean, there's other companies out there for 100% certain that will provide a bigger gain than SE in the next 5 years. I just have yet to be educated on any firm ideas that say the current bottom is the new top, or that the next 5 year curve of this company will take the kind of shape that makes SE too marginal to deserve any merit.

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As some other posters in this thread have pointed out, SE is more safe than the majority of other companies regarding being stable enough to survive at all. Do said posters have a lot of stock knowledge? No. But i'd say they have looked at the numbers and understand that SE is not in any danger of folding, and not only that, but they can take a lot of damage before they reach a dangerous level. Now, if the economy gets in a real bad way that dwarfs what we've seen so far, then well, that's a whole nother issue well beyond stocks in SE.

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Again, such statements is one of the main reason of many retail investors failing at stock exchange.

You have to be completely blind to believe that something is "more safe than (...)" without having any serious knowledge about the matter. If it was as safe as it sounds, again, lot of investors would buy SE stocks.

Also, buying stock is not as easy as pressing "buy" and hoping that the stock rise and sell when it's high. As a retail investor, you will probably invest in a very small amount of stocks (less than 1K). That mean that management fees, transaction processing fees, currency exchange fees, will eat up lot of your profit (if any) or make your losses bigger.

2nd thing, Forex. I suppose that you live in the USA and will be using USD to purchase stocks and or take your profits in. Forex is extremely complex, very hard to predict and will have a big influence on your profits/loss.

In 2007, USD/JPY was around 120. As of today, USD/JPY is below 80. That alone can make you lose everything and turn a nice 20% profit into a 20% loss.

Stock exchange isn't as easy as you make it sounds. You aren't playing a roller-coaster. Buy low/sell high may work in your Market Wards in Eorzea. That's not how real life work. Sorry to disappoint you.

I'm not going to continue trying to explain you how things works really. Feel free to invest gamble your money. But please, do not involve anyone else in this. Do not give advices to people who aren't knowledgeable about trading and do not make it sounds as if it was "easy" or "safe" to make profit while not having any knowledge on the matter. There is real money at stake. While advice saying "do not buy or do not invest" will never hurts, the opposite isn't true.

My biggest concern is this really. What you do with your personal money is something you are responsible of. You should also be aware that even brokers making advertisement for investment products aren't allowed to make the whole thing looks easy and use a wording that make the retail user feel that there aren't much risk involved. Recently, many companies got sued in Europe because of these advertisement practices.

If your OP was an ad, it would fall into this category.

Makes the reader feel that risk is lower than it is:

"In any case, i think it's silly to think that SE stock will go down any further. THIS, right now, is the low point. RIGHT NOW."

Talk about huge possible profits without mentioning possible loss:

"Will it go up to a modest $23-24, or as high as $45-50? Tough to say. I think it'll top $30 in the next three years though. That's a 2:1 investment and it could be pretty lucrative if you have enough overhead."

Congratulations on that at least.

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Originally Posted by Antipika

Also, buying stock is not as easy as pressing "buy" and hoping that the stock rise and sell when it's high. As a retail investor, you will probably invest in a very small amount of stocks (less than 1K). That mean that management fees, transaction processing fees, currency exchange fees, will eat up lot of your profit (if any) or make your losses bigger.

2nd thing, Forex. I suppose that you live in the USA and will be using USD to purchase stocks and or take your profits in. Forex is extremely complex, very hard to predict and will have a big influence on your profits/loss.

In 2007, USD/JPY was around 120. As of today, USD/JPY is below 80. That alone can make you lose everything and turn a nice 20% profit into a 20% loss.

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^^That part there is really the kind of information i'm looking for.
But then, neither do i agree with 'don't ask, don't tell'.
what people do with their money is their own business,
but i'll not feel responsible if someone mortgages their house or ruins their life from reading it.
Neither will i neglect the topic, ever, over the my money your money or anything else in that vein,
although perhaps simply for a lack of interest with greater regard to my own family. In that case, yes.

if you want a safe investment, buy raw material that will still retain value after the zombie apocalypse.
Paper money, coin money, banks, stocks, etc etc has no real value unless there is a monetary system to grant it value. if you want a safe investment, fill the storage closet in your house with something you can trade for food after the apocalypse. Again, i'm not going to take responsibility for people with gambling problems. I'd like to, but i've got to prioritize how i use my time before i die.

Anyway, thanks for the info i quoted though.
Our disagreement is really a philosophical or political one, and i never really enjoy having those kinds of arguments, at least not when our core beliefs are so very opposite. haha. I wish to take nothing from your education on the matter however, as it is useful and necessary.

Postedit:
and i mean ... as you say, it's not as easy as clicking buy... LITERALLY.
A person would have to go through the steps necessary to partake in the process to begin with. If they go ahead and throw more than they can afford at something and ruin their life based on this kind of discussion after having to go through the procedure of setting up an account, then i don't think it's reasonable to say it wouldn't have happened anyway... and if they already have an account, aren't they already doing it anyway?

but yes ... achem. >_> I guess we can get into that if you want...

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Originally Posted by Neomarl

Fail troll is fail

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Reason why you don't feed the trolls.

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Originally Posted by buritoslicer

Reason why you don't feed the trolls.

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i know this image is a decade old, but it still cracks me up.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-4_B1AANiXs...lls-kitten.jpg

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Originally Posted by Neomarl

Why would you invest in a dying company?

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Why would you invest in a MMORPG from a company you're sure is dying?

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Originally Posted by Isaveron

Why would you invest in a MMORPG from a company you're sure is dying?

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^^This. I mean, ... would you invest 100 days of your life into anything, let alone an MMO if you thought all your character data was gonna be wiped in a year or two anyway? Maybe just for the experience of playing it to begin with... but ... that's a lot of time.

To those who are saying Square Enix is dying, pull off your black-rose-tinted glasses and get over the fact that you didn't like a Final Fantasy game or five.

People keep forgetting that Final Fantasy isn't Square Enix's only profitable genre. They own Eidos, therefore they own the publishing rights to the Hitman and Deus Ex games. They own Taito. There's Kingdom Hearts and DragonQuest, and their remakes of previous Final Fantasy games. Don't forget that they also have a lot of other sidegames as well for the DS.

There's a difference between being in a low point and dying.

"Square Enix Holdings Co" does not trade on the NYSE. Only on the TSE. And I'd probably go short on SE when the game releases.

Weirdest question I've seen in a long time.

FFS WHY IS THIS THREAD STILL NOT LOCKED? THIS FORUM ISN'T ABOUT THE GODDAMN STOCK MARKET

I'm vested in SE. Every share you buy, regardless of what company it comes from is a gamble.

Now might not be the best time to buy shares however.

Whilst SE might not be at the level it was at previously, it's far from dying. If it was dying they wouldn't have the money to host elaborate conventions for XI or remake XIV. They see XIV as a nest egg, and dying companies very rarely take major risks.

If you see VII get a HD remake, then we're in trouble.

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Originally Posted by Risae

FFS WHY IS THIS THREAD STILL NOT LOCKED? THIS FORUM ISN'T ABOUT THE GODDAMN STOCK MARKET

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I might have unintentionally cornered them. <_> After all, we're talking about consumer confidence in the company here. Locking it might send an unfavourable message, nor will they say 'don't buy stock in our company', but i suspect they won't come in and say, 'buy stock' either. Additionally, SE could very fairly want to know a little bit about what is said here, if there's someone employed to study such things, and there should be... or heck, it might also be because FFXIV and this subject are related to one another, so it is about FFXIV. Run a search on the topic and see how many times it has come up.

On a side note, this thread got derailed last night and the mods came in and ninja modded it of all the derailing posts, so that might have been their decision.

In any case, SE is shifting their company focus over to MMOs, of which FFXIV is one, and a flagship title at that. I know that public opinion of Wada is mixed, but i feel his decision to move towards online games and mobile services is a very lucrative one.

Regarding the notion that this is a bad investment because no one else is investing ... i find it a bit silly. Worth paying attention to, but silly. If everyone were already investing, you'd have missed the boat. but sometimes there isn't a boat in the first place. There's a boat here.

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Originally Posted by ThePatriarch

I'm vested in SE. Every share you buy, regardless of what company it comes from is a gamble.

Now might not be the best time to buy shares however.

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I maintain that metal ingots are a very good investment.
They still have value after all the money and stocks in the world don't.

Actually, i'd set aside an entire room in my place or storage shed and fill it with useful goods. ingots, shoes, yarn, cloths, and heck, Rice/grains/seeds. The stock market IS A GAME. it's a game built around agreed upon value of valueless things. Granted, that agreed upon value is important for the well being of you and your family so long as it holds, so a bit of this and a bit of that is probably best. but anything that is valuable when money has no value is most valuable of all.