Cloud DC Proves Cross-Region Travel is OK

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Originally Posted by CidHeiral

No thanks.



Yeah it's so much better to have one giant faceless blob of glorified NPCs where you never see the same person twice and nobody interacts with anyone ever. That was such a blast to see happen in WoW I'm sure it would be wonderful here.

And before someone says "but FFXIV is already like that!"

No, it isn't, at all. If you think it is that's a you problem. Learn some social skills.

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Welcome to IRL where you have your usual group of friends but you still can see and interact with strangers on a daily basis.

I think its really telling how some people in this thread really express the idea that an MMO community should be limiting rather than be expanding. Its as if they're not confident in their own little communities somehow

You know what's ruining this game? Too many servers. Again there's a tech reason due to this game's server infrastructure but imagine if they worked on them. No more need to DC travel to get to certain groups or have better queues for content, you can also interact and hang out with other people from other parts of the world and make the auto-translate feature that so many people have forgotten actually useful.

This is the ideal in a <ahem> A MASSIVELY MULTIPLAER ONLINE ROLE PLAYING GAME.

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

I think its really telling how some people in this thread really express the idea that an MMO community should be limiting rather than be expanding. Its as if they're not confident in their own little communities somehow

You know what's ruining this game? Too many servers. Again there's a tech reason due to this game's server infrastructure but imagine if they worked on them. No more need to DC travel to get to certain groups or have better queues for content, you can also interact and hang out with other people from other parts of the world and make the auto-translate feature that so many people have forgotten actually useful.

This is the ideal in a <ahem> A MASSIVELY MULTIPLAER ONLINE ROLE PLAYING GAME.

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Not everyone wants that, you might want a "mega server", I do not, and some other people do not, it's that simple.

As someone else mentioned earlier, DC travel should not be expanded, it should stay as is, reworked or removed entirely, but any expansion of it is a massive no no.

As for mega servers, there's a probably reason it is dying MMORPGs that make them. They portray it as this amazing technology, but what they are really doing is merging servers because their game is dying and all their servers lack players if there are too many.

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

I think its really telling how some people in this thread really express the idea that an MMO community should be limiting rather than be expanding. Its as if they're not confident in their own little communities somehow

You know what's ruining this game? Too many servers. Again there's a tech reason due to this game's server infrastructure but imagine if they worked on them. No more need to DC travel to get to certain groups or have better queues for content, you can also interact and hang out with other people from other parts of the world and make the auto-translate feature that so many people have forgotten actually useful.

This is the ideal in a <ahem> A MASSIVELY MULTIPLAER ONLINE ROLE PLAYING GAME.

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It's probably because the expansions are harming other aspects of the game in an attempt to progressively expand. People are deliberately willing to ignore possible consequences of such features because on the surface it sounds like a reasonably good idea to them. Cross DC visit for example has helped certain communities grow while it has completely eliminated other communities. For any sort of expansion to the system to work, we need other changes, so we don't have another "Everyone goes to Aether" situation repeating itself. These are all ideas that sound good on paper but actually tend to come with unforeseen consequences that nobody expected to happen. For some of us, DC visits have actually caused there to be less socializing, not more. Also let's be honest, the auto-translate feature isn't going to prevent language barrier issues. JP already has "Must speak Japanese" or "Must speak English" issues in their own PF and this is before region visit exists. The auto-translate feature isn't going to help anyone have an engaging conversation or discuss strats in PF either. It's a cute little thing that's good for simple greetings, and people already don't like talking in dungeons. DC region visits could also make it harder for people to find statics due to some job roles being more congested than others. It'd be nice if people started thinking more what could possibly go wrong instead of, "It'd be nice to hang out with that friend from overseas".

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Originally Posted by Bonoki

the auto-translate feature isn't going to prevent language barrier issues. JP already has "Must speak Japanese" or "Must speak English" issues in their own PF and this is before region visit exists.

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That's reasonable because for some purposes you probably just want everyone to speak the same language. It's even like that in EU where you can run into French speakers a lot and it can be a headache and if they wanted an all-French speaking or all-English speaking party respectively it makes a lot of sense.

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The auto-translate feature isn't going to help anyone have an engaging conversation or discuss strats in PF either.

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I've found you can actually do that but it can take time to find all the things in the auto-translate dictionary. But if you know how to use it, you can find a lot of useful things quick and a lot of it does relate to strategy actually, including things like "clockwise". Depends if you have the patience for it but it is useful for casual content and Duty Finder where you aren't carefully choosing who your party members are.

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Originally Posted by Bonoki

It's probably because the expansions are harming other aspects of the game in an attempt to progressively expand. People are deliberately willing to ignore possible consequences of such features because on the surface it sounds like a reasonably good idea to them. Cross DC visit for example has helped certain communities grow while it has completely eliminated other communities. For any sort of expansion to the system to work, we need other changes, so we don't have another "Everyone goes to Aether" situation repeating itself. These are all ideas that sound good on paper but actually tend to come with unforeseen consequences that nobody expected to happen. For some of us, DC visits have actually caused there to be less socializing, not more. Also let's be honest, the auto-translate feature isn't going to prevent language barrier issues. JP already has "Must speak Japanese" or "Must speak English" issues in their own PF and this is before region visit exists. The auto-translate feature isn't going to help anyone have an engaging conversation or discuss strats in PF either. It's a cute little thing that's good for simple greetings, and people already don't like talking in dungeons. DC region visits could also make it harder for people to find statics due to some job roles being more congested than others. It'd be nice if people started thinking more what could possibly go wrong instead of, "It'd be nice to hang out with that friend from overseas".

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Which is why I bring up the tech issue. Current FFXIV isnt built for it, just imagine on console.

Also some of these points here are taking away player agency into it. If were talking about joining statics or PF, the person would have to make sure theyre capable of communicating and playing well.

The point is removing the barrier to allow for such a thing possible. Everything that can go wrong already has happened with general human toxic behavior, which isnt bound by region.

I just dont agree with blindly dismissing the idea.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

JP players have always said no to cross region, they dont want english speaking people.

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Yeah and i dont want french, italian or sometimes even english players? thats not how things should be working...

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Originally Posted by Kuroka

Yeah and i dont want french, italian or sometimes even english players? thats not how things should be working...

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They have a completely different mentality than europeans and americans, that's not comparable to EU being paired with french,italians,spanish or any other EU country.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

Yeah lets base that opinion on a minority of people playing on the cloud DC.

JP players have always said no to cross region, they dont want english speaking people.

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They already have english speaking people. See: Tonberry

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Originally Posted by Bonoki

I think the problem with this is that it really doesn't prove anything at all. It's a test server which will be deleted later on. Therefore, everyone visiting and checking it out aren't exactly taking the game seriously in any meaningful degree aside vibing. It's a bunch of people having careless fun with no rhyme nor reason behind their antics. Nobody in their right mind is going onto the test server behaving like this is their new permanent stay. So, it's only natural that things on the surface are seemingly fine.

Never forget how everyone thought cross data-center visits was a good idea but didn't once consider the after effects that it inevitably caused. You always need to think outside the box on what could possibly go wrong.

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I agree it doesn't prove anything but on the other hand, I've been in enough stress tests and beta tests in the past to know that they have a tendency to bring out the worst in many players because it's not the "real" game so they think they're free from any sort of penalties for poor behavior.

So far, it doesn't seem any different from the live servers other than a much greater use of the auto-translate dictionary in chat channels. It's something that doesn't get used much on the NA worlds.

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Originally Posted by Thurmnmurmn

Making a simple suggestion is ruining the game. Alrighty then.

My view of it is that FFXIV is very strong in having multiple communities that all like different things about the game. Making it into a mega server would help all the communities grow since they could now play with similar communities from different regions.

We're in a general forum. If you disagree with my take you can do so but there's 0 harm in making a suggestion and seeing if anyone else is interested in the same or not.

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Pushing divergent communities together rarely makes for a better experience.

I can remember playing WoW when there was no cross-realm content other than battlegrounds. If you want to do dungeons or raids, you got to know the other players on your realm and started making friends. That is what formed the communities.

Once cross-realm activity started being added, it became more difficult to get to know other players because chances were good you'd see them once or never again. For all you were doing multi-player content, in a lot of ways you felt alone because you rarely knew who you were playing with. Most of the friends I was playing with in WoD and Legion were friends I had made before the introduction of cross-realm Group Finder for raiding and in many cases even going back before Dungeon Finder was added.

The community was isolated so all we had was each other to get content cleared. It paid to get to know the others and to help them get better as players.

Once cross-realm became standard, everyone became disposable. They were a handy tool of the moment to clear content and that's it. If they weren't living up to your standards, kick them from the group and replace them with a different random player who might do better.

The mega servers don't help communities grow. They create flash mobs instead. Everyone rushes together for a few moments because they happened to be in the same place with the same goal then separate out when it's time for everyone to go their own way. Certainly that can be appealing to some players but it's not going to appeal to everyone.

More does not always make for a better experience.

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

I think its really telling how some people in this thread really express the idea that an MMO community should be limiting rather than be expanding. Its as if they're not confident in their own little communities somehow

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https://i.gifer.com/5Pm.gif

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

You know what's ruining this game? Too many servers. Again there's a tech reason due to this game's server infrastructure but imagine if they worked on them. No more need to DC travel to get to certain groups or have better queues for content, you can also interact and hang out with other people from other parts of the world and make the auto-translate feature that so many people have forgotten actually useful.

This is the ideal in a <ahem> A MASSIVELY MULTIPLAER ONLINE ROLE PLAYING GAME.

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You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about.

I have always thought that it would be best to cross DC all the servers except the JP servers. Solves both problems at the same time.

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Originally Posted by Hyperia

I have always thought that it would be best to cross DC all the servers except the JP servers. Solves both problems at the same time.

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I have thought this too, but then you know there will always be someone who will be upset they can't cross over to JP servers.

Also, for a maybe tiny suggestion, what if they trial ran it like these servers now? Could leave it up for a bit and see if there would be any difficulty in bringing regions together.

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Originally Posted by Hyperia

I have always thought that it would be best to cross DC all the servers except the JP servers. Solves both problems at the same time.

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I think what you meant is, it'll solve the "problem" that communities still exist in this game and kill them off for good.

What a fun game when everyone you see you know you'll never see again, so exciting.

I'm glad the devs don't read the forums ngl, yall would just take this game and burn it to the ground.

Think about the consequences this would have on communities amongst other things.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

I think what you meant is, it'll solve the "problem" that communities still exist in this game and kill them off for good.

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Local communities still exist despite world visit and DC travel (although world visit did affect them since just before Shadowbringers).

I agree that mega servers would be what would ruin that but that is a different thing than DC travel, provided they make it undesirable to travel to the same location 100% of the time such as for raid PFs, but Yoshi-P mentioned having a plan for that anyway.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

I think what you meant is, it'll solve the "problem" that communities still exist in this game and kill them off for good.

What a fun game when everyone you see you know you'll never see again, so exciting.

I'm glad the devs don't read the forums ngl, yall would just take this game and burn it to the ground.

Think about the consequences this would have on communities amongst other things.

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I for one prefer disposable parties. I am an autistic introvert, if I can go in, do a duty finder run, and never have to see the people again unless I want to, [in which case I ask to friend them] it's a good thing.

Edit to add: Not everyone plays this game the same way. Many people don't want to make a bunch of friends just to be able to complete the MSQ [as XI once forced you to do prior to Trusts becoming a thing]. There is a reason I did not play WoW in its heyday, [there are reasons I don't now either but that is a different matter.] and a large portion of that was being forced to interact with the same people every day even if I didn't want to just to complete the story.

I think we are separated enough..., thinking of that the Korean and Chinese version of the game and it's players are inaccessible for us. Why are we not allowed to pat Chinese or Korean lalafells!? ò.ó

So I still think, that we should be able to at least connect with all players from the global game version. This region lock is really sad. Of course there are differences but why shouldn't an MMO be a place where we can come together and find and fokus on our similarities and maybe can come closer? :3

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Originally Posted by Heavenchild

the Korean and Chinese version of the game and it's players are inaccessible for us. Why are we not allowed to pat Chinese or Korean lalafells!? ò.ó

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That has a lot to do with China wanting to regulate what is and isn't in their version of the game and the ways in which they can interact with foreigners.

For Korea, I think they are supposed to have very limited playtimes so their version of the game has to have restricted playtime (but I think their players have ways of getting around it).

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

That has a lot to do with China wanting to regulate what is and isn't in their version of the game and the ways in which they can interact with foreigners.

For Korea, I think they are supposed to have very limited playtimes so their version of the game has to have restricted playtime (but I think their players have ways of getting around it).

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It was more like some kind of rhetorical question. I just wanted to speak about, how much separation we already have. And in my opinion it would be really cool, when we could at least manage it in a mmo game to come together and forget about lines on real maps. :)

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

I think what you meant is, it'll solve the "problem" that communities still exist in this game and kill them off for good.

What a fun game when everyone you see you know you'll never see again, so exciting.

I'm glad the devs don't read the forums ngl, yall would just take this game and burn it to the ground.

Think about the consequences this would have on communities amongst other things.

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I hope you realize that the game already is kinda like that? Unless were just pretending that everyone here can tell me who were exactly the last individuals they ran a dungeon or trial or raid with.

So about the fear of this server killing local server communities further, what would you do to counteract this? Because I like the idea of visiting my friends who play JP, OCE and EU, but I kind of want to restore Primal's raiding scene.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

Japanese, NA, EU, OCE and other players have all played together on the Cloud data center and it has been fine. All we did was use auto-translate to say "Hello" and "Good game" and "Thank you" and communicating with JP players worked fine. It was even fine in dungeons as well.

All these concerns about culture clashes seem unfounded.

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While I kind of agree and wish a smaller "global" dc would happen, we have to also be cognizant of the fact that cloudtest players who opted into it and are actually playing the game and not just ERPing on a throwaway alt are kind of built different. Think about it. There's a thread up right now where someone's bitching about how they can't take their 50 million in cloud gil back onto their main. The thread has loads of replies of people saying "why even go there if I won't be rewarded on my main?" and so on. This type of player who's in it primarily for the incentive, was completely filtered out of the cloud population. All that's left are a lot of people who just really enjoy the game on its own, and a few people who just want to be naughty and get away with it. The result has been some of the cleanest, fastest content runs I've experienced in years. I haven't had a bad group this entire time. And others feel it too. I keep seeing in the party chat "wow this is going so fast," or "clean af run, gg," etc.

When the players are all good and just bond over their love of the game like this, an international server probably works fine because there's barely any friction to spark drama that gets heated up by cultural differences. We've also only been together for a few days so far. If you took a group of your average xiv players and mixed them like this for a prolonged period, it'd probably segregate itself really quickly because a lot of NA is self absorbed as hell, and a lot of jp really really doesn't want english speakers anywhere near them apparently ("JP ONLY"). You don't see those people on cloud much, because anyone averse to the idea of a dc open to everyone probably would've opted out of cloud to begin with, and any of NA's self absorbed narcissists were so put off at the idea of starting over and being a nobody that they stayed home (I'm not saying that everyone who didn't cloud is like this, just that the negative people who ruin communities had little incentive to come here which is why it's actually fun). Hell, think about the kind of insane JP players on cloud right now. The ping for them is actually horrendous because it has to route to the east coast U.S. instead of taking a path to cali from japan. Yet they're still here, probably on like 400ms or some crazy level of ping, and they're playing the content. I really just want to underline how the cloud players who're here and doing the gameplay side of things aren't typical, making it hard to gauge from cloud alone.

I am gonna miss this place, though. Having good dutyfinder squads has spoiled me so much and it's only been a few days. Also people ACTUALLY talk in party chat now. I went back on my main to do some roulettes last night and nobody said a word the whole way through except me, when I said hi at the start. It was like running with bots, because the report function actually works on the main servers and nobody wants to accidentally offend some fragile dude's ego and get hit with a strike on their account. It sucks here. On the cloud datacenter, we spent a long time getting orbonne monastery to pop and when it did it was actually just fun as hell because all the people in the group wanted to be there and loved the game. I've turned on every language option for queuing and I'm getting partnered up with people from all over the world; we use auto translate and get along just fine, but again, it's because cloudtest's community is just built different. I keep wondering how we can ever replicate this back home, but I don't think it's possible. Outside of club venues where people just spam beesknees for 11 hours, people seem totally absorbed into their insulated groups already. Cloud's fresh start approach awakened many people to the possibility of what this community could become though, so I hope when we all return home we can take a good piece of it with us.

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Originally Posted by EstelleCere

I have thought this too, but then you know there will always be someone who will be upset they can't cross over to JP servers.

Also, for a maybe tiny suggestion, what if they trial ran it like these servers now? Could leave it up for a bit and see if there would be any difficulty in bringing regions together.

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They could always make a character on the JP worlds. The JP worlds would be isolated because of their own preference.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

Local communities still exist despite world visit and DC travel (although world visit did affect them since just before Shadowbringers).

I agree that mega servers would be what would ruin that but that is a different thing than DC travel, provided they make it undesirable to travel to the same location 100% of the time such as for raid PFs, but Yoshi-P mentioned having a plan for that anyway.

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How many of those communities formed after the addition of world visit and data center travel?

Certainly there were communities created because of new content additions that didn't exist until Shadowbringers (Bozja) or Endwalker (Island Sanctuary) but some of them get treated more like information dumps than social communities.

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Originally Posted by Volgia

So about the fear of this server killing local server communities further, what would you do to counteract this? Because I like the idea of visiting my friends who play JP, OCE and EU, but I kind of want to restore Primal's raiding scene.

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Communities are as strong as their members are willing to make them. If the majority don't want to put in effort and are just taking advantage of what a community already offers because it's convenient, the community won't last.

If Primal players want a Primal raiding scene, then they need to get more Primal players committed to rebuilding it by playing on Primal instead of going to other data centers.

I think the truth is that MMOs have mostly been filled with solo players all along. They don't care who they play with as long as they get their clears and their loot, and they'll pick the most convenient option to make that happen. They have no interest in being part of a community.

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Originally Posted by Volgia

So about the fear of this server killing local server communities further, what would you do to counteract this? Because I like the idea of visiting my friends who play JP, OCE and EU, but I kind of want to restore Primal's raiding scene.

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They just need to block the public (not private) High-End section of Party Finder to Travelers. Possibly PvP as well, if that is a problem somewhere. For Dynamis specifically, it may help to temporarily prevent leaving the data center, but allow people to travel to it.

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Originally Posted by Avoidy

The result has been some of the cleanest, fastest content runs I've experienced in years. I haven't had a bad group this entire time. And others feel it too. I keep seeing in the party chat "wow this is going so fast," or "clean af run, gg," etc.

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Yes, I expected this from the start. It's unlikely new players would be on the cloud DC. This is something veterans who understand the game well will be doing, so I fully expect (and have experienced) bosses being killed faster than normal. It's funny because they all keep their sprout icons, but you know they are all the complete opposite of that.

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I really just want to underline how the cloud players who're here and doing the gameplay side of things aren't typical

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Sure. They are the rare kind that are not only veterans but also want to help SE test. Most people wouldn't care about wasting their time with that when they have lots of other things to do. But it still seems interesting to me that all these fears didn't occur when mixing.

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I've turned on every language option for queuing

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Oh yes, if anyone has forgotten to do that, it is unfortunate for their queue times. I had a party leader change it and it suddenly worked and we got in.

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

Communities are as strong as their members are willing to make them. If the majority don't want to put in effort and are just taking advantage of what a community already offers because it's convenient, the community won't last.

If Primal players want a Primal raiding scene, then they need to get more Primal players committed to rebuilding it by playing on Primal instead of going to other data centers.

I think the truth is that MMOs have mostly been filled with solo players all along. They don't care who they play with as long as they get their clears and their loot, and they'll pick the most convenient option to make that happen. They have no interest in being part of a community.

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I think this was just a trade-off though, isolating a server forces people to make a community in order to clear content, and when you open it up there's more interaction between servers, but you lose that sense of community because it's so widespread.

This isn't only because Aether / Light / Mana are the popular raiding spot. Progging a savage fight in PF means trying a few times, disbanding, and trying again with another party, and it's just natural that all PF savage players congregate in a single DC so it has the most parties to try and prog or clear. It's not just the "They want to get carried for the clear and loot" argument.

Putting all the weight of fault on players is a mistake. The devs made this decision without counterbalancing that social aspect of the game and there is no real tangible benefit to staying in your own DC if you want to raid.

When you say:

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

If Primal players want a Primal raiding scene, then they need to get more Primal players committed to rebuilding it by playing on Primal instead of going to other data centers.

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All that you're asking is that we create our own little tribe and keep people out, and I don't know if i really want to spell how that will become toxic in less that a patch cycle.

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

How many of those communities formed after the addition of world visit and data center travel?

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New communities formed from across worlds, that is true.

I have no problem with people being able to visit other local communities where their friends or family may be located. The problem is when they are forced to go there, because then it results in what is effectively a "mega server".

Everyone visiting Aether doesn't quite make it a mega server, because Aether itself is still split into 8 worlds, but it's still bad that anyone feels forced or pressured to go to Aether when they don't actually want to. Data Center Travel is good when everyone is using it because they want to. It's not good when something is making them feel they have to.

Even if 40% of people just go to Aether to raid, it pressures everyone to, resulting in everyone being on the same data center which is not good, so the public High-End category needs blocking off to Travelers.

Another example is where if 60% of people leave Dynamis to do basic content on other data centers, then the other 40% of people feel pressured to follow them even though they don't want to, so their need a custom solution for new data centers to only allow people to visit them, and not allow Dynamis players to travel out. Statics would still be able to visit Dynamis to do their raiding there with their Dynamis' static members.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

New communities formed from across worlds, that is true.

I have no problem with people being able to visit other local communities where their friends or family may be located. The problem is when they are forced to go there, because then it results in what is effectively a "mega server".

Everyone visiting Aether doesn't quite make it a mega server, because Aether itself is still split into 8 worlds, but it's still bad that anyone feels forced or pressured to go to Aether when they don't actually want to. Data Center Travel is good when everyone is using it because they want to. It's not good when something is making them feel they have to.

Even if 40% of people just go to Aether to raid, it pressures everyone to, resulting in everyone being on the same data center which is not good, so the public High-End category needs blocking off to Travelers.

Another example is where if 60% of people leave Dynamis to do basic content on other data centers, then the other 40% of people feel pressured to follow them even though they don't want to, so their need a custom solution for new data centers to only allow people to visit them, and not allow Dynamis players to travel out. Statics would still be able to visit Dynamis to do their raiding there with their Dynamis' static members.

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Idk why you keep talking about locking dynamis players on their DC, people would just transfer away you know that right? It's literally too late for dynamis the damage is already done. Locking me there would literally just mean I'd transfer away immediately, everyone else gets to have fun and dc travel to any dc but I don't bc im on dyna? Nah lmao

That is the absolute worst idea i have ever seen if anything, you would kill off the already extra tiny population the dc has.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

Idk why you keep talking about locking dynamis players on their DC, people would just transfer away you know that right?

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Yes, I know that. But they are already traveling away anyway.

So the only way to keep people there is to prevent them leaving, really, but allow people to visit there.

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It's literally too late for dynamis the damage is already done.

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I don't think there is any damage done. Dynamis just never got off to a good start in the first place, and still hasn't. I don't think there is a really a way they can help it, other than to prevent people not using it to queue for content.

If they force people to stay there, then sure, many will leave, but the ones that stay will actually queue for content there and then other people will be more likely to get queue pops for once.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

Yes, I know that. But they are already traveling away anyway.

So the only way to keep people there is to prevent them leaving, really, but allow people to visit there.

I don't think there is any damage done. Dynamis just never got off to a good start in the first place, and still hasn't. I don't think there is a really a way they can help it, other than to prevent people not using it to queue for content.

If they force people to stay there, then sure, many will leave, but the ones that stay will actually queue for content there and then other people will be more likely to get queue pops for once.

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not "many" will leave, everyone will, dynamis players wouldnt be able to dc travel or anything while others can just come over and abuse the fall guys event or any other event that will come in the future that is by the same idea, you'd basically be at a massive disavantage by being on dyna, it's a ridiculous idea and makes our DC an even less attractive option, and it's already not attractive of an option at all.

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Originally Posted by Stormpeaks

not "many" will leave, everyone will, dynamis players wouldnt be able to dc travel or anything while others can just come over and abuse the fall guys event or any other event that will come in the future that is by the same idea, you'd basically be at a massive disavantage by being on dyna, it's a ridiculous idea and makes our DC an even less attractive option, and it's already not attractive of an option at all.

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Well ok then, but Dynamis was being used as a reason why DC travel shouldn't exist, my point was really that Dynamis could use a specific measure for it instead rather than punishing other data centers for its problems.

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Originally Posted by Volgia

All that you're asking is that we create our own little tribe and keep people out, and I don't know if i really want to spell how that will become toxic in less that a patch cycle.

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I'm not saying keep others out. I'm saying ask the locals to prioritize "buying local" if they want more local activity.

What was the opinion of Primal players about Primal raiding before data center travel was added?

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

What was the opinion of Primal players about Primal raiding before data center travel was added?

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It was very healthy. Never had a problem getting a group for anything, including ultimates. Now it's pretty much dead and if you want to raid you either have to accept waiting eons for the party to fill (which I do out of principle) if it ever fills at all or go through the hassle of travelling to Aether only to join a group full of players from Primal anyway. Smart!

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

Yes, I know that. But they are already traveling away anyway.

So the only way to keep people there is to prevent them leaving, really, but allow people to visit there.

I don't think there is any damage done. Dynamis just never got off to a good start in the first place, and still hasn't. I don't think there is a really a way they can help it, other than to prevent people not using it to queue for content.

If they force people to stay there, then sure, many will leave, but the ones that stay will actually queue for content there and then other people will be more likely to get queue pops for once.

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Or SE needs to find incentives that will get players to stay on or go to the less populated worlds instead of going to Aether by default.

Or SE comes up with disincentives for traveling to congested worlds by off world players. That could be locking worlds under character creation locks to off world Wanderers and Travelers as well, only allowing players to travel to/from the world if it is their character's home world. They can always meet their friends on their friends' world, or pick a third world if both are congested.

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Originally Posted by CidHeiral

It was very healthy. Never had a problem getting a group for anything, including ultimates. Now it's pretty much dead and if you want to raid you either have to accept waiting eons for the party to fill (which I do out of principle) if it ever fills at all or go through the hassle of travelling to Aether only to join a group full of players from Primal anyway. Smart!

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Like I said, the problem isn't that it's on Aether, the problem is that it's very optimal for players to congregate in a single DC to have the most parties to play with. For example if you are in Primal and there's 6 parties for P11S and they all have your role locked you can't do much, but if you're in Aether and there are Crystal and Aether players doing 20 parties there for p11S you're more likely to get a spot to play. It isn't a matter of server skill but of convenience.

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

What was the opinion of Primal players about Primal raiding before data center travel was added?

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We didn't only have a healthy raid scene but we even had our own discord with our own strats for Ultimates. There were a LOT of people who preferred to raid in Primal in Abyssos even with Aether open.

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Originally Posted by Volgia

Like I said, the problem isn't that it's on Aether, the problem is that it's very optimal for players to congregate in a single DC to have the most parties to play with. For example if you are in Primal and there's 6 parties for P11S and they all have your role locked you can't do much, but if you're in Aether and there are Crystal and Aether players doing 20 parties there for p11S you're more likely to get a spot to play. It isn't a matter of server skill but of convenience.

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Looks like that's working out great!

https://i.imgur.com/Kt0X8Ct.png

The Primal Raid situation is a bit of a Paradox.

Originally there were just enough people playing healers to sustain statics but with DC visit, they joined other statics and now everyone needs healers. Including those that might have went healing to fill the group may have went to other roles adding to the healer shortage.

This problem will only be made worse with region travel.

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Originally Posted by CidHeiral

Looks like that's working out great!

https://i.imgur.com/Kt0X8Ct.png

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This happened in Primal with Phys Ranged back in Asphodelos. Just a 10 parties waiting to do one content or another fighting each other for a phys ranged, and we didn't have DC travel back then!

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Originally Posted by Volgia

Like I said, the problem isn't that it's on Aether, the problem is that it's very optimal for players to congregate in a single DC to have the most parties to play with. For example if you are in Primal and there's 6 parties for P11S and they all have your role locked you can't do much, but if you're in Aether and there are Crystal and Aether players doing 20 parties there for p11S you're more likely to get a spot to play. It isn't a matter of server skill but of convenience.

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If this is truly the route that most people want to take then we might as well nuke the different DCs and have everyone pushed into one mega server. There's no reason to not at that point. It isn't really fair to force people from 3 other DCs to travel to do content when prior to DC Travel being a thing, this wasn't an issue.

Regardless of if you want to blame the playerbase or not, the system opened up the door for people to abuse it and a lot of people did. Instead of Dyna having a chance to build its own identity and community, people were going to Aether on Day 1 to do content because they didn't want to exercise an ounce of patience or used the DC as housing with plans to still go back to their original DC anyway to do their day-to-day activities. There are now consistently 100+ PFs on Aether at most hours of the day while Crystal and Primal struggle to get half of that and Dyna can't even break over 10 most of the time.

If this wasn't an issue pre-DC travel and only became one after, then the reality needs to be looked at here that the fault is on both sides: the devs and the playerbase. You should not need to leave your own DC to get content done, period. If we're going to speak on efficiency/convienence, the most efficient/convienent thing is to queue on your DC instead of having to travel and sit in a queue and then sit in a PF party waiting for it to be filled (which could take exponentially longer now considering you're fighting 10+ ads for the same content at the same time).