Add iLevel restrictions to Alliance Roulette

Two potential solutions that I'm not the first to talk about

Personal solution: Leave duty. Try again later. Additionally queue for your favorite alliance raids outside of your own roulette to populate other players alliance roulette with different content.

Solution two (Which will never become reality): I hate to say it. But copy World of Tanks, each player is able to blacklist one map, with premium you can blacklist a second map. I can only speculate but I bet most players don't mind LoTA/Syrcus/WoD, so it should impact those queues minimally.

How Do I Exclude a Map in a Standard Battle?

• Every player can exclude one map. With WoT Premium Account, you can exclude two maps.
• You can exclude a map only for Standard Battles.
• You can change the excluded map every four hours.
• If a Platoon enters a battle, maps excluded by the Platoon Commander apply.
• Excluded maps do not apply:

• to Tier I–III vehicles
• to Encounter Battles, Grand Battles, and Assault.

https://eu.wargaming.net/support/en/...article/15744/

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Originally Posted by Harpeizanae

Two potential solutions that I'm not the first to talk about

Personal solution: Leave duty. Try again later. Additionally queue for your favorite alliance raids outside of your own roulette to populate other players alliance roulette with different content.

Solution two (Which will never become reality): I hate to say it. But copy World of Tanks, each player is able to blacklist one map, with premium you can blacklist a second map. I can only speculate but I bet most players don't mind LoTA/Syrcus/WoD, so it should impact those queues minimally.

How Do I Exclude a Map in a Standard Battle?

• Every player can exclude one map. With WoT Premium Account, you can exclude two maps.
• You can exclude a map only for Standard Battles.
• You can change the excluded map every four hours.
• If a Platoon enters a battle, maps excluded by the Platoon Commander apply.
• Excluded maps do not apply:

• to Tier I–III vehicles
• to Encounter Battles, Grand Battles, and Assault.

https://eu.wargaming.net/support/en/...article/15744/

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Yo time to never see paradigm's breach ever again!

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Originally Posted by Saraide

Yo time to never see paradigm's breach ever again!

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Yep, that's the one that would be in my sights. Guaranteed 40 minute run if all goes well because of damage sponge bosses. More if it doesn't.

ilvl cheese is the least of the issues with it. It's the lowest lvl and mandatory so everyone doing alliance raid roulette is in selection.

Making the others mandatory would help, some but with it being the easiest, it would need to be correctly rebalanced which SE should have done with the stat squish but didn't, means people will ilvl cheese it still. Moving it to msq roulette is completely not viable since the dungeons in it are 4 man's, they'll never pop as it stands now.

The current msq dungeons should be scooted over into the leveling like they used to be and remove the lock on cutscenes. It has trust, do it with trust to see them in full. And in it's stead the CT raids should be alone there, as the cheapest, easiest and fastest way to fix this.
And what about void ark? Nothing, it's fine. That's a non-issue.

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Originally Posted by Harpeizanae

Two potential solutions that I'm not the first to talk about

Personal solution: Leave duty. Try again later. Additionally queue for your favorite alliance raids outside of your own roulette to populate other players alliance roulette with different content.

Solution two (Which will never become reality): I hate to say it. But copy World of Tanks, each player is able to blacklist one map, with premium you can blacklist a second map. I can only speculate but I bet most players don't mind LoTA/Syrcus/WoD, so it should impact those queues minimally.

How Do I Exclude a Map in a Standard Battle?

• Every player can exclude one map. With WoT Premium Account, you can exclude two maps.
• You can exclude a map only for Standard Battles.
• You can change the excluded map every four hours.
• If a Platoon enters a battle, maps excluded by the Platoon Commander apply.
• Excluded maps do not apply:

• to Tier I–III vehicles
• to Encounter Battles, Grand Battles, and Assault.

https://eu.wargaming.net/support/en/...article/15744/

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We'll have a total of 15 alliance raids when the EW set finishes. Alliance raids comprise of 24 players though. We definitely couldn't allow people to blacklist multiple raids. It'd be a mess.

To add to this, groups that queue together would have a well diversified blacklist. Imagine if 8 players queue together in a group. That's 8 unique blacklists, over half of the existing raids currently and half of them even after EW finishes. It wouldn't be fair, and if anything, it'd create the potential for trolls to try and break the queues altogether.

And finally, alliance raid queues die off at certain times on most servers. This would probably harm queue times further during those times.

Even a single blacklist would be asking for way too much.

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Originally Posted by Ranaku

I think OP is a bit confused, these restrictions already exist. You can't queue for like world of darkness if your itemlevel is below 90. That is the reason why if you push your itemlevel below that you will only get either crystal tower or labyrinth.

Fact tho is that SE can never change this cause of how the roulette works, you can complete the msq without ever doing a different raid than the crystal tower raids. So if a player who has only ever done these queues for alliance raid roulette it will be anyways just one of these 3. Which is one of the reasons why the crystal tower series, as the mandatory msq raid, will ALWAYS pop much more frequently than any other alliance raid even without the cheese.

Sucks i know but there is literally nothing that can be ever changed or will get changed about it, put your energy into something else than crying over it i would say, just move on.

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They could change it to be like Mentor roulette and its locked until you have all the raids unlocked or at least the highest raid for your highest level chr and then add the ilvl requirement

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Originally Posted by NekoMataMata

We'll have a total of 15 alliance raids when the EW set finishes. Alliance raids comprise of 24 players though. We definitely couldn't allow people to blacklist multiple raids. It'd be a mess.

To add to this, groups that queue together would have a well diversified blacklist. Imagine if 8 players queue together in a group. That's 8 unique blacklists, over half of the existing raids currently and half of them even after EW finishes. It wouldn't be fair, and if anything, it'd create the potential for trolls to try and break the queues altogether.

And finally, alliance raid queues die off at certain times on most servers. This would probably harm queue times further during those times.

Even a single blacklist would be asking for way too much.

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My guess is if they ever made this sort of blacklist a thing, they will only take account of party leader's blacklist just like how players cannot join a PF of somebody they blacklisted but can still end up in the same PF.

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Originally Posted by Ayche

Enforcing that you must have all 24-man raids unlocked is not a huge ask.
Especially since this would only apply to people who want to use the roulette.
Also 24-man raids should have strict ilvl syncs to ensure they can never truly be overgeared for.

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Why should people be forced to unlock and do optional content they dont want to do? Thats a hard no. If you want to do a certain one queue it directly or accept your roulette.

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Originally Posted by Nyxs

Why should people be forced to unlock and do optional content they dont want to do? Thats a hard no. If you want to do a certain one queue it directly or accept your roulette.

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Because roulettes are basically volunteering to get bodies into old content.
If you want the roulette rewards, you gotta be willing to volunteer to run content you don't personally like.
If you never want to take the risk of running old content you have zero tolerance for, just forgo the roulette rewards.

It might break their DF algorithim/programming but the only fair way to fix things (w/o them shoving CT into its own roulette with separate roulette rewards, which I think the Devs are hesitant to do) is for there to be a ilvl check and if you are the reason CT was chosen you'll get the EXP and other rewards we get currently, but if you're ilvl is high enough to qualify for a non CT raid and you end up in CT anyway due to somebody else then you get additional rewards (can even have that be tiered even further, with the highest tier being available for meeting the EW 24 man raids ilvl requirements) for not participating in ilvl cheese. If all 24 people get CT due to the DF's roll of the dice then everyone gets enhanced rewards.

This sidesteps the issue of people who legitimately need the clear being punished or quarantined off into their own roulette category/pool of possible players.

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Originally Posted by Ayche

Because roulettes are basically volunteering to get bodies into old content.
If you want the roulette rewards, you gotta be willing to volunteer to run content you don't personally like.
If you never want to take the risk of running old content you have zero tolerance for, just forgo the roulette rewards.

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SE could instead make roulettes enjoyable. Having to put up with content you don't find fun isn't a selling point and isn't something to defend.

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Originally Posted by NekoMataMata

The Prae-Castrum comparison is weird though. Prae had the better value despite being longer, but Prae was also much more afk too when you remember that the fights in both were easily pushed through. The ultimate weapon fights in Prae were the only fights that maybe took more than a minute(I don't really remember). Prae being longer didn't matter so much because you could do other things during the whole movie's worth of cutscenes.

You'd be better off both nerfing CT and buffing other raids, and a lot of people would still probably just stop doing alliance raid roulette, but I feel like that'd be for the best anyways.

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If you believe that would be the eventual end result, then this is a terrible solution regardless.

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Originally Posted by PyurBlue

SE could instead make roulettes enjoyable. Having to put up with content you don't find fun isn't a selling point and isn't something to defend.

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Thats kinda subjective. The only way they can make CT enjoyable is to finally update the damn raids to the current level of quality and spectacle offered by the newer ones. Although part of the fun with endgame raids are the fact that you have more access to your toolkit soooo...

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

Thats kinda subjective. The only way they can make CT enjoyable is to finally update the damn raids to the current level of quality and spectacle offered by the newer ones. Although part of the fun with endgame raids are the fact that you have more access to your toolkit soooo...

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Fun is absolutely subjective, so one way to make the roulettes more fun is to give us more control over what content we end up in. My idea of making CT more fun is to never have to run them. Before the CT raids were mandatory you could avoid unlocking them and have an alliance roulette that was much better. We could go back to this if the CT raids were put in their own roulette. There are players that naturally flock to them, so there is no danger of increasing queue times for required content. Instead of trying to fight everyone, just let them do what they want. This would allow the other alliance raids to have their own roulette or roulettes to be enjoyed by the players that prefer them.

If you don't want random duties or a particular duty, don't do roulette. You hate to see it, but that's all this ever comes back to because you're still not coming up with anything that's actually better for everyone.

No one's forcing anyone to do anything they don't want, but when you do something like a roulette, you have to understand and accept what the possibilities are. Some of you sound like you should avoid mentor roulette because if you think CT is bad, wait til you get ARR EX fights with a bunch of sprouts.

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Originally Posted by Deveryn

If you don't want random duties or a particular duty, don't do roulette. You hate to see it, but that's all this ever comes back to because you're still not coming up with anything that's actually better for everyone.

No one's forcing anyone to do anything they don't want, but when you do something like a roulette, you have to understand and accept what the possibilities are. Some of you sound like you should avoid mentor roulette because if you think CT is bad, wait til you get ARR EX fights with a bunch of sprouts.

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How do you figure that? Also, why does it even matter? If a new idea is not making things worse for anyone, but better for me, who is losing out? No one.

Being given the option to avoid certain duties sounds like exactly the thing that would benefit everyone anyway. If roulettes were more inviting, that might increase participation. Especially when we have duties with very lopsided participation rates. It would be almost impossible to create a situation where CT queue times increase. It's mandatory and many people care about getting in and out rather than actually having any kind of in game experience. That is creating a very negative experience for many players who would rather run the other raids in the game. I don't see any way to paint the side that wants to actually enjoy the game as selfish or entitled. Roulettes don't have to be the way they are now. If their current form doesn't bother you fine, but trying looking beyond your own point of view.

And CT being worse than wiping in EX? Hardly, at least one counts as something to do.

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Originally Posted by PyurBlue

How do you figure that? Also, why does it even matter? If a new idea is not making things worse for anyone, but better for me, who is losing out? No one.

Being given the option to avoid certain duties sounds like exactly the thing that would benefit everyone anyway. If roulettes were more inviting, that might increase participation. Especially when we have duties with very lopsided participation rates. It would be almost impossible to create a situation where CT queue times increase. It's mandatory and many people care about getting in and out rather than actually having any kind of in game experience. That is creating a very negative experience for many players who would rather run the other raids in the game. I don't see any way to paint the side that wants to actually enjoy the game as selfish or entitled. Roulettes don't have to be the way they are now. If their current form doesn't bother you fine, but trying looking beyond your own point of view.

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My point is these ideas only make things better for you (maybe) and will somehow make things worse for others. I've said all I can and more in this thread and the main one.

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And CT being worse than wiping in EX? Hardly, at least one counts as something to do.

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Take the blinders off so you can read better. Failing that, read it again! Failing that, have someone show you how to read comparative statements like the one I made.

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Originally Posted by Deveryn

My point is these ideas only make things better for you (maybe) and will somehow make things worse for others.

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If you have some objection to the idea, share it. That's how problems are solved. Otherwise you're making baseless assumptions (like it's going to be worse for everyone).

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Take the blinders off so you can read better.

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What you typed was read very clearly. If wiping is possible, even if it's from poor play, then whatever content you're pointing to is almost certainly better than CT.

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Originally Posted by Deveryn

If you don't want random duties or a particular duty, don't do roulette. You hate to see it, but that's all this ever comes back to because you're still not coming up with anything that's actually better for everyone.

No one's forcing anyone to do anything they don't want, but when you do something like a roulette, you have to understand and accept what the possibilities are. Some of you sound like you should avoid mentor roulette because if you think CT is bad, wait til you get ARR EX fights with a bunch of sprouts.

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Lol! You gotta be a troll.. your accusing the people who are queuing normally for AR roulette of not being ok with their duty? When the ilvl cheese heads are literally crying about being in any duty except CT/LotA to the fact that they are activity manipulating the RNG of the roulette to only be what they want.. get outta here with that victim shaming and role reversal on who is really the problem!

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Originally Posted by Baxcel

Lol! You gotta be a troll.. your accusing the people who are queuing normally for AR roulette of not being ok with their duty? When the ilvl cheese heads are literally crying about being in any duty except CT/LotA to the fact that they are activity manipulating the RNG of the roulette to only be what they want.. get outta here with that victim shaming and role reversal on who is really the problem!

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Nah. Troll would be saying everything you just said.

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Originally Posted by PyurBlue

SE could instead make roulettes enjoyable. Having to put up with content you don't find fun isn't a selling point and isn't something to defend.

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You missed the point...

Roulettes can be enjoyable or unenjoyable, but regardless, you won't always get to do the content that you want to do because the purpose of roulettes is to help fill in queues.

Roulettes give you rewards because you're filling in necessary slots, helping other players get into duties. When you do roulettes with a full party of friends or manipulate the roulette with your gear, you cheat a system that's supposed to benefit the community. It's a system set up so that you help players and in return you get rewards. It's a two way street. If you're not willing to help out with content that you've unlocked then you shouldn't join the roulette, not the other way around.

I don't know how many times we have to reiterate this.

Besides that, how exactly do you want to change roulettes to be enjoyable when as you've already mentioned, enjoyment and fun is subjective(not to mention that roulettes consist of a variety of duties within each queue and you'd have to apply that change to all of them)?

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

If you believe that would be the eventual end result, then this is a terrible solution regardless.

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Why is it a terrible solution?

People are currently abusing the system, so therefore, why should the system itself continue to exist?

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Originally Posted by NekoMataMata

People are currently abusing the system, so therefore, why should the system itself continue to exist?

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Yes, people abuse the system. That's been established and there's no disputing it, but it's just part of many reasons that CT will come up in roulette. That's why the system should continue to exist. The legit reasons outweigh the illegitimate.

There's no good / clear alternative that will address all of the situations. SE doesn't want to force anyone down a particular path. They do encourage unlocking the other raids. Upping the challenge is out because it already has enough going on and it's also the intro to the alliance format.

Some folks complain about the cheese and freely admit to bailing as soon as they land in CT. Those people are no better than the ones cheesing because you're forcing another person to fill that spot. How is that fair? I'd say it's even worse because people don't check off 'party in progress' to fill in for babies, but that's what happens.

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Originally Posted by NekoMataMata

You missed the point...

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I disagree, if it seems that way I think it's because you're not considering what's beyond the status quo.

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Roulettes can be enjoyable or unenjoyable, but regardless, you won't always get to do the content that you want to do because the purpose of roulettes is to help fill in queues.

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FF14 is a video game, so if something is unenjoyable, I think it's fair to say that it might be a fault.

Roulettes are meant to help fill queues, we can agree on that. Being dull isn't part of that requirement though. Unless roulettes could only function as they are now, and there is no possible alternative, then do we have to suffer through a roulette system that isn't fun? Do you believe in constructive criticism? Do you believe that developers can make mistakes or that they should be take feedback from the community? It's very strange that requests to improve the game are looked down upon so heavily.

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Roulettes give you rewards because you're filling in necessary slots, helping other players get into duties. When you do roulettes with a full party of friends or manipulate the roulette with your gear, you cheat a system that's supposed to benefit the community. It's a system set up so that you help players and in return you get rewards. It's a two way street. If you're not willing to help out with content that you've unlocked then you shouldn't join the roulette, not the other way around.

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Following the rules isn't cheating the system. Premade parties are perfectly OK. If the game went out of its way to prevent you from playing with friends, what value would it even have? You can argue against influencing the roulette with gear since it's probably unintentional that max level players can force low level duties, although there are reasons for the roulette to take gear into account. Just because you're level 60 doesn't mean that you have level 60 gear or can even unlock level 60 content.

Anyway, this is all besides the point. You're unintentionally or not defending a poorly thought out system because you're not looking for alternatives. Roulettes being boring does not help them achieve their goal. It probably does the opposite as it makes people not want to queue for them. What would you rather queue for; an expert roulette with the same 2 never changing dungeons that are practically identical in all but aesthetic that you've played 500 times each or an expert roulette with 5 dynamic dungeons that change a bit each time and have some challenge to them? Well that's a subjective I guess, but I know for a fact quite a few people, myself included, would prefer the latter. I'd queue probably queue for it even if I had already received my daily reward.

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I don't know how many times we have to reiterate this.

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It doesn't matter how many times it's repeated. It's just not a good argument. Why do roulettes need to be boring to fulfill their purpose?

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Besides that, how exactly do you want to change roulettes to be enjoyable when as you've already mentioned, enjoyment and fun is subjective(not to mention that roulettes consist of a variety of duties within each queue and you'd have to apply that change to all of them)?

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That's the easy part. Give people choice. Since it's subjective, let people find their own fun. The people that want to login, get XP, and log out can queue for CT. I'll queue for something that doesn't have me reaching for the abandon duty button or more realistically avoiding the roulette (defeating its purpose) completely.

The best solution is just to lower the ilvl sync cap so that the CT raids actually have mechanics again. The second boss of ST hasn't seen mechanics since WoD released and it has only gotten worse over time. Once the CT series is on the same level as the rest of the raids (minus Void Ark because that's too easy too) then there is no reason to ilvl cheese it. It will still op more often than the others, but the ilvl cheese won't contribute to it.

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Originally Posted by PyurBlue

I disagree, if it seems that way I think it's because you're not considering what's beyond the status quo.


FF14 is a video game, so if something is unenjoyable, I think it's fair to say that it might be a fault.

Roulettes are meant to help fill queues, we can agree on that. Being dull isn't part of that requirement though. Unless roulettes could only function as they are now, and there is no possible alternative, then do we have to suffer through a roulette system that isn't fun? Do you believe in constructive criticism? Do you believe that developers can make mistakes or that they should be take feedback from the community? It's very strange that requests to improve the game are looked down upon so heavily.

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I find roulettes fun and interesting. Maybe you should check out the other thread on this topic.

You're entitled to feel one way or another, but that doesn't mean someone else is at fault for that feeling. Some people don't like gathering or crafting. That doesn't mean the system is poorly designed.

I like pineapple on pizza. Other people don't. That doesn't mean it's a horrible idea and it should never be done.

If you feel negatively about something, maybe you need to just stop doing it.

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That's the easy part. Give people choice. Since it's subjective, let people find their own fun.

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The choice is there. You choose to ignore it. All these arguments and discussions over a little bit of xp and tomes rewarded from a roulette.... Why? Why is this the hill people want to die on? There are certainly more pressing issues with the game that could use attention.

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Originally Posted by BubblyBoar

The best solution is just to lower the ilvl sync cap so that the CT raids actually have mechanics again. The second boss of ST hasn't seen mechanics since WoD released and it has only gotten worse over time. Once the CT series is on the same level as the rest of the raids (minus Void Ark because that's too easy too) then there is no reason to ilvl cheese it. It will still op more often than the others, but the ilvl cheese won't contribute to it.

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Level sync can only do so much. Level 50 has been reduced to being almost as simple as level 15 at this point. You can't recreate the original experience. If instead of level sync we had stat sync so we could do run CT with level 90 skills at level 50 damage and HP, maybe that would work.

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Originally Posted by Deveryn

I find roulettes fun and interesting.

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I'm glad to hear it, you should be onboard with my idea since it's designed to change nothing for people like you.

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Maybe you should check out the other thread on this topic.

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It doesn't seem relevant.

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You're entitled to feel one way or another, but that doesn't mean someone else is at fault for that feeling. Some people don't like gathering or crafting. That doesn't mean the system is poorly designed.

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The conversion your quoting was discussing if roulettes should offer an entertaining experience. The proper analogy isn't a crafting system that only some people like, it's a crafting system that no one likes. If I were to use an argument similar to "roulettes can be boring for everyone because they fill queues" it would be no different than saying "crafting can be boring for everyone because it contributes to the economy". When you spell it out, it doesn't sound very good.

This is all besides the point again because, as I said the last time we discussed this:

"Also, why does it even matter? If a new idea is not making things worse for anyone, but better for me, who is losing out? No one."
If you have a problem with the idea, let's hear it. If you don't, then it doesn't seem like there is a problem.

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I like pineapple on pizza. Other people don't. That doesn't mean it's a horrible idea and it should never be done.

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And that's why reasonable people don't make arguments like this.

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If you feel negatively about something, maybe you need to just stop doing it.

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Would that apply to your participation in this thread? No, you seem to care about the subject, so you're putting in your opinion to defend your stance. You should expect the same from other people. If players care about the game, they will suggest improvements.

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There are certainly more pressing issues with the game that could use attention.

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Maybe then, this is near the top of the list. The game is built on roulettes. You're expected as a player to spend a considerable amount of time in roulettes. If roulettes are supposed to be a more or less everyday experience, they should absolutely contribute to every player's enjoyment. That's just how games work.

Skipping a lot because you're being obtuse.

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Originally Posted by PyurBlue

Maybe then, this is near the top of the list. The game is built on roulettes. You're expected as a player to spend a considerable amount of time in roulettes. If roulettes are supposed to be a more or less everyday experience, they should absolutely contribute to every player's enjoyment. That's just how games work.

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The game is built on a story and different modes of play. Roulettes are icing on the cake. You're expected to play the game to your level of enjoyment, not a predetermined amount of time or duties. You're given a wide range of activities to choose from because you can't please everyone all the time.

If you're never going to answer the question of what it is you need so badly from this roulette that you can't get from anywhere else, then the conversation is pretty much done. You're looking to make a change where it's not really needed or will have a negative impact on others. Selfish ideas like this will not make it to discussion by the devs.

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Originally Posted by PyurBlue

Level sync can only do so much. .

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They can do a lot more than they have.

Because right now the ilvl sync for CT is:

LoTA: Min ilvl 50, ilvl sync 130 (Almost 3 times the minimum)
ST: Min ilvl 70, ilvl sync 130 (almost twice the minimum)
WoD: Min ilvl 90, ilvl sync 130 (almost 50% more than the minimum)

No ilvl sync should be more than ideally 10 ilvls more than the rewards for said content. At most LOTA should have an ilvl 70 max (ST's minimum), ST should have an ilvl max of 90 (WOD's minimum)

LoTA at ilvl sync of 60 would be completely different than it is right now.

its 135 isnt it?

but i agree. ilvl sync, more rewards for longer raids und preventing cheesing.... a lot to do to make a-raid roulette better

Hello again, this topic. It’s been a while, I thought you had forgotten about us.

I’ll help reunite you with your family:

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...-cheese-people
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...-the-CT-24-man
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...ower-has-to-go
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...d-use-a-rework

…and these are just in like..the last month or two.

@OP, I wish they actually would address this in an official way, either a “it’s working as intended” or “yeah that’s not cool”. I don’t care which way at this point, but point blank, I would never run those roulettes again if they required me to gear up for a job I’m never going to play beyond being competionist.

As is, I level a job to 50, get what I need to do CT and level it passively on alliance raid, beast tribes and pvp. I never need better gear, and I will never use those jobs again after leveling. I’m not interested in doing anything else with that job and, were I required to do otherwise I’d just stop doing the raid roulette entirely, which (assuming others are like me) would only make less people doing the content entirely, which wouldn’t really change wait times that much…it just makes CT take longer to get as well.

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Originally Posted by kaynide

As is, I level a job to 50, get what I need to do CT and level it passively on alliance raid, beast tribes and pvp. I never need better gear, and I will never use those jobs again after leveling. I’m not interested in doing anything else with that job and, were I required to do otherwise I’d just stop doing the raid roulette entirely, which (assuming others are like me) would only make less people doing the content entirely, which wouldn’t really change wait times that much…it just makes CT take longer to get as well.

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The reason i avoid that roulette is because im sick of the same raids over and over and never facing the later ones. For any person that wouldnt enter anymore, a player like me can take its place.

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Originally Posted by Ayche

Because roulettes are basically volunteering to get bodies into old content.
If you want the roulette rewards, you gotta be willing to volunteer to run content you don't personally like.
If you never want to take the risk of running old content you have zero tolerance for, just forgo the roulette rewards.

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Just because someone doesnt want to unlock every single piece of content you think they shouldn’t get to do roulettes? How very self-entitled of you to think you get to decide everyone has to do everything. No one has to. If its not required for MSQ its OPTIONAL content. You do know what that word means right?

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Originally Posted by Nyxs

Just because someone doesnt want to unlock every single piece of content you think they shouldn’t get to do roulettes? How very self-entitled of you to think you get to decide everyone has to do everything. No one has to. If its not required for MSQ its OPTIONAL content. You do know what that word means right?

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Interesting how you try to deflect the selfish desire on me.
The sole reason to do roulettes is the rewards. If you want the reward, you help others in whatever content they want to do.
You don't get to pick and choose what you want to play AND get the reward, that is the actual selfish behavior in this thread.
Enough with this same trash argument, also in every single thread where mentors moan about the mentor roulette.

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Originally Posted by Nyxs

Just because someone doesnt want to unlock every single piece of content you think they shouldn’t get to do roulettes? How very self-entitled of you to think you get to decide everyone has to do everything. No one has to. If its not required for MSQ its OPTIONAL content. You do know what that word means right?

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That's an extremely weak argument because doing roulettes is also optional. Hell even MSQ is optional. Who's gonna stop you if you just never progress past ARR and instead spend your entire time ocean fishing?

So if one only has the starting ARR game and no expansions. You going to block them from running alliance raids because they don't have any of the other expansions. It's just fine how it is now been this way for years. I don't have a problems ever getting it the raid I won't without alliance raid roulette.

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Originally Posted by PyurBlue

Fun is absolutely subjective, so one way to make the roulettes more fun is to give us more control over what content we end up in. My idea of making CT more fun is to never have to run them. Before the CT raids were mandatory you could avoid unlocking them and have an alliance roulette that was much better. We could go back to this if the CT raids were put in their own roulette. There are players that naturally flock to them, so there is no danger of increasing queue times for required content. Instead of trying to fight everyone, just let them do what they want. This would allow the other alliance raids to have their own roulette or roulettes to be enjoyed by the players that prefer them.

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I will agree to at least have CT be on MSQ roulette solely based on the fact that its required for msq.

But I dont think thisll ultimately solve the issue as people will still complain, heck even with what we have now I always see people complain in chat when we get one of the Ivalice raids or Dun Scaith when I get queued into them. Whos to say if they do arrange CT out of alliance roulette, that those older raids will also start to lose appeal and be in the same position as CT was?

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Originally Posted by hynaku

So if one only has the starting ARR game and no expansions. You going to block them from running alliance raids because they don't have any of the other expansions. It's just fine how it is now been this way for years. I don't have a problems ever getting it the raid I won't without alliance raid roulette.

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Considering people have asked to either change the level synch limit to keep the roulette from being zerged, or move CT to MSQ roulette because it's now a mandatory thing that skews the probability by default (as in, without even factoring in people cheesing the item level), I'm pretty sure people with the base game would be fine.

Also, people with the base game have free access to Heavensward. They can go unlock Mhach once they reach lv 60. They're not stuck to just what the MSQ gives them.

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Originally Posted by Atelier-Bagur

I will agree to at least have CT be on MSQ roulette solely based on the fact that its required for msq.

But I dont think thisll ultimately solve the issue as people will still complain, heck even with what we have now I always see people complain in chat when we get one of the Ivalice raids or Dun Scaith when I get queued into them. Whos to say if they do arrange CT out of alliance roulette, that those older raids will also start to lose appeal and be in the same position as CT was?

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Yeah, and that's the problem with the above statement. Because if we add it to MSQ, then Mhach will be the only thing "base game players" will have access to in their Alliance Raid Roulette.

Even if they don't punch through the synch like they did with CT, it's still going to end up putting Mhach raids at a higher probability. Though, that's always to be expected; it is nowadays. People have access to this on the base game, meaning it's likely more people will have Mhach unlocked than people with, say, NieR.

However, there are alternatives to shoving CT to MSQ. Probably healthier for the content as well.

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Originally Posted by PyurBlue

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That's the easy part. Give people choice. Since it's subjective, let people find their own fun. The people that want to login, get XP, and log out can queue for CT. I'll queue for something that doesn't have me reaching for the abandon duty button or more realistically avoiding the roulette (defeating its purpose) completely.

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You really, really enjoy saying the same things over and over again, don't you?

So tell me how your solution of giving people choices in regards to roulettes is going to help roulettes fulfil their purpose of filling in empty queues? Your idea of removing the boredom from roulettes would do more harm than good.

You act like it's some sort of amazing solution, when in reality, you most likely just want to be able to do the quickest roulette possible and log out. You don't want to help others or contribute to the community. You want to help yourself to rewards you haven't earned.

To suggest that anything should be added to MSQ roulette is to ignore its actual purpose, which was to get people to help out at a key point in the story with these scene-heavy instances. Even with duty support being enabled, they still stand on their own instead of just being put in the level 50 spot.

If someone wants to use the logic that required content should be put in the roulette, then they would have to add way more than just CT.

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Originally Posted by Midareyukki

Considering people have asked to either change the level synch limit to keep the roulette from being zerged, or move CT to MSQ roulette because it's now a mandatory thing that skews the probability by default (as in, without even factoring in people cheesing the item level), I'm pretty sure people with the base game would be fine.

Also, people with the base game have free access to Heavensward. They can go unlock Mhach once they reach lv 60. They're not stuck to just what the MSQ gives them.



Yeah, and that's the problem with the above statement. Because if we add it to MSQ, then Mhach will be the only thing "base game players" will have access to in their Alliance Raid Roulette.

Even if they don't punch through the synch like they did with CT, it's still going to end up putting Mhach raids at a higher probability. Though, that's always to be expected; it is nowadays. People have access to this on the base game, meaning it's likely more people will have Mhach unlocked than people with, say, NieR.

However, there are alternatives to shoving CT to MSQ. Probably healthier for the content as well.

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Yeah I think ultimately the whole misconception of the frequency of CT raids on roulettes due to ilv cheese is in truth the most minor of contributors . What we have currently is fine and works for what is intended (although I still stand by the case of moving CT to msq roulette) and if you really have an issue of doing CT on roulette, nothing is stopping you from leaving. You have 3 strikes per day for doing it and most people dont mind taking one regardless.