Purge ERP from this game!

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Originally Posted by redheadturk

If your teenagers are running off to meet RL adults, that's a you problem, not an ERP problem. Teach your kids the signs of what to look for, their chances of being preyed upon go down significantly. It's because parents think "sex is icky" and refuse to educate their children on how to avoid predators that such things are so prevelent in the first place. Adults and consenting teens keeping things between teens should not be punished by having activities they enjoy banned just because adults are too damned squeamish to teach their kids how to minimize their risk of exposure to predators.

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Yes, obviously you have a lot of experience with children.
You are assuming children have the same degree of understanding and wisdom as adults, they always do what they are told, always go with the right choice.
You are projecting adult behaviour onto children, and not even adults are able to do the right thing at all times.

The human brain fully matures at the age of 25, a 13 year old brain is far from being able to comprehend how the world works.
No matter how good of a parent you are, you cannot expect a 13 year old child to always behave properly, that's why there are so many laws directed at the protection of children.

I'm sorry Karen. But we are not a theocracy.

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Originally Posted by Setesh45

Yes, obviously you have a lot of experience with children.
You are assuming children have the same degree of understanding and wisdom as adults, they always do what they are told, always go with the right choice.
You are projecting adult behaviour onto children, and not even adults are able to do the right thing at all times.

The human brain fully matures at the age of 25, a 13 year old brain is far from being able to comprehend how the world works.
No matter how good of a parent you are, you cannot expect a 13 year old child to always behave properly, that's why there are so many laws directed at the protection of children.

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Again watch your damn kids. Guess what? Kids can't play this game unless their parents pay their subs past a certain point. If you don't want your kids under the age of thirteen [which kids under 13 aren't legally supposed to be in this game in the first place without strict parental supervision, accounts have gotten banned because they belonged to kids under 13] exposed to things in this game, don't allow them to have unsupervised internet access or purchase the game. Simple as.

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Originally Posted by Setesh45

For someone so old you're quite naive... How do you think pedophiles seek their victims these days? Using "harmless" ERP on social media, it starts as ERP, your "relatively harmless" fun, after a while they agree to meet... Even someone as naive as you should be able to imagine what comes next. People on the internet are anonymous, you cannot know their age, that's why there is nothing like "as long as both parties are teens", you just don't know, cannot know, hence ERP needs to be harshly punished in all media content targeted at minors.

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What exactly do you propose? Because with this type of reasoning, we would have to ban all types of games directly, or ban minors from them. Heck, in fact we should ban minors from all types of forums and even almost the entire internet.

If ERP is banned, predators will use other methods. "Whispering", for example. Or Discord. I think you are naive if you think that banning ERP will have any impact on the abuses that can exist in video games.

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Originally Posted by hagare

I'm sorry Karen. But we are not a theocracy.

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Excuse me sir. Early Heavensward Ishgard was meant to be an instruction manual for the workings of a perfectly healthy society with no flaws what so ever.

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Originally Posted by Merrigan

What exactly do you propose? Because with this type of reasoning, we would have to ban all types of games directly, or ban minors from them. Heck, in fact we should ban minors from all types of forums and even almost the entire internet.

If ERP is banned, predators will use other methods. "Whispering", for example. Or Discord. I think you are naive if you think that banning ERP will have any impact on the abuses that can exist in video games.

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Because it's nothing to do with children at all, just a means to control and police others.

There is a depressingly large population that wants to ban any kind of mature content and interactions from everything.

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Originally Posted by GrizzlyTank

Because it's nothing to do with children at all, just a means to control and police others.

There is a depressingly large population that wants to ban any kind of mature content and interactions from everything.

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This person reminds me of the twatter antiship crusaders. I've run into them, on the whole they are insane.

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Originally Posted by GrizzlyTank

Because it's nothing to do with children at all, just a means to control and police others.

There is a depressingly large population that wants to ban any kind of mature content and interactions from everything.

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I think some people are really proposing this from the perspective of protecting children. The questions it raises about infringement of personal freedoms or control are real, but don't seem to be part of the conversation here.

Having said that, I find that there is a huge hypocrisy about the ERP in general. I see a lot of people calling ERP enthusiasts "degenerates" and the like. And I can't help but wonder if they're not consuming some pretty nasty content themselves, but suddenly hide behind the excuse of modesty as soon as the virtual is involved.

ERP is not something I understand personally. But honestly, I'd tend to be much more shocked by some p*rnographic content that goes extremely far into vulgarity; or adds that are sometimes so suggestive that you wonder if they should really be displayed on the street.

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Originally Posted by Setesh45

Yes, obviously you have a lot of experience with children.
You are assuming children have the same degree of understanding and wisdom as adults, they always do what they are told, always go with the right choice.
You are projecting adult behaviour onto children, and not even adults are able to do the right thing at all times.
The human brain fully matures at the age of 25, a 13 year old brain is far from being able to comprehend how the world works.
No matter how good of a parent you are, you cannot expect a 13 year old child to always behave properly, that's why there are so many laws directed at the protection of children.

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Your job as a parent is to make sure they don't do anything stupid. Any other response is an excuse. I'm very well researched in crime including crimes done to children. ERP is not your enemy. I've said this before and I'll say it again. Your enemy is social media and platforms where kids feel the need to post or exchange about themselves. To name the biggest ones right now; discord and twitter. Those are the main two hubs that I personally see kids make terrible mistakes. People exchange discords all the time in xiv. All the time. Its pretty much a must if you join an fc or a lot of content like raiding which involves using their voices which attracts predators after hearing them speak. These two spaces, young people tend to want to stand out the most. They want to be somebody. They post selfies, they overshare about their real life, they talk to strangers and develop crushes. This is all irl stuff. None of this has anything to do with people roleplaying as two catboys. Do you understand what I'm saying?

Try not to get defensive or argumentative with me. Really think about it.
I'm telling you I've seen this myself. I've seen young kids clearly getting groomed stemming from raiding. Stemming from just posting a lot on twitter and getting a little following. I've seen it. The common denominator is them involving their real lives. Not them pretending to be a vampy looking aura. And when it comes to things like that, that is souly the responsibility of parents. That is their soul obligation. You are to watch your children and what they do online. If something happens, you bare responsibility. Because you should have been watching what they were posting. No one care about what a cool progressive space-giving parent you are when your kid turns up missing because they made friends with someone 30 years older than them in minecraft (which is a true case and the girl has still never been found to this day, shes been gone for 2 years about now). Ok? If you genuinely want to be angry and point fingers and make a fuss about the dangers of the internet for children, point it in the right place, is all I'm saying. Because this isnt it.

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Originally Posted by Merrigan

What exactly do you propose? Because with this type of reasoning, we would have to ban all types of games directly, or ban minors from them. Heck, in fact we should ban minors from all types of forums and even almost the entire internet.

If ERP is banned, predators will use other methods. "Whispering", for example. Or Discord. I think you are naive if you think that banning ERP will have any impact on the abuses that can exist in video games.

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What I propose? Nothing but following the ToS. ERP is already against the rules.

"You may not use profanity or any language that a reasonable person would find offensive. The Game is for players aged 13 and older. You agree to behave accordingly."

Everyone here trying to justify ERP is basically saying it's ok to break the rules that already exist. Saying it's ok to ERP with 13 years old kids.
I'm only asking for a simpler way to report public ERP and stricter punishments.

https://support.na.square-enix.com/r...1&tag=users_en

boy this got boring really fast guess 8 padges was the burnout point.

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Originally Posted by Setesh45

What I propose? Nothing but following the ToS. ERP is already against the rules.

"You may not use profanity or any language that a reasonable person would find offensive. The Game is for players aged 13 and older. You agree to behave accordingly."

Everyone here trying to justify ERP is basically saying it's ok to break the rules that already exist. Saying it's ok to ERP with 13 years old kids.
I'm only asking for a simpler way to report public ERP and stricter punishments.

https://support.na.square-enix.com/r...1&tag=users_en

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I've never understood ToS documents that include this clause when the game itself has profanity (a lot of it voice acted) baked into the game itself and other pretty heavy and elicit subject matter being discussed or mentioned. What defines a reasonable person and what defines offensive? In the context of public discourse that could be just about anything depending on your walk in life.

In this case, no one can see what they're doing or saying (again, public ERP is another matter entirely.) The last thing we need are some Home-Owners Association tier loons going up and banging on their doors and windows to threaten them with harsh reprisals for the words they type.

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Originally Posted by Batbrat

Your job as a parent is to make sure they don't do anything stupid. Any other response is an excuse.

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Are you god? Can you monitor your children 24/7? Can you see absolutely every interaction your child has with anyone and anywhere? Can you guarantee their still developing brains think everything through?
Your first two sentences already show how disconnected from the real world you are.

The parents job and the job of all adults is to try to limit the amount of risks the children are exposed to and prepare them for the risks they may get exposed to. The age rattings are a result of this job, that's why when something is rated for teens it should be ok for teens and it cannot support ERP which is not meant for teens.
Public ERP is already against the rules, like it or not. I just want an easier way to report it and stricter punishments.

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Originally Posted by redheadturk

Again watch your damn kids. Guess what? Kids can't play this game unless their parents pay their subs past a certain point. If you don't want your kids under the age of thirteen [which kids under 13 aren't legally supposed to be in this game in the first place without strict parental supervision, accounts have gotten banned because they belonged to kids under 13] exposed to things in this game, don't allow them to have unsupervised internet access or purchase the game. Simple as.

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Just read the rules dude, ERP is already against the ToS. Smarter people than you and me decided that pretty much on a global level, you can present your argument to them.
All I want is an easier way to report public ERP.

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Originally Posted by Setesh45

What I propose? Nothing but following the ToS. ERP is already against the rules.

"You may not use profanity or any language that a reasonable person would find offensive. The Game is for players aged 13 and older. You agree to behave accordingly."

Everyone here trying to justify ERP is basically saying it's ok to break the rules that already exist. Saying it's ok to ERP with 13 years old kids.
I'm only asking for a simpler way to report public ERP and stricter punishments.

https://support.na.square-enix.com/r...1&tag=users_en

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Okay, just... no.

Keeping a certain politeness between players, reminding them that they are not just talking to bots but to people they owe some respect: yes. It helps to minimize the toxic behavior that too many people allow themselves under the guise of anonymity.

Calibrating everything so that it is accessible and politically correct is another problem. That's how you get tasteless games. Especially since some parts of the game are much less "politically correct" than ERP.

Endwalker's story can be deeply depressing at times.
Direct references to rape are made frequently.
Miqo'te are often referred to as prostitutes; only the word is never uttered, but it is crystal clear.

From this, it is clear that SE has opted for an environment that is not all rosy, and whose undertones are accessible to an adult audience. I would also point out that the rules you mention do not prohibit ERP at all, as long as it is done by "whisp" / offered in a respectful way / in adapted places (cf: some "brothels" in housing areas)

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Originally Posted by Nizzi

SICKNESS MUST BE PURGED

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LoL u got to it B4 I did.

FILTHY RATS
THIS SHALL BE A MERCY

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Originally Posted by Setesh45

Just read the rules dude, ERP is already against the ToS. Smarter people than you and me decided that pretty much on a global level, you can present your argument to them.
All I want is an easier way to report public ERP.

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No, public erp is against the rules, not erp in general. Hell, the one GM that tried to ban people for erp party finders? That guy got disciplined and moved to another team and all bans he handed out were rescinded and the marks removed from the records of the players. Why? Because any 18+ activity was performed behind closed doors.

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Originally Posted by Setesh45

Everyone here trying to justify ERP is basically saying it's ok to break the rules that already exist. Saying it's ok to ERP with 13 years old kids.
]

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Are you a Spartan? because that's a fucking Reach holy shit

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Originally Posted by redheadturk

No, public erp is against the rules, not erp in general. Hell, the one GM that tried to ban people for erp party finders? That guy got disciplined and moved to another team and all bans he handed out were rescinded and the marks removed from the records of the players. Why? Because any 18+ activity was performed behind closed doors.

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That's a complete lie. :)

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Originally Posted by Merrigan

Okay, just... no.

Keeping a certain politeness between players, reminding them that they are not just talking to bots but to people they owe some respect: yes. It helps to minimize the toxic behavior that too many people allow themselves under the guise of anonymity.

Calibrating everything so that it is accessible and politically correct is another problem. That's how you get tasteless games. Especially since some parts of the game are much less "politically correct" than ERP.

Endwalker's story can be deeply depressing at times.
Direct references to rape are made frequently.
Miqo'te are often referred to as prostitutes; only the word is never uttered, but it is crystal clear.

From this, it is clear that SE has opted for an environment that is not all rosy, and whose undertones are accessible to an adult audience. I would also point out that the rules you mention do not prohibit ERP at all, as long as it is done by "whisp" / offered in a respectful way / in adapted places (cf: some "brothels" in housing areas)

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So? Your point is that because the game references rape, it's ok to virtually molest a 13yo? wow

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Originally Posted by Setesh45

That's a complete lie. :)

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Yoship said it was fine between consensual people in private.

Everybody ingame being 13 years old WOULD explain why the general player base is so bad at this game.

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Originally Posted by Setesh45

That's a complete lie. :)

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Example 2
In the case of role-playing involving mildly sexual expressions (such as erotic role-playing) with a consenting group of two or more players, if it is conducted in a private area, it will not be considered a violation unless a report is made.
Not a lie, this is from their tos document.

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Originally Posted by Setesh45

So? Your point is that because the game references rape, it's ok to virtually molest a 13yo? wow

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wow, that's so disingenuous to what you are replying to.

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Originally Posted by Mosha

Yoship said it was fine between consensual people in private.

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Source? Because I call this another lie.
Yoshi-P has a whole legal team watching his every action, saying something like that would mean having a lawsuit on their backs soon as it would not only be against the current game rules, but against the law of most countries.

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Originally Posted by Setesh45

Source? Because I call this another lie.
Yoshi-P has a whole legal team watching his every action, saying something like that would mean having a lawsuit on their backs soon as it would not only be against the current game rules, but against the law of most countries.

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it was in a live letter, can't remember which one.


"but against the law of most countries."
Lol LMAO lol. ERP is illegal guys

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Originally Posted by redheadturk

Example 2
In the case of role-playing involving mildly sexual expressions (such as erotic role-playing) with a consenting group of two or more players, if it is conducted in a private area, it will not be considered a violation unless a report is made.
Not a lie, this is from their tos document.

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"unless a report is made" They are saying it's not against the rules unless they know about it, also it says mildly, the ERP I have seen had nothing to do with "mildly". If people were roleplaying kissing, cuddling and dancing nobody would care.

Just ignore it like I do.

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Originally Posted by Mosha

it was in a live letter, can't remember which one.


"but against the law of most countries."
Lol LMAO lol. ERP is illegal guys

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It is in most of Asian countries to have anything sexualize involving minor.

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Originally Posted by Setesh45

"unless a report is made" They are saying it's not against the rules unless they know about it, also it says mildly, the ERP I have seen had nothing to do with "mildly". If people were roleplaying kissing, cuddling and dancing nobody would care.

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And? How are you going to report something going on in whispers unless you're a parent looking over your kid's shoulder? Let adults do what the f they want in private and watch your own kids.

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Originally Posted by Divinemights

It is in most of Asian countries to have anything sexualize involving minor.

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great good thing I'm sexualizing adults

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Originally Posted by Setesh45

"unless a report is made" They are saying it's not against the rules unless they know about it, also it says mildly, the ERP I have seen had nothing to do with "mildly". If people were roleplaying kissing, cuddling and dancing nobody would care.

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Actually the way it's worded, erp is an example of mild. Also what erp are you seeing? Are you going out and paying for it? Using third party add ons to snoop into others tells somehow?

For those of you saying I’m here to troll or calling me a “Karen,” wake up. If you were to turn on the news and see a broadcast about how a sex offender coerced young teens through the use of online media, you would all be quick to demonize them. Yet you sit here in a video game forum and defend the practice of ERP by saying “what happens behind closed doors is okay.”

What the actual fuck? How do you not see that it’s a slippery slope and a borderline double standard? It needs to go.

I was gonna reply to a specfic thread which made me laugh but...you all are wonderful, ty

The assumption of course being that erpers intentionally seek underage people like a predator targeting known teens on social media would.

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Originally Posted by SaberMaxwell

The assumption of course being that erpers intentionally seek underage people like a predator targeting known teens on social media would.

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^this. My twitter account specifically says under 18 do not interact. I don't want to even talk to kids on twitter, much less have them scrolling my timeline.

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Originally Posted by Setesh45

Source? Because I call this another lie.
Yoshi-P has a whole legal team watching his every action, saying something like that would mean having a lawsuit on their backs soon as it would not only be against the current game rules, but against the law of most countries.

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I feel like this is going to shatter your entire world view, but did you know in the vast majority of western civilized society, the age of consent is only 16? Even in these lovely United States (excuse me all other Anglo-Sphere folk) the federal AoC is 16. In some countries it's even lower than that. I believe Japan even had an age of consent of 13 but there is A LOT more nuance to that.

Point is, you're talking out of your ass at this point. ToS documents have also historically been thrown out in court as they are not legally binding documents. How long before you start screaming that everyone in this thread is just a closet pedophile? We've had the strawman arguments so I believe we're about due for the ad hominen attacks too. It's the last bastion of someone without a sound argument.

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Originally Posted by chaotix69

For those of you saying I’m here to troll or calling me a “Karen,” wake up. If you were to turn on the news and see a broadcast about how a sex offender coerced young teens through the use of online media, you would all be quick to demonize them. Yet you sit here in a video game forum and defend the practice of ERP by saying “what happens behind closed doors is okay.”

What the actual fuck? How do you not see that it’s a slippery slope and a borderline double standard? It needs to go.

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How do you enforce it, friend? Apart from actively monitoring every player's communication at every moment, actively watching them. Is that not also a slippery slope? Double standards and slippery slopes work both ways. The path way to tolerance and safety is marked by extreme examples of oppression and heavy-handed punishments.

But it's for the children, right? Give me a break.

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Originally Posted by chaotix69

For those of you saying I’m here to troll or calling me a “Karen,” wake up. If you were to turn on the news and see a broadcast about how a sex offender coerced young teens through the use of online media, you would all be quick to demonize them. Yet you sit here in a video game forum and defend the practice of ERP by saying “what happens behind closed doors is okay.”

What the actual fuck? How do you not see that it’s a slippery slope and a borderline double standard? It needs to go.

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shit guess we will have to ban the catholic church and schools then, a sex offender might be a teacher or a priest.

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Originally Posted by SaberMaxwell

Actually the way it's worded, erp is an example of mild. Also what erp are you seeing? Are you going out and paying for it? Using third party add ons to snoop into others tells somehow?

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No, you are just lucky that you are a North American

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Originally Posted by chaotix69

For those of you saying I’m here to troll or calling me a “Karen,” wake up. If you were to turn on the news and see a broadcast about how a sex offender coerced young teens through the use of online media, you would all be quick to demonize them. Yet you sit here in a video game forum and defend the practice of ERP by saying “what happens behind closed doors is okay.”

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What happens behind closed doors is okay, in my opinion, so long as it involves 2 or more consenting adults, aka anyone 18 years of age or older. Involving minors is never okay, which is why ERP in an online game is a bad idea by default. You never really know who's on the other side of an in-game character.