What's even the point of doing savage?

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Originally Posted by GaspardSavoureuxx

I wonder though, BIS taken appart, what's the point of the savage content? Just killing difficult boss?

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Savage and Ultimate fights are fun! Painful, but fun!

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Originally Posted by BrokentoothMarch

That's, pretty pathetic. One can tell when another is that starved for what should be a basic function. Seriously? Undyeables in 2022? GW2 had this downpat out the gate. And if your other reward is a pretty number on a website that's against the ToS, then WEW, that's bad.



I don't want to trash high-enders too much, but said high-end content in XIV ranks among the absolute easiest out of nearly any other comparable game. Even the elites of this game are rather casual, considering how the devs took to the predictable "dance"-like design of fights. With enough memorization skills, you'll beat literally anything in this game. In any difficulty. It's just a cheap dopamine injection for many who either aren't interested in other games or couldn't hack it in said other games. The perma-enraged Rajang was far more difficult than anything XIV had to offer in terms of on-the-fly thinking you had to do and the rewards being unachievable cosmetics in any other fashion was the motivation. Considering the main point of Savage is to prepare for Ultimate, however, it has a huge focus instead on the effectiveness of that weapon, which will be quickly outdated.

Essentially, as usual in the end-game, the devs simply don't know how to handle their target audience. They offer cheap confetti and people have to make their own fun by constructing websites that would get them banned should SE bother to look into it.

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ah yes spoken truly by someone who has never touched the content

fantastic

Fancy glams, playing with friends and the content itself was also pretty fun for me.

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Originally Posted by Ivtrix

ah yes spoken truly by someone who has never touched the content

fantastic

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I checked their achievements on the lodestone after you posted this, and sure enough, they have never cleared savage, and barely touched extremes. Pretty funny.

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Originally Posted by Rolder50

I checked their achievements on the lodestone after you posted this, and sure enough, they have never cleared savage, and barely touched extremes. Pretty funny.

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It's usually how it goes. The ones claiming the game is super easy and casual never actually do anything difficult.

Because it’s fun! Prog is great and that first kill on the cusp of enrage with your heart pounding is something else entirely!

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Originally Posted by GaspardSavoureuxx

Yep my question is exactly that :D But in dark souls, hard boss gives you good gear that you can use the rest of the game. Not totally the case here.

Like you said it's a videogame, you play it for fun. And after killing something that took me 2 weeks to learn, i love receiving an item or something useful on it, and not just killing it "for challenging content".

Challenging content should be rewarded. At least it's my point of view.

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You are being rewarded, just not the way you wanted to.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

It's usually how it goes. The ones claiming the game is super easy and casual never actually do anything difficult.

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I mean, if you dont automatically assume this is the baseline case then your putting yourself at a disadvantage.

Its just the same boring song and dance. "Dance style fights"

Like ok you watched a youtube clear of 8 coordinated raiders after hours of prog make something look easy.

Nevermind the fact that just a few weeks ago SE just released what is widely considered the hardest fight this game has ever seen. World first raiders from wow put 160+ hours into it and are only halfway thru.

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Originally Posted by GaspardSavoureuxx

Hey all,

I started savage couple weeks ago, it's difficult but not that difficult either.

I'm actually on P3S and learn the mecha with my roster.

I wonder though, BIS taken appart, what's the point of the savage content? Just killing difficult boss?

For what? You can be full 600 ilvl (except weapon 595) only with memoquartz. What's even the point of learning and training hours just for killing a boss who gives you nothing really important.

I'm just curious, everyone seems so happy with how the actual endgame content are right now but i don't get it.

Even if you farm and you have everything BIS, in the next big patch when new ilvl release, the stuff from crafting will be 10 ilvl more than your actual BIS.

What's the point? How do you guys don't be bored of farming something that are not more useful than the other one which you don't need to farm to have it but just wait weeks and weeks...

You can't use your stuff on PVP and every roulette are sync so, your stuff means nothing, except for helping you killing the savage you already kill.

Even doing ultimate gives you nothing more except a skin... It just feel weird.

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what's the point of playing ff14?

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Originally Posted by GaspardSavoureuxx

Hey all,

I started savage couple weeks ago, it's difficult but not that difficult either.

I'm actually on P3S and learn the mecha with my roster.

I wonder though, BIS taken appart, what's the point of the savage content? Just killing difficult boss?

For what? You can be full 600 ilvl (except weapon 595) only with memoquartz. What's even the point of learning and training hours just for killing a boss who gives you nothing really important.

I'm just curious, everyone seems so happy with how the actual endgame content are right now but i don't get it.

Even if you farm and you have everything BIS, in the next big patch when new ilvl release, the stuff from crafting will be 10 ilvl more than your actual BIS.

What's the point? How do you guys don't be bored of farming something that are not more useful than the other one which you don't need to farm to have it but just wait weeks and weeks...

You can't use your stuff on PVP and every roulette are sync so, your stuff means nothing, except for helping you killing the savage you already kill.

Even doing ultimate gives you nothing more except a skin... It just feel weird.

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You cannot queue into DSR without a P4S clear.

You gotta do it to go back in time to save our HW boy.

He needs you.

There isn't really point to doing Savage beyond dyeable gearsets. I quickly learned I do not enjoy the process of raid prog. Savage is just not worth the time investment personally.

There were no progs left to answer.

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Originally Posted by GaspardSavoureuxx

It may not be for me then.

The only problem is that it's the only thing to do in endgame content so...

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You're lacking imagination if you think thats the only thing to do at endgame x)

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Originally Posted by BrokentoothMarch

I'm not confused? You're just spewing utter manure out of your face.

Covenants, differing endings, invasions, blue phantoms, later on purple phantoms, build variety, etc. These are all things that contribute to Dark Souls replayability while none of that exists here. There's continued gameplay while nothing exists after the end-game here. You're conflating the point of an entire game with the nothing that exists in an MMO. Live service games do not, and should not, follow the same rules as their smaller counterparts. That simple.

Learn to keep your hands off the keyboard when you consider touching something you know nothing about.

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I do savage for new fights, new cutscenes, dyeable gear, ultimates, mounts and achievements. All of which gives me more than the two hours I spent on Melania, Blade of Miquella.

Honestly, bob, there isn't really a point. I don't find it difficult anymore, especially this joke of a tier, and like you say; it just makes you better at doing the thing you're already capable of doing. wowiezowie.

I'm in a static. For us, Savage is the modern day equivalent of "bowling night." We're not doing it for the loot (although it's definitely nice to be near BiS like I am now). We're doing it for the challenge of learning something difficult and doing it together.

We only meet once or twice a week, because we work full time jobs (all 8 of us) and several have kids. For two of the members, this is the only guaranteed kid-free adult time they have, as their spouses agree to watch the kids for this time only. For the rest of us, it's a time to decompres and deal with a struggle we know that we can overcome, unlike all the petty office politics and BS we have to deal with in our day jobs.

It’s the age old question with MMOs. Why do you raid? To get better equipment. Why do you need better equipment? To raid.

FFXIV just takes it a step further into pointlessness by making the difference between a BIS raider and someone in catch up tome gear a barely noticeable difference in substats and having absolutely no overlap between patches.

I do it for the challenge and for the glam, aswell as the epicness that is the extra phase in savage you don't get to see in normal. That and Ultimate is fun af.
Gear will become pointless around 6 months after the new tier releases yes, but thats not my concern since the boss dies way before that and I have ample time to enjoy my BiS as raider.

IMO I would be fine if they made Savage gear the iLvl of Augmented Tome +5 with selectable stats. (605) for this tier. Then come the next tier the crafted gear is also the same iLvl as the previous savage gear.

This gives raiders a bit more value from their previous tier and don't have to deal with the day 1 crafting shit show for raid prog before the prices divebomb to what the gear is really worth.

Crafted gear would still have it's value for people who did not clear Savage which is a large chunk of the player base.

The main attraction of savage is challenge running, getting the mounts, seeing the special boss at the end, and acting as another way to gear faster than the tomestone cap allows, since even clearing the first two will generally push people above the curve. You don't even need the crafted gear to do the first half on launch usually.

It mostly just has problems because of the lockout system and people issues.

I'm at point where raiding is too boring to do, so in this expansion, I just do basic stuff and decorating the house...

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Originally Posted by GaspardSavoureuxx

FFXIV have increase player because 1/ it's a free trial for like 100hours and more and 2/ people come on expansion, farm it for 3-4 weeks, and then leave for month to wait for the next expansion. Lots of people does that.
In warhammer online, you always had something to do in endgame and you never ran out of endgame content like in here. There were countless of hours to do in endgame, without any expansion. But there were no glam, so i guess nowaday people play MMO for glam :D

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That's funny. I have little interest in glam, yet I have a monster list of content still to do even though I've completed the MSQ. Crafting, gathering, achievement hunting, getting the last Role quest, sightseeing log entries from ARR that I never did. There's countless hours to do HERE in endgame. Perhaps you might not be interested in it. But to act as if it doesn't exist seems very disingenuous.

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Originally Posted by GaspardSavoureuxx

It may not be for me then.

The only problem is that it's the only thing to do in endgame content so...

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outside of..

Housing?
Mount collecting?
Minion Collecting?
Relic Weapons?
Acheivement Hunting?
Eureka?
Marketboard Domination?

The endgame is what you want it to be, Raiding is only a small fraction of the game.

the only COMBAT end game (when most people say end game unless they're specific they mean level 90 combat content) rn is EX trials (including unsynced), ultimate, and savage (including unsynced eden savage even unsynced can still be a challenge) on the lesser end of end game you have alliance raids, fates/hunts, and dungeon/normal trial/raid spam

now if you want to lower your level sure there's plenty of content for them but rn at 90 which is where most people wanna play there's really not alot "challenging content" tbh

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Originally Posted by pikalovr

the only COMBAT end game (when most people say end game unless they're specific they mean level 90 combat content) rn is EX trials (including unsynced), ultimate, and savage (including unsynced eden savage even unsynced can still be a challenge) on the lesser end of end game you have alliance raids, fates/hunts, and dungeon/normal trial/raid spam

now if you want to lower your level sure there's plenty of content for them but rn at 90 which is where most people wanna play there's really not alot "challenging content" tbh

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if your saying ultimate isnt challenging.. ok.

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Originally Posted by DixieBellOCE

if your saying ultimate isnt challenging.. ok.

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the older ones have become significantly easier

not saying they are easy tho

For fun. One thing people seem to forget. We play challenging contents for fun. Its a game not a job.

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Originally Posted by DixieBellOCE

if your saying ultimate isnt challenging.. ok.

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my guy why do you think i specifically seperated lesser end game content and regular end game content? regular end game content is made to be harder hence why they're considered a higher end of end game compared to something easier like fate grinding or dungeon spamming

have you ever thought that some people just do it because it's ... fun?

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Originally Posted by DixieBellOCE

if your saying ultimate isnt challenging.. ok.

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Ucob is pretty easy.

You can apparently clear UwU by killing your teammates on purpose (some stream highlight), so I'd assume this one is on the easy side too. (never tried this fight)

TEA is mechanically dense, but gets 'easier' as the fight continues.

Don't know about current.

Purpose of savage is:
1. To get better and finish challenges
2. To get glamour
3. To get achievements/ titles
4. To experience the content Normal mode cannot offer
5. To unlock Ultimate
6. To dominate the marketboards with rare item drops that can be used for crafting
7. To gear up your side jobs with those extra stats for next patch
8. To play with friends and kill them have a good time while laughing as you do content together

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Originally Posted by DixieBellOCE

outside of..

Housing?
Mount collecting?
Minion Collecting?
Relic Weapons?
Acheivement Hunting?
Eureka?
Marketboard Domination?

The endgame is what you want it to be, Raiding is only a small fraction of the game.

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What you list is not endgame content, you can do that while being lvl 70-80, maybe less and you don't even need the best gear for it.

Endgame content is what you can do with your best character at max level with the best gear in game. That's endgame content. What's the point of being ilvl 600 for housing or relic farming?

That's my point. YES, savage is fun (kind of, i dare you to do all the 4 actual savage in PF and tell me it's fun) but you're not rewarded with gear, like in every other MMO.
Even mount farming, for what? OK, your mount will be beautiful, but it will have THE EXACT SAME SPEED as the basic chocobo. Glam taken appart, what's the point then?

So, the only endgame in FF14 is the glam, farming for glam, learning mecha for glam, and killing hard content for glam, i got it.

FF14 is fun, some thing are hard AF, but it's for glam. Ok i get it now people, thanks :D

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Originally Posted by AnotherPerson

Purpose of savage is:
1. To get better and finish challenges
2. To get glamour
3. To get achievements/ titles
4. To experience the content Normal mode cannot offer
5. To unlock Ultimate
6. To dominate the marketboards with rare item drops that can be used for crafting
7. To gear up your side jobs with those extra stats for next patch
8. To play with friends and kill them have a good time while laughing as you do content together

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To be fair, any of what you list seems attractive to me.

Especially the "to get better", for what? Rolling on sastasha or crystal tower in roulette?

The only thing that can attract me is 4. To experience the content Normal mode cannot offer. But it's just the same thing, way harder without any good loot (for my taste)

I'll never put a toe in ultimate, never. What for? Spending month of learning pattern and dying again and again just for a title and a shiny weapon (not even better (ilvl) than the savage one) No thanks.

It's a question that has been asked regularly here, what is the point of getting BiS gear from savage when said gear is entirely useless by the time you have it? And in that case you're kind of correct.

Once you've finished savage and got your BiS there are basically only 2 things to use those better stats for, Ultimate and parse runs for a higher number on a 3rd party site (and associated bragging rights I guess).
Now if you're doing neither of those there really is no point to getting the best gear in the game. What are you gonna do with it, run extremely easy dungeons faster?

And by the time the next raid tier rolls around you're gonna replace your BiS gear with full crafted gear anyway, because it's flat out better.

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Originally Posted by EnigmaticDodo

Ucob is pretty easy.

You can apparently clear UwU by killing your teammates on purpose (some stream highlight), so I'd assume this one is on the easy side too. (never tried this fight)

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Ucob is pretty easy compared to tea and DSR. It's not easy in a vacuum.
Why do I feel like you're referring to the "cya wow gamers" clip where they wiped seconds later because they were missing a healer?

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Originally Posted by Absurdity

It's a question that has been asked regularly here, what is the point of getting BiS gear from savage when said gear is entirely useless by the time you have it? And in that case you're kind of correct.

Once you've finished savage and got your BiS there are basically only 2 things to use those better stats for, Ultimate and parse runs for a higher number on a 3rd party site (and associated bragging rights I guess).
Now if you're doing neither of those there really is no point to getting the best gear in the game. What are you gonna do with it, run extremely easy dungeons faster?

And by the time the next raid tier rolls around you're gonna replace your BiS gear with full crafted gear anyway, because it's flat out better.

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The problem is parsing are not allowed, and ultimate is useless for me because it gave you nothing except a title and a skin.

So, yeah, the glam...

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Originally Posted by GaspardSavoureuxx

FFXIV have increase player because 1/ it's a free trial for like 100hours and more and 2/ people come on expansion, farm it for 3-4 weeks, and then leave for month to wait for the next expansion. Lots of people does that.
In warhammer online, you always had something to do in endgame and you never ran out of endgame content like in here. There were countless of hours to do in endgame, without any expansion. But there were no glam, so i guess nowaday people play MMO for glam :D

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As I said, it has increased with every expansion even back when the trial didn't exist.
Maybe EW is the peak maybe it's not, who knows.
Regardless of that I am sure people will be crying about the game '' dying '' ESPECIALLY if they're already doing it and have been doing it with every new expansion even tho the game was growing in players.

The same can be said about WoW too tbh, infinite growth doesn't exist games are going to hit a peak and then go down.
There's other factors that makes it more significant in WoW but much the same even it's essentially a meme at this point that people have been saying the game is '' dying '' since day 1 even way back in Vanilla the narrative was the same.
In FFXIV there's also a lot of '' seasonal players '' much like in a game like Path of Exile where people come back and play the new patch for story content then stick around a bit and take a break.
Nothing wrong with that either.
But FFXIV has become more successful with each expansion thus far.

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Originally Posted by GaspardSavoureuxx

The problem is parsing are not allowed, and ultimate is useless for me because it gave you nothing except a title and a skin.

So, yeah, the glam...

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Why would gear be important for you if you're not interested in doing harder content tho?
Imo gear not being as big of a deal ( but still a big deal ) is a nice thing about FFXIV, that's a matter of taste tho but I find that gear being the be all end all tends to result in a lot more toxicity and frustration.

Parsing isn't officially endorsed but people do it, there's log runs being openly advertised in PF and no action is taken against them.
The devs don't like it and don't endorse it but it's pretty clear that they accept that it exists unless you harass people with it or otherwise make a big deal out of it.

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Originally Posted by GaspardSavoureuxx

Endgame content is what you can do with your best character at max level with the best gear in game. That's endgame content. What's the point of being ilvl 600 for housing or relic farming?

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End game is limited at the moment because we literally are only in 6.1x. We have a lot more patches to go that will have more content added to it. FF is not the type to drown you in content all at once, it's spaced out so people of all playstyles can keep up and not feel rushed to complete it. Once you've gotten your gear on your main job to the point that you want it, you have a few options:

1) Do harder content such as current tier savage or any of the ultimates.
2) Level alt jobs and gear them up (since, at this point, if you aren't doing harder content you're just gearing up for 7.0 content/the new relic grind coming in)
3) Do old content such as relic grinds and achievement hunting for titles and other rewards (such as mounts)
4) Cancel your sub until new content comes in

It's not "just glam", you've been given plenty of other options for what to do and it just doesn't seem to fit what you're looking for. Which is fine, just might be time to do something else for now until new content rolls in. If you don't see a point to it, no amount of us explaining options to you will change anything.

I do find it kind of head tilting though that you find learning a fight for a month straight for a weapon pointless but you're literally doing that same thing already in savage. You do know Augmented Radiant's gear (tome gear that can be augmented with the drop from Aglaia) is ilvl 600 too...right?

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Originally Posted by LianaThorne

End game is limited at the moment because we literally are only in 6.1x. We have a lot more patches to go that will have more content added to it. FF is not the type to drown you in content all at once, it's spaced out so people of all playstyles can keep up and not feel rushed to complete it. Once you've gotten your gear on your main job to the point that you want it, you have a few options:

1) Do harder content such as current tier savage or any of the ultimates.
2) Level alt jobs and gear them up (since, at this point, if you aren't doing harder content you're just gearing up for 7.0 content/the new relic grind coming in)
3) Do old content such as relic grinds and achievement hunting for titles and other rewards (such as mounts)
4) Cancel your sub until new content comes in

It's not "just glam", you've been given plenty of other options for what to do and it just doesn't seem to fit what you're looking for. Which is fine, just might be time to do something else for now until new content rolls in. If you don't see a point to it, no amount of us explaining options to you will change anything.

I do find it kind of head tilting though that you find learning a fight for a month straight for a weapon pointless but you're literally doing that same thing already in savage. You do know Augmented Radiant's gear (tome gear that can be augmented with the drop from Aglaia) is ilvl 600 too...right?

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Yep, my BIS is a mix of memo stuff and raid stuff. I did savage because 1/ It's the only combat related endgame, the only thing with ultimate, there's nothing else to do combat related endgame. And 2/ i wanted better stuff and a 605 weapon.
After due consideration, what for? Ilvl means nothing because there is no endgame. FF14 is a MMORPG mixed with animal crossing.
You do super hard stuff to loot a shiny weapon, and you afk in limsa showing that weapon to everyone.

Or even better, you play music afk in limsa, that's the real endgame :D

You seems to not understand what i said. Everything you just said as an example (except savage/ultimate) is not endgame related, it's just base game related.

There is not really endgame content in ff14 and it's too bad cause it's a good game. You can tell me all you want savage/ultimate is the endgame but if you do that for the gear, and can do nothing more with this gear after, it's just useless.

The only "endgame" you advice me is farming glam "relic" which is a pain (farming with my ilvl 597 warrior doing lvl 34 fate synchronized is a pain) or cancel my sub.

So maybe the devs should look after releasing something for endgame maybe (something useful, not just a shiny glam)? or at least, let us use our savage/ultimate gear in pvp with our pve skills...

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Originally Posted by GaspardSavoureuxx

So maybe the devs should look after releasing something for endgame maybe? or at least, let us use our savage/ultimate gear in pvp with our pve skills...

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We had that before and nobody was interested in it :p