soiled promissory note?

Can't wait to see yet another DoM weapon that sucks yet has some ridiculously hard requirement to get.

So many good comments here, I've forgotten where I wanted to begin, so I'll just sum up all my thoughts:

FIX
YOUR
LOOT
SYSTEM

Yes, it is broken. Badly!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Junpei

well shit son, we get 3 seals a night... so thats like, 3 back to back nights of nothing but hamlet for 1 person.


These better be some fucking good weapons cause the person at the back end of static is waiting 24 days minimum

---

Oh no, you mean the AF weapons might be....HARD to get?!?!?!?! Unthinkable!

People complained day and night about jobs and AF being too easy to get and people getting 7/7 too quickly. This was the dev's answer I imagine.

I've still yet to see any proof that all this beastmen seal stuff has anything to do with AF weapons...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Arcell

Oh no, you mean the AF weapons might be....HARD to get?!?!?!?! Unthinkable!

People complained day and night about jobs and AF being too easy to get and people getting 7/7 too quickly. This was the dev's answer I imagine.

---

The problem is RNG and idiotic loot policies are mandating the difficulty. Not the actual content. There, in fault, lies the problem.

You basically have to win the lottery 9 times, how stupid is that? Difficulty, rofl, sure, "difficult." And that is just for one weapon. Imagine getting all the AF weapons, or even three. Pure lunacy.

SE needs to change these garbage tactics or they are going to alienate the people they want to bring in for 2.0. These loot distribution systems belong in the dark ages, aka FFXI. Lets not bring them into XIV.

as far as the AF weapons and the seal drop rates go we should hold our tongue till we see the stats. For all we know the stats could be absolute game changing over the top like relic's in FFXI. The only reason ppl never complained about relics in FFXI was because they were well worth the efforts involved and they allowed a shell to reward its most dedicated members with a large scale effort. I'm happy knowing in my shell a few will probably get the AF weapons first then we'll work to knock out the rest of the members over time hopefully before 2.0

seals are tradable right? (before they hit inventory)

Or make points earned like a currency. Buy a seal for a given price, thats a couple of runs just for one...No luck based crap, just simply more skill = more points. That will prevent someone going 20 runs without a single seal or any form of progress, compared to one lucky fuck who gets on first match.

The luck based system really...."really"....needs to go. I can't believe the only response we have gotten out of the developers is "It is fine, because the gear is good.". They don't understand the mentality of it's own community. Clearly the mass majority agrees that it's loot system is horrid, yet we get no response. I want them to come out and explain why they believe this system is good. The problem is I don't believe they are capable of that because there isn't a good reason to have it, unless you get a thrill out of not getting rewarded for your efforts.

I really want a Dev response to this, a proper one.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Junpei

well shit son, we get 3 seals a night... so thats like, 3 back to back nights of nothing but hamlet for 1 person.


These better be some fucking good weapons cause the person at the back end of static is waiting 24 days minimum

---

Just be prepared to find out that all that work only gets you one step closer to getting your weapons, or perhaps gets you the weapon, but in very poor shape that you will then need to upgrade throught other tedious tasks. I get the impression that AF weapons in XIV will be more like relic weapons were in XI.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Biggs

Just be prepared to find out that all that work only gets you one step closer to getting your weapons, or perhaps gets you the weapon, but in very poor shape that you will then need to upgrade throught other tedious tasks. I get the impression that AF weapons in XIV will be more like relic weapons were in XI.

---

Actually I am very sure that everyone will get their powered-down weapons through a completely unrelated quest, tied to the storyline of the jobs, and this whole shenanigans will be to make the weapons actual top-tier gear

Please for the love of God tell us if the RNG is gonna stay in 2.0 or if there will be a drop system even remotely like XI's so I know if I need to drop my subscription now or keep it. I can picture it now all the Cloud Strife fans raising hell they gotta spam Ultima Weapon 300+ times to get their wanna look like Cloud sword.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Skies

Actually I am very sure that everyone will get their powered-down weapons through a completely unrelated quest, tied to the storyline of the jobs, and this whole shenanigans will be to make the weapons actual top-tier gear

---

Possibly. It certainly would lower this anxious feeling I have that this is just step 1 of a very long and tedious 5 step process. Not to mention, years from now when they FINALLY increase level cap, they could add more things likethis to upgrade further to keep up with the increased levels and equipment.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hiruke

I've always found it fascinating (in a scientific, social science sort of way) how people in general put up with so much nonsense in MMOs that they'd never put up with a "real" video game. What if you had to kill the final boss for a chance for the ending to "drop"? And it was possible you had to kill it 100+ times for that to happen? The first 99 times it was all like "as you prepare to deliver the killing blow, mist rises from the earth, obscuring your sight. you quickly strike, but you hit nothing but soft earth. quick! find the villain!" then you have to go find the boss again, and he's fully healed. Oh, and this fight takes like 30-60 minutes each time. Would you kill the boss until you got the ending? You'd seriously devote 100 hours to that? I kind of doubt it.

---

Haha, I'm sorry if that came off as a little oddly put. I was just trying to get across that I do not disagree with the complaints, so much, as I find there existence interesting. Game design at a theoretical level interests me, so a violent response like this is fascinating to me. I have myself actually argued for a more robust drop mechanic that does not diminish the difficulty of the respective task, but encourages the player instead of taunting them, in another thread.

It's a complex problem. The developer needs to preserve content, while keeping the player interested in the content long enough to produce more. Ideally, content has a half life (I prefer to refer to a content's lifetime in terms of half life because the decay of interest often looks closer to half life formula than anything else) longer than the development cycle, thus producing more content than is consumed.

Random chance has a base response in the human psyche. There is a reason why gamblers often end up in alcoholics anonymous. It's untrue to say that random drop mechanics have no place in preserving content, or even interest. At the same time, even an addicted gambler will lose interest in a machine that never wins. Similarly, constant progression gives the players the sense of constant progress towards a goal. However, it also feels very mechanical. Go to Ifrit, punch time card, work, receive credits, go to ifrit, punch time card, work, receive credits.

Put simply, just a pRNG or a token system alone will not preserve player interest long enough to sustain a small pool of content (FFXIV's real problem, but that's another topic entirely). Each needs something to counter-balance their flaws. For all of the fact that many came to despise Dynamis after years of running them, I think they found an excellent balance, as you said. The frustration of the pRNG (Relic AF) was offset by the fact that the drop rate was 1:20(ish) with any monster in the zone able to drop an item. Not to mention, even if you did not receive an item, you could work toward the ultimate goal of a Relic weapon. The mechanical nature of the token system of the relic weapons, on the other hand, was offset by adding a market mechanic to the system (simply by making the items trade-able).

I suppose in the context of FFXIV, we can only hope that once the full team is working on the game again (post 2.0) they will be able to produce more content, thus reducing the load on current content and freeing the developers up for more creative drop systems.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Hulan

The comments in this thread fascinate me, in a scientific, social science sort of way. These requirements really aren't 1/100th as steep as those for getting relic weapons, even 1/1000th. Yet while I can barely recall a complaint a year about the difficulty of procuring relic weapons, it prompts a veritable flood of complaints in this context. What is it that has changed? Is it the perception of the community? The implementation? The very social structure of MMO players? Or perhaps a combination of all three.

---

You could actually work towards getting the relics in xi. Here its just luck based. You are just sitting there spamming content that is unrewarding outside of getting those seals.

The content is becoming the equivalent of putting electric nodes on your nipples and electrocuting yourself for 12 hours only to be rewarded with a hat that says "I survived having my nipples being shocked for 12 hours and don't have to do it anymore"

Unless there is some secret mechanic we don't know about its probably going to take like 25-40 perfect hamlet runs to get the 9 seals for one person. And that is just one person, the only reward the other people in the party will be getting are dark matter and militia barbuts.

I think, Req, that the secret mechanic that we don't know about is getting Rank 3+ Hamlet. From what I get the hamlet level is a multiplier to your points, and it seems like you already get a pretty good drop rate with 50k acquired at rank 2, imagine what 100k+ would net you at rank 5?

Of course, all the hamlet suppliers want is making it top 20 and not increasing hamlet level, so eh.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bayohne

Greetings,

Eemeefu from the Localization team has confirmed that this is indeed a typo in the English language version and the correct number should be three of each seal. The issue will be addressed in patch 1.22b. Sorry for the confusion.

---

Thank you, sir.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Skies

I think, Req, that the secret mechanic that we don't know about is getting Rank 3+ Hamlet. From what I get the hamlet level is a multiplier to your points, and it seems like you already get a pretty good drop rate with 50k acquired at rank 2, imagine what 100k+ would net you at rank 5?

Of course, all the hamlet suppliers want is making it top 20 and not increasing hamlet level, so eh.

---

when rank 3 is added people will go out of there way to see what its like and we will probly go from there

your right though, some people just dont want to donate without a guarentee of getting top 20, which is a bit rediculous when half of them only do so cuz they dont understand what top 20 even means(such as people claiming you get no drop sunless your in top 20 regardless of the situation)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Skies

I think, Req, that the secret mechanic that we don't know about is getting Rank 3+ Hamlet. From what I get the hamlet level is a multiplier to your points, and it seems like you already get a pretty good drop rate with 50k acquired at rank 2, imagine what 100k+ would net you at rank 5?

Of course, all the hamlet suppliers want is making it top 20 and not increasing hamlet level, so eh.

---

if nothing else phase 3 should be easily attainable. You'll get more points over all form more kills probably more NM's plus a x3 multiplier, so i wouldn't be surprised to hit 100k in phase 3 alone.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Skies

I think, Req, that the secret mechanic that we don't know about is getting Rank 3+ Hamlet. From what I get the hamlet level is a multiplier to your points, and it seems like you already get a pretty good drop rate with 50k acquired at rank 2, imagine what 100k+ would net you at rank 5?

Of course, all the hamlet suppliers want is making it top 20 and not increasing hamlet level, so eh.

---

The thing about it is, we already get the gold chest from level 2 hamlets. Unless the gold chest in the level 3 hamlets is somehow different it won't make a difference because points past 50k are seemingly worthless at the moment.

Either way, the content is unrewarding and that is the main problem. Sure its going to be cool to get the hamlet diggers hat and all that good stuff, but by the time we get even 2 of these promissary notes the entire party will more than likely have every decent item from the hamlet. It is kind of how like with the dungeons, at this point about 90% of the linkshells doing aurum vale and cutters cry have long gotten past the point where they need any non darklight drops from the dungeons meaning the market is being flooded with them and their value is so much less than they should be. The same exact thing is going to happen with the hamlet defense, everyone who wants the non seals are going to have them and theres going to be absolutely no reason to do the content outside of getting the seals.

The only possible thing I can think that they will do to counter act this feeling of worthless content at this point is by making the beastmen currency that is for some reason mysteriously dropping from the chests even though it has no use, have a use that is related to getting seals outside of the event.

And one final thing, to everyone saying we were complaining about this being the "hard to do" content we are looking for, this isn't hard to do, hamlet defense is a joke, the only thing that will make these things rare is the fact they have ridiculous requirements to get and the rng in this game is a piece of garbage.

Being top 20 I think only adds like 3k points. Not that big of a deal.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Velhart

Being top 20 I think only adds like 3k points. Not that big of a deal.

---

it also allows you a chance at one of the many secondary tools and a few jewelry drops that the chest doesnt drop
but the misconception ALOT of people have is that ALL the gear comes from only top 20 drops...

Since the 25k item can stack. We can only assume you will have to do this for each job as well.

Time to start picking your "Main Job".

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TheVedis

it also allows you a chance at one of the many secondary tools and a few jewelry drops that the chest doesnt drop
but the misconception ALOT of people have is that ALL the gear comes from only top 20 drops...

---

Ya just to agree with you, lots of items still drop from chest. We've been getting red chest non stop and have gotten about 8 Militia items so far. Never had 1 person in top twenty yet.

This would only be bad if you just do PUGs all the time. It's really not so bad if you take each person from your group and build their seals. The downside is the time and effort for just one person. However, like others have said, if these weapons are as good as SE hinted to early on about them, it's a hell of a lot better than building a relic weapon.

Unless.... these are like relics and this is only for the base weapon lol

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BruceyBruceyBangBang

This would only be bad if you just do PUGs all the time. It's really not so bad if you take each person from your group and build their seals. The downside is the time and effort for just one person. However, like others have said, if these weapons are as good as SE hinted to early on about them, it's a hell of a lot better than building a relic weapon.

Unless.... these are like relics and this is only for the base weapon lol

---

whats funny is some shells have gotten 10+ seals already and its only been a week, and im sure if they worked at keeping hamlets at level 2 more often theyd probly have even more in some cases

its gonna be something you have to work for, sorry to tell everyone, if you dont wanna work for it, much like achievements, then DONT

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Scytale

Since the 25k item can stack. We can only assume you will have to do this for each job as well.

Time to start picking your "Main Job".

---

i bought it and it doesn't show up for sale anymore, not sure if that means anything.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by syntaxlies

i bought it and it doesn't show up for sale anymore, not sure if that means anything.

---

maybe we only need to buy it once but get the seals several times? im sure we will know once its all officialy added

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bayohne

Greetings,

Eemeefu from the Localization team has confirmed that this is indeed a typo in the English language version and the correct number should be three of each seal. The issue will be addressed in patch 1.22b. Sorry for the confusion.

---

Thou shalt spam our new content until it pleases us!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MFd2DOtSPxo&t=3m42s

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BruceyBruceyBangBang

Unless.... these are like relics and this is only for the base weapon lol

---

I have this bad feeling that this will be the case . . . and the final form will need 99 of each seal.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BruceyBruceyBangBang

This would only be bad if you just do PUGs all the time. It's really not so bad if you take each person from your group and build their seals. The downside is the time and effort for just one person. However, like others have said, if these weapons are as good as SE hinted to early on about them, it's a hell of a lot better than building a relic weapon.

Unless.... these are like relics and this is only for the base weapon lol

---

if you read the text of the npc, these seals and stuff seem to be for the upgrade version(also SE already said in patch 122.b there will be af weapons and a means to upgrade them)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TheVedis

whats funny is some shells have gotten 10+ seals already and its only been a week, and im sure if they worked at keeping hamlets at level 2 more often theyd probly have even more in some cases

its gonna be something you have to work for, sorry to tell everyone, if you dont wanna work for it, much like achievements, then DONT

---

Yeah, I've seen over 10 drop since running them. I have two of them and am thinking, "Woohoo! Just need a grid seal!"

Then I read this thread. Back to work!

That was basically last night for me. I got my "final" seal and then this post went up right after. It was the single greatest buzz kill for me in the history of this game.

I think it's better to know the truth, than to freak out over rumors. Thanks Eemeefu and Bayohne!
The drop rate is lowish, but at my LS's current drop rates, 4-6+ a hamlet, that works out to about 1-2 weapons every 3-4 days.
Which really isn't too bad.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Bayohne

Greetings,

Eemeefu from the Localization team has confirmed that this is indeed a typo in the English language version and the correct number should be three of each seal. The issue will be addressed in patch 1.22b. Sorry for the confusion.

Originally Posted by Eemeefu http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/i...post-right.png Sorry for the confusion on this one, guys. As you suspected, it is simply a mistranslation from the original Japanese. You do indeed, need three of each of the three different primal seals.

I've just made the necessary changes to the text, which will go live in patch 1.22b.

Again, sorry for any confusion this caused, and thank you very much for bringing it to our attention.

---

Hi Bayohne,

Thanks for the updated information.

If you could pass along our sentiments to Yoshida-san & the Battle Team:

* Please, please let them know that many of us are tiring of the current Random Number Generator Drop Rate % that's currently found in all the Max Level Content (and especially now with the Primal Seals, needing 3 of EACH type).

I'm fine with long-term goals. I'm also OK with items being rare / hard to acquire as well.

But the system we've been exposed to since Ifrit, through Darklight Gear, Materia Melding, and now with the Primal Seals / Hamlet Instances is really about Gambling / Rolling the Dice, repeatedly over and over in the hopes that luck is on your side to get the drop.

The big difference in something like Dynamis (early days) for Relic Weapons is that the player sees Incremental Gains EACH TIME they participate in Dynamis (via Ancient Currency).

And to counteract the point Hulan brought up - there's still an element of the "Lottery / Gambling" / Random Number Generator (that this Dev Team seems so enamored with :( - via you might be only getting Single "One Byne Bills" or you could get some "One Hundred Byne Bills" (different levels of currency) in the process of slaughtering Dynamis Xarcabard, and other Dynamis Instances.

You also work towards different goals in Dynamis. There are different Branches / Paths, different NMs, different Drops.

You could be working toward beating Dynamis Lord. Or Getting Fragments or Attestations.

But here, it's running the same Instance repeatedly and just rolling the dice.

I think Random Number Generator certainly has a place in this game, but for Long Term Goal-Oriented Systems like a "Relic / AF Weapon + Upgrading," having a Point System where players can work towards it and SEE that they're making gains each time they commit is highly desirable and much-needed.

It still achieves the Time Sink that Yoshida-san wants with dragging out content, but many Players would be far more receptive, and willing to work towards those Goals vs. what we have now.

Thank you!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kiara

Hi Bayohne,

Thanks for the updated information.

If you could pass along our sentiments to Yoshida-san & the Battle Team:

* Please, please let them know that many of us are tiring of the current Random Number Generator Drop Rate % that's currently found in all the Max Level Content (and especially now with the Primal Seals, needing 3 of EACH type).

I'm fine with long-term goals. I'm also OK with items being rare / hard to acquire as well.

But the system we've been exposed to since Ifrit, through Darklight Gear, Materia Melding, and now with the Primal Seals / Hamlet Instances is really about Gambling / Rolling the Dice, repeatedly over and over in the hopes that luck is on your side to get the drop.

The big difference in something like Dynamis (early days) for Relic Weapons is that the player sees Incremental Gains EACH TIME they participate in Dynamis (via Ancient Currency).

And to counteract the point Hulan brought up - there's still an element of the "Lottery / Gambling" / Random Number Generator (that this Dev Team seems so enamored with :( - via you might be only getting Single "One Byne Bills" or you could get some "One Hundred Byne Bills" (different levels of currency) in the process of slaughtering Dynamis Xarcabard, and other Dynamis Instances.

You also work towards different goals in Dynamis. There are different Branches / Paths, different NMs, different Drops.

You could be working toward beating Dynamis Lord. Or Getting Fragments or Attestations.

But here, it's running the same Instance repeatedly and just rolling the dice.

I think Random Number Generator certainly has a place in this game, but for Long Term Goal-Oriented Systems like a "Relic / AF Weapon + Upgrading," having a Point System where players can work towards it and SEE that they're making gains each time they commit is highly desirable and much-needed.

It still achieves the Time Sink that Yoshida-san wants with dragging out content, but many Players would be far more receptive, and willing to work towards those Goals vs. what we have now.

Thank you!

---

Alternatively, if the beastmen themselves had a chance to drop the seal, and the 50k chest was garaunteed a seal. Im just spitting ideas though. At the end of the day, the Hamlets still lack fun and skill in order to fully clear.

My speculation is that this quest will get you a weapon that is on par with (just slightly better than) the current primal weapons. Then there will be an upgrade quest that make them even better.

I'm kind of hoping their goal is to have a line of quests that will keep upgrading these over the lifetime of the game. Use today's upgraded weapon down the road (when the level cap is raised) to do another upgrade that will continue to keep the weapon the best in the game for the job.

my speculation? ffxi didnt have official forums. i bet if we looked thru 3rd party ones wed find plenty of griping.

i gripe myself a lot too, because i can. but this is my theory

kkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkkk

I do wonder what the reaction of adding these seals to the qq black market for a seemingly absurd amount of beast man currency would be.

Hearing that this is pRNG is getting pretty old. Run 10 hamlets and get a low score (Copper Chest). Run 10 hamlets and get a high score (Gold Chest). Count up how many seals you got from each. I think you'll find that skill and performance have boosted your drop rate significantly. That's not even taking into account the militia gear that will drop.