Possible Ideas to Address Hrothgar/Viera Hat Disparity?

This went from 0 to 100 real fast.

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Originally Posted by reivaxe

This is true, they legit made it clear that they only added Viera to please people who have been begging for them since before HW revealed the Draggos cause this was likely the last chance to please them.
It's a choice to pander to people who just wanted to play dress up with a bun.

IMO it's clear that most times a MMO adds a new race it's more so to fill a gap in their line up and add visual diversity to their product as to attract a larger audience than they currently have. If all they wanted to do was pander to please people already playing the game all they would have to do would be ... make a 3rd Miqote clan with new faces and/ or make a Half Elezen Human that's just a Meddie with Elezen ears, new faces and emotes. It's super easy to pander to the wants of people who just want different pretty spins on basic human design for their anime waifu/ hubs, but it's not really worth the effort or room that it takes up. That's where the problem with Viera come in at, it feels like an addition that doesn't add anything new and now we have to hear everyone wanting more effort tossed their way cause they're a limited race that a ton of people converted to.



This is true, but at least it's a thing that they said and reaffirmed more than once (that they would add new hair to Viera and new manes and faces to Hrothgar). At this rate I think it may just be a 6.0 thing really, but Bozja Hroths have me thinking that it's at least closer than that.

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God. I'd love a half elezen/half hyur. Like Hilda. They could look amazing.. That would be my main race. Plus it probably wouldn't be limited at all like viera..

I don't want to disappoint myself too much. i'll hope for 6.0, but if they came any sooner, I wouldn't complain..

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Originally Posted by reivaxe

Unless you're talking about a small number of hats I think you're getting your order mixed up.

It's not a case of "They just didn't make the hat hair model :v".
It's more like "They didn't intend for these races to wear hats so they didn't make a hat hair model".

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I was talking about a small number of headgear and I'm not getting my order mixed up at all, I know why they (said) they did what they did. I'm saying they cannot let just let the ears clip through additional pieces of headgear like people are suggesting because the hair would go with it. Or disappear in Hrothgar's case.

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Originally Posted by reivaxe

So yeah ... they decided to give Viera the freedom to customize their ears at the cost of head gear as ear customization on that scale would make it hard af to make head gear, so that's why they didn't bother making the hat hair models in the first place.

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Yes, but the freedom to customize your ears at the cost of everything else is pretty worthless with only 4 options, they could've done something really unique with the ears instead since they never intended to account for hats anyway.

For example: More ears with distinct silhouettes like asymmetry with 1 lop ear and 1 straight (and then a mirrored option for taste), ears with longer fur, Fran's more rounded and speckled ears, ears going out more horizontally from the base rather than straight up or back, a very short type for people that want to RP as a Feol, maybe even some of that iconic black ornamental Viera plating you could add, remove and dye to dress up the ears a bit to match your armor.

There really didn't need to be only 4 options, with 3 of them being pretty samey, of the racial feature you really wanted to highlight and remain unhidden by hats. And lastly of course more than 8 hairstyles.

Any of these options wouldn't have completely stopped people asking for more headgear but it would have gone a long way to show they made an effort and it was at least slightly worth it, because right now it just isn't.

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Originally Posted by Yencat

I was talking about a small number of headgear and I'm not getting my order mixed up at all, I know why they (said) they did what they did. I'm saying they cannot let just let the ears clip through additional pieces of headgear like people are suggesting because the hair would go with it. Or disappear in Hrothgar's case.



Yes, but the freedom to customize your ears at the cost of everything else is pretty worthless with only 4 options, they could've done something really unique with the ears instead since they never intended to account for hats anyway.

For example: More ears with distinct silhouettes like asymmetry with 1 lop ear and 1 straight (and then a mirrored option for taste), ears with longer fur, Fran's more rounded and speckled ears, ears going out more horizontally from the base rather than straight up or back, a very short type for people that want to RP as a Feol, maybe even some of that iconic black ornamental Viera plating you could add, remove and dye to dress up the ears a bit to match your armor.

There really didn't need to be only 4 options, with 3 of them being pretty samey, of the racial feature you really wanted to highlight and remain unhidden by hats. And lastly of course more than 8 hairstyles.

Any of these options wouldn't have completely stopped people asking for more headgear but it would have gone a long way to show they made an effort and it was at least slightly worth it, because right now it just isn't.

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Considering viera don't get any hats, you'd think they could have given us more ear customization options. As is they really are really light on the customization.. I know someone will probably come here and go "limitations", but if the limitations are the reason we get such limited races, then they should have tempered their vision a bit..

No headgear, tiny amount of hairstyles, limited customization.. definitely not worth it..

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

Considering viera don't get any hats, you'd think they could have given us more ear customization options. As is they really are really light on the customization.. I know someone will probably come here and go "limitations", but if the limitations are the reason we get such limited races, then they should have tempered their vision a bit..

No headgear, tiny amount of hairstyles, limited customization.. definitely not worth it..

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Unless I'm completely mistaken Viera ears in the CC fall under the same category as Miqo'te and Au Ra tails with the different types and a length slider, and Miqo'te got 8 different tail types. So yes there would have been room to give us more unique ear options in lieu of headgear even with "limitations", but instead these "highly customizable races you can really go all out on" got less.

They could still do it, but considering changing ears is Fantasia only it's still not a super appealing option for everyone to get access to customization that really should have been there at launch. But then again, this is already a reality for Hrothgar so it would be par for the course at this point. :rolleyes:

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Originally Posted by Yencat

Unless I'm completely mistaken Viera ears in the CC fall under the same category as Miqo'te and Au Ra tails with the different types and a length slider, and Miqo'te got 8 different tail types. So yes there would have been room to give us more unique ear options in lieu of headgear even with "limitations", but instead these "highly customizable races you can really go all out on" got less.

They could still do it, but considering changing ears is Fantasia only it's still not a super appealing option for everyone to get access to customization that really should have been there at launch. But then again, this is already a reality for Hrothgar so it would be par for the course at this point. :rolleyes:

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Now that I think of it though, yeah, I was thinking of customization options for the ears in general, but you are definitely right. There does seem to be quite a lack of distinct ear options to begin with! In relation to the amount of tails a base race gets, which is an equivalent slider, viera got the short end of the stick here! ONLY FOUR options sucks!

No doubt! No free fantasia either! Well. I won't say that.. MAYBE SE will give us a single free fantasia for viera/hrothgar players during 6.0 launch. They did get to cash in on all the players using fantasias the previous two years after all..

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Originally Posted by reivaxe

In order to use the Miqote head system for gear they would have to be in the same spot on the head (YP outright said that). They would also have to not have customization so that they could act like Miqote ears. They could likely make Miqote ears that are up scaled and altered some and translate that into easy to do upscales to a number of hats/ helms but they wouldn't look like what he have.

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I see, didn't know Yoshi-P said that.
But then again, there is no need to use Miqo head system. Make a different system for the Viera specifically but without this whole "ears take up a headpiece slot" and stuff. Even if we don't get the holes in the headgear like Miqo'tes do for some clipping through is fine, I don't think anyone would care at this point.

Honestly, I don't even wear hats usually but it's just sad that we aren't even getting anything to compensate for it. Like stated in posts above - give us more ear options. Give us more hairstyles at least. If they don't need to fit Viera hairstyles to change with the hat on it should be even easier to make a new hairstyle for a Viera than it is for other races.

ill be honest., i could care less about head gear at this point. I just want hairstyles at this point for viera and I will advocate for the hrothgar needing more styles as well.

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Originally Posted by Vickii

Delete both races.

Honestly this is the third thread today about hats for races that were announced to not have hats.

Your best option is to roll a proper race and they shouldn’t pander to people making new ones in the future because the people that beg them for stuff are never happy and will keep demanding more and more.

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I'm sorry, what? lol
In what world is asking for a finished product 'demanding more and more'?

SE, being the poor indie developer that they are, wanted to present something shiny with the release of 6.0 and dropped the ball. They only have themselves to blame. I would have happily waited for 6.5 or 7.0 and get a _finished_ race.
But we never got that open, did we?

Fix it, SE.

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Originally Posted by Payadopa

I'm sorry, what? lol
In what world is asking for a finished product 'demanding more and more'?

SE, being the poor indie developer that they are, wanted to present something shiny with the release of 6.0 and dropped the ball. They only have themselves to blame. I would have happily waited for 6.5 or 7.0 and get a _finished_ race.
But we never got that open, did we?

Fix it, SE.

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The problem is, they consider viera/hrothgar a finished product. Pretty sure they've said so themselves. Any hairstyles that are supposedly supposed to be added after the fact would just be a bonus. God forbid we would ever get hats, I literally don't ever see that happening. Never know, but I seriously doubt it. It looks like they tried for awhile to give us more headgear that wasn't hats (circlets, etc.), but there overall design hasn't really changed, so largely viera/hrothgar are left out. As people have said, they were never supposed to have hats, so why bother? That's probably their thinking.

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

The problem is, they consider viera/hrothgar a finished product. Pretty sure they've said so themselves. Any hairstyles that are supposedly supposed to be added after the fact would just be a bonus. God forbid we would ever get hats, I literally don't ever see that happening. Never know, but I seriously doubt it. It looks like they tried for awhile to give us more headgear that wasn't hats (circlets, etc.), but there overall design hasn't really changed, so largely viera/hrothgar are left out. As people have said, they were never supposed to have hats, so why bother? That's probably their thinking.

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The hat problem wouldn't be that much of an issue if we could at least get more hairstyles. Hrothgars specially only have 2 hairstyles unless you change the actual face to use the others, and even then it's only possible by buying a Fantasia. That's a bad decision no matter where you look at it which, at worst, made the race dead on arrival for many.

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Originally Posted by Allegor

The hat problem wouldn't be that much of an issue if we could at least get more hairstyles. Hrothgars specially only have 2 hairstyles unless you change the actual face to use the others, and even then it's only possible by buying a Fantasia. That's a bad decision no matter where you look at it which, at worst, made the race dead on arrival for many.

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Yes, even if hrothgar in the future get more than two hairstyles per face, it would still require a fantasia to access them! You guys could have a couple dozen hairstyles per face, but that would still not fix the core problem! Requiring a fantasia SUCKS! Granted, it would be in SE's best interest! I'm sure if hrothgar had options, they would continue to cash in on those fantasias, may look scummy though.

I mean sure, but in general it would probably require making it an entirely separate skeleton that is attached to the body, which makes it harder to work with when making animations and gear show up fine on them without clipping issues. It's as they said before about how they did Hrothgar's entire head - the Hair basically IS the head. That's why it's so limited and I'm hoping for 6.0 for them to address this(because skeleton work takes a LONG TIME to get right, especially for a ton of gear and future gear they plan on adding). If they don't do anything for those two races in terms of headpieces in 6.0, then that ship is dead on arrival.

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

The problem is, they consider viera/hrothgar a finished product. Pretty sure they've said so themselves. Any hairstyles that are supposedly supposed to be added after the fact would just be a bonus. God forbid we would ever get hats, I literally don't ever see that happening. Never know, but I seriously doubt it. It looks like they tried for awhile to give us more headgear that wasn't hats (circlets, etc.), but there overall design hasn't really changed, so largely viera/hrothgar are left out. As people have said, they were never supposed to have hats, so why bother? That's probably their thinking.

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Hmmm. Yeah, could be.

But I'd counter with the devs did it (in their spare time, which shouldn't have happened). So they felt an obligation which is as good as admitting it. The rest is just PR speak.

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Originally Posted by Allegor

The hat problem wouldn't be that much of an issue if we could at least get more hairstyles. Hrothgars specially only have 2 hairstyles unless you change the actual face to use the others, and even then it's only possible by buying a Fantasia. That's a bad decision no matter where you look at it which, at worst, made the race dead on arrival for many.

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Obvious solution: Greatly expand what the Aesthetician can do.

We should be able to completely recustomize characters with him. Hair, face, height, etc. If we want to be on par with WoW we'd be able to change everything but race and name but maybe asking gender to be changeable with gil is asking too much.

Expanding the aesthetician would resolve the Hrothgar problem and make it everyone else happy.

Hairstyles are needed for Hrothgars asap

I knew about the hat issue when I change my guy to one so will live with it and hope some do come up in the future, however, for me, JOB gear should fit whichever race you play from head to toe.
Dungeon gear comes and goes but your Job Class set should be made to fit everyone and this is coming from an RDM who can't even wear his hat :(

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Originally Posted by HyperiusUltima

It's as they said before about how they did Hrothgar's entire head - the Hair basically IS the head.

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Hrothgar hair isn't actually attached to the head at all, the head and the hair are separate models so in that sense they work pretty much the same as for every other race. There's no real reason for them to be the way they are right now outside of the wacky world of design decisions.

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Except that's exactly what it is.

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And there isn't anything wrong with it.

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They've been profiting all along

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Well, they've been meeting someone's demands, then, haven't they?

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SE would have been far better off never adding Viera and Hrothgar

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Perhaps, but it's irrelevant.

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Originally Posted by Yencat

Yes, but the freedom to customize your ears at the cost of everything else is pretty worthless with only 4 options, they could've done something really unique with the ears instead since they never intended to account for hats anyway.

For example: More ears with distinct silhouettes like asymmetry with 1 lop ear and 1 straight (and then a mirrored option for taste), ears with longer fur, Fran's more rounded and speckled ears, ears going out more horizontally from the base rather than straight up or back, a very short type for people that want to RP as a Feol, maybe even some of that iconic black ornamental Viera plating you could add, remove and dye to dress up the ears a bit to match your armor.

There really didn't need to be only 4 options, with 3 of them being pretty samey, of the racial feature you really wanted to highlight and remain unhidden by hats. And lastly of course more than 8 hairstyles.

Any of these options wouldn't have completely stopped people asking for more headgear but it would have gone a long way to show they made an effort and it was at least slightly worth it, because right now it just isn't.

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Like I said, I disagree with how they implemented these races. But to me there's no real point living in the land of Shoulda-Coulda, it is what it is ... it's a core design decision they're not going to change and we can only hope that if they make the counterparts they do something different that's less limiting and learns from the backlash.

Like ... the Viera as is are atrociously bad from a character design PoV in a MMO setting. They suffer from twining because they have human skin colors + Gray and the only thing that makes them different from what's in the game already is their ears. So they effectively put in a race of humans that have only a FRACTION of the hair styles as any other race before it (and of these 8 hair styles most land on using the same popular 3 "best looking ones"), gave them 4 ears (only 2 of which are commonly used, 1 is objectively ugly cause of lack of animation) and took away the option to use hats and helms to change the shape of their head. They're basically the least visually diverse option in this game and once they thought about the limits they would have the Devs/ YP should have pulled the plug on them, either going back to making full Hrothgar or just made up a bunny like race that uses the Miqote head and told people "Yeah, we decided to make these new FF14 races inspired by the Viera and Ronso". (Seems clear to me that many people would have been happy af at just getting an updated Miqote with longer, Spiggan like ears and a fat fluffy Happy Bunny tail they can customize).

But that doesn't make a difference anymore so ehh, it's a fuck up that may only be changed in some kinda "FF14: Part 2" sequel, or maybe they will find some way to make a system they're ok with to allow for hats and helms (I'm sure most hrothgar wouldn't mind their manes going away when they wear a hat and maybe Viera players wouldn't whine about getting stock ears that poke downward from underneath the brim of a hat).

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Originally Posted by reivaxe

Like I said, I disagree with how they implemented these races. But to me there's no real point living in the land of Shoulda-Coulda, it is what it is ...

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Maybe not, but that was basically the point of the thread so that's what I responded to.

If they can't give them headgear there are still other things they can do to alleviate the feeling that you're playing totally busted races, there's no reason they can't still do this and they've said as much themselves.

Now whether that statement was just to placate players or they actually want/intend to do something about it remains to be seen.

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Originally Posted by Yencat

Maybe not, but that was basically the point of the thread so that's what I responded to.

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I thought the point of this thread was " Possible Ideas to Address Hrothgar/Viera Hat Disparity" and not to live in the shoulda-coulda lands. Like I said, I think they were poorly implemented with everything set up against them adding head stuff later ... but nothing can really come from being stuck on that and I didn't think of this thread as a "What could they do besides adding hats to help this half baked race?". The devs did what they did, leaving a fat hurdle to jump over if they decide to do it.

This was and has always been my answer to how they could get hats to work ...
"But that doesn't make a difference anymore so ehh, it's a fuck up that may only be changed in some kinda "FF14: Part 2" sequel, or maybe they will find some way to make a system they're ok with to allow for hats and helms (I'm sure most hrothgar wouldn't mind their manes going away when they wear a hat and maybe Viera players wouldn't whine about getting stock ears that poke downward from underneath the brim of a hat)."

As in this.
(shit 3:30am drawing but w/e, visuals work better)
https://i.imgur.com/DkS8UML.jpeg

Make a pair of stock ears and have them be a part of the "hat hair model" or hat model. Boom, no having to alter models for holes in 100s or 1000s of hats that were never made to have holes in them, no comically large "ear socks/ mittens". Just turn off the ears, plop a large hat on and make the "culled hair model" have 2 ears sticking outta the bottom like this or have them attached to the hat like that. They have shown that they make custom head gear for other races often ... they just don't make more than 1.

So yeah, either they disregard the 4 types of ears to make this idea work OR they make ... 4 different types of hat hair models or hats to make this idea work. Tis the problem. But it's by all means a viable idea that could work with how things currently are as far as I know.
(Hrothgar are easy, just turn off mane.)

But who knows if even that could work. Even when they give Viera hoods things go bonkers outside of it looking like trash (like the Bozja Aiming hood. Last I checked for w/e reason the goggles float through the ears when you visor on Viera ... IDK what kinda spaghetti code they're dealing with but this is my best crack at it)

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Originally Posted by Reyketi

This isn't a charity, it's a game for profit, if they want to continue to profit, they will meet their customer's demands.

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Just wanted to note that it goes both ways. The devs are on record saying a majority of the headgear that DOES work was done on voluntary time, not actual salaried/paid time (same as Doman Mahjong).

That should tell you one if not two things:
1) The devs are being charitable with their time to make something they hope the players will appreciate.
2) The devs and management are making it clear the whole helms-for-viera thing is not worth their time on the clock to complete.

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Originally Posted by reivaxe

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This thread has been full of suggestions ranging from just letting things clip, to not bothering with hats at all and just giving more hair, to even outright deleting the races (lol), so I'm not sure what it is about my posts that stands out so much for being off-topic?

I definitely wouldn't be opposed to having a pair of stock ears hanging down under a hat, but as was discussed earlier in the thread certain Viera hairstyles (like the one with the black helmet baked into it and it's 2 clones) would be very difficult to partially cull or squish to make the hat sit properly without stretching the texture unless they make one universal "hat-hair" with the stock hanging ears.

That's when some of the posts veered off into what other things they could do if they couldn't work with the hairstyles.

It all hinges on how stubborn they are about their no-hats stance. If they're open to making hats work then by all means I'm all for your suggestion, if not then giving other customization options such as more ears/hair/manes/whatever to make up for it is another option.

At the end of the day it's not like they come here looking here for suggestions anyway so it's all speculating and theorizing either way.

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Originally Posted by reivaxe

I thought the point of this thread was " Possible Ideas to Address Hrothgar/Viera Hat Disparity" and not to live in the shoulda-coulda lands. Like I said, I think they were poorly implemented with everything set up against them adding head stuff later ... but nothing can really come from being stuck on that and I didn't think of this thread as a "What could they do besides adding hats to help this half baked race?". The devs did what they did, leaving a fat hurdle to jump over if they decide to do it.

This was and has always been my answer to how they could get hats to work ...
"But that doesn't make a difference anymore so ehh, it's a fuck up that may only be changed in some kinda "FF14: Part 2" sequel, or maybe they will find some way to make a system they're ok with to allow for hats and helms (I'm sure most hrothgar wouldn't mind their manes going away when they wear a hat and maybe Viera players wouldn't whine about getting stock ears that poke downward from underneath the brim of a hat)."

As in this.
(shit 3:30am drawing but w/e, visuals work better)
https://i.imgur.com/DkS8UML.jpeg

Make a pair of stock ears and have them be a part of the "hat hair model" or hat model. Boom, no having to alter models for holes in 100s or 1000s of hats that were never made to have holes in them, no comically large "ear socks/ mittens". Just turn off the ears, plop a large hat on and make the "culled hair model" have 2 ears sticking outta the bottom like this or have them attached to the hat like that. They have shown that they make custom head gear for other races often ... they just don't make more than 1.

So yeah, either they disregard the 4 types of ears to make this idea work OR they make ... 4 different types of hat hair models or hats to make this idea work. Tis the problem. But it's by all means a viable idea that could work with how things currently are as far as I know.
(Hrothgar are easy, just turn off mane.)

But who knows if even that could work. Even when they give Viera hoods things go bonkers outside of it looking like trash (like the Bozja Aiming hood. Last I checked for w/e reason the goggles float through the ears when you visor on Viera ... IDK what kinda spaghetti code they're dealing with but this is my best crack at it)

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I like the idea of the ears down to avoid clipping issues through the ear length x tall helms, but in both examples you drew (esp. the cap, that is as flat as it can get), it would be perfectly fine to have the holes on top of the hats though!

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Originally Posted by Raikai

I like the idea of the ears down to avoid clipping issues through the ear length x tall helms, but in both examples you drew (esp. the cap, that is as flat as it can get), it would be perfectly fine to have the holes on top of the hats though!

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Top hat would look tragic with the "Bent ears" and the point is that these hats/ helms were never designed to have "holes on top". It's not an easy task to do, would require making custom versions of hats with custom textures and such which is 1 of the problems.

Tis why I say just have them fit this way. Now, would they disregard the fact that there's 4 types of ears or would they make 4 different versions? No idea, leaning towards it being a no to them cause they would not disregard the player's choice in ear shape and they will not make 4 custom versions of every hat hair model just for Viera.

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Originally Posted by Yencat

This thread has been full of suggestions ranging from just letting things clip, to not bothering with hats at all and just giving more hair, to even outright deleting the races (lol), so I'm not sure what it is about my posts that stands out so much for being off-topic?

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Never said anything was off-topic, just that it's pointless to focus on how things coulda or shoulda been different over thinking of ways to fix what the devs gave us.

Adding 4 more ears isn't going to do much about the core problem with the race having the least amount of visual diversity, their ears are basically knives that stick out of their skull with lil to zero animation and people already ignore 2 of the 4 options cause they're not "cute". Adding twice the amount of hair for a whooping 16 unique styles would only really be a ban-aid at best that wears off once people notice that they all settled on the same ones again (assuming they even do twice the amount. They could easily just do 4, they are strangely frugal with making hair styles).

Another idea I had, sparked by Fox's wording the last time they spoke about it (that they were looking into ways to make some helms (Not HATS, helms) that are unique to Viera) made me think that they may simply pull a "Fran hair". As in, take some other hair styles and make a "Viera Helm" version like this with Mjrn. So basically they just bake a few helms into some Viera hairstyles so that for 2k gil you can either rock the reg hair version or the helm version of that style. Would be inline with how you have the bangs or no bangs version and it's already a thing in game with Fran hair. Could actually do something about the diversity in appearance as even if they can't wear reg hats or helms they have the option for Viera ONLY helms with their hair that can be mixed and matched with head gear they already can wear.

Might be the best option TBH. Though I think my hat idea works it would only really work in a world where they're ok with just ignoring player choice OR in a world where they're willing to put that much effort and memory into a single race just to allow them to have something they told people they wouldn't have. Actually running with the Fran hair idea to give people some helms that are unique to Viera's unique hair styles could be the best bet for "head gear" for this race.

Apparently Yoshida did a surprise Q&A on the Chocobo server on New Years day and someone asked about Viera & Hrothgar headgear:

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Q: Can we get 100% support on all headgear for Viera and Hrothgar?
A: In regards to headgear for those races, due to the unique ears and faces it will be impossible to implement 100% support. I am sorry.

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Not exactly news and this probably won't shock or surprise anyone, but optimistically I don't think many people were ever expecting 100% to work so if they're actually trying to make a couple more work that is an improvement to what we have now.

"Not 100%" is pretty ambiguous though and it could just as well mean that they're content with the type of items that already work now and there won't be more, so make of that what you will.

On the other hand though it seems safe now to rule out that they're trying or looking for some sort of blanket solution to solve the issue entirely, so if anyone was holding out hope for that I guess this is it. It's probably not actually impossible but it'd clearly be a lot of work and too much of a headache to bother with.

Someone posted a couple of questions they caught to Reddit and I thought I'd post this one here since it's the most recent statement on the topic, even if it's what most people probably expected.

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Originally Posted by reivaxe

Top hat would look tragic with the "Bent ears" and the point is that these hats/ helms were never designed to have "holes on top". It's not an easy task to do, would require making custom versions of hats with custom textures and such which is 1 of the problems.

Tis why I say just have them fit this way. Now, would they disregard the fact that there's 4 types of ears or would they make 4 different versions? No idea, leaning towards it being a no to them cause they would not disregard the player's choice in ear shape and they will not make 4 custom versions of every hat hair model just for Viera.

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Oh, I totally get it, and I really like your solution, top hat included on that, but just not the examples you drew... Especially the cap. It actually would look quite hard to keep the stifeness of the ears not pulling them back because a cap is just... a cap lol.

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Originally Posted by Yencat

Apparently Yoshida did a surprise Q&A on the Chocobo server on New Years day and someone asked about Viera & Hrothgar headgear:



Not exactly news and this probably won't shock or surprise anyone, but optimistically I don't think many people were ever expecting 100% to work so if they're actually trying to make a couple more work that is an improvement to what we have now.

"Not 100%" is pretty ambiguous though and it could just as well mean that they're content with the type of items that already work now and there won't be more, so make of that what you will.

On the other though hand it seems safe now to rule out that they're trying or looking for some sort of blanket solution to solve the issue entirely, so if anyone was holding out hope for that I guess this is it. It's probably not actually impossible but it'd clearly be a lot of work and too much of a headache to bother with.

Someone posted a couple of questions they caught to Reddit and I thought I'd post this one here since it's the most recent statement on the topic, even if it's what most people probably expected.

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Yeah! I really hope that this "not 100%" quote means that they are at least try to give some options, because let's face it, there are some hats that wouldn't affect neither the ears or the Hrothgar unique faces at all, regarding the 3D model.

Even if we got like just 15 old hat models (and their color/texture variants) adapted, still would be light years better than simply have nothing

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Originally Posted by Yencat

Apparently Yoshida did a surprise Q&A on the Chocobo server on New Years day and someone asked about Viera & Hrothgar headgear:



Not exactly news and this probably won't shock or surprise anyone, but optimistically I don't think many people were ever expecting 100% to work so if they're actually trying to make a couple more work that is an improvement to what we have now.

"Not 100%" is pretty ambiguous though and it could just as well mean that they're content with the type of items that already work now and there won't be more, so make of that what you will.

On the other hand though it seems safe now to rule out that they're trying or looking for some sort of blanket solution to solve the issue entirely, so if anyone was holding out hope for that I guess this is it. It's probably not actually impossible but it'd clearly be a lot of work and too much of a headache to bother with.

Someone posted a couple of questions they caught to Reddit and I thought I'd post this one here since it's the most recent statement on the topic, even if it's what most people probably expected.

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Just a more current update of their same stance on the subject. The problem with that question is they asked "headgear" rather than hats. Viera already have support for headgear that isn't hats! Nothing new was learned! The community had a chance and blew it with that question! :(

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Originally Posted by Yencat

Q: Can we get 100% support on all headgear for Viera and Hrothgar?
A: In regards to headgear for those races, due to the unique ears and faces it will be impossible to implement 100% support. I am sorry.

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Well...yeah. Hrothgar don't have human faces, so there is no way to make gear 100% compatible. They would need to make new versions of alot of headpeices to get it to fit the Hrothgar head. Viera....besides some gear like I guess helmets...I dont know their excuse with alot of headgear. Maybe its personal choice that they dont ears to clip, but still gotta wonder why newer gear doesnt have built in earholes.
Heres to hoping in 6.0 they manage to make some headgear for both races that will be compatible.

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

Just a more current update of their same stance on the subject. The problem with that question is they asked "headgear" rather than hats. Viera already have support for headgear that isn't hats! Nothing new was learned! The community had a chance and blew it with that question! :(

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I'm assuming the question was asked in Japanese so I can't say how specific the wording was on that end. But even if the question was literally about "headgear", unless he was being purposefully obtuse I'd wager he knew what was being asked and answered accordingly.

But then the question about glamour restrictions being loosened was misconstrued into asking about axes on black mages, so who knows?

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

but still gotta wonder why newer gear doesnt have built in earholes.

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I don't think they do many custom models for Miqo'te anymore either, so it's probably too much work to adapt the hairstyles and make custom models just for Viera and/or Hrothgar.

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Originally Posted by Yencat

I'm assuming the question was asked in Japanese so I can't say how specific the wording was on that end. But even if the question was literally about "headgear", unless he was being purposefully obtuse I'd wager he knew what was being asked and answered accordingly.

But then the question about glamour restrictions being loosened was misconstrued into asking about axes on black mages, so who knows?

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Axes on black mages? Maybe, I'm better off not knowing..

I mean, all he said was "not 100%", which answers literally nothing. Plus devs in general are known for being quite... ambiguous..

They need to step up their game imo and stop with the endless excuses since the reintroduction of this game, and improve quality.
This includes equal options for hairstyles and headgear for all races. No excuses.
Also start now, today...and begin fixing the clipping of all gear, AND improve the physics of the gear, no more cardboard stiff dresses, hair, tails ..omg. It is horrendous. And do NOT introduce any new gear/hairstyle with the SAME problems!

The game comes across as low budget, MANY FTP games look 1000x better.
GIT GUD SE

ty

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

Axes on black mages? Maybe, I'm better off not knowing..

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I'm having trouble finding the exact quote right now, but if you're curious; Basically the question was something like if they ever intended to loosen the glamour restrictions between DoW and DoM because people were sick of only having robes for healers and casters, and he answered that no that wouldn't be possible because it would be very confusing and strange for a Black Mage to be using a Warrior's axe :confused::confused::confused: Something to that effect.

I don't think it was ever clarified if he misunderstood, the question got lost in translation, or he didn't really want to answer the question, but it was a real head scratcher.

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

I mean, all he said was "not 100%", which answers literally nothing. Plus devs in general are known for being quite... ambiguous..

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Well, it answers the question that they've not been so quiet about it because they've been hard at work on a solution to make everything work, but outside of a small minority of people I don't think many people ever believed they would.

But you're right, it doesn't actually answer if they ever intend to add more. It's possible they aren't sure yet themselves either and just don't want to commit to any definitive answer right now.

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Originally Posted by MistyMew

Also start now, today...and begin fixing the clipping of all gear, AND improve the physics of the gear, no more cardboard stiff dresses, hair, tails ..omg.

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But does the XIV engine allows more fluid physics, that's the question... I don't know, actually. However in the case of "not working out", it would be actually impossible to avoid every clipping that happens from hairs to collars, but there's one single clipping that defnitely should be addressed somehow, that is the tail clipping. It's the most horrendous of them all, and something that really sticks like an eyesore in a huge distance... Funny that they never showed any Blue Mage artifact gear publicity with that Au Ra turned backwards.

I, unfortunately, don't know the answer to fixing these races, but I will say this and it's kind of a rant so I'm sorry in advance, but...I'm honestly getting incredibly tired of Square Enix's excuses in regards to, well just about everything here lately.

It always boils down to "Dev resources" and I'm sorry...FFXIV is one of their most financially successful games and they assign a shoestring budget and team size to it..and I have no idea why. It's honestly unacceptable for how large this game is. Assign more resources to FFXIV or find a better excuse, because I'm tired of this one, lol. I love my Hrothgar, but it has been a year now and they've made 0 progress on even just attempting to fix any of the issues for the Hrothgar or Viera.

These races were created overnight ( exaggerating I know ) and it shows. The Hrothgar only has 8 hairstyles which are all tied to face types...and only two per face type. God forbid you only like one of the face types because then you're literally limited to two hairstyles...and you better be ready to fork out $10 for a fantasia because they weren't' kind enough to make face changes free and a fantasia exception for our race due to the limitations they caused.

It's insanely frustrating because weeks after these races were made, modders found ways to make the hairstyles work across all face types and make hats work for Hroth/Viera. A quick google/twitter/social media search can confirm this in minutes. If Joe Schmoe can figure this out in 2 weeks, why cant your billion-dollar company figure it out in a year?

I dunno, rant over and I clearly feel some kind of way about this, but it's really disheartening. :(

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Originally Posted by MistyMew

They need to step up their game imo and stop with the endless excuses since the reintroduction of this game, and improve quality.
This includes equal options for hairstyles and headgear for all races. No excuses.
Also start now, today...and begin fixing the clipping of all gear, AND improve the physics of the gear, no more cardboard stiff dresses, hair, tails ..omg. It is horrendous. And do NOT introduce any new gear/hairstyle with the SAME problems!

The game comes across as low budget, MANY FTP games look 1000x better.
GIT GUD SE

ty

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Can you list some of the "MANY"? I've played quite a few, and, unless the characters in-game are cartoonish, they all seem to suffer pretty much the same problems. WoW included.

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Originally Posted by Kyeria

It's insanely frustrating because weeks after these races were made, modders found ways to make the hairstyles work across all face types and make hats work for Hroth/Viera. A quick google/twitter/social media search can confirm this in minutes. If Joe Schmoe can figure this out in 2 weeks, why cant your billion-dollar company figure it out in a year? (

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Joe Schmoe has one thing going for them that SE does not. They don't have to guarantee that it works the same way on Playstation and PC.

Nor does Joe Schmoe have to consider the 'legal issues' involved. There's a reason that most authors don't read fanfiction based on their characters.

I feel like people don't quite understand what the devs refer to when they say this. They are likely referring to the time it takes not the monetary reasons. Unless they pulled every team from SE into XIV I doubt every issue will be addressed in the manner you want them to be. They likely also prioritize things that we as players rarely ever need to bother with considering now this doesn't excuse them not doing what the playerbase wants but they say it because their is various things they have to take into consideration, how much time on cosmetic items, how much time to add things to the character creator, how much on hats for the new races, how much on raids, how much on dungeons, etc. etc.

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Originally Posted by DPZ2

Joe Schmoe has one thing going for them that SE does not. They don't have to guarantee that it works the same way on Playstation and PC.

Nor does Joe Schmoe have to consider the 'legal issues' involved. There's a reason that most authors don't read fanfiction based on their characters.

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I'm sorry, the first part is a pathetic excuse for Square Enix if we're really going to go with that. We're talking about a cosmetic, a hairstyle, and a hat.
This isn't rocket science. If they can make a brand new hairstyle ( Wind Caller Hair ) work for 10 races, ( Hyur, Miq, Roe, Lala, Aura, and each has an additional tribe ) across both PS4 and PC there's no reason they couldn't figure this out a SINGLE brand new hairstyle or fixing a single existing hat cosmetic for Viera and Hrothgar over the course of a year.

For the second part, what legal issues do they have with adding all the hairstyles and hats to all the races...they literally own all the rights to them?
And for the last part, I literally have no idea what you meant.