Great job in 1.21 - Let's Talk Future FFXIV additions.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by BruceyBruceyBangBang

For the last question in the players' poll, I actually commented on this kind of OP. Basically stating that they should look to the player's posts for suggestions regarding 2.0 and only pick out key descriptions as in, "Difficult", "Long term", or "Challenging" rather than reusing past systems.

If you're going to have a team of creative people developing why not use that to your full potential? As long as you have the general idea for the content it doesn't need to be a carbon copy of something from FFXI or from any other final fantasy for that matter.

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Exactly, Well said

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rydin

Once again.. its about being inspired by FFXI.. not copying features directly from it...
Because to put it bluntly (And I know you loved FFXI, but it's the truth) SE wanted to appeal to a MUCH broader market than FFXI players... and I don't blame them

When you've got 500,000 people playing your online game and 6 million people playing the offline titles, as a business you have to consider ways to reach out to the other 92% of your fans

The OP has some good ideas... you even have good ideas about ZNMs... HNMs...huge zones of content... more NMs than any one person can name... But we've got to stop saying this game failed because it wasn't enough like FFXI... because financially... FFXI was just mediocre because it was exactly like FFXI

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A big part of "it failed because it wasn't FFXI" is simply because look at FFXI 10 years later, if FFXIV released with that kind of foundation and built off of it while trying to appeal to the masses, do you really think it would have done worse than it did before?

There's MMOs with under 100,000 people doing just fine and if you don't know, FFXI was actually pulling in more money than any of their game simply because of the monthly fee alone, you can't call that 'mediocre'. People really have big number syndrome lately, because a stable playerbase will always be better than having millions of finicky players. The latter is better in terms of gross income that much is true, but really if you can sit there and say you've played with 1 - 6 million different people in your playtime, big numbers are indeed better.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TheBlazed

Along with those things... Battle system was negatively critized, you couldnt even party because leve's were the way to level up. (grouping on leve's), Crafting system was decent, but thousands of materials to craft 1 item.

I didnt have much problem with Latency and lag at start, it was rushed with bad mechanics leading to failure.
People didn't like what was in the game first then concluded it was rushed. Not 100% why it failed by trying to be different is a big part of its failure.

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Im all about happy compromises....
they went with an auto-attack (Like FFXI) but the battle system is still a lot faster than its predecessor
Also they left the action bar in instead of going towards a menu based battle system
All in all I LOVE the direction of the game... I just recognize that it's far from finished...
and even with jobs and combos... the battle system is still extremely vanilla
Battle regimen needs to come back (More robust and in depth, mind you)
Incaps need to frikkin matter (I know I say this a lot but I just can't say it enough)
You can even incorporate combos into incaps to allow for special incap objectives on NMs and bosses
More emphasis needs to be placed on damage types (Blunt, slashing, piercing)

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rydin

Im guessing based on science

Lest we forget "Measures" were a weapon in FFXII
In that game the measures had really low attack power (So they did laughable damage) but inflicted a positive status effect
So the idea was you hit your own parties members with it, it didn't really hurt them but would cast bubble or haste or something on them

http://images.wikia.com/finalfantasy...7s_Sextant.png
http://images.wikia.com/finalfantasy...fd/Caliper.png
http://images.wikia.com/finalfantasy...ross_Scale.png
http://images.wikia.com/finalfantasy...Multiscale.png
http://images.wikia.com/finalfantasy.../Arc_Scale.png

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Neat, so something like a support/Enfeeble class? i want to here more on this lmao.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Rydin

Im all about happy compromises....
they went with an auto-attack (Like FFXI) but the battle system is still a lot faster than its predecessor
Also they left the action bar in instead of going towards a menu based battle system
All in all I LOVE the direction of the game... I just recognize that it's far from finished...
and even with jobs and combos... the battle system is still extremely vanilla
Battle regimen needs to come back (More robust and in depth, mind you)
Incaps need to frikkin matter (I know I say this a lot but I just can't say it enough)
You can even incorporate combos into incaps to allow for special incap objectives on NMs and bosses
More emphasis needs to be placed on damage types (Blunt, slashing, piercing)

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Good Suggestions, ima put those up n original post

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Originally Posted by TheBlazed

xDDD

I picked that and the Musketeer one.

WTF is an Arithmetician in FFXIV? that interested me

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/em begins casting Lvl. 4 Death. >_>

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Elexia

There's MMOs with under 100,000 people doing just fine and if you don't know, FFXI was actually pulling in more money than any of their game simply because of the monthly fee alone, you can't call that 'mediocre'. People really have big number syndrome lately, because a stable playerbase will always be better than having millions of finicky players. The latter is better in terms of gross income that much is true, but really if you can sit there and say you've played with 1 - 6 million different people in your playtime, big numbers are indeed better.

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And they were also pulling in a lot more money into continued development than ANY OTHER GAME
essentially.. the current FFXI has taken 13 years to develop...
that SERIOUSLY eats into all of those monthly fees
But I'm not saying it didn't make a profit... Its not that kind of comparison...
Im not comparing it to other games... I'm comparing FFXI with 500,000 players to FFXI if it had 2.5 million players....
thats what SE is looking at....
What company wouldn't want MILLIONS of subs?

Wall of text incoming, sorry for the ranting :)

I actually don't like the increased level cap idea, though I think it IS inevitable. That actually destroyed WoW experience, as the lower levels would be more and more irrelevant.

I played WoW from the very start all the way to the Wrath of the Lich King, coming back for two months when Cataclysm hit (pun not intended =D). At the start the game was very fun, but it was getting more and more boring, to the point of me simply quitting in WotLK because I had nothing fun to do in the game aside from talking to friends (and believe me, I was in an endgame guild, and doing the same stuff over and over again did get boring). I came back in Cataclysm because a few friends were saying they restored the beauty of the old times, and even though that was somewhat true, the game was still boring. Everything there is about leveling up as fast as you can to get to end game content. Lower levels became irrelevant, and Blizz simply chose to make leveling stupidly simple, with very little time spent learning the game lore and system. It took me some good 6 months of playing regularly (though not to the exclusion of everything else) to get my first character to level 60 back in the day; now, if you know what you're doing, you can rise a character from level 1 to 85 in one week, two tops. The game went from savoring the story to a mechanical chore. Not to mention you don't even have the option to experience some game content if you just happened to start playing after a level cap-increase: a few friends I brought to the game simply didn't get to like it the way I did, and I suspect it has something to do with me being able to run Molten Core 40-man back in the day and them not even having the chance to get a party to run something as simple as Upper Blackrock Spire! (Ehm, sorry if you don't know what I'm talking about =D)

Now, I'd hate to see that happening to FFXIV. The thing is, when you have a level cap such as 50, people automatically start to expect it to be risen, and rightly so. I'd prefer if they found a way to make things interesting/harder at the end of the game by awarding things other than levels. Actually, I'd prefer if there weren't even levels at all: the MMORPG that took the longest to get old for me was Ultima Online, and I think part of the fun was getting better in "professions" without making your character... How can I put this... Statistically stronger, only able to do stuff a newbie could only dream of. FFXIV's system does a pretty well job of emulating that, what with all the mixing-and-matching of the classes. Focusing on THAT would be more fulfilling than "being able to reach the next level cap".

That, of course, is just my humble opinion, and I expect most to disagree, and rightfully so.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TheBlazed

Neat, so something like a support/Enfeeble class? i want to here more on this lmao.

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I guess they could do any number of scientific things from crafting bombs, enfeebling, enhancing to even setting traps.
Could be cool.... I would also like to hear more about that

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TheBlazed

Good Suggestions, ima put those up n original post

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thats what its all about....
Im not saying dont learn from FFXI... we actually need them to learn from it
but at some point.... Yoshi is going to have to make something special for FFXIV

EVERY SINGLE FF TITLE has added something new to the series
Thats their legacy.. similar ideas.. and new ones that become part of the great pantheon of FF innovations
If Yoshi just continues to bite from the plate of Final fantasy then this game will contribute NOTHING to the series

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Arathalion

Wall of text incoming, sorry for the ranting :)

I actually don't like the increased level cap idea, though I think it IS inevitable. That actually destroyed WoW experience, as the lower levels would be more and more irrelevant.

I played WoW from the very start all the way to the Wrath of the Lich King, coming back for two months when Cataclysm hit (pun not intended =D). At the start the game was very fun, but it was getting more and more boring, to the point of me simply quitting in WotLK because I had nothing fun to do in the game aside from talking to friends (and believe me, I was in an endgame guild, and doing the same stuff over and over again did get boring). I came back in Cataclysm because a few friends were saying they restored the beauty of the old times, and even though that was somewhat true, the game was still boring. Everything there is about leveling up as fast as you can to get to end game content. Lower levels became irrelevant, and Blizz simply chose to make leveling stupidly simple, with very little time spent learning the game lore and system. It took me some good 6 months of playing regularly (though not to the exclusion of everything else) to get my first character to level 60 back in the day; now, if you know what you're doing, you can rise a character from level 1 to 85 in one week, two tops. The game went from savoring the story to a mechanical chore. Not to mention you don't even have the option to experience some game content if you just happened to start playing after a level cap-increase: a few friends I brought to the game simply didn't get to like it the way I did, and I suspect it has something to do with me being able to run Molten Core 40-man back in the day and them not even having the chance to get a party to run something as simple as Upper Blackrock Spire! (Ehm, sorry if you don't know what I'm talking about =D)

Now, I'd hate to see that happening to FFXIV. The thing is, when you have a level cap such as 50, people automatically start to expect it to be risen, and rightly so. I'd prefer if they found a way to make things interesting/harder at the end of the game by awarding things other than levels. Actually, I'd prefer if there weren't even levels at all: the MMORPG that took the longest to get old for me was Ultima Online, and I think part of the fun was getting better in "professions" without making your character... How can I put this... Statistically stronger, only able to do stuff a newbie could only dream of. FFXIV's system does a pretty well job of emulating that, what with all the mixing-and-matching of the classes. Focusing on THAT would be more fulfilling than "being able to reach the next level cap".

That, of course, is just my humble opinion, and I expect most to disagree, and rightfully so.

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While i do see your point, i believe there is a medium they should get too. There already spells and abilities with the indication of rising levels.

Remember we started with 50 then 55 then 60 then 65 then 75. 75 Was their medium and balanced EVERYTHING around 75. Several year it went like like (9-11 years?). I do believe it should of stayed like that and 99 should never have been released.

I think the reason we don't see many content things is because caps will be raised thus making them useless. I don't believe 50 is the End-game for FFXIV.

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Originally Posted by Sav

/em begins casting Lvl. 4 Death. >_>

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i only had 2 options lol

Since MMO's never end like a traditional game, your end reward is personal satisfaction, and items. I'd like to see heavy focus on new item development, and for the gap to widen on who obtains what depending on event difficulty and time it takes to acquire.

Believe me i'm a casual player, and usually end up with middle of the road gear I just don't dedicate the time for that 5% absolute best. But it does need to be there otherwise the world is bland when everyone has the same, and looks the same.

Also I'd like to see structured / tiered content. I haven't played too much of other MMO's but in XI there was Sea / Sky / ZNM... i don't want a copy of those events in XIV, but things like THAT. You're rewarded with really great armor, and great challenges, and it takes a long time to obtain. I feel like that kind of endgame is missing in XIV right now.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TheBlazed

I think the reason we don't see many content things is because caps will be raised thus making them useless. I don't believe 50 is the End-game for FFXIV.

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You do have a point there. I disagree with the strategy in itself, but, again, this is just my opinion. Maybe smaller increases would be less "traumatic", then! I guess an increase to 55 now and 60 at 2.0, being more gradual, would be better :)

Go replay FFXI. You'll find out first hand that HNM like Nidhogg, to Abyssea HNM are all trigger pop. Meaning no timers, and no camping for hours.

FFXIV can borrow ideas from other MMO's, but they have to improve on it for the masses, and take only what works.

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Originally Posted by RedAffinity

Since MMO's never end like a traditional game, your end reward is personal satisfaction, and items. I'd like to see heavy focus on new item development, and for the gap to widen on who obtains what depending on event difficulty and time it takes to acquire.

Believe me i'm a casual player, and usually end up with middle of the road gear I just don't dedicate the time for that 5% absolute best. But it does need to be there otherwise the world is bland when everyone has the same, and looks the same.

Also I'd like to see structured / tiered content. I haven't played too much of other MMO's but in XI there was Sea / Sky / ZNM... i don't want a copy of those events in XIV, but things like THAT. You're rewarded with really great armor, and great challenges, and it takes a long time to obtain. I feel like that kind of endgame is missing in XIV right now.

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Thats all my OP was about... making things like them but not exactly the same.. the concept yea but not the material... added to OP

TheBlazed, after talking to you... I really do agree with the spirit of this thread....

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Originally Posted by Rydin

TheBlazed, after talking to you... I really do agree with the spirit of this thread....

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Allllllllll riiiiiiight :D...


Just tryin to get my voice heard... i cant stay on any MMO these days for more than 3-4 months. I keep flocking back to FFXIV as my Defualt MMO. So just voicing my opinion... SE is doing better of listening to players.

Hell i need to quit MMO's But whatelse am i going to do after sex, homework and the box talkin to me lol

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Originally Posted by Victor

Sounds to me like you should be playing FFXI instead!

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We are playing the sequel now that we have 1.21, did u noticed all the changes and similarities? why not use what worked in other games? but one thing i for sure i dont like remakes, use those elements but add something fresh in the mix, add more ranks and gear in companies that makes u wanna do those events, like hamlet defense might be a Campaign and Besieged at the same time and be massive this time, add assaults, cutscenes in battles random HNM in those kind of battles, assaults with several objectives so many parties can focus on completing separetely in order to win, add strategy in the mix.

I would like to see content that is not repetitive, like moogle fight the moogles spawn randomly and its not like u stand here, we stand there and then everything is killed easily, u need to be running around kiting, evading, etc. More like random objectives, random attack waves, random NM's, etc.

So in a few words content that is not boring after a month...

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Originally Posted by Elexia

Considering Yoshida wants to make FFXIV feel more like a FF game, do you really think, unlike Tanaka, he would ignore the previous MMO based around Final Fantasy III?

The mere fact we have jobs and iconic gear for them now is kind of proof he's not afraid to pull from the series. FFXIV failed simply because it got pushed out early to pad a financial report.

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I'm not arguing the fact that he won't pull from the series, I'm just saying the reason the game was crap at launch was because of Tanaka.

You only need to go look at the FF11 boards and see how unhappy they are with the changes since Tanaka took over.

Feel free to post thoughts... ima keep this thread live!

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Originally Posted by TheBlazed

xDDD

I picked that and the Musketeer one.

WTF is an Arithmetician in FFXIV? that interested me

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This is Arithmatician > http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Arithmetician

The Arithmetician (算術士, Sanjutsushi?), also known as Calculator, is a Job class from Final Fantasy Tactics. A high-level magic class, the Arithmetician use Arithmeticks ("Math Skill" for the PlayStation version) can cast most magick for free and without a charge time, assuming they already know the spell and they can do the right calculations for it. Calculations are done by choosing a condition, like Level, then choosing a number, like 5. With those conditions, Arithmeticians will cast a selected spell targeting all units (allies and foes) whose level is a multiple of 5.

The cat is bemused =-.-=

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Originally Posted by Elexia

If anything the mere fact I'm playing a WHM and DRG (which playable in FFXI too) right now means it's a FFXI clone based on those standards of "it'll turn into a FFXI clone!"

I don't see said people quitting....or is it because they simply took the concept did something different with it?


LE GASP

It is possible to pull from a previous game, do something different (better) and it not suddenly become a clone.

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Did you really use LE GASP?? really?

And you never played WHM or DRG in any other FF game before FFXI? Really? They didn't pull the classic FF jobs out because they were in FFXI they used them because they are the classic FF jobs that have been used in almost every FF game that has been made... even if the characters in recent FF games do not use the job name directly you can pretty much draw a connection between them.

The cat is bemused =-.-=

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Originally Posted by TheBlazed

Lets take a peak at FFXI

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Gotta love the references to XI in this OP. Kudos for pointing out what so many other fail to realize (or just refuse to acknowledge). To all those that raged at the OP, I will give you this small concession:

XI was really AWFUL in ************SOME************ aspects, but PLEASE give credit where credit is due.

Most people coming from XI are looking/hoping to play XIV for the long haul. I would guess that the reason people hate(d) XI so much was because they despise intricate, immersive, time-consuming gameplay. But if the plan is to play this game for a little while, and then just "move the hell on" after a year or two, then please, by all means, just leave now. Not trying to be rude, but putting this game on "easy mode," sharing exp on classes and jobs, so you don't have to choose (specific roles, or versatility) is about the worst conceivable way to implement the job system.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AdvancedWind

I understand what you mean. Sure, FFXI was a great game and has plenty of stuff that worked, plenty of stuff people remember fondly, but I personally believe SE can outdo it and make a better game than it was, instead of making the same game with shinny graphics....

And heck, maybe they really can't make a better game, maybe the final result will never be as good as XI was, but I'd still think we should at least let them try it and offer constructive criticism when they are indeed failing to deliver a good experience...

...In fact, Final Fantasy is a series that excels in this: Each game is very similar to it's predecessors and at the same time it's very different. The most recent entries accentuate this fact even more (each iteration after IX is completely different from it's predecessors and STILL manage to feel like FF. Even XIII.). I don't want them giving up on that philosophy and just resorting to porting as much as possible from FFXI...

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What is with people and assuming that "porting over as much from XI as possible" is going to result in a clone? Are the classes, abilities, weaponskills, spells, the lore, the main storyline, the quests, the leves, the areas, ETC. clones of XI? NO, they're not. And most of what XI fans are proposing can be found in, virtually, EVERY d#$n FF title since the beginning of time:

~Clear defined roles for party play.

~The "nested" UI as unamed jack a$$es call it.

~An actual, PERCEIVABLE difficulty factor (not just tedium via ifrit fights and dodging ghosts while fighting an enemy that requires a tank to be spammed in cures, rather than relying on his own d#$n abilities, ETC.)

~Some sort of viable sub job/class melding system that doesn't force every player to be a carbon f@#$!@ing copy of one another.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by AdvancedWind

That's why I *always* post on this kind of thread, I think there are many people that just...can't move on from FFXI and won't accept anything other than a game that allows them to revive their "old times of glory" (not saying this is your case, but definitely with a few other people around this place), and think that turning this as close to XI as possible is what will help them achieve that goal. But believe me, it won't.

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Underlined Portion Response: Wow....really? as if every biased thought that comes from that ignorant, dismissive, condescending, self-righteous point of view of yours is just GOLD, right?

Bolded Portion Response: The problem isn't that ppl can't move on from XI. The problem is that if anyone even mentions that f@#$!@ing title, ppl like you eat them alive, and so nothing productive comes from these threads.

This is all I get from your post, and those like yours:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSXrs4h8L9A

Creating Immersion

Immersion at this point it's one of the biggest problems I have with the game. The world seems disjointed and non responsive.
First of all, the cities and regions are lacking any type of authority. In XI we had President in Bastok, the Royal family in Sandy, and the mages in Windy.
In XIV we had Empress of Uldah in one cs and some general but seeing them is so rare. In XI we had soldiers stationed, you could go visit the palace with soldiers and generals in there. Besieged featured TOAU defenders/generals.
I seemed like cities we're always aware of some type of danger and there was a structure in place in case.
In XIV we have primals and we are facing a garlean invasion which apparently everyone knows about and it seems like nothing is happening.
I would like to see Hall of Flames (and other company headquarters) become a part of the cities that's not in a separate room but rather out in the open. Would be great if units were gathering, generals walking around, etc, etc.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Khal_Drogo

Gotta love the references to XI in this OP. Kudos for pointing out what so many other fail to realize (or just refuse to acknowledge). To all those that raged at the OP, I will give you this small concession:

XI was really AWFUL in ************SOME************ aspects, but PLEASE give credit where credit is due.

Most people coming from XI are looking/hoping to play XIV for the long haul. I would guess that the reason people hate(d) XI so much was because they despise intricate, immersive, time-consuming gameplay. But if the plan is to play this game for a little while, and then just "move the hell on" after a year or two, then please, by all means, just leave now. Not trying to be rude, but putting this game on "easy mode," sharing exp on classes and jobs, so you don't have to choose (specific roles, or versatility) is about the worst conceivable way to implement the job system.

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Agreed, Alot of aspects i ignored because it wasn't very popular. Im not asking the Dev's to put everything from XI into XIV. But the the things that added to overall gameplay and has longevity im asking them to consider. Thing that succeeded renovate, change, alter, implement it and see how it fairs.

As humans we are scared of change, and naturally opt to things we have been familiarized with. Im taking advantage of that as asking for SOME of the successful parts. FFXIV can still maintain its orginality.

BCNM- people did these for years... 30 cap events proved useful with gear
KSNM - Years.

ENM - wasnt very popular left that out off the top of my head

peak:
noun
1.the pointed top of a mountain or ridge.
2.a mountain with a pointed summit.
3.the pointed top of anything.
4.the highest or most important point or level: the peak of her political career.
5.the maximum point, degree, or volume of anything: Oil prices reached their peak last year.

peek:
verb (used without object)
1.to look or glance quickly or furtively, especially through a small opening or from a concealed location; peep; peer.
noun
2.a quick or furtive look or glance; peep.

I never played ff xi but I heard it has feature level sync, can someone explain it to me? I hope there are options for player to replay lower level content but keeping with the challenge. So the older player can help newer player without bypassing the challenge on that content.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Phobos

peak:
noun
1.the pointed top of a mountain or ridge.
2.a mountain with a pointed summit.
3.the pointed top of anything.
4.the highest or most important point or level: the peak of her political career.
5.the maximum point, degree, or volume of anything: Oil prices reached their peak last year.

peek:
verb (used without object)
1.to look or glance quickly or furtively, especially through a small opening or from a concealed location; peep; peer.
noun
2.a quick or furtive look or glance; peep.

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Number 4 - 4.the highest or most important point or level: the peak of her political career.

1. Let's take a Peak at FFXI/ Those most important point's in FFXI: The peak of FFXI as an MMO


You lose.

Anyway, I appreciate all the suggestions and whatnot... I hope the Dev's Take a look at this and if not well.. i can only do what anyone else does... voice my opinion... If anyone else has suggesstions. Post it here and i will Edit/Keep updated

About the Future of Faction Leves
I think that's another part of the game that has lots of potential yet unexplored.
When Tanaka added the few high level leves (Buffalo, Wolves, etc) I thought it was nice. Provided us with few interesting fights and a reward for dreadful leve grinding.
I thought it was a nice start and that we will see expansion of this system.
Lets face it, leves are still boring so atleast dangle a carrot in front of our face with a promise of a cool fight after we complete number of them. I have 1000 points in each Faction and do not even bother currently using them because I've done the other ones and the rewards are outdated or waste of time.
In XI we had BCNM 20, 30, 40, 50, 75, etc, etc. Why not make BCNM type of fights that will be accessed through Faction Leves. It would elevate their value beyond that of grinding exp and occasional 10k gil.
While Company Leves deal with the empire and related content, Faction Leves can deal with super strong beast like monsters and relate to the past of Eorzea.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TheBlazed

Number 4 - 4.the highest or most important point or level: the peak of her political career.

1. Let's take a Peak at FFXI/ Those most important point's in FFXI: The peak of FFXI as an MMO


You lose.

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I'm sorry, you're wrong. What is stated in your OP is "Let's take a peak at FFXI". You mean to use the second definition. You do not mean to take a mountain at FFXI. You mean to take a look at it.

The context of the word suggests it is meant to mean: "Let's take a look at FFXI", yet with your current spelling you actually end up saying "Let's take a highest point at FFXI" or "Let's take a most important point at FFXI"

"Let's take a peek at FFXI" - Could have read, "Let's take a peek of FFXI at its peak", and that would have been worked as you suggested (Let's take a look at the most important points of FFXI, or something to that effect).

Hate to be a "grammar nazi" but seriously, this is like second grade english. Homonyms dude... freaking homonyms. This is just so glaring to me because your OP is well enough put together with headings and proper grammatical structure for the most part, but one of your headings is hilariously incorrect.

EDIT: If for some reason you still don't beleive me, or can't understand why your spelling is, in fact, incorrect - just take a look at google.

https://www.google.com/search?q=take...ient=firefox-a

A simple search of the term "take a peak" results in google suggesting you actually meant "take a peek" - seeing as the possible uses of the former are perhaps one-in-a-million (if you're writing a novel about stealing a mountain, for example).

EDIT 2: On topic. Imho there are far too many references to using concepts from FFXI. While I did enjoy many of the end-game events offered there, I had my fill of many of them, and was not fond of the others for the most part. While I agree FFXIV can "learn" from FFXI by using basic instance/end-game event mechanics and concepts, I don't want to see this simply turn into an FFXI close in the way that say, SWTOR is a WoW clone.

That being said, I'll comment specifically on some of the more popular aspects of end-game FFXI.

Dynamis (and limbus/salvage being a close second/third) was my favorite type of endgame in FFXI. I beleive the sort-of randomness of gear drops at decent rates, which did not require killing NM's to get was an excellent way of doing things. The time limit and frequency of entry limit were both great ways of moderating the event so that players could not get pressured by LS leaders to farm for their relic weapons every day. This also made relics more of a long term goal (as was the case with mythics). While a good deal of the gear was lackluster, the mechanics behind dynamis offer an engaging, difficult endgame event that players will never feel as though they have to do constantly to see results. I believe some of the dynamis concepts shine through a little bit in the current instanced raids (there's a sort of way of doing things for each one you need to learn, the fights can be approachable by anyone, etc). I would definitely like to see something like dynamis in FFXIV, as I feel it was one of the more unique FFXI concepts. When you remove time limits and entry delays/limits on a system where there is meant to be a long term goal, you end up with Abyssea, which simply ended up with everyone spamming for empyrean weapons constantly and getting what should have been a long term goal in a matter of days/weeks.

I did enjoy the concept of HNM's in FFXI, and enjoyed them at the 75 cap, but I rather prefer how the higher level NM's have been executed here, and there really isn't much reason to use infrequency of a spawn to limit player progression. I think the current system of a somewhat infrequent spawn with this faster-paced game works well. I personally never like the change of HNM's in FFXI to a pop system, and think FFXI used far too many pop nm's as the simple mindless response to complaints of the "difficulty" of high level endgame being about claiming a mob rather than player skill. I feel as though in FFXIV, the response was to simply have the NM respawn at a far more reasonable rate, and with less "lottery" spawns.

Things like sea, sky and znm's as you mention were great and all, but those are simply pop NM farming zones, with a hierarchy. I do enjoy this method of pop NM's, and feel as though it was a relatively successful mechanic in FFXI, so wouldn't mind to see something like it implemented. I do not, however, think there should be an equivalent farming zeni for hours on end, or farming diorite for hours on end simply to be able to pop one or two NM's. The other end of the spectrum, however, should not be used either. This is evidenced by abyssea, where it is quite easy to get an NM to spawn, and the result of end-game content here is simply "farming" NM's for empyrean gear/weapons.

/rantoff (apologies if none of what I just said makes any sense, it's well past stupid o'clock here)

TLDR; While I agree some FFXI concepts should be used (such as dynamis), any carryover between the two games should be minimal, and more in the foundation of the event rather than a carbon copy of how it worked (if FFXIV dynamis involved statues and knowing correct pulls, it would be quite lame.) The concept of the event's could be carried over from FFXI, but the event itself must retain a feeling of individuality and uniqueness.

I think part of the Dynamis appeal was the atmosphere it had. We spent quite a bit of time leveling our first jobs when we began to play XI and we were used to running around the cities a lot. It was neat how you when you went into Dynamis the places you knew so well and regarded as safe turned dark and dangerous.

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Originally Posted by TheBlazed

General

First off i take my hat off to the entire development team of 1.21 working around the clock to turn this game around. 1.21 Was a great addition and am very excited about a raise in level cap to start experiencing these jobs.

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Lets stop here. This post was a disgrace to XIV. We don't need more XI in XIV. There is enough already. Your antequated nostaliga with XI needs to stop: now. With that being said.

FINAL FANTASY XIV CANNOT AND SHOULD NOT HAVE A LEVEL INCREASE EVEN AFTER 2.0

Phew. With that said I feel like I can move on to addressing this post.

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While i was dissapointed with not having to level jobs it actually made more sense to because when level caps get increased that will satisfy my urge. I enjoy they were not implemented "Key and Chest" style like FFXI.

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Seriously, you want more grind in XIV? There is enough. The problem is not enough CONTENT to make the grind feel less like a sledgehammer to your face and more like something you actually enjoy.

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I personally Played FFXI for 8 year's because its the best game ive played since FF7.

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You clearly haven't played many recent games then.

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- Multiple Angles of progression
-Introduction of Alliance and compatible raids (Confirmed for 2.0)

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Acceptable suggestions.

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- Raise in level cap to 60 (Confirmed for 2.0?)

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You're insane. Raising the level cap is a terrible thing to do. The game is just becoming "acceptable" and here you go wanting to raise the level cap. What would this achieve? More mindless grinding for you and your antequated XI masochists to go off in the night? Pointless. Increasing the level cap would be the antithesis of 2.0 in general. There isn't enough content as it is to fill 1-50, if even 1-30. We don't need another 10 arduous, tedious, and leve-filled grind sessions just so XI purists can go about their merry way. Furthermore, don't go spewing it is confirmed (even with a question mark). The only passing Yoshi has given to the topic is that they had no plans to increase the level cap up to 1.21. That doesn't mean in 1.22 or even 2.0 the level cap will (or should) increase. In fact, I recommend it doesn't increase until an expansion pack nearly a year after 2.0.

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- Implementation of advanced jobs (confirmed for 2.0?)

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No idea what you consider "advanced jobs" unless this is referring to something like having unlocked and achieved a certain level with WHM + BLM = SMN. I do recall the dev team discussing this but it certainly wasn't confirmed. Cite sources please. It is a good suggestion and can probably add a lot of variety to the game.

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- Public content anyone can join.
- Immersion (A war is coming up, why don't we see increased military activity. (guards walking places, Defense Mechanism being installed by npc's)

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Acceptable suggestions.

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I believe we need many "NEW" things to do... don't get me wrong FFXIV now has many things to do for the new gamer who may have started a few months ago but i am basing my suggestion for your customer base who have been with you since the start "action cost anyone?" This is in no way shape or form angled towards in a sense "Casual or hardcore" but simply those who progress at a normal rate. What's a normal rate well that's subjective and varies.

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2.0 is not for the community currently playing. It is for those who left, became enraged over the state of the game, and quite frankly voted with their pocketbooks. If you want some things to do, pace yourself and leave some classes open. Furthermore, if you're so into grinding, we're getting more classes and jobs before or right at 2.0. You'll have things to do.

Also, have you read the PDFs and collective interviews? There will be plenty of new things to do.

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- Hyper Notorious Monsters (Allaince required)
- Fafnir & Nighogg (Already being talked about in Dragoon quest line)
- Behemoth & King Behemoth
- Hydra
- Kirin (Needs to make an epic return with great look/animation improvements and new abilities)

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Acceptable.

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These to name a few, one of the most complained about problem in XI was the pop time and camping and i have a simple solution to this:
- Every 6 hours with a 1 hour window of opportunity
- Drop rate is 5-6 pieces with individual percentage according to usefulness/rarity
- 2 drops should be guaranteed (1-6 roll dice instead of percentage)
- Other drops have between 15-20% chance
- Implemented HNM slayer counter: Kill X HNM times choice of drop from NPC
ex, Fafnir slayed 50 times choice of drop (perhaps make some RA/EX to entice killing after all gear is obtained from particular mob)
- Low percent drops could have 75-125 kill counter (unrealistic but realistic method of obtaining for those who claim to go 0/XXX without drop)

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Another disillusioned and antequated form of XI creeping into XIV. No, no, no, again: no.

Furthermore, what is this garbage about usefulness/rarity. Each drop should have an equal chance of dropping. Tis only fair to each individual who needs. Thats like saying because I enjoy a lesser played class, my class "item" will drop 30% less frequently than another higher played class. Garbage. Did you even think this post through?

Ultimately the rest of your post just validates the previous statements. It is nothing but a manifesto of why "XIV NEEDS MORE FFXI." Clearly it doesn't. What very little XI did right, XIV has already addressed in many ways. Sadly, most of XI was a disaster that many people overlooked simply because it was in itself, an MMO that existed in an older gaming era.

Please. Stop white knighting XI.

HNM Exclusive (Rage after 75 minutes)
- This is to add a versatile play of style to HNM.
Random chance of 3 move-sets
1. one that require kiting (Hard-hitting beast but has ranged that isn't as hard-hitting)
- requires attention 100% of fight
- abilities like "Must keep moving to avoid certain abilities and certain abilities where back must be turned, or no moving required.
2. one that one shot's if kited (Straight tanked with some abilities that require exact position.
3. one one that requires moving a lot (Ifrit nailed this)
Ifrit would be a perfect example of an HNM if he were not instanced.
- Mixture of kiting and tank phases.

These are designed to not be easy, Well-coordinated alliances, Vent, Teamspeak, whatever. Difficulty is easier with repetition and learning as with all NM.

- This weakens camping as those who want to claim as soon as pop... if you your setup is wrong you could wipe.




-Dynamis
This fits into the world of FFXIV original image and would work well here.

-Nyzule Isle (Named differently TBA
- BSNM TBA
- KSNM TBA
- Sky (Named differently) TBA
- Sea (Named differently) TBA
- ZNM (Rage after 75 minutes)
- Alternative Method to HNM with different drops weaker than HNM counterparts.
- Require's Quest completion
- Uses 40 for Regular (Fafnir) (from 0 leve's 5 days to replenish)
- Uses 56 for King (Nighogg) (From 0 leve's 12 days to replinish)
- 3 ??? (different zones) spots known for their respective style of fighting (Practice for Main HNM) different drops from each to counter guild spamming easier style
- 15 minute ??? repop time.

- Salvage (LM-77 anyone xD) TBA

Player Responses:

Credit to Actionhero for the Below
I’d like to see a change to leves in 2.0... id like to see that leves quests paint a picture with visuals rather than blocks of text. While I love story in the previous FF’s they had a fair combination of reading and action scenes. Also it would be nice to have our adventurers to have some purpose in the world… right now all our characters do is ride along being at the wrong place at the wrong time, not having any sort of impact on the decisions being made around us. Heres how we can do it!

Creating Difficulty and Party Dynamics
In 1.21 SE brought in the concept I was hoping for, where the party is split up into two groups to complete objectives towards a goal (although it’s not perfect it’s a start). In Leves 2.0 I hope that we will need to for example defend the village in 2 or more groups. One group to protect the villagers, the other to take up the front lines and prevent the incoming swam to completely overrun and the third (maybe DOH/DOL) putting out fires or parleying with NPCs (LOL). It would even be nice for disciples of hand and land to help out by putting out fires and reinforcing gates ect…. There should be mini bosses that look different (i.e. different skins, size difference) and should be more challenging than regular enemies by having increased health, and increased damage/defense.

Creating immersion and urgency
In the current leves we get a block of text that no one really reads for a back story that is completely useless for mindlessly killing mobs. In leves 2.0 hopefully when we start a leve (again using the same example with the village) you have to kill a few mobs that pop on us and then talk to a leader of some sort and they say in a short amount of text what to do. This paints a picture with visuals and allows players to feel like they have a purpose while getting right into the action.
I understand that with the current setup we aren’t allowed to see 20+ (?) characters at once which is limiting but in 2.0, but hopefully there are NPC characters that fight with us allowing us to earn bigger rewards for keeping them alive.
Preserving the idea of leves
While these changes seem like it would be changing leves into large scale battles we don’t want to change the entire concept. by keeping them short and sweet we allow hardcore and casual players to do something while waiting for large scale raids and PVP..

Credited to Cichy

Immersion at this point it's one of the biggest problems I have with the game. The world seems disjointed and non responsive.
First of all, the cities and regions are lacking any type of authority. In XI we had President in Bastok, the Royal family in Sandy, and the mages in Windy.
In XIV we had Empress of Uldah in one cs and some general but seeing them is so rare. In XI we had soldiers stationed, you could go visit the palace with soldiers and generals in there. Besieged featured TOAU defenders/generals.
I seemed like cities we're always aware of some type of danger and there was a structure in place in case.
In XIV we have primals and we are facing a garlean invasion which apparently everyone knows about and it seems like nothing is happening.
I would like to see Hall of Flames (and other company headquarters) become a part of the cities that's not in a separate room but rather out in the open. Would be great if units were gathering, generals walking around, etc, etc.

About the Future of Faction Leves
I think that's another part of the game that has lots of potential yet unexplored.
When Tanaka added the few high level leves (Buffalo, Wolves, etc) I thought it was nice. Provided us with few interesting fights and a reward for dreadful leve grinding.
I thought it was a nice start and that we will see expansion of this system.
Lets face it, leves are still boring so atleast dangle a carrot in front of our face with a promise of a cool fight after we complete number of them. I have 1000 points in each Faction and do not even bother currently using them because I've done the other ones and the rewards are outdated or waste of time.
In XI we had BCNM 20, 30, 40, 50, 75, etc, etc. Why not make BCNM type of fights that will be accessed through Faction Leves. It would elevate their value beyond that of grinding exp and occasional 10k gil.
While Company Leves deal with the empire and related content, Faction Leves can deal with super strong beast like monsters and relate to the past of Eorzea.

Some ideas for 2.0 leves
You are placed near a Garlean camp and your mission is to capture a captain who is planning on invading a hamlet. (Leve will end if captain leaves by 15 minute time limit, bonus rewards if Garlean supplies are seized.)

You are placed in a small village that is currently under attack and are required to save as many villagers and houses as possible within a 15 minute time limit. Leve will end if all villages are dead, bonus rewards for houses saved (can only be done by splitting party)

You are placed near a goblin mine and are required to steal/destroy a new goblin bomb prototype. Fighting your way to the end of the zone stealing the bomb would mean you have to fight a goblin head honcho (this will give bonuses) and destroying the bomb would still mean you fight your way out but no boss.
Credit to Actionhero for the Above

Credit to Jinko
I would much prefer them to take something like Ultimate weapons sent by the garlean empire make it massive massive big and spawn in random places around the world, it would require 60-100 people to kill it.

Make it public content so anyone can enter and help.
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Credit to Rydin
Battle regimen needs to come back (More robust and in depth, mind you)
Incapacitation need to matter (I know I say this a lot but I just can't say it enough)
You can even incorporate combos into incaps to allow for special incap objectives on NMs and bosses
More emphasis needs to be placed on damage types (Blunt, slashing, piercing)

Credited to RedAffinity
I'd like to see structured / tiered content. I haven't played too much of other MMO's but in XI there was Sea / Sky / ZNM... i don't want a copy of those events in XIV, but things like THAT. You're rewarded with really great armor, and great challenges, and it takes a long time to obtain. I feel like that kind of endgame is missing in XIV right now.

Credited to Elreed
I would like to see content that is not repetitive, like moogle fight the moogles spawn randomly and its not like u stand here, we stand there and then everything is killed easily, u need to be running around kiting, evading, etc. More like random objectives, random attack waves, random NM's, etc.

So in a few words content that is not boring after a month...

The ones in bold fon't i believe could hold the player base and bring a substantial amount of players back.

These are just suggestions and i'd like to hear some imput of the community... I will edit and add later stuff and additions but this is what i have for now.

Let me know your thoughts on everything, Balance, questions, idea's for other catergories.

Thanks guys for the read!
Blazed~[/QUOTE]

If you'd like to suggest something from XI into XIV. Make it Tetra Master -- only supported 100% in game and completely FREE.

^ yes obviously my immersion post was invalid. You know what dude they should just post lore on Lodestone than we can immerse while reading it on the iPad while on the toilet. Do not add NPCs into the game, dont change areas to reflect the lore, leave it as the great phantom is running entire Eorzea. He does everything while doing nothing. Are you mental?
There was plenty of good ideas that XI had that can be implemented in this game. If you read closely players are asking to improve on those mechanics rather than copy them. I dont think anyone is stupid enough to think they should copy/paste.
It's funny how you find HNM system acceptable which was the most hated thing about XI.
For once we had a decent thread going on this god forsaken forum and you come in and huff and puff.
Oh and yeah level increase is coming and it's a great idea. For those of us who have so many jobs at 50 already exping will give us a chance to enjoy the jobs even more.

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Originally Posted by Phobos

I'm sorry, you're wrong. What is stated in your OP is "Let's take a peak at FFXI". You mean to use the second definition. You do not mean to take a mountain at FFXI. You mean to take a look at it.

The context of the word suggests it is meant to mean: "Let's take a look at FFXI", yet with your current spelling you actually end up saying "Let's take a highest point at FFXI" or "Let's take a most important point at FFXI"

"Let's take a peek at FFXI" - Could have read, "Let's take a peek of FFXI at its peak", and that would have been worked as you suggested (Let's take a look at the most important points of FFXI, or something to that effect).

Hate to be a "grammar nazi" but seriously, this is like second grade english. Homonyms dude... freaking homonyms. This is just so glaring to me because your OP is well enough put together with headings and proper grammatical structure for the most part, but one of your headings is hilariously incorrect.

EDIT: If for some reason you still don't beleive me, or can't understand why your spelling is, in fact, incorrect - just take a look at google.

https://www.google.com/search?q=take...ient=firefox-a

A simple search of the term "take a peak" results in google suggesting you actually meant "take a peek" - seeing as the possible uses of the former are perhaps one-in-a-million (if you're writing a novel about stealing a mountain, for example).

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Did you seriously just take almost a half of a paper to point out that i'm wrong about something obviously i just intentionally flipped because it's not that serious?

lol^ You seriously losing right now

Moving on..

Personally I think 1.21 is a bit of a mess and very disappointing. Great job? More like great f**k up.

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Originally Posted by Victor

Sounds to me like you should be playing FFXI instead!

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Sounds like hes just putting out suggestions to me. Hes allowed to talk about what he likes ._.

This is a general dicussion forum.

I Think people forget that sometimes mike.

No.. Nooo. NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! No more camping/claim war for hours a NM that requires the entire LS to go, and only one person gets drop.

An area like Sky/Sea <yes, please>. Sky and Sea were areas that people looked forward to go in and it was really really really hard to achieve it, but when you finally do it after hours of suffering Proto-Ultima, Mammets, Oryuu, among others, it feels extreamly rewarding! I'm sure that SE have this kind of plans for Version 2.0.

Regarding Allience, I find it not necessary; we already can hit and target mobs claimed by others, making the Large-Scale content available without the need of creating Alliances.