5.0 and MSQ Skip: Free Skip Potion?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by ShanXiv

It's not very hard to understand....
like classic games, pop music, movies & some good stuff in the golden era, they are so good & they don't fade over time.
but classic stuff is very hard to make, it requires time & talented directors & developers.
New players come & try this game, because the hype & the graphics are pretty,
after some time,they found that this game is just so so, then leave, maybe 1/20 of them will stay,
so there's a constant need for new players to fill the gap

---

And the MSQ/Job skip potion can't really solve the problem
It's only going to make things worse.

because players who are willing to pay more time on a game, they hate such short signed stuff

But I do agree that quest quality >> quantity
FFXIV 1.2x quests are far better than 2.0 ,
I felt excited every time I got a new quest in 1.2x
now most quests are just meaningless, a waste of time, just like other contents (duty finder, gear treadmill)in this game

Many things in this game are wrong....
Yoshi-p mentioned their team are lacking MMO design experience, so this is foreseeable

I don't thing newcomers should skip them. Yes, there are a lot of stupid sidequests I hated myself and the transition between "go save the world!" to "go be my private delivery guy!" back to "go save the world again!" is a bit of anticlimatic, but they get you around and show you all the places.

Also, skipping right to the end (or near the end) without learning the game, your class and the system will only get you killed and drag your whole group down in dungeons/raids. We've propably all seen enough "I've just bought a level 60 starter kit and went to certain doom"-guys in the duty finder already.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TwistedTea

Only on the FFXIV forums, have I seen people defending something like the current MSQ which is a mostly solo experience, as being conducive to an MMORPG.

---

At the same time, people rant about blue mage being a solo job.

One can only hope it's not the same people doing both. That would be hypocritical.

i highly doubt they will give away a skip potion, but i do remember talks about the 2.x quest bloat, and it is possible they may change the quest chains for that area come 5.0 to speed it up a little, to the missions that give no major 'plot'

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TwistedTea

So maybe, I've missed it with all the news about 4.5 and 5.0 but has SE addressed what are they going to do about the MSQ regarding skip potions?

Because if new players, have to go through hundreds of quests just to get into 5.0 areas and content, I can foresee a lot of them just quitting way before they even finish ARR. ARR alone has 285 MSQ quests.

Some of these are soul-crushingly tedious and I say this as someone who enjoys the story.

So will SE give out free skip potions or something similar with 5.0 or will it be $kip potion on the Mog Station again?

---

B-b-b-b-b-b-but IT'S A FINAL FANTASY, IT HAS TO HAVE A STORY, IT'S SUPER DUPER MEGA IMPORTANT OR ELSE IT'S NOT A FINAL FANTASY - ah you get the gist of it.

In all honesty, I totally agree with you: my sister was one of those who quit the game knowing the amounts of quests she had to do and has never touched the game ever since. We are both huge lovers of stories in jrpgs but the filler was so much she just couldn't handle it - while I managed because I was way ahead of her.

This is basically HW all over again because of that issue and I remember many people I knew were bashed because of their "absurd" idea of skipping the main story and reach the expansion right away, so if anything be sure that nothing will change because...well final fantasy fans are that fixated over defending flaws.

On the other hand, I was having the same idea: give new players a free skip potion to reach 5.0 right away and then let them enjoy the past as they wish - or don't and save it for later. I think it would be a great idea and would definitely pump some fresh numbers into the game.

I mean the worst MMORPG of all time World of Warcraft does give a free boost if you preorder and it's not like you NEED it but hey, that game is the worst MMORPG of all time so if the worst MMORPG of all time can do it, why not the best MMORPG of all time can?

PS: yes that sentence is purposely over the top, I forgot that on the internet I have to explain every lame joke I make.

With the New Game+ option, story skips might actually be more viable. As you say, skip ahead then enjoy the past as you wish, something you couldn't do with a story skip before, if you skipped it, it was gone for good, you just lost 90% of the game you paid for.

Skipping straight to 5.0? No, that would be pointless.
At release, there won't be all that much to 5.0, you'd be left with about a months worth of content before you'd finished everything. Sounds like a rip off to me. Not to mention you'd miss out on HW, some of the best story content in the game, or any Final Fantasy in the past 10 years for that matter!

There should be a free 2.0 skip for all future copies though, given that we can now go back and replay it whenever we want.

If they were going to implement any sort of "free skip" in contrast to the paid skips available so far, I would expect that it would be the ARR skip that becomes free, while Heavensward and a newly-introduced Stormblood skip still need to be bought. But I'd be pleasantly surprised if they even did that much.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kurando

I don't think SE would ever give MSQ skip potions for free, they want you to go through and enjoy the story, but no doubt they will advertise them for purchase on the MogStation should players choose to go down that route.

---

New players can always skip on one character and go back on another or with New Game +. At some point it's going to be imperative that a skip potion comes with the complete package because there's just too much back log content for the default expectation to be that new players are going to start from the beginning and have to catch up with friends from there. At some point (some people will argue we're already there,) it's going to happen.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Voltyblast

B-b-b-b-b-b-but IT'S A FINAL FANTASY, IT HAS TO HAVE A STORY, IT'S SUPER DUPER MEGA IMPORTANT OR ELSE IT'S NOT A FINAL FANTASY - ah you get the gist of it.

In all honesty, I totally agree with you: my sister was one of those who quit the game knowing the amounts of quests she had to do and has never touched the game ever since. We are both huge lovers of stories in jrpgs but the filler was so much she just couldn't handle it - while I managed because I was way ahead of her.

This is basically HW all over again because of that issue and I remember many people I knew were bashed because of their "absurd" idea of skipping the main story and reach the expansion right away, so if anything be sure that nothing will change because...well final fantasy fans are that fixated over defending flaws.

On the other hand, I was having the same idea: give new players a free skip potion to reach 5.0 right away and then let them enjoy the past as they wish - or don't and save it for later. I think it would be a great idea and would definitely pump some fresh numbers into the game.

I mean the worst MMORPG of all time World of Warcraft does give a free boost if you preorder and it's not like you NEED it but hey, that game is the worst MMORPG of all time so if the worst MMORPG of all time can do it, why not the best MMORPG of all time can?

PS: yes that sentence is purposely over the top, I forgot that on the internet I have to explain every lame joke I make.

---

I said no free stuff for newbies in 5.0 but i never played a SE game before this one and life and strange... so im not a fan for sure.
calling WoW the worst MMORPG is just dumb, without WoW Most MMORPGS wouldnt exist or the player count would be very low, they also do plenty of stuff better than XIV and the other way around too, So it sounds like you are the fanboy here not us.

If people would get a free skip potion they will just drag other people down like Pepsi said above.
Your argument is pretty weak, saying only fans defend the fact that people should either pay for a boost or just do the quests like some of us had to, i know plenty of people who regreted boosting and quit the game becaus they had no idea what theire doing.
Also why are people who try to get free jump potions for newbies also never people who cleared a Ultimate or atleast Savage fight? you are biased seriously. You only think of benefits for Casual players, but you fail to realize that free boosts will hurt Savage & EX Content because people with 0 experience will join up either Duty finder groups or PF groups and drag us down. im not a elitist but start thinking about the entire community instead of just one part of it.

Dont get me wrong, Give people a ARR skip because the content there is just Boring, HW is great but i wouldnt mind if people get a boost there too, that way people would learn the game to some degree and wont be deadweight, but im against getting more than that.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Seraphor

With the New Game+ option, story skips might actually be more viable. As you say, skip ahead then enjoy the past as you wish, something you couldn't do with a story skip before, if you skipped it, it was gone for good, you just lost 90% of the game you paid for.

Skipping straight to 5.0? No, that would be pointless.
At release, there won't be all that much to 5.0, you'd be left with about a months worth of content before you'd finished everything. Sounds like a rip off to me. Not to mention you'd miss out on HW, some of the best story content in the game, or any Final Fantasy in the past 10 years for that matter!

There should be a free 2.0 skip for all future copies though, given that we can now go back and replay it whenever we want.

---

I think there would be one big flaw, im pretty sure the new game + will be after you finished 5.0? if yes, just imagine you going into 5.0 and you start that new game, suddenly character you never seen before are there, then you know they died in the progress of lore or something else happend to them, you still know the difference between warrior of light & darkness etc, which makes the experience not as good since you technically also know how the story will end because they are chained into eachother, but well i do admit that its a bit too early to judge since we dont know that much about new game + yet or do we? im not sure if they talked more about it at fanfest.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TwistedTea

I fail to see how skip potions are a service. We buy the game, the expansions and pay a subscription.

---

"I bought Witcher III and it's expansions, I should be able to play Blood and Wine with my character decked out already on my first running of the game!"

See the problem there? Expansion is called that because it expands on what is already there. It is not stand-alone content. It is story for when you complete the stories BEFORE it. Most expansions offer something small extra for earlier content, but the bulk of it is ALWAYS after most or all of previous content is finished. That's the whole point.

I agree that there is a whole lot of trash quests in ARR. I know that. I begun playing sometime during Heavensward so I did all those quests in that horrid stretch at the end over two days myself. But however much we want to dismiss it, it is part of the game content. You buy the game with its expansions. Not the expansions. If you want to skip majority of the game, then pay for that service. You should be glad you have that option. Outside of MMO's with item mall such option just doesn't exist because it completely invalidates the entire point of the game existing. In MMO's it's only "valid" because the actual content is what you do with other people.

Current skip potions are a lazy and profitable way for SE who chose to gate nearly all of the content behind the MSQ.

Some people will point out that XIV is an FF game before it's an MMORPG but at some point in order to compete with other MMORPGs for subs, the MSQ is a gate to end-game raiding/crafting/chilling out in new areas etc.[/QUOTE]

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tenryuu-Kai

If people would get a free skip potion they will just drag other people down like Pepsi said above.
Your argument is pretty weak, saying only fans defend the fact that people should either pay for a boost or just do the quests like some of us had to, i know plenty of people who regreted boosting and quit the game becaus they had no idea what theire doing.
Also why are people who try to get free jump potions for newbies also never people who cleared a Ultimate or atleast Savage fight? you are biased seriously. You only think of benefits for Casual players, but you fail to realize that free boosts will hurt Savage & EX Content because people with 0 experience will join up either Duty finder groups or PF groups and drag us down. im not a elitist but start thinking about the entire community instead of just one part of it.

---

Yes because it's not like we already have newbies WHO DO the main quest and still have absolutely no idea how to play their class but hey, if you think this is a good way then by all means keep doing it: I'm sure you won't get tired of playing with the same people for a hundred years in a row who still can't connect a 1-2-3 combo.

In addition to this

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tenryuu-Kai

calling WoW the worst MMORPG is just dumb, without WoW Most MMORPGS wouldnt exist or the player count would be very low, they also do plenty of stuff better than XIV and the other way around too, So it sounds like you are the fanboy here not us.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Voltyblast

PS: yes that sentence is purposely over the top, I forgot that on the internet I have to explain every lame joke I make.

---

I might be a fanboy but you're clearly blind, so I think I'm in a better shape so far.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tenryuu-Kai

If people would get a free skip potion they will just drag other people down like Pepsi said above.

Your argument is pretty weak, saying only fans defend the fact that people should either pay for a boost or just do the quests like some of us had to, i know plenty of people who regreted boosting and quit the game becaus they had no idea what theire doing.

Also why are people who try to get free jump potions for newbies also never people who cleared a Ultimate or atleast Savage fight? you are biased seriously. You only think of benefits for Casual players, but you fail to realize that free boosts will hurt Savage & EX Content because people with 0 experience will join up either Duty finder groups or PF groups and drag us down. im not a elitist but start thinking about the entire community instead of just one part of it.

---

To address a few things, the majority of the player base does not do Ultimates. The number of casual players attempting Savage might be higher but still lesser than the people who do Savage raids.

As for your concern about player skill being dumbed down due to skip potions/jump potions, I addressed this in this thread and others,including raiders in other threads, have brought forth solutions that SE can implement:

1. The MSQ does not really prepare you for harder content. It prepares you for more MSQ.

We get our full kit of abilities at level 70 where we re-learn our rotations.

2. Just like there's a Hall of the Novice, SE could implement the following:

a. Hall of the Expert Roulette
b. Hall of the Extreme Primal
c. Hall of the Savage Raider

and not just as one-off but every time content in these categories is released. These have to be difficult enough and with some of the mechanics that players will encounter when they go on to do the actual hard content.

If a player is unable to clear these Halls solo before attempting the actual content, they are not given permission to enter said content.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Voltyblast

Yes because it's not like we already have newbies WHO DO the main quest and still have absolutely no idea how to play their class but hey, if you think this is a good way then by all means keep doing it: I'm sure you won't get tired of playing with the same people for a hundred years in a row who still can't connect a 1-2-3 combo.

In addition to this





I might be a fanboy but you're clearly blind, so I think I'm in a better shape so far.

---

Dont come at me with that BS.
what did you say? oh right ''PS: yes that sentence is purposely over the top, I forgot that on the internet I have to explain every lame joke I make.''
oh what was your over the top stupid sentence at the start? oh right it was ''B-b-b-b-b-b-but IT'S A FINAL FANTASY, IT HAS TO HAVE A STORY, IT'S SUPER DUPER MEGA IMPORTANT OR ELSE IT'S NOT A FINAL FANTASY - ah you get the gist of it.''
So pretty sure you meant that with the joke, not the WoW part BS because that sounded pretty legit and most likely what a fanboy would say.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TwistedTea

To address a few things, the majority of the player base does not do Ultimates. The number of casual players attempting Savage might be higher but still lesser than the people who do Savage raids.

As for your concern about player skill being dumbed down due to skip potions/jump potions, I addressed this in this thread and others,including raiders in other threads, have brought forth solutions that SE can implement:

1. The MSQ does not really prepare you for harder content. It prepares you for more MSQ.

We get our full kit of abilities at level 70 where we re-learn our rotations.

2. Just like there's a Hall of the Novice, SE could implement the following:

a. Hall of the Expert Roulette
b. Hall of the Extreme Primal
c. Hall of the Savage Raider

and not just as one-off but every time content in these categories is released. These have to be difficult enough and with some of the mechanics that players will encounter when they go on to do the actual hard content.

If a player is unable to clear these Halls solo before attempting the actual content, they are not given permission to enter said content.

---

The halls would be a good way to lockout those skipped players and im sure many people would be fine if thats the solution, but you also have to consider that it would need probably more coding than you think, and of course A concept of it. And i know ultimates are very rare upon the player base, but i said everyone who trys to get the free stuff for newbies Doesnt consider us raiders into it, not everyone has a static and is bound to PF due to Work / irl or something like that, your solution would make those peoples life easier and we would have no issues with those free bosted players in that case, so yes you now do consider us and in that way i can Get friendly with the idea, because hell i dont care aslong people dont waste my time in PF, but saying ''Hey my sister quit because she didnt want to Quest a few hours'' doesnt sound like a good argument.

Also MSQ does prepare you for harder content by slowly push up the difficulty from dungeons & Trials, you also learn most of the mechanics and can figure out part time of your rotations, because ofc they will change with time but the basics are the same which you do learn while doing MSQ (which includes all the dungeons and trials you have to do to complete MSQ) Hell if i skipped through 70% of the content in FF XIV i would probably still bashing my head Against the wall with most of my class rotations, because i once bought a level 60 boost for my alt for a class i never ever played before and i was overwhelmed by the amount of skills which got thrown at me.

I Doubt any of those Halls will ever get released, but atleast you try to provide a solution to the problem.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by kikix12

"I bought Witcher III and it's expansions, I should be able to play Blood and Wine with my character decked out already on my first running of the game!"

---

The Witcher 3 is a single-player game. FFXIV is an MMORPG with lots of content outside of the story/MSQ. However due to design choices, even many of the usual MMO elements are locked behind MSQ.

Also strawman, not talking about having a character fully decked out. But an option to skip the story to the start of 5.0.

Quote:

---

If you want to skip majority of the game, then pay for that service. You should be glad you have that option...

---

Nope, that's just players defending SE double dipping, when they could provide the skip option for free.

Is the MSQ really the "majority of the game" though in an MMORPG?

Quote:

---

In MMO's it's only "valid" because the actual content is what you do with other people.

---

The MSQ as it is currently, is mostly a solo experience.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Tenryuu-Kai

Dont come at me with that BS.
what did you say? oh right ''PS: yes that sentence is purposely over the top, I forgot that on the internet I have to explain every lame joke I make.''
oh what was your over the top stupid sentence at the start? oh right it was ''B-b-b-b-b-b-but IT'S A FINAL FANTASY, IT HAS TO HAVE A STORY, IT'S SUPER DUPER MEGA IMPORTANT OR ELSE IT'S NOT A FINAL FANTASY - ah you get the gist of it.''
So pretty sure you meant that with the joke, not the WoW part BS because that sounded pretty legit and most likely what a fanboy would say.

---

Welcome to the internet where nobody can understand your jokes unless you tell them, and everyone is a bunch of fragile snowflakes I guess.

First of all, the last and top lines are obviously jokes...but if you were smart you'd know that by now because of the end line "ah you get the gist of it". That's a reference to people who try to give the idea of skipping msq but the usual response is "but it's a final fantasy game, it has to have a story". I don't personally care because I can skip it but you apparently took it so at heart that you had to say it here.

Secondly, I'm a fanboy of what? I play both games, I like both games, both games do good and bad things: I like wow's simplicity and more varied stats and classes while I like the fact I can use all classes in one here, so fanboy of WHAT?! If anything I seem pretty unbiased because if I was a fanboy, I'd defend one game blindly. I also like the story in wow, i don't like it here, but I don't tell everyone to skip it: I only want more people in the game and suggested an OPTION to skip it.

And for last, my line remains there, if I don't explain every single damn joke people get all upseat, and you obviously fell for it because my middle post is all about good intentions, how it could improve and how I just wish the game was more flexible when it come to the story, because not everyone enjoys the story of this game. I like stories in game, my favorite genre (if you believe it or not, I don't care) is jrpg, I have plenty of jrpgs in my shelf but oh darn, I don't like this game's story and so many others: why not let them enjoy the story at their own pace? Is that such an absurd idea?

So I suggest to keep on the topic instead of nitpicking 2 lines that I obviously made to be over the top and "whiny" because of actual people in the past (about before HW hit) who legitimately said that this game HAS to have a story.

So this conversation is over: if you're so desperate to try pick a fight with joke lines I suggest to go elsewhere, like a cabaret or something.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Voltyblast

Welcome to the internet where nobody can understand your jokes unless you tell them, and everyone is a bunch of fragile snowflakes I guess.

First of all, the last and top lines are obviously jokes...but if you were smart you'd know that by now because of the end line "ah you get the gist of it". That's a reference to people who try to give the idea of skipping msq but the usual response is "but it's a final fantasy game, it has to have a story". I don't personally care because I can skip it but you apparently took it so at heart that you had to say it here.

Secondly, I'm a fanboy of what? I play both games, I like both games, both games do good and bad things: I like wow's simplicity and more varied stats and classes while I like the fact I can use all classes in one here, so fanboy of WHAT?! If anything I seem pretty unbiased because if I was a fanboy, I'd defend one game blindly. I also like the story in wow, i don't like it here, but I don't tell everyone to skip it: I only want more people in the game and suggested an option to skip it.

And for last, my line remains there, if I don't explain every single damn joke people get all upseat, and you obviously fell for it because my middle post is all about good intentions, how it could improve and how I just wish the game was more flexible when it come to the story, because not everyone enjoys the story of this game. I like stories in game, my favorite genre (if you believe it or not, I don't care) is jrpg, I have plenty of jrpgs in my shelf but oh darn, I don't like this game's story and so many others: why not let them enjoy the story at their own pace? Is that such an absurd idea?

So I suggest to keep on the topic instead of nitpicking 2 lines that I obviously made to be over the top and "whiny" because of actual people in the past (about before HW hit) who legitimately said that this game HAS to have a story.

So this conversation is over: if you're so desperate to try pick a fight with joke lines I suggest to go elsewhere.

---

Noone gets upset here, i just argumented with you nothing else,never tried to pick a fight.
So youre acting like a snowflake right now because you interpretend that i tried to start a fight, but i just answered to your Post on this thread, you dont even have a good argument of why people should get a free boost or what SE could do for the other part of the community which is not fine with people slowing them down, TwistedTea does this very well and i like her / his posts because they are not empty worded like yours, but yeah the conversation is over little snowflake.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TwistedTea

The Witcher 3 is a single-player game. FFXIV is an MMORPG with lots of content outside of the story/MSQ. However due to design choices, even many of the usual MMO elements are locked behind MSQ.

Also strawman, not talking about having a character fully decked out. But an option to skip the story to the start of 5.0.



Nope, that's just players defending SE double dipping, when they could provide the skip option for free.

Is the MSQ really the "majority of the game" though in an MMORPG?



The MSQ as it is currently, is mostly a solo experience.

---

I do agree on that point too, a singleplayer & multiplayer games are different things.
But most of the online MMORPGs are a solo experience atleast in MSQ, its just that final fantasy locks far more behind those quests than other games in this genre, Even im bothered by the fact that some new dungeons / Trials get locked behind a annoying side-quest chain, i remember that i didnt do Hells lid for weeks because of that, so i atleast hope they stop locking those things behind a sidequest chain because thats also tiresome, i even had to use google many times to find unlocks for older content because the game is filled with side quests at this point.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TwistedTea

The Witcher 3 is a single-player game.

---

Technicalities don't change from single player to multiplayer, or even from games to other stuff. An expansion is an expansion no matter what it applies to. An expansion to game or an expansion to your PC have the same effect. It is adding something on top of what you already have, not a replacement of it.

If we'd go your way, every expansion should have been a stand-alone game. WHY build upon an existing game if all you want is that expansion? Why not make that expansion a standalone game then? You should make a thread about FFXIV being abandoned and having Shadowbringers and future expansions be stand-alone games then. No need for skip potions.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TwistedTea

FFXIV is an MMORPG with lots of content outside of the story/MSQ. However due to design choices, even many of the usual MMO elements are locked behind MSQ.

---

Yes, I agree that the amount of content locked behind main story is a bit too much, but then again, a lot of it is locked reasonably due to how it ties into the story. It is a "necessary evil" for an artistic vision given. Cuss at it as much as you want, stomp as you want. This game belongs to Square Enix, not players. As the creators they decided for it to be a story-driven MMO so stuff being tied to main story is only reasonable.

This is something you have no right to complain about, plain and simple. Variety is necessary. There are plenty games for you if all you're interested in is whacking a random mob for no reason but to whack it. Go to one of them. Don't try to turn a game that chose a different path into one of those whack-a-mole games just cause you prefer em.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TwistedTea

Nope, that's just players defending SE double dipping, when they could provide the skip option for free.

---

It's not double dipping if you don't pay for anything twice. When you buy expansion you buy the ability to utilize what is in that expansion when you reach it. NOT instant access to that expansion. Thinking otherwise is ridiculous.

Also, they can provide the game for free too. They can provide the server code for people to make private servers. They can provide instant savage gear to everyone. That is a completely nonsensical argument. They made a product. You either like the product and use it or not like it and not use it, looking for something that you would. Simple as that.

You are entitled to your opinion and you're free to give suggestions. However you are accusing Square Enix for something that is, fundamentally, nothing to be accuse-worthy. It is neither a crime nor even shady. It's not gray area and it's not even unusual. It is simply not trying to break the mold, that's all.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TwistedTea

Is the MSQ really the "majority of the game" though in an MMORPG?

---

MMORPG stands for "Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game". It is not "Massive Multiplayer Only Role Playing Game". The difference between "online" and "only" is a huge one, because the first one means that many players are logged on at the same time whether or not they interact with each other, while the latter means that many multiplayer are online at the same time INTERACTING with each other. Some of the Battle Royale games nowadays are multiplayer-only. Solo content in MMO games is nothing weird. Lack of multiplayer content would be weird, but it's here and doing well. This game absolutely does meet the needs of being an MMO game.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TwistedTea

The MSQ as it is currently, is mostly a solo experience.

---

The story is a solo experience. Yes, it is a pain that it's impossible for most story content to be done with another player. It irked me from the beginning. Then again, that's because the quests are not about "kill a 100 mobs and hope that it will be enough to get 10 copies of a rare drop". The drops are virtually always guaranteed here and the amount of mobs that need to be killed is usually 1-3.

That being said, most of the content is multiplayer experience, with or without solo options. You cannot solo dungeon (only unsynced when you overlevel it, and then you don't get normal drops). There are MMO's where you can solo EVERYTHING on level because the mobs scale to the number of people or the dungeon have a "solo" and "party" versions. Here you are forced to run it in party (though that WILL change with trust system for Shadowbringers, if that system will be done well). There are dungeons, trials, alliance, raids, ultimates, PvP, hunts, treasure maps, Eureka, Diadem, FATE's, deep dungeons. All of these can (and are suggested to be) played with multiple people. SOME of them can be soloed, but even if possible, it's usually very inefficient or excessively difficult. Or requires you to significantly overlevel the content (even then, some content is not feasibly soloable due to instant-kill mechanics). Even crafting can be done "multiplayer style". Several people can work towards gathering and crafting an item by providing various materials. Or one player can level multiple classes and do it solo.

So yes, multiplayer in this game doesn't suffer. It won't suffer either, no matter how many of these things will become "soloable" with Trust or similar mechanics. Because if someone does not want to do multiplayer, they won't do it or will not readily cooperate, making playing with them a pain. Those that do want to socialize will still do.

I agree that MSQ teaches you more than MSQ by gradualling pushing difficulty to players, and I'm happy to see that Stormblood pushed a bit further with content like Shinryu/Tsukuyomi normal that requested a bit of player involvement.
Although 2.0 has somehow "aged" badly and could do with a lifting for new players (similar to how they removed that awful crystal quest for the Crystal Tower unlock), they could streamline some fetch quests and simply buff the amount of XP you get from the MSQ up until 50. That does not solve everything, but it would make it a bit more appealing for newcomers, or enjoyable for alt characters (or that New Game + mode they announced)

As stated, the Devs would love to go and fix the MSQ but that essentially requires them to rewrite an entire expansion worth of quests. They simply don't have the resources to undertake such an endeavor. We would have to give up something major like 24-player raids or delay an expansion for a year in order for them to get things worked out. I'm not a fan of either option, so at this point, the new players will need to grind through the quests like we did or pop a potion for a few bucks to catch up with everybody else. Their choice, if they really want to play with their friends, they will need to put in either the time or the money.

Best thing the devs can do is have a sale on the jump potions during their free play campaigns.

Just gonna argue here specifically on the "free" part.


Why does it need to be free? I don't see a low pop game to warrant it in an attempt to be used as a promo to get more people in. The game's not aged enough either to say the old player pop is getting stale so it needs fresh blood and a free skip pop is once again used as an incentive.

So really, I'd like to know why it needs to be free?

Who plays a final fantasy game just to skip the story?

So reading the title you're only asking for a free MSQ skip? What a terrible idea. The MSQ is a huge pile of experience for a new players first job and without it you're only lengthening the time they're going to spend grinding with the admittedly terrible pre-50 job/class kits. If you're asking for a free MSQ + Job skip then I also think that's a poor idea without somehow putting in place some catch up mechanics that they'd be funneled through first to give them more than the flat basics hall of the novice does. But I believe that WoW tried something like that years ago and found it actually didn't help, it didn't replace the experience of having leveled to that point yourself.

I'd rather that they do something about streamlining the old MSQ (maybe leave the longer version for New Game+ when people go back to look it over?) so that it's not quite so boring in spots. If it's time you're worried about then perhaps a permanent 'Road to X' buff could come into play. Doesn't have to be identical to the Road to 60 we have now but something to help people move along at a good clip and remove those few grindy gaps that currently exist in the MSQ might do the job without having people just wholesale skip.

I started with ARR and I absolutely hated the story there (especially the titan part) along with all the filler quest (again my personal opinion) . I loved heavensward and stormblood so far is good too. I honestly don't see how people skipping is going to make them a bad players, since we are encouraged to use guides before entering a dungeon for the first time or guides for rotations.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ranetsu-Akagane

I started with ARR and I absolutely hated the story there (especially the titan part) along with all the filler quest (again my personal opinion) . I loved heavensward and stormblood so far is good too. I honestly don't see how people skipping is going to make them a bad players, since we are encouraged to use guides before entering a dungeon for the first time or guides for rotations.

---

Its really not that logic is kinda flawed tbh. Its more about why should this type of item be free? If someone wants to purposely skip content then they should have a fee tacked on. We can see from 4.0 launch though that nothing really changed with having them on the mog station and people still opted to not use them. A new player already gets a bunch of little goodies to play the game and sometimes even more. Thought should go to the actual members who play and sub regularly.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by bass9020

Its really not that logic is kinda flawed tbh. Its more about why should this type of item be free? If someone wants to purposely skip content then they should have a fee tacked on. We can see from 4.0 launch though that nothing really changed with having them on the mog station and people still opted to not use them. A new player doesnt need all these little goodies to maybe play a game, thought should go to the actual members who play and sub regularly.

---

I don't agree with the item being free. I don't think it ever will be either, because they want you to try the story,the option to skip should be just that optional. I just don't think that everyone who skips is a bad player.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ranetsu-Akagane

I don't agree with the item being free. I don't think it ever will be either, because they want you to try the story,the option to skip should be just that optional. I just don't think that everyone who skips is a bad player.

---

Yea I agree, I dont like when that is thrown around as a reason. I mean I still dont know how to play half the jobs I just level them because I enjoy the leveling and story for every job.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ranetsu-Akagane

since we are encouraged to use guides before entering a dungeon for the first time or guides for rotations.

---

We are? Honestly, that's not how I would ever play a game. A game is something I want to play myself and something I want to figure out for myself. I don't think you are supposed to use a guide for a problem you haven't even met yet. You're supposed to face a challenge and try to figure it out yourself (with your group). Therefore you even have mentors to help you with that. If everything fails, you can still look up a guide and try again.

Same goes for rotation. Guides help you to get better at what you do, not to teach you exactly what you do. You have 70 levels to learn your job and figure out (most of) your skills for yourself, with enough opportunities to test them in any given situation.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Pepsi_Plunge

We are? Honestly, that's not how I would ever play a game. A game is something I want to play myself and something I want to figure out for myself. I don't think you are supposed to use a guide for a problem you haven't even met yet. You're supposed to face a challenge and try to figure it out yourself (with your group). Therefore you even have mentors to help you with that. If everything fails, you can still look up a guide and try again.

Same goes for rotation. Guides help you to get better at what you do, not to teach you exactly what you do. You have 70 levels to learn your job and figure out (most of) your skills for yourself, with enough opportunities to test them in any given situation.

---

When I first started I remember when someone would wipe in dungeons, they'd be asked if they watched a guide or asked why they didn't watch a guide ,sometimes even yelled at. Maybe that's only in certain dungeons this was in haukke manor (not sure if I spelled that right) sunken temple, aurum vale those are the ones I remember anyway. I remember seeing this a lot when I was new.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by kikix12

Yes, I agree that the amount of content locked behind main story is a bit too much, but then again, a lot of it is locked reasonably due to how it ties into the story. It is a "necessary evil" for an artistic vision given...This game belongs to Square Enix, not players. As the creators they decided for it to be a story-driven MMO so stuff being tied to main story is only reasonable.

---

An MMORPG even "muh story driven MMO" has to compete in the MMORPG market. No one is asking to do away with niche MMORPGs but asking to reduce hindrances to the new player experience is not unreasonable.

Quote:

---

It's not double dipping if you don't pay for anything twice...NOT instant access to that expansion. Thinking otherwise is ridiculous.

---

What kind of instant access are you talking about? Has anyone here supporting an MSQ skip proposed level 70 and fully decked out gear with access to the hardest end-game raids? An MSQ skip doesn't absolve the player from leveling classes,gearing up, learning rotations etc.

Quote:

---

Also, they can provide the game for free too. They can provide the server code for people to make private servers. They can provide instant savage gear to everyone. That is a completely nonsensical argument. They made a product. You either like the product and use it or not like it and not use it, looking for something that you would. Simple as that.

---

Slippery slope argument. As paying customers we can provide feedback.

Quote:

---

MMORPG stands for "Massive Multiplayer Online Role Playing Game". It is not "Massive Multiplayer Only Role Playing Game". The difference between "online" and "only" is a huge one, because the first one means that many players are logged on at the same time whether or not they interact with each other, while the latter means that many multiplayer are online at the same time INTERACTING with each other. Some of the Battle Royale games nowadays are multiplayer-only. Solo content in MMO games is nothing weird. Lack of multiplayer content would be weird, but it's here and doing well. This game absolutely does meet the needs of being an MMO game.

---

So now we are arguing that because it fits the technical definition of an MMORPG, there's nothing wrong with something like the current MSQ, that forms the first impression for a new player of FFXIV as an MMORPG?

Quote:

---

"...So yes, multiplayer in this game doesn't suffer. It won't suffer either, no matter how many of these things will become "soloable" with Trust or similar mechanics. Because if someone does not want to do multiplayer, they won't do it or will not readily cooperate, making playing with them a pain. Those that do want to socialize will still do.

---

So what's the problem then? If the MSQ is mostly a solo experience and skipping it only affects the player involved, why force everyone who might want to play FFXIV for its other MMO elements into doing it?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Keridwyn

So reading the title you're only asking for a free MSQ skip? What a terrible idea. The MSQ is a huge pile of experience for a new players first job and without it you're only lengthening the time they're going to spend grinding with the admittedly terrible pre-50 job/class kits. If you're asking for a free MSQ + Job skip then I also think that's a poor idea without somehow putting in place some catch up mechanics that they'd be funneled through first to give them more than the flat basics hall of the novice does. But I believe that WoW tried something like that years ago and found it actually didn't help, it didn't replace the experience of having leveled to that point yourself.

---

A player who chooses to utilize an optional MSQ is also choosing to accept the consequences. It simply means, if a player does not level through the MSQ, they'll have to find alternative methods. But for example, they can level through POTD,HOH and get ready for end-game way faster than going through the current MSQ.

Also, others and myself have proposed more than just the Hall of the Novice on this thread and others. The game does not adequately teach players class and fight mechanics for harder content. This is a separate problem that SE needs to address regardless of whether or not they implement a free MSQ skip.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vespar

Who plays a final fantasy game just to skip the story?

---

People more interested in the battle content? Plenty of people aren't interested in the story. Not to mention, a good chunk of ARR is pointless filler. 2.1 to 2.3 is almost entirely useless. The Company of Heroes? Awful. I'm someone who likes the story and that quest chain nearly got me to skip dialogue. I was that bored. Regardless, why does it matter what other people do? They don't impact your experience.

With this town this will be my third time playing through the MSQ. Doesn't bug me any and I have fun unlocking everything each time.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TwistedTea

Because ARR does have a whole bunch of pointless fetch/delivery quests,fetch,go here,now go there,now come back again just so we can send you off again.

---

Soon we will get new game+ so we can experience it again.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ranetsu-Akagane

When I first started I remember when someone would wipe in dungeons, they'd be asked if they watched a guide or asked why they didn't watch a guide ,sometimes even yelled at. Maybe that's only in certain dungeons this was in haukke manor (not sure if I spelled that right) sunken temple, aurum vale those are the ones I remember anyway. I remember seeing this a lot when I was new.

---

That is more a reflection on other people's impatience than the need for guides. 99% of the casual(story/additional dungeons/trials - basically anything outside of Extreme - debatable sometimes - and savage stuff) you don't need a guide for, you just need to pay attention and see what is going on. The people who demand that others read/watch a guide forget that there are new players out there that like to go into things blind. Many of those blind runners will accept advice, but prefer to figure things out themselves unless they ask.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TwistedTea

I fail to see how skip potions are a service. We buy the game, the expansions and pay a subscription.

Current skip potions are a lazy and profitable way for SE who chose to gate nearly all of the content behind the MSQ.

---

Once upon a time there wasnt a store to buy in game items. Then they rewarded fanatsia for veteran awards and completing the msq. Then we cried for them to sell it. At first they said no, then they eventually gave in and started selling fanatsia and the rest is history.


Bottom line its a business and the skip poitions are more and likely here to stay. SE will do anything it needs to make a profit and people will buy them up. Just like everything else they sell there.

I was okay with most of the fetch and bring-quests. Delivering a bottle of wine to a friend? Sure thing. Go and get some new clothes for Y'shtola? Why not. Fetch some ingredient for a meal? If I have to. But now the MSQ of SB goes ahead and orders me to collect sh*t. Literally sh*t. From mammoths. That's it. A Level 65 quest to collect shit? I quit. I'm outta here. I'm done with being an adventurer. Save the world yourself, I retire to Golden Saucer and make a living by playing triple triad...