Red Mage use Casting gear!!

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Originally Posted by Kageaki

This for the most part. I think they'll use SMN/BLM gear 50-60 like Ninja did with monk from 1-50 and then get it's own INT set, but instead of being color swapped caster gear it will be color swapped BRD/MCH gear.

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Many 3.0 Ranged Phy. gear share model with caster and healer already. I don't see the point why must make seperate set?

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Originally Posted by Kemonologist

Many 3.0 Ranged Phy. gear share model with caster and healer already. I don't see the point why must make seperate set?

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This reminded me of the, 'Jester,' like set you can buy in Ishgard at level 50, and how BRD/MCH, for some reason, had the same thing. Depressing.

I'm kind of hoping the new armor and weapons you can buy from vendors in 4.0 will be based around some of the dungeon sets. Caster/Healer gear from Neverreap and Fractal Continuum, tanking and DRG gear from Sor Khai and Hullbreaker HM, etc... Especially if they can be dyed.

Just remove the restriction for glamour (as long as the job is leveled you can glam the stuff on another job)...

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Originally Posted by Dualblade

Note that while this is true, it is still possible that Red Mage will be like Dragoon and Ninja and have their own set of gear instead of sharing with Black Mage/Summoner. Given that they will be up close and personal more often then the other two it would probably have higher Defense (though not as much as melee DPS probably).

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Armor isn't really applicable when you're a melee mage with low cooldown gap closer and elusive jump

I don't get why people were assuming that a casting class would use DEX gear in the first place. (Using "well, it's a ranged DPS" isn't really an excuse because NIN is melee.)

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Originally Posted by RaijinSupreme

True, but to take out Robes altogether simply because of the addition of RDM would also be a bad choice. BLM and SMN's should have their robes, as well as their coats, but RDM shouldn't have to be subjected to it.

So even if RDM just get recolors of other gear, as long as it means that they don't have to get a robe because BLM and SMN got a robe, then I'm cool with it.

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I'm a SMN and I dislike that I have to share gear that always looks like BLM gear or generic mage gear. To me, SMN has always been about the horn, but we only have a few horns to work with, and one went to BRD (? pvp set unicorn). I'm hoping Stormblood gives us a much smaller horn this time for our job specific equipment.

If anything separates the mages, it's the hat imo. Though I'm looking forward to (hopefully) less featureless blankets for body armor. :)

I'm still holding out some hope that a new expansion will bring big enough changes that they'll finally be able to fix the glamour system somehow, so that we can have a different glamour for each job, even in cases where they do share gear.

And that they'll then add more AF like gear, where each job gets custom designs. (We just need the fix to glamour first, so we can make better use of AF designed sets.)

Cool, means I can start stockpiling poetic gear for it.

Also, Scouting gear: why is this still a thing?

Scouting should probably be collapsed and nin put on striking along with sam. Then all eastern themed jobs have one set. I know that kind of sucks for glamor.

They actually should probably start putting some non-main attributes on gear too... like INT for healers, MND for casters, Dex for STR jobs, pie for Dex jobs, etc. There tend to be small ways they could make use of the stats. And if there aren't, then make a small effect, like Dex giving parry rate again, or STR increasing parried amount,' but definitely something that isn't an offensive bonus.

Healers would have less of a gap between using Cleric's Stance correctly or not.

Caster's Physick would be more functional.

Mcn/brd party buffs would last longer.

Historically red mage wore heavier armor similar to what the Dragoon is wearing. Red Mage was a mix between fighter, white mage, and black mage originally. They could use most of the same weapons as a fighter and wearing things like chain mail and scale mail were pretty common. They also couldn't cast the highest levels of black or white magic. They retained most of that in FFXI but tended to focus more on casting in the end game due to game design.

I'm not a fan of pigeon holing this class into being a caster and wearing caster gear. It shouldn't be just a caster. This class really does need it's own set of gear to be what it should be. Barring that they could either find a way to increase the armor value for red mages in cloth gear or find a way to give them int and mnd from the dragoon gear. Some sort of cleric stance like ability would probably work.

I do like the idea of adding in other stats to all the gear and making them somewhat relevant again. I am pretty sure that's how 1.0 gear worked.

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Originally Posted by Xandos

Historically red mage wore heavier armor similar to what the Dragoon is wearing.

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To be fair, that extra armor value doesn't exactly help Dragoons survive all that much. There's a reason they're called, 'Floor Tanks.'

While I'd like to hope RDMs get their own gear, I won't expect it to happen. Less disappointment when it doesn't.

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Originally Posted by Xandos

Historically red mage wore heavier armor similar to what the Dragoon is wearing.

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When was the last time you ever saw a fencer in mail like a dragoon? The correct answer is you haven't because the art of using a rapier requires being mobile, which armor that dragoon wears just wouldn't offer. Also some slight humor that you use the word "historically" when these jobs are paying more homage to actual history, hence why red mage also has that crystal in their back hand.

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Originally Posted by Xandos

They retained most of that in FFXI but tended to focus more on casting in the end game due to game design.

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That's what I love about this game: it's not FFXI, plus it's also because of game design that it's not going to be as watered down in terms of skills compared to other jobs.

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Originally Posted by Xandos

I'm not a fan of pigeon holing this class into being a caster and wearing caster gear. It shouldn't be just a caster. This class really does need it's own set of gear to be what it should be. Barring that they could either find a way to increase the armor value for red mages in cloth gear or find a way to give them int and mnd from the dragoon gear. Some sort of cleric stance like ability would probably work.

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Lack of armory space says "HEEEEEEEEEEEEY!!!!!!"

I actually hope Red Mage has it's own gear so at the very least i may mean better stats (possibly) and not subpar ones like we have been having recently for casters.
Also nice to have unique outfits for each job, which looking good is what matters :)

Interview is already confirm, Red mage's main stat will be INT and share gear with casters.
https://www.famitsu.com/news/201703/01127999.html
http://ff14net.2chblog.jp/archives/50758960.html

While I am reluctant to condemn XIV's iteration of RDM before we know more, this factlet is another potential nail in the coffin for me. If RDM is just going to be a back line nuker like BLM with a jump in / jump out gimmick then the XIV dev team have completely missed the point of RDM. I'm becoming increasingly suspicious that they don't really care, though - I mean, look at "SMN".

I love Red Mage as a job, both in its previous iterations and conceptually, but if SE aren't willing to alter the XIV job system to accommodate RDM then I would prefer it not to be added. The feathered hat is too important for us to have to tolerate a pretender.

I actually love the SMN. The ffxi version sucked imo. They could always make the summons functions like black mage spells but we already have a Blm. Redmage being a backline and swooping in to deal a melee hit and then backing out to cast again also seems fine to me. Just the potential for him to be stuck in robes that I take issue with. Definitely planning out some glamours based on current gear just in case.

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Originally Posted by Feidam

Just the potential for him to be stuck in robes that I take issue with.

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I think casters are going to need a bit more variety in gear appearances if RDM is going to be added to them. But then again, they could really do with more variety anyway. So it comes down to how much they're going to add more gear (glamour) variety to casters to accommodate the addition of RDM, and how much they're going to shoehorn RDM into the existing aesthetic.

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Originally Posted by Niwashi

I think casters are going to need a bit more variety in gear appearances if RDM is going to be added to them. But then again, they could really do with more variety anyway. So it comes down to how much they're going to add more gear (glamour) variety to casters to accommodate the addition of RDM, and how much they're going to shoehorn RDM into the existing aesthetic.

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The existing aesthetic isn't all that bad. Look at the Shire Set. Just needs a different hat and it's solid for a Red Mage.

SMN is mechanically fine and fun to play as a class, as I am sure RDM will be, it's just that SE seems to slap a job theme on the mechanical classes fairly arbitrarily in some cases. I find that really frustrating because I like to see the playstyle and the established theme as a package - that's part of the appeal of FF repeatedly using the same jobs over and over. When you have a job like XIV's SMN that pretty much ignores summoning as a theme then I find it really frustrating as I'm not getting what the package advertises, no matter if the job is good / fun / well-designed mechanically.


Same goes for RDM. If I'm going to be nuking the whole time with the occasional diving in for an ineffectual sword slash then I'm not getting the flexible hybrid class that RDM thematically should be. SE stating that RDM will use "INT gear like BLM and SMN" demonstrates that they could potentially ignore several of what I consider to be RDM's most important attributes, even if the job is mechanically functional - hence my concern.

I'll be curious to see what Red Mage's tool kit of abilities will be to be honest. There are a lot of iconic spells that could fit in for it.

Defensive: Phalanx (damage absorb) Blink (damage dodge)
Healing: Self Heals
MP Restore: Refresh
Damage Buff: Enspells (Saw a suggestion for Enastral/Enumbral that seemed to consolidate things nicely)
Group Utility: Haste/Hastaga

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Originally Posted by Vexander

To be fair, that extra armor value doesn't exactly help Dragoons survive all that much. There's a reason they're called, 'Floor Tanks.'

While I'd like to hope RDMs get their own gear, I won't expect it to happen. Less disappointment when it doesn't.

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As a DRG main, I would love if they just scrapped the DRG specific armor and either coupled them with Monks (and Sams) or with Tanks. The current stat difference in survivability is not worth it for all the other issues we get with loot, rolls and for the complexity of keeping multiple jobs geared up.

My dream would be:
VIT Gear = PLD/WAR/DRK/DRG
STR Gear = MNK/SAM
DEX Gear = NIN/BRD/MCH
INT Gear = RDM/BLM/SMN
MND Gear = WHM/SCH/AST

My second choice for gear distribution would be:
VIT Gear = PLD/WAR/DRK
STR Gear = MNK/SAM/DRG
DEX Gear = NIN/BRD/MCH
INT Gear = RDM/BLM/SMN
MND Gear = WHM/SCH/AST

This would make itemizing WAY easier for raid loot and rolls, for one!

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Originally Posted by Jerbob

Same goes for RDM. If I'm going to be nuking the whole time with the occasional diving in for an ineffectual sword slash then I'm not getting the flexible hybrid class that RDM thematically should be. SE stating that RDM will use "INT gear like BLM and SMN" demonstrates that they could potentially ignore several of what I consider to be RDM's most important attributes, even if the job is mechanically functional - hence my concern.

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I don't think that was ever going to be possible for the Red Mage in 14 though. The role system is just not set up to handle true hybrids.

As for the red Mage using int gear I'm ok with it, but I wonder why they didn't go for a dex stat set and then give the Redmage a trait that buffs their int to equal the dex. This way it at least give the illusion of being a hybrid in stat looks and armor variations.

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Originally Posted by Feidam

As for the red Mage using int gear I'm ok with it, but I wonder why they didn't go for a dex stat set and then give the Redmage a trait that buffs their int to equal the dex. This way it at least give the illusion of being a hybrid in stat looks and armor variations.

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They have opted to describe the job as Ranged DPS, and their ranged abilities are not coming from physical damage as it does for Bards and Machinists, so I am guessing in their eyes the RDM is a Magic DPS job first and foremost, and likely they have a stance switch that maybe flips Int to Dex and Dex to Int, making it inefficient to use magic while on the Melee stance.

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Originally Posted by Feidam

I don't think that was ever going to be possible for the Red Mage in 14 though. The role system is just not set up to handle true hybrids.

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Sadly I completely agree, but if they're not willing to modify the role system then why are they adding a job that is practically defined by its hybrid nature? I just don't understand, and it's so frustrating.

I doubt we will see a stance since the class is about rapid positioning as seen in the reveal. Having the abilities be int based still works in my thought. My guess is it was just easy to code for caster gear.

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Originally Posted by Jerbob

Sadly I completely agree, but if they're not willing to modify the role system then why are they adding a job that is practically defined by its hybrid nature? I just don't understand, and it's so frustrating.

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Because people like me still want to be the Red Mage! Favorite class in the final fantasy universe. It could still be quite heavy on utility though like ninja due to having white magic as part of the "red magic". So you think of support in that sense. Only time will tell.

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Originally Posted by Feidam

I doubt we will see a stance since the class is about rapid positioning as seen in the reveal. Having the abilities be int based still works in my thought. My guess is it was just easy to code for caster gear.

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I think the trailer pretty much noted we WILL have a stance, even if by a different name. There is a stance where the sword is, well, a sword, while you hold that crystal in your off-hand, and then a stance where you tie the crystal to the hilt of the sword and it becomes a magic staff of sorts. Maybe the stance switching wont have a cooldown, maybe it will require some combo to actually trigger the change. I am curious what approach they are taking to that.

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Originally Posted by Ogulbuk

I think the trailer pretty much noted we WILL have a stance, even if by a different name. There is a stance where the sword is, well, a sword, while you hold that crystal in your off-hand, and then a stance where you tie the crystal to the hilt of the sword and it becomes a magic staff of sorts. Maybe the stance switching wont have a cooldown, maybe it will require some combo to actually trigger the change. I am curious what approach they are taking to that.

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The weapon change can simply be accomplished in an abilities animation. Unless the "stance" is going to be something like forms from the monk. Having to hit say cleric stance to jump in and do a melee attack the back out and have to hit another stance to go magic would be tedious on a class that supposedly has rapid positioning.

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Originally Posted by Feidam

The weapon change can simply be accomplished in an abilities animation. Unless the "stance" is going to be something like forms from the monk. Having to hit say cleric stance to jump in and do a melee attack the back out and have to hit another stance to go magic would be tedious on a class that supposedly has rapid positioning.

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Could be the stance is off the global cooldown and with no recast. That'd make it far less tedious.

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Originally Posted by Vexander

Could be the stance is off the global cooldown and with no recast. That'd make it far less tedious.

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Could be. Only time will tell. Could really use some more information just because I want to be impatient. Give it to me NOW. :) Sorry suddenly channeled Verruca Salt.

I would guess a Jump-like action that switched stances. If you at mage stance, or jumps in and sets melee stance. If you on melee stance or jumps back and sets mage stance. It's pretty much what happened in the video.

Assuming it is a stance and not just animation. It sounds like we are already going to be juggling chainspell/quickspell

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Originally Posted by Feidam

Assuming it is a stance and not just animation. It sounds like we are already going to be juggling chainspell/quickspell

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Looks like an animation to me, as you can clearly see the cast before the RDM uses the light line to pull him to the mob.

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Originally Posted by Stitches1974

Looks like an animation to me, as you can clearly see the cast before the RDM uses the light line to pull him to the mob.

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That's what I think too.

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Originally Posted by Feidam

I don't think that was ever going to be possible for the Red Mage in 14 though. The role system is just not set up to handle true hybrids.

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This depends on the scope of what you want RDM to do. RDM could have easily been built stand in the front lines so that meleeing enhances spell output (procs that make spells instant-cast) while still having the option of using spells from range when they can't reach their target due to gaps, AoE telegraphs and so on (hard-casting spells). The sticking point is off-healing, but I can easily point to PLD and Clemency to show how that can be implemented without interfering with the job's primary role of DPS.

We thus have sword, heals and nukes rolled into one job, and I didn't even need to invent a gimmick to make it work.

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Originally Posted by Ogulbuk

My dream would be:
VIT Gear = PLD/WAR/DRK/DRG
STR Gear = MNK/SAM
DEX Gear = NIN/BRD/MCH
INT Gear = RDM/BLM/SMN
MND Gear = WHM/SCH/AST

My second choice for gear distribution would be:
VIT Gear = PLD/WAR/DRK
STR Gear = MNK/SAM/DRG
DEX Gear = NIN/BRD/MCH
INT Gear = RDM/BLM/SMN
MND Gear = WHM/SCH/AST

This would make itemizing WAY easier for raid loot and rolls, for one!

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I'd like go much more extreme with simplification and put the pretty bold suggestion of removing INT altogether, making MND working as INT, thus removing a full set of gear to keep in storage and all gear with int/mnd keep mnd with highest number. Goodbye, Cleric Stance. Revolution!

RDM shares gear with Monk they all ready stated this.

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Originally Posted by Blackcanary

RDM shares gear with Monk they all ready stated this.

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Weird cause they did confirm RDM uses int, so I guess they are going to be basically useless since their gear won't have the stat they need on it.

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Originally Posted by Blackcanary

RDM shares gear with Monk they all ready stated this.

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Samurai uses monk gear, Red Mage confirmed to use caster gear.