I am disappointed with Deep Dungeon

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Originally Posted by WinterLuna

I was just thinking about another games similar content (pretty much the same thing as Deep Dungeon) but they utilised SO many aspects of the game. Yep, Runescape 'Dungeoneering'.

They had different colour keys for different rooms, had weapons and armour actually drop so killing mobs was exciting, and even used gathering and crafting classes such as setting fire to trees which blocked doors. This can easily be implemented into FF. They also had really fun puzzles and riddles to access rooms. All of those were optional though so nobody could complain about progression if they didn't have the levels.

Those are just a few examples to add some depth into the content.

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Deep Dungeon will be expanded on the next patches. They already stated it.

personally, I LOVED IT. This is what I wanted Diadem to be. Now I want a version where everything is ABSOLUTE DARKNESS and you only have your weapon to light your path.

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Originally Posted by Tyrn

Almost everything in this game is a bloody tutorial.

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Hall of the Novice (how to be a {CLASS/JOB}, Guildhests (how to be a party) and now Palace of the Dead (will you enjoy being a {CLASS/JOB})

Palace of the Dead is currently the only content in the game that let's newbies decide if the Job they chose at the start is the Job they want to be from Level 17 to 60 (if not, then they can test out the other Jobs, excluding the HW Jobs). I see the flaws in this content, but again, I was never hyped for it to begin with. I do have expectations for Floor 51-200, but I am still keeping my hype in the basement and underneath the trapdoor.

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Originally Posted by Fevelle

Deep Dungeon will be expanded on the next patches. They already stated it.

personally, I LOVED IT. This is what I wanted Diadem to be. Now I want a version where everything is ABSOLUTE DARKNESS and you only have your weapon to light your path.

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I'm just giving some suggestions! But I'm glad you enjoyed it :)

If you went read "floors after 50 will be more challenging, going without a full party will be more challenging" and still went in with a tank, healer, and 2 DPS, what were you expecting?

This is the same thing as Savage and why people aren't interested kinda. You go in DD with 4 people (easy mode) then you get disappointed because it's easy/bland. All incentive to do a harder version is lost.

Doing it without 4 people, at least 2, and no healers makes it that challenge that requires deeper thought.

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Originally Posted by Magic-Mal

If you went read "floors after 50 will be more challenging, going without a full party will be more challenging" and still went in with a tank, healer, and 2 DPS, what were you expecting?

This is the same thing as Savage and why people aren't interested kinda. You go in DD with 4 people (easy mode) then you get disappointed because it's easy/bland. All incentive to do a harder version is lost.

Doing it without 4 people, at least 2, and no healers makes it that challenge that requires deeper thought.

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I tried the 'harder version' before I entered with a group and it was even more tedious. It does not change the fact the content is bland. Just because I'm getting hit harder and have to pull one mob at a time does not make the content fun either.

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Originally Posted by WinterLuna

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I don't know. To each their own then I guess. I liked the extra challenge and planning it took.

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Originally Posted by Magic-Mal

I don't know. To each their own then I guess. I liked the extra challenge and planning it took.

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Still I'm genuinely glad you enjoyed it. These are all just my own opinions, it's nice that some people really do like it :)

Have to agree that it's quite disappointing: I haven't finished it yet due to the lack of healers (and the fact that the last boss was a complete 180, making us unprepared for the fight) but I really felt it was a bore, with basically no real incentives to try again except for grabbing my "possible weapon". Since I don't like EX trials, that would be my best bet. However if they said that they'll patch it for future events (any quotes? I'd like to see the actual words from him), then I have no issues...but I'm not putting my hopes too high.

I guess back to Aquapolis after I'm done with this. Got more incentives to do that at least.

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Originally Posted by WinterLuna

I'm just giving some suggestions! But I'm glad you enjoyed it :)

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Good suggestions, in my opinion.

I'm not sure working in other classes, like gathering and crafting, will be at all likely or even at all easy to implement...given how the current set-up with save files is very much locked into one class ("One classh only, please") I have no idea if the code for it allows for switching. But puzzle rooms, areas accessed via keys, secrets to be found via unconventional means...would love to see those added.

At the time of this posting I'm omw home from work. Not having a chance to check out the new palace stuff I decided to check the forums to see what ppl are saying. Everyone is saying it's too easy,lack of creativity, lack puzzles or mechanics and a disapproval of the development team...well duhh they said from the very beginning it was gonna be easy and wasn't gonna feel hard till post50 & 100. After reading all the post my big disappointment is more with us, the community.

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Originally Posted by Donaria

well duhh they said from the very beginning it was gonna be easy and wasn't gonna feel hard till post50 & 100. After reading all the post my big disappointment is more with us, the community.

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Yeah...

This marks the third time they have tried to do something new and unique and have looked to overall botch the implementation (Diadem, Verminion, now Deep dungeon) I hate to be the guy to point out that if nobody likes the "Easy" version of the dungeon why did they design it that way at all?

Maximizing profit vs development costs?

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Originally Posted by Donaria

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You realise the community are allowed an opinion, right? Would you do something you disliked and tell everyone you enjoyed it because SE already told you you'd dislike it from the very beginning? That's the logic you have here.

As I said, it's not just about how 'easy' it is anyway. There's many aspects that have disappointed me. God forbid you ever give feedback to SE if it isn't positive.

To be fair it has nothing to do with Dead Palace being easy, but it's all about lack of incentives and, partially, fun. I mean the deep dungeon thing, what does it have right now for the exception of the possible 235 weapons? Levelling alts? What else beside that? The rewards are super low at the end of the 10 floors and doesn't make it worth it already. There aren't rewards from chests in the place except for those things you use in the dungeon. I might have missed something but, I'm not seeing the incentives to return, unlike, say, aquapolis where gil is always a good incentives, plus costumes and materias. It could use more additions but I have at least an incentive to go back there everyday.

Plus it's really not that fun. Different a bit yes, but not really fun: you just kill random enemies, find the exit and you're good. No real tactics or variation on what you do on a normal dungeon. There's not really much reason for explore for the exception of raising your weapon/armor to 30. After that what's left? If I'm missing something let me know, but this is what I feel right now regarding this new feature.

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Originally Posted by Voltyblast

I'm not seeing the incentives to return, unlike, say, aquapolis where gil is always a good incentives, plus costumes and materias.

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There are 2 minions, a mount and battle Tier V materia on a token vendor. One 41-50 clear gets you 1 token so there's that. Minions are 3 tokens each, Mount is 10, tier V is 1 each.

I am enjoying it id rather level through this and get tomes then doing it through regular dungeons.

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Originally Posted by Vaer

There are 2 minions, a mount and battle Tier V materia on a token vendor. One 41-50 clear gets you 1 token so there's that. Minions are 3 tokens each, Mount is 10, tier V is 1 each.

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That's it? I mean I guess for those who are into minions and mounts is fine, but the materias aren't a big deal (unless i can grab gathering and crafting ones). I can do Weeping city and VA for my materias...what about costumes? that girl has a nice one!

Nevermind, I'll wait for it to be in the mogshop, just like all of the other high relevance costumes.

I like the concept as a source for tomes, EXP, and items. Obviously it's a tad too easy ATM, but it'll probably get to a more comfortable difficulty level when more levels are released for it.

I approve of it.

I admit floors 1 to 20 were pretty boring and even my static didn't seem that into it (everyone agreed that normal dungeons were nicer) but the more levels and actions we gained (and after our first wipe due to double minotaurs+a trap that spawned mobs), the more exciting it became (we wiped at floor 40 due to the boss' back-to-back raid-wide AoE). Our composition was WHM, SMN, THM and DRG. :'D I am disappointed by the recycled BGM but it was nice to hear Antitower's BGM again. I miss that dungeon being part of DREX. :'(

I guess if you've capped all of your combat classes, it's boring since you know your rotations, hotbar arrangement and your skills. Personally I'm really thankful since I want to use DRs for my main (I need all them Esotorics yo!) so Deep Dungeon would be used to level and learn how to play my alt classes; just hitting dummies doesn't cut it for me. Aside from the EXP, I want the minion and the mount! I'm also glad that you can get combat materia Vs this way rather than having to wait for weekly resets. I hope it won't crash the MB though...

Looking forward to future floors!



Question: In your runs, how fast is the mob spawn rate? In ours, we kill the mob, kill the next room's mob and when we enter the previous room, the mobs have respawned. We didn't even take long to kill the mobs so the fast respawn rate is really surprising!

Things to consider here:

- It's the first step, accesible for new/lowlvl players to get through leveling easier.
- It's more like a lore introduction (won't spoil the end ofc) for the first 50 floors. You reach lv60 just a few floors before 50th, after that, we'll have the challengeable lv60+ floors with no more lore-friendly fights, focusing on harder fights.

I do agree it was easy, but that was the point of it. It was already said, and I don't know what you expected. The challenge will come later. I like the concept of having to use items in dungeons, having fun picking what to use on next floor or save it for a different one.

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Originally Posted by Zojha

No, I don't think so.

Creative content isn't necessarily difficult content.

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You're right about creative not meaning hard but if SE are to add interesting mechanics to trash, having more traps and the like then it means players need to actually do more than spam aoes, do thier standard combos etc. etc. which the majority don't like as shown every time SE try to think of something interesting.

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Originally Posted by WinterLuna

What are your thoughts on Deep Dungeon? Also please respect my opinion as I respect yours. Thank you for reading.

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I'm loving it. If I could change anything would make it little easier when solo or remove time limit. Instant death attacks just seem unfair when solo.

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Originally Posted by Kit-Kat

I do agree it was easy, but that was the point of it. It was already said, and I don't know what you expected. The challenge will come later. I like the concept of having to use items in dungeons, having fun picking what to use on next floor or save it for a different one.

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Ahahaha, this!! My tanking healer popped the item that ensures the next floor has a lot coffers and lo and behold, it had gloom and we didn't have any Pomander of Serenity nor Pomander of Sight. Tanking healer was all "WE NEED TO EXPLORE EVERY ROOM! WE CAN DO THIS! IT'S A WASTE IF WE DON'T!"

I dont expect SE to make any changes to its half-baked formula they'll abandon it just like the did with chocobo racing/lord of vermillion/diadem.

The chocobo racing that got an update in 3.25 and the Diadem that is reportedly being reworked for 3.4 or 3.5?

Putting another battle materia? Why not crafting/gathering?! :mad:
Aside of that, I enjoy it as healer.

I find it funny how so many people believe it will get better for 51+ floors.
It will be the same thing, mobs will just get a bit more HP. I have been here for 3 years, who are you fooling? It was always like this.
Puzzles? Interaction? Not gonna happen.

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Originally Posted by Berethos

The chocobo racing that got an update in 3.25 and the Diadem that is reportedly being reworked for 3.4 or 3.5?

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Is chocobo racing fun now? No. How long ago did they get released?

It's all too little too late.

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Originally Posted by Kitano123

Is chocobo racing fun now? No. How long ago did they get released?

It's all too little too late.

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I enjoy it.

Went in solo SCH

was Ok, seeing how much i could handle was a thing to me so i was enjoying it somewhat

and then a slime exploded on floor 16, oh well

bit annoying to have several levels of progress shafted but i conceeded the point of learning the enemy

and then i get to floor 18 and open a chest that exploded and 1shot me

im now disheartened by this and dont really want to continue to be honest.
i understand the risks of going in solo but i figured [and by reading im sorta correct] that going solo is the only way to make this a challenge (going into a room with 3 enemies and triggering a 4mob spawn trap? GOOD TIMES) but if there are 1shot (or close to it) traps like these chests?
that just remove this as a viable option as something to do for some people

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Originally Posted by Kitano123

I dont expect SE to make any changes to its half-baked formula they'll abandon it just like the did with chocobo racing/lord of vermillion/diadem.

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They will not. They said they are adding 50 floors in 3.4 and like 100 in 3.45.

Unless something terrible happens that makes them cancel everything, I highly doubt they will drop it..

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Originally Posted by Kitano123

Is chocobo racing fun now? No. How long ago did they get released?

It's all too little too late.

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I find it pretty fun. It's my favorite part of the challenge log and every once in a while I play some matchs even after filling the challenge. It's just not the type of grindy content, nor it should be. It's a mini game where I can spend some time. I would be surprised if people decided to stay their whole day at chocobo racing. It's just not the type of content that actually makes sense to do it through months of gameplay because you'll eventually get tired. Doesn't make it less fun.

As for the deep dungeon, while I don't think that it's this terrible thing and certainly do not agree with all the drama about it in the forums, OP post has a very good point. I believe that Deep Dungeon can be so much more, and have way more interesting fights. But for now? It's okay, and fun. I don't have high hopes for extremely-complex puzzles or anything like that, but something less face rolling already would be amazing, and it would fit pretty well in the later floors. The adventure itself, when made with friends and slowly is very refreshing.
I think that my favorite part was seeing so many people at Quarrymil today making parties. Kinda reminded of my time in an old MMO without a duty finder or party finder system. Of couse, that sucked, but it made me very nostalgic. I can only hope that SE makes it better along the way.

Just completed floor 50 the first time. I halfway liked it. I had the most fun with a group that was trying to go as fast as possible, avoiding monsters when they could but getting all the chests. I also like the rare super strong NPCs that can show up. Some of the traps can make for interesting situations. I also like how it almost feels like a full adventure.

The problem is that's all there is to it. On top of that, it was designed for a group of level 17s with no class composition requirements. WHY does every new piece of content have to be made for someone who hasn't played the game or hasn't played in months? Level 17s and newbies have enough stuff to do. These players haven't learned any dungeon or game mechanics so you end up with content that requires no knowledge of game mechanics. That's bad and boring. Additionally, this place negates your gear - just another sign that there's no point in gearing up or picking your stats in this game.

How to fix it:

STEAL FROM GOOD GAMES. Add random events and objectives to floors. Here's some suggestions I thought of in 5 minutes:

Oh no, a Tonberry is chasing you (this one is from your good game, ARR around 2.0) so you have to move quickly through this floor.
A mysterious merchant has appeared who will let you trade 2 pomanders (stop it loc team) for one.
Certain monsters on a floor have had their stats turned way up. They have a black aura.
Cultists are summoning a boss on this floor. Get to them and kill them before they succeed.
You found a magic lamp with a genie inside who will grant you a wish. Choose wisely (+weapon, +armor, +exp, +gil, or a massive buff for the next floor)
This floor has no map and is shrouded in darkness. Stick together and make your way to the exit.
This floor's exit is behind a caved in wall. You need to lure bombs to the wall to destroy it.
A treasure goblin appeared. Where have I seen this one before?
There are 4 switches that you need to stand on at the same time. Split up and go do it.
A miniboss appeared. Kill it.

The second thing is to GO NUTS WITH ITEMS. You don't get this stuff outside of deep dungeon, so use this place to test new stats and effects. You opened a silver chest. +1 weapon level and BONUS!!! your weaponskills sometimes go off twice. Your spells sometimes cost no MP. You have a fireball proc. XXXX weaponskill is AOE. Whatever. The haste floors are fun. Do more stuff like that.

Finally, make it harder. Level 60s should be able to handle some basic dungeon requirements. For starters, all of the telegraphed moves in there right now should be instant. Next, a healer should be required at the bare minimum. A tank should be present. Monsters should actually hit decently hard and it should encourage you to pay attention to your surroundings and what you're fighting. A cyclops should be dealt with differently than a morbol, etc. Also these bosses are seriously a joke for the amount of pomander stuff we have available.

Stop designing stuff for four level 17 lancers to go in and win because it makes it extremely boring for anyone who has been playing the game for more than a month.

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Originally Posted by Brannigan

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I think you missed the part where this particular batch of floors will be for newbies and that they're adding 150 lv60 floors...

Be patient ._.

Did you guys try to solo it? It seems like you're complaining because you went the easy way with a good comp, and since it was easy that way, yo got bored.

Trying to solo it with any job makes it fun and challenging, or even duoing. I got to floor 37 yesterday soloing it, and I'll repeat it today cuz I messed up a bit the leveling part.


Also, remember we only got 50 floors, and we're supposed to get 200 floors.

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Originally Posted by LDR

Went in solo SCH


was Ok, seeing how much i could handle was a thing to me so i was enjoying it somewhat

and then a slime exploded on floor 16, oh well

bit annoying to have several levels of progress shafted but i conceeded the point of learning the enemy

and then i get to floor 18 and open a chest that exploded and 1shot me

im now disheartened by this and dont really want to continue to be honest.
i understand the risks of going in solo but i figured [and by reading im sorta correct] that going solo is the only way to make this a challenge (going into a room with 3 enemies and triggering a 4mob spawn trap? GOOD TIMES) but if there are 1shot (or close to it) traps like these chests?
that just remove this as a viable option as something to do for some people

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There aren't one-shot traps/chests, you just weren't full HP.
When you're fighting a mob you shouldn't run everywhere because there's a chance you'll trigger a trap. And you should never open a chest while fighting because it could be a mimic/bomb, and remember to open every single chest only hen you're full HP.

Wait for 2.X the game is young, WoW used to be like this too, wait for 3.X the expansion just came out, wait for Diadem revamp, the Diadem just came out, wait for 51+ floor, The Deep Dungeon just came out, yeah sure.
Lets grind 50 faceroll floors while waiting for 150 others that are going to be exactly the same. Kill x mobs with slightly more HP, finish boss with 3 AoEs and 1 mechanic, rinse and repeat 10 times to get a mount and 2 minions.
And to go solo? Well, if I wanted to play solo I would probably play Dark Souls and not a MMO. Also the difficulty of going solo lies in HP bags which can "maybe" result in not finishing on time and the fact that some jobs (AST for example) lack DPS. Maybe when (or if) there is a solo leaderboard then it might be a worthwhile.

DON'T get me wrong here, I am actually finishing my 3rd round of Deep Dungeon and I am having fun BUT I don't believe anything is going to change or that 51+ floors are going to be different, they aren't.

Dayuuum, I am actually going to save quote of my post so I can throw it at your faces when 3.4X arrives.

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Originally Posted by Brannigan

No. Why are they designing this for newbies at this stage in the game's life? A level 17 has like 40 dungeons to go through before hitting max level and hasn't experienced even five percent of the game's content. Must they gimp every single new event and piece of content for the sake of new players at the expense of the old?

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AMEN. If they want to keep new players, they should prolly do something about the 100 fetch quests between 2.X and 3.0 instead of dedicating the only hyped content since Diadem and LotV to newbies.

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Originally Posted by Magic-Mal

I think you missed the part where this particular batch of floors will be for newbies and that they're adding 150 lv60 floors...

Be patient ._.

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No. Why are they designing this for newbies at this stage in the game's life? A level 17 has like 40 dungeons to go through before hitting max level and hasn't experienced even five percent of the game's content. Must they gimp every single new event and piece of content for the sake of new players at the expense of the old?

I would love to see in the DD some mechanics from other FF that have you use your brain, like the Trials in FF10 for example or puzzle jumps but i think it's just me dreaming, people will never accept such things

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Originally Posted by ChocoFeru

Did you guys try to solo it? It seems like you're complaining because you went the easy way with a good comp, and since it was easy that way, yo got bored.

Trying to solo it with any job makes it fun and challenging

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It's a challenge? Don't know dude, go as scholar, summoner or warrior and there is no challenge what so ever at least for the first 40 floors. Going with a group at least you have some entertainment. Where else besides WC you see a bunch of morons running into every shit and die 2 seconds later?

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Originally Posted by ChocoFeru

There aren't one-shot traps/chests, you just weren't full HP.

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Actually there is, lvl 11 - 20 has those lvl 23 palace slimes. You need to kill them before they cast/explode and if not, you are 1 shot even with full hp. Now there is a couple of tricks so, if you go as scholar you could have the fairy tank the slime and stand out of range, so that if it's explodes only your fairy dies.

Anymore advice you would love to share with us?