My Experience With Alexander Normal Yesterday As A Tank

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Originally Posted by Kyros

Sure, that is a valid point. Complaining about DF not going smoothly because you went in blind is stupid. But at the same time, people here acting like its the end-of-the-world or asking such ridiculous things like "Should have watched a video!" or "Make a PF" for Story Content is so counter-intuitive and quite honestly beyond stupid.

Besides, if he actively stated that he is new, and the party did not take any appropriate action, it is the other players fault. They have no one to blame when he under-performed that their own silence. I mean, when you expect a new player to perform at knowledge-level without any help all you are doing is setting up for failure.

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What is this? Roegadyn brotherly love?

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Originally Posted by hagare

yea, they shoulda just kicked him or vote abandoned :p

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Sure, let's go with that. Because that will in no way backfire or make them lose more time than spending the oh so dreadful 10 or so seconds it'll take to type out what to do.

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blaming someone for not teaching is as ridiculous as blaming someone for not wanting to learn.

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He actively stated he is new. It's not like he's covering his ears and going la la la. That is about as far as his responsibility goes as a new player in story content.

And yes. I'll blame anyone not speaking up when a new player asks for help. Because the opposite of speaking up is not doing anything and wiping - which is quite honestly stupid.

Make a PF if you want to go in blind and figure things out as a group/yourself or go in with your static to do this. Going in blind through DF is basically wasting 7 other peoples time. There is a little more going on in Alexander Normal in terms of mechanics compared to things like Crystal Tower, so expecting people to explain things to you, for the simple reason that you dont want any spoilers via a video, is slightly selfish when it comes to the time you potentially wasting of those 7 other people.

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Originally Posted by Reinth

What is this? Roegadyn brotherly love?

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more like roegadyn tank love

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Originally Posted by Kyros

Sure, let's go with that. Because that will in no way backfire or make them lose more time than spending the oh so dreadful 10 or so seconds it'll take to type out what to do.

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you're not that rare.
and your argument goes back to square one again.

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Originally Posted by Kyros

Besides, if he actively stated that he is new, and the party did not take any appropriate action, it is the other players fault.

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i do not agree with this. this is saying it's right to approach things in a manner which hinder the majority. expecting others to compensate for where you lack is distasteful and far too common in this game.
in a dungeon i usually only explain bosses which may prove difficult blind and can easily wipe the group, aery is a good example as it has a dps check and an enrage timer. but its a dungeon, with simple mechanics.
alexander normal is still raid content with dumbed down raid mechanics. tank is a pretty important role (except in a4). explaining these mechanics takes substantial time. far more if i need to provide different explanations for multiple roles. or trying to explain a2 spawns? because apparently he struggled there so somethin as simple as grab everything and bring them together wasnt something he could figure out on his own. would take him far less time looking it up for himself. or ask a friend and waste the time of 1 person instead of 7

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Originally Posted by hagare

and your argument goes back to square one again.

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Please elaborate. Because being completely ambiguous and assuming you are right without offering any counterpoints goes a long way into making you look like a fool.

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Originally Posted by Amberyl

Why wouldn't they? Everyone does it now. But go do a forum search on duty finder queue times, and tell me who came up with the idea of negating the language function to cut down queue times.

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Wait... so it's alright if it's non-English people who tick all the boxes to shorten queue times, but it's not okay if English-only people do that? Because that was kind of your comment to that effect that I replied to.

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Originally Posted by Kolaina

but its a dungeon, with simple mechanics.

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explaining these mechanics takes substantial time.

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Lol, no? These are about as braindead easy as it gets. Here, step-by-step on what tank needs to do per turn:

A1) Voke the add (Or main boss, depending on the other tank). Take it to the other side.

A2) Grab adds, bring them together. Pop some buffs on Jagds.

A3) Pretend you're a DPS (Chances are the other tank knows whats up).
If not: Face Man away from group. Face Hand towards Group.

A4) If MT: Just Tank, maybe help grab balls. Pop a buff for Discoid in last Phase. If OT: Get ready to duo an add. Also help grab balls.

Oh look, took me about 10 secs per Turn, must be hardz.

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Originally Posted by Kyros

Please elaborate. Because being completely ambiguous and assuming you are right without offering any counterpoints goes a long way into making you look like a fool.

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from this:

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Originally Posted by Kyros

OP was in the right to go blindly on the DF's.

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to this:

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Originally Posted by Kyros

Sure, let's go with that. Because that will in no way backfire or make them lose more time than spending the oh so dreadful 10 or so seconds it'll take to type out what to do.

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PS: I'm using your original statement, not your edited one.

you're basically saying that it's okay to take 7 other people hostage because forcing people explaining something that you don't wanna learn by yourself for whatever reason is okay.
After all, you're a tank and it's "hard" finding a replacement *ego much*.

going in blind = fine
not explaining to newbies = fine
blaming either side for not fulfilling your own expectations = not fine

the only time I say going in blind in DF is fine, is the first 2 weeks of content launch.
or you're a fast learner, like real fast.

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Originally Posted by Kyros

Lol, no? These are about as braindead easy as it gets. Here, step-by-step on what tank needs to do per turn:

A1) Voke the add (Or main boss, depending on the other tank). Take it to the other side.

A2) Grab adds, bring them together. Pop some buffs on Jagds.

A3) Pretend you're a DPS (Chances are the other tank knows whats up).
If not: Face Man away from group. Face Hand towards Group.

A4) If MT: Just Tank, maybe help grab balls. Pop a buff for Discoid in last Phase. If OT: Get ready to duo an add. Also help grab balls.

Oh look, took me about 10 secs per Turn, must be hardz.

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theres more to it than your explanations. if yours held true he should never have wiped in the first place

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Originally Posted by hagare

you're basically saying that it's okay to take 7 other people hostage because explaining something that you don't wanna learn by yourself for whatever reason is okay.
After all, you're a tank and it's "hard" finding a replacement *ego much*.

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It can be a Tank, a DPS, or a Healer. The same rules apply. I don't even know why you'd bring some Classism into this short of having no better argument.

And again, "you dont want to learn for yourself" is completely wrong. He is on the DF of an incredibly easy Story mode content with the purpose of learning. You are asking to "Learn the mechanics of the encounter meant for you to learn the mechanics". Him stating he is here for learning is about the extent of his responsibility.

The other 7 people at this juncture have a choice: To explain, or to do nothing. One takes them extra "work" (And I use the term here loosely, I can do that before he finishes watching his cutscene), the other wastes the 7 other people's time because of wiping. If the other 7 choose to do nothing, then it is entirely their fault for their time wasted.

What you are trying to imply is that by some very convoluted sense of morals is that the fault for the other 7 choosing not to speak up must be of the new player.

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theres more to it than your explanations. if yours held true he should never have wiped in the first place

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Then by all means go into a bit more detail. The success of your run is entirely dependent on it. But if you'd rather wipe because "Typing is oh so dreadful" then that's your own prerogative.

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Originally Posted by Kyros

Oh look, took me about 10 secs per Turn, must be hardz.

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To be fair, I'm not too fond of the A2 "bring them together"....since some of them buff others' defence or magic defence (Hardhelm/Hardmind, respectively).
And in A3, me and my co-tank keep the hand on us only, not the group. And I'd add in 'in last phase, tank swap at X stacks' (substituting X for whatever number of stacks you usually go with).

But either way, it'd be almost equally quick for me to explain tactics in similar shorthand if I DFed in and got a new co-tank who openly said he was new and asked for tips.

Then if we wiped, and it was clear he didn't get a certain part of the fight, I'd clarify that part of it. Like in A1, if the blue beam appeared badly and the new tank didn't think to turn/move the Oppressor and thus ended up cleaving DPSes or otherwise making it inconvenient/difficult to place the adds appropriately.

That said, I'm a pretty patient player. I don't mind explaining things if people are new and ask for tips. I also don't mind wiping several times as long as it's a friendly group and/or we're making steady progress each time. I'm in no way expecting the average DF raider to be equally patient. But neither am I expecting the average DF raider to be good either. Like everything that relies on RNG, you end up with something random and different each time when it comes to party composition (unless the RNG pool is very small because it's off-peak hours). I just think that those who are unwilling to accept that bit should resort to PF instead ^^; Whether it's people who are still learning and end up getting vote-kicked, or people expecting a farm and going off on party-members when things aren't going too well.

Edit: Do I think people should be more patient with new people? Absolutely. But I'm not expecting it of them, sadly.

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Originally Posted by Kyros

It can be a Tank, a DPS, or a Healer. The same rules apply. I don't even know why you'd bring some Classism into this short of having no better argument.

And again, "you dont want to learn for yourself" is completely wrong. He is on the DF of an incredibly easy Story mode content with the purpose of learning. You are asking to "Learn the mechanics of the encounter meant for you to learn the mechanics". Him stating he is here for learning is about the extent of his responsibility.

The other 7 people at this juncture have a choice: To explain, or to do nothing. One takes them extra "work" (And I use the term here loosely, I can do that before he finishes watching his cutscene), the other wastes the 7 other people's time because of wiping. If the other 7 choose to do nothing, then it is entirely their fault for their time wasted.

What you are trying to imply is that by some very convoluted sense of morals is that the fault for the other 7 choosing not to speak up must be of the new player.

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going in blind = fine
not explaining to newbies = fine
blaming either side for not fulfilling your own expectations = not fine

that bolded part = what you're doing.

the only time I say going in blind in DF is fine for everyone, is the first 2 weeks of content launch.
or you're a fast learner, like real fast.

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Originally Posted by hagare

not explaining to newbies = fine.

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It must take a very special kind of person to think of this as being "Fine".

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blaming either side for not fulfilling your own expectations = not fine

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Like I said, it was dumb of him to complain about going blind and not succeeding. But is is even dumber of the other 7 people for wasting their own time by negligence.

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Originally Posted by Kyros

It must take a very special kind of person to think of this as being "Fine".

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it takes a normal person actually.
unless you say yes to every request?

what is special is thinking that everyone should do what you ask them to.
Including asking for explanations.

it's your right to go in blind and it's their right to not explain.

but go ahead, attack me instead of giving an argument if you like :D

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Originally Posted by Kyros

Then by all means go into a bit more detail. The success of your run is entirely dependent on it. But if you'd rather wipe because "Typing is oh so dreadful" then that's your own prerogative.

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how about in a1 saying to ignore adds during emergency deployment so as he does not have them tethered to him either preventing them from being put into position or having the dps take them? or even suggesting dropping tank stance to increase dps after the .5 is positioned making it less likely to hit enrage. if it was a warrior suggesting going back to defiance during the jump if theres a scholar for a shared adlo considering the increase in potency due to defiance.
or a2 kill orders? suggesting if bringing dolls together to V-angle yourself from other tank so as not to cleave them?
a3 voking hand and once again with the V-angle for bane while not taking 2x cleaves a long with other mechanics?
a4 assuming they will be the off tank suggesting to focus target the laser after the first leg dies to know when your going to be sucked away for quarantine? or to avoid healer in last phase because of their debuff and further elaborating by saying in case they do get debuff to not go back on boss because that'll be passed around to main tank and melee dps causing a wipe.
those are minor examples of things you missed which should be noted
edit: also in a4 since it may be hard to see indicators depending on where you position yourself, mentioning balls spawn with discord

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Originally Posted by hagare

it takes a normal person actually.
unless you say yes to every request?

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When the success of my own doings is dependent on the request yes, I will say yes to it every time. After all, I don't want to waste my time, and I don't think any sane person would want to.

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Originally Posted by hagare

it's your right to go in blind and it's their right to not explain.

but go ahead, attack me instead of giving an argument if you like :D

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Like I said earlier. Of course it's their right. But the former is expected. The later is pure idiocy. If I'd weight the balance of who is responsible for what, I think it takes some pretty serious self-delusion to believe that choosing the option that wastes your own time is anything but your fault, regardless of who it was. That one side has 7 people doing this speaks a lot of which side has the most "blame".

I think this wouldn't of been so much of a hot topic, if the OP Hadn't of put the onus of responsibility on the party for "Not explaining it to me." This degree of hand-holding is often what most players really dislike in the Duty Finder, and they want the OP to understand that in the future, he needs to hold himself accountable, too.

Now - could the party have explained it to compensate for his lazy action of just 'queing duty finder and kamikazing" it? Yes, they could have. It'd take possibly about 3-5 minutes (When I explain things to someone, I explain what's relevant to their role. For an MT, positioning on each phase is important, and assisting with dolls is ideal if you see one is loose.) For an OT, it's important to understand how to handle other mechanics - such as Orbs, Lines, and the Healer "No Touch My Body" mechanic work.


Then we still have to discuss strategy. I've seen too many teams wipe because they let the dolls during Phase 2 go wild on the party - something that most parties sorely forget (I love when people eat their words when they say "Just kill adds" and they all go for the healer, detonating the entire party before I get back from quarantine.)

So, OP, instead of,

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Originally Posted by Arabian_Wolf

left the group because they didn't want to bother explaining in short

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Take some responsibility, watch a video before going in. And no, there aren't many spoilers in videos. You're fighting Bahamut in T13? Neat. There's still some awesome story that accompanied that fight going into and out of it, so enjoy watching that.

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Originally Posted by Kyros

He is on the DF of an incredibly easy Story mode content with the purpose of learning.

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Yeah, this is just wrong.
1) Alex Normal is NOT incredibly easy for an average player. It's incredibly easy for an endgame raider, but it's harder content for an average player.
2) It is not MSQ content, as such it is NOT required to do.
3) If you want to do something blind, DO IT BLIND, don't ask for others to explain it. If you want to know how the fight works without spoiling yourself, READ A GUIDE!

http://vignette3.wikia.nocookie.net/...20110817182305

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I need to buy more popcorn.

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Originally Posted by Kyros

When the success of my own doings is dependent on the request yes, I will say yes to it every time. After all, I don't want to waste my time, and I don't think any sane person would want to.



Like I said earlier. Of course it's their right. But the former is expected. The later is pure idiocy. If I'd weight the balance of who is responsible for what, I think it takes some pretty serious self-delusion to believe that choosing the option that wastes your own time is anything but your fault, regardless of who it was. That one side has 7 people doing this speaks a lot of which side has the most "blame".

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Yea. One person inconveniencing 7 other people :p

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Originally Posted by Selli

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I need to buy more popcorn.

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not an official thread til Selli is present \o/

Oh boy here we go again...

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Originally Posted by sirDarts

Yeah, this is just wrong.
1) Alex Normal is NOT incredibly easy for an average player. It's incredibly easy for an endgame raider, but it's harder content for an average player.

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There was a thread some weeks ago about just how hard Alex really is. Most agreed that it was slightly harder than the 24-man raids, but definitively easier than most primals. I know the Average player is bad, but I'd like to think it's not that bad. Like I said, the extent of one's role can often be summarized in couple of sentences. I one shotted 3 of the 4 turns on the first week, with randoms, which most of them where also new. I'm sure a group that has the majority with a clear can fare better.

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2) It is not MSQ content, as such it is NOT required to do.

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It's still story content tho. Much like Hildebrand. In fact, SE purposely stated that they are releasing this because they don't want players to be left out of the story like they where in coil.

xD I did 1st time as Tank (Dark Knight lv171 that time) Alex1.
We finished without issues!

My question at party: "1st timer tank was here! How was I? xD

I never videos as guides! I dont let me spoil <,<
So I just watch other people there doings and enemy there actions/rotations!

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Originally Posted by hagare

Yea. One person inconveniencing 7 other people :p

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ITT: Typing for about 10 seconds is so inconvenient I'd rather wipe. Other 6 players share my line of thought. Fault clearly lies on the new person.

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Originally Posted by Arabian_Wolf

Yeah I know, but if I ask for few things they must answer and not stay silent till a wipe then they vent their anger and frustration at me although I clearly asked before the pull.

Always hungry for a fine specieman of Au ra!

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Ok first I don't know if this is the way you ment to writ this but no even if you say your new don't (never) expect people to tell you how to do the fight once your in. In an ideal world we all would hold hands and sing happy songs together (not me cause that's just weired why would people do this???). Short answer never expect help. No one has to give you the answers to anything.

Second really man leave our tails alone.

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Originally Posted by Kolaina

not an official thread til Selli is present \o/

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I've been recognized!

http://kes.wimp.com/images/sthumbs/2...992b_story.gif

Sleep is simply for normal people who don't have a 20-year-old cat to tend to.


Srsly. Does this look like the face of mercy?!

https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net...eb&oe=55F8F6BA

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Originally Posted by Eidolon

I think this wouldn't of been so much of a hot topic, if the OP Hadn't of put the onus of responsibility on the party for "Not explaining it to me."
Take some responsibility

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pretty much

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Originally Posted by Kyros

I one shotted 3 of the 4 turns on the first week

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sometimes you need to realize some players need a lot more help. people like us have endulged in end game raiding where everything else is laughable. but there are people who have never seen mechanics outside of dodge the cone/ circle, touch the tree, etc. those people who still struggle in content like titan hard mode. sometimes its not as easy as 1 liner explanations.

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Originally Posted by Kyros

There was a thread some weeks ago about just how hard Alex really is. Most agreed that it was slightly harder than the 24-man raids, but definitively easier than most primals. I know the Average player is bad, but I'd like to think it's not that bad. Like I said, the extent of one's role can often be summarized in couple of sentences. I one shotted 3 of the 4 turns on the first week, with randoms, which most of them where also new. I'm sure a group that has the majority with a clear can fare better.

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I wouldn't say it's easier than HM primals. It's somewhere between those and EX Primals IMO, and that's something I wouldn't consider easy, especially seeing how many people can still fail in HM primals despite the majority there being extremely over-geared and thus skipping mechanics.
Yes, most groups in A1N clear without issues even when they have new people, as long as these don't mess up one of the 3 main things - 1) Provoke when 0.5 spawns. 2) Kill adds in the right place. 3) Damage the two oppressors evenly. But if you have someone who only knows these points, you push a lot of work on the healers, since you will likely be taking unnecessary damage.

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It's still story content tho. Much like Hildebrand. In fact, SE purposely stated that they are releasing this because they don't want players to be left out of the story like they where in coil.

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And there are still people who have issues with the Typhoon fight, and people expect you to know the trials within the Hildi story. As said, A:N is harder content for the average player, and should be taken as such: Read a guide before going in, unless you are among "World's first". There is a lot of content that doesn't require reading a guide (basically all 4-man content falls there, except maybe Garuda Story), but Alex is IMO not among them.
And once again if you want to go in blind, do it, but don't ask for help, you reading a guide takes less time than getting it explained, and guides don't spoil the story.

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sometimes you need to realize some players need a lot more help. people like us have endulged in end game raiding where everything else is laughable. but there are people who have never seen mechanics outside of dodge the cone/ circle, touch the tree, etc. those people who still struggle in content like titan hard mode. sometimes its not as easy as 1 liner explanations.

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Like I said, I did this when the majority of the people had no idea what they where doing. It's a lot easier right now, because A) Most everyone has already done it and B) We have gear up the wazoo now.

I still regularly do some Alex Normal runs, since I'm not spending Eso on my tertiary jobs. I still get new players a lot, from any roles, and I will typically have their role explained before they are done with the Cutscene, or by the time we get to the boss. I regularly clear with this new people usually on the first try. Most roles don't even need an explanation depending on turn.

So far the "worst" I've seen is Floor 1 with DPS that are being given responsibilities for the first time in their life (Which is why I typically go DPS there), and it's not a new-player exclusive. All other turns are very simple to understand. I once 7-maned A3 with a single, sub-par healer and managed to go through. You are all making mountains out of molehills.

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Originally Posted by Selli

Srsly. Does this look like the face of mercy?!

https://scontent-sea1-1.xx.fbcdn.net...eb&oe=55F8F6BA

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im going to have this image in my mind from this point forward when i read these forums. 'You disagree with me?!' /insert image

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Originally Posted by Kyros

It's a lot easier right now, because A) Most everyone has already done it and B) We have gear up the wazoo now.

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mhm
i just like people to understand what to do because there wont always be parties that can basically carry when they re-run the content on a later date so i provide more elaborate detail. not a novel, but more in-depth than a 1 liner. now mind you i am the type to provide explanations so long as my language barrier doesnt get the best of me in the moment. i'm the type to ask if explanations are needed when i see 1st timer notifications and get agitated at preemptive pulls before the individual can reply. i dont want to wipe, i want a smooth run. but i dont think someone should EXPECT others to do something they couldnt do for themself

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Originally Posted by sirDarts

And once again if you want to go in blind, do it, but don't ask for help, you reading a guide takes less time than getting it explained, and guides don't spoil the story.

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I don't understand this line of thinking. Why would you not ask for help if going in blind? The least he can do is say he is new, it's not like it's a secret (It is very obvious who is the new person). I for example, will on my own initiative give an explanation to new player on key roles if I notice it - because I don't want to wipe. And honestly, expecting someone to read a guide is not practical, these kind of players are the kind that won't read a guide on how to play their own job correctly, much less a specific turn.

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Originally Posted by Kyros

I don't understand this line of thinking. Why would you not ask for help if going in blind? The least he can do is say he is new, it's not like it's a secret (It is very obvious who is the new person). I for example, will on my own initiative give an explanation to new player on key roles if I notice it - because I don't want to wipe. And honestly, expecting someone to read a guide is not practical, these kind of players are the kind that won't read a guide on how to play their own job correctly, much less a specific turn.

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I don't understand your line of thinking.
If you want to go in BLIND, just do it BLIND.
If you don't want to do the content blind, read a guide.
EXPECTING to get stuff explained is just wrong.

Though saying this, if someone does ask for help in a dungeon, or boss pointers, or something, I am usually the first one to explain stuff, as long as I know it (I might not know some mechanics being a healer main). But going into content and EXPECTING to get everything handed on a silver platter, that's just wrong.

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Originally Posted by Kyros

Why would you not ask for help if going in blind?

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The same reason they don't read a spoiler free guide.
If you really wanna go blind, you don't ask for explanations.
If you want to ask for explanations, why didn't you read a spoiler free guide?

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Originally Posted by Kyros

Explaining something takes like, 3 lines. That's about 10 seconds of writing. I can probably get that done while running to the boss with no time lost. You are expecting someone to spend 5+ minutes watching a video instead. So no, it's not "That easy".

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3 lines is enough to explain it to someone that has seen the fight before. For someone that has no idea what you're talking about, it's not going to help anything.

I don't understand how you are worried about spoiling bosses story-wise when the bosses are not relevant to the story.

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Originally Posted by Kolaina

mhm
i just like people to understand what to do because there wont always be parties that can basically carry when they re-run the content on a later date so i provide more elaborate detail. not a novel, but more in-depth than a 1 liner. now mind you i am the type to provide explanations so long as my language barrier doesnt get the best of me in the moment. i'm the type to ask if explanations are needed when i see 1st timer notifications and get agitated at preemptive pulls before the individual can reply. i dont want to wipe, i want a smooth run. but i dont think someone should EXPECT others to do something they couldnt do for themself

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Yeah, exactly. I went over this in another thread, but the fight you're doing matters in the context of reading/watching a guide.

Take A1, for example. What do I need to tell my co-tank if they are completely new? "go to the other end of the room when the alarm sounds, voke .5, keep it there". That's it, that's all I gotta do,and assuming they know how to tank, we will have a smooth run.

Now comes A3, and while it's a much lighter fight mechanics wise than a SCoB or FCoB turn, it requires a bit more explanation. What do you need to know? The boss has 3 forms. The hand has cleaves that share damage. The hand splits into 2 parts and they must be tanked facing opposite ways. When he turns into a water spout, you have to take the tethers away from other players. For the magnets, opposites attract and likes repel. The 2nd part of the humanoid phase will have stacking vulnerabilities on you a-la-Shiva EX so a tank swap will make things smoother.

Three possible outcomes can happen here:

A. The other tank is new and makes it known. I'll explain the fight but still be ready to haul ass and take all tethers because I can't trust them to do it. I may tank the 2 hands for longer than I'd want to if they're not quick enough to realize what's going on. I may point the hand at the party because I don't see them standing next to me. I hope they can switch with me at 5 stacks. The kicker is that they don't need to do any of those things. Do I still explain it to them? Yes, because I'd like to think that all players want to make a run a smooth as possible in consideration of your seven team mates until proven otherwise.

B. The person is completely blind and doesn't want an explanation. Piggyback time. I'll point the hand at the group because they don't know about its damage-sharing cleaves. I'll have to take all tethers. I'll have both hands on me and mitigate like hell. I'll hope that the DPS is fast enough to burn the boss before I get more than 12 stacks. I won't get salty and try to do my best to ensure the smoothest run I can with the hand I was dealt.

C. A mixture of A and B except the other tank also doesn't know what they're doing either. Good luck!

D. (oh look, a fourth one!) The other tank watches a 3 minute guide (yes, an A3 guide is 3 minutes, so nice hyperbole going with the "6+minute" guide, Kyros) and neither gets carried nor gets spoonfed by another player inside the dungeon. See? They learned what they needed to learn, except they did it at their own time.

No one is required to explain a fight inside a dungeon. It's courteous of them to do so, but you could also say that it's courteous of you to watch a 3 minute guide, or do some light reading. Expecting someone to spoon feed you and then crying when they don't, however, is wrong.

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Originally Posted by Odett

Take A1, for example. What do I need to tell my co-tank if they are completely new? "go to the other end of the room when the alarm sounds, voke .5, keep it there". That's it, that's all I gotta do,and assuming they know how to tank, we will have a smooth run.

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If they're completely new you have them MT it and stand completely still. A fresh tank + A1 is probably the only case where you'd be able to explain the fight quicker than a short guide, though.