Yoshi have not worked on XI.Quote:
Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok
Did Yoshi P messed up the relics Im trying to understand the meaning of this help me!
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08-11-2015, 04:55 PMFelis
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08-11-2015, 05:02 PMStrejdaTom
If they give us headstart on the new relic (if we have ZETA) and it is some fine headstart, I will be completely fine throwing my old ZETA into trashbin.
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08-11-2015, 05:46 PMVinestraIf you want to grind do the PvP Ranks, or the Who wants to be a Gillionaire achievements. There is grinds in FFxiv.Quote:
Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok
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08-11-2015, 05:54 PMaerialrave
I spent over 20 million gil making my Zeta. Those Tier4 materias cost me more than gil, they basically cost me a part of my soul with every failed meld. After that ordeal, dropping a few million on the marketboards for overpriced mats for the Zodiac was nothing.
It is definitely a heartbreak, but we have been warned in advance. You just can't stop vertical gear progression. Just remember that for the next time you spend time/effort/gil/your soul on something. 2-3 patches later and it will be worthless. Remember that. -
08-11-2015, 05:58 PMJibeMalkieri
So I didn't read through every post to see if anyone's mentioned this:
But the Esoteric weapons are not the relic weapons, Relic weapons are 3.1 we most likely will have details on them coming with the first wave of major info regarding that patch. -
08-11-2015, 06:02 PMDaraliiIt's possible that the esoteric weapons will be the base form of the new relics(akin to the unfinished versions). Them and the 2.X relics are, as far as I know, the only weapons in the game that are exclusive to the jobs and can't also be equipped by the base classes.Quote:
Originally Posted by JibeMalkieri
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08-11-2015, 06:03 PMEidolonYou and I both don't know this, but considering these are the ONLY job specific weapons in the game aside from relic? It's pretty safe to assume it will be AF2.Quote:
Originally Posted by JibeMalkieri
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08-11-2015, 06:15 PMGilthasI don't feel disrespected because it's easier to get relics now. Probably because I'm not entirely selfish.Quote:
Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok
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08-11-2015, 07:06 PMAlmalexiaThis is not FFXI.Quote:
Originally Posted by This thread
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08-11-2015, 07:16 PMTadacho
Hm, just because there was a relic weapon in FFXI and a "relic weapon" (although they are actually called Zodiac weapon) in FFXIV this does not mean they are the same thing.
A relic weapon in XI was designed as a massive undertaking which would be the best weapon.
A relic weapon in XIV was designed as a grinding alternative to the current best raiding weapon designed to last you as long as that current best raiding weapon.
It was always advertised as an alternative to the current best raid weapon. Always. The only people who thought it would continue to grow and be the best weapon beyond 3.0 were those people (such as yourself OP) clinging on to the idea of it being the same relic weapon model as XI. It is not, and was never designed as such. Also, the grind to obtain a XIV zodiac weapon was nowhere near as insurmountable as XI's relic weapon grind, I don't know why you would think they were even comparable. -
08-11-2015, 07:33 PMVapa
next on the menu will be---
Why do Zeta weapon owners get a head start on 3.1 relics. Life is so unfair.......
lol
Don't forget, we ground it out because it was a great weapon option available to us (otherwise most wouldn't of had). But now once you've reached 50, it takes longer (even with nerf) to get your relic than it does to get your character to lv 55 (better weapons now available). So other than to glamour it or to "try" and get that step ahead in 3.1 people won't even touch it.
I don't see why they should have to go through all that trouble we had to for something that's easily replaceable now. Since they don't really get to reap in the rewards of having "the best". -
08-11-2015, 09:02 PMReynhartI...laughed...hard.Quote:
Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok
Dynamis first version :
- Cost 1 million gils to enter each time
- Could only enter once every 72 hours
- Need a full Linkshell to clear
- Had an abysmal drop rate for ancient currency, especially major ones
Present Dynamis :
- Cost 50kgils for a key item granting permanent access
- Can enter once every day
- Mobs can be soloed at lvl 90, a party of 75 can kill them and they even give XP.
- Each mob can be "proced" with a spell/skill/weapon skill (depending on type and hour) to ensure a currency drop, even a major currency drop if you manage to obtain a white proc
Yep...no nerf...ever...
And for quite some time, the relics were garbage compared to any weapon in the Seekers Of Adoulin expansion pack, before too much people complained about that. -
08-11-2015, 09:09 PMabzoluut
I still find it a bit senseless that people think they have earned some sort of recognition when completing zeta.
Why would there be an advantage in an expension when you ineptly obtained a weapon? Do people with T13 clear need to feel the same way? That actually asks for some form of aptitude. However, you can just start raiding in HW.
I think the true feeling is that people like the OP want others to go through the same things. Only then it's justified for them to start the new relic. Or, people who took the time to finish the zeta, should have this mindboggling advantage.. -
08-11-2015, 09:26 PMMoonlegActually, people think that because Yoshida said so in a Live Letter; no one knows what this 'consideration' means, though. There have been tons of speculation ranging from a head start on a new relic (unlikely) to anyone that obtains a Zeta at any point, past or future, gaining access to the mentioned glamour shop of relic stages. But at its core, people think they have earned recognition for their Zeta because the lead game designer said so.Quote:
Originally Posted by abzoluut
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08-11-2015, 09:41 PMReynhartWhile I'm not for forcing people to do the whole grind as I did, I think it's fair that the invested time is "lampshaded".Quote:
Originally Posted by abzoluut
It's exactly like the Legacy status or keeping characters level when transitioning from 1.0 to 2.0. It's fine that leveling is much faster in ARR, but it would have been a real pain in the ass if I had to redo the whole leveling process for the jobs I already played.
Besides, it has been said time and time again that the "head start" for the new relic will be really slight, at best, for Zeta owners, so it's not a big deal anyway. -
08-11-2015, 09:44 PMMaero
True that those of us who started/did Relic before any of the nerfs had a way longer and annoying journey but nerfs are just a part of the mmo genre of game i guess.
We were basically the testers for SE, lol
I am totally fine with nerfs to the Relic as it currently is not relevant of a weapon until the next one, which btw i was very annoyed at first in hw that a dungeon drop weapon was better then my Zeta but i have got over it.
Let's just hope the "taken into consideration" is just not some dye or something option.
Life is not fair, what can you do.. -
08-11-2015, 09:50 PMVelstriker
I really liked reading this thread, Thank you.
I agree with everyone here, the idea that keeping the relic quest the same and just continuing on in 3.1 is impossible. DRK/MCH/AST have no 2.0 relic and to basically tell anyone who enjoys these new jobs "screw you, we did stuff before your job existed" is an insane way of adding content to this game. I hope that the "consideration" zeta holders get in the new relic quest-line isn't TOO substantial because of this. I get it, you put in some grind, you should get acknowledged for it. As a DRK I hope i don't have to jump through a million hoops just to be on equal ground when the new relic hits. -
08-11-2015, 09:52 PMckc22
Old content should be made more accessible.
Your real problem is with vertical progression. -
08-11-2015, 09:57 PMHorseBoots
FFXIV line of progression is vertical, ever increasing increments of powers as the time goes on.
FFXI line of progression was horizontal, multiple paths to attain power that all capped off at the same point.
It is two completely different styles of progression, for two completely different style of games. You're not going to be using that same relic for 9+ years like you wore those Leaping Lizzy boots.
FFXIV =/= FFXI 2: Electric Boogaloo
/thread -
08-11-2015, 10:01 PMkarateorangutang
@ OP
I hope its a new quest. I did my relic quest in 2.5... but I did them on PLD and I am quite unhappy with what they did with the class in 3.0.
I would be kinda annoyed that I would be punished for what I feel are design oversights. -
08-11-2015, 10:03 PMFendredFFXI was made that way to more closely match the expectations players would have about certain equipment and mechanics from previous Final Fantasy titles. They managed to hold out for quite a long time before raising the level cap again in Abyssea.Quote:
Originally Posted by HorseBoots
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08-11-2015, 10:06 PMjustinjarjar
Did skizzle make another whine thread? Does he want some cheese with that wine? More at 11.
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08-11-2015, 10:07 PMVelhart
Why don't we just trash FFXIV and make FFXI-2? This game is obviously just a complete failure of a MMO and not going anywhere at all. Am I right fellows...right!?
http://i.imgur.com/r5ziw.gif -
08-11-2015, 10:24 PMJetstream_FoxWhat's the "consideration" the first step skipped? If they consider anything it should be to make the steps less influenced by the community. Seriously half the relic is influenced by other players. Need materia? Spend weeks SBing or fork over 600k on the mb! Need a high end desynthesis item? Spend weeks grinding a otherwise useless skill or fork over another 600k! The only time it seemed ok was atma and light farming.Quote:
Originally Posted by Moonleg
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08-11-2015, 10:35 PMReynhartDon't worry, it's coming...on mobile :pQuote:
Originally Posted by Velhart
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08-11-2015, 10:40 PMDeviant1I have to love all the ffxi bashing i see. There are a lot of systems that were in ffxi that are still miles ahead of ffxiv: AH, Mog housing, merit points, gear, abilities, and job distinguishing features. Not even to mention that it is what going on its 12th year or something like that?Quote:
Originally Posted by Velhart
How many games can honestly say they have that type of player retention with a multi-million subscriber count game as their competition? Even in the best of WOW times, ffxi still had customers bringing in the money, so there cant be anything good there... lol
With relics, tomestones, and now scrips the line between which is more grindy in ffxi vs ffxiv is getting blurred. -
08-11-2015, 10:41 PMVelhartNot good enough. FFXIV needs to be shut down to revamp it again. Transport all our characters to a HD Vana'diel and remake all the content so its like pre-WoTG. Making a game where accessibility for both casual and hardcore is simply scrub talk.Quote:
Originally Posted by Reynhart
I loved FFXI as much as the next person (2003-2010). The game however is being held together by veterans only. The amount of new players is extremely minimal. They are even attempting to bring people in by making it mobile, which is actually a genius idea if done well. I won't argue some things could be brought from it to benefit FFXIV. Unfortunately, a lot of the ideas people in these forums bring are either based off archaic design or it simply does not work in the context of FFXIV. These said people like the OP really just want a FFXI-2 at the end of the day rather they admit it or not.Quote:
Originally Posted by Deviant1
FFXIV has it's share of balance issues, but no where near to the extent that FFXI did and still has today. FFXI has not been able to truly somewhat balance jobs since Day 1 and still struggle to make some jobs relevant today. You say job distinguishing features is a good thing, which it is, but going to FFXI as a source is a terrible thing to do. I think jobs in this game differ from one another enough to be their own thing. -
08-11-2015, 10:43 PMLineageRazorThere has been nothing but silence on the exact nature of what the "consideration" will be, and I expect that to be the case up until the very day the new Relics are released. Keep your expectations low, or you are almost certain to be disappointed. Personally, I'm expecting that those who created Zeta relics will receive an exclusive glamour body armor. It will a T-shirt with the text, "I crafted a Zeta Relic, and all I got was this lousy T-shirt!"Quote:
Originally Posted by Jetstream_Fox
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08-11-2015, 10:45 PMFirepower
Bring back 3 hours of waiting in Jeuno to get an EXP party that disbands after 5 minutes because it can't get Chain 5 due to someone not grinding for a week to get the gil to buy a haubergeon or scorpion harness just to get the acc to hit things (Pre sushi era)
/sarcasm -
08-11-2015, 10:59 PMReynhartYeah, you're right...Quote:
Originally Posted by Deviant1
But we shouldn't forget having to talk to absolutely every NPC in the world each time you finish a quest, gain a level or changing jobs, in case he might have a new quest to offer you.
Doing quests that don't refresh on your log (or even don't appear until you finish them, hello, BRD's unlocking quest) and only gave you very very vague indication.
Or camping NM for hours while competing with 50 other people to drop an item with 3% chance resulting on the market controled by spoils from gil sellers.
Or camping an invisible NM that could only aggro by casting a spell, if only you even know that the NM exists.
Or doing and endless numbers of Dynamis to gain a pitiful amount of currency and being lucky if the leader of your LS doesn't keep it all for him and breaks the LS without any notice.
Or killing beastmean for hours to drop a f**king coffer chest.
Or having your job totally scrapped because it took the spotlight for too long and now it's RDM time ! No, MNK time ! No, THF time ! No, BLM time !
Or paying an extra fee to make another character just because the game didn't give you enough room to keep all your items.
Or just playing at a snail's pace just because it claims to be "more tactical" (8 seconds between each Great Sword swing...kill me now)
Or ignoring half of your spells except when the game forces you to use it in Abyssea.
Or paying more for a log wood than for a whole bunch of arrows made using this said log (Or selling the same log higher than the set of arrows).
Or having to buy twenty stacks of pickaxe because one breaks every two swings.
Or being chased by monsters around an entire map. -
08-11-2015, 11:20 PMInstrumentalityI think I spent a little over eight weeks irl time (not game time) on my relic and around 11 million gil?Quote:
Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok
So 9% of irl time from 2.0-3.0 in which I accomplished lots of other things while also grinding relic is a big timesink? I dunno, sounds kinda casual/easy to get to me? -
08-11-2015, 11:28 PMCatwhoBy the time Seekers of Adoulin was released, only two relics were still worth it: Gjallarhorn and Aegis. And 99 Ghorn was second fiddle to the Empyrean harp, which was the third set of "relic-like" weapons SE released for XI. Professional bards and paladins were expected to have both instruments and both shields, and juggle them when appropriate. (Excalibur was outclassed by then so PLDs were allowed to escape that.)Quote:
Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok
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08-11-2015, 11:44 PMWarlyxGjallarhorn? meh , Daurdabla let the brd put a 3rd song....Quote:
Originally Posted by Catwho
Aegis : magic dmg taken -25% at 75.... -50% at 99.
FFXIV ....u can change to DRK for magic mitigation :P
I hope relic this time is done right , because i hated the Novus stage... -
08-12-2015, 12:19 AMNaliee
http://i.imgur.com/v5ShpbC.gif
XI and XIV are two different games. Plus, last time I checked relic was optional thing to do. Not something you must have.Quote:
1) People with a zeta have been promised 'consideration' when the Heavensward relic quest line begins in 3.1
2) Traditionally, an expansion to an MMO means that all the stuff you had becomes effectively useless. It has always been this way and will always be this way, otherwise newer players will always be years behind with no realistic way of catching up.
What you GOT from your investment was months of being at the top of the line; not an eternal place among the stars.
And they did let us know early enough that Zeta ends there, but that we'd get new thing. In time. -
08-12-2015, 12:33 AMIbiIt's not quite an apples to apples comparison though, because those relics with the low drop rates (Warglaives, Thori'dal) were good to go as soon as they dropped. It would be equivalent to T9 or T13 having a 1% chance a chance to drop Zeta weapons.Quote:
Originally Posted by Colorful
For the quested relics (Val'anyr, Fangs of the Father), I believe the drop rates stayed the same, but it's possible to go in and easily kill the bosses solo even on their heroic setting, rather than requiring 10 or 25 people, which vastly speeds up the process.
Why? Because you say so? Despite what your posting record seems to indicate you think, you do not speak on behalf of the player base.Quote:
Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok
If you feel that the criteria for being enjoyable is that something has to be both a grind and rewarding, you're setting terrible criteria and probably playing the wrong game (although the fact that you feel you have to make daily threads complaining about one facet of the game or another should probably have been sufficient evidence of the second part of that).Quote:
Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok
If grinding and rewarding really is your thing though, perhaps work on something like the Fenrir mount. I hear that's an incredibly grindy process, and unlikely to be nerfed any time soon.
Or, if you wanted something challenging (rather than just grinding) and rewarding, you could try actually doing some of the tougher content in this game, since your achievements show you haven't yet killed the extreme Primals or Alexander Normal (and therefore can't have set foot into Savage).
That's kind of odd, given that you were lamenting a week and a half ago about burning out "farming Alex gears now as an alternatives" and how much of a chore it was.
Unless all these threads you keep making are just trying to make sure you live up to your FC rank of TROLOLOL Master. -
08-12-2015, 01:16 AMMalevicton
Yeah, I always feel betrayed when I have a personal idea for how something should work and someone instead goes with what was always the intended design.
Wait no I don't because that's literally insane. -
08-12-2015, 01:22 AMIlitsa
"replaced overnight", the Zeta is not replaced until around level 56-58. That's almost the ENTIRE leveling process of this expansion. I think we got our money's worth out of the ARR relics. I look forward to doing HW's relic questline next.
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08-12-2015, 04:57 PMSkizzleofRagnarok
Again no one wants a new FFXI so drop that. We said maybe use some elements in fact we are discussing one thing only and thats to make the relic grind enjoyable rewarding and in some way make it feel you earned this.
Expansion or not there are other ways to get items and make them as pro as everything else.
Overmelds,currency,ex primals,endgame raid etc Why must this also be nerfed and placed in that category. Out of everything mentioned before that The relic IS the most time consuming of it all and most likely the most expensive way to go.
Yet we got punished for dedicating time and putting money into it.
Instead of a new chapter it should have just continued to expand.
Regardless if your relic worked in the new expansion new weapons got released that where just as good and some came from quests so what was the point again if stuff matched up to it? -
08-12-2015, 05:13 PMAshkendorI'd peg overmelds as the most expensive thing to do, actually. Novus bottoms out at 50% chance to meld materia to the scroll. When you pentameld with tier IV's, you're looking at a cool 6 or 7% chance to do that last meld.Quote:
Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok
This isn't punishing those that made Zetas any more than Echo is punishing raiders or the new gear is punishing crafters that made Lucis tools. It's the nature of the beast when you're talking about a vertical progression MMO. Old things are replaced by new things and become obsolete. This isn't FFXI. We don't have horizontal progression.Quote:
Yet we got punished for dedicating time and putting money into it.
Instead of a new chapter it should have just continued to expand.
After a certain point, quest chains just get too unwieldy for people to catch up with. This was the case with the relic quest. Even with all of the nerfs, the grind is still pretty real when you consider it's only a glamour item now. -
08-12-2015, 05:23 PMAsierid"So let me sit here and talk about XI with hearts/longing in my eyes and suggest things from a different game. I'm just comparing the two for no real reason..."Quote:
Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok
Oh. Right. That's totally relevant to the topic at hand. Just because XI has it means we should too. Got it. Never mind that they are two different styles of MMO and the relic is now old content.Quote:
FFXI was never like that so i have no idea wich MMO you are talking about? I came from FFXI straight to FFXIV.
Soo...why not let people experience it? Because -you- had to grind for it? Please. It's not even relevant anymore (or a big deal for that matter).