SE, Stop promoting AFK gameplay.

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Originally Posted by Gallus

And it is? But that doesn't mean I don't play the game for fun? Who in here doesn't play the game for fun? I think it's already implied ALL OF US PLAY THE GAME FOR FUN, what other reasons could we have? But one thing does not exclude the other. Rewards are PART of the fun and play a big role on many people's motivation to play certain content.

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So people should only do stuff if it fits your definition of fun? I know someone that still like CT, the original one, why, because they like that Atomos fight, you get jack from that fight, but this person still will que up and do it just for that.

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Originally Posted by Divinemight

You are simply trying to find an easy way out because this is not those free to play IOS/Android application games where you can just dump in cash to get what you want instantly.

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Yeah, indeed. That's why my favourite games are RPGs, I do not enjoy time sinks lol, and that is why too I have an Animus and a Novus, 24 atmas, 1800 mobs, 54 fates and 54 leves. Instant gratification you've said it well. "Oh but don't do it", but I did, and would do it again, because I like this game, and because I enjoy the 95% of its content, and I want to use my relic in the content I like, and I want to keep enjoying it, and if I have to put up with all the absolute mind numbing boring and tedious content like the hunts and the atma grind I will if I feel I'm on the mood, but that doesn't mean I'm not going to say "Brilliant SE, good job, I want my i120 relic upgrade to be something along the lines of: travel 350000 KMS WITH YOUR CHOCOBO".

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Originally Posted by Mcshiggs

So people should only do stuff if it fits your definition of fun? I know someone that still like CT, the original one, why, because they like that Atomos fight, you get jack from that fight, but this person still will que up and do it just for that.

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The atma grind is NOT fun, don't say it's "just my opinion", you'll find 99 out of 100 people that will tell you IT'S NOT FUN, and then you'll have the overly exceptional dude with some strange twisted tastes/who was overly lucky that will tell you that he enjoyed his/her atma quest. There's a reason why the most used argument against the people who complain about the Atma grind is "don't do it, no one forces you". How many people have you seen using the same argument as you? Almost none, because claiming the atma grind is a matter of tastes is beyond ridiculous.

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Originally Posted by Gallus

I have an Animus and a Novus, 24 atmas, 1800 mobs, 54 fates and 54 leves.

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Are these your game career totals? Please specify.

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Originally Posted by Gallus

then you'll have the dude with some kind of mental disorder/was overly lucky that will tell you that he enjoyed his/her atma quest ... because claiming the atma grind is a matter of tastes is beyond ridiculous.

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Check yourself, that's some REALLY offensive language.

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Originally Posted by Gallus

"Brilliant SE, good job, I want my i120 relic upgrade to be something along the lines of: travel 350000 KMS WITH YOUR CHOCOBO".

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Is KMS supposed to be killamalms, because with the ilm malm yalm thing, I don't think Eorzea would suddenly switch to metric?

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Originally Posted by Gallus

The atma grind is NOT fun, don't say it's "just my opinion",

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When did I mention atma, you brought it up after, my posts were about you commening on frontlines, and I brought up a friend liking CT, so are you just trying to add in stuff and pretend I said it to argue? Or maybe it was just you trying to bring up a novus weapon so you could brag, do you want a cookie? Also saying someone that likes something you don't, the atma grind, as having

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Originally Posted by Gallus

some kind of mental disorder

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really just goes to show what type of person you really, I hope you have fun with your Novus, and I am going to guess your 37 cats.

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Originally Posted by Mcshiggs

Is KMS supposed to be killamalms, because with the ilm malm yalm thing, I don't think Eorzea would suddenly switch to metric?


When did I mention atma, you brought it up after, my posts were about you commening on frontlines, and I brought up a friend liking CT, so are you just trying to add in stuff and pretend I said it to argue?

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Oh but you are bringing up the definition of KMs which is indeed very relevant to this topic.

The 'best' weapons are now, and will always be, gained from the top tier raid: currently, Binding Coil 2. The devs have never expressed any intent to give the best gear through any other means, in fact they've said the opposite: the Relic chain grind is an alternate method to get a powerful, but not BiS, weapon.

It's basically for those that don't like raiding.

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Originally Posted by ZephyrAM

The 'best' weapons are now, and will always be, gained from the top tier raid: currently, Binding Coil 2. The devs have never expressed any intent to give the best gear through any other means, in fact they've said the opposite: the Relic chain grind is an alternate method to get a powerful, but not BiS, weapon.

It's basically for those that don't like raiding.

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And why does that have to become killing level 3 toads with a rotation of 2 spells for the next 100 hours?

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Originally Posted by Issac

Are these your game career totals? Please specify.



Check yourself, that's some REALLY offensive language.

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Edited. I don't think it's that offensive, but I don't want to eat a forum ban for this.

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Originally Posted by Gallus

And why does that have to become killing level 3 toads with a rotation of 2 spells for the next 100 hours?

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It only takes 100 hours if you do 5 FATEs, take a 2 hour break to watch a movie, do 3 FATEs, go run errands, do 10 FATEs, sleep, go to work, rinse and repeat.

There's nothing wrong with doing it that way! But complaining about it doesn't get it done any faster. How do I do it? I did a zone's FATEs nonstop for a maximum of 2 hours. If I didn't get it by then, I'd take a break. Doing it this way I got all the atma in under 2 weeks. This is accounting for a full-time job and sleeping, of course, as well as time with my friends and such.

Sure, it's entirely possible to go hours upon hours without drops, but the law of large numbers comes into play; eventually you WILL get it. There are also other factors to consider: Are you getting a gold rating every single time or are you half-distracted watching a movie?

The reality is that relics are not meant to be something obtained in a day. Yeah there's a grind involved but some do appreciate that level of effort for a badge. You may think them socially disordered, but to each their own. You reply in circles and your arguments are falling apart.

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Originally Posted by Gallus

Yeah, indeed. That's why my favourite games are RPGs, I do not enjoy time sinks lol

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S/E is simply unable to please everyone isnt it? That applies to all gaming companies. I personally dislike those games that giving out welfare gears to the players. It is a mechanic that is killing the mmorpg. Why dont you go play dialbo 3 or Star Ocean Online 2 if that is the type of gameplay you want?

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Originally Posted by Mcshiggs

really just goes to show what type of person you really, I hope you have fun with your Novus, and I am going to guess your 37 cats.

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What kind of person I am? For what? For having an opinion? For stating that certain content is boring and that SE shouldn't keep going this line if they want to keep players hyped? What do you even mean with "the kind of person I am", you are the one that has gone offtopic since you opened your mouth in here. You've claimed "I didn't play this game for fun?" which was a silly comment in the first place, then you went on further and made a silly joke about KMs, offered me a cookie (how nice of you). I haven't landed a single offensive comment to no one since this thread started, I'm just saying a certain content of this game is very poorly implemented, but you've been clearly offensive to me since your first post. So go look yourself at the mirror before coming here and judging people.

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Originally Posted by Gallus

I haven't landed a single offensive comment to no one since this thread started,

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You have already gone back and edited one of your posts because of offensive comments, if it wasn't offensive, you wouldn't have edited it.

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Originally Posted by Mcshiggs

You have already gone back and edited one of your posts because of offensive comments, if it wasn't offensive, you wouldn't have edited it.

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It could have been potentially seen as "offensive language", but I wasn't specifically insulting anyone or offering cookies.

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Originally Posted by Gallus

/sitting for the next 30 hours in 27 fates waiting for them to pop from you 9 animus books is NOT fun.
Running around in circles/afking with an app radar is NOT fun.

Why do you insist on making the players NOT play this game in order to acquire SIGNIFICANT stuff?

There are over 15 level 50 dungeons, all of them with arguably fun mechanics, 5 primals, mog, frontlines... but the arguably most valuable stuff you can obtain in this game is via killing level 5 sprites for the next 100 hours (aka atma grind) and afking in a 8 man party with an app radar?

The next relic upgrade gonna be dance the manderville 100 hours in each area?

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Simple.

You do not NEED to do the Atma/Atmus/Novus Questline. There are, and will always be, weapons of the same level/better in game. It is an alternate weapon/content. BC/Primals is considered the more prudent path for those who enjoy active play/challenging play/have a preformed group.

Allied Marks:
So don't camp? Again, you don't NEED allied marks. The gear isn't better than what you can get other ways, and the vanity/yard items =not too difficult/time consuming to get if you just did your 3 daily non-fate locked marks, and then happened to join in any mark battle you chanced to meet. All the stuff that most people are farming these for drop in other places...and technically are easier to 'farm' for. But you need a dedicated team.

As to the sands: If you aren't actually grinding BC2, well...then technically you don't even need them....the gear you have for the content you are grinding is fine...heck, even people grinding BC2 don't need the sands atm. They are just nice to have for upgrades.

So really, if you don't like it, don't do it...if enough don't do it, SE will change it.

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Originally Posted by Nadrojj

As said multiple times in the thread, if you don't like the content don't do it. No one forces you to stand around in one area for a fate, no one forces you to do anything. You are free to make every choice you want in game, god forbid you have to grind a little bit to get something of note, or have a little patience.

The best part is, you're complain about it, but you're going to keep doing the content because you want the end result. Just like when people complain about how much they hate their job, but they wake up and go to it every day so they can get paid. Why are you even playing an mmo if you are complaining about time sinks?

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This. If a quest line looks like it's gonna be a pain in the ass and is gonna make me dislike the game? Guess what, I don't do the shit.

Well after seeing the OP act like a child for the last 2 pages I can't really defend/agree with them anymore.

I still think that having to grind low level FATEs to get some of the best weapons in the game is the wrong way for SE to do things. I don't find it fun and will probably always miss out on that "content" because I don't find it fun. That sucks, it really does, but I'll live and will continue to support threads that are against it unless they change it or at least make it less random. As long as it takes 10 hrs for 1 person and 100 hrs for another person to get the same reward I will never agree with it.

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Originally Posted by Gallus

The next relic upgrade gonna be dance the manderville 100 hours in each area?

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You know, Id take that requirement over the current Atma RNG Grind. At least I will get enjoyment out of watching my Lala silly dancing and not have to kill the same fates for hours on end, hoping to see a single item drop. And yes, my RNG luck is horrible more often than not.

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Originally Posted by Gallus

Yeah, indeed. That's why my favourite games are RPGs, I do not enjoy time sinks lol.

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Uhhh.... What? Have you ever played any Final Fantasy ever? There are time sinks in EVERY SINGLE ONE.

Hell MOST RPGs have some kind of level system. All of which are time sinks.

Baldur's Gate? Yep time sinks
All of the Elder Scroll games? Time sinks

It does suck. Waited around 3 hours in Sylphlands waiting for Breaking Dawn only to discover it's a hunt so it goes down in about 30 seconds so I didn't get enough credit towards my atma book. >_>

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Originally Posted by DoctorPepper

Well after seeing the OP act like a child for the last 2 pages I can't really defend/agree with them anymore.

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More childish or less childish than this kind of stuff?

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Originally Posted by Nadrojj

So you're going to continue to do them, but complain about it on the forums? Enjoy. Sounds like you're spending your time wisely.

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Originally Posted by Sapphic

I get fun from it. That's why I do Frontlines.

I know, shocking aint it?!

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Originally Posted by Mcshiggs

So if you don't play the game for fun, why do you play it?

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Originally Posted by Divinemight

You are simply trying to find an easy way out because this is not those free to play IOS/Android application games where you can just dump in cash to get what you want instantly. MMORPG rewards their players if we put in time and effort.

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And more nice words for the OP:

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Originally Posted by Mcshiggs

Is KMS supposed to be killamalms, because with the ilm malm yalm thing, I don't think Eorzea would suddenly switch to metric?
Or maybe it was just you trying to bring up a novus weapon so you could brag, do you want a cookie? Also saying someone that likes something you don't, the atma grind, as having

really just goes to show what type of person you really, I hope you have fun with your Novus, and I am going to guess your 37 cats.

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And if the OP gets offended and answers those kind of replies in a not so polite way, then the OP is a child. Seriously dude, with friends like you, nobody needs enemies.

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Originally Posted by Canopia

You know, Id take that requirement over the current Atma RNG Grind. At least I will get enjoyment out of watching my Lala silly dancing and not have to kill the same fates for hours on end, hoping to see a single item drop. And yes, my RNG luck is horrible more often than not.

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I know, I would take dancing the manderville for the next 500 hours over the atma grind any day of the week, but I just wanted to put an example of an absurdly mindless grind and that's the first thing that crossed my mind.

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Originally Posted by Gallus

More childish or less childish than this kind of stuff?

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Umm, how are any of those posters "childish"? You have literally posted 4 pages of whining over nothing. You seem to not like atma grinding, the posters said you don't have to do it, how is that childish? Childish doesn't mean "the other person doesn't agree with me".

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Originally Posted by Gallus

More childish or less childish than this kind of stuff?

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Haha, don't get me wrong, I'm not defending them either. I just think you could have reacted a little differently, you don't fight fire with fire. You really shouldn't let things offend you so easily.

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Originally Posted by Magis

Umm, how are any of those posters "childish"?.

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It is because OP felt hurt that he is unable to winning support for his complaint. What else? He just want item to be hand to him on top of a silver plate then he can either move to next or complain that the game is "lacking of contents". All MMORPG is a timesink and players only will be reward after putting time and efforts.

Well I'm not a stone, and I'm just honest about what I feel and what I see, and if there's something I don't like I say it, just like the atma grind. Agree or disagree with me, but I'll never get used to this kind of random stuff you are thrown from everywhere when you complain about something to the point people even start correcting your grammar mistakes (glad it didn't happen this time)? I never understood the sense of that. I mean, whenever I come to this forum or any other forum, I look for stuff I'm interested in, I'm not going to start looking for those posts I disagree with the TC and tell those people they are stupid, but hey, again, that's just me, what do they say? Different strokes for different folks or something like that?

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Originally Posted by Gallus

Well I'm not a stone, and I'm just honest about what I feel and what I see, and if there's something I don't like I say it, just like the atma grind.

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They are offering you alternatives, but you are calling them childish. Yea sure, but I will keep my politness in front of your rudeness. You can always punish S/E by not subscribe. How about that? This is the most effecive way of telling a game company that they are doing something wrong. Players did to S/E at FF14 1.0. You can always do that again, but out of curiosity, how many of players are sharing same opinion as you are? Only 5% of playerbase will effectively use fourm, and I already fail to see that you are winning support within this 5% fourm users.

agreed. Grinding is completly fine. I dont mind running bosses and dungeons endlessly, but these endless zergfest content called fates and "hunts" are completly boring to me and I'm not planning to participate in the hunt. If hunts had mobs like on leves, where only the party gets to fight, it would be pretty fun.

running for 10 minutes to reach a hunt mob just to find it dead = not fun
fighting a hunt mob for 10 minutes = fun

The amount of time spent is the same, the differenace is that one makes you want to play the game, and the other makes you want to watch TV ( > . >

Also Gallus, dont pay attention to the whiteknight trolls lol, luckily they're not the one developing the game :D What's imporant is that SE read your feedback, you dont need to care about what others say

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Originally Posted by Gallus

I'm not going to start looking for those posts I disagree with the TC and tell those people they are stupid

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I'll stop you right there.. the majority of people who are in here are simply disagreeing with you, they are not calling you stupid. The fact is you came to a forum that revolves around a game that people, including yourself, are very passionate about. If somebody sees an idea on the official forum that they do not agree with and that they do not want to see changed they have every right to disagree with you and attempt to make valid points around why they disagree with you. The same goes for you coming here and posting your thoughts, you have every right and initially I even agreed with the things that you were saying but then you let it become personal which is where I stopped agreeing.

The point of a forum is to express ideas and discuss them, just because somebody disagrees does not mean they are calling you stupid. I'll admit that there are a fair share of trolls on here who will say anything to try and get under your skin but it's your choice whether you allow them to do that or not. Acting like they act is not going to help your initial idea so it's best to put your efforts towards proving your point and not having little spats of insults with those people.

Honestly waiting for FATES for my atma bookis not that big a deal. Just find times when you have some down time when it's slow in the game and wait watch a video or something if something better like an elite mark or the chance to party with friends comes up do that. The fate will still be there later. It's no illusion that the atma books are a bit time consuming so if you came in to it thinking you could breeze through probably should not have started. Besides this is an optional weapon no one is forcing you to wait go do ex Levi or ex ramuh for i100 weapon or get in a static and do coils. People should stop crying about anima/atma already it's well known what kind of grind it is if you don't like it don't do it.

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Originally Posted by Recaldy

It does suck. Waited around 3 hours in Sylphlands waiting for Breaking Dawn only to discover it's a hunt so it goes down in about 30 seconds so I didn't get enough credit towards my atma book. >_>

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Omg, it's a FATE in the book I bought yesterday. Oh dear...

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Originally Posted by Zeeg44

Just find times when you have some down time when it's slow in the game and wait watch a video or something

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Every time i see someone suggest this as a thing to do while waiting on something in game I facepalm. If you wanted to watch a video, why would you be playing the game in the first place.

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Originally Posted by Gallus

Beautfiul argument, except it's a bit overused and does not match the reality.

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PvE and PvP are two totally different things. I have PvE for gear progression, PvP for competition against other living players. I want to win knowing I out played the other, not because my gear or their gear was better. I've PvPd in many games where gear had no real significance in the outcome. DaoC, pve gear was practically given as it was that easy to obtain and the PvP is still seen as one of, if not THE, best MMO PvP.

Pre WoW PvP gear didn't exist, then comes WoWs PvP gear progression and everyone expects it. Yet PvP flourished just fine without it before.

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Originally Posted by TheMax1087

Every time i see someone suggest this as a thing to do while waiting on something in game I facepalm. If you wanted to watch a video, why would you be playing the game in the first place.

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i know right? What I get from that is "is not that bad, you can enjoy the game if you don't play it". You're not making it look any better by saying that.

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Originally Posted by Cuervo78

I have to agree with Gallus, the relic quest is just mindless grind with fates that pop every few hours.
If I do some of the other cool stuff (primal/coil/etc) I have a good chance that i miss them, so the options i have is to finish the ugrade somtime next year or walk to the site of an fate and pick up a good book.

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Atma can be got within minutes not hours, FATEs can be forced to spawn, myth was super easy to get even before 2.3 with no need for any Brayflox runs at all. Just a matter of if you use your brain or only keyboard while playing game.

Really? How do you get an ATMA in a few minutes? Read in the devs blog that it is pure luck.

Sitting in one place and waiting on a FATE is boring as hell, yeah, but it's far from the only thing you can do. One thing I did a -lot- while I was working on my animus books was that I'd go into an area, open the map and park it on the space I knew the FATE would spawn at, and then go wander around the zone and do things. Run other FATEs on a different class to try and get another atma or (once I had my first animus weapon) spare alexandrite, kill the target mobs in the area, or just plain spiritbond. Another trick also is that you take a time you'd be afk -anyway- (like say lunchtime) and before you go do that thing, park your char where the FATE pops and just keep half an eye on the screen while you do stuff. You don't have to just sit there and do nothing. And Square's dropping the wait times for a lot of these rarer FATEs too, specifically because of this problem. I agree the three target FATEs are the least fun part of each book, but I don't think it's at all as bad as you make it out to be. And I say this as someone with a novus shield and 6/9 books towards Thyrus Animus finished.