Bring back zones like:

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Originally Posted by Meshico

Not trying to be a nay-sayer here. If people find out which dungeon is easiest thats the one they will all flock to, and so will RMT. People wan't fastest possible exp, fun, so on and so forth. And I'm talking in general here, does not apply to all. Just look at the other games, they would all flock to one little tiny area, and well that would be that, overrun.

But if they do manage to truly implement what you say...that would be glorious!

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In FFXI there were lot of zone that was hardly visited ... but by Beastmaster !!!
Beastmaster RULES/SUX :)

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Originally Posted by Synapse

Only less skilled players prefer instance-fest! ooooooooooooooooh!


Yeah OP im all for this. Sadly few poster above and this new generation of gamers prefer easier things. They rather just stand in town and tell mama jokes while waiting for instance.

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Yes, walking to the dungeon is so much harder than waiting for the queue... I just can't imagine just trying to get past those packs of level 34 mobs on the way to the entrance.

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Originally Posted by AmyNeudaiz

No. I actually am not.

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Sorry Amy, I was just using your logic against you. There's lore ties and many borrowed assets - Did you know, the new dungeon will feature more FFXI mobs? Using YOUR LOGIC, that means we're playing XI-2 already.

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We have meaningful dungeons already.

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You do realize if SE didn't add the roulette system almost no one queues for dungeons once they're long done with them both loot and story wise, right? Prove me wrong: How many times have you honestly queued for the level 16-41 dungeons? You know, just to experience those "meaningful dungeons"? I'm not talking about leveling, I'm talking about on your main level 50 class you've been gearing out with i90 gear because there's much to explore and new paths always opening as it can hold multiple boss instance zone (think BCNM) or offer even side quests not related to the "story".

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we already have four "dungeons" (strongholds)

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These are a far cry from even 1.x's versions - There's not even loot in them.

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Originally Posted by AmyNeudaiz

Also, to get back to your first reply, the OP quite literally is asking for things from XI to be added into XIV. The reason I wanted you to look at my reply was that it directly pertained to why I do not want.

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See, Preypacer got the point, you're too busy hating on XI to see what people are mentioning. When someone says "bring back", they're referring to how it's the same dev team (which is is largely) to bring back dungeon styles. I assume you either

1. Never played XI and just hating on it as it's the cool thing to do

or

2. Just really ignore the ties this game has to XI.

No one asked for XI-2 because once again, by your logic we already have XI-2 given how many monsters and even some lore is reused - What, did you think those exact goblin models and naming conventions just happen to also exist in a separate world? Or those Wamoura Moths just happen to inhabit another world? What about Titan lore wise wanting to be a protector? What she was stating was how you pretty much said "I wanted it but then I realized we already have beastmen strongholds" which is basically saying we don't need any other as we already have it.

I've been reading other MMORPG forums and this is still the only community where naming a companies previous game or using the word "unique/innovation" invokes so much hate it's pretty silly. Garden of Ru`hmet/Palace of Hu`Xoi for example was an amazing zone, it was a tad bit annoying, had nice music and had an actual purpose to not only the world but the storyline.

Tell me, what did we learn from going through Satasha? What cutscenes happened throughout the dungeon that ties that dungeon into the world of Eorzea? The storyline of Limsa? Who in the bloody hell was Captain Morrigan?

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Originally Posted by BloodPact

Yes, walking to the dungeon is so much harder than waiting for the queue... I just can't imagine just trying to get past those packs of level 34 mobs on the way to the entrance.

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It has to do with the concept of RPG. Your character should actually be a part of the world.

DF = Teleporting to a different world/dimension with people from another world/dimension. Nothing to do with RPG really.

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Originally Posted by Amberion

It has to do with the concept of RPG. Your character should actually be a part of the world.

DF = Teleporting to a different world/dimension with people from another world/dimension. Nothing to do with RPG really.

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Very subjective topic. Could say the same about people talking about real life while playing. The option to gather a party and run to the dungeon is still there, so this isn't actually the issue. It's more of a "I want it this way, so take out all other options".

I'm not really sure what I miss about XI's open dungeons. They did provide a real sense of danger and accomplishment that wasn't at all formulaic. I don't want duty finder and fates to change, but it would be nice to have some of that sense of accomplishment back. Most of FFXIV right now feels like a treadmill, but no matter how nostalgic I get about FFXI - no game ever has been or will be more of a grind for me.

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Originally Posted by Kirinichibon

I'm not really sure what I miss about XI's open dungeons. They did provide a real sense of danger and accomplishment that wasn't at all formulaic. I don't want duty finder and fates to change, but it would be nice to have some of that sense of accomplishment back. Most of FFXIV right now feels like a treadmill, but no matter how nostalgic I get about FFXI - no game ever has been or will be more of a grind for me.

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Yeah, there are definitely things to be missed; for example: solo farming Rogberry in the Temple and being scared and careful as a mage not to be get close to the hallway because pots could magic aggro you, and then if they did, managing the adds while keeping the NM on red so people didn't steal.

Things like those, the little solo or duo adventures with a friend were cool. However, for me "full party" or endgame content is better in here. I feel I get more out of my time in this game. There was nothing fun about camping Fafnir for hours, every day, and sometimes not even get to fight it, for weeks. And even then, omg those drop rates...

I don't really get the nostalgia for XI dungeons...

I remember places like Garbage Citadel as a place where people go to grind EXP and have their souls crushed for hours, and occasional as a places where you'd grind trash for Coffer Keys before using Sneak/Invis to get around with zero danger until you find a chest to get AF gear from.

The endgame ones were better, but as endgame you went with a group, and that instantly destroyed and danger Sneak/Invis didn't cover. They just became "Run past trash mobs to get to the God Island for the real content" eventually. I have that in ARR, it's called Turn 3. That said... Damn, if Coil was open world? Awesome. Just the start of Turn 1 and all of Turn 3, but yeah, that would be amazing. Turn 1 ADS would be like some of the door mechanic bosses in XI (groups can leech past it), as would the Golems beyond ADS. The boss would remain in an instance to prevent camping, then after that you move straight to Turn 2, again an instance since the whole thing is a boss. Turn 3 is then completely open world and at the end you move on to Turn 4s instance and then Turn 5. Expand the areas for Turn 1 and 3, throw in some XI style Treasure Coffers on the Dark Matter mobs... Damn, that would have been awesome...

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Originally Posted by Tupsi

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Except that's not my logic. Taking game design choices from a specific FF is not the same as re-using mobs from previous FF games. One is copying game design while the other is re-using assets. My beef is with the former.

And yes, bringing up XI does insight hatred, but not because it's "cool", but because so many people bring it up that it's a bad meme on this forum. Sure, it was worse in the 1.0 forums but it's still a thorn in the side to many people to hear "Bring this from XI to XIV" over and over and over it gets tiring.

And are you joking? Every dungeon has a backstory as to why you're in it and most have cutscenes involving the story, if you don't skip them. From Stone Vigil to Cutter's Cry to Binding Coil of Bahamut every single one has an underlying quest and lore so no, they are not meaningless. Cutter's Cry especially to me has meaning in the story for how sad the quest was but yeah, let's ignore that because XI did it differently and you think it's better. And if you think Sastasha had no story behind it you need to stop skipping that text and READ before coming to this forum asking why why why when it's right there in the game.


Instanced dungeons do not change anything other than to keep other people out of your runs. There's still exploration to be had, there's still lore to be read, there's still cutscenes to be watched. You just skip it and pretend it's not there so you can cry about something on the forums and claim XI was better.

So that begs the question, why don't you just go back and play that instead?

one area to add to the list would be Caedarva Mire. Not for the open world dungeon, but for the sheer danger of exploring.

There's just something about Vana Diel that makes it feel alive. Even though FFXIV is pretty just, everything feels fake. Like a fish in a pretty aquarium.

http://www.ffxionline.com/forums/att...kurm-dunes.jpg

and La Tiene

http://www.ffxionline.com/forums/att...227180502a.jpg

Was it the sense of danger? The size of the zone? Was it the unique mobs that don't just have frontal/circle aoe attacks and stops chasing you after a couple of seconds?

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Originally Posted by AmyNeudaiz

Except that's not my logic.

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It is your logic because you assume someone wanting the style back = wanting XI-2. Hence, we already in XI-2 since if you read every story and lore bits, you'll see many connections to actual XI lore ;)

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Every dungeon has a backstory

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All it does is explain why they got rid of Cassopeia Hollows, Shopshae and opened up Mistbeard Cove, which, btw, is the actual 'Satasha' that was locked off. You just naturally assume I skip text. Then again, I'm just not going to ignore the obvious left out in between the supposed 5 years that we suddenly have all these different "important people" that's never explored because the dungeons themselves are obviously designed as a leveling tool that's forced into the main story.

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There's still exploration to be had

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Alright, tell me what alternate paths in every dungeon you've found by exploring.

still nobody has explained how RMTing inside of a room will be vastly different then outside in the openworld we have today...

Also.. you never did any exploring down that other so different path in WP??? Me neither.. because it doesn't exist... Dungeons in this game could successfully be explored by blind people because there is only 1 way in.. 1 way out... and no way to get lost.

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Originally Posted by Doo

Even though FFXIV is pretty just, everything feels fake.

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Yeah I'm with you on this. For me, it has a lot to do with the maps being much smaller and less wide open, and also all the invisible walls that limit exploration. I mean, I guess there's always Skyrim for that...but it'd be nice if FFXIV offered lots of world exploration.

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Originally Posted by Tupsi

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You're trying to be clever with your responses but you're just making yourself look willfully ignorant. People wanting to change XIV to be like XI is just like asking for XI-2 but killing XIV in the process. Also, FFXIV has lore from every FF game, something most FF games have in common. This doesn't mean they take place in the same world. A complete imbecile would be able to garner that much.

There's more to Sastasha than why it is in existence. To feint ignorance to make a point is disingenuous.

Just because there are no "alternate path's" doesn't mean there's no exploration. There are several optional places to go. Sure, the dungeons aren't massive, but I will still never get over the feeling I got when I entered each turn of The Binding Coil for the first time (I still do). I explored every inch of that place from 1 to 5 to the dismay of my party and if you say that wasn't exploration just because there weren't "alternate paths" you and I are at an impasse.

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Originally Posted by odintius

My god your reading comprehension needs some work after reading all your posts on this thread.... Just take out ffxi in every sentence and you'll understand what the op is asking for just because someone compares something to another game they have experienced doesn't mean they just want it to be completely copy and paste from that game!

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Your reading comprehension needs some work after reading your post. Take out FFXI in every sentence and you'll understand what I'm talking about.

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Originally Posted by AmyNeudaiz

So that begs the question, why don't you just go back and play that instead?

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My god your reading comprehension needs some work after reading all your posts on this thread.... Just take out ffxi in every sentence and you'll understand what the op is asking for just because someone compares something to another game they have experienced doesn't mean they just want it to be completely copy and paste from that game!

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Originally Posted by AmyNeudaiz

Your reading comprehension needs some work after reading your post. Take out FFXI in every sentence and you'll understand what I'm talking about.

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Thanks for proving my point.

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Originally Posted by AmyNeudaiz

Just because there are no "alternate path's" doesn't mean there's no exploration.

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Sort of like FF13?

Someone trying to defending FFXIV dungeons as something you can explore? /faceplam.

FFXIV does not fit with "explore"....

1) Username/Password.
2) Start screen
3) Character selection
4) Loading screen
5) City
6) Loading screen
7) Linear dungeon
8) Loading screen
9) City
10) Loading screen
11) Another DF
12) Loading screen
13) City
14) Exit game.

Welcome to Instanced Co-OP player RPG!

My favorite was Zitah.

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Originally Posted by Synapse

Someone trying to defending FFXIV dungeons as something you can explore? /faceplam.

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Oh, you knew every aspect of every zone and dungeon the first time you did them? No. Exploration was present at the start of the game. In 2.2, you'll be exploring Amdapori Township and it will be a new experience. Once you've explored it though, that is gone.

The exact same was true for something like XI. Once I'd done Sky bosses, Sea bosses, Limbus, Dynamis, etc. etc., they stopped being something I explored because I'd already explored them, just like with XIV they simply became things I did. I guess the only reason people never complained about this in XI was because there were completely and utterly pointless side passages you would never use once you knew where you were going.

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Originally Posted by Morticous

Castle Zvahl Baleys - http://ffxi.somepage.com/zonedb/95
Delkfutts tower - http://ffxi.somepage.com/zonedb/73
Castle Oztroja - http://ffxi.somepage.com/zonedb/8
Fei'Yin - http://ffxi.somepage.com/zonedb/39
Grand Palace of Hu'Zxoi - http://ffxi.somepage.com/zonedb/160
Garliage Citidel - http://ffxi.somepage.com/zonedb/7

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If they add this areas without a solid purpose, only the FFXI players will check this zones and the rest the playerbase will ignore them.

If the dev team add something like Castle Zvahl Baleys into ARR.

Creating Seven Demons battles for 24 players, as open world Bosses, the items for pop this demons will be droped by the enemies in the zone.

Creating a New AF+2 ilv95 - 100, by completing hunting logs, quests and the open world bosses in the area, will be the only way for the playerbase try your the content.

Lets dont forget, a lot ouf actual playerbase are people came from WoW or others vertical progresion MMRPGs and for this public "Open World content" = A painful torture

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Originally Posted by Sotek

The exact same was true for something like XI. Once I'd done Sky bosses, Sea bosses, Limbus, Dynamis, etc. etc., they stopped being something I explored because I'd already explored them, just like with XIV they simply became things I did. I guess the only reason people never complained about this in XI was because there were completely and utterly pointless side passages you would never use once you knew where you were going.

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Nah you eventually had to look for coffers again for AFs or other quests where you had to find things, nms, etc.

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Originally Posted by Sotek

Oh, you knew every aspect of every zone and dungeon the first time you did them? No. Exploration was present at the start of the game. In 2.2, you'll be exploring Amdapori Township and it will be a new experience. Once you've explored it though, that is gone

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This +1

At least there are some from XI who aren't blind by nostalgia

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Originally Posted by Wulfyn

My favorite was Zitah.

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The game already has a mini Zi'Tah. If you go to Urth's Gift in the Shroud, that place screams of IX's Zi'Tah. Now that I think about it, looking at the Sanctuary of Zi'Tah; that place was a massive copypasta... along with most of the other zones in XI, and for the 5 years that I played that game, no one complained about it. I should have remembered in XIV's 1.0. :P

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Originally Posted by Doo

Nah you eventually had to look for coffers again for AFs or other quests where you had to find things, nms, etc.

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And when I was doing that I wasn't exploring the zone, because I'd already done so, heck I probably knew where to look for the chests by the point I'd gotten that far. Sitting around waiting for a party forever left me with little else to do but look up what AF quests required several weeks in advance. At that point I wasn't exploring, just like when I'm hunting for Treasure Maps in XIV I'm not exploring the zones anymore. First time I ran through zones in both games though? That was exploring.

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Originally Posted by Sotek

And when I was doing that I wasn't exploring the zone, because I'd already done so, heck I probably knew where to look for the chests by the point I'd gotten that far.

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Let's say first time you go to Castle Zvahl Bailey was to kill Shadow Lord. There are strong enemies that made you have to sneak/invis around so you couldn't just go anywhere you pleased like in FFXIV. Second time you might explore more of the area looking for coffer keys or hunting nms, quests, or whatever. The areas are big enough that you can still get lost after going to it often. Certain areas are higher level than others as well which feels like it opens up as you get stronger.

Now compared that to FFXIV where you explore Satasha. There was just more to FFXI areas like FF12 is to FF13.

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Originally Posted by Doo

There's just something about Vana Diel that makes it feel alive. Even though FFXIV is pretty just, everything feels fake. Like a fish in a pretty aquarium.

Was it the sense of danger? The size of the zone? Was it the unique mobs that don't just have frontal/circle aoe attacks and stops chasing you after a couple of seconds?

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Yes, it is the sense of danger.
You can't die in FFXIV at level 50 unless you are in an instance... it is simply put impossible, unless you go to aggro area and go afk.

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Originally Posted by Doo

Let's say first time you go to Castle Zvahl Bailey was to kill Shadow Lord. There are strong enemies that made you have to sneak/invis around so you couldn't just go anywhere you pleased like in FFXIV. Second time you might explore more of the area looking for coffer keys or hunting nms, quests, or whatever. The areas are big enough that you can still get lost after going to it often.

Now compared that to FFXIV where you explore Satasha. There was just more to FFXI areas like FF12 is to FF13.

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When I first went through Zvahl it was fun, though I instantly noticed the heavy amount of copy and paste zone design. Second time I went through it I knew things like the teleport mechanics, and the copy and paste zone design was just boring by then so there was nothing new to see.
First time I went through Satasha? Still had a lot of copy and paste zone design, but it was far more varied than anything in XI. It had an interesting boss who kept running off. It had side passages for optional treasure chests. One of those side passages had two groups of enemies fighting each other, which was very entertaining to see. Other side passages had some caged whores.

Zvahl was the same corridor over and over, occasionally swapping out the type of beastmen I'd already seen plenty of from Lv.1. The Shadow Lord at the end was the only new thing there.
Satasha was varied, had optional side passages with a purpose then and there (and side passage in Zvahl was to be seen later), as well as interesting things happening there. It was the first time in the game I'd faced a Coeurl type mob (which also came as a surprise). It was the first time in the game I'd faced Sahagin.

Best part here? Satasha is the first dungeon in XIV. Zvahl was the endgame on XI at launch. A real comparison would be Zvahl vs Castrum Meridianum and Praetorium. Granted, there is a lot less path deviation there.

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Originally Posted by Sotek

And when I was doing that I wasn't exploring the zone, because I'd already done so, heck I probably knew where to look for the chests by the point I'd gotten that far. Sitting around waiting for a party forever left me with little else to do but look up what AF quests required several weeks in advance. At that point I wasn't exploring, just like when I'm hunting for Treasure Maps in XIV I'm not exploring the zones anymore. First time I ran through zones in both games though? That was exploring.

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You must be really hard to please then or get bored really quickly of course some of the exploration feel goes away because you been their dozens of times just like any other game eventually. Does that mean the dev's should take out content to the game because those areas don't have the exploration feel to it anymore no. Should they not even bother then adding new content because the exploration feel will not be their in 2 weeks nope.

Im mean if you have a reason to go their not only just because of the exploration aspect of it by adding both open world and instances content it gives more options if put in properly giving player more stuff to do instead of one path to follow in duty finder.

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Originally Posted by Sotek

When I first went through Zvahl it was fun, though I instantly noticed the heavy amount of copy and paste zone design. Second time I went through it I knew things like the teleport mechanics, and the copy and paste zone design was just boring by then so there was nothing new to see.

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Honestly, FFXI maps were so very well designed that I didn't really notice have time to notice the copy/pasta. It was always exciting to revisit areas because they never got dull to the point where you could faceroll it solo.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIcLKaLtdHU

Boyahda Tree
Den of Rancor


Zones that put hair on your chest as a BST.

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Originally Posted by Sotek

O In 2.2, you'll be exploring Amdapori Township and it will be a new experience. Once you've explored it though, that is gone.

completely and utterly pointless side passages you would never use once you knew where you were going.

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Visiting an instance place is not the same as exploring a wide world.

Exploration kinda loses its effect when i can do them as level 1 fisher. There nothing to explore in FFXIV, or i should say no reason to explore... no mysterious ancient technologies like the crags, or hidden corridors in plain zone.


I never felt the same when i explored the zones in FFXi compared to FFXIV. Of course Nm had me revisiting many areas, something FFXIV does not have..

Only thing i felt great was when i entered coil for the first time.. i was like "wow, a whole ancient civilization build this etc etc".. and that was just a frking instance -_-.....


it would have been great if allagan technologies was like you know, in normal world map.

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Originally Posted by Doo

Honestly, FFXI maps were so very well designed that I didn't really notice have time to notice the copy/pasta. It was always exciting to revisit areas because they never got dull to the point where you could faceroll it solo.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIcLKaLtdHU

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You're just biased, like I was when I was obsessed with that game. Go run from one end of Meriphataud Mountains to the other and tell me those 10 minutes(!!!!!!) it took you to get from one point to the other were exciting. Now, take out Meriphataud Mountains and insert: Jugner Forest, Sanctuary of Zi'tah, Sarutabaruta, Al'Taieu, whatever the area outside Aht Urghan was, etc. etc. etc. etc. etc. They were super larger, copy/pastas, that's it. I'm not complaining about it; back when I was playing I loved the game and all those zones, but to say they were better than what we have in this game is just not right.

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Originally Posted by Doo

Honestly, FFXI maps were so very well designed that I didn't really notice have time to notice the copy/pasta. It was always exciting to revisit areas because they never got dull to the point where you could faceroll it solo.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dIcLKaLtdHU

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I actually agree. The zones were well designed. The problem is the content around them wasn't, the content utterly wasted the potential the zones had.

As much as I loathed Abyssea, it at least gave me reason to see parts of La Thiene. It really wasn't until Abyssea that XI really made the most of its zones. The majority of NMs in XI were pretty damn pointless, as were the coffers. They justified the large map but they were so utterly worthless. Actually, Wings of the Goddess might have been the start of them using zones properly, SCNMs were utterly great in that regard.

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Originally Posted by Synapse

Exploration kinda loses its effect when i can do them as level 1 fisher. There nothing to explore in FFXIV, or i should say no reason to explore... no mysterious ancient technologies like the crags, or hidden corridors in plain zone.

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Your mileage may vary.

I very much enjoyed exploring Eorzea at launch. I had no Sneak/Invis to just walk past everything, I actually had to treat every mob in XIV as True Sight mobs in XI. I enjoyed walking through The Shroud and finding Urths Font, traveling to Thanalan and seeing High Bridge, Burning Wall and then Southern Thanalan. I enjoyed finding all the scars of Dalamund scattered throughout the zones. I enjoyed heading to Coerthas and finding towers and camps that actually made sense. Seeing Natalan, exploring the caves nearby, and the ruins just north of it. Seeing Ishgard again. I enjoyed seeing Boulderdowns for the first time, then heading to Mor Dhona, walking out the gate and seeing Crystal Tower.

Again, your milage may vary.

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Originally Posted by Sotek

As much as I loathed Abyssea, it at least gave me reason to see parts of La Thiene.

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I always help players do AF quests, nation quests, limit break quests, main story quests, expansions quests, hunt nms, xp grinding, farming, bcnms, etc. I found plenty of reasons to going back to areas that I've been to before.

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Originally Posted by BloodPact

You're just biased,

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Aren't we all? The difference is I don't pretend not to be bias.

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Originally Posted by Doo

I always help players do AF quests, nation quests, limit break quests, main story quests, expansions quests, hunt nms, etc. I found plenty of reasons to going back to areas that I've been to before.

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None of those things involved you traveling to certain corners of the maps. The entire south west section of La Thiene, for example. It was wasted space until Abyssea put it to use.

Just compare the use of the map in Davoi to the use in La Vaule (S). The difference is quite apparent.

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Originally Posted by BloodPact

things

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I have to agree. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed playing FFXI, but the maps weren't that well designed. They were big, yes, but big =/= good design. Most of the map wasn't used for anything (more so in the earlier days than later when things like Voidwatch was added).

Running to Jeuno was fun the first time because it was a different kind of adventure, you had no chocobo or invis/sneak to just run through everything, and it was quite tense when that Gobbie you were following stops to turn around. After that, though, it quickly died off. You got a 'Bo and you just ran by everything for 15-20 minutes.

Simply put, the maps were bigger than they needed to be. I actually prefer XIVs map design because most of it actually feels functional or has a different vibe to it. If it was larger, it may not have had that same feeling and that was the purpose behind designing it smaller.

Maybe in the future we will get some bigger maps but every part of it has to have a reason to exist and not just be there for the sake of it.

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Originally Posted by Sotek

Your mileage may vary.

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Considering i had exploration blog in lodestone, and 1.0 had better scenery than 2.0(which my blog was mainly about)

Yes, Mileage may vary, as an experienced explorer, FFXIV ARR broken down after few days.


Not sure if we can revisit old Lodestone blogs... if its possible and it ifs still there to trace it with my character name(cant now cause at work and lodestoneis blocked :/)

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...f-Eorzea/page6

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Originally Posted by Synapse

Considering i had exploration blog in lodestone, and 1.0 had better scenery than 2.0(which my blog was mainly about)

Yes, Mileage may vary, as an experienced explorer, FFXIV ARR broken down after few days.

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Really? Because if I was blogging my exploration through Eorzea I'd hardly have had time to play the game. Every corner has something to write about and post a picture of. Right out the gate of Gridania I could turn around and post a picture of the city (not possible in 1.0). Then there is a training camp. A giant root acting as a path up a cliff. So and and so on. That's just Central Shroud... What could I have blogged in 1.0? "Here's the same corridor... With some different monsters !".

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Originally Posted by Sotek

None of those things involved you traveling to certain corners of the maps. The entire south west section of La Thiene, for example.

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There were plenty of places in FF12 I didn't go to but that doesn't mean it should just change into a linear corridor like FF13 though. Players still got lost trying to find quests or got chased by mobs and had to run in different directions.

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Originally Posted by Sotek

I'm not arguing that...

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Those quests that I mentioned did take you to many different areas all over Vana Diel though. Just take a lot at Rise of Zilart quest to get Sky access as an example. I mean where there still unused areas in FFXI? Sure, but they did a great job of making areas relevant for a long time.