I want 2.2 to be a "reset" for players in full i90 gear. Make Turn 6 a distant goal.

Either way.....who says the gear levels have to match the player levels....if they raise the level cap (or don't) and you get gear putting you at iLVL 354 so be it....it is after all an Item Level. When and if they raise the player level Cap, you are still going to see increases in stats in your player. Resetting every one that worked so hard on getting myth/allagan is pointless. That iLVL 90 gear is still going to be available for you in the same way it was for them.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NeoAmon

Yeah, first time you go there with Ilvl90 you get stomped, 3-4 months later you are full ilvl120, same lvl as the bosses and you would be the one doing the stomping this time. It is the natural order and I would not have it any other way.

My full ilvl90 BiS gear have to look absolutely worthless in comparison to Coil 2 drops. Otherwise, just like CT, Ultima, & King Mog, I will never do them.


つ ◕_◕ ༽つ Give ILVL 120

---

So, enjoy not running content then? Sometimes running stuff like Mog is just fun. I don't need to have sweet awesome drops to make something fun. I enjoy new running things with my FC and figuring out and making our own strats.

I'm sure all your jobs are also max i90 and you don't need anything at all for any of your jobs.

Do you even have fun? Do you know what fun is? You seem the type to be very angry all time (especially when there is one small mistake). Hey, if they don't add ilvl 120 gear, you can always quit right?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NeoAmon

Yeah, first time you go there with Ilvl90 you get stomped, 3-4 months later you are full ilvl120, same lvl as the bosses and you would be the one doing the stomping this time. It is the natural order and I would not have it any other way.

My full ilvl90 BiS gear have to look absolutely worthless in comparison to Coil 2 drops. Otherwise, just like CT, Ultima, & King Mog, I will never do them.


つ ◕_◕ ༽つ Give ILVL 120

---

Pardon me while i throw up.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Marishi-Ten

So, enjoy not running content then? Sometimes running stuff like Mog is just fun. I don't need to have sweet awesome drops to make something fun. I enjoy new running things with my FC and figuring out and making our own strats.

I'm sure all your jobs are also max i90 and you don't need anything at all for any of your jobs.

Do you even have fun? Do you know what fun is? You seem the type to be very angry all time (especially when there is one small mistake). Hey, if they don't add ilvl 120 gear, you can always quit right?

---

Wow all the assumptions. Can I assume whatever I want about you to? I'm having fun ty, no I have no fun in any content that is not challenging or rewarding. No I don't get mad at a game, no I'm not going to quit and yes I think you are a very terrible player, why? assumptions, remember what you just did?

You have your fun, I have my own. What is wrong with that? Or the game is just made for what you like alone?

I think there will be a 20-30 item level increase in turns 6-10. They are adding new tombs which can be assumed to buy the AF2 gear they showed in a live letter preview. As well as dropping allegan 2 gear from 6-10 you know there will be a meaningful power increase to get people grind out their gear sets again for the next 6 months.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Zumi

I think there will be a 20-30 item level increase in turns 6-10. They are adding new tombs which can be assumed to buy the AF2 gear they showed in a the preview. As well as dropping allegan 2 gear from 6-10 you know there will be a meaningful power increase to get people grind out their gear sets again for the next 6 months.

---

I very much hope so ^^.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NeoAmon

You have your fun, I have my own. What is wrong with that? Or the game is just made for what you like alone?

---

That is what you're advocating here, intentionally or not.

Not everyone wants the game turned into a mindless power-creeping item-squshing gear grind fest, which you seem to want so very badly.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aenarion

That is what you're advocating here, intentionally or not.

Not everyone wants the game turned into a mindless power-creeping item-squshing gear grind fest, which you seem to want so very badly.

---

Was not 2.1 made for that? What is wrong for me to ask for what I want now in 2.2 which was promised to be a "progress" not ilvl same old no progress that I have 0 interest in.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NeoAmon

Was not 2.1 made for that? What is wrong for me to ask for what I want now in 2.2 which was promised to be a "progress" not ilvl80 that I have 0 interest in.

---

2.1 is a catch up, it's shit that's supposed to be in for launch. Also, you're missing the point - it's not that there shouldn't be progress, but rather the amount of "progress" you're asking for.

Going by people like you we'd be at ilvl 9000 by the end of next year.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Vech

They just need to make the boss mechanics interesting and the gear drops ilvl 95. Let's not get ahead of ourselves here, otherwise Coil 1-5 gear would be almost pointless if they retired it so early. Also, iLvl 145? Lol.

---

You do realize they said coil 1-5 will be nerfed with the echo buff when 6-10 is out making it really easy for anyone to do. 6-10 will probably drop stuff thats at least 20-30 item levels higher. Basically the level 90 gear will become the new darklight type gear for getting started in 6-10. New 100+ gear will be the high end gear now 110 or 120 somewhere around there.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aenarion

2.1 is a catch up, it's shit that's supposed to be in for launch. Also, you're missing the point - it's not that there shouldn't be progress, but rather the amount of "progress" you're asking for.

Going by people like you we'd be at ilvl 9000 by the end of next year.

---

You are the one missing the point, after 2.2 is another CT update which is what you guys want, do you want that be only 5 levels lower than Coil 2? It have to be at least 10 lvls lower or no point. Farm CT > ez mode Coil > profit.

The previous progress was good, Ilvl70 into ilvl90. When CT came out ilvl80 did not turn Coil gear to worthless. This is the same thing here, 2.2 gear have to be better than 2.3 by a good amount.

Plus know your math, if every 6 month we get an ilvl jump like we had since the game launched it will be ilvl120-140 max. the game would be 2 years old if not more before we reach ilvl200.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aenarion

2.1 is a catch up, it's shit that's supposed to be in for launch. Also, you're missing the point - it's not that there shouldn't be progress, but rather the amount of "progress" you're asking for.

Going by people like you we'd be at ilvl 9000 by the end of next year.

---

Did you notice that the average item level has four slots, and our HP bars have space for 3 more digits?

It will come, sooner or later.

I was never big on progression, but doing WP endlessly, filling my slots with item level 90 gear and beating the last boss of a fresh new dungeon, wouldn't be very satisfying.

The progression (iLevel) in this game doesn't make any sense

They really need to get their sh-- together

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Thunderz

The progression (iLevel) in this game doesn't make any sense

They really need to get their sh-- together

---

Have you played any other recent mmo? Everytime a new raid tier comes out there is like a 20-30 item level increase in gear to give motivation for people to get new gear sets and do the new raid to make their characters more powerful.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NeoAmon

You are the one missing the point, after 2.2 is another CT update which is what you guys want, do you want that be only 5 levels lower than Coil 2? It have to be at least 10 lvls lower or no point. Farm CT > ez mode Coil > profit.

---

Don't try to put words in my mouth, you don't know jack shit about what I want.

Quote:

---

Plus know your math, if every 6 month we get an ilvl jump like we had since the game launched it will be ilvl120-140 max. the game would be 2 years old if not more before we reach ilvl200.

---

It's a hyperbole, go check the dictionary since you apparently don't know what that is.

What you're describing is exactly the kind of unimaginative endless gear treadmill that does nothing but trivializes every content that comes before it that too many MMOs these days have become.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NeoAmon

When CT came out ilvl80 did not turn Coil gear to worthless. This is the same thing here, 2.2 gear have to be better than 2.3 by a good amount.

---

Agreed. Not only do they need to reserve ilvs for the next CT
but they'll need space to fit in the new crafted gear as well as gear drops from the new dungeons.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ri_ri

Did you notice that the average item level has four slots, and our HP bars have space for 3 more digits?

It will come, sooner or later.

I was never big on progression, but doing WP endlessly, filling my slots with item level 90 gear and beating the last boss of a fresh new dungeon, wouldn't be very satisfying.

---

Yea, can't wait for the day when "ilvl 9000+ onry" shouts in Mor Dhona won't be jokes any more :rolleyes:

Nobody said the current content is good enough, but that hardly means a mindless treadmill is any better.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NeoAmon

Wow all the assumptions. Can I assume whatever I want about you to? I'm having fun ty, no I have no fun in any content that is not challenging or rewarding. No I don't get mad at a game, no I'm not going to quit and yes I think you are a very terrible player, why? assumptions, remember what you just did?

---

I stated that I don't need sweet awesome drops to run stuff. You drew the parallel to yourself from a generalized statement.

I did assume that all of your max jobs were geared in BiS though. I apologize if you took offense. This is the only logical explanation I could come to you not wanting to run CT, Mog, etc. If this isn't the case, wouldn't you benefit from these drops? What would the motivation be for not running them?

I also assumed you were a very angry person as your post seemed very opinionated and obtuse. It appeared that you were not interested in having a conversation or debate, but only use the forums as a medium to dictate your demands. I apologize if this is not the case.

In the event that ilvl120 equipment is not introduced, will you protest it's non implementation by quitting? What will you do?

I'm not the best player, I'm not even mediocre I imagine. But I have fun doing it and to me, that's enough.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Aenarion

Don't try to put words in my mouth, you don't know jack shit about what I want.

---

What you want is an easy ride that require minimum efforts. You and others are making assumptions without thinking it through. It only takes few seconds of thinking to understand what you are asking for.

You want Coil to stay ilvl90? great. WHAT THE IS THE POINT? We are not getting special gear stats, we are not getting progress, what should we get then? same old stuff with different colours?

If you want ilvl90 to be the max forever, then every single ilvl in the game including Coil 1 need to get nerfed to the ground so Coil 2 gear have "progress". This is why I'm playing this game and this is why I'm enjoying it, I love raiding and I love the loot. You take the loot away and you take my fun away.

I never asked for your fun to be taken away so stay away from what I enjoy. Why do you think FCs are still doing Coil every week since the game launched? It is because someone in the group is still missing dat ilvl90 BiS even when he/she have the Myth one.

inb4 Twintania HM, 3 twister inside conflagration, real caduceus as add

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by NeoAmon

If you want ilvl90 to be the max forever, then every single ilvl in the game including Coil 1 need to get nerfed to the ground so Coil 2 gear have "progress". This is why I'm playing this game and this is why I'm enjoying it, I love raiding and I love the loot. You take the loot away and you take my fun away.

---

So what will you do when they stop making content, and you have no more progression to make? Hop onto the next MMO? I am not against progression, but that mindset blows my mind.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Marishi-Ten

SNIP

---

I do, I need the fight to be hard and I need it to have a reward at the end, not just me but many others. This is how I enjoy my MMO, we don't have to like the same thing and we can coexist, you have your patch "2.1, 2.3, 2.5" and I will have my own challenging rewarding contents. For god sake, I have the ilvl95 SMN Book in my bag and 1460~ Myth, the Allagan gear needed & the 3 Ex Primals drops to make a BiS SMN within few days. Yet I still did not level one up to 50, cause I don't enjoy it. All I enjoy is my BLM late night with friends trying to kill imaginary pixel boss that gives a pixel reward with higher number than what I have.

Don't hate, this what I like to do after hard day at work/uni and taking care of my family.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eardstapa

So what will you do when they stop making content, and you have no more progression to make? Hop onto the next MMO? I am not against progression, but that mindset blows my mind.

---

This is a subscription MMO, they will never stop making new contents.

I'm not sure if 2.2 will necessarily be the power creep update, but the OP is right that it will eventually happen. That's how gear-based, carrot-and-stick MMOs work. At some point there's a major update, level caps are increased and gear you've already gotten becomes obsolete as you chase for the next tier of gear.

Anyone who thinks that won't happen or doesn't want it to happen is playing the wrong genre of MMO. For those that don't like or want power creep, might I suggest a more horizontal progression MMO like

by the time we see lv55 we'll have ilv140 the game is also using four digits for ilevel average so by lv99 we'll be 1k or more
vertical progression is a waste of numbers.

iLevel upgrade will probably come sooner than later. But if it starts coming out something like every two months, I'll have to rethink my sub to this game. I'm all for the game keeping a carrot on a stick for me, but if new gear is released super quickly it feels frustrating/annoying/pointless to even bother capping. There are many other MMOs out there to choose from. /shrug/

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Magis

One poster gave EVE as an example, another is FFXI (yah, yah) until Abyssea came out. Gear didn't get thrown out after the next flavour of the month came in. Horizontal progression > Vertical progression. Even AF1 gear was useful for a while... not thrown away right when you hit 50.

---

A system that creates stupidly broken gear for the sake of giving it "value" is not a properly balanced system. Should we talk about the elemental staves that outclassed relics and pretty much every other mage weapon past lv51?

Not to mention the only reason things like AF were even relevant was because of gear swapping, another broken system.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Eardstapa

So what will you do when they stop making content, and you have no more progression to make? Hop onto the next MMO? I am not against progression, but that mindset blows my mind.

---

Generally when a game stops making content, it's because the servers are shutting down.

You talk about a broken system in 11 and i'm looking at a very boring & bland system that is 14

11 had his shares of problem but 14 is ....struggling

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by LineageRazor

I gotta wonder what's going on in their heads... especially since folks are able to get fully decked in i90 gear after just four months of play! SE wants you playing for YEARS

---

It takes four months to get full i90 in ONE job, of which we have access to NINE on each character.

Until people are finding themselves maxed out in at least a couple more jobs -- say, enough time to experience one class of each role in Coil -- then I don't see what the rush is to push back the goalposts. And before anyone says, "BUT I DONT LIKE ALL ROLES, WHY SHOULD I HAVE TO WAIT", there are still multiple classes to experience for whatever role(s) you DO like. Try having fun with those for a little while instead.

I'm just sayin', granted SE logic can be "special", why give us a huge selling point in the form of the armory system if we're not going to be allowed any time to play with it?

I'm all for pushing the goalposts forward to keep things from getting stale, but it's a delicate balance. I want to see patches as something to be excited about, and if done right, they can be just that. However if they push the ilvl increases out too quickly, then with each new patch I'm not going to feel excited -- instead I'm going to dread how much further behind I'll always feel. This feeling of being behind coming from a player currently with one job in full i90, and a second job three Allagan pieces in. This is because I don't measure the goal by one class, but rather by the maximum sum of experiences that the game allows.

If I want to pigeonhole myself into one class and race forward, then I already have my choice of ANY other MMO for that experience. If you want to talk about fear of the game feeling stale, then that right there is what will accomplish it faster than anything else -- making this game feel like all the others that we've already grown tired of and quit.

If SE indeed wants to keep us playing for years, then all they need to do is keep fun, new content coming. They can keep giving us new boss fights that are increasingly challenging. They can keep expanding on the immersive world and lore with new sights, story, and Hildibrand-quality quests. But bigger numbers don't make better games. They can make the new rewards from new content range from side-grades to small upgrades with each patch, to help players gear up their other classes in a wider variety of new ways. The new content will still be new. It will still be more. It will still be enough to keep the game fresh, yet it will also be encouraging players to explore the things that makes this game unique, and therein lies the key: If they capitalize on the reasons that we've been given to play this game instead of another, then people will continue to play this game instead of another. It's that simple.

You can't be serious OP. Sorry but I can't really stop laughing thinking about this mad idea. And what is the benefit? just to make turn 6 a distant goal? Just to satisfy the selfish needs of those lagging behind so that everyone can start at square one to have a chance to be world first?

I am pretty sure the answer is no. However, it depends on the developers if they want to buff Turn 1 - 4 to be more challenging.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Magis

One poster gave EVE as an example, another is FFXI (yah, yah) until Abyssea came out. Gear didn't get thrown out after the next flavour of the month came in. Horizontal progression > Vertical progression. Even AF1 gear was useful for a while... not thrown away right when you hit 50.

---

A large part of why this worked in XI was the ridiculous "gear swapping" system whereby you could change all your gear mid-combat or even half way through casting a spell. They could create lots of situational gear that excelled for certain types of spell or using certain weapon skills such as equipping gear with dark magic skill for casting Drain or gear loaded with STR for basically every weapon skill.

But I'm hoping that at some point they will make gear a bit more diverse, perhaps weapons with additional effects or armour with properties we've not seen yet.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kaedan94

I'm not sure if 2.2 will necessarily be the power creep update, but the OP is right that it will eventually happen. That's how gear-based, carrot-and-stick MMOs work. At some point there's a major update, level caps are increased and gear you've already gotten becomes obsolete as you chase for the next tier of gear.

Anyone who thinks that won't happen or doesn't want it to happen is playing the wrong genre of MMO. For those that don't like or want power creep, might I suggest a more horizontal progression MMO like

---

Yeah those gear resets do happen, they're called expansions.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Alkimi

A large part of why this worked in XI was the ridiculous "gear swapping" system whereby you could change all your gear mid-combat or even half way through casting a spell. They could create lots of situational gear that excelled for certain types of spell or using certain weapon skills such as equipping gear with dark magic skill for casting Drain or gear loaded with STR for basically every weapon skill.

But I'm hoping that at some point they will make gear a bit more diverse, perhaps weapons with additional effects or armour with properties we've not seen yet.

---

As much as I loved FFXI I hated the gear swapping system as well, it necessitated old content that I'd been doing for years to still be relevant and necessary to run because someone was always in need of the gear from it. I found myself hating even the thought of endgame because it necessitated doing things I'd been doing for the last 3 years. Horizontal upgrades are a great way to limit how much new endgame content needs to be made.

I really dislike the idea of pulling everyone back to the start line. I don't like these huge gear leaps either. I hope I'm not alone when I say that I'd love for everything you've done to have some lasting worth; instead of being able to buy AF2 with some new Mythology tokens, I think you should also have to upgrade from your current level 90 Mythology gear; meaning players would still have to grind out this old content and experience what we had to before moving onto the new gear.

Otherwise I can't see what will happen to the current level 90 Mythology gear. Will it become entirely redundant and skippable?

Coil T6-10 should be ilvl 95. While the next CT should be ilvl85. That would be a good slow and steady progression.

Now I cannot even gear up my main properly to ilvl 90, tanks to epic RNG drops. Making the next level a big jump will be a big gimp.

coil t6-10 will be ilvl 100 , weapons ilvl 105 , a new AF is coming , i doubt the jump will be only 5 ilvls.

always check thread tags

I think they should bring back the toughness that was XI, Not saying bring back death penalty but at the same time look how effective it was at toning the skill sets of players and not get that mentality of " oh what ever we can just wipe and do it again over and over " XI made it so you really had to make strats really had to focus on your role.
With that said though I think the leveling of XI nailed it on the head as well you really fell in love with that job you got to 75 you had a connection and wanted to perfect it. A: not only did it take forever yea got it. But there was no ( maxed out every job and craft ) so in turn i think they need to take a step back and really make the future of 50+ or 2.2+ and Not make it as hard as FFXI but not so face rolling as XIV is now. I miss the fear! I miss the CHASE of a NM spawn the heart pounding seconds b4 you seen if the 48 hours of waiting was for a super rare item or for a wind crystal. ( which could turn and fix the horrid economy )

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Wolf_Gang

That's no different from when you hit lv50. Item lv jumped 40 levels. I'm basically mimicking the same exact lv of progression with the new ilv scaled to match.

---

No, this is completely different from when you hit 50. When you hit 50 you start off with i50-55 gear. Then you get i55 from WP, and i60 from AK (it's a bit more varied now). THEN you get DL gear i70. NOW you have i80 gear from CT and then i90 gear from coil.

Why do so many people care so much about ilvl progression btw, It's more player understanding of mechanics and not dying to them that gets you through, gear only gets you so far.

Please no. Just make gear harder to get. If you miss the nostalgia of...doing weekly chores for your gear then.. maybe just do chores around the house?

I vividly remember grinding item token #9 or 10 (I have lost count at this point) to buy endgame gear set #37. That's all this is, I did the same thing in world of warcraft for 3 expansions, and quite honestly, the less repeated dungeon grinding I have to do the better at this stage. I do not enjoy that method of keeping me subscribed and if this game continues down that path, I'll go somewhere else because indefinitely leveling characters in DIFFERENT collections of textures, is better than not leveling characters in the same texture set. There is a way to add content and shock and awe, not just replace old content. New content inevitably ends up the same way old content is, so why even bother adding it?


TL;DR, my sub depends on how repetitive they keep level cap. You're basically proposing infinite repeats faster than expansions usually do this. If you want a new goal, go outside.

What i think they should explore is making coil 8-10, perhaps into 24 man / 16 man contents?

This will give them more room to play with more interesting counters / add more mechanics to the fight